# Rearranging the sub-forums...again



## Alzrius (Mar 28, 2010)

I just noticed that the structure for the various sub-forums have been rearranged, and in some cases renamed (though it doesn't look like any were merged).

I have to ask, what was the impetus for this latest round of changes? Everything seemed fine the way it was before - now it'll be necessary to grow reacquainted with the new structure, and while I don't think that'll take very long, I'm curious why it was done in the first place.


----------



## jeffh (Mar 28, 2010)

At a guess, because it was goofy to have to look to two different sections for, say, 4E discussion.

I almost immediately liked the new organization better, and it's along more intuitive lines so I don't see the reacquaintance process as a serious problem.


----------



## Theo R Cwithin (Mar 28, 2010)

After I got over the confusion (  ), I like the new arrangement.


----------



## Relique du Madde (Mar 28, 2010)

Media lounge and "Off topic forem formerly known as <What ever that word was>" were merged.


----------



## Morrus (Mar 29, 2010)

Combining quiet forums, general tidiness (the list was too long), a more intuitive arrangement, and I like the occasional change!

Changes aren't finished yet.  But it's mostly done.


----------



## stonegod (Mar 29, 2010)

Moving the Talking the Talk and Living Worlds down makes organizational sense, but I fear the lesser visibility of the latter and the errant posts of the former going into Playing the Game. We'll see how it plays out.

Merging Off-Topic and Media, however, seems odder.


----------



## Morrus (Mar 29, 2010)

stonegod said:


> Merging Off-Topic and Media, however, seems odder.




Both are comparative graveyards (save Truth Seeker's weekly 10+ posts listing upcoming TV episode names).  I'm hoping the combination will result in a more lively envireonment for non-gaming discussion.


----------



## Kzach (Mar 29, 2010)

So, err... is there no longer a 4e rules forum? In which case, does that mean we can ask 4e rules questions in the 4e discussion forum?


EDIT: Nevermind, I'm a retard. Yes, you can quote me on that.


----------



## Morrus (Mar 29, 2010)

The 4E Rules and 3E Rules forums have been renamed 4E Discussion and 3E Discussion respectively. The forums descriptions remain the same, except that all system-specific discussion should be in there rather than General.


----------



## Relique du Madde (Mar 29, 2010)

Morrus said:


> Both are comparative graveyards (save Truth Seeker's weekly 10+ posts listing upcoming TV episode names).  I'm hoping the combination will result in a more lively *HIVEMIND* discussion.




fify


----------



## Aeson (Mar 29, 2010)

I'm ok with the changes so far. The thing I'm not fond of is the popup if you're not signed in. Sometimes I like to read the forums with logging in. Is that staying or is it just a test?


----------



## Orius (Mar 29, 2010)

Morrus said:


> Both are comparative graveyards (save Truth Seeker's weekly 10+ posts listing upcoming TV episode names).  I'm hoping the combination will result in a more lively envireonment for non-gaming discussion.




Yeah, it's a shame really, the Media Lounge was getting kind of dead so this merge wasn't surprising.  I like to hang around there a lot so i noticed it.

Didn't notice the deadness of the off-topic forum but I only go there when I feel like messing with the Hivers.   I wonder if the deadness is partially because a certain former member got banned, thus ending his massive multi-way sockpuppeting.


----------



## Thanee (Mar 29, 2010)

stonegod said:


> Moving the Talking the Talk and Living Worlds down makes organizational sense, but I fear the lesser visibility of the latter and the errant posts of the former going into Playing the Game. We'll see how it plays out.




I especially fear, that new folks now post in the "Playing the Game" forum instead of "Talking the Talk".

It would probably be better to have the OOC Forum on top and the Game Forum as a subforum.

Bye
Thanee


----------



## Nikosandros (Mar 29, 2010)

With the new structure, what is the proper location for pre-d20 D&D?


----------



## Thanee (Mar 29, 2010)

> *D&D Legacy and Other RPGs*
> These forums are for talking about the rules and house rules of 3.x Edition D&D, 2nd Edition D&D, 1st Edition D&D, OD&D and any other pre-4E version of D&D, along with all other RPGs.




Bye
Thanee


----------



## Piratecat (Mar 29, 2010)

Thanee said:


> I especially fear, that new folks now post in the "Playing the Game" forum instead of "Talking the Talk".
> 
> It would probably be better to have the OOC Forum on top and the Game Forum as a subforum.
> 
> ...



Either is cool with us. Can I deputize you to start a thread in the OOC forum asking about opinions, and then link us to it here? It's a simple change if there's a consensus.


----------



## Piratecat (Mar 29, 2010)

Alzrius said:


> Everything seemed fine the way it was before - now it'll be necessary to grow reacquainted with the new structure, and while I don't think that'll take very long, I'm curious why it was done in the first place.



I think the previous forum listing was long, unintuitive, unwieldy and redundant in some cases. We're a big fan of fewer forums when possible.


----------



## Morrus (Mar 29, 2010)

Nikosandros said:


> With the new structure, what is the proper location for pre-d20 D&D?




Yup, we could clarify that a little.  Some of the old forum names and descriptions are still in place, but they go in the 3E forums (which we'll rename "D&D Legacy").


----------



## Nikosandros (Mar 29, 2010)

Thanee said:


> > D&D Legacy and Other RPGs
> > These forums are for talking about the rules and house rules of 3.x Edition D&D, 2nd Edition D&D, 1st Edition D&D, OD&D and any other pre-4E version of D&D, along with all other RPGs.
> 
> 
> ...



I read that, but it's unclear in which specific subforum it would go? 3rd edition because it's for pre-3e? Or the Other RPG (but this technically is for non-D&D)?


----------



## Morrus (Mar 29, 2010)

Nikosandros said:


> I read that, but it's unclear in which specific subforum it would go? 3rd edition because it's for pre-3e? Or the Other RPG (but this technically is for non-D&D)?




I've clarified the forum names and descriptions now.  

If we get a lot of legacy D&D threads, I *might* consider a single Legacy Catch-all forum.  But we'll see.


----------



## freyar (Mar 29, 2010)

I'm getting the following error when trying to access the Hosted Forums (now only listed as a subforum for General RPG Discussion AFAICT):



> Redirect Loop
> 
> Iceweasel has detected that the server is redirecting the request for this address in a way that will never complete.




I'm guessing that this is due to the forum rearrangement somehow (it's happening on firefox 3.6 and iceweasel 3.0 , which is also just firefox).

Also, this is just a matter of convenience, but I'd appreciate having direct links to the Creature Catalog forums on the main forum page again.


----------



## Morrus (Mar 29, 2010)

Fixed that.  Had the link and the category with the same name.


----------



## Moon_Goddess (Mar 29, 2010)

Is it possible to make just a link to the sub sub forums, it's unweildy to have to have 2 layers to get to the L4W and LEB


----------



## Morrus (Mar 29, 2010)

The problem is that there are so many hosted forums, all craeted at different times and in different categories, some of which don't really make much sense.  The whole area needs cleaning up, the number of layers removed, etc., but it's quite a big task (simple, but lengthy).  I'll get to it at some point, though, I promise!


----------



## catsclaw227 (Mar 29, 2010)

I'm not a fan of merging Media and Off Topic.  I liked reading the various media threads and they weren't cluttered with a bunch of stuff that had nothing to do with books or movies and such, like "Request Math Help Regarding Tsunamis".

Oh well.  We all can't be pleased...


----------



## garyh (Mar 29, 2010)

Please do NOT merge the Living World forums!  Each Living World has it's own things going on (adventures, discussions, proposals, etc.), and merging them would confuse everyone.


----------



## John Crichton (Mar 29, 2010)

Well done so far, Morrus.  

I like the changes.


----------



## Nifft (Mar 30, 2010)

It's nice that there's an unambiguous place to put all the threads about whatever appears on DDI Dragon each week.

Cheers, -- N


----------



## Thanee (Mar 30, 2010)

Piratecat said:


> Either is cool with us. Can I deputize you to start a thread in the OOC forum asking about opinions, and then link us to it here? It's a simple change if there's a consensus.




Sure, I can do that. 

Bye
Thanee


----------



## Thanee (Mar 30, 2010)

catsclaw227 said:


> I'm not a fan of merging Media and Off Topic.




Agreed, that's quite a mess in there.

Bye
Thanee


----------



## TerraDave (Mar 30, 2010)

Moving from 4E rules to 4E discussion is a pretty big change. As is the creation of the legacy forum.

Do people know? Will you be able to move threads again to sort of let them know?

I am not saying its bad, just that we are clueless.


----------



## freyar (Mar 30, 2010)

*how to?*

With the forum rearrangement, the hosted forums are subforums of General RPG Discussion.  Anyone know how to mark the main forum as being read without marking all the subforums as being read also?


----------



## jaerdaph (Mar 30, 2010)

On a positive note, I just discovered the awesomeness that is Plots & Places because of its new placement. I was only marginally aware of it before.  

It's like seeing a whole new side of EN World.


----------



## Mouseferatu (Mar 30, 2010)

catsclaw227 said:


> I'm not a fan of merging Media and Off Topic.  I liked reading the various media threads and they weren't cluttered with a bunch of stuff that had nothing to do with books or movies and such, like "Request Math Help Regarding Tsunamis".
> 
> Oh well.  We all can't be pleased...




I'm with Catsclaw. I really liked having a media-specific forum. I understand why you might want to combine two forums that weren't getting a lot of attention... But I'm afraid that, for me, needing to dig through all the other OT stuff to find the media threads is more likely to get me to stop visiting _either_, as opposed to inspiring me to visit _both_.


----------



## Piratecat (Mar 30, 2010)

Mouseferatu said:


> I'm with Catsclaw. I really liked having a media-specific forum. I understand why you might want to combine two forums that weren't getting a lot of attention... But I'm afraid that, for me, needing to dig through all the other OT stuff to find the media threads is more likely to get me to stop visiting _either_, as opposed to inspiring me to visit _both_.



Hmm. Tags might help with this - simple ones such as "media" and "OT" only. One click and you'd filter everything else out.


----------



## Crothian (Mar 31, 2010)

Is the market place forum gone?  I was using a thread there to keep track of trade stuff.


----------



## Nonei (Mar 31, 2010)

I mostly like the new forum/subforum structure, although I have a few comments.  They seem much more organized now 

There is a suggestion in the legacy discussion forum to separate out pre-3E from 3e again, but instead of 3e-specific, have the forum include both 3e and D20 derivatives.  That seems to me like it would be very helpful, since there's quite a variety with 3.5, pathfinder, True20, and all the other various D20 systems.

I personally would also like to see the hosted forums as not a subforum of  general discussion, and 'plots and places' listed in the forum jump just underneath the general discussion forum.  It's kind of hiding down there lol.

My other suggestion is to combine all the system-specific forums under one heading, instead of having both 4e and other.  This is kind of a selfish suggestion, since it would make the forum jump box narrower and fit better on my screen without scrolling LOL.  Also, it seems a little odd to have a section with only 2 forums in it...

Thank you!


----------



## fba827 (Mar 31, 2010)

I think consolidated forums makes it a lot easier to make joke forum names for april 1st   Not that anyone would even be thinking or planning such a thing...


----------



## Thanee (Mar 31, 2010)

Piratecat said:


> Either is cool with us. Can I deputize you to start a thread in the OOC forum asking about opinions, and then link us to it here? It's a simple change if there's a consensus.




I made a poll, and even among the very first comments one idea has been proposed, which I had toyed with as well (which is a little more complicated, however).

Basically, make a new main forum (called, e.g., Play by Post), which is for general threads, recruitment threads and the likes.

And move all the other forums as subforums into that one.

Talking the Talk (OOC), Playing the Game (IC), Plots & Places (RG - maybe just a link to the forum, because I guess it is meant to be more prominent up there, as it is now), and the Living Games main forum (with the various Living Games subforums, as it is now).

Would that be doable?

I'm reasonably sure, that if I make a new poll, this structure will get a vast majority voting for it.

Bye
Thanee


----------



## Deset Gled (Mar 31, 2010)

Just a thought... Would it be better to merge Media with the Software Computers and Video Games forum?  The tech stuff is a kind of media, and I think the crossover between the two would be better than the crossover between Media and Off Topic.

Of course, it might be even harder to go back.


----------



## freyar (Mar 31, 2010)

freyar said:


> With the forum rearrangement, the hosted forums are subforums of General RPG Discussion.  Anyone know how to mark the main forum as being read without marking all the subforums as being read also?






Nonei said:


> I personally would also like to see the hosted forums as not a subforum of  general discussion, and 'plots and places' listed in the forum jump just underneath the general discussion forum.  It's kind of hiding down there lol.




Moving the hosted forums somewhere else would help out with my question, too!   I'm not sure the best place for all of them, though the Creature Catalog could logically go under Legacy Houserules.


----------



## Orius (Apr 1, 2010)

Deset Gled said:


> Just a thought... Would it be better to merge Media with the Software Computers and Video Games forum?  The tech stuff is a kind of media, and I think the crossover between the two would be better than the crossover between Media and Off Topic.
> 
> Of course, it might be even harder to go back.




That might be an interesting approach, especially since the tech forum  is even deader than the media lounge.


----------



## Piratecat (Apr 1, 2010)

We may still merge Tech into OT/Media. Dunno. I agree that it doesn't need its own forum.


----------



## Jdvn1 (Apr 1, 2010)

Morrus said:


> Both are comparative graveyards (save Truth Seeker's weekly 10+ posts listing upcoming TV episode names).  I'm hoping the combination will result in a more lively envireonment for non-gaming discussion.



I always thought the graveyardness came and went in sort of cycles.

But, maybe it'll be a positive effect. A little experimentation never hurt anyone, right?


----------



## Thanee (Apr 2, 2010)

@Piratecat: Can I get an answer to my above question? 

Bye
Thanee


----------



## Piratecat (Apr 2, 2010)

Thanee said:


> @Piratecat: Can I get an answer to my above question?
> 
> Bye
> Thanee



I won't have a chance to make changes anyways until I'm home next week in any case (I'm traveling over Easter.) What's the difference between the PbP general forum and Talking the Talk? I don't see much need for TtT in this case. Am I missing something?


----------



## Mark (Apr 2, 2010)

There seems to be a lot of non-General forum threads getting started in the General forum.  I've seen it suggested that a 3E thread be restarted in the Legacy forum but there seems to be an uptick in 4E threads (that are specifically 4E threads with no General value) that are not being suggested as better in the D&D 4th Edition Discussion.  Some threads even seem to be flat out promoting 4E/WotC events and products in the General forum.  Why the difference?


----------



## Morrus (Apr 2, 2010)

Mark said:


> Why the difference?




Mainly because it's Easter and we're not really about at the moment.


----------



## Mark (Apr 2, 2010)

Morrus said:


> Mainly because it's Easter and we're not really about at the moment.





Thanks.  I'll layoff the issue until things get more in step.  Just wondered if I was missing something or not understanding the new forums divisions.


----------



## Thanee (Apr 2, 2010)

Piratecat said:


> I won't have a chance to make changes anyways until I'm home next week in any case (I'm traveling over Easter.) What's the difference between the PbP general forum and Talking the Talk? I don't see much need for TtT in this case. Am I missing something?




Well, it's mostly because that way the IC and OOC will be on the same layer, which just makes sense.

Of course, a simple forum index (I mean something like what you get when you click on Living Worlds now) would work.

It would, however, be necessary to know what is acceptable and what is not to proceed (because it makes little sense to tell you what the forum members would want if that is something you wouldn't do ).

Bye
Thanee


----------



## Thanee (Apr 10, 2010)

@Piratecat: I have made a new poll with some options now (here).

I hope that these are all acceptable solutions to you, and that depending on what will be the prefered option, these changes are possible. 

Bye
Thanee


----------



## CapnZapp (Apr 11, 2010)

Where do I find the EN Publishing forum?

(If the answer is "it's gone", how do I go about finding the threads from that forum?)


----------

