# How do I get more roleplaying out of my Players?



## Creamsteak

I would like to get more role playing out of my game. Our average session begins with someone needing to catch up their character and then leads into my recap. After a short speach I remind the characters of their exact situation they left off.

Normally a session begins in either the wilderness or a town. If there is nothing urgent at the time they begin doing simple bartering, pick pocketing (rarely), and looking for some kind of job. A few of the PC's play diplomatic characters and tend to get into lengthy conversations with NPC's trying to recruit, gather information, and accidently sprining arguments.

The other PC's make up a forray of characters varying from a half-celestial human psion to a half-dragon Githyanki fighter. The characters that are not diplomats don't really interact with the acception of killing things and bickering amongst themselves. When a generic quest like _kill the troll_ pops up they rarely spring in to action so they need other kinds of motivation. Treasures namely.

The PC's know my intentions are false and apply metagame physics to over-lucritive opportunities. Even if I was to make such an opportunity they would pass it up. They want to think they bluffed me. If I show them the item, possibly in the possession of a powerful NPC located in the town or by noticing a dragon in the sky they go after it.

They fail sometimes, which of course begins a chase, fight, or other encounter.

Then rinse and repeat mostly... sometimes they get involved in a war for fun, sometimes they side with a leader to gain more experience and gold, and sometimes they get a prostitute pregnant.

Generally I never see epic plots, which I am fine with because epics should remain epics. They only happen once in a while.

The issue I find annoying is that there is never any important interaction outside the party. They don't make friends, though they do make enemies. Metagame thinking prevents me from tieing important npc's to the party, "the DM is sure making this guy stick out... at least a little bit... I don't trust this character, but maybe I can get some information or equipment from him."

If the PC's can get something out of him and end the association there they often kill, abandon, or mislead the NPC. If they encounter him again they expect to either continue abandoning, killing, or misleading him unless they see immediate information.

One ally they always keep is the generic _Powerful Good Cleric_ . If that kind of character needs help they jump up and obey, as long as there are no strings attached.

Next session, tomorrow, I am going to try another hook. 
_The Greater Evil_  hook. Enemy A is more powerful than the PC's and is their competition. Enemy B is the constable from a town the PC's are infamous in for less than legal activities. Enemy C is the Ogre Mage bastard the PC's have never encountered before and has all plans to eliminate Enemy A, is a bigger agrivation to Enemy B, and is holding not one, but two of the PC's hostage (of 9 total PC's in the campaign). 

I am hoping the PC's follow the hook and aid either A or B, but there needs to be a reason they don't want to backstab A or B.

A is going to be important because only he knows how to free the PC's appropriately for the time being. B can only offer immunity from their _current_  record of crimes in his jurisdiction.

This is my first step to getting roleplaying going. If you think you can improve/replace my idea, or have other steps I can take then inform me. Keep in mind that hey "want" to roleplay, they need a little help though.


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## Henry@home

It sounds like they are playing a party full of Eddie Haskells! (If the reference is unfamiliar, don't worry.)

In general, they sound like they are being general public nuisances, with the exception of the convenient relationships such as the good cleric for resurrections.

It sounds like carrots on sticks are working, but you may not be using the right type of carrot.

I say, make their sorry butts pay for their aggravations. Get them involved in the community.

Do they train for level gains, or do they just happen? If they have trainers, these trainers are eventually going to want more than just money for their aggravation. If character #1 won't do quest X or Y, they don't get trained. If character #2 doesn't help his trainer win the heart of his beloved, then he is too distraught to train him. If character #3 is too busy being a successful con-man and thief, then his trainer, who has picked up on this fact, will bribe him into absconding with a powerful item in exchange for training. After a certain level, they CAN'T FIND trainers for what they want - unless they are willing to pay triple the time and money to train. Remember that.
Do the characters tick off everyone in the community? It's not wise to do so, because word eventually gets back to that good cleric. The good cleric is going to want them to atone before he has anythign to do with them.
That Barmaid they got pregnant? Turns out it was the local 15th level Artistocratic Lord's daughter, who ran away from home to see the world! She got infatuated with a handsome adventurer - who has just knocked her up. DAD'S gonna want satisfaction, and he's gonna want his future son-in-law to present him with an appropriate dowry for his "damaged goods."
The NPC they just abandoned for dead? He was the good cleric's long-lost son; he was just on his way to see dad, but dad tells the PC's that he hasn't arrived yet, and dad is afraid some brigands have befallen him. Would they go and see to his safety?  

My point is that the world will not stop idly while it waits for the PC's to get involved. The world will MAKE the PC's get involved, or it will roll over them in its eternal march forward. The PC's will go from being PROactive to being REactive. That's what you want to remove those jaded feelings. If the world is moving then they have to move to keep up.

Good luck and I hope some of this helped!


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## Creamsteak

The concept of trainers being more important NPC's is something I'm taking off your list to use. Some of your plots are good ideas, with the exception that the particular cleric is celebatel. The prostitute they killed, but I always wanted the kid to grow up wanting to meet daddy. With the PC's the way they are I would expect them to try and kill him... which leads into more and more plots, etc.


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## BadMojo

Personally, I would handle a problem like this "out of game".  Clearly there is a conflict in gaming styles between you and some of your players.  You seem like you want to run a heroic game with some long term storylines and a good dose of roleplaying; some of your players seem like they just want to accumulate treasure and kill stuff.

Try talking to your players and see if you can find a style of play that suits everyone.  You can also try to convey the type of game you want to run to your "problem" players and see if they would be willing to adapt their style of play a bit.

You can try in-game solutions all you want, but if your players can't or don't want to roleplay, it probably will just be more frustrating for you.

Also, I'm not sure what alignments these folks are playing, but you can always use XP penalties for "breaking alignment" and using too much Meta-Game knowledge.


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## Henry@home

creamsteak said:
			
		

> *The concept of trainers being more important NPC's is something I'm taking off your list to use. Some of your plots are good ideas, with the exception that the particular cleric is celebatel. The prostitute they killed, but I always wanted the kid to grow up wanting to meet daddy. With the PC's the way they are I would expect them to try and kill him... which leads into more and more plots, etc. *




Excellent! Just keep the overriding theme in mind - make your world come to them, and "hit them where it hurts" - involve things that they need or take for granted in your plots. Make them feel that the merri-go-round isn't stopping just because they feel like a night of looting the town jeweler. Every single one of their actions has a consequence - you just have to figure out what those are!

Good luck!


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## William Ronald

It seems the player characters assume that the world exists solely for their benefit; it is time to disabuse them of the notion.

For those who are reluctant to role play, have them encounter people who matter to them.  The half-celestial (who seems not to be acting in a good manner by robbing the jewel merchant) may run into a relative who scolds him for his behavior.  Or one who is legitimately worried about him.  Of course, agents of darker powers might want to have him as a follower and try to manipulate him.  If he refuses, they may decide he is a hindrance to their plans. On a more mundane level, the character may see someone who once knew him.  Have this character talk to him.  If the player is foolish enough to attack the old friend, have him get a rude surprise. (Project image is a wonderful spell. As is unseen servant.)

The githyanki half-dragon is darn lucky he is not being chased by villagers with torches and pitch forks.  He may meet members of his own kind who wonders what he is doing slumming with the humans.  They may have certain ideas on how he can advance their agenda, and might not be willing to take no for an answer.  (Her majesty, the lich queen, might take a personal interest in the character -- if he is likely to be a threat to her power or machinations.) Of course, the character may have a few githzerai out looking for him.  It would be reasonable for the githyanki half-dragon to be contacted by someone with a grudge against the illithid. (Unless of course, this person is an agent of the illithid.)  The key is to make interactions which the characters can's solve just by loping someone's head off.  (If they try an attack in a public square, send in some competent guards with nets and clubs. Or worse, another party of adventurers helps the guards.)

Merchants do not like to be intimidated, and may have a few hired guns looking for the party.  It would be nasty if a rogue with a few levels of cleric infiltrated the party and tried to engineer their downfall. Or they could be declared persona non-grata and forbidden to enter the town.  As word of their bad reputations spread, few people will want to associate with them. (Morale: people do not like being treated badly.)

I suggest that the good cleric starts to hear bad news about his associates.  He demands penance.  If the party is stupid enough to attack the character in his own temple, then they should be ready for nasty consequences.

Trainers are important.  Imagine if the only person who could train one of the characters was the friend or relative of someone they offended? No training.  Worse, training but with an additional cost. (Amulet of inescapable location.)

Another thing I try to do is put characters in social situations.  Weddings and funerals are great.  The characters might have to say something appropriate to the occasion.  This can impact on their reputation in the community.  Or have the wedding or funeral be for someone the non-role players would actually care about.  

You can not force a person to role play; you can only set up opportunities.  Try to do so.  Remember, if the characters act like automatons maybe everyone else will treat them that way. Similarly, characters who think they own the world usually will find that they don't.



> The difference between role playing and roll playing is the distance between the human heart and the dice rolling hand.


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## Creamsteak

Your talking about what to do about the characters actions, which is a totally seperate issue. Im trying to encourage them to solve problems in character and play their role, not just interact with the world. When you send Enemy X at them, they will solve the problem however they see to be the easiest or most efficient way, but they don't solve the problem as a person sees it.

If I tell player A his brother is kidnapped he doesn't care. Do you see what I am saying? They don't play like they are in the game. They play like they are outside the box looking in. I like some of your ideas, but thats all about the story of the game and the key players. You could help me more by giving me ways to use your ideas to force them into wanting to save their brother. Does that make any sense?


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## Mixmaster

"If I tell player A his brother is kidnapped he doesn't care."

The first question I musk ask you is: Do you ask him why??

It seems to me that they just want to dungeon-hop and not much more. There are some who "get into the spirit" of roleplay and some who don't (whether they don't feel like it, they're afraid of bumbling or ridicule, etc). You're going to have to talk to them to get the answers you seek.


*"The PC's know my intentions are false and apply metagame physics to over-lucritive opportunities. Even if I was to make such an opportunity they would pass it up. They want to think they bluffed me. If I show them the item, possibly in the possession of a powerful NPC located in the town or by noticing a dragon in the sky they go after it."* 


Again, this is something that should be hashed out by all of you ASAP. They could be bored. You might have to make changes (someone else DM's, different setting, a couple of weeks off to "get everyone to recharge their batteries") but whatever they are, there must be communication from all players. Let them say what's on their minds -- and most of all, Listen (don't be defensive).


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## William Ronald

Creamsteak,

Sorry I did not get back to you sooner.  I had some problems trying to post a reply and was away from home (and my PC) most of the day.

It is difficult to make someone care.  Indeed, I  have known people who were so indifferent that they have endangered their lives and their health.  (Also, hurting loved ones in the process.)  Sometimes it is difficult to make a person care about the real world, let alone relatives of a fictional character.

However, actions and inaction do have their consequences.  Consider.  How many people would want to associate with someone who did not lift a hand to save his own brother? Would anyone wish to train such a character?  Also, how would other friends and family members react.  In the case of the half-dragon githyanki and the half-celestial, they may find that they have irate relatives.  As much as some families fight amongst themselves, it is quite another thing for an outside enemy to come in and cause harm.  Possibly the characters could find that they are targeted for vengeance by grieved loved ones.

Then there is always the chance that the death of someone will effect the character.  There is the possibility of an angry, vengeful ghost.  Or possibly sacrificing a character's brother will help a PCs enemy be in a position to harm him.  In Celtic mythology, there was a weapon called a tathlum -- essentially a human head covered with layers of lime.  When thrown at a relative or friend of the deceased, it could be potentially lethal.

In game, I think NPCs will resent being used or abused  by PCs.  They may find every open door slammed shut.  They may even have trouble being hired as adventurers, for who can trust a faithless man. (If you had to hire an adventurer, would you want someone who did not even take the time to save the life of his own brother? Probably not.)

I think that you need to also reward role playing.   Possibly you could reward good role playing.  A positive incentive might work.  It is often easier to use a carrot and a stick, rather than just a carrot or a stick.

By all means talk to the players.  It seems that you and at least some of the players have different visions about what you want out of the campaign.  I second mixmaster's advice, and urge you to talk and listen to  your players.  I hope it works out.  If not, chalk it up to a learning experience and move on.  Sometimes that is all you can do  - in life or gaming.


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## Humanophile

creamsteak said:
			
		

> *...Keep in mind that they "want" to roleplay, they need a little help though. *




I'd think that anyone who _wanted_ to roleplay would go for the big, neon "family member in danger" sign, especially in a group of relative novices.  It sounds like you have some players who want to be social and fall into a role, and others who just want to break stuff.  You'll have to work to keep things flowing.

Training is good.  Reputations can be good if they hinder the party's access to Stuff.  I'd also reccomend putting a kibosh on all non-PHB races or possibly even all non-humans after this.  (I know some people will disagree with me, but in my experience good roleplayers would rather be known for their exploits and abilities, while bad roleplayers are more likely to want grand, implausible backgrounds and lists of stuff.  Templates and odd races tend towards the latter.)

But I agree that the best things to encourage roleplaying are sitting down and talking with everyone, and small carrots.  (May I reccomend a small XP bonus, maybe 10 for appropriately placed catch phrases and war cries, and 50 or 100 for following up on a "useless" interest if it drives play or makes a good scene.)  Good luck.


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## Red Baron

Humanophile said:
			
		

> *I'd think that anyone who wanted to roleplay would go for the big, neon "family member in danger" sign, especially in a group of relative novices.... I'd also reccomend putting a kibosh on all non-PHB races or possibly even all non-humans after this.  (I know some people will disagree with me, but in my experience good roleplayers would rather be known for their exploits and abilities, while bad roleplayers are more likely to want grand, implausible backgrounds and lists of stuff.  Templates and odd races tend towards the latter.)*



I agree, H-phile. I certainly don't mean this to be insulting, but, creamsteak, how old are your players and how long have they been playing? I think most, if not all of us who started gaming when we were quite young probably went through a phase in which having bizarre, outlandish characters (often of decidedly N if not even NE/CE alignments) who only cared about getting Cool Stuff was pretty normal. It's pretty natural to _most_ younger/new players. Still, if you're trying to DM in a different vein, then things can become uncomfortable for you (and, as a result, for everyone else). 

My advice: If the many good suggestions above don't help, then take some time away from DMing with this group, or at least with certain players in the group. It's tough, but having fun is really the bottom line, isn't it? If you're not having fun any more, take the few players (nine is an enormous number of players to keep entertained...) who do roleplay, and continue whith just them -- let the others "spin off" into their own game with one among them DMing in their favourite style. You'll find that everyone's happier, I think. After a while, the others may grow tired of playing their way and come to see the role-play beyond the roll-play.


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## your_mother

*upsetting...*

1. I suggest that as the campaign progresses--if it isn't already this way--that you have any pregnant prostitutes' pimp go to either the local Thieves Guild or member of the ruling body--some big authority figure with lots of power and clout--and drag the PC who fathered the child into a minor legal skirmish. You know, something that can only be settled by the PC agreeing to do something in character, to support the child, etc. Or otherwise require dialogue, arguing, and verbal conflict to resolve. Then force him to follow it up with action.

2. A potent tool that should be used to encourage role-playing is pacing. It involves a few factors: How much time are the player characters are given outside of the action to deliberate, in character? Are they ever trapped in a situation--like the hostage / captive scenario you described--in which they can do nothing but talk with one another, plot, etc.? Can you put an NPC in the cell with them and say, 'you're trapped in the dungeon of the Big Bad Guy... what are you doing? Oh, and you see a grubby gnome who looks like he's been here for at least a decade, he's sitting in the corner, eyeballing you.'

3. githyanki half-dragons should not exist, and neither should undead elves. but that's a horse of a different color.


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## DungeonKeeperUK

*RPing?*

I think its been said before, most new players (if they are new players).. like to cut thier teeth on "neat stuff adn ganrly monster bashing" as time goes on and you players and DMing style change (as they will) things will change...
But the best way to get roleplaying out of your players is to lead by example, keep them in character byt you keeping in character... not saying you don'y, but tis advice there anyway..


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## rounser

> *If I tell player A his brother is kidnapped he doesn't care. Do you see what I am saying?*




Well, yes, but really the "kidnap the family" hook is a particularly poor example.

IMO, if you're going to use family or friends as adventure bait, you are obliged to get some emotional connection going first - have them visit, help - actually make the character care for them somehow.  Only then do you get the right to kidnap them and expect the player to care in more than a lip service way.

In short, you have an obligation to emotionally connect the player to this brother in some way - otherwise the roleplaying will probably be insincere, and (if you're using family members only as ways to manipulate the PCs) - cynical.

If you do a good enough job in making the player care for the PC's family, your job is already done.  This is the opposite of making the players hate (or want to see the comeuppance of) your villains, which is also important...


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## Grim

If you read the Githyanki Culture section in the Psionics handbook, it says that as soon as they reach 15th level, their queen kills them... Or is that Gizerthi? THAT would sure make that player want to roleplay...


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## William Ronald

Rounser's suggestions are quite good.  If the NPCs surrounding a character are part of the PCs lives, it is likelier that the player will be concerned about them.  Possibly have the NPC relatives help the PCs out of a jam, or help them celebrate important events in the character's lives.

It is hard to get some people to role play.  The irony is that I have seen non-human, and even odd-ball characters roleplayed well.  However, this is VERY difficult for most beginning players to do.

Talking to the players is probably the best thing that can be done.  It also helps to create something for the characters to identify with.  Nation, family, faith, an organization -- most people tend to belong to something other than themselves.  Even Conan the Barbarian, a bit of a loner, saw himself as a Cimmerian who would never abandon a friend.  Heck, even Elric of Melnibone had loyalties beyond himself. 

Perhaps it would be good to just have tne new players have human and other relatively normal characters until they have a clearer grasp on role playing.  Is it easy to make a powerful character, yes.  But it is more important to make one that can at least give the impression of having a heart and a soul.  Mind you, powerful characters and role playing are not mutually exclusive.  (Power, I believe, should be earned through blood, sweat, tears.  Along the way, such characters should have built up such interesting and meaningful lives that they would qualify for a good episode of Biography.  Contrast this with a munchkin character whose victories are meaningless and who never truly fought for what they achieved.)


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## Creamsteak

Did I make a mistake?

Last session, about two hours before we were actually going to start, one of the githyanki came over to work on his character.

We were starting anew with the campaign, and he went about rolling a similar character to his previous ones. Thirty minutes into his writing a background another player came in. This player made a similar character and desired to be his younger brother, which was fine with me.

A few hours later I was looking at everyone else's characters... 90% of them were humans, the other character chose a dwarven subrace (mountain I believe).

Two outsider characters and four players handbook races... I was befudled.

While I was looking over characters and discussing the campaign setting I had chosen to use, the Githyanki and rouge were outside talking. I could hear some conversation about, "I don't really feel like playing tonight," from the rouge and that both Githyanki broke up with their girlfriends simultaneously the day before and then got drunk.

I then decided I didn't want to have Githyanki characters at all for the sake of campaign stability. When they all came inside I asked them if they would use the character generator on my computer and make some simpler characters.

They said something, but I can't remember what. I know I didn't get to say anything back. They went outside.

After a few minutes one of them came in and grabbed his stuff and said he was leaving. I asked him why, knowing the answer already, "because you won't let us use our characters we spent two and a half-hours making." In his face, however, I read "I'm getting drunk because I am distraught."

I did not get to play this week. Someone asked I'm 17 and just had my birthday on the 19th. There was some talk about possibly playing, and I would have.

One of the players called me Saturday when we were supposed to play. He said that the Githyanki and Rouge were planning on playing with another DM (a person who I played with when I first started playing, but we had a falling out). He told me they would make plans with me and then break them to get wasted. I felt a bit disturbed and did not know what to say. I called Kevin, one of the three "bad eggs", but the one that I really don't feel betrayed by. He stated he had no idea, and I believed him. But both other players were already at his house. My friend that called me earlier was correct.

I have a little more to say, but I will post that after I get some response to just this material.


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## Humanophile

A game is just a game.  What you sound like you have going on is people being self-centered and troubled, and sadly sitting around a table does not make people more mature.  Step back from the game, and realize that the "bad players" are not likely to improve soon.

(This is not a "kick the bums out" rant.  Doing so is probably one of the worst things to do to friends, and I'm assuming these people are friends of yours.)

I don't envy the position you're in, having to keep a game up while simultaneously not seeming too antagonistic to people who need to work through their own stuff in their own ways.  As a DM, make it a point to superficially write in roles for them, while making those roles of as little importance to the campaign at large as you can.  If you're really skilled, try getting them to blow off games without making it look like you want them out, but that requires skills many people don't have.  (Hint: put a lot of social action or puzzles between fights, puzzles especially as you can't attack them for S&G, and those players will probably lose interest fast.  But don't push it.)  But at the same time, make it clear that you're there for your friends, and (even against previous advice) let them just kick ass if they need to blow off steam.

You've got a tough trick ahead of you.  Good luck.


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## William Ronald

Hi, creamsteak.

Sometimes you have to let friends work out their personal issues.  It seems that there is a lot going on outside of the game.

I have seen more people come and go in 21 years of role playing than I can keep track of without a spreadsheet.  Sometimes people will drift away and come back.

It sounds like it was not the githyanki vs. more regular PCs issue that caused the players to leave.  It seems that they have a few things they have to work out.  Just let them know that you will be there as a friend.  Sometimes, that is all you can do.  (People have to make their own decisions.)

I think Humanophile had a lot to say.  Leave an open door for your friends, and hopefully they will continue to value your friendship.

I wish you good luck with your players and friends.


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## Mark

Sorry to bump this old thread but I am trying to be sure I update the "DMing Advice" thread with the proper urls...


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## Creamsteak

Grah! Did you know this was like my first post on the boards, or at least, the first thread I started? Wow...


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## ES2

In all my months and months and three years of gaming, I can say that no matter what a GM does, how they do it, whatever tactics or whatever they use, if a person does not want to roleplay, they won't roleplay, period.  Nothing a GM can do will help them, or cause them, to roleplay (and I mean getting into characters, thinking like their characters, that kind of stuff).  

I tell everybody that I play with, when I run a game, that the more they put into the game, the more they put into their characters, the more they will, in turn, get out of the game.  If all a person does is roll dice, pick a race, class, equipment, and say they are ready and then only act like they want to fight, and then later they say they are bored while the two others who made up some kind of background and speaking to each other in character are having more fun, then as GM this situation would not be my fault at all.  It would be the player's, and this player would have chosen to not put as much into their character as the other players did.  

It's not just up to the GM, its up to the players also.  Sometimes things outside gaming come up, like a split up in a relationship, and if that occurs its better to play video games where you can kill things (like Soul Caliber 2, Tekken, things like that) are better alternatives than to roleplay.  

But, I think some players also expect the GM to provide everything for them, and those players won't get as much out of the game due to this miss-expectation.


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## ForceUser

> *How do I get more roleplaying out of my players?*



Create a campaign environment that encourages roleplaying. Create adventure situations that require something more than hack-and-slash to accomplish - perhaps the PCs need to convince someone to do something, or maybe they need to investigate something by asking a lot of people questions. Make your NPCs memorable by using distinct voices, postures, and attitudes for each one. If an NPC is entertaining, the players will want to interact with him. Ham it up, and don't get embarrassed. Finally, make the players aware that they'll get extra XP for good roleplaying.


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## Faraer

Do people really use in-game solutions to out-of-game problems successfully? I've always found talking to players works better than trying to manipulate or trick them.

I'd say that pretending to be someone else is normal, something every child can do, while playing psychopathic chess-pieces who lust after imaginary wealth is a learned response...


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## bret

One question you might also want to ask yourself is if you punish your players for roleplaying.

If they develope relationships with NPCs, do those NPCs suddenly start getting kidnapped and threatened at every turn? Each time they put some trust in an NPC they have been dealing with, does that NPC betray them? If they help a community, does the community welcome them or still try and cheat them out of every coin they can?

I remember finding out in one campaign that I was the only character with any family ties. I found this out after an adventure that started out as a bethrothal celebration for my character's sister. There were over 30 deaths before we took out the vampire that has shown up, and never did catch the murderer.

The other players mentioned that fear of something like this happening was why none of them had defined family or friends in their background.


Make sure you aren't teaching the players all the wrong lessons when they do attempt to roleplay.


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## S'mon

Personally I would just go along with the group's preferred playing style.  By the sound of it they would read CE to alignment-detection, and should be wanted for murder, theft et al in most places.  I'd let them be hunted renegades and see how it feels to have high-level NPC adventurer parties out to kill them and nick their stuff.  I don't believe in forcing players to act lawful, or good, or whatever to fit with my plans - I give them a world to play in, potential patrons, enemies etc.  My last group basically 'went evil' due to a money argument with a patron and ended the game as hunted renegades, the current group seem to be more into working with the local authority figures and are building their reputations as 'good guy' heroes.  I enjoyed GMing both games.


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## JoeGKushner

One question that crops up into my mind when seeing the diverse racial types of your player's characters is where are the parents?  Half Dragon? Celestial? These beings have ties to other places and even other planes and it might make for some good opportunities to add those elements into the game.

On the other hand, there is nothing wrong with an action adventure style RPG and if the players are having fun, run wild with it.

There are other ways to incorporate role playing. Some of them requiring some campaign altering decesions. Instead of thinking big foe that they can't beat, try big foe that beats them, strips them of their items, and puts them in a prison plane where they can only navigate from place to place by helping those in power here as they play off once another trying to gather power.


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## hong

JoeGKushner said:
			
		

> One question that crops up into my mind when seeing the diverse racial types of your player's characters is where are the parents?



One question that crops up into my mind when seeing the diverse zombie threads walking the boards is: this really is the Night of the Living Thread all over again, isn't it?


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