# I also have the books [merged] (info on upcomming Power sources and more)



## RandomCitizenX

*I also have the books (info on upcomming Power sources and more)*

Just managed to get my hands on all three books. Only started to flip through them and noticed a few things. First they have a little sidebar which talks about power sources and confirms primal, elemental, psionic, shadow, and ki. Also there are only 4 Epic Destinies in the PHB: Archadmage, Deadly Trickster, Demigod, and Eternal Seeker. Once I have had time to go through more I should be able to answer some questions.


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## TwoSix

RandomCitizenX said:
			
		

> Just managed to get my hands on all three books. Only started to flip through them and noticed a few things. First they have a little sidebar which talks about power sources and confirms primal, elemental, psionic, shadow, and ki. Also there are only 4 Epic Destinies in the PHB: Archadmage, Deadly Trickster, Demigod, and Eternal Seeker. Once I have had time to go through more I should be able to answer some questions.




Hmm, confirmation of ki as a power source, and that's the first time I've seen elemental listed as being a separate power source.  Very interesting indeed.  Let the grid speculation begin!


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## MMKyt

Can you post full list of paragon paths.


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## RandomCitizenX

MMKyt said:
			
		

> Can you post full list of paragon paths.



Cleric 
-Angelic avenger
-Divine oracle
-Radiant servant
-Warpriest
Fighter 
-Iron vanguard
-Kensei
-Pit fighter
-Swordmaster
Paladin 
-Astral weapon
-Champion of order
-Hospitaler
-Justiciar
Ranger 
-Battlefield archer
-Beast stalker
-Pathfinder
-Stormwarden
Rogue 
-Cat burglar
-Daggermaster
-Master infiltrator
-Shadow assassin
Warlock 
-Doomsayer
-Feytouched
-Life-stealer
Warlord 
-Battle captain
-Combat veteran
-Knight commander
-Sword marshal
Wizard 
-Battle mage
-Blood mage
-Spellstorm mage
-Wizard of the Spiral Tower


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## marune

RandomCitizenX said:
			
		

> Cleric
> -Warlock
> -Doomsayer
> -Feytouched
> -Life-stealer




Did you forget one or the warlock is the only one with 3 p.p. ?


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## Wormwood

Thanks, rcX!


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## pogminky

Looks like no bare-knuckle fighter path?


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## greyscale1

Random. You are kingly!

This is great info, thanks a ton!

Anything thats new and interesting you would like to share?

(I would love some info on some of the rituals in the book, but the more the better!)

Again, superkudos for any info!


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## Vael

Just a few wizard questions, if you don't mind. First, what are the names of the Wizard's other two at-will powers, we know the Ray of Frost, Magic Missile and Scorching Burst. Second, any info on the wizard's other cantrips and class features would be awesome.


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## RandomCitizenX

skeptic said:
			
		

> Did you forget one or the warlock is the only one with 3 p.p. ?




They only have one for each build option. They are also the only class with 3 builds listed. The other classes look to have two for each of the build options i.e. Stormwarden and Pathfinder are both twf while Beast Stalker and Battlefield Archer are ranged.

Sadly there are no unarmed fighter options (heres hoping they are in the DDI or Martial Handbook)


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## Saragon

I confess that I'm disappointed in the small number of epic destinies. I'm hoping "Demigod" is a good enough catch-all, since the others seem a bit... specialized (e.g. Archmage and Deadly Trickster have obvious lead-in paths.)


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## Irda Ranger

RandomCitizenX said:
			
		

> Warlock
> -Doomsayer
> -Feytouched
> -Life-stealer



And weirdly, each PP sounds appropriate for only one of the Pacts, so any given Warlock really only has one choice.


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## MMKyt

Thank you. And what about full description of Daggermaster and Life-stealer.


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## Family

From Agrias Oaks on another board.



> Dwarf info
> 
> +2 con, +2 wis
> +2 to dungeoneering and endurance
> 
> +5 saves against poison
> can use 2nd wind as a minor action instead of standard
> gain prof with throwing and warhammers
> Move at normal speed when otherwise would be encumbered by armor or heavy load
> get pushed back by 1 square less then normal, and can make a saving throw to immediately get up if knocked prone.


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## RandomCitizenX

The two other at wills are called Cloud of Daggers and Thunderwave. Cloud of Daggers is a Force attack and Thunderwave is a Sonic blast


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## Amy Kou'ai

RandomCitizenX said:
			
		

> JAlso there are only 4 Epic Destinies in the PHB: Archadmage, Deadly Trickster, Demigod, and Eternal Seeker.




My question:

Are they cool enough that we won't need to worry about the limited number of epic destinies being tedious for awhile?


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## habaal

I can see any character being a Demigod, but only one an archmage or a Deadly Trickster. Kinda lame, dont you think? Guess I'll decide once I'll read through it all. If all those ED's only fit one class, we will see tons of Demigods roaming the land 'couse there aren't enough options to go around.
Assuming the Demmigod is a general ED, that is.

What do you think?


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## Family

I'm hoping the deadly trickster ends up like Jack Sparrow at the end of the 3rd movie.


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## jedrious

*Have books: Post Questions*

I just got my books in, post questions, I'm going to take 3 hours to digest the books for myself and then I'll come back on and answer them


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## Cheesepie

These threads totally need to be consolidated!


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## Voss

Family said:
			
		

> I'm hoping the deadly trickster ends up like Jack Sparrow at the end of the 3rd movie.




I'm not sure that 'completely crazy', 'compulsively treacherous' and 'indeterminable sexuality' are really useful and appropriate epic destiny features


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## jelmore

So that means we have all 8 power sources that WotC said they were looking at, right?

Arcane
Divine
Elemental
Ki
Martial
Primal
Psionic
Shadow

Plus, the unofficial ninth power source: Ignorance


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## Counterspin

Voss said:
			
		

> I'm not sure that 'completely crazy', 'compulsively treacherous' and 'indeterminable sexuality' are really useful and appropriate epic destiny features




I must vigorously disagree.


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## Family

Voss said:
			
		

> I'm not sure that 'completely crazy', 'compulsively treacherous' and 'indeterminable sexuality' are really useful and appropriate epic destiny features




Disagree.

And you forgot looking for a good drink


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## RandomCitizenX

Having just looked over the Deadly Trickster it seems to have a favored by fortune flavor. They get an ability which lets them force the DM to roll a 1 with no chance to reroll as well as a Daily Utility that recovers all HP, healing surges, automatically save against all effect on them, plus recover either all their encounter powers or all other daily powers.


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## Voss

I am a bit confused by the elemental power source.  The wizard already throws energy around.  Also, to one extent or another, can most of the other arcane or divine casters. Primal will probably get in on that action to.  So whats the point of this one?


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## proto128

RandomCitizenX said:
			
		

> Having just looked over the Deadly Trickster it seems to have a favored by fortune flavor. They get an ability which lets them force the DM to roll a 1 with no chance to reroll as well as a Daily Utility that recovers all HP, healing surges, automatically save against all effect on them, plus recover either all their encounter powers or all other daily powers.




*FRY:  *Hey watch out!
_(Zoidberg eats him.)_
*ZOIDBERG:  *Uh oh!
*LEELA:  *Oh my god, he ate Fry! Fry is dead!
_(Fry slides up behind them.)_
*FRY:  *It's OK, I had another guy!
_(Everyone cheers.)_


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## Voss

RandomCitizenX said:
			
		

> Having just looked over the Deadly Trickster it seems to have a favored by fortune flavor. They get an ability which lets them force the DM to roll a 1 with no chance to reroll as well as a Daily Utility that recovers all HP, healing surges, automatically save against all effect on them, plus recover either all their encounter powers or all other daily powers.




Wow... thats, uh, well, so much better than the Archmage utility.  In every single way.  You sure it does all of that?  Because getting one daily power back as a standard action doesn't even measure against that.  At all


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## Knight Otu

Voss said:
			
		

> I am a bit confused by the elemental power source.  The wizard already throws energy around.  Also, to one extent or another, can most of the other arcane or divine casters. Primal will probably get in on that action to.  So whats the point of this one?



Primal probably less so (it seems to have more of a shapeshifting/weather focus), and Divine seems to be more of a Radiant/Necrotic focus. Still, it seems quite odd, also having both Martial and Ki. Is there some hint at the flavors of the power sources?


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## Piratecat

Amy Kou'ai said:
			
		

> My question:
> 
> Are they cool enough that we won't need to worry about the limited number of epic destinies being tedious for awhile?



Actually, I am almost sure it was a hard decision after they ran out of space.

Incidentally, I merged this thread with Jedrious's. I figured they will fit together nicely.

Who did you guys order your books from?


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## Counterspin

Everyone here and on rpg.net who claims to has the books says they're from buy.com


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## The_Fan

Voss said:
			
		

> Wow... thats, uh, well, so much better than the Archmage utility.  In every single way.  You sure it does all of that?  Because getting one daily power back as a standard action doesn't even measure against that.  At all



 I think that's more meant to compare to the Arcane Spirit ability. That's the Deadly Trickster's "Not dead yet!" ability.


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## VBMEW-01

One question, if you would be so gracious, and then I'll be utterly content to read the answers to everyone else's.

Can you briefly describe the differences of being various sizes (just small, medium, and large will do)?  This is an item that has come up in a race that me and my team of creators are working on.


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## RandomCitizenX

Voss said:
			
		

> Wow... thats, uh, well, so much better than the Archmage utility.  In every single way.  You sure it does all of that?  Because getting one daily power back as a standard action doesn't even measure against that.  At all




It is even worse... Epic Trick is only a minor action..... yeah...



Ki is described as manipulating the power of your soul's energy, so I guess that is why they aren't lumping it in with martial. 


I got my books at a local independent book store. They are really unpredictable on when they get new things and most of their business comes from used books that they resell (which is why I am assuming they were willing to part with the books early)


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## Family

Voss said:
			
		

> I'm not sure that 'completely crazy', 'compulsively treacherous' and 'indeterminable sexuality' are really useful and appropriate epic destiny features



Mr Voss, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I've ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response was there anything that could even be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this thread is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.  -Adam Sandler 

And no I'm not a:





It's just that I put the Taco Chi in Chaotic


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## Drakhar

I'm planning on playing a Dragonborn for my first character so I've got a few questions on them. For starters there were rumors floating around that DB's could possibly fly at some point? Also what stats are you able to pick to add to the DB's Breath weapon?


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## RandomCitizenX

Only size description I could find was detailing how many squares things occupied, how that meshed with terrain rules, and how far the creatures reach was.

Small and Medium use the same rules, while large creatures occupy a 2x2 on the map and have reach 2 if they are tall.


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## The_Fan

Do the other size categories still exist? I hope colossal does, because I just bought the red dragon :/


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## ShockMeSane

I fully expect this post to be over 20 pages long when I get home tonight.

All the information you can provide on the 2 warlock pacts we haven't seen would be awesome, and maybe a high level ability example that seems representative for each pact? Hehe.


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## Rex Blunder

Besides die.com, it also rhymes with "they left out the bard! WHY??" dot com, although it has significantly fewer syllables.

I just got a confirmation email that my order has been shipped.


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## VBMEW-01

Thanks, I almost figured there wouldn't be much crunch in size this go around (its all hidden in the other stats, I'd imagine)


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## RandomCitizenX

Drakhar said:
			
		

> I'm planning on playing a Dragonborn for my first character so I've got a few questions on them. For starters there were rumors floating around that DB's could possibly fly at some point? Also what stats are you able to pick to add to the DB's Breath weapon?




You choose between Str, Dex, and Con... no sign of flight.


Size runs Tiny, Small, Medium, Large, Huge, and Gargantuan

Star Pact lets you get a +1 bonus for each cursed creature you kill on the next turn. Infernal gives you temp HP equal to your level. All pacts get Prime Shot and Shadow Walk. Warlocks can also use rods and wands as implements.


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## The_Fan

RandomCitizenX said:
			
		

> You choose between Str, Dex, and Con... no sign of flight.
> 
> 
> Size runs Tiny, Small, Medium, Large, Huge, and Gargantuan
> 
> Star Pact lets you get a +1 bonus for each cursed creature you kill on the next turn. Infernal gives you temp HP equal to your level. All pacts get Prime Shot and Shadow Walk. Warlocks can also use rods and wands as implements.



 %$#@! Q'bert is angry!

My poor colossal will never see use...


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## Drakhar

Another quick question. What's the stats on a Bastard Sword, and will I need to take a feat to use it one handed?


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## DerekSTheRed

Can you feint in combat and if so how does it work?  If you have time could you list the special maneuvers in the combat chapter like grapple, trip, disarm etc.

Derek


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## Mouseferatu

The_Fan said:
			
		

> %$#@! Q'bert is angry!
> 
> My poor colossal will never see use...




Yes it will. "Gargantuan" basically includes "..and up."


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## RandomCitizenX

The_Fan said:
			
		

> %$#@! Q'bert is angry!
> 
> My poor colossal will never see use...




Gargantuan now covers bigger creatures as well, so there is hope yet


Bastard swords are versatile superior weapons, so you will need to take a weapon proficiency feat to wield them it seems

Also just found a chart for weapon damage scale based on size.


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## Family

The_Fan said:
			
		

> My poor colossal will never see use...



By section 12, subsection A, paragraph vi of the regulations I am mandated authorized compelled and obliged to make the following remarks.

1: Your statement is redundant to be posting on a D&D message board. 
2: The term "colossal" is under question.


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## Voss

Ah, a useful question: 

the point buy system-
Starting points, cost for each score, 'typical' number of points you get to spend.

Please and thank you.


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## Nahat Anoj

For the love of Pete, what do Gnomes and Orcs get??  As PC races, of course.  (I've asked this question, like, three times on various fora   )

Is there an Aasimar/Celestial race in the MM?


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## ShockMeSane

Oh, and just because I really want to know, whenever someone gets around to the MM:

Beholders. Tell me!


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## Knight Otu

Mouseferatu said:
			
		

> Yes it will. "Gargantuan" basically includes "..and up."



Like the old colossal, then. And Tiny includes "... and down, if you really need those?" With size being deempha-sized, it makes sense to shave off some size categories.


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## andarilhor

I Think my question get lost in thread:

The 1st level wizard starts with two daily spells, and I want to know if they continue to receive two dailies and two utilities instead of one in higher levels, or they receive only one of each but can wider his abilities finding then in scrolls and spellbooks?

Thanks for all your answering!


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## Amy Kou'ai

RandomCitizenX said:
			
		

> Warlocks can also use rods and wands as implements.




Wait, rods?  What?

Mind telling us about arcane implements and the wizard implement paths?


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## RandomCitizenX

Voss said:
			
		

> Ah, a useful question:
> 
> the point buy system-
> Starting points, cost for each score, 'typical' number of points you get to spend.
> 
> Please and thank you.




you start with 8, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10 and buy up from their with 22 points. It starts on point for point basis until you get to 14, then it is 2 points for one ability point until you get to 17 when it jumps to 3 points.

To get from 10 to 18 is 16 points

Orcs get a bonus to Str and Con, and their racial power is an encounter attack that lets you regain a healing surge. They also gain an additional 2 move on a charge.

Gnomes get a bonus in Int and Cha, and their racial power is an encounter reaction that makes them invisible until they attack or the end of their next turn. They can also get a free stealth check if they have cover or concelment when they make an initiative check.


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## Voss

RandomCitizenX said:
			
		

> you start with 8, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10 and buy up from their with 22 points. It starts on point for point basis until you get to 14, then it is 2 points for one ability point until you get to 17 when it jumps to 3 points.
> 
> To get from 10 to 18 is 16 points
> 
> Orcs get a bonus to Str and Con, and their racial power is an encounter attack that lets you regain a healing surge. They also gain an additional 2 move on a charge.




Ta, I appreciate it. It actually works out for the KotS characters and the tiefling warlord, which is good.
Wouldn't 18 be 15 points?
1 (11) + 1 (12) + 1 (13) + 2 (14) + 2(15) + 2(16) + 3 (17) +3 (18) =15


Orcs sound potentially interesting.  Good fighters and warlords, not bad at clerics and paladins, depending on the powers you pick.


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## RandomCitizenX

Amy Kou'ai said:
			
		

> Wait, rods?  What?
> 
> Mind telling us about arcane implements and the wizard implement paths?




Wizards get to pick between staff, wand, and orb as implement mastery. Which one you pick gives you access to a different set of effects you can use when you have that implement. For example, the Orb implement let's you either inflict a penalty on the next saving throw of a creature you hit with an ongoing effect or increase the duration of one of the at-wills by a turn.


The spell book allows wizards to pick two known dailies and utilities every time they gain should normally gain one. You can't prepare the same spell twice. If you swap a spell for another using the retraining option the spell is lost from your spell book as well.


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## Nahat Anoj

RandomCitizenX said:
			
		

> Orcs get a bonus to Str and Con, and their racial power is an encounter attack that lets you regain a healing surge. They also gain an additional 2 move on a charge.
> 
> Gnomes get a bonus in Int and Cha, and their racial power is an encounter reaction that makes them invisible until they attack or the end of their next turn. They can also get a free stealth check if they have cover or concelment when they make an initiative check.



Thanks!


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## DerekSTheRed

Voss said:
			
		

> Ta, I appreciate it. It actually works out for the KotS characters and the tiefling warlord, which is good.
> Wouldn't 18 be 15 points?
> 1 (11) + 1 (12) + 1 (13) + 2 (14) + 2(15) + 2(16) + 3 (17) +3 (18) =15




If it works like 3E then going from 13 to 14 is still one point.  That means going from 10 to 18 is worth 14 points but going from 8 to 18 is 16.

Derek


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## RandomCitizenX

Voss said:
			
		

> Ta, I appreciate it. It actually works out for the KotS characters and the tiefling warlord, which is good.
> Wouldn't 18 be 15 points?
> 1 (11) + 1 (12) + 1 (13) + 2 (14) + 2(15) + 2(16) + 3 (17) +3 (18) =15
> 
> 
> Orcs sound potentially interesting.  Good fighters and warlords, not bad at clerics and paladins, depending on the powers you pick.




Just checked it again, and you are right. It should be +4 to get to the 18.


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## Family

Now THIS is crunchy!!

Mr. Lunt: I think you look like Captain Crunch! 
Pa Grape: Huh? No I don't! 
Mr. Lunt: Do too! 
Pa Grape: Do not! 
Mr. Lunt: You're making me hungry. 
Pa Grape: That's it! You're walking the plank! 
Mr. Lunt: Says who? 
Pa Grape: Says the captain, that's who! 
Mr. Lunt: Oh yeah? Aye-aye, Captain Crunch! Hehehehe! 
Pa Grape: Arrrrrrrgh! 





 

-Thanks guys.


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## Voss

RandomCitizenX said:
			
		

> Just checked it again, and you are right. It should be +4 to get to the 18.




Ouch.
So,
9-13 are 1 point each
14-16 are 2 each
17 is 3
18 is 4

18s are painful. Not sure if they're worth it, considering (if rumors are right about +1 to two stats every 4 levels and +1 to all at 11 and 21) that will leave you with an odd number at level 28.  Hmmm.


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## Amphimir Míriel

RandomCitizenX said:
			
		

> Just checked it again, and you are right. It should be +4 to get to the 18.




So, let me see if I understand this, is it like this?:

10 -> 0
11 -> 1
12 -> 2
13 -> 3
14 -> 5
15 -> 7
16 -> 9
17 -> 12
18 -> 16


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## RandomCitizenX

Voss said:
			
		

> Ouch.
> So,
> 9-13 is 1 point each
> 14-16 is 2 each
> 17 is 3
> 18 is 4
> 
> 18s are painful. Not sure if they're worth it, considering (if rumors are right about +1 to two stats every 4 levels and +1 to all at 11 and 21) that will leave you with an odd number at level 28.  Hmmm.




the +1 to two stats every 4 levels as well as the +1 to all at 11 and 21 are indeed correct.


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## FreeXenon

Thanks RC-X.

Howz bout rituals and what's up with gricks anyway?


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## RandomCitizenX

Gricks are level 7 brutes who get a bonus on flanking. There is also an upgraded version who is supposed to be the pack leader. Its a level 9 brute that gets the flanking bonus and a grapple attack.

What are you looking for about rituals?


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## Bolongo

RandomCitizenX said:
			
		

> the +1 to two stats every 4 levels as well as the +1 to all at 11 and 21 are indeed correct.



But is there a ceiling? I.e. can you ever max out a stat?


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## Rookseye

Did someone really just ask a question about _gricks_?


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## Family

Oh, you're THAT guy   Hi That Guy, gonna build a Tarresque killer? 

Just Kidding, as if I'm one to talk; actually I'm also curious.


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## FreeXenon

Rookseye said:
			
		

> Did someone really just ask a question about _gricks_?




I could not resist!  

Do they have resistance or anything like that?

Anything about Rituals. The whole chapter?
Just some examples would be good.

Perhaps if they are used for creating normal things like swords and stuff.


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## Voss

Well, I'm off work.  Thanks for all the answers!


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## keterys

We've had a picture of the monster manual page for Gricks since late February. I posted one then... but I cheerfully encourage you to use this one instead, complete with Grell as well.


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## RandomCitizenX

Considering that some epic feats have a req of 27 in a stat there doesn't seem to be a stat cap.

Rituals are broken up into categories based on their function: Binding, Creation, Deception, Divination, Exploration, Restoration, Scrying, Travel and Warding. You can copy down rituals in a ritual book only from other ritual books. Ritual scrolls do not have the entire ritual, instead one use of the ritual has been stored in the scroll.

Rituals included are: 
Animal Messenger, Comprehend Language, Gentle Repose, Magic Mouth, Make Whole, Secret Page, Silence, Tenser’s Floating Disk, Endure Elements, Eye of Alarm, Water Walk, Detect Secret Doors, Arcane Lock, Enchant Magic Item, Hand of Fate, Knock, Travelers’ Feast, Brew Potion, Hallucinatory Item, Magic Circle, Commune with Nature, Cure Disease, Discern Lies, Disenchant Magic Item, Leomund’s Secret Chest, Phantom Steed, Sending, Speak with Dead, Linked Portal, Raise Dead, Remove Affliction, Water Breathing, Wizard’s Sight, Consult Mystic, Detect Object, Drawmij’s Instant, Hallucinatory, Passwall, Shadow Walk, Eye of Warning, View Location, Consult Oracle, Planar Portal, View Object, Forbiddance, Loremaster’s Bargain, Observe Creature, Voice of Fate, True Portal


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## jedrious

_dbl post please move on_


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## jedrious

someone asked for high level Warlock powers, figured I'd expand upon that a bit, keeping formatting as close to the book as possible.
BTW got the book at a B&N, saw a trainee cashier and took a chance

_Post deleted.  ~ PCat_


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## Njall

Ok, I've got a couple of questions about fighters if you don't mind 
1) One of the first articles about 4e said that the weapon you chose to use as a fighter would impact your powers/feats selection. Is this still the case? 
2) Swordmaster paragon path...(*drools a couple of minutes*)...care to share some of what they can do? 
Thanks in advance...


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## FreeXenon

Thanks for all of the insane type'age.


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## jedrious

Fighters and Melee Weapons
Fighters master intricacies of melee weapon skill that other characters can’t match. Unlike other classes, fighters have many encounter powers that work better when used with specific groups of melee weapons (see the table below). Powers associated with a weapon
group favor a particular ability score mix, so that fighters with high Constitution are likely to want to use axes, hammers, or picks, while fighters with high Dexterity are more likely to favor heavy blades, light blades, flails, or spears. The weapon feats described in 
Chapter 6 that provide optimized abilities for specific groups of weapons favor the same ability score mixes, so the list below notes the melee weapon groups and the ability score that is most likely to help you optimize your fighter abilities with that weapon group.


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## Njall

jedrious said:
			
		

> Fighters and Melee Weapons
> Fighters master intricacies of melee weapon skill that other characters can’t match. Unlike other classes, fighters have many encounter powers that work better when used with specific groups of melee weapons (see the table below). Powers associated with a weapon
> group favor a particular ability score mix, so that fighters with high Constitution are likely to want to use axes, hammers, or picks, while fighters with high Dexterity are more likely to favor heavy blades, light blades, flails, or spears. The weapon feats described in
> Chapter 6 that provide optimized abilities for specific groups of weapons favor the same ability score mixes, so the list below notes the melee weapon groups and the ability score that is most likely to help you optimize your fighter abilities with that weapon group.




Thanks! I must say I love what I've seen so far. 
I hope my books ship ASAP...


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## jedrious

jedrious said:
			
		

> Fighters and Melee Weapons
> -Snip-.



Armor-Piercing Thrust Fighter Attack 3
You drive your weapon through a weak point in your foe’s defenses.
Encounter ✦ Martial,Weapon
Standard Action Melee weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Strength vs. Reflex
Weapon: If you’re wielding a light blade or a spear, you gain a bonus to the attack roll equal to your Dexterity modifier.
Hit: 1[W] + Strength modifier damage.
Weapon: If you’re wielding a light blade or a spear, you gain a bonus to the damage roll equal to your Dexterity modifier.


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## Zaruthustran

That's some pretty specific info there, on the high level powers. Isn't that level of specificity against this board's rules?

I mean, answering general questions is great, but posting copy-pastes from the rulebook seems wrong.


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## Damar74

Wow, thanks for the effort!  You're my hero!

How about the half elf in terms of being natural multi-classers?  Can you confirm or deny the ability to gain a class ability from a different class, or is it just the at-will power gained as a per-encounter?


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## jaldaen

Anyone willing to hand me the 1st level two-weapon fighting at-will power on a silver platter? Bueller?


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## Henrix

In order to minimise the need for typing, I'd like to add that there is a similar thread over at RPG.net.

And thanks for posting all this!


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## RandomCitizenX

Half-elves only get the at-will power as an encounter power. The speculation on getting to steal a class feature came from the warlock pregen having prime shot, which most people assumed was picked us as a multiclass racial thing. Instead it was a feature for both ranged strikers.


----------



## Kobold Avenger

What's some of the 29th level wizard spells, and exactly what do classics like Fireball and Lightning Bolt do?


----------



## jedrious

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Anyone willing to hand me the 1st level two-weapon fighting at-will power on a silver platter? Bueller?



Twin Strike Ranger Attack 1
If the first attack doesn’t kill it, the second one might.
At-Will ✦ Martial,Weapon
Standard Action Melee or Ranged weapon
Requirement: You must be wielding two melee weapons or a ranged weapon.
Targets: One or two creatures
Attack: Strength vs. AC (melee; main weapon and off-hand weapon) or Dexterity vs. AC (ranged), two attacks
Hit: 1[W] damage per attack.
Increase damage to 2[W] at 21st level.


----------



## Stoat

Three words and a question mark.

Golden Wyvern Adept?


----------



## jedrious

Kobold Avenger said:
			
		

> What's some of the 29th level wizard spells, and exactly what do classics like Fireball and Lightning Bolt do?




_Copyrighted text deleted by admin._


----------



## weem

Okay, thought I would chime in with a question. If someone could answer it that would be great.

In the Excerpt "Tiers of Play" regarding the Epic Tier "From the DMG" description, they mention the following...

_In combat, flight and teleportation are routine, as well as extraordinary feats of climbing and jumping._

I was curious how "epic" *jumping* was going to be handled - in other words, I was wondering if they were going to get into specific measurements of distance, or if it would be generally described (for example: "you could jump the widest rivers", etc). With an answer to that, I think it would give me an idea of how some other things are going to be handled that I was wondering about.

Thanks!


----------



## RandomCitizenX

Stoat said:
			
		

> Three words and a question mark.
> 
> Golden Wyvern Adept?



Nowhere to be found.


----------



## JoshWilhoyte

Awesome info, dudes, thanks,

  josh


----------



## AllisterH

1. Attribute increase. Is it +1 to 2 stats every 2 levels or every 4 levels?

2. Magic Items. What classic D&D magic items are in the PHB? And, can you give an example of one?


----------



## keterys

> Text deleted by admin




I'm a little dubious that being radiant damage is worth losing a close burst 10 enemies only blind (or reliable, to compare to the fighter, or crazy sneak attack/crit damage to compare to the rogue's)...


----------



## jaldaen

jedrious said:
			
		

> Twin Strike Ranger Attack 1




Thank you very much!


----------



## jedrious

Stoat said:
			
		

> Three words and a question mark.
> 
> Golden Wyvern Adept?



Not in PHB


----------



## MindWanderer

My request: paragon paths.  We've seen a list of them; can someone post the entry requirements and general gist/theme of each?

Also, can someone confirm whether there's exactly one class-specific multiclass feat for each class?


----------



## cjais

Anyone kind enough to post some high level racial feats?


----------



## Lacyon

keterys said:
			
		

> I'm a little dubious that being radiant damage is worth losing a close burst 10 enemies only blind (or reliable, to compare to the fighter, or crazy sneak attack/crit damage to compare to the rogue's)...




There's at least one bonus effect I'm aware of that boosts Radiant Damage. It may look better in synergy with other abilities.


----------



## Piratecat

Guys, please don't post anything larger than a snippet of text. We don't want to break copyright.  You can answer questions and discuss rules, but reposting larger sections of text isn't okay.

Thanks!


----------



## RandomCitizenX

MindWanderer said:
			
		

> My request: paragon paths.  We've seen a list of them; can someone post the entry requirements and general gist/theme of each?
> 
> Also, can someone confirm whether there's exactly one class-specific multiclass feat for each class?




There is only one multi-class feat per class.

All of the paragon paths other than the ranger and warlock ones only have the class as a req. Each warlock pack gets one path, and each ranger fighting style gets two paths. I will try to type up a list of path summaries before I have to leave for family things.


----------



## jedrious

cjais said:
			
		

> Anyone kind enough to post some high level racial feats?



No epic Tier racial feats

here's a Paragon elf feat
Running Shot [Elf]
Prerequisite: Elf
Benefit: You don’t take any attack penalty to
ranged attacks after you use the run action.


----------



## RandomCitizenX

Cleric
-Angelic avenger - Angelic esq powers as you act out the will of your god 
-Divine oracle - Mouthpiece for your god. Granted with powers prophecy
-Radiant servant -You glow as you become a source of your god's light in the world.
-Warpriest - Priest of battle who's god blesses his weapons

More to come later.


----------



## jaldaen

I was wondering how zones work? What makes them so different? Are they constant effects? Are there any special rules (besides them being dispellable)? Thanks


----------



## MindWanderer

RandomCitizenX said:
			
		

> There is only one multi-class feat per class.
> 
> All of the paragon paths other than the ranger and warlock ones only have the class as a req. Each warlock pack gets one path, and each ranger fighting style gets two paths.



Nooooo...! It's impossible to pick up a ranger paragon path if you're not a ranger, I guess.  So much for that hope.  Oh, well, I'm sure one of the cleric PPs will work for my cleric/ranger.


----------



## baberg

AllisterH said:
			
		

> 1. Attribute increase. Is it +1 to 2 stats every 2 levels or every 4 levels?
> 
> 2. Magic Items. What classic D&D magic items are in the PHB? And, can you give an example of one?



1) +1 to two stats (must be different) at level 4, 8, 14, 18, 24, 28.  +1 to all stats at 11, 21.

2) Dancing Weapon, level 20+, (Daily) Minor to make it "float" in midair, sustain floating is also a minor.  Attacks are as if you're holding it, but if you don't take an attack in a round it can make an automatic basic attack with reach 2.


----------



## Stalker0

Other than for certain classes that rely on it, does intelligence give any secondary benefits?

We know it adds to AC, and to int based skills, but does it do anything else? Any cool feats that make having a high int useful?

Are there any feats or abilities that let high level character wear heavy armor and still keep their int or dex bonus to AC?


----------



## jaldaen

Stalker0 said:
			
		

> Other than for certain classes that rely on it, does intelligence give any secondary benefits?




I'd like to know this too


----------



## malcolm_n

okay, starting with an 18 in a stat, at +1 per 4 levels = 24
Plus 1 to all stats at 11 and 21 = 26
so the Feats with 27 required are Racial maybe?


----------



## Brown Jenkin

malcolm_n said:
			
		

> okay, starting with an 18 in a stat, at +1 per 4 levels = 24
> Plus 1 to all stats at 11 and 21 = 26
> so the Feats with 27 required are Racial maybe?




With a starting point buy of 17 in the stat.


----------



## ForbidenMaster

malcolm_n said:
			
		

> okay, starting with an 18 in a stat, at +1 per 4 levels = 24
> Plus 1 to all stats at 11 and 21 = 26
> so the Feats with 27 required are Racial maybe?




30/4=7
+1 at 11
+1 at 21

so its 18+7+1+1=27

In addition to ratial.


----------



## Family

How long does it take to make a Char?


----------



## Lobo Lurker

17 + 8 = 25. That's 2 points shy of the prereq. With an 18 and an attribute bonus (racial) then you can meet that prereq. 

Maybe there's a magic item that will boost a stat by +2 in such a way as to allow you to qualify for a feat w/out breaking the combat model.


----------



## The Little Raven

MindWanderer said:
			
		

> Nooooo...! It's impossible to pick up a ranger paragon path if you're not a ranger, I guess.  So much for that hope.  Oh, well, I'm sure one of the cleric PPs will work for my cleric/ranger.




I'm pretty sure someone said that having a multiclass feat for a class qualifies you as being a member of that class for prerequisites, so you can pick up ranger feats and ranger PPs if you have the ranger multiclass feat. Not 100% sure, though.


----------



## MindWanderer

Mourn said:
			
		

> I'm pretty sure someone said that having a multiclass feat for a class qualifies you as being a member of that class for prerequisites, so you can pick up ranger feats and ranger PPs if you have the ranger multiclass feat. Not 100% sure, though.



 Well, yes... you count as being a ranger, but you _don't_ count as being a ranger with the two-weapon fighting style.  So a cleric could take Kensei, but not Stormwarden.


----------



## Kobold Avenger

What can some of the really powerful magical implements do beyond giving bonuses to attack and damage and adding to criticals?

Are the Staff of Power or Staff of the Magi now implements?


----------



## ForbidenMaster

Mourn said:
			
		

> I'm pretty sure someone said that having a multiclass feat for a class qualifies you as being a member of that class for prerequisites, so you can pick up ranger feats and ranger PPs if you have the ranger multiclass feat. Not 100% sure, though.





> A character who has taken a class-specific multiclass feat counts as a member of that class for the purpose of meeting prerequisites for taking other feats and qualifying for paragon paths. For example, a character who takes Initiate of the Faith counts as a cleric for the purpose of selecting feats that have cleric as a prerequisite. These feats can qualify you for other feats; for example, a warlock who takes Sneak of Shadows can use the rogue’s Sneak Attack class feature, which means that he meets the prerequisite for the Backstabber feat




http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/4ex/20080430a


----------



## Andur

I'm just going to say that jedrious posts look alot more like cut and paste than they do typing of stat-blocks...  

Why else
would one
type like 
this?


----------



## Scribble

Does the PHB have a "what is roleplaying" section???

This was something I thought 3e was missing.


----------



## Scribble

Also, can anyone who has them perhaps list the chapters of the 3 books? I know it's a bunch of work but... consider it your paymwent for being luckier then us.


----------



## Mal Malenkirk

Stalker0 said:
			
		

> Other than for certain classes that rely on it, does intelligence give any secondary benefits?
> 
> We know it adds to AC, and to int based skills, but does it do anything else? Any cool feats that make having a high int useful?




''Aside from bonus to AC, reflex and several skills, what has a high intelligence ever done for us?''


----------



## Rechan

*MM*

I didn't see any recycled art when I was flicking through it.

Most monsters get 1 page, 2 versions of the monster each. Very little fluff for standard monsters. Though there are a lot that get several pages; Hags, Harpies, Humans, etc get two pages or more.

There's no apendix for typical animals; they're interspersed with the normal monsters. There's a dire version, and either a Paragon version (a Feywild boar) or a normal version (wolf, cave bear)

Dragons get 4 age categories: Young, Adult, Elder, Ancient. The various dragon roles are: Black (Lurker), Blue (Artillery) Green (Controller) Red (Soldier) White (Brute)

The Needlefang drake's stats seem correct. No change to the Zombie minion either.

Destrachan is in. Yaun-ti are paragon-level foes. Galeb Duhr are in - weren't these in 2e? Same with Helmet Horror. We have dragonspawn from the MMV; odd. Purple Worms: Solo soldier. Battlebriar (MMIV or V).


*DMG*

Templates:

Battle Champion
Bodyguard
Death Knight
Death Master
Demonic Acolyte
Devastator
Feyborn
Frost Adept
Lich
Mummy Lord
Mummy Champion
Savage Berzerker
Scion of Flame
Shadowborn Stalker
Vampire Lord

There's a template for every PC class.

Templates are very small. The layout is thus:

Name: Elite Role (And possibly Role2)
Defense increases
Action Point 1
Hit points per level
Ability/Power.

That's it.

There are two pages on Monster Design Steps. In this section, there are three tables:

Monster Stats By Role. It looks something like this:


		Code:
	

Roles (Brute ARtillery Bla bla) 
Init Bonus 
Hit Points 
AC 
Attack vs. AC 
Attacks vs. Other Defenses* *Reduce attack bonus by two for attacks that target multiple opponents


Next is a table for Normal Damage by Level:



		Code:
	

Level          Low         Medium       High 
1-3                   1d6+3         1d10+3      2d6+3


There's a note like how artillery and controller monsters that effect mulitple opponents should use the low, while low accuracy powers like brutes and lurkers should use the high.

There is a third table, Limited Damage By Level. These are for powers that a monster may use only once in a fight.

Rules for Creating New Elites and Solos fit into this dynamic, etc.

Three pages on creating NPCs. Six pages on creating house rules.

Traps and Hazards: 9 pages. There are a few one-shot traps (Pit trap, glyph of warding, etc). I only saw one solo trap (the soul gem), but I didn't read through any to see if they are elite-makin'.

Terrain: There's a lot of stuff here. Break DCs for doors, how much HP objects have, etc. There's notes on Difficult Terrain, Obscuring Terain, Hindering Terrain, Challenging Terrain (Takes a successful skill check to get through), etc. There's also fantastical terrain (remember the mushrooms that did clouds of poison damage? Those are here, along with a lot of other stuff).


----------



## ForbidenMaster

How many healing surges do monsters have?


----------



## The Little Raven

Rechan said:
			
		

> I didn't see any recycled art when I was flicking through it.




Check the Vampire stuff, including the template in the DMG. We've heard the vampire art was recycled from 3rd.


----------



## baberg

ForbidenMaster said:
			
		

> How many healing surges do monsters have?



Heroic Tier: 1
Paragon Tier: 2
Epic Tier: 3

Also, just read one of the Thief Epic Destiny abilities: at level 30 he can force the DM to change any d20 he just rolled to a 1, with no rerolls possible.

DM: And Orcus critically hits you for 132 damage
Rogue: No, he fumbled.
DM: BLAST!


----------



## Jack of Tales

I think its very interesting that so many people managed to obtain the books today and from different sources. I've seen a game store, barnes and nobles, amazon and buy.com quoted as places the books were gotten from. How come, even though many places have received the books PRIOR to today has it come to be released by so many sources? Thoughts?


----------



## Rechan

> Heroic Tier: 1
> Paragon Tier: 2
> Epic Tier: 3



Where'd you find that, btw?

HAHAHAHHA.

The book specifically says that powers that heal you when you attack only work on legitimate threats; characters carrying a bag of rats to hit them for healing does not work. 

There's a section on combat in different types of environments and circumstances: Mounted combat, aquatic combat, flying combat, etc.


----------



## Charwoman Gene

Jack of Tales said:
			
		

> Thoughts?




Many people posting got their books by downloading material available in a way which violates US copyright law.


----------



## baberg

Rechan said:
			
		

> Where'd you find that, btw?



Page 7 of the MM.  You probably skipped it because it's in the description of "how to read the stat block" but right at the end it says they don't mention Healing Surges because they're rarely used, but gives those values.


----------



## jedrious

Rechan said:
			
		

> Where'd you find that, btw?
> 
> HAHAHAHHA.
> 
> The book specifically says that powers that heal you when you attack only work on legitimate threats; characters carrying a bag of rats to hit them for healing does not work.
> 
> There's a section on combat in different types of environments and circumstances: Mounted combat, aquatic combat, flying combat, etc.



MM pg 7 Bottom of right hand column


----------



## jedrious

Charwoman Gene said:
			
		

> Many people posting got their books by downloading material available in a way which violates US copyright law.



and those of us that didn't take great offense to the implication that we did


----------



## jaldaen

Here's another question: Are there any stance-based attack powers? Or are all stances utility powers?


----------



## The Little Raven

Charwoman Gene said:
			
		

> Many people posting got their books by downloading material available in a way which violates US copyright law.




And is simply disrespectful towards the team of people that developed it with the intention of it releasing on a particular date in a particular format. But then again, I'm not surprised, as John Gabriel's Greater Internet F-ckwad Theory usually holds true.


----------



## Rechan

baberg said:
			
		

> Page 7 of the MM.  You probably skipped it because it's in the description of "how to read the stat block" but right at the end it says they don't mention Healing Surges because they're rarely used, but gives those values.



Here I was thinking it was in the NPC section in the DMG. Thanks.


----------



## Wormwood

Mourn said:
			
		

> And is simply disrespectful towards the team of people that developed it with the intention of it releasing on a particular date in a particular format.



True enough.

So true, in fact, that I'll be taking a break from this site until I pick up my own books in June (at Emerald City---my kick-ass FLGS!)

Later all!


----------



## keterys

Wormwood said:
			
		

> True enough.
> 
> So true, in fact, that I'll be taking a break from this site until I pick up my own books in June (at Emerald City---my kick-ass FLGS!)
> 
> Later all!




Not sure there's much point to _that_ - you're doing no wrong, there's still plenty of good discussion, etc.

But, whatever makes you happy I guess.


----------



## zero skill LPB

A couple of skill questions, if I may. 

(1) How many trained skills does a Fighter get? is it 3 (as per KotS) or 4 (as per DDXP)?

(2) Trained confers +5, right? 

((Trying to fix all the errors on the KotS characters before playing tomorrow, doncha know... ))


----------



## Kobold Avenger

I got some more questions on top of my other ones.

1) What can some of the really powerful magical implements do beyond giving bonuses to attack and damage and adding to criticals?

2) Are the Staff of Power or Staff of the Magi now implements?

3) What are the variants of Dwarves, Elves, Eladrin, Humans, Halflings, Dragonborn and Tieflings in the Monster Manual?  And do they get things that make them very different from a PC with class levels?

4) Are there Affiliations in the core book?  Do they give bonuses and special abilities depending on affiliation score?


----------



## Rechan

zero skill LPB said:
			
		

> A couple of skill questions, if I may.
> 
> (1) How many trained skills does a Fighter get? is it 3 (as per KotS) or 4 (as per DDXP)?



Three.


----------



## jackston2

Somebody post some mundane items, you know, just some little trinkets for the players to buy wile playing shadowfell.


----------



## WhatGravitas

Wormwood said:
			
		

> Later all!



Hang in there! Just go to the General boards. As I'll do! 

I feel left out here... 

Cheers, LT.


----------



## jaldaen

One more question about zones: How does the typical *Target* line fro them read.

Examples: Any creature in the zone or All creatures in the zone.


----------



## jaldaen

double post


----------



## Rechan

Kobold Avenger said:
			
		

> I got some more questions on top of my other ones.
> 
> 1) What can some of the really powerful magical implements do beyond giving bonuses to attack and damage and adding to criticals?



Most of the implements that are magical all have some ability, and then you tack on the bonus. Those abilities are like using 'encounter or daily' powers of certain classes. There's an 18+ wand that gives you a daily use of the Warlock's _Soul Flaying_ power. 

Also, all magical implements seem to give bonus crit damage, like magical weapons.

Orbs are awesome. Let me tell you. There's 20th level Orb that, as a daily interrupt, lets you cancel the power a monster just recharged, and in exchange, you recharge an encounter power.



> 2) Are the Staff of Power or Staff of the Magi now implements?



Staff of Power, yes.


----------



## Scipio202

Are there any limits on how many powers per day you can get from items?


----------



## Caliber

Scipio202 said:
			
		

> Are there any limits on how many powers per day you can get from items?




Heroic - 1/day
Paragon - 2/day
Epic - 3/day

Every milestone +1 use (this only applies to Daily magic item powers)


----------



## Scipio202

Caliber said:
			
		

> Heroic - 1/day
> Paragon - 2/day
> Epic - 3/day
> 
> Every milestone +1 use (this only applies to Daily magic item powers)



 Thank!

Are all item powers daily, or are any per-encounter powers?


----------



## Caliber

Scipio202 said:
			
		

> Thank!
> 
> Are all item powers daily, or are any per-encounter powers?




Seems a mix, with some At-Wills as well.


----------



## Gansk

baberg said:
			
		

> Page 7 of the MM.  You probably skipped it because it's in the description of "how to read the stat block" but right at the end it says they don't mention Healing Surges because they're rarely used, but gives those values.




So monsters cannot take second winds? What about NPC allies?


----------



## Rechan

Kobold Avenger said:
			
		

> 3) What are the variants of Dwarves, Elves, Eladrin, Humans, Halflings, Dragonborn and Tieflings in the Monster Manual?  And do they get things that make them very different from a PC with class levels?



Darven Bolter, Dwarven Hammerer, 
Dragonborn Soldier, Dragonborn Gladiator, Dragonborn Raider, Dragonborn Champion. 
Eladrin Fey Knight, Eladrin Twilight Incanter, Bralani of the Autumn Winds, Ghaele of Winter.
Elf Archer, Elf Scout.
Halfling Slinger, Halfling Stout, Halfling Thief, Halfling Prowler, 
Human Rabble, Human Bandit, Human Lackey, Human Guard, Human Berzerker, Human Mage
Tiefling Heretic, Tiefling Darkblade.

To answer your last question: Yes. For instance, when the Tiefling Heretic is hit, it can teleport 5 squares.  

Holy crap. The Goblin Picanter is missing! As is the Bugbear Headhunter! THe Foulspawn pic looks goofy, but the monsters are nasty. Reused ar for Hags.


----------



## uber42

Most important to me: Do you feel it would be easy to make home brew material (compared to 3.5)? Namely, is it still ridiculing complicated to make a new monster? My greatest hope for 4e is that it will allow me to (more) quickly make new things for my game.


----------



## vagabonvoid

Anything for Unarmed combatants?  Are there feats like in SW saga edition that ramps up the unarmed damage or effectiveness?  

If you can, give us a taste, I know many of us are waiting to find out if they can build a pugilist character.


----------



## Rechan

This thread title says there's info about new power sources. Where is that? 



			
				uber42 said:
			
		

> Most important to me: Do you feel it would be easy to make home brew material (compared to 3.5)? Namely, is it still ridiculing complicated to make a new monster? My greatest hope for 4e is that it will allow me to (more) quickly make new things for my game.



I spoke a litlte about that here in the DMG section. I don't think it will be too hard.


----------



## Caliber

uber42 said:
			
		

> Most important to me: Do you feel it would be easy to make home brew material (compared to 3.5)? Namely, is it still ridiculing complicated to make a new monster? My greatest hope for 4e is that it will allow me to (more) quickly make new things for my game.




In my opinion, you will be stupidly happy with 4E. At least, I am!


----------



## Caliber

Rechan said:
			
		

> This thread title says there's info about new power sources. Where is that?




Check pg 54 of the PHB. The very bottom right corner of the page says "Future power sources include elemental, ki, primal, psionic, and shadow."

Since we've been told there will be 8 power sources total, there you are.


----------



## Incenjucar

I'm pretty sure they mentioned Elementalists at some point (Which is wonderful -- I was suggesting them back during the setting search, along with shape-altered classes), so I frankly expected it.

Hopefully elementalists will be big on persistent effects rather than blasting, as has been my vision.


----------



## jedrious

vagabonvoid said:
			
		

> Anything for Unarmed combatants? Are there feats like in SW saga edition that ramps up the unarmed damage or effectiveness?
> 
> If you can, give us a taste, I know many of us are waiting to find out if they can build a pugilist character.



no Unarmed love at all, it's a 1d4 improvised weapon that can be used as a basic melee attack


----------



## MatrexsVigil

*Post removed.

Yup, we're excited for the new game too, but copying information from illegal PDFs will get you banned. Don't do it. Feel free to discuss the information or provide snippets, but violating copyrights isn't something we want to see.  ~ PCat*


----------



## jedrious

ok, guys, I've got writing to do(and I know have solid mechanics to work with), I'll check back here periodically if people have more questions


----------



## Ondo

Caliber said:
			
		

> Since we've been told there will be 8 power sources total, there you are.



Actually, what we've been told is that there are 8 power sources "that should take care of basically 90% of the classes they foresee making".


----------



## Dark080matter

In the name of the Dragons, both Above and Below, any general info on the mechanics of Shifters, Changeling and Warforged as PC races would be gloriously awesome.

If the mechanics are sound for these races (especially Shifters) they will be making solid appearances in my WIP homebrew campaign (think something along the lines of "Fantasy Dune: Points of Sand" ) along with possibly some house-ruled racial feats... to tide me over till Eberron in '09.

Thanks for everything!


----------



## Khaim

Rechan said:
			
		

> Monster Stats By Role. It looks something like this:
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> Roles (Brute ARtillery Bla bla)
> Init Bonus
> Hit Points
> AC
> Attack vs. AC
> Attacks vs. Other Defenses* *Reduce attack bonus by two for attacks that target multiple opponents




I assume there's a line for each defense as well. Are the numbers listed the actual ones, or is it just a modifier to the monster's level? Because if so, I _totally_ called it.


----------



## zoroaster100

Can someone please confirm the racial ability bonuses for half-elves?  Both pre-gen half-elves we have seen had +2 on Charisma and +2 on Constitution, but there was speculation that at least the +2 Con was possibly a flexible bonus the half-elf could choose for any physical stat.  Was that correct, or is it a straight +2 to Constitution?


----------



## andrew

jackston2 said:
			
		

> Somebody post some mundane items, you know, just some little trinkets for the players to buy wile playing shadowfell.




Until the new books come in I'm sticking to the equipment section of the 3.5PH and the various sourcebooks (excluding alchemical items) for adventuring gear.

As for minor magic items (the shop _occasionally_ has them), the previews have shown that level 1 magic items cost 360gp. That should cover any basic +1 enhancement for weapons, armor, and implements. It should be reasonable to make level one skill boost items based on the previews that give +1 or +2 to a skill check. Round off the list with healing potions at 50gp and that's about all Winterhaven has to offer.


----------



## keterys

zoroaster100 said:
			
		

> Can someone please confirm the racial ability bonuses for half-elves?  Both pre-gen half-elves we have seen had +2 on Charisma and +2 on Constitution, but there was speculation that at least the +2 Con was possibly a flexible bonus the half-elf could choose for any physical stat.  Was that correct, or is it a straight +2 to Constitution?




It's +2 Con.

I'll admit it's a little odd... whereas the +2 to any other stat would have fit along with the human thing and made half-elves a bit more appealing (not that they're horrible)


----------



## baberg

Dark080matter said:
			
		

> In the name of the Dragons, both Above and Below, any general info on the mechanics of Shifters, Changeling and Warforged as PC races would be gloriously awesome.



There are two variants of Shifters, Longtooth and Razorclaw.  Longtooth seems to be the more "standup fighter" style of Shifter while Razorclaw is the sneakier Rogue-ish guy.  They get unique Minor Encounter bloodied-only abilities.  Longtooth gets some health regeneration and bonus damage while Razorclaw gets movement and defense bonuses

Warforged are, of course, Warforged.  Great fighters.  They're harder to kill when they're knocked unconscious - they can "Take 10" on their death saving roll.  Encounter power, Minor, grants a small bit of Temporary HP.

The Doppleganger is insane.  Change Shape is an at-will Minor action power, can imitate specific people, and gets a +20 bonus to Bluff checks while they're polymorphed.  They don't get too many bonuses other than that (aside from the standard +2 to 2 stats) but man, is that a powerful at-will ability.


----------



## baberg

zoroaster100 said:
			
		

> Can someone please confirm the racial ability bonuses for half-elves?  Both pre-gen half-elves we have seen had +2 on Charisma and +2 on Constitution, but there was speculation that at least the +2 Con was possibly a flexible bonus the half-elf could choose for any physical stat.  Was that correct, or is it a straight +2 to Constitution?



Half-Elves get +2 CHA, +2 CON.  Only Humans can choose where to put their bonus ability score (+2 to one ability)


----------



## Scipio202

Someone mentioned Polymorph is a ritual.  Any more details?   Is there a limited list of what you can polymorph into?  Do you only get some of the stats/abilities of what you morph into?


----------



## Rechan

Okay, for those who want to know all about two weapon fighting.

Rangers with TWF can wield a one-handed weapon as if it was an off-hand weapon. They also get toughness free. 

There's a TWF feat: You get a +1 to damage rolls when you have two weaposn in hand.

TW Defense: You get a +1 shield bonus to AC and Ref when you have two weapons in hand. 

Half the ranger's powers are TWF.

*Multiclassing With Paragon Paths*:
The Multi-classing with Paragon Paths looks like you can't get a 3rd class. The pre-req is having the Novice/Acolyte/Adept feats. 

11th level, you can replace an at-will power from class 1 to class 2.
11th (When you would get a PP encounter power), you can pick any 7th level Encounter power from class 2. 
12th: In place of a PP Utility power, you get Utility power of 10 or lower from class 2. 
20th: Instead of PP daily power, you get 19th level or lower Daily power from Class 2.


----------



## Rechan

Khaim said:
			
		

> I assume there's a line for each defense as well. Are the numbers listed the actual ones, or is it just a modifier to the monster's level? Because if so, I _totally_ called it.



Each defense is NOT listed, oddly. There might be a typo, but it seems that EVERY monster's defenses are: Level+12. Which doesn't make a lot of sense.


----------



## Dark080matter

Thank you baberg!  I'm absolutely pumped, to say the least, especially that they're bundling up groups of bonuses into a single Shifter trait.  I hope they eventually bring back the Dreamsight trait, I really felt it added a great "Primal Druidic" flavor to them as a race... and would fit well with the upcoming Primal power source.  

And Warforged as indestructible juggernaughts sounds good, altho I hope they also maintain at least some semblance of the Immunities they had back in the days when "Living Construct" was a whole half-page gaggle of rules.  Any word at all on different bodies/armor sets for them?

So Changelings Doppelgangers get +2 to two stats?  That's definitely interesting, I would have thought maybe a single floating stat bonus to represent their mutable nature (as a race)... well if that's the case here's guessing CON and DEX, just off the top of my head.


Ah well, excuse my rambling.  I totally understand if no more info is forthcoming, all of you "early bird" book-owners have already been too kind.


----------



## Daelkyr

Dark080matter said:
			
		

> In the name of the Dragons, both Above and Below, any general info on the mechanics of Shifters, Changeling and Warforged as PC races would be gloriously awesome.
> 
> If the mechanics are sound for these races (especially Shifters) they will be making solid appearances in my WIP homebrew campaign (think something along the lines of "Fantasy Dune: Points of Sand" ) along with possibly some house-ruled racial feats... to tide me over till Eberron in '09.
> 
> Thanks for everything!




Shifter is broken into two sub-groups (Longtooth and Razorclaw).

+2 Wis & +2 Str (L)/ +2 Dex (R).
Medium w/ 6 squares movement and low-light vision
+2 Athletics/Endurance (L), +2 Acrobatics/Stealth (R)

Each has a shifting power (encounter) activated after they are bloodied.

*Post removed.

Copying information from illegal PDFs will get you banned. Don't do it. As I said up-thread, feel free to discuss the information or provide snippets, but violating copyrights isn't something we want to see.  ~ PCat*


----------



## Rechan

I plan on using Shifters as Elves in my campaign world, so I'm giving Shifters the "Can make a shift movement into difficult terrain" and give them movement 7. 



			
				Dark080matter said:
			
		

> And Warforged as indestructible juggernaughts sounds good, altho I hope they also maintain at least some semblance of the Immunities they had back in the days when "Living Construct" was a whole half-page gaggle of rules.  Any word at all on different bodies/armor sets for them?



They don't seem to have any immunities in this write-up. However, they get a +2 on saves against ongoing effects. Even though they don't eat/drink/breathe, they aren't immune to any effects. They can take 4 hours of rest during a 6 hour rest. No mention of body builds.

We've been promised a full racial writeup on DDI for warforged, so don't worry. 



> So Changelings Doppelgangers get +2 to two stats?  That's definitely interesting, I would have thought maybe a single floating stat bonus to represent their mutable nature (as a race)... well if that's the case here's guessing CON and DEX, just off the top of my head.



+2 Int +2 Cha, actually. But yes, *were it me*, I'd give +2 to Dex/Cha.


----------



## keterys

uber42 said:
			
		

> Most important to me: Do you feel it would be easy to make home brew material (compared to 3.5)? Namely, is it still ridiculing complicated to make a new monster? My greatest hope for 4e is that it will allow me to (more) quickly make new things for my game.




It's _really_ easy to make new monsters. In the 4e games I've been running I often make up half of the monsters on the way over.

I'm a bit of an exception, but seriously - cake!


----------



## Aaron L

If it isn't too much of a bother... could you describe a little what glaives are like? (game mechanically, I mean)  I plan on  making my fist character a spooky human Fighter Warlock who fights with a glaive.

Warlocks are kinda spooky, right?  And they have a Star path that's almost Lovecraftian feeling, right?


I hope I understood correctly about that.  Cause that's what I want to  play.


----------



## Green Knight

Couple of questions. 

1) What are the stats for the Bastard Sword? 

2) What's the fourth Paladin At-Will Power (We'v seen Bolstering Strike, Holy Strike, and Valint Strike. So what's the fourth and what does it do)? 

3) What stat bonuses do PC Orcs get? 

4) What stat bonuses do PC Hobgoblins gets (assuming they have a PC writeup in the MM)? 

5) What stat bonuses do PC Kobolds get? 

6) We've seen Utility Powers that're Daily, and others that're Encounter. Are there any that're At-Will? If so, mind posting a few examples? 

That's about all I got for now. Thanks!


----------



## baberg

Aaron L said:
			
		

> If it isn't too much of a bother... could you describe a little what glaives are like? (game mechanically, I mean)  I plan on  making my fist character a spooky human Fighter Warlock who fights with a glaive.



Two-handed weapon, 2d4 base damage, considered to be a Heavy Blade and a Polearm, grants Reach.  It's one of the weaker 2-handed Military weapons damage-wise, but it's got style.


----------



## Kraydak

If it hasn't been asked yet, while I approve (whole-heartedly) conceptually moving magic items from the DMG to the PHB, the 3.5E PHB and DMG had the same (to within a few) page count.  Magic items ate about 60 pages.  Did they manage to avoid choosing between a "thin" DMG, a "fat" PHB or a thin magic item section?

How big is the jump to the better armors (Godplate etc...)?  How abrupt is it?  Can you upgrade your existing armor a type category or whatever it is called?


----------



## baberg

Green Knight said:
			
		

> 6) We've seen Utility Powers that're Daily, and others that're Encounter. Are there any that're At-Will? If so, mind posting a few examples?



With the exception of the Rogue (and one Cleric power called "Lantern") there are no at-will powers beyond level 1.  The Rogue gets several at-will power Utilities, mostly dealing with going back into Stealth once you're in combat.  A few magic items have at-will abilities, but that's it.  Everything from level 2 on up is Daily or Encounter.



			
				Kraydak said:
			
		

> If it hasn't been asked yet, while I approve (whole-heartedly) conceptually moving magic items from the DMG to the PHB, the 3.5E PHB and DMG had the same (to within a few) page count.  Magic items ate about 60 pages.  Did they manage to avoid choosing between a "thin" DMG, a "fat" PHB or a thin magic item section?



PHB: 317 pages
DMG: 221 pages

30ish pages of Magic Items.  8 on a page full of nothing but stat blocks, but there's flavor text and charts listing item progression - I'd estimate around 150 or so items?


----------



## zoroaster100

If a character is proficient with a longsword, do they get +3 on their attacks with it?


----------



## baberg

zoroaster100 said:
			
		

> If a character is proficient with a longsword, do they get +3 on their attacks with it?



Sir, yes sir.  Different weapons have different proficiency bonuses. I'd say about 2/3rds get +2 when you're proficient and 1/3rd get +3.  I can see no rhyme or reason as to the distinction. 

For instance, Longsword is +3, 1d8 damage and costs 15 gp with Versatile (+1 damage if wielded 2-handed).  A Scimitar only gets +2 with the same damage but only 10 gp, but also has the "High Crit" ability (deals another 1[W] when you crit with it at Heroic)


----------



## Rechan

Green Knight said:
			
		

> 2) What's the fourth Paladin At-Will Power (We'v seen Bolstering Strike, Holy Strike, and Valint Strike. So what's the fourth and what does it do)?



Enfeebling Strike. 1w+Cha and if the target is marked, it takes -2 to attacks until end of turn.



> 3) What stat bonuses do PC Orcs get?



+2 Str/Con
+2 to speed on a charge.
Can use warrior's surge (attack and use a healing usrge). 



> 4) What stat bonuses do PC Hobgoblins gets (assuming they have a PC writeup in the MM)?



+2 Con/Cha
+2 Athletics/History
+2 Init
Hobgoblin resiliance (You get to make an immediate saving throw against an effect). 



> 5) What stat bonuses do PC Kobolds get?



+2 Dex/Con
+2 Stealth/Thievery
+2 vs traps
Can use Shifty (Shift on a minor).  



> 6) We've seen Utility Powers that're Daily, and others that're Encounter. Are there any that're At-Will? If so, mind posting a few examples?



Fleeting Ghost Rogue Utility LVL2; You can move and make a stealth check, not taking the normal penalty for moving and making a stealth check. 
Great Leap Utility Rogue LVL 2; you can make a long or high jump as though you had a running start. 
Chameleon Utility Rogue LVL 6; Make a stealth check. You're invisible to someone who has a clear line of sight to you, if you are hidden and then lose cover.


----------



## Drakhar

I have a question concerning the multiclass feats, If you already have say religion as a trained skill and you MC into a cleric, do you get no benefit from the skill training?


----------



## Green Knight

Thanks a bunch, Rechan. Noticed you didn't answer question #1, though. I take it that there is no Bastard Sword in 4E, then?


----------



## FadedC

baberg said:
			
		

> Sir, yes sir.  Different weapons have different proficiency bonuses. I'd say about 2/3rds get +2 when you're proficient and 1/3rd get +3.  I can see no rhyme or reason as to the distinction.
> 
> For instance, Longsword is +3, 1d8 damage and costs 15 gp with Versatile (+1 damage if wielded 2-handed).  A Scimitar only gets +2 with the same damage but only 10 gp, but also has the "High Crit" ability (deals another 1[W] when you crit with it at Heroic)




Actually having seen the weapon list, there does seem to be a fairly clear rhyme or reason to it. Weapons in a particular category and size (ie one handed martial) seem to have a base damage dice and one special ability. That special ability can be +1 more to prof, 1 hiigher damage die, or something like high crit. versatile doesn't "cost" anything.

So one handed weapons have a base of d8. An actual one handed weapon can be +3 prof, d8 damage (longsword), +2 prof, d10 damage (battleaxe) or +2 prof d8 damage and high crit (scimitar).


----------



## Kaodi

If it would not be too much trouble, I would be interested to know whether clerics have powers that utilize charisma, and what sort of powers warlords have that do not require strength and a melee attack.

Also, unless I missed it, I too would appreciate knowing what intelligence can give you other than a bonus to reflex defense.


----------



## Shroomy

So, we've seen how custom templates work, but how do the class templates work exactly.  I'm assuming you just give the monster a handful of the class powers appropriate to its levels, but some details would be nice.  Thanks!


----------



## GMforPowergamers

hey guys... if you would be so kind as tolet me know about Shadar-kai, they have been a fav of mine since fiend folio, and the new fluff sounds great, are they playable, and if so what are the adjustments and special power???

thanks in advance for any and all info, you guys rock for shareing


----------



## Aaron L

baberg said:
			
		

> Two-handed weapon, 2d4 base damage, considered to be a Heavy Blade and a Polearm, grants Reach.  It's one of the weaker 2-handed Military weapons damage-wise, but it's got style.





Thank you, sir 

I have like glaives.  I think they're elegant, and I'm glad they've got some "style" now.


----------



## Rechan

Drakhar said:
			
		

> I have a question concerning the multiclass feats, If you already have say religion as a trained skill and you MC into a cleric, do you get no benefit from the skill training?



Nope. 

Cleric, Wizard, and Rogue force you to train in a specific skill.


----------



## Rechan

GMforPowergamers said:
			
		

> hey guys... if you would be so kind as tolet me know about Shadar-kai, they have been a fav of mine since fiend folio, and the new fluff sounds great, are they playable, and if so what are the adjustments and special power???
> 
> thanks in advance for any and all info, you guys rock for shareing



+2 Dex/Int
+2 Acrobatics/Stealth
+1 Fort defense
Shadow Jaunt; move action, teleport 3, become insubstantial until the start of your next turn.


----------



## GMforPowergamers

Green Knight said:
			
		

> Thanks a bunch, Rechan. Noticed you didn't answer question #1, though. I take it that there is no Bastard Sword in 4E, then?




I belive that earlier today I read somewhere (sorry lots of leaks not alot of memery for where each came from) that it was a supioror versitle D10 +3 prof Sword


----------



## Rechan

Green Knight said:
			
		

> Thanks a bunch, Rechan. Noticed you didn't answer question #1, though. I take it that there is no Bastard Sword in 4E, then?



I just didn't look it up. I haven't even gone near the equipment section.


----------



## Green Knight

Nice. Thanks a bunch!


----------



## Lurker37

Rechan said:
			
		

> Nope.
> 
> Cleric, Wizard, and Rogue force you to train in a specific skill.




Can you retrain to re-select the trained skills you already had to compensate for this? Specifically, can retraining affect the trained skills you selected at character creation?


----------



## hong

Aaron L said:
			
		

> Thank you, sir
> 
> I have like glaives.  I think they're elegant, and I'm glad they've got some "style" now.



 You say "glaive", but we all know you mean "naginata"!

. . .

Also, is there still a Skill Focus feat?


----------



## Rechan

Kaodi said:
			
		

> If it would not be too much trouble, I would be interested to know whether clerics have powers that utilize charisma



A few, as I glance over them quickly. Charisma is mainly a little bonus effect.

Sacred Flame for instance gives temp HP to an ally equal to your charisma+ 1/2 level. Divine Aid (utility) lets an ally make a saving throw with your charisma bonus. Command (among other effects) lets you slide a target 3+Cha. Bastian of Health lets you add Cha to a healing surge. 

Clerics either have str focused abilities or Wisdom focused abilities.



> and what sort of powers warlords have that do not require strength and a melee attack.



Outside of Utility powers? I only see Commander's Strike has an ally make a basic attack. 



> Also, unless I missed it, I too would appreciate knowing what intelligence can give you other than a bonus to reflex defense.



If you're in light armor, Int contributes to AC.


----------



## arscott

At 317 and 221 pages for the PHB and DMG respectively, I'm guessing each book has three pages of ads.  Am I right?


----------



## RandomCitizenX

Green Knight said:
			
		

> Thanks a bunch, Rechan. Noticed you didn't answer question #1, though. I take it that there is no Bastard Sword in 4E, then?



I already posted the bastard sword earlier in the thread


----------



## Rechan

hong said:
			
		

> Also, is there still a Skill Focus feat?



Yes. +3 to skill.


----------



## Kaodi

Thanks, Rechan.


----------



## Rechan

Lurker37 said:
			
		

> Can you retrain to re-select the trained skills you already had to compensate for this? Specifically, can retraining affect the trained skills you selected at character creation?



You can retrain a class skill for another. You can't if it is a pre-requisit for a feat, power, or any other attribute, or if it's pre-determined for your class (arcana for wizards). If you pick a skill your class gives you an option (like a ranger who has nature or dungeoneering) and you want to retrain one of those two, you have to pick the other (I.e. ranger with nature can't retrain nature for perception, it'd have to be dungeoneering).


----------



## Aaron L

hong said:
			
		

> You say "glaive", but we all know you mean "naginata"!
> 
> . . .
> 
> Also, is there still a Skill Focus feat?





Personally, I consider them to be the same (in D&D, at least.)


----------



## Classic Villany

Just to reiterate a request I made in the other thread...

Could get a list of the creatures listed under the entries below?

Demons
Devourers
Giants (exlcuding the Hill Giants and Earth Titan)
Elementals
Kuo-Toa
Minotaurs
Ogres
Troglodytes
Trolls
Yuan-ti

And if we could get their levels and roles as well, that would be greatly apreciated as well.

Thanks for all the info!


----------



## Rechan

Classic Villany said:
			
		

> Just to reiterate a request I made in the other thread...
> 
> Could get a list of the creatures listed under the entries below?



Do you want just their names, or their level/role?


----------



## Classic Villany

Rechan said:
			
		

> Do you want just their names, or their level/role?




I was kind of looking for both...but I'll gladly settle for just the names.


----------



## Underage AOLer

Forgive me if this has already been posted or is a violation of some copyright thing, but here are the first set of feats from the PHB.  (Goodness it took a long time to format it and make it look nice...)
[sblock=Heroic Tier Feats]*Name* [Prerequisites]: Benefit
*Action Surge* [Human]: +3 to attacks when you spend an action point
*Agile Hunter* [Dex 15, ranger, Hunter’s Quarry class feature]: Shift as a free action after scoring a critical hit
*Alertness* [none]: No combat advantage when surprised, +2 to Perception
*Armor of Bahamut* [Channel Divinity class feature, must worship Bahamut]: Use Channel Divinity to invoke armor of Bahamut
*Armor Proficiency (Chainmail)* [Str 13, Con 13, training with  leather or hide armor]: Training with chainmail armor
*Armor Proficiency (Leather)* [none]: Training with leather armor
*Armor Proficiency (Hide)* [Str 13, Con 13, training with leather armor]: Training with hide armor
*Armor Proficiency (Plate)* [Str 15, Con 15, training with scale armor]: Training with plate armor
*Armor Proficiency (Scale)* [Str 13, Con 13, training with chainmail]: Training with scale armor
*Astral Fire* [Dex 13, Cha 13]: +1 damage with fire or radiant power
*Avandra’s Rescue* [Channel Divinity class feature, must worship Avandra]: Use Channel Divinity to invoke Avandra’s rescue
*Backstabber* [Rogue, Sneak Attack class feature]: Sneak Attack dice increase to d8s
*Blade Opportunist* [Str 13, Dex 13]: +2 to opportunity attacks with heavy blade or light blade
*Burning Blizzard* [Int 13, Wis 13]: +1 damage with acid or cold power
*Combat Reflexes* [Dex 13]: +1 to opportunity attacks
*Corellon’s Grace* [Channel Divinity class feature, must worship Corellon]: Use Channel Divinity to invoke Corellon’s grace
*Dark Fury* [Con 13, Wis 13]: +1 damage with necrotic or psychic power
*Defensive Mobility* [none]: +2 to AC against opportunity attacks
*Distracting Shield* [Wis 15, fighter, Combat Challenge class feature]: Target hit by opportunity attack takes –2 to attack rolls
*Dodge Giants* [Dwarf]: +1 to AC and Reflex against attacks of Large or larger foes
*Dragonborn Frenzy* [Dragonborn]: +2 damage when bloodied
*Dragonborn Senses* [Dragonborn]: Low-light vision, +1 to Perception
*Durable* [none]: Increase number of healing surges by 2
*Dwarven Weapon Training* [Dwarf]: +2 damage and proficiency with axes and hammers
*Eladrin Soldier* [Eladrin]: +2 damage and proficiency with longswords and spears
*Elven Precision* [Elf]: +2 to reroll with elven accuracy
*Enlarged Dragon Breath* [Dragonborn, dragon breath racial power]: Dragon breath becomes blast 5
*Escape Artist* [Trained in Acrobatics]: Escape a grab as minor action, +2 to Acrobatics
*Expanded Spellbook* [Wis 13, wizard]: Add additional daily spell to spellbook
*Far Shot* [Dex 13]: Increase projectile weapon range by 5 squares
*Far Throw* [Str 13]: Increase thrown weapon range by 2 squares
*Fast Runner* [Con 13]: +2 to speed when you charge or run
*Ferocious Rebuke* [Tiefling, infernal wrath racial power]: Push 1 square with infernal wrath
*Group Insight* [Half-Elf]: Grant allies +1 to Insight and initiative
*Halfling Agility* [Halfling, second chance racial power]: Attacker takes a –2 penalty with second chance reroll
*Harmony of Erathis* [Channel Divinity class feature, must worship Erathis]: Use Channel Divinity to invoke harmony of Erathis
*Healing Hands* [Paladin, lay on hands power]: Add Cha modifier to damage healed with lay on hands
*Hellfire Blood* [Tiefling]: +1 attack and damage with fire and fear powers
*Human Perseverance* [Human] +1 to saving throws
*Improved Dark One’s Blessing* [Con 15, warlock, infernal pact]: Pact boon grants 3 additional temporary hit points
*Improved Fate of the Void* [Con 13 or Cha 13, warlock, star pact]: Pact boon grants additional +1 bonus to die roll
*Improved Initiative* [none]: +4 to initiative checks
*Improved Misty Step* [Int 13, warlock, fey pact Pact boon grants additional 2 squares of teleport
*Inspired Recovery* [Warlord, Inspiring Presence class feature]: Grant ally saving throw with Cha modifier bonus
*Ioun’s Poise* [Channel Divinity class feature, must worship Ioun]: Use Channel Divinity to invoke Ioun’s poise
*Jack of All Trades* [Int 13]: +2 to untrained skill checks
*Kord’s Favor* [Channel Divinity class feature, must worship Kord]: Use Channel Divinity to invoke Kord’s favor
*Lethal Hunter* [Ranger, Hunter’s Quarry class feature]: Hunter’s Quarry damage dice increase to d8s
*Light Step* [Elf]: Add to overland speed of group, +1 to Acrobatics and Stealth
*Linguist* [Int 13]: Learn three new languages
*Long Jumper* [Trained in Athletics]: Make standing jumps as if from a running start, +1 to Athletics
*Lost in the Crowd* [Halfling]: +2 to AC when adjacent to at least two larger enemies
*Melora’s Tide* [Channel Divinity class feature, must worship Melora]: Use Channel Divinity to invoke Melora’s tide
*Moradin’s Resolve* [Channel Divinity class feature, must worship Moradin]: Use Channel Divinity to invoke Moradin’s resolve
*Mounted Combat* [none]: Gain access to the special abilities of your mount
*Nimble Blade* [Dex 15]: +1 to attacks with light blade and combat advantage
*Pelor’s Radiance* [Channel Divinity class feature, must worship Pelor]: Use Channel Divinity to invoke Pelor’s radiance
*Potent Challenge* [Con 15, fighter, Combat Challenge class feature]: Add Con modifier damage to target hit with opportunity attack
*Power Attack* [Str 15]: +2 damage for –2 to attack
*Powerful Charge* [Str 13]: +2 damage, +2 to bull rush on a charge
*Precise Hunter* [Wis 15, ranger, Hunter’s Quarry class feature]: Allies gain +1 attack against target hit by critical hit
*Press the Advantage* [Cha 15, rogue]: Retain combat advantage with a critical hit
*Quick Draw* [Dex 13]: Draw a weapon with attack action, +2 to initiative
*Raging Storm* [Con 13, Dex 13]: +1 damage with lightning or thunder power
*Raven Queen’s Blessing* [Channel Divinity class feature, must worship the Raven Queen]: Use Channel Divinity to invoke Raven Queen’s blessing
*Ritual Caster* [Trained in Arcana or Religion]: Master and perform rituals
*Sehanine’s Reversal* [Channel Divinity class feature, must worship Sehanine]: Use Channel Divinity to invoke Sehanine’s reversal
*Shield Proficiency (Heavy)* [Str 15, Shield Proficiency (Light)]: Proficiency with heavy shields
*Shield Proficiency (Light)* [Str 13]: Proficiency with light shields
*Shield Push* [Fighter, Combat Challenge class feature]: Push 1 square to target hit by Combat Challenge attack
*Skill Focus* [Training in chosen skill]: +3 to checks with chosen skill
*Skill Training* [none]: Gain training in one skill
*Sure Climber* [Trained in Athletics]: Climb at normal speed on any surface, +1 to Athletics
*Surprise Knockdown* [Str 15, rogue]: Knock target prone with critical hit
*Tactical Assault* [Warlord, Tactical Presence class feature]: Ally gains bonus to damage equal to your Int modifier
*Toughness* [none]: Gain 5 additional hit points per tier
*Two-Weapon Defense* [Dex 13, Two-Weapon Fighting]: +1 to AC and Reflex while holding a weapon in each hand
*Two-Weapon Fighting* [Dex 13]: +1 damage while holding a melee weapon in each hand
*Weapon Focus* [none]: +1 damage with chosen weapon group
*Weapon Proficiency* [none]: Gain proficiency with the weapon of your choice
*Wintertouched* [none]: Gain combat advantage against foe vulnerable to cold[/sblock]


----------



## Fallen Seraph

As someone else who has got the books (thus why not here all day, already been making up characters (best way for me to learn, already made up a couple)) I too shall be happy to ask questions...

Though, since been away all day, what kind of limitations have been said on giving out info?


----------



## Classic Villany

Fallen Seraph said:
			
		

> As someone else who has got the books (thus why not here all day, already been making up characters (best way for me to learn, already made up a couple)) I too shall be happy to ask questions...
> 
> Though, since been away all day, what kind of limitations have been said on giving out info?




Basicaly small snippets and excerpts are alright, but large word for word reproductions of rules are best avoided.


----------



## baberg

Fallen Seraph said:
			
		

> Though, since been away all day, what kind of limitations have been said on giving out info?



No solid rules, just the overall "Don't violate copyright".  Huge chunks of text copied out of the rulebooks is a no-no.  Giving out information (as long as you're not under an NDA) is fine but don't copy the text verbatim.  Read it, summarize it, and then post the summary.


----------



## Vempyre

Fallen Seraph said:
			
		

> As someone else who has got the books (thus why not here all day, already been making up characters (best way for me to learn, already made up a couple)) I too shall be happy to ask questions...
> 
> Though, since been away all day, what kind of limitations have been said on giving out info?




No posting whole powers or whole paragraphs textually, for example. Small snippets and talking about them and what they mean to the game is sure fine. I am sure listing them without too much details is reasonable too (personal opinion).

(recap from what I have seen the mods post)


----------



## Fallen Seraph

Cool, thanks. Well then who wants some questions answered in summarized form 

I am still working my way through the book (it has been unfortunately a hectic day) so I apologize ahead of time for delays.


----------



## Scipio202

Fallen Seraph said:
			
		

> Cool, thanks. Well then who wants some questions answered in summarized form
> 
> I am still working my way through the book (it has been unfortunately a hectic day) so I apologize ahead of time for delays.



 I mentioned this before, but I think it got lost.  What can you tell us about polymorph?  Someone said it is a ritual.  Is there a list of specific monsters you can 'morph into, or anything in the MM?  Do you get all their stats/powers/abilities, or just some of them?

Thanks.


----------



## Classic Villany

Fallen Seraph said:
			
		

> Cool, thanks. Well then who wants some questions answered in summarized form
> 
> I am still working my way through the book (it has been unfortunately a hectic day) so I apologize ahead of time for delays.




Check my post on the last page for my request.

I'd post the exact request, but I'm rather loathe to do so after posting it so recently.


----------



## Fallen Seraph

Well it seems like from what I have seen Polymorph is more a Keyword for a variety of things, soo... Turning into a shadow for example or growing leathery wings (so far for powers in PHB only seen them as Warlock).

Just to start off though, in the MM, in the Glossary (which I adore). They have Polymorph keyword, with *Change Shape* essentially, things like type and size is dependent on the creature's entry (monster power).

You can basically turn into whatever thing the power tells you too (in most it is your basic medium humanoid). If it is a specific person you have to roll Insight vs. Bluff (+20) if your trying to not be found out by someone that knows that person.

So yeah it seems to be very specific to the power and it is more simply a keyword, and change shape seems to be the most common (in the MM).

I haven't read much of the DMG yet, so dunno there.


----------



## Rechan

Demons:
Balor (27 Elite Brute) Barlgura (8 Brute) Evistro (6 Brute) Glabrezu (23 Elite Brute) Goristro (19 Elite Brute) Immolith (15 Controller) Hezrou (22 Brute) Marilith (24 Elite Skirmisher) Mezzodemon (11 Soldier) Vrock (13 Skirmisher)

Devourer:
Spirit Devourer (11 Elite Soldier) Soul Spike Devourer (20 Elite Soldier (Leader)) Viscera Devourere (12 Controller)

Elemental:
Rockfire Dreadnought (18 Soldier) Firelasher (11 Skirmisher) Earthwind Ravager (23 Controller) Thunderblast Cyclone (26 Elite Artillery) 

Kuo-toa
KT Guard (16 Minion) KT Harpooner (14 Soldier) KT Maurader (12 Skirmisher) KT Monitor (16 Skirmisher) KT Whip (16 Controller (Leader)) 

Minotaur 
M Warrior (10 Soldier) M Cabalist (13 Controller (Leader)) Savage M (16 Brute) 

Ogre 
O Thug (11 Minion) O Bludgeneer (16 Minion) O Savage (8 Brute) O Warhulk (11 Elite Brute) Ogre Skirmisher (8 Skirmisher) 

Troglodyte Mauler (6 Brute) T Curse Chanter (8 Controller (Leader)) T Warrior (12 Minion) T Impaler (7 Artillery) 

Troll 
Troll (9 Brute) War T (14 Soldier) Fell Troll (20 Elite Brute).

I'll do YT and Giants later, because there's a lot of them.


----------



## Scipio202

Ok, thanks!


----------



## Fallen Seraph

Say Rechan in general as someone else with them, what you think so far?

I am quite liking what I have read so far, though haven't delved into much of the DMG yet.


----------



## WyzardWhately

I know this is an odd thing to be interested in, but what kind of world-building stuff is stated or implied? Game-world economics? DMG stuff on the political and social structures of the world? How hard they are to mess with using skill challenges, etc.? Anything someone with the book cares to toss up will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks, guys.

Also: Are there still trained-only uses for skills? And is weird stuff like making a Heal check to burn your life energy in an attempt to counteract a necromantic ritual part of the canon? (See the optional web-supplement for KotS. Seriously.)  If you've had time to at least skim the skill challenges, what's the most awesome thing you can do using only skills, anywhere from heroic to epic?  Talk your way into owning a kingdom?  Seduce a goddess?  Break down mountains with a sledgehammer and elbowgrease?  

Furthermore:  How about these astraljammers?  They in there?  Any rules attached?


----------



## Classic Villany

Rechan said:
			
		

> Demons:
> Balor (27 Elite Brute) Barlgura (8 Brute) Evistro (6 Brute) Glabrezu (23 Elite Brute) Goristro (19 Elite Brute) Immolith (15 Controller) Hezrou (22 Brute) Marilith (24 Elite Skirmisher) Mezzodemon (11 Soldier) Vrock (13 Skirmisher)
> 
> Devourer:
> Spirit Devourer (11 Elite Soldier) Soul Spike Devourer (20 Elite Soldier (Leader)) Viscera Devourere (12 Controller)
> 
> Elemental:
> Rockfire Dreadnought (18 Soldier) Firelasher (11 Skirmisher) Earthwind Ravager (23 Controller) Thunderblast Cyclone (26 Elite Artillery)
> 
> Kuo-toa
> KT Guard (16 Minion) KT Harpooner (14 Soldier) KT Maurader (12 Skirmisher) KT Monitor (16 Skirmisher) KT Whip (16 Controller (Leader))
> 
> Minotaur
> M Warrior (10 Soldier) M Cabalist (13 Controller (Leader)) Savage M (16 Brute)
> 
> Ogre
> O Thug (11 Minion) O Bludgeneer (16 Minion) O Savage (8 Brute) O Warhulk (11 Elite Brute) Ogre Skirmisher (8 Skirmisher)
> 
> Troglodyte Mauler (6 Brute) T Curse Chanter (8 Controller (Leader)) T Warrior (12 Minion) T Impaler (7 Artillery)
> 
> Troll
> Troll (9 Brute) War T (14 Soldier) Fell Troll (20 Elite Brute).
> 
> I'll do YT and Giants later, because there's a lot of them.




Wow, thanks a lot Rechan! Pitty this site doesn't have Rep.

The only bad thing about this is that it makes me want the books yesterday.


----------



## hong

Enter HAMLET.

HAMLET: O thug! O bludgeoneer! O savage, O warhulk!


----------



## Fallen Seraph

This is a very quick skim through WyzardWhately but...

There are still Trained Skill specific abilities, such as: reducing falling damage and detect magic.

Can't see any astraljammers, but... Just since I love Sigil, thought might say there is a quick blurb about Sigil, it seems to exist between the planes and is like your classic Sigil, lots of portals (to all the planes and parts unknown), bustling metropolis, Lady of Pain.

I haven't looked at Skill Challenges or Economy yet.


----------



## Dyrvom

So as I understand it, there is one overall key ability for each class at level 1, and then a choice between two possible secondary abilities based on build options? What are the key abilities for each class?


----------



## Rechan

Fallen Seraph said:
			
		

> Say Rechan in general as someone else with them, what you think so far?



I've mainly sunk my teeth into the MM. I'm kind've confused that some preview monsters we saw (Goblin Picanter, Shadow Demon, Bugbear Headhunter) are missing! I'm surprised that some monsters are the level they are. I'm confused that DB don't have a "Get wings" feat, but one of the DB in the MM have wings. Not enough traps IMHO (There should be a whole chapter on them ). They put whole sections on fighting under water/in the air/mounts. I loves it. 

You'd possibly have to plan out your campaign in advance, because the book is all over the map with regards to levels and monster groups. 

As far as the PHB? I LOVE IT. I love the classes. And abilities. I want to play everything. I love orbs (They are so nasty). Layout is nice, but they could've moved the advancement table a little earlier. Still, the whole thing is SEXY.


----------



## Fallen Seraph

I have to doubly agree on the layout, it doesn't melt your eyes like other books.

I noticed the air combat section, I haven't read it yet, but it definitely peeked my interest. 

Oh and answer to a question:

Well, builds are simply suggestions. So they don't really impact your key abilities in that they change it, but they suggest what abilities to concentrate on if you go that route.

The Key Abilities are:

Cleric: Wisdom, Strength, Charisma
Fighter: Strength, Dexterity, Wisdom, Constitution (all fighters need strength, but the others can depend on weapons)
Paladin: Strength, Charisma, Wisdom
Ranger: Strength, Dexterity, Wisdom
Rogue: Dexterity, Strength, Charisma
Warlock: Charisma, Constitution, Intelligence
Warlord: Strength, Intelligence, Charisma
Wizard: Intelligence, Wisdom, Dexterity


----------



## Kobold Avenger

I'm interested in what are the varieties of Yuan-Ti, is it more than just Purebloods, Halfbloods and Abominations?

Also with Eladrin, if the Bralani is a 19th level controller, what's a Ghaele compared to that?  Are Fey-Knights also known as "Shieres"?

What is the highest level minion out of curiosity?


----------



## Destil

My posts will be a bit of a stream of consciousness... I'm doing this as I go.

Like the art. Many of these spread pieces feel a lot like the better Eberron art, in a good way.

I almost skipped the 'What's a RPG' chapter, but I'm glad I skimmed it. Sidebar has the history of D&D, which makes me smile.

Wow, this *is* well organized. The newbie play example flows naturally out of the section I mentioned above, and then it gets into the core mechanic.
Roll a d20. "You want to roll high!"
Add all relevant modifiers
Compare to the target number

Very clean. The basic rules structure is spelled out in 3 points which will settle many Hypersmurf-worthy arguments:

Simple Rules, Many Exceptions
Specific Beats General
Allways Eound Down

(Haven't seen D&D's additive multiplication mentioned yet... that still in, anyone who's farther than me?)


----------



## Rechan

Be aware that the stats that Fallen Seraph mentions.

Primary Stat 1, Primary Stat 2, Secondary Stat that Would be Very Good to Have. 

For example, a Paladin _needs_ a good wisdom. A lot of his tricks depend on something there (like lay on hands depends on wisdom score).


----------



## Fallen Seraph

Kobold Avenger said:
			
		

> I'm interested in what are the varieties of Yuan-Ti, is it more than just Purebloods, Halfbloods and Abominations?
> 
> Also with Eladrin, if the Bralani is a 19th level controller, what's a Ghaele compared to that?  Are Fey-Knights also known as "Shieres"?
> 
> What is the highest level minion out of curiosity?



There are Malisans (3 types), Abomination, Anathema, Snaketongue (3 types, their humans who worship Zehir and are somewhat transformed).

Ghaele is a level 21 Artillery.

Fey-Knights don't appear to be called Shieres.

Minions highest level is Level 26 a "Lich Vestige" (I love the MM's back of book Monster by Level book).


----------



## Dyrvom

Fallen Seraph said:
			
		

> I have to doubly agree on the layout, it doesn't melt your eyes like other books.
> 
> I noticed the air combat section, I haven't read it yet, but it definitely peeked my interest.
> 
> Oh and answer to a question:
> 
> Well, builds are simply suggestions. So they don't really impact your key abilities in that they change it, but they suggest what abilities to concentrate on if you go that route.
> 
> The Key Abilities are:
> 
> Cleric: Wisdom, Strength, Charisma
> Fighter: Strength, Dexterity, Wisdom, Constitution (all fighters need strength, but the others can depend on weapons)
> Paladin: Strength, Charisma, Wisdom
> Ranger: Strength, Dexterity, Wisdom
> Rogue: Dexterity, Strength, Charisma
> Warlock: Charisma, Constitution, Intelligence
> Warlord: Strength, Intelligence, Charisma
> Wizard: Intelligence, Wisdom, Dexterity




Thanks! Two questions though:
Fighters emphasize Wisdom?
Paladins are defenders and DON'T emphasize constitution?


----------



## Rechan

I will say that I did have to hunt for mechanical stuff like defenses. There's a comment in Ability Scores that says 'refer to this page for defenses', but still. 


> Paladins are defenders and DON'T need constitution?



A nice con is useful, but doesn't relate to your _powers_.


----------



## vagabonvoid

What weapons can weapon proficiency apply to (groups or individual weapons)?  Also, can improvised weapons (unarmed in particular ) be chosen?

Also, grappling...  Is it just grab in this edition?


----------



## Fallen Seraph

As for Fighters, it appears from the Fighters and Melee Weapons thing. Polearm's are tied into Wisdom for powers.


----------



## vagabonvoid

Fallen Seraph said:
			
		

> I
> The Key Abilities are:
> 
> Cleric: Wisdom, Strength, Charisma
> Fighter: Strength, Dexterity, Wisdom, Constitution (all fighters need strength, but the others can depend on weapons)
> Paladin: Strength, Charisma, Wisdom
> Ranger: Strength, Dexterity, Wisdom
> Rogue: Dexterity, Strength, Charisma
> Warlock: Charisma, Constitution, Intelligence
> Warlord: Strength, Intelligence, Charisma
> Wizard: Intelligence, Wisdom, Dexterity




OMG!!!  Fighters are MAD now!!!


----------



## Fallen Seraph

vagabonvoid said:
			
		

> OMG!!!  Fighters are MAD now!!!



Well, most of those besides strength are only really needed depending on which weapon you specialize in.


----------



## Lurker37

Rechan said:
			
		

> Be aware that the stats that Fallen Seraph mentions.
> 
> Primary Stat 1, Primary Stat 2, Secondary Stat that Would be Very Good to Have.
> 
> For example, a Paladin _needs_ a good wisdom. A lot of his tricks depend on something there (like lay on hands depends on wisdom score).




From the preview, the rogue build options seem to determine which stat is Primary 2, and which is the secondary. Is this accurate? Does it hold true for all classes? Does the primary stat vary with build choice for any class?


----------



## Dyrvom

Rechan said:
			
		

> I will say that I did have to hunt for mechanical stuff like defenses. There's a comment in Ability Scores that says 'refer to this page for defenses', but still.
> 
> A nice con is useful, but doesn't relate to your _powers_.



Warlocks have con-based powers?


----------



## Rechan

vagabonvoid said:
			
		

> What weapons can weapon proficiency apply to (groups or individual weapons)?



Individual weapons. 



> can improvised weapons (unarmed in particular ) be chosen?



Donno.



> Also, grappling...  Is it just grab in this edition?



Yes.


----------



## Rechan

Dyrvom said:
			
		

> Warlocks have con-based powers?



Infernal pact is con based.


----------



## Fallen Seraph

Rechan said:
			
		

> Infernal pact is con based.



Well and also Star, divided with Charisma as well.

This is one of my few issues so far, actually is dealing with Pacts. It seems like Infernal get more powers then the rest.


----------



## Rechan

vagabonvoid said:
			
		

> OMG!!!  Fighters are MAD now!!!



Well, here's an example:

Paragon Feat:
Deadly Axe  Pre-req: Str 17, Con 13    Treat all axes as high crit.
Heavy Blade Opportunity   Str 15 Dex 15   Use At-Will power with OA.


----------



## Destil

*PH Ch 2*

You can take powers / skills / feats / et cetera out of the order their presented. EDIT: at 1st level.

Con does something extra for everyone (HP, Surges). In fact con seems to be is the only score everyone gets a benefit from for free...

(no mention in the 2nd chapter so far of Str affecting encumbrance, for instance. Or Dex and initiative for that matter, but we know that from previews).

16 14 13 12 11 10 is the new 15 14 13 12 10 8.

Same default dice roll as 3E (4d6 six times drop the lowest, arrange as desired). But nice shiny new hopeless reroll ... I can't even call it a rule. It simply mentioned that if your total bonuses are below +4 or above +8 before racial adjustments the DM may wish you to reroll. (there's been no mention of rule 0 in general, but I'm skimming).

I like the way they present info on deities. Each has 3-4 'commands' or 'laws' or somesuch. Actually putting some dogma into religion rocks, it's the sort of thing I've always spent a lot of time working on when playting / DMing religious types.

Random deity - Raven Queen, since I've heard some clamor about her. Seems rather cool. Death is a natural end, she's unaligned and has a Three Sisters of Fate sort of vibe from Norse / Greek myth. Her commandments are: Hold no pity for those who die; it is a natural end. Bring down those who attempt to cast off the chain of fate (PCs who treat the afterlife as a revolving door; I'm looking at you...). Put down the creations / cults of Orcus.

Language is mentioned, no mention of Int adding to starting languages (maybe the feat...). 2-3 depending on race.

Each type of check is outlines. Attack, Skill and Ability. All add 1/2 your level. Aside from two page references to where you'll find 'All Other Modifiers' these three are the exact same (I'm guessing Initiative is just a Dex ability check, or were we seeing +5s?).

Step by step level up rules... though the steps are numbered it never says 'in order' specifically. *Sigh*. There's a debate we haven't had enough of. This could be a problem if feats require powers or if paragon / epic require feats (I haven't looked over the level breakdown to see where these could collide). Of course that could be alleviated because next, we have:

Retraining (1/2 a page). Any single feat, skill, power. Any one of the three each level, of course stating that you can't do anything too fancy to dodging prerequisites (haven't read this for loopholes, looks good at a glance).

18 feats at 30th. Nothing else scales that high, though the utility powers entirely 'stack' (never replace old ones): you end up with 7. At will 2, encounter / daily 4 each at 30th (this is the base progression, there could be more of any of these from class). You can entirely retrain all your heroic tier to paragon and paragon tier to epic feats, as long as you only do 1 level at a time and don't break prerequisites. It'll be interesting to see how this is balanced, and *looks* like the single most fiddly bit so far (including parts I've only heard of and haven't read)...

On to races...


----------



## Korgoth

So... what's the fluff on Mind Flayers like?


----------



## Destil

*PH C3: Races*

These have been spoiled to death by now. I'm just hitting the high points (by which I mean things that are new to me).

Eladrin get a bonus trained skill (from their superior education). +1 to will saves and +5 vs charm. Considered a fey.

I'm in the 'WTF, again!?!?' camp on half-elves... A floating +2 and +2 Cha was all I think it would take to make them awesome, +2 Con... well at least everyone can use it.

Tiefling also _looks_ underpowered, though they at least feel right.


----------



## Dyrvom

Thanks for the confirmation on Warlocks.

I am somewhat bothered by some classes and builds seeming to get noticeably better synergy and base-coverage with their abilities (demon pact Warlock vs. main-defender Paladin). However, Wizards swears by their playtesting, and I haven't touched 4E yet personally, so I'll see.


----------



## MindWanderer

Can you explain a little more about:







			
				Underage AOLer said:
			
		

> *Inspired Recovery* [Warlord, Inspiring Presence class feature]: Grant ally saving throw with Cha modifier bonus
> *Mounted Combat* [none]: Gain access to the special abilities of your mount
> *Nimble Blade* [Dex 15]: +1 to attacks with light blade and combat advantage
> *Precise Hunter* [Wis 15, ranger, Hunter’s Quarry class feature]: Allies gain +1 attack against target hit by critical hit
> *Press the Advantage* [Cha 15, rogue]: Retain combat advantage with a critical hit
> *Quick Draw* [Dex 13]: Draw a weapon with attack action, +2 to initiative
> *Shield Push* [Fighter, Combat Challenge class feature]: Push 1 square to target hit by Combat Challenge attack
> *Tactical Assault* [Warlord, Tactical Presence class feature]: Ally gains bonus to damage equal to your Int modifier



and all the Channel Divinity feat powers?



			
				Underage AOLer said:
			
		

> *Toughness* [none]: Gain 5 additional hit points per tier



<Sigh> And it sucks again.  The preview version (3 + 1/level) was pretty solid, but not a must-have.  5/tier--1 per 2 levels--is crap.


			
				Underage AOLer said:
			
		

> *Skill Focus* [Training in chosen skill]: +3 to checks with chosen skill



They lied to me... at DDXP, they said this no longer existed.  Well, it makes some of those DCs we've seen more attainable.


----------



## Rechan

Korgoth said:
			
		

> So... what's the fluff on Mind Flayers like?



Same as the old fluff.


----------



## Korgoth

Rechan said:
			
		

> Same as the old fluff.




Thanks! Also, just what I wanted to hear.


----------



## MindWanderer

Fallen Seraph said:
			
		

> The Key Abilities are:
> 
> Cleric: Wisdom, Strength, Charisma
> Fighter: Strength, Dexterity, Wisdom, Constitution (all fighters need strength, but the others can depend on weapons)
> Paladin: Strength, Charisma, Wisdom
> Ranger: Strength, Dexterity, Wisdom
> Rogue: Dexterity, Strength, Charisma
> Warlock: Charisma, Constitution, Intelligence
> Warlord: Strength, Intelligence, Charisma
> Wizard: Intelligence, Wisdom, Dexterity



To follow up on this:

1) Can you give us an example of what Dex does for a wizard, what Int does for a Warlock, and what Cha does for a cleric?  I think we have a good idea about the rest of them.
2) For a paladin, Str is primary and Cha secondary?  That seems odd--most of the paladin stuff we've seen has been Cha primary.  I was looking forward to playing a low-Str paladin, which looked possible (if limiting) so far--can you confirm whether this is at all viable?


----------



## Destil

Since it was requested: Zones are continual area effects. They overlap (don't stack) if they produce a similar effect...

No mention of when damage happens, I'm guessing in the power descriptions.


----------



## Matrix Sorcica

*Reused art in the MM*

I'm a bit let down that there's reused art in the MM. You'd think that in a production of this magnitude, Wizards could afford ten more illustrations or so......


----------



## Rechan

MindWanderer said:
			
		

> Can you explain a little more about:



Some of those are pretty much what you get. Like Tactical assault, you really just add your int to the damage to an ally's attack when they use an Action Point.  

But I'll specify with a few.

Quickdraw lets you draw an item or a weapon in the same motion that you would _use_ that item. So let's say you've got a dagger in your belt, but you're unarmed. You can draw it and attack with a single standard action. You also get a +2 to Initiative. 

Mounted Combat grants certain traits that mounts grant their riders. For instance, the Dire Wolf has an ability that grants its rider combat advantage if another ally (other than the mount) is adjacent to the foe. 

A warhorse horse gives you a +5 damage on charge attacks.


----------



## Rechan

Matrix Sorcica said:
			
		

> I'm a bit let down that there's reused art in the MM. You'd think that in a production of this magnitude, Wizards could afford ten more illustrations or so......



I'd say there's maybe 5 pictures that have been reused, at least of what I've seen.


----------



## RigaMortus2

Can anyone give us the run down on alignments?  Is CG just rolled into Good now?  Any penalty/bonus for changing alignment mid-campaign?

Any class restrictions?  Alignment based?  Race based?  Minimum ability score?


If I wanted to make an archer type character, could the Fighter fill this role, or am I stuck with Ranger?  ie, can you make a feasible archery based Fighter?


----------



## Destil

*The first power to really make me say 'Awesome'*

The new spiritual weapon rocks. Level 5 daily, d10+wis damage with sustain minor (Wis attack vs. AC each round) and you can move it 10 squares as a move...

But the real benefit: Remember how spiritual weapon didn't grant flanking bonuses? Hell with that, now it grants combat advantage for all allies attacking the target.


----------



## Rechan

MindWanderer said:
			
		

> To follow up on this:
> 
> 1) Can you give us an example of what Dex does for a wizard



The only real EXAMPLE that I can find is that with Wand accuracy, it gives you a dex bonus to attack.

I mentioned earlier that Charisma is just a slight rider on some effects for a Cleric.



> 2) For a paladin, Str is primary and Cha secondary? ?



No no no.

There are two builds. A STR based Pally, or a CHA based Pally. THe former is very offensive, the latter is offensive/defensive mixed. Wisdom is the secondary stat that really helps a paladin of either build; a low Wis Strenght paladin is going to be hurtin' with his abilities, because Wisdom effects a lot of his powers' secondary effects. Lay on Hands is keyed off your wisdom, for instance.

I'll give you an example. Righteous smite. It's Charisma vs. AC, 2(W)+Charisma, and you and any ally within 5 squares of you gain temp hp of 5 + Your Wisdom.


----------



## Rechan

RigaMortus2 said:
			
		

> f I wanted to make an archer type character, could the Fighter fill this role, or am I stuck with Ranger?  ie, can you make a feasible archery based Fighter?



Looking through the first five levels of Fighter, I don't see any real powers that you can use with ranged weapons.


----------



## MindWanderer

Rechan said:
			
		

> Some of those are pretty much what you get. Like Tactical assault, you really just add your int to the damage to an ally's attack when they use an Action Point.



The words "Action Point" being missing from the short description were pretty key.


			
				Rechan said:
			
		

> For instance, the Dire Wolf has an ability that grants its rider combat advantage if another ally (other than the mount) is adjacent to the foe.



So we'll have rogues riding dire wolves.  Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.







			
				Rechan said:
			
		

> There are two builds. A STR based Pally, or a CHA based Pally. THe former is very offensive, the latter is offensive/defensive mixed. Wisdom is the secondary stat that really helps a paladin of either build; a low Wis Strenght paladin is going to be hurtin' with his abilities, because Wisdom effects a lot of his powers' secondary effects. Lay on Hands is keyed off your wisdom, for instance.



Ah, so it's more like the ranger and warlock: pick one of two primary stats, or maybe but not necessarily both.  Thanks a lot.


----------



## Rechan

MindWanderer said:
			
		

> So we'll have rogues riding dire wolves.  Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.



You and an adjacent ally gaining combat advantage is one of the abilities that wolves (and hyenas, and a select few monsters) have. A dire wolf giving that same ability to its rider would suggest that the rider is operating on the same "Harrying Pack" tactic. 

Besides, I don't know if a rogue would be able to do all his shifty tricks if he's mounted on a dire wolf. He's also got to be able to lug the beast around, tend to it, spend the feat, the dire wolf will likely die against more fierce foes (It's just a level 5 skirmisher), etc.


----------



## Rechan

MindWanderer said:
			
		

> Ah, so it's more like the ranger and warlock: pick one of two primary stats, or maybe but not necessarily both.  Thanks a lot.



Warlord is the same. You have Int-based powers and Cha-based powers. 
Cleric is also the same. Str or Wisdom based.
Rogue is Str or Cha (with dex tossed in there too).


----------



## Naathez

Everyone will find these question so silly, but I'm curious.

Are Spiked Gauntlets (and Gauntlets) in the weapons list? 
If yes, (and if it can be told) what damage do they do, and do they have any special ability?


and

Are SHIELDS also weapons (as in, is there a damage listed for Shield Bash?)
Thanks!


----------



## MindWanderer

Rechan said:
			
		

> Warlord is the same. You have Int-based powers and Cha-based powers.
> Cleric is also the same. Str or Wisdom based.
> Rogue is Str or Cha (with dex tossed in there too).



 Not quite, from what I've seen so far.

- Ranger chooses one of two primary abilities (Str and Dex), and has one secondary ability (Wis).
- Warlock chooses one or both of two primary abilities (Con and Cha), and has one secondary ability (Int).
- Paladin has at least one primary ability, but having good scores in both (Str and Cha) gives you more options.  One secondary (Wis).
- Warlord and Rogue have one definite primary (Str/Dex, respectively) and choose one of two secondaries (Int and Cha/Str and Cha, respectively).
- Cleric has one definite primary (Wis) and may or may not have a second primary (Str).  One secondary (Cha).
- I'm still not sure how wizards and fighters play out.

Interesting that the MAD dynamic seems to be different for every class, except for rogue and warlord, and maybe wizard.


----------



## MinionOfCthulhu

I don't know if this is the right place to put this, but: 
The fact that phoenixes are now unintelligent, fiery cousins of rocs is stupid.


----------



## 1013dragon

*Warlock for KotS*

I'm addicted and the books aren't even officially out! Would someone please give enough information to run a warlock to 3rd level for Keep on the Shadowfell? 

2nd level Utility power

3rd level power(s)

I am using the Fey Pact rules from DDXP since that is all that has been released for the Warlock as of yet.


----------



## Jack Colby

MinionOfCthulhu said:
			
		

> I don't know if this is the right place to put this, but:
> The fact that phoenixes are now unintelligent, fiery cousins of rocs is stupid.




Why?


----------



## Rechan

1013dragon said:
			
		

> I'm addicted and the books aren't even officially out! Would someone please give enough information to run a warlock to 3rd level for Keep on the Shadowfell?
> 
> 2nd level Utility power



Beguiling Tongue. +5 to Bluff, Diplomacy, or Intimidate checks for the entire encounter. 



> 3rd level power(s)



Otherwind Stride. Encounter. Close burst 1. Charisma vs Fort. 1d8+Cha, targets are immobilized until end of your turn. You teleport 5+Int. 

There are other options. I'd actually suggest some of the powers under the star pact; their utility ones are nice for that level. But I don't feel comfortable posting anything more. THat should at least get you through KotS.


----------



## Rechan

Naathez said:
			
		

> Everyone will find these question so silly, but I'm curious.
> 
> Are Spiked Gauntlets (and Gauntlets) in the weapons list?



No.

and



> Are SHIELDS also weapons (as in, is there a damage listed for Shield Bash?)



Shields are not, but there's a Fighter feat that lets you Push a foe 1 square if you hit them with your Combat Challenge class feature.


----------



## Rechan

Two things, just observations.

The MM is awesome. Why? Because when there's a spread picture that has multiple monsters on it, there's almost always a footnote that lets you know which monster is which. I spent the longest time looking at the 3e MM trying to figure out which pic went with which demon. 

I love shuriken. Why? 

They're a Superior weapon (4e equivalent of exotic weapon). +3 accuracy, 6/12 range. They do 1d4.

But Rogues get to use them for free, and in a rogue's hands they do 1d6.


----------



## 1013dragon

*Cthulhu Pact (Star)*

Thanks, Rechan!


----------



## Naathez

Thanks, Rechan!

guess I'll have to talk to my DM and stat up some gauntlets. (I have a character I wanted to remake, a disgraced knight who refused to use  knightly weapons out of his shame and only fought with his spiked gauntlets, and the fact a weapon isn't included in a list doesn't seem to me like good reason not to play Scar again.) 

If I understand it well, though, the way weapons work now, I can just take any other appropriate one-handed martial weapon (is that still the nomenclature?) which my DM thinks may mechanically fit and use its stats, just describing it as gauntlets. Maybe change its special ability with not being disarmable. 

Come to think of it, one could do that before, as well. 

why are minutes passing so slowly? release is a LIFE away!!!


----------



## Fallen Seraph

You could always use the stats for the Katar, but change the Group to say... Unarmed, Mace.


----------



## Rechan

Naathez said:
			
		

> Thanks, Rechan!
> 
> guess I'll have to talk to my DM and stat up some gauntlets. (I have a character I wanted to remake, a disgraced knight who refused to use  knightly weapons out of his shame and only fought with his spiked gauntlets, and the fact a weapon isn't included in a list doesn't seem to me like good reason not to play Scar again.)
> 
> If I understand it well, though, the way weapons work now, I can just take any other appropriate one-handed martial weapon (is that still the nomenclature?) which my DM thinks may mechanically fit and use its stats, just describing it as gauntlets. Maybe change its special ability with not being disarmable.



One handed weapons, yeah.

You know, what you COULD do is use a Katar. 

Superior weapon (Exotic), +3 Accuracy, 1d6 damage. That should function as the equivalent of of a bladed gauntlet. 

Otherwise I'd just use a mace or hammer or something.


----------



## Fallen Seraph

Beat you to the punch (horrible pun I know)


----------



## Naathez

This is why I love this place. We've seen discussions, fighting, and bickering over nothings for months, but the moment one throws an idea on the table, he's sure to find help and cooperation. 

This is what makes ENworld so great. Thank you all. 

more on topic, I also like the idea of the gauntlets being superior "exotic" - as in, I think using a superior weapon as a template might reflect the fact Scar's been fighting with these so compulsively, and had to stay alive just by using them, that he's honed their use to a very efficacious level. And the feat expenditure reflects that training.


----------



## MinionOfCthulhu

Jack Colby said:
			
		

> Why?




Because there doesn't seem to be a good reason why they made the previously intelligent, good-aligned, magic-imbued symbols of hope and rebirth into dumb giant birds on fire?


----------



## Dyrvom

Can I get a clarification as to the Half-Elf racial power (ie. is it simply "another class's at-will as an encounter" like we thought)?


----------



## pukunui

Wow! I start a new job (which means hardly any time to check the boards anymore) and people have already got the books, more than a week early!

My one question at this time is:

What can you do with Athletics and Acrobatics? Does either skill allow you to do any sort of tumbling maneuver, or is that solely a 1/encounter rogue power now?


----------



## That One Guy

Family said:
			
		

> Oh, you're THAT guy   Hi That Guy, gonna build a Tarresque killer?
> 
> Just Kidding, as if I'm one to talk; actually I'm also curious.



I thought I was that one guy... funny. But I'm not a Tarresque killer (actually... in an epic game I did do it. But it wasn't like I wanted to fight a friggin' Tarresque). 

Fallen Seraph, did you also get your books from a site that rhymes w/ die.com?

To be honest, I sort of wish the books hadn't shipped (or as some claim leaked to the interwebs) early. It was sort of like waiting of Christmas, or any other generic day of awesome things and that anticipation is broken.

And Wormwood, I miss Emerald City Too.


----------



## WhatGravitas

That One Guy said:
			
		

> To be honest, I sort of wish the books hadn't shipped (or as some claim leaked to the interwebs) early. It was sort of like waiting of Christmas, or any other generic day of awesome things and that anticipation is broken.



Rather like waiting for Christmas, then seeing that the OTHER kids got their presents early. AND you know where your parents have stocked your presents.

Cheers, LT.


----------



## Tuft

pukunui said:
			
		

> What can you do with Athletics and Acrobatics? Does either skill allow you to do any sort of tumbling maneuver, or is that solely a 1/encounter rogue power now?




Acrobatics has a specific "Stunt" option that are not present in the other skills. That allows you to do something "tumble-ish" (think the example was something like "vaulting over an opponent") IF you manage to sweettalk you DM into it (read: I think the difficulty was set by the DM on a case-by-case basis, no fixed rule.)


----------



## hong

Tuft said:
			
		

> Acrobatics has a specific "Stunt" option that are not present in the other skills. That allows you to do something "tumble-ish" (think the example was something like "vaulting over an opponent") IF you manage to sweettalk you DM into it (read: I think the difficulty was set by the DM on a case-by-case basis, no fixed rule.)



 Awesome!


----------



## Rechan

Man. It seems like the designers really got their jollies making the Infernal powers. On several levels, there's 2 infernal powers and only 1 Fey and Star.

Also, int modifies various abilities, similar to how Wisdom modifies various Paladin abilities.


----------



## Silverblade The Ench

What do daggers do as implements, for wizards? 

Orbs = basically make harder to save against.
Wands = bonus to hit.
Staffs = bonus damage??
Daggers = ???


----------



## Destil

Silverblade The Ench said:
			
		

> What do daggers do as implements, for wizards?
> 
> Orbs = basically make harder to save against.
> Wands = bonus to hit.
> Staffs = bonus damage??
> Daggers = ???



Wizards don't use daggers. Warlocks get rods & wands with daggers as special (along the lines of the holy avenger for a paladin).

Orbs - Better Duration for spells, Wis Based bonus
Wands - Better attack roll for spells, Dex based
Staffs - Better defense, con based

All of the basic benefits are free actions and only usually last 1 round.

EDIT: Wis affects some of the wizard At-Wills, but I haven't seen it in the normal powers (Thunderlance is now a set 4 squares, for example).

And they didn't fix Mirror Image -_-


----------



## Khaalis

Silverblade The Ench said:
			
		

> What do daggers do as implements, for wizards?
> 
> Orbs = basically make harder to save against.
> Wands = bonus to hit.
> Staffs = bonus damage??
> Daggers = ???




From what I can see, nothing. There is a "pact blade" mentioned in the warlock section which is a special magical dagger that acts as an implement for warlocks.

The only implements for wizard are: Orb, Staff or Wand, which grants its bonus to attack and damage with 'implement' keyword powers, as well as choosing your implement mastery. I suspect we will see more implement masteries in the Arcane splatbook as well.

I am sure I read somewhere that more implements will be included in the splat books to follow.


----------



## Khaalis

Dyrvom said:
			
		

> Can I get a clarification as to the Half-Elf racial power (ie. is it simply "another class's at-will as an encounter" like we thought)?




*Half-Elf*
* +2 Con, +2 Cha
* Medium, 6 squares, Low-Light
* +2 Diplomacy, +2 Insight
* Choose an at-will power from a class different from yours and use it as an encounter power.
* Can take Human or Elven feats.
* Grant +1 Diplomacy to all allies within 10 squares.


----------



## Silverblade The Ench

Ah, thanks folks
thought I'd read some place daggers were going ot be an implement, too.


----------



## Khaalis

Silverblade The Ench said:
			
		

> Ah, thanks folks
> thought I'd read some place daggers were going ot be an implement, too.



I seem to remember that in the first iteration of implements they were mentioned. However, that was way back in the development cycle when books were an implement as well. Once things were closer to what they are now, I think we heard that daggers, masks, and other such implements would make an appearance later on (thus likely in the Arcane book).

Keep in mind, they do need to keep some juicy material to put in the future books. I am certain they specifically "trimmed" the PHB taking out certain "extras" for later use in the splatbooks.


----------



## Lurker37

RigaMortus2 said:
			
		

> If I wanted to make an archer type character, could the Fighter fill this role, or am I stuck with Ranger?  ie, can you make a feasible archery based Fighter?




No, because 3E fighters got split into two 4E classes, due to the concept of roles. 3E fighters could be defenders or strikers. So in 4E the fighter got split into a class for each role, and the striker killed the ranger and took all his weapon skills, and his name. 

( If WoTC had just given both these classes brand new names, we wouldn't have half the trouble wrapping our heads around what they do, but then I guess it would be too much of a departure from the icons of D&D. )

The new defender class kept the name of Fighter. It wears heavy armour, goes toe to to with the enemy, and has lots of abilities to discourage any opponent it can close with from attacking other, less resilient party members, and swing at the Fighter instead. Standing back and using a missile weapon just doesn't work with that role - they need to get up close and personal to be effective.

The lightly armoured, mobile finesse fighter now goes by the name of Ranger. _Despite the name of 'Ranger', this class has no magic, no animal companion, and doesn't even necessarily know that much about nature._  As a striker, their role is to inflict damage on the enemy, preferably without getting hit themselves. To achieve this they can either specialise in darting in and out of combat with a melee weapon in each hand, or standing back and letting fly with arrows et al.  It's really just another type of fighter with a different role - dealing damage instead of keeping the enemy occupied. 

So if you want a non-magical Fighter specialised in Archery, you actually want a Ranger in 4E. It just feels weird because we're used to that class name having a lot of baggage it no longer has in 4E.

By the same token, anyone wanting to play a woodsman with nature-themed magic and a trained attack lion/tiger/bear/(oh my!) is SoL for now.


----------



## Upper_Krust

Hey there! 

A few minor questions for anyone with the books. Curious about the *number of epic monsters in the book* (a general ballpark figure will do), and who are the *top ten highest level* (or should that be by XP Value I suppose) *monsters in the book* (Name, Level & Role)?

WotC mentioned Orcus is Level 33, *just wondering if Levistus or any other unique beings show up*?

Thanks in advance.


----------



## Voss

Lurker37 said:
			
		

> The lightly armoured, mobile finesse fighter now goes by the name of Ranger. _Despite the name of 'Ranger', this class has no magic, no animal companion, and doesn't even necessarily know that much about nature._
> 
> By the same token, anyone wanting to play a woodsman with druidic magic and a trained attack lion/tiger/bear/(oh my!) is SoL for now.




Hooray and hooray, respectively.  Though to be fair, D&D has never supported a mobile finesse fighter.  At least not well.  You certainly couldn't do it effectively with the fighter class.


----------



## Khaalis

Upper_Krust said:
			
		

> Curious about the *number of epic monsters in the book* (a general ballpark figure will do), and who are the *top ten highest level* (or should that be by XP Value I suppose) *monsters in the book* (Name, Level & Role)?




The Top 10:

1) Orcus - Level 33 Solo Brute
2) Ancient Red Dragon - Level 30 Solo Soldier
3) Tarasque (Abomination) - Level 30 Solo Brute
4) Runescribed Dracolich - Level 29 Solo Controller
5) Godforged Colossus - Level 29 Elite Brute
6) Efreet Karadjin - Level 28 Soldier
7) Sorrowsworn Deathlord - Level 28 Lurker
8) Earthrage Battlebriar - Level 28 Elite Brute
9) Atropal (Abomination) - Level 28 Elite Brute
10) Adult Blue Dragon  - Level 28 Solo Artillery


By epic, did you mean Elites? If so about 90.
If you meant "epic Tier" ... about 75.


----------



## Ishmayl

I think they hired weapons consultants on the images of weapons - some of them look much more realistic and are better represented than all the previous editions.


----------



## Ulthwithian

Cool stuff, all.

The question I have regarding the Warlock powers is:

If a Warlock power says it is associated with a given Pact, do you need to have that pact to pick the power?  E.g., if I'm a Star pact Warlock, can I choose Infernal pact powers?

Looking forward to hearing more.


----------



## RigaMortus2

Matrix Sorcica said:
			
		

> I'm a bit let down that there's reused art in the MM. You'd think that in a production of this magnitude, Wizards could afford ten more illustrations or so......




This isn't unusual.  In fact, 3E is the only edition DIDN'T recycle old art.


----------



## Fifth Element

MinionOfCthulhu said:
			
		

> I don't know if this is the right place to put this, but:
> The fact that phoenixes are now unintelligent, fiery cousins of rocs is stupid.



This probably isn't the right place to put that.


----------



## Ulthwithian

Re: reused art, I would be willing to bet any money that the only reason it's reused is that the new art submitted was not accepted.


----------



## Zinger2099

To the lucky bookowners:

What other goodies can be found in the DM's Toolbox?


----------



## LostInTheMists

*Class Templates*

Hey folks!

Since my books are still a few weeks off (they're going to be a Father's Day gift from my wife), could someone give examples of a few of the "class templates" that were mentioned?  I've been dying to know how those work.

Thanks!


----------



## RigaMortus2

Would like to re-ask...  Can we get any info on alignments?  Is Neutral Good and Chaotic Good rolled into Good?  Do Paladins have to be Lawful Good, or can they be of other alignments?  Any other classes have alignment restrictions?

Any other info you can give regarding alignments?


----------



## RandomCitizenX

Alignment is broken down as follows
LG= civilization and order. The greater good sort of vibe..seems to stress the L over the G. Prefer to work from within the system if it is possible, but does not blindly follow the law.
G= freedom and kindness. Doing the right thing doesn't always mean following the law.. also doesn't mean you always break it.
E= tyranny and hatred. Self serving evil. Prefer laws which segregate as long as it puts them at an advantage. 
CE= Entropy and Destruction. Total self serving individualism taken to the extreme. If you are not directly helping their goal then you must be destroyed.
unaligned=not taking a stand. This is where the average man falls. Not  evil, but not always willing to put their life on the line for a good cause. In a cosmic sense it is also just staying out of it for one reason or another.

The book talks about how you should consider the alignments as teams you can choose to play on. If you are LG you are on the same team as Bahamut even if he isn't your god. They also mention that for anything which keys off of alignment (such as some magic items) LG=G and CE=E


----------



## Zinger2099

RigaMortus2 said:
			
		

> Would like to re-ask...  Can we get any info on alignments?  Is Neutral Good and Chaotic Good rolled into Good?  Do Paladins have to be Lawful Good, or can they be of other alignments?  Any other classes have alignment restrictions?
> 
> Any other info you can give regarding alignments?




I don't have the books but can answer some of these myself.

Paladins are no longer a Champion of Good and Justice, but merely a Champion of a God. So, while a Paladin of Bahamut might be restricted to LG, I am fairly certain you can have Paladins of any alignment (restricted only by your God).

As far as I can tell, the alignment spectrum is Lawful Good > Good > Unaligned > Evil > Chaotic Evil.


----------



## Bolongo

Ulthwithian said:
			
		

> If a Warlock power says it is associated with a given Pact, do you need to have that pact to pick the power?  E.g., if I'm a Star pact Warlock, can I choose Infernal pact powers?



No and Yes.
(And if you have trouble parsing that it's because of the way you phrased your question.    )

However... some powers get noticeably better if you have the corresponding pact.


----------



## Caliber

RigaMortus2 said:
			
		

> Would like to re-ask...  Can we get any info on alignments?  Is Neutral Good and Chaotic Good rolled into Good?  Do Paladins have to be Lawful Good, or can they be of other alignments?  Any other classes have alignment restrictions?
> 
> Any other info you can give regarding alignments?




Good more or less has subsumed CG and NG. As far as I could tell from my time with them (and note I'm at work so I don't have them now ... :shifty eyes alignment has nearly NO affect on the game's mechanics, other than you must be the alignment of your Deity (if Cleric, and presumably Paladin). If your god is unaligned, they don't care what your alignment is (again, if Cleric, and presumably Paladin.) 

Off hand, I only remember one power that mentioned alignment at all, and it was a Paladin Paragon Path Power (wow, I feel the need for more P-words suddenly)

Hope that helps!


----------



## RandomCitizenX

Zinger2099 said:
			
		

> As far as I can tell, the alignment spectrum is Lawful Good > Good > Unaligned > Evil > Chaotic Evil.




It is really better to think of it more along the lines of

LG\  /E
G  / \CE

     U (doing its own thing)


LG isn't the ultra paragon of good. Just like CE isn't the always the more evil of evil.


----------



## jaldaen

Are there any move action attack powers? If so, how do they balance them? Penalty to attack? Lesser damage? Both?


----------



## jedrious

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Are there any move action attack powers? If so, how do they balance them? Penalty to attack? Lesser damage? Both?



did a quick look-over and found this:


> Fortifying Smite Paladin Attack 17
> A symphony of otherworldly music resonates throughout your body, fortifying it to withstand the tests to come.
> Encounter ✦ Divine, Weapon
> Standard Action Melee weapon
> Target: One creature
> Attack: Charisma vs. AC
> Hit: 3[W] + Charisma modifier damage. Until the end of your next turn, you gain a power bonus to AC equal to your Wisdom modifier.
> 
> Hand of the Gods Paladin Attack 17
> You hold your holy symbol high above your head, and a brilliant flash of divine light explodes from it. The radiance sears your foes and inspires your closest allies.
> Encounter ✦ Divine, Implement, Radiant
> Minor Action Close burst 1
> Target: Each enemy in burst
> Attack: Charisma vs. Fortitude
> Hit: 2d10 + Charisma modifier radiant damage, and the target is marked until the end of your next turn.
> Effect: Until the end of your next turn, allies in the burst gain a power bonus to attack rolls equal to your Wisdom modifier.



 haven't seen a move action attack but surely they exist if a minor action one exists


----------



## Stonesnake

To all of those who have the books early...

I'll give you $300 (paypal) for your set if you send them to me FedEx for tomorrow (I'll give you my FedEx number to use).

I just ask for all three books in the slipcase (the original core rulebook giftset which I assume is what everyone got early) and I'll send you the money today.

Send me a message if you are interested in making a quick buck off of your early shipment!


----------



## Darkthorne

Expecting a no to most of these but I'll ask anyhow. Anything akin to the leadership feat (gaining a cohort)? Also any template or feat to simulate being royalty? For weapons is there spiked chains or something akin to them? If so what is damage/perks and possible feat/power that works well with it?
Thanks in advance


----------



## jedrious

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Are there any move action attack powers? If so, how do they balance them? Penalty to attack? Lesser damage? Both?



did a more thorough look through and move action powers are exclusive to utility powers


----------



## RigaMortus2

Any powers or feats or racial abilities that require the use of an Action Point?  Can you show some examples of some?


----------



## Spenser

If you are a human who multiclasses at first level, can you pick your free at-will from your multiclass?


----------



## Caliber

Darkthorne said:
			
		

> Expecting a no to most of these but I'll ask anyhow. Anything akin to the leadership feat (gaining a cohort)? Also any template or feat to simulate being royalty? For weapons is there spiked chains or something akin to them? If so what is damage/perks and possible feat/power that works well with it?
> Thanks in advance




Dunno about Q #s 1 and 2, but Spiked Chains are still around and count as Flails for Weapon specific feats. Can't think of any off the top of my head though, but I know I saw them.


----------



## MinionOfCthulhu

Fifth Element said:
			
		

> This probably isn't the right place to put that.




I suppose not. Not sure where else to mention it though.


----------



## Westwind

Any chance we could get a sense of what sort of powers a bow-focused ranger has in the heroic tier of play?


----------



## Insight

Family said:
			
		

> How long does it take to make a Char?




"You're a silly person, and I'm not going to interview you anymore."

"What?"

"That's not even a proper nose.  It's polystyrene."

<takes nose>

"Give me my nose back!"

"You can collect it at reception, now go away."

Seriously, this is kind of a silly question.  It takes as long as it takes.  We're all learning the rules right now.  How long did it take for you to make your first 3e character?  Figure about the same amount of time.


----------



## DerekSTheRed

I asked this yesterday but didn't see a response.  Can someone list the special actions in the combat chapters (i.e. bull rush, grab, trip, disarm etc.).  I specifically want to know if you can feint in combat like you could in 3E.

Thanks,
Derek


----------



## Luinnar

Do epic tier wizard spells seem to be modeled after the high level spells in 3rd edition or are they all new? Also if someone can post a snipit of a epic level wizard spell, that would be great!


----------



## RandomCitizenX

DerekSTheRed said:
			
		

> I asked this yesterday but didn't see a response.  Can someone list the special actions in the combat chapters (i.e. bull rush, grab, trip, disarm etc.).  I specifically want to know if you can feint in combat like you could in 3E.
> 
> Thanks,
> Derek




Bullrush, Charge, Grab, Coup De Grace, Crawl, Escape (as in from a grab)


----------



## DerekSTheRed

RandomCitizenX said:
			
		

> Bullrush, Charge, Grab, Coup De Grace, Crawl, Escape (as in from a grab)




Thanks RC-X.


----------



## nadethoughts

*Templates*

So are there were templates? Like, oh, weretiger? and if so is there any way of making them a character option?


----------



## jedrious

Luinnar said:
			
		

> Do epic tier wizard spells seem to be modeled after the high level spells in 3rd edition or are they all new? Also if someone can post a snipit of a epic level wizard spell, that would be great!



I posted the lvl 29 dailies on somewhere around page 6, epic level wizard spells are a I'd approximate 1/3 updates to old spells, 1/3 entirely new spells and 1/3 upgrades to lower level spells


----------



## jedrious

nadethoughts said:
			
		

> So are there were templates? Like, oh, weretiger? and if so is there any way of making them a character option?



Lycanthropy was a big let-down actually, only Werewolf and Wererat in MM Wererats spread Filth Fever with a bite, werewolves spread Moon Frenzy with a bite, there doesn't seem to be a method for spreading Lycanthropy at all, the closest thing you'll get to playing a Lycan is the two Shifter write-ups in the Apendix

I'm anticipating/hoping that when we get the Druid next year we'll also get a more fleshed out Lycanthropy in MM2


----------



## Mouseferatu

Spenser said:
			
		

> If you are a human who multiclasses at first level, can you pick your free at-will from your multiclass?




Since they've already talked about multiclassing in public, I feel safe answering this.

The answer is "no." Each multiclass feat offers very specific traits and abilities; no more, no less. Taking your extra at-will from a different class if you're human is not one of those traits.


----------



## jedrious

Mouseferatu said:
			
		

> Since they've already talked about multiclassing in public, I feel safe answering this.
> 
> The answer is "no." Each multiclass feat offers very specific traits and abilities; no more, no less. Taking your extra at-will from a different class if you're human is not one of those traits.



Note that Paragon Multiclassing does allow you to swap an at-will for your new class


----------



## Mouseferatu

jedrious said:
			
		

> Note that Paragon Multiclassing does allow you to swap an at-will for your new class




Indeedy. But that's not a 1st-level thing.


----------



## AkaKageWarrior

Thanks for answering all the questions!

one more about the specific fighter multi class feat:

the +1 to attack you get, is that also only 1/enc, or a permanent bonus?


----------



## Caliber

AkaKageWarrior said:
			
		

> Thanks for answering all the questions!
> 
> one more about the specific fighter multi class feat:
> 
> the +1 to attack you get, is that also only 1/enc, or a permanent bonus?




1/encounter


----------



## Truth Seeker

Hmmm, looks like the NDA got rendered 'useless'.


----------



## AkaKageWarrior

Caliber said:
			
		

> 1/encounter




thanks! 

Take a look at the warlord's level 29 powers, ain't it cinematic, ain't it BEAUTIFUL?

look for:
http://www.rpg-shop.com/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=201598&postcount=475

Defy Death Warlord Attack 29
warlord leaps to ally’s side and spare him from the jaws of death,
which means move twice speed (no OAs!), attack for 7[W], enemy's attack misses,
AND ally can spend healing surge... wow!


----------



## jaldaen

jedrious said:
			
		

> did a more thorough look through and move action powers are exclusive to utility powers




Thanks


----------



## jaldaen

Does the Ranger's Hunter's Quary damage go up each tier? +1d6 1st-10th; +2d6 11th-20th, +3d6 21st-30th? I'm just trying to figure out if the other classes have class features which scale with tier besides the rogue. Thanks


----------



## Voss

Caliber said:
			
		

> 1/encounter




Really.  Hmm.  Well so much for making that character multi-classed.
Hmm


----------



## Underage AOLer

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Does the Ranger's Hunter's Quary damage go up each tier? +1d6 1st-10th; +2d6 11th-20th, +3d6 21st-30th? I'm just trying to figure out if the other classes have class features which scale with tier besides the rogue. Thanks




Yes.  That is the progression as well.


----------



## Caliber

Voss said:
			
		

> Really.  Hmm.  Well so much for making that character multi-classed.
> Hmm




Note that Fighters themselves only get +1 constantly. To give that to someone multiclassing into Fighter might leave poor 'ole Regdar feeling left out in the cold.


----------



## AkaKageWarrior

next question:

how many skills does each class get?


----------



## jaldaen

Underage AOLer said:
			
		

> Yes.  That is the progression as well.




Excellent! I'll assume the Warlock's curse does the same... now here's another associated question: Do any of the non-striker classes have class features, which increase by level or tier? If so, what are they?

Cleric: Do channel divinity or healing word scale (okay this already scales, but does the 1d6 increase to 2d6 at paragon, etc...)
Fighter: Not certain what this could be.
Paladin: Channel Divinity... or something else
Warlord: Inspiring word?
Wizard: Not certain what they might get... perhaps their implement bonus?


----------



## melkoriii

I have a Question

Looking at the Multi-Class rules and class powers.

Are there Cleric Powers that can be used with a Ranged weapon (bow, Crossbow, Sling, ect..)?

I want to Make a Cleric\Ranger or a Ranger\Cleric that is the healer for a party (character conversion)  but looking at the rules I have seen this combo is useless since none of the cleric weapon powers can be used with a ranged weapon and going Cleric\ranger gives you HQ once an Encounter sucks.

Going Ranger\Cleric gives Healing Word once a DAY! also sucks for multi-classing


----------



## Caliber

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Excellent! I'll assume the Warlock's curse does the same... now here's another associated question: Do any of the non-striker classes have class features, which increase by level or tier? If so, what are they?
> 
> Cleric: Do channel divinity or healing word scale (okay this already scales, but does the 1d6 increase to 2d6 at paragon, etc...)
> Fighter: Not certain what this could be.
> Paladin: Channel Divinity... or something else
> Warlord: Inspiring word?
> Wizard: Not certain what they might get... perhaps their implement bonus?




All At-Wills scale somewhat (generally improving to 2[W] at Epic). Cleric and Warlord Healing Word abilities scale as well. As for Fighter/Paladin/Wizard, I can't think of anything off hand. Maybe someone with the books handy can check.


----------



## Caliber

melkoriii said:
			
		

> I have a Question
> 
> Looking at the Multi-Class rules and class powers.
> 
> Are there Cleric Powers that can be used with a Ranged weapon (bow, Crossbow, Sling, ect..)?
> 
> I want to Make a Cleric\Ranger or a Ranger\Cleric that is the healer for a party (character conversion)  but looking at the rules I have seen this combo is useless since none of the cleric weapon powers can be used with a ranged weapon and going Cleric\ranger gives you HQ once an Encounter sucks.
> 
> Going Ranger\Cleric gives Healing Word once a DAY! also sucks for multi-classing




Clerics don't get any ranged weapon powers, but they have plenty of ranged attack spells. I'm not sure specifically what you'd like out of the build, but I'd advise that, as RAW stands, you have to start as a Ranger to take any of the Ranger PPs.

Edit: Looking at your post, I notice you say you want the character to primarily be a healer, in which case I'd advise definitely starting as Cleric. I'm not sure you'd be able to get enough healing out of the Cleric multiclass feat to really function as a group's primary healer (although you'd likely be a heck of a backup)


----------



## Luinnar

Is metamagic still in?


----------



## jaldaen

Caliber said:
			
		

> All At-Wills scale somewhat (generally improving to 2[W] at Epic). Cleric and Warlord Healing Word abilities scale as well. As for Fighter/Paladin/Wizard, I can't think of anything off hand. Maybe someone with the books handy can check.




Thanks... though I'm mainly concerned with scaling class features. I'm thinking the Healing/Inspiring Word for clerics/warlords might scale enough with level not to need an extra increase, but seeing all the strikers get an increasing class featuer makes me wonder about the other classes


----------



## Caliber

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Thanks... though I'm mainly concerned with scaling class features. I'm thinking the Healing/Inspiring Word for clerics/warlords might scale enough with level not to need an extra increase, but seeing all the strikers get an increasing class featuer makes me wonder about the other classes




Perhaps I'm misreading your post, but just to clarify:

Cleric's Healing Word and Warlord's Inspiring Word DO scale with level. I think they go to +2d6 healing at 6th, and follow some progression or other. 

As for the other classes, no idea. I'm at work (boring!) and can't check.


----------



## Caliber

Luinnar said:
			
		

> Is metamagic still in?




Not in any recognizable form. There are feats that allow you to alter your magic in ways that may have been metamagic in 3E, but they're always on and cost nothing (except for the feat slot to pick them, I suppose)

Note that none of these feats give bonuses anywhere near what 3E's metamagic offers. Most are like +1 to this or that, or maybe shape out some squares from AEs or the like.


----------



## jedrious

Luinnar said:
			
		

> Is metamagic still in?



the closest to metamagic you'll find are feats and class features that work better with powers with certain keywords


----------



## melkoriii

Caliber said:
			
		

> Clerics don't get any ranged weapon powers, but they have plenty of ranged attack spells. I'm not sure specifically what you'd like out of the build, but I'd advise that, as RAW stands, you have to start as a Ranger to take any of the Ranger PPs.
> 
> Edit: Looking at your post, I notice you say you want the character to primarily be a healer, in which case I'd advise definitely starting as Cleric. I'm not sure you'd be able to get enough healing out of the Cleric multiclass feat to really function as a group's primary healer (although you'd likely be a heck of a backup)




Thanks Caliber

Would you say that at any point (lvl) that multi-classing is anything like multi-classing?

As it stands your post reinforces my thoughts that 4ed Multi-classing is not multi-classing and just dabbling with a feat....

very disappointed and feeling misslead by wotc.

Hate having to get groups to house rule crap like this.


----------



## jedrious

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Thanks... though I'm mainly concerned with scaling class features. I'm thinking the Healing/Inspiring Word for clerics/warlords might scale enough with level not to need an extra increase, but seeing all the strikers get an increasing class featuer makes me wonder about the other classes



Wizard has no scaling class features, Warlord Inspiring Word adds an additional d6 every 5 levels, Warlock curse increases every tier, Rogue sneak attack increases every tier, Ranger hunter's quarry increase every tier, Paladin divine challenge damage gains 3 damage per tier, Fighters have noscaling features, Cleric turn undead and healing word increase every 5 levels.
In addition all at-will attack powers scale up at 21st level


----------



## jaldaen

Caliber said:
			
		

> Cleric's Healing Word and Warlord's Inspiring Word DO scale with level. I think they go to +2d6 healing at 6th, and follow some progression or other.




That's actually exactly what I was wondering... the only difference seems to be that the extra healing for leaders goes up a bit faster than the striker's increased damage.



> As for the other classes, no idea. I'm at work (boring!) and can't check.




Thanks for the clarification above...


----------



## jedrious

melkoriii said:
			
		

> Thanks Caliber
> 
> Would you say that at any point (lvl) that multi-classing is anything like multi-classing?
> 
> As it stands your post reinforces my thoughts that 4ed Multi-classing is not multi-classing and just dabbling with a feat....
> 
> very disappointed and feeling misslead by wotc.
> 
> Hate having to get groups to house rule crap like this.



Paragon Multiclassing makes for a good side-by-side multiclass


----------



## melkoriii

jedrious said:
			
		

> Paragon Multiclassing makes for a good side-by-side multiclass




Really?

I was hoping for basically swapping one at-will or Encounter or daily power for my multi-classed powers (at-will for at-will ect..)

Also why are all Cleric Weapon powers melee?!

how did that make it past play testing?


----------



## Spenser

jedrious said:
			
		

> Note that Paragon Multiclassing does allow you to swap an at-will for your new class
> 
> 
> 
> Mouseferatu said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeedy. But that's not a 1st-level thing.
Click to expand...


Man, this thread moves fast!  Thanks for clearing that up, guys.


----------



## Caliber

melkoriii said:
			
		

> Thanks Caliber
> 
> Would you say that at any point (lvl) that multi-classing is anything like multi-classing?
> 
> As it stands your post reinforces my thoughts that 4ed Multi-classing is not multi-classing and just dabbling with a feat....
> 
> very disappointed and feeling misslead by wotc.
> 
> Hate having to get groups to house rule crap like this.




I know the multiclass rules get a lot of dislike piled on them, but to be honest I like them a lot. What you have to keep in mind though, is that taking a multiclass feat isn't going to let you perform as a full member of that class. That being the case though, I think you could make some pretty strong builds using the new multiclassing rules. 

After the first multiclass feat there are three more you can take that let you exchange an Encounter/Utility/Daily power from your base class with one from your multiclass. The thing to keep in mind though, is that these powers are of your character level, so you don't have to worry about being stuck with just CLW because you only have one level in Cleric, or anything like that. 

You may only have a handful of abilities from your multiclass, but you're actually quite competent within those abilities. Or at least, that's what my initial reading gave me.


----------



## Caliber

melkoriii said:
			
		

> Really?
> 
> I was hoping for basically swapping one at-will or Encounter or daily power for my multi-classed powers (at-will for at-will ect..)
> 
> Also why are all Cleric Weapon powers melee?!
> 
> how did that make it past play testing?




I don't really think Clerics have that much history as ranged weapon users in the first place. On my brief skim through the books, only the Rogue and Ranger had ranged weapon powers. Other classes had melee weapon powers and ranged spell attacks. Of course, as splats come out, I wouldn't be surprised to see ranged Clerics (and all other sorts of wackiness) but the PHB is HUGE. If everything people wanted was in here we'd have a 600 page book that cost $70. 

... Of course, I know people who wouldn't blink at buying said book, but that's perhaps another matter ...  

Edit: As an addendum, I wanted to say that there ARE feats that let you swap Encounter/Utility/Daily powers from your base class to your multiclass, if you weren't aware of that. A Ranger multi'd into Cleric could take the Utility swap feat and gain a daily use of CLW (and CSW, and eventually Mass CLW at higher levels) or whichever other power they wanted to swap out.


----------



## jaldaen

Another question: What are the weapon proficiencies of the wizard? All simple melee and ranged? Or a specific subset of these?


----------



## Saurdaux

AkaKageWarrior said:
			
		

> thanks!
> 
> Take a look at the warlord's level 29 powers, ain't it cinematic, ain't it BEAUTIFUL?
> 
> look for:
> http://www.rpg-shop.com/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=201598&postcount=475
> 
> Defy Death Warlord Attack 29
> warlord leaps to ally’s side and spare him from the jaws of death,
> which means move twice speed (no OAs!), attack for 7[W], enemy's attack misses,
> AND ally can spend healing surge... wow!




Cue the slow-motion "NoOOOOoooOOOOOO!!!" sequence.

Has anyone seen any info on domains at all, whether used in the traditional cleric sense, or just as a descriptor to gods?


----------



## AkaKageWarrior

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Another question: What are the weapon proficiencies of the wizard?




dagger & quarterstaff (info from one of the guys over at WotC forum)


----------



## Caliber

Mordralis said:
			
		

> Cue the slow-motion "NoOOOOoooOOOOOO!!!" sequence.
> 
> Has anyone seen any info on domains at all, whether used in the traditional cleric sense, or just as a descriptor to gods?





Hehe. Nice scene.

Re: domains, no sign of anything like it. However, each god had a feat that gives a worshipper a different use for their Channel Divinity ability. The KotS Cleric has the one for Bahamut, for example.


----------



## Chibbot

I might have missed this somewhere along the line, but I was wondering how the Warlord's _Inspiring Word_ power works. Is it identical to the Cleric's _Healing Word_, as predicted, or does it behave somewhat differently?

Thanks.


----------



## Rechan

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Another question: What are the weapon proficiencies of the wizard? All simple melee and ranged? Or a specific subset of these?



Dagger, Quarterstaff.


----------



## melkoriii

Oh one last thing (lol)

Do Multi-classed caster characters get access to rituals?


----------



## Caliber

melkoriii said:
			
		

> Oh one last thing (lol)
> 
> Do Multi-classed caster characters get access to rituals?




Re: Warlord's Inspiring Word, it is exactly the same as Healing Word, as far as I remember. 

For rituals, you have to take a feat to be able to use them (the feat requires training in Arcana or Religion, so multiclassing into Cleric/Wizard helps out). Wizards start with a few Rituals known (and presumably Clerics do too but I don't recall). Anyone with the feat can use them though, so if you want a Ritual using Fighter, saddle up, 'cause you just got him!


----------



## Saurdaux

Caliber said:
			
		

> Hehe. Nice scene.
> 
> Re: domains, no sign of anything like it. However, each god had a feat that gives a worshipper a different use for their Channel Divinity ability. The KotS Cleric has the one for Bahamut, for example.




I noticed some of that in an earlier post, too. It looks cool and frees domains up for me to use as my houseruled alternate alignment system. Win-win!


----------



## jedrious

Chibbot said:
			
		

> I might have missed this somewhere along the line, but I was wondering how the Warlord's _Inspiring Word_ power works. Is it identical to the Cleric's _Healing Word_, as predicted, or does it behave somewhat differently?
> 
> Thanks.



They be identical in all but name and flavor text


----------



## jedrious

Caliber said:
			
		

> Re: Warlord's Inspiring Word, it is exactly the same as Healing Word, as far as I remember.
> 
> For rituals, you have to take a feat to be able to use them (the feat requires training in Arcana or Religion, so multiclassing into Cleric/Wizard helps out). Wizards start with a few Rituals known (and presumably Clerics do too but I don't recall). Anyone with the feat can use them though, so if you want a Ritual using Fighter, saddle up, 'cause you just got him!



Clerics get Gentle Repose and the 1st level ritual of their choice added to their ritual book at 1st level, Wizards are the masters of ritual though:


> Rituals: Your book contains three 1st-level rituals of your choice that you have mastered.
> At 5th level, and again at 11th, 15th, 21st, and 25th level, you master two more rituals of your choice and add them to your spellbook. Any ritual you add must be your level or lower.


----------



## Voss

Caliber said:
			
		

> Hehe. Nice scene.
> 
> Re: domains, no sign of anything like it. However, each god had a feat that gives a worshipper a different use for their Channel Divinity ability. The KotS Cleric has the one for Bahamut, for example.




These make me cranky.  This is setting specific info thats taking up space in a book, and a lot of feat space.  Out of all the things that have been mentioned, these make me the least happy, because there just aren't a lot of options for a setting other than the nebulous default one:  toss out, cherry-pick mechanics, or try to come up with something similar.


----------



## Rechan

Okay. I skimmed the last few pages, but looks like everyone got their questions answered. I AM AVAILABLE FOR ANSWERIN'. Anyone got anything?


----------



## Caliber

Voss said:
			
		

> These make me cranky.  This is setting specific info thats taking up space in a book, and a lot of feat space.  Out of all the things that have been mentioned, these make me the least happy, because there just aren't a lot of options for a setting other than the nebulous default one:  toss out, cherry-pick mechanics, or try to come up with something similar.




Eh. They aren't THAT setting specific. I mean, sure your world doesn't have Bahamut. But if you have some kind of LG defender of the weak type god, giving their followers the ability to take Bahamuts Channel Divinity feat (changing the name to Armor of WhatsHisFace) seems like cake to me. 

To be fair though, I don't get riled by fluff so YMMV.


----------



## Caliber

jedrious said:
			
		

> Clerics get Gentle Repose and the 1st level ritual of their choice added to their ritual book at 1st level, Wizards are the masters of ritual though:




Cool! Thanks for clarifying that for me (I'd likely have forgotten to check by the time I make it home from work today!)


----------



## Westwind

Could I get a sense of the powers a bow ranger has access to in the heroic tier?  Also, is there a way for a non-rogue character to use his Dex bonus instead of his Str bonus as the +hit attribute in melee (via using a certain weapon, feat, whatever)?


----------



## Caliber

Here's a question from a guy sitting at work without his books to those sitting somewhere with them. How dare you make me so jealous of you? 

Ok ok, real question. Is there Weapon Finesse still? Or is this built into certain weapons? Or is this simply built into certain class powers? A friend asked me at lunch and I couldn't answer ... 

Thanks!


----------



## oukan

Weird Question: Obviously the Bard is slated for the next PH, but do any of the current skills allow you to perform, as in for money, like in 3.5?

What kind of pacts can high level Fey-pact Warlocks look forward to? Are they geared more towards the controller or striker role?


----------



## jedrious

Westwind said:
			
		

> Could I get a sense of the powers a bow ranger has access to in the heroic tier?  Also, is there a way for a non-rogue character to use his Dex bonus instead of his Str bonus as the +hit attribute in melee (via using a certain weapon, feat, whatever)?



here's a midheroic level ranger ranged power



> Excruciating Shot                        Ranger Attack 5
> One well-placed arrow leaves your enemy hunched over and howling in pain.
> Daily ✦ Martial, Weapon
> Standard Action         Ranged weapon
> Target: One creature
> Attack: Dexterity vs. AC
> Hit: 3[W] + Dexterity modifier damage, and the target is weakened (save ends).
> Miss: Half damage, and the target is not weakened.





and for using dex for attacks, I posted this one earlier



> Armor-Piercing Thrust        Fighter Attack 3
> You drive your weapon through a weak point in your foe’s defenses.
> Encounter ✦ Martial,Weapon
> Standard Action     Melee weapon
> Target: One creature
> Attack: Strength vs. Reflex
> Weapon: If you’re wielding a light blade or a spear, you gain a bonus to the attack roll equal to your Dexterity modifier.
> Hit: 1[W] + Strength modifier damage.
> Weapon: If you’re wielding a light blade or a spear, you gain a bonus to the damage roll equal to your Dexterity modifier.



 the fighter has quite a few powers that do things like this differing based upon weapon choice, haven't checked for other classes using dex for melee, will look and post again


----------



## Classic Villany

I've got some questions that are kind of related to Golems.

1. What Golems are in the MM?

2. What kind of Immunities, Resistances and Vulnerabilities do they have?

3. Are there rules for different metals like Mithral and Adamantine?

4. Are Rusting Grasp or Transmute Rock to Mud still in the rules?


----------



## Rechan

Westwind said:
			
		

> Could I get a sense of the powers a bow ranger has access to in the heroic tier?



Excruciating Shot (Daily, 5). 3[W]+Dex damage, target is weakened (save ends). Miss: Half damage, no weakening. 
Hawk's Talon 7: Gain a bonus on this attack equal to your wisdom bonus. Ignore cover and concealment penalties. 2[W]+Dex damage. 
Spikes of the Manticore 7: Two targets. 2[w]+Dex first target, 1[W]+Dex second target. 



> Also, is there a way for a non-rogue character to use his Dex bonus instead of his Str bonus as the +hit attribute in melee (via using a certain weapon, feat, whatever)?



Looking, I don't see any feats. 

Ack, I must go. Food calls.


----------



## rhm001

Does the half-elf racial description say whether they are supposed to include half human/half eladrin characters, or does it only mention elves?


----------



## RigaMortus2

oukan said:
			
		

> Weird Question: Obviously the Bard is slated for the next PH, but do any of the current skills allow you to perform, as in for money, like in 3.5?




Hmm, this brings up another question I just thought of...

With the 8 power sources now known, which one would most likely fit the Bard?


----------



## Mengu

Here is a request, if someone wants to take the time.

I would love to see an Elf Cleric of Corellon (to replace the half-elf cleric from KotSF), done in a similar style, with level up powers for 2nd and 3rd levels.


----------



## Caliber

RigaMortus2 said:
			
		

> Hmm, this brings up another question I just thought of...
> 
> With the 8 power sources now known, which one would most likely fit the Bard?




Arcane, I'd say. In fact, I think the designers have referred to the Bard as an Arcane Leader.


----------



## Horus_sungod

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Another question: What are the weapon proficiencies of the wizard? All simple melee and ranged? Or a specific subset of these?




dagger and quarterstaff. Only that.


----------



## VBMEW-01

Here's a fun one...

What is the coolest thing (in your opinion) that you have seen so far that was previously unknown?


----------



## The_Universe

I bet this has been posted much earlier in this thread, but I'm dying to know: 

Are there rules for rolling stats in the traditional way in addition to point-buy?


----------



## AkaKageWarrior

The_Universe said:
			
		

> I bet this has been posted much earlier in this thread, but I'm dying to know:
> 
> Are there rules for rolling stats in the traditional way in addition to point-buy?




it has.

4d6 drop lowest.


----------



## DerekSTheRed

I'd be interested in knowing how dragons are displayed in the MM.  Are they created/built like in 3.x MM or are they stat'd out explicitly?  Are there rules to build custom dragons?

Derek


----------



## jedrious

DerekSTheRed said:
			
		

> I'd be interested in knowing how dragons are displayed in the MM.  Are they created/built like in 3.x MM or are they stat'd out explicitly?  Are there rules to build custom dragons?
> 
> Derek



explicitly statted, only the customization rules for monsters nothing specific


----------



## jedrious

ok ppl, time for my spycraft game be back in a few hours


----------



## baberg

rhm001 said:
			
		

> Does the half-elf racial description say whether they are supposed to include half human/half eladrin characters, or does it only mention elves?



Nope.  The "Dual Heritage" bonus that Half-Elves get specifically says you can take any feats that have Human or Elf as prerequisites, not Eladrin.


----------



## jaldaen

Could anyone give some examples (i.e. short descriptions) of Wizard utility 2 and attack 3 spells besides the ones from D&DXP and Shadowfell? Thanks


----------



## Gerry

*chapters.indigo.ca shipped me my DMG*

waaa!  Who wants to start reading a series with book #2???? Bleah, onto the shelf until either my PHB arrives, or I'm done Red Hand of Doom. 

Okay, I lied a little. Flipped thru DMG. THe first third is advice. Who knew? a GUIDE on how to DM!!  Wow!  Not a reference book!  They must have had some geek from IBM explain the difference between a GUIDE and a REFERENCE book. The first walks you thru how to do things, when and why. The latter tells you things in a manner you can look up. Chapter page artwork looks great too btw!

Example. Grade 1 Reader vs Grade 1 Picture Dictionary. 

No school I know of teaches children how to read by handing out dictionaries.....

Gerry


----------



## Gerry

*Ooops Rules on Mounts is in the DMG*

sigh. Players ride horses, not the DM.  should been in the PHB. Rules that the players will want to look at time and time again, belogn in the PHB. Or is that just me? 

Gerry


----------



## Daniel D. Fox

VBMEW-01 said:
			
		

> Here's a fun one...
> 
> What is the coolest thing (in your opinion) that you have seen so far that was previously unknown?




I also like that you can learn as many Rituals as you'd like. Plus, Rituals on scroll format are now the "expendable" scrolls you can use during combat.


----------



## baberg

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Could anyone give some examples (i.e. short descriptions) of Wizard utility 2 and attack 3 spells besides the ones from D&DXP and Shadowfell? Thanks



Utility 2: Feather Fall (Daily),  Jump and Shield (Encounter).  They do pretty much what you expect them to do.

Attack 3: Color Spray (damage + dazed, close 5), Icy Rays (damage + immobilized, ranged 10), Shock Sphere (high damage, area 2 within 10)


----------



## Reef

Gerry said:
			
		

> waaa!  Who wants to start reading a series with book #2???? Bleah, onto the shelf until either my PHB arrives, or I'm done Red Hand of Doom.
> 
> Okay, I lied a little. Flipped thru DMG. THe first third is advice. Who knew? a GUIDE on how to DM!!  Wow!  Not a reference book!  They must have had some geek from IBM explain the difference between a GUIDE and a REFERENCE book. The first walks you thru how to do things, when and why. The latter tells you things in a manner you can look up. Chapter page artwork looks great too btw!
> 
> Example. Grade 1 Reader vs Grade 1 Picture Dictionary.
> 
> No school I know of teaches children how to read by handing out dictionaries.....
> 
> Gerry




Gah.  I'm glad I'm not the only one Indigo did that to.  Yes, I'm glad my DMG is in the mail...would have preferred my PHB at this point though...


----------



## Jcosby

*Rituals*

I don't know if this was answered yet or not, but I've seen a number of posts with this information left out.

Rituals are mostly 10 mins or longer making it very unlikely that they will be cast (done) in combat.  Also you can interupt a ritual by messing with the process.  (smearing the chalk, knocking down candles etc)  I think that would be very easy to do in the heat of combat, let alone a 10 minute combat.  Some rituals are many hours long.

Second point that people are missing from the posts i've read.  If you want to perform a ritual you need the feat to do it from a book.  You do not need the feat to perform the ritual from a scroll.  You will always need the proper componets though.  Also the "casting" time of a ritual is half the normal time when using a scroll.  As per usual the scroll goes poof when the ritual is complete.

One other tid bit, you can stop a ritual at anytime before it's complete and not loose anything.  

JBC


----------



## jaldaen

Thanks for the spells. here's a toughy for everyone:

Can you force move a target into a square occupied by one of its allies? 

If so, then what happens in the movement ends there? 

Does the enemy get a saving throw to end up prone in an adjacent square? 

Does he automatically fall prone in the square with his ally?

Does he just shift into an adjacent square without falling prone?

Something else? Thanks


----------



## Jcosby

*Bluff*



			
				DerekSTheRed said:
			
		

> I asked this yesterday but didn't see a response.  Can someone list the special actions in the combat chapters (i.e. bull rush, grab, trip, disarm etc.).  I specifically want to know if you can feint in combat like you could in 3E.
> 
> Thanks,
> Derek





Bluff'ing in combat is in.  You can get an opertunity attack with a successful bluff check.  Rogues with high CHA's are going to be very interesting.

JBC


----------



## Daniel D. Fox

Jcosby said:
			
		

> I don't know if this was answered yet or not, but I've seen a number of posts with this information left out.
> 
> Rituals are mostly 10 mins or longer making it very unlikely that they will be cast (done) in combat.  Also you can interupt a ritual by messing with the process.  (smearing the chalk, knocking down candles etc)  I think that would be very easy to do in the heat of combat, let alone a 10 minute combat.  Some rituals are many hours long.
> 
> Second point that people are missing from the posts i've read.  If you want to perform a ritual you need the feat to do it from a book.  You do not need the feat to perform the ritual from a scroll.  You will always need the proper componets though.  Also the "casting" time of a ritual is half the normal time when using a scroll.  As per usual the scroll goes poof when the ritual is complete.
> 
> One other tid bit, you can stop a ritual at anytime before it's complete and not loose anything.
> 
> JBC




Also, you must have the book as part of the casting of a Ritual. Meaning, when you cast Magic Circle (casting time 1 minute or round in combat), the book must be out and being read to use it properly.

Truth be told, I believe Magic Circle is the only Ritual I've seen that may be able to be used during combat (that doesn't have a long amount of time to cast). However, as noted above, a Magic Circle can be "foiled" by creatures who're not affected by the circle by simply smudging away the chalk/silver/whathaveyou as a standard action.


----------



## Daniel D. Fox

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Thanks for the spells. here's a toughy for everyone:
> 
> Can you force move a target into a square occupied by one of its allies?
> 
> If so, then what happens in the movement ends there?
> 
> Does the enemy get a saving throw to end up prone in an adjacent square?
> 
> Does he automatically fall prone in the square with his ally?
> 
> Does he just shift into an adjacent square without falling prone?
> 
> Something else? Thanks




Foes generally cannot be forced into an occupied square, UNLESS a Power dictates otherwise and will have the description of what happens. Although I haven't seen anything like this yet in my copy, the exception always trumps the general rule.

If you force a foe off a cliff or edge of something, however - they get an immediate saving throw to catch themselves from falling.


----------



## baberg

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Can you force move a target into a square occupied by one of its allies?



From the section on Forced Movement: "Forced movement can’t move a target into a space it couldn’t enter by walking."  I would rule that to mean that you can force-move a creature through a space his ally was occupying but he must end the move on an open space.


----------



## DerekSTheRed

Jcosby said:
			
		

> Bluff'ing in combat is in.  You can get an opertunity attack with a successful bluff check.  Rogues with high CHA's are going to be very interesting.
> 
> JBC




But not Combat Advantage as in 3.X?

Thanks,
Derek


----------



## cdrcjsn

Jcosby said:
			
		

> Bluff'ing in combat is in.  You can get an opertunity attack with a successful bluff check.  Rogues with high CHA's are going to be very interesting.
> 
> JBC




Combat Advantage doesn't mean Opportunity Attack


----------



## jaldaen

Is there an Ranger attack 1 encounter power that attacks two or more creatures? If so what damage and effect does it do? I'm guessing it does 1[W] + Dexterity (due to my current theory of power design). Thansk for your help.


----------



## CrimsonNeko

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Is there a ranger attack 1 power that attacks two or more creatures? If so what damage and effect does it do? I'm guessing it does 1[W] + Dexterity (due to my current theory of power design). Thansk for your help.




Yes, Twin Strike, it does 1W damage, At Will.  It's str or dex vs ac (depending on if your melee or ranged respectively), and you get 2 attacks vs one or two targets.


----------



## AkaKageWarrior

again, please, how many skills does each class get?


----------



## baberg

AkaKageWarrior said:
			
		

> again, please, how many skills does each class get?



Cleric: Religion, 3 more class skills
Fighter: 3
Paladin: Religion, 3 more
Ranger: Nature or Dungeoneering, 4 more
Rogue: Stealth and Theivery, 4 more
Warlock: 4
Warlord: 4
Wizard: Arcana, 3 more


----------



## GMforPowergamers

baberg said:
			
		

> Cleric: Religion, 3 more class skills
> Fighter: 3
> Paladin: Religion, 3 more
> Ranger: Nature or Dungeoneering, 4 more
> Rogue: Stealth and Theivery, 4 more
> Warlock: 4
> Warlord: 4
> Wizard: Arcana, 3 more




so does this mean if look close enough you can still see the rule "fighters don't get nice things."


----------



## baberg

GMforPowergamers said:
			
		

> so does this mean if look close enough you can still see the rule "fighters don't get nice things."



It's worse than you know.

Paladins get Plate Proficiency by default, Fighters don't.  They have to spend a Feat for it.  

Paladins get +1 to Fort, Reflex and Will; Fighters get +2 Fort.  

Paladins get one more healing surge.  Starting HP and HP per level are the same.  

Fighter is the only class that doesn't get some "class ability" that increases in power at Paragon and Epic tier.  Every other class gets something.


----------



## GMforPowergamers

baberg said:
			
		

> It's worse than you know.
> 
> Paladins get Plate Proficiency by default, Fighters don't.  They have to spend a Feat for it.
> 
> Paladins get +1 to Fort, Reflex and Will; Fighters get +2 Fort.
> 
> Paladins get one more healing surge.  Starting HP and HP per level are the same.
> 
> Fighter is the only class that doesn't get some "class ability" that increases in power at Paragon and Epic tier.  Every other class gets something.



OMG... I was jokeing......AAAAHHHHHHHHHH


----------



## Rechan

Classic Villany said:
			
		

> I've got some questions that are kind of related to Golems.
> 
> 1. What Golems are in the MM?
> 
> 2. What kind of Immunities, Resistances and Vulnerabilities do they have?



Flesh Golem: No immunities, however, they have +2 to saving throws.
Stone Golem: Immune to Poison, Disease, Sleep. Also has +2 saving throws.



> 3. Are there rules for different metals like Mithral and Adamantine?



If there are, I haven't seen them.



> 4. Are Rusting Grasp or Transmute Rock to Mud still in the rules?



No. Bet you a dollar that would be part of the Primal or Elemental schtick.


----------



## Rechan

oukan said:
			
		

> What kind of pacts can high level Fey-pact Warlocks look forward to? Are they geared more towards the controller or striker role?



There are a FEW spells that are bursts, but I'd say 95% are "Make one guy very unhappy". 

As for high level fey pacts...

Throns of Venom, 23 Encounter, 3d8+cha poison damage, target is immobilized, takes 1+Int penalty to AC and Reflex until end of your next turn.

Curse of the Twin Princes, 25 Daily. 4d10+Cha psychic damage. Any time you take damage, roll another attack; if you hit, you and your original target split the damage. Until the end of the encounter, if you're adjacent to your original target, you look exactly alike, and anyone attacking either of you has 50% of hitting the other.


----------



## the Jester

Monster Manual questions!! 

Are tabaxi in it? What about the dharculus (my FAVORITE dnd monster!)?


----------



## Rechan

the Jester said:
			
		

> Are tabaxi in it? What about the dharculus (my FAVORITE dnd monster!)?



No, and... the dharculus might be in under some other name; what IS it?


----------



## Boarstorm

Rechan said:
			
		

> No, and... the dharculus might be in under some other name; what IS it?




This... apparently.

http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/planar_gallery/82535.jpg


----------



## baberg

Boarstorm said:
			
		

> This... apparently.
> 
> http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/planar_gallery/82535.jpg



I think I recognize that from a few episodes of the show "Drawn Together", but I don't see Clara anywhere in that picture.


----------



## daddystabz

I put an order through Buy.com last night at around 10pm eastern and it changed in status last night to "sent to warehouse" but it has been saying that all day today too and has not been sent to shipping yet. I even ordered 2 business day express shipping. I am worried and wondering if maybe they caught the mistake and are holding new orders now till the release date. Their site also says that they do not charge your card until the item ships but my card has already been charged in full.


----------



## jaldaen

CrimsonNeko said:
			
		

> Yes, Twin Strike, it does 1W damage, At Will.  It's str or dex vs ac (depending on if your melee or ranged respectively), and you get 2 attacks vs one or two targets.




Oops... sorry my bad... I meant is there an attack 1 encounter power that attacks two or more creatures.


----------



## CrimsonNeko

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Oops... sorry my bad... I meant is there an attack 1 encounter power that attacks two or more creatures.




Quite alright.  Yes, there is basically a whirlwind style attack where you attack everyone adjacent to you as an encounter power.  Str vs. AC, 1W+str mod damage.

Edit: There is also a daily to make 2 attacks that do 2W+mod damage.  There is a seperate daily for melee and ranged.  The ranged is 2 rolls, but you take the better of the two for both targets.  The melee does 1W than 2W, but you get to shift in between the attacks and the 2nd target is weakened.


----------



## the Jester

Boarstorm said:
			
		

> This... apparently.
> 
> http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/planar_gallery/82535.jpg





Crappiest art for a dharculus ever. Wish I had a scanner...

A dharculus is a long, cigar-shaped monster, with one end twisted around to face backwards. That end of it is basically a huge maw; the other end is a swarm of long tentacles with eyes or mouths on the end. 

The dharculus swims around in the border ethereal, inserting its tentacles into the Material Plane. Then, when it finds prey, it tries to bite it and get a hold on it. If it succeeds, it draws the victim onto the ethereal plane and eats him.

IIRC 3e did a very poor job of capturing the feel of the dharculus. It is straight out of _the Gates of Firestorm Peak._


----------



## SSquirrel

TwoSix said:
			
		

> Hmm, confirmation of ki as a power source, and that's the first time I've seen elemental listed as being a separate power source.  Very interesting indeed.  Let the grid speculation begin!




OK there's about 13 pages or so so far, so here's my thought.  Elemental power source allows the Elemental Clerics in Dark Sun


----------



## Rechan

the Jester said:
			
		

> A dharculus is a long, cigar-shaped monster, with one end twisted around to face backwards. That end of it is basically a huge maw; the other end is a swarm of long tentacles with eyes or mouths on the end.
> 
> The dharculus swims around in the border ethereal, inserting its tentacles into the Material Plane. Then, when it finds prey, it tries to bite it and get a hold on it. If it succeeds, it draws the victim onto the ethereal plane and eats him.



Holy crap that's scary. Not in the MM, no.

Though in 4e I'd say that it swims through the Far Realms, and can slip its tentacles through any crack between the Far Realms and the Real world. I'd treat any mirror as a window.


----------



## Rechan

Something that hasn't been brought up.

The TWF build for rangers all specify that you can use two MELEE weapons [w]+S, or two RANGED weapons [W]+Dex. 

So yes, you can be using two thrown weapons with all the TWF powers. I'm not sure how you'd pull that off with the Close Burst powers (If you make an attack with a ranged weapon adjacent to an enemy, doesn't int draw an OA?).


----------



## Stogoe

Wouldn't the *Close* descriptor negate OAs?


----------



## Rechan

Stogoe said:
			
		

> Wouldn't the *Close* descriptor negate OAs?



Hmmm. I hadn't considered that.


----------



## Rokes

No Iron Golems! *sigh*


----------



## Classic Villany

I think this was probably answered earlier but...

Are there still rules for Riding and Mounted Combat?

And if so, what Classes is it available too?

Normally I wouldn't think much of it, but having played a Hellbred Paladin, I'm curious as to how easy it would be to translate into 4E.


----------



## jaldaen

Anyone have some short descriptions of daily attack 1 Ranger and Wizard powers? Thanks


----------



## Cadfan

baberg said:
			
		

> Fighter is the only class that doesn't get some "class ability" that increases in power at Paragon and Epic tier.  Every other class gets something.



Just to interject, the Fighter gets an attack bonus.  Attack bonuses automatically scale.  Damage has to increase or else what was useful at level 1 becomes irrelevant at level 30, but attack bonuses are forever.


----------



## the Jester

More Monster Manual questions...

Please report on the presence (or absence) of the following: the flumph, slaadi, deepspawn, spawn of Kyuss.

And PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE tell me that there is NO. FRICKING. TOJANIDA. in the 4e MM!


----------



## AkaKageWarrior

baberg said:
			
		

> Cleric: Religion, 3 more class skills
> Fighter: 3
> Paladin: Religion, 3 more
> Ranger: Nature or Dungeoneering, 4 more
> Rogue: Stealth and Theivery, 4 more
> Warlock: 4
> Warlord: 4
> Wizard: Arcana, 3 more




thanks! 

poor fighter!


----------



## Classic Villany

the Jester said:
			
		

> More Monster Manual questions...
> 
> Please report on the presence (or absence) of the following: the flumph, slaadi, deepspawn, spawn of Kyuss.
> 
> And PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE tell me that there is NO. FRICKING. TOJANIDA. in the 4e MM!




Going off the list of Monsters in the 4E MM that was posted earlier, Slaadi are the only creatures you listed that ARE in the MM.

Speaking of which, could someone provide some details on the Slaad in 4E?


----------



## Rechan

Classic Villany said:
			
		

> I think this was probably answered earlier but...
> 
> Are there still rules for Riding and Mounted Combat?



Yes. Mounted Combat is a feat. It lets you access the abilities that a mount can grant its rider. But you have to be a level that the mount can give it.

Lemme give you an example.

Warhorse: When ridden by a 3rd level rider, the warhorse grants +5 damage on charge attacks. 
Hippogriff: When ridden by a 5th level rider, it grants the rider +1 to all defenses.


----------



## hbarsquared

Here's my request...

SKILL CHALLENGES!

 Are they, and can they be, as open-ended as some players have said, or how Mearls described in his blog?  Does the system allow for everything between _"the players must succeed at these two skill checks"_ to _"players can offer the use of any skill, which the DM adjudicates,"_ or something in between?

Not really looking for specifics, of course, but what range does the skill challenge system allow for?

Thanks!


----------



## Rechan

> Anyone have some short descriptions of daily attack 1 Ranger and Wizard powers? Thanks



Wizard:
Acid Arrow, Sleep (we know those).
Flaming Sphere. Int vs Reflex: 2d6+Int fire damage when you attack. Sustain minor: it stays, you move it with a move action. You can make it attack with a standard action. Alternatively you can just move it adjacent to anyone, and they take 1d4+Int fire damage.
Freezing Cloud: You create a freezing cloud in an area burst 2 that lasts untilt he end of your turn. Does 1d8+int damage. Int vs Fort. Any creature that starts its turn int he cloud or enters the cloud gets attacked again. Miss half damage.

Ranger:
Hunter's Bear Trap: 2(W)+S or 2(W)+D, target is slowed and takes 5 ongoing (save ends both). 
Jaws of the Wolf: Just two attacks, both are 2(W)+Str, and both do half damage if you miss. 
Split the tree.
Sudden Strike: Make an attack with your off hand 1(W). You shift 1 square, make a secondary with your main weapon, 2(W)+S, target is weakened until the end of your next turn.


----------



## VBMEW-01

Are there any utilities/rituals that duplicate the old Obscuring mist spell?  If so, what does it do?

Thank you


----------



## chaotix42

Classic Villany said:
			
		

> Speaking of which, could someone provide some details on the Slaad in 4E?




There is a Slaad Tadpole, a lvl 5 Lurker. Slaad implant things with embryos which hatch into Tadpoles that burrow out their host's skulls, maturing into a random Slaad in several days. 

Most adult slaad can inflict anyone they hit with chaos phage, a disease that inflicts madness in bloodied victims, causing them to attack the nearest creature be it friend or foe. Eventually the disease nurtures the growth of a slaad tadpole which bursts out and kills the victim. 

Also, most Slaad have a teleport speed  of anywhere from 2 to 6.

Gray Slaad (Rift Slaad) are lvl 13 Skirmishers that, when hit with a negative condition, can in turn inflict the condition on another nearby target instead! They can also shift enemies away from them while damaging them at the same time, and teleport and become insubstantial when bloodied. 

Red Slaad (Blood Slaad) are lvl 15 Soldiers. They have a Leaping Pounce that allows them to shift several squares and makes two claw attacks, marking the target. It can also croak, immobilizing everyone within a close burst. 

Blue Slaad (Talon Slaad) are lvl 17 Brutes that can fling their enemies, sliding them away and knocking them prone. Also, once bloodied they rake everything in reach while gaining temporary HP. Thankfully they can only do this 1/encounter!

The Green Slaad (Curse Slaad) is a lvl 18 Controller. It can launch a Chaos Bolt at-will that does 1d20 + 4 dmg (how's that for Chaos?), can Transpose a target to deal damage and teleport them somewhere nearby, and can use a Croak of Chaos which damages everyone nearby and slides them away. 

The last one is the Black Slaad (Void Slaad). The art is re-used from the 3.0 ELH, but I do love that pic. The good old boy is a lvl 20 Skirmisher, and MUCH weaker than its ELH counterpart. It doesn't inflict Chaos Phage with its claws, but it does cause ongoing damage (save ends) - and there's a catch! If the save vs. ongoing damage fails the target loses a healing surge! The Void Slaad can use a Ray of Entropy at-will that deals damage and surrounds the target in a crackling field - any time the target is damaged they take an extra 1d10 from the shroud (save ends). Once the Slaad is killed it explodes into a Zone of Oblivion that deals damage to anyone inside while blocking line of sight. The Zone lasts until the end of the encounter!


----------



## Incenjucar

Rechan said:
			
		

> Yes. Mounted Combat is a feat. It lets you access the abilities that a mount can grant its rider. But you have to be a level that the mount can give it.
> 
> Lemme give you an example.
> 
> Warhorse: When ridden by a 3rd level rider, the warhorse grants +5 damage on charge attacks.
> Hippogriff: When ridden by a 5th level rider, it grants the rider +1 to all defenses.




Oh hell yes. <3


----------



## jaldaen

Thanks for the power descriptions


----------



## Rechan

VBMEW-01 said:
			
		

> Are there any utilities/rituals that duplicate the old Obscuring mist spell?  If so, what does it do?



Wizard Utility 6, Daily. Wall of Fog. You create a wall of fog 8 squares long and up to 4 squares high (Not sure what that means; I haven't seen anything about 3D squares). Ends on your next turn, sustain minor. Everyone inside has concealment, wall blocks line of sight.


----------



## VBMEW-01

thanks, you're awesome


----------



## Westwind

Bump!

To keep this from being a mindless bump, I'll ask if anyone can fill me in on Ranger utility powers.


----------



## Knightlord

I know that we now have the Dragonborn to sate our draconic needs, but is there any information in the MM on playing a Half-Dragon?


----------



## jaldaen

How many different Channel Divinity class features do Clerics and Paladins have? More than what we've seen or just the one's we know about. Thanks


----------



## jaldaen

Here's another question: Is there a repeating crossbow in the superior weapons section? If so how does it work?


----------



## melkoriii

Could some one comment on how Paragon lvl Multi-Classing differs from Heroic lvl?  Then Destiny lvl as well?

Someone said at Paragon it was more of a one for one kind of power swap.  Is this true?

Im a multi-classer and so far very disappointed in 4ed so called multi-classing


----------



## Gort

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Here's another question: Is there a repeating crossbow in the superior weapons section? If so how does it work?



Nope, the only superior ranged weapon is the shuriken.



> I know that we now have the Dragonborn to sate our draconic needs, but is there any information in the MM on playing a Half-Dragon?



Nope, there's no half-anything in the MM. Unless you count the Cambion.



> Could some one comment on how Paragon lvl Multi-Classing differs from Heroic lvl? Then Destiny lvl as well?



Until you get to Paragon level, multi-classing is feat-based and is based on swapping out powers, as we saw in the excerpt.

At Paragon level, you trade one of your at-wills for an at-will ability from another class. Then you gain powers from that class instead of gaining Paragon path powers.



> To keep this from being a mindless bump, I'll ask if anyone can fill me in on Ranger utility powers.



I wasn't massively impressed to be honest. They have about a hundred flavours of "you can run away/move around without drawing attacks of opportunity" and "if one of your friends is using a skill you have trained but they don't, they get a bonus equal to your wisdom modifier" stuff.

The rogue has way better utilities, in my opinion.


----------



## jaldaen

How does Aid Another work in 4e? Is there Aiming?


----------



## Gort

jaldaen said:
			
		

> How does Aid Another work in 4e? Is there Aiming?



Aid Another hasn't changed, and there is no Aim action.


----------



## Chibbot

A somewhat large request, but if someone could be so kind...

What are the races of monsters (goblin, kobold, etc) that have creatures in the 1-3 level range? And, if you're feeling exceptionally generous, how do they break down by level?

Thanks a ton!


----------



## RandomCitizenX

Aid Another can be used in combat or with a skill

In combat you pick an adjacent enemy, and make an attack against AC 10. If you hit you don't deal any damage, but can pick an ally to give +2 on an attack against that enemy.

Skill and Ability checks are similar, beat a DC 10 to give an ally +2 on their next roll

In both instances the bonus only lasts until the end of the ally's next turn


----------



## Green Knight

Rechan said:
			
		

> Wizard Utility 6, Daily. Wall of Fog. You create a wall of fog 8 squares long and up to 4 squares high (Not sure what that means; I haven't seen anything about 3D squares). Ends on your next turn, sustain minor. Everyone inside has concealment, wall blocks line of sight.




Heh. Suddenly I feel a great need to get my hands on 1" x 1" blocks for use when those kinds of spells are cast.


----------



## Classic Villany

Could someone provide a descreption of the Abilities/Powers for the Balor and Marilith?

And could someone please list all of the Giants and Titans in the MM (excluding the Hill Giants and Earth Titan)?


----------



## Ethalias

Chibbot said:
			
		

> A somewhat large request, but if someone could be so kind...
> 
> What are the races of monsters (goblin, kobold, etc) that have creatures in the 1-3 level range? And, if you're feeling exceptionally generous, how do they break down by level?
> 
> Thanks a ton!




Seconded.


----------



## Voss

Gort said:
			
		

> Nope, there's no half-anything in the MM. Unless you count the Cambion.




*Voss does the Dance of Someone Pleased with the lack of implied bestiality*

Merlin can stay.


----------



## Chibbot

Voss said:
			
		

> *Voss does the Dance of Someone Pleased with the lack of implied bestiality*




I agree. Implied bestiality is the worst.

Thats why my setting with have explicit bestiality! Yay!


----------



## Mengu

Chibbot said:
			
		

> A somewhat large request, but if someone could be so kind...
> 
> What are the races of monsters (goblin, kobold, etc) that have creatures in the 1-3 level range? And, if you're feeling exceptionally generous, how do they break down by level?
> 
> Thanks a ton!




I'll third it.


----------



## Westwind

Looking at the feat list from page 14, I noticed that the old "+2 save" feats aren't listed, but I've seen playtest characters with Iron Will listed as a feat.  Are they available at the paragon tier?  If so, do they do something in addition to a flat +2 defense bonus?


----------



## jaldaen

What other power levels gain benefits from the Artful Dodger/Brutal Scoundrel builds, or are those builds only beneficial for the attack 1 encounter powers?


----------



## jaldaen

What are the Wizard's encounter attack power 1 spells? What do they do (in short)?


----------



## Dyrvom

If a power or feature or what-have-you refers to allies, can/does its effect also apply to the user of said power/feature?


----------



## jedrious

Chibbot said:
			
		

> A somewhat large request, but if someone could be so kind...
> 
> What are the races of monsters (goblin, kobold, etc) that have creatures in the 1-3 level range? And, if you're feeling exceptionally generous, how do they break down by level?
> 
> Thanks a ton!



Granted



		Code:
	

Halfling Slinger                      Level 1 Artillery
Kobold Slinger                        Level 1 Artillery
Dire Rat                              Level 1 Brute
Fire Beetle                           Level 1 Brute
Riding Horse                          Level 1 Brute
Goblin Blackblade                     Level 1 Lurker
Stirge                                Level 1 Lurker
Decrepit Skeleton                     Level 1 Minion
Giant Rat                             Level 1 Minion
Goblin Cutter                         Level 1 Minion
Kobold Minion                         Level 1 Minion
Goblin Warrior                        Level 1 Skirmisher
Kobold Skirmisher                     Level 1 Skirmisher
Spiretop Drake                        Level 1 Skirmisher
Stormclaw Scorpion                    Level 1 Soldier
Elf Archer                            Level 2 Artillery
Goblin Sharpshooter                   Level 2 Artillery
Guard Drake                           Level 2 Brute
Kruthik Young                         Level 2 Brute
Zombie                                Level 2 Brute
Clay Scout (Homunculus)               Level 2 Lurker
Gnome Skulk                           Level 2 Lurker
Halfling Stout                        Level 2 Minion
Human Rabble                          Level 2 Minion
Kruthik Hatchling                     Level 2 Minion
Elf Scout                             Level 2 Skirmisher
Gray Wolf                             Level 2 Skirmisher
Halfling Thief                        Level 2 Skirmisher
Human Bandit                          Level 2 Skirmisher
Hyena                                 Level 2 Skirmisher
Rat Swarm                             Level 2 Skirmisher
Kobold Dragonshield                   Level 2 Soldier
Needlefang Drake Swarm                Level 2 Soldier
Hobgoblin Archer (Goblin)             Level 3 Artillery
Kobold Wyrmpriest                     Level 3 Artillery (L)
Spitting Drake                        Level 3 Artillery
Goblin Skullcleaver                   Level 3 Brute
Gravehound (Zombie)                   Level 3 Brute
Ochre Jelly (Ooze)                    Level 3 Elite Brute
Warhorse                              Level 3 Brute
Young White Dragon                    Level 3 Solo Brute
Gnome Arcanist                        Level 3 Controller (L)
Goblin Hexer                          Level 3 Controller (L)
Hobgoblin Warcaster (Goblin)          Level 3 Controller (L)
Imp (Devil)                           Level 3 Lurker
Pseudodragon (Drake)                  Level 3 Lurker
Shadowhunter Bat                      Level 3 Lurker
Hobgoblin Grunt (Goblin)              Level 3 Minion
Zombie Rotter                         Level 3 Minion
Doppelganger Sneak                    Level 3 Skirmisher
Orc Raider                            Level 3 Skirmisher
Wererat (Lycanthrope)                 Level 3 Skirmisher
Hobgoblin Soldier (Goblin)            Level 3 Soldier
Human Guard                           Level 3 Soldier
Iron Defender (Homunculus)            Level 3 Soldier
Skeleton                              Level 3 Soldier


----------



## jedrious

Westwind said:
			
		

> Looking at the feat list from page 14, I noticed that the old "+2 save" feats aren't listed, but I've seen playtest characters with Iron Will listed as a feat.  Are they available at the paragon tier?  If so, do they do something in addition to a flat +2 defense bonus?



Paragon Tier, +2 to the specified defense no other benefit


----------



## jaldaen

Is there such a thing as hardness for objects? If so, how is it presented? Just resist all #? Something else?


----------



## Lab_Monkey

*Skills*

Could someone please provide the a list of the skills that can be selected as trained for each of the classes? Thanks in advance.

For example, we know the following:

*Ranger *(choose Nature or Dungeoneering plus 4 more):
Acrobatics (Dex), Athletics (Str), Dungeoneering (Wis), Endurance (Con), Heal (Wis), Nature (Wis), Perception (Wis), Stealth (Dex)

*Rogue *(Stealth and Thievery plus 4 more):
Acrobatics (Dex), Athletics (Str), Bluff (Cha), Dungeoneering (Wis), Insight (Wis), Intimidate (Cha), Perception (Wis), Stealth (Dex), Streetwise (Cha), Thievery (Dex)

*Warlord *(choose 4):
Athletics (Str), Diplomacy (Cha), Endurance (Con), Heal (Wis), History (Int), Intimidate (Cha)

So what are the lists for Cleric, Fighter, Paladin, Warlock, and Wizard?


----------



## VBMEW-01

does non-lethal or subdual damage still exist.


----------



## Daniel D. Fox

VBMEW-01 said:
			
		

> does non-lethal or subdual damage still exist.




No, not that I've seen in the DMG.


----------



## Stomphoof

Can I get some information about Epic Destinies?  Like how many, what they are called, and a brief description of each one based on the flavor of its powers?

I am really interested in this.


----------



## Chibbot

jedrious said:
			
		

> Granted




You're _*amazing*_.

<+karma>


----------



## Devlin Rainguard

*Languages*

Hey, how are languages structured in 4E? Are there any ways to get languages aside from taking the Linguist feat, and what are the languages available?


----------



## Rechan

jaldaen said:
			
		

> Is there such a thing as hardness for objects? If so, how is it presented? Just resist all #? Something else?



No, items just have HP.


----------



## Rechan

Classic Villany said:
			
		

> Could someone provide a descreption of the Abilities/Powers for the Balor and Marilith?



Balor: 27 elite brute. Aura 2 (3 when bloodied) enemies starting turn in aura take 10 fir damage (20 when Balor is bloodied). Balor has a lightning sword and a flame whip (which is very nasty); on a standard action, it can attack with both. Once per encounter it can re-roll a missed attack with +5. When it dies, he explodes. 

Marilith: 24 elite skirmisher. When you miss the marilith, she gets a free basic attack. As a standard, she can attack twice and then use the other scimitars to get a +4 to AC. Also has an ability that she makes six attacks, each time one hits, she shifts 1 square (I think there's a typo. This power just reads 'Standard; Recharge when first bloodied'; I can't tell if that means it's an encounter power or what.) 



> And could someone please list all of the Giants and Titans in the MM (excluding the Hill Giants and Earth Titan)?



Death Giant (22 Brute) Death Titan (25 Elite Brute) Fire Giant (18 Soldier) Firegiant Forgecaller (18 Artillery) Fire Titan (21 Elite Soldier) Storm Giant (24 Controller) Storm Titan (27 Elite Controller).

Sidenote: The art for the various giants (especially the Storm titan) is really cool.


----------



## jedrious

Chibbot said:
			
		

> You're _*amazing*_.
> 
> <+karma>



amazing yes, but I think I burnt out my space bar in that coded text


----------



## ShaggySpellsword

Is Counterspelling in?  Who can do it and how does it work?

Are there feats/powers/class features that make it sexier than the base counter-spelling ability?


----------



## Kesh

Random question I haven't seen yet: are there any rules at all for using firearms in 4e?


----------



## Rechan

Kesh said:
			
		

> Random question I haven't seen yet: are there any rules at all for using firearms in 4e?



No. Or, if there are, they are hidden really good in the DMG.



			
				ShaggySpellsword said:
			
		

> Is Counterspelling in?  Who can do it and how does it work?



No.


----------



## Stomphoof

No one saw my question about the Epic Destiny choices?    Last post on Page 31?


----------



## Zelgadas

Rechan said:
			
		

> Also has an ability that she makes six attacks, each time one hits, she shifts 1 square (I think there's a typo. This power just reads 'Standard; Recharge when first bloodied'; I can't tell if that means it's an encounter power or what.)




It looks like it's a recharge power, except instead of recharging when a die comes up the right face (as in, Recharge 5, 6), it recharges when she's first bloodied.  So she uses it once, gets bloodied, then uses it again; it's basically twice per encounter.


----------



## Lab_Monkey

Stomphoof said:
			
		

> Can I get some information about Epic Destinies?  Like how many, what they are called, and a brief description of each one based on the flavor of its powers?
> 
> I am really interested in this.



Search through the thread.  This has definitely been covered.  

Here's a quick summary:
Only 4 Epic Destinies in the PHB: Archmage, Deadly Trickster, Demigod, and Eternal Seeker (I think).  Archmage is basically wizard only.  Deadly Trickster requires you to have training in one of several roguish skills.


----------



## Rechan

Stomphoof said:
			
		

> Can I get some information about Epic Destinies?  Like how many, what they are called, and a brief description of each one based on the flavor of its powers?



That's been mentioned earlier. But okay.

Archmage - You become a badass wizard. They all ready posted that on the Epic Destiny preview.

Deadly Trickster: You're f-ing Loki. At 26th level, you get an ability that, as a daily minor action, you are restored to max HP, all your powers are recharged (encounter and daily), and all status effects are gone. At 30th level, once per day, you can tell the DM that a d20 roll he just made is a 1. No rerolls are possible. 

Demi-God: You become a, well, demi-god. At level 26 you get an ability that gives you regeneration for an encounter equal to your highest ability score. 

Eternity Seeker: You have too many destinies to be summed up, so you just sorta wander. At 26th level, you get the 22nd level utility power from any other class, and at 30th level, you get the 24th level epci destiny power from any other desitny.


----------



## Stomphoof

Lab_Monkey said:
			
		

> Search through the thread.  This has definitely been covered.
> 
> Here's a quick summary:
> Only 4 Epic Destinies in the PHB: Archmage, Deadly Trickster, Demigod, and Eternal Seeker (I think).  Archmage is basically wizard only.  Deadly Trickster requires you to have training in one of several roguish skills.




I read through the entire thing.  And thats about all the info I could find.

What about the Demigod or Eternal Seeker?  What do they do?

EDIT - Thanks Rechan.  

Wow thats not much for choice is it


----------



## Chibbot

About monster powers recharging on rolls:

How does that work, exactly? I think it has been previewed, but I can't remember where.

From what I've seen, it would appear that recharges are basically 6, 5-6, 4-6, etc. I vaguely remember talk about a power having a recharge of like 4,6 though, so that it doesn't recharge on a 5.

I think the idea behind this was roll once for a monster for all recharges, and it keeps them from being an all-or-nothing recharge (if you roll a 5, the 1,3 power doesn't recharge, but the 5,6 and 3,5 do), or something like that.

Is the 6, 5-6, 4-6 recharge how its done, or is the system such that one power has 6, one power has 5, one power has 3,4, one power... etc.

(sorry the question is a little convoluted...)


----------



## fil kearney

I am also VERY interested in skill challenges.. we've seen 4/2, 6/3, and 8/4... how high does the success vs fail rolls go?
what makes an easy vs moderate vs hard?
what kind of DC's do we need for the various difficulties at various levels? 

Thank you VERY much for this... I want to run some skill challenges for fun this week!


----------



## salsb

fil kearney said:
			
		

> I am also VERY interested in skill challenges.. we've seen 4/2, 6/3, and 8/4... how high does the success vs fail rolls go?
> what makes an easy vs moderate vs hard?
> what kind of DC's do we need for the various difficulties at various levels?
> 
> Thank you VERY much for this... I want to run some skill challenges for fun this week!



4/2 complexity 1
6/3 complexity 2
8/4 complexity 3
10/5 complexity 4
12/6 complexity 5

For completing a skill challenge, the party gets the lvls xp times the complexity (so complexity 5 is like a solo monster).

For DC's you are refered to a table, which goes like:

level              Easy      Moderate Hard
1-3                  15       20          25
4-6                   18      22          26
7-9                  20      24           28
and so on up to 30, 34 and 38 at 28th-30th

(Actually the table numbers are 5 less, but at the bottom it says to add 5 to the DC's for skill checks, so I added 5 already).

There are examples of several types of skill checks, and all are set at the party's level.


----------



## MindWanderer

Chibbot said:
			
		

> About monster powers recharging on rolls:
> 
> How does that work, exactly? I think it has been previewed, but I can't remember where.
> 
> From what I've seen, it would appear that recharges are basically 6, 5-6, 4-6, etc. I vaguely remember talk about a power having a recharge of like 4,6 though, so that it doesn't recharge on a 5.
> 
> I think the idea behind this was roll once for a monster for all recharges, and it keeps them from being an all-or-nothing recharge (if you roll a 5, the 1,3 power doesn't recharge, but the 5,6 and 3,5 do), or something like that.
> 
> Is the 6, 5-6, 4-6 recharge how its done, or is the system such that one power has 6, one power has 5, one power has 3,4, one power... etc.
> 
> (sorry the question is a little convoluted...)



I think that was the old way, but in the final rules you roll once per ability.


----------



## half-dragon dragon

I've followed the various threads giving snippets fairly closely, so apologies if this was answered before, but I haven't seen it mentioned before.

Anyway, I've seen on various character builds for fighters cleave and either reaving strike or tide of iron, but no mention of the fourth fighter at-will.

So, I was wondering, could any give the name of and what it does in general?


----------



## Rechan

half-dragon dragon said:
			
		

> I've followed the various threads giving snippets fairly closely, so apologies if this was answered before, but I haven't seen it mentioned before.
> 
> Anyway, I've seen on various character builds for fighters cleave and either reaving strike or tide of iron, but no mention of the fourth fighter at-will.



Sure Strike: Str +2 vs. AC. 1[W] damage.

Now, on the one hand, that's lame. On the other hand, Power Attack lets you take -2 to Hit for +2 to damage (+3 if you're using a two-handed weapon)*. So you could take Sure Strike (+2) and use Power Attack (-2) for a net of +0 for +2/+3 extra damage. But you're also losing your Str to damage, so I'm not sure. Hm. 

*Power attack raises by Tier, btw.


----------



## half-dragon dragon

Rechan said:
			
		

> Sure Strike: Str +2 vs. AC. 1[W] damage.




That's...umm...hrm, isn't pretty much identical to the Ranger's careful shot (melee instead of range of course)? I do agree that that seems like a less desirable ability than what I've seen/heard about the other powers. Although, from what I've heard attack bonuses are seemingly rare, but a +2 seems not quite worth when you're only dealing [1W] or [2W] w/o str. 

Oh well, I'll still have to see the whole of the game, maybe it will play out better than it looks on paper.

Also, thanks for the info!


----------



## Spenser

Sure Strike and Careful Shot are not bad if you're up against opponents with very high defenses. Or if it's important to take out a particular minion, this turn.


----------



## Lab_Monkey

*Skills*

Any chance of seeing skill lists for the fighter, cleric, paladin, warlock, and/or wizard?


----------



## Rechan

Lab_Monkey said:
			
		

> Any chance of seeing skill lists for the fighter, cleric, paladin, warlock, and/or wizard?





Cleric: Religion, 3 more:
Arcana, Diplomacy, Heal, History, Insight, 

Fighter: 3
Athletics, Endurance, Heal, Intimidate, Streetwise.

Paladin: Religion. 3 more
Diplomacy, Endurance, Heal, History, Insight, Intimidate.

Wizard: Arcana, 3 more:
Diplomacy, Dungeoneering, History, Insight, Nature, Religion. 

Warlock: 4
Arcana, Bluff, History, Insight, Intimidation, Religion, Streetwise, Thievery.


----------



## Lab_Monkey

Thank you very much!


----------



## RigaMortus2

Prestidigitation is an at will spell for wizard that can be used to reproduce one of several effects:


Move up to 1 pound of material.
Create a harmless sensory effect, such as a shower of sparks, a puff of wind, faint music, or a strong odor.
Color, clean, or soil items in 1 cubic foot for up to 1 hour.
Instantly light (or snuff out) a candle, a torch, or a small campfire.
Chill, warm, or flavor up to 1 pound of nonliving material for up to 1 hour.
Make a small mark or symbol appear on a surface for up to 1 hour.
Produce out of nothingness a small item or image that exists until the end of your next turn.
Make a small, handheld item invisible until the end of your next turn.

Also, it says you can have as many as three prestidigitation effects active at one time.

This is probably old news, but Detect Magic is part of the Arcana skill.

There is a feat that turns sneak attack dice into d8s (instead of d6s).  What Rogue wouldn't take this?  And Combat Reflexes is horrible now...  (+1 on OAs, that's it?)


----------



## hbarsquared

Thanks for the Complexity mechanics of Skill Challenges....

But, how open-ended are skill challenges described?  What are the options for running a skill challenge?


----------



## RigaMortus2

Vorpal weapon is nasty.  Not the insta-kill it used to be, but might as well...

Lvl 30 magic weapon.  +6 enhan to hit and damage
Deals +1d12 per enhancement on a crit (so basically +6d12)
Whenever you roll the maximum result on any damage die for this weapon, roll that die again and add the additional result to the damage total. If a reroll results in another maximum damage result, roll it again and keep adding.
Also has a Daily Power that is a FREE Action...When you hit with the weapon, deal an extra 3d12 damage with the attack.


----------



## malcolm_n

Everybody says that multiclassing allows you access to your paragon path.  What of Epic Destinies?  It's a strange take, but could I be a FIGHTER/wizard/Battle mage/Archmage?  Simpler put, how do epic destinies handle requirements for entry?

If it doesn't let you get in from MC, doesn't that mean there is one for wizard, one for rogue, and 2 for everybody else to share (for now anyway)?


----------



## chaotix42

Archmage requires you to be a 21st level wizard, so no, you cannot enter the class if all you did was take the Arcane Initiate feat.

Deadly Trickster has a requirement of 21st level, Dex or Cha 21, and training in Acrobatics, Bluff, Stealth, or Thievery. These are rather easy to acquire since you can buy training in any skill with a feat and stat boosts are plentiful.


----------



## Zedcuk

RigaMortus2 said:
			
		

> And Combat Reflexes is horrible now...  (+1 on OAs, that's it?)




Probably because you can have as many OA's a round as you like but only 1 per combatant.  Combat reflexes has to change as multiple OA's are irrelevant from a Feat now


----------



## AkaKageWarrior

Rechan said:
			
		

> Warlock: 4
> ...
> Thievery.





Really? don't you mean stealth?

just guessing, though.


----------



## Fallen Seraph

Nope, it is Thievery, not Stealth.


----------



## Zedcuk

Stogoe said:
			
		

> Wouldn't the *Close* descriptor negate OAs?




Dont think anyone came back to this.  Looking at attack types Close doesnt have "provokes opportunity attacks" mentioned in the summary box, unlike Ranged and Area attacks so i think your right.  And checking "what provokes" in the OA section it only mentions ranges and Area attacks

makes those close blasts from the wizard actually really nice.


----------



## MindWanderer

chaotix42 said:
			
		

> Archmage requires you to be a 21st level wizard, so no, you cannot enter the class if all you did was take the Arcane Initiate feat.



Are you sure?  Arcane Initiate allows you to be considered a wizard for the purpose of qualifying for stuff, so if you're 21st level, and you're considered a wizard, doesn't that make you a 21st-level wizard?


----------



## pukunui

Tuft said:
			
		

> Acrobatics has a specific "Stunt" option that are not present in the other skills. That allows you to do something "tumble-ish" (think the example was something like "vaulting over an opponent") IF you manage to sweettalk you DM into it (read: I think the difficulty was set by the DM on a case-by-case basis, no fixed rule.)



 Sounds intriguing. Can't wait to read it for myself (I'm the DM but I'm playing a scoundrelish PC in a SWSE game right now and I quite like the whole "trained only" concept for skills in that game and I was hoping that they'd keep some sort of tumble in that anyone could use rather than limit it to a purely 1/encounter rogue power).


----------



## Xanaqui

RigaMortus2 said:
			
		

> Vorpal weapon is nasty.  Not the insta-kill it used to be, but might as well...
> 
> Lvl 30 magic weapon.  +6 enhan to hit and damage
> Deals +1d12 per enhancement on a crit (so basically +6d12)
> Whenever you roll the maximum result on any damage die for this weapon, roll that die again and add the additional result to the damage total. If a reroll results in another maximum damage result, roll it again and keep adding.
> Also has a Daily Power that is a FREE Action...When you hit with the weapon, deal an extra 3d12 damage with the attack.



Note that the continual re-roll on max result ends up being less than adding +1 to the mean of each roll. For example, doing this with a d6 gives a mean around 4.2 (instead of 3.5).


----------



## Kosj

Could someone please post the levels of the different dragons? I'm curious as to the level spread between them.


----------



## Rechan

Kosj said:
			
		

> Could someone please post the levels of the different dragons? I'm curious as to the level spread between them.




Young Black Dragon (4 Solo Lurker) Adult Black Dragon (11 Solo Lurker) Elder Black Dragon (18 Solo Lurker) Ancient Black Dragon (26 Solo Lurker)

Young Blue Dragon (6 Solo Artillery) Adult Blue Dragon (13 Solo Artillery) Elder Blue (20 Solo Artillery) Ancient Blue (28 Solo Artillery)

Young Green Dragon (5 Solo Skirmisher) Adult Green (12 Solo Controller) Elder Green (19 Solo Controller) Ancient Green (27 Solo Controller) Yes it goes from Skirmisher to Controller. 

Young Red Dragon (7 Solo Soldier) Adult Red (15 Solo Soldier) Elder (22 Solo Soldier) Ancient (30 Solo Soldier)

Young White (3 Solo Brute) Adult White (9 Solo Brute) Elder White (17 Solo Brute) Ancient White (24 Solo Brute).


----------



## RigaMortus2

Zedcuk said:
			
		

> Probably because you can have as many OA's a round as you like but only 1 per combatant.  Combat reflexes has to change as multiple OA's are irrelevant from a Feat now




I know, but just a +1 is not worth it for the feat IMHO.  If a feat grants a bonus that only occurs in certain situations and not all the time, I think it should be greater than +1.


----------



## jtrowell

RigaMortus2 said:
			
		

> I know, but just a +1 is not worth it for the feat IMHO.  If a feat grants a bonus that only occurs in certain situations and not all the time, I think it should be greater than +1.




Attack bonuses are fairly rare in 4th edition (weapon focus give a bonus to damage, not to hit, to a whole weapon type), and to some fighter builds, this +1 added to the combat superiotty bonus can make for some hard-to-doge AOs.


----------



## Kosj

Rechan said:
			
		

> Young Black Dragon (4 Solo Lurker) Adult Black Dragon (11 Solo Lurker) Elder Black Dragon (18 Solo Lurker) Ancient Black Dragon (26 Solo Lurker)
> 
> Young Blue Dragon (6 Solo Artillery) Adult Blue Dragon (13 Solo Artillery) Elder Blue (20 Solo Artillery) Ancient Blue (28 Solo Artillery)
> 
> Young Green Dragon (5 Solo Skirmisher) Adult Green (12 Solo Controller) Elder Green (19 Solo Controller) Ancient Green (27 Solo Controller) Yes it goes from Skirmisher to Controller.
> 
> Young Red Dragon (7 Solo Soldier) Adult Red (15 Solo Soldier) Elder (22 Solo Soldier) Ancient (30 Solo Soldier)
> 
> Young White (3 Solo Brute) Adult White (9 Solo Brute) Elder White (17 Solo Brute) Ancient White (24 Solo Brute).




Thanks alot.


----------



## Baka no Hentai

Forgive me if this has already been asked (I've been through this thread and several others on the board and havent noticed it) but can anyone explain exactly how the passive perception skills work?

For example say that I've got a group of PCs and a group of orcs blundering through the forest, unaware that they are bound to cross paths. How do I figure out which group sees the other first?  In this scenario neither group starts with a clue about the other, so they would not be attempting to move silently or actively spot the other group.


----------



## Devlin Rainguard

It looks like my earlier post got lost in the shuffle, so I'll ask again. What languages are listed and, aside from the Linguist feat, how do characters learn them? Thanks!


----------



## abyssaldeath

The DM would "roll" passive perception checks for both groups. (Roll is in quotes because a passive check is just taking ten on the roll.) If I were the DM I would rule it that which ever group has the highest check gets to notice the other first.


----------



## Bishmon

Devlin Rainguard said:
			
		

> It looks like my earlier post got lost in the shuffle, so I'll ask again. What languages are listed and, aside from the Linguist feat, how do characters learn them? Thanks!



Common
Deep Speech
Draconic
Dwarven
Elven
Giant
Goblin
Primordial
Supernal
Abyssal

The only ways I've seen to learn languages are through the Linguist feat or the half-elf's racial ability. There might be more, but they haven't jumped out at me.


----------



## Rechan

Damn, ninja'd!


----------



## RandomCitizenX

ninja'd as well


----------



## Devlin Rainguard

Bishmon said:
			
		

> Common
> Deep Speech
> Draconic
> Dwarven
> Elven
> Giant
> Goblin
> Primordial
> Supernal
> Abyssal
> 
> The only ways I've seen to learn languages are through the Linguist feat or the half-elf's racial ability. There might be more, but they haven't jumped out at me.




Cool, thanks! I'm a little disappointed that there's no way to take just one language you'd like. Still, at least there's enought there that I have no qualms taking Linguist for one of my first levels (might have to take it a second time as well).


----------



## Baka no Hentai

abyssaldeath said:
			
		

> The DM would "roll" passive perception checks for both groups. (Roll is in quotes because a passive check is just taking ten on the roll.) If I were the DM I would rule it that which ever group has the highest check gets to notice the other first.





That makes sense.  Follow-up question, is there simply one "Passive Perception" skill, or is there a Passive Spot and Passive Listen?

Additionally, does the DMG give any guidance as to around when these checks should take place?


----------



## chaotix42

MindWanderer said:
			
		

> Are you sure?  Arcane Initiate allows you to be considered a wizard for the purpose of qualifying for stuff, so if you're 21st level, and you're considered a wizard, doesn't that make you a 21st-level wizard?




The multiclass feats actually say that you count as a member of the class for meeting feat pre-reqs and Paragon paths. Nothing about Epic Destinies. 

Just my call - waiting to be proven wrong.


----------



## Kosj

To follow on from my question about the dragons, how about dracoliches? What different types are there, what level are they and what size?


----------



## Bishmon

Kosj said:
			
		

> To follow on from my question about the dragons, how about dracoliches? What different types are there, what level are they and what size?



Level 18 solo huge Dracolich
Level 23 solo gargantuan Blackfire Dracolich
Level 29 solo gargantuan Runescribed Dracolich


----------



## Bishmon

A few random thoughts:

-I really like most of the classes. Often times, they're not as much as I'd like them to be, but for what they are, they're really good.

-Feats are disappointing. We've pretty much seen all the racial feats at one point or another. There's a few new ones, but not much. And each race looks like it only has one racial paragon feat, and no racial epic feat. Epic feats in general are disappointing. There's not many of them, and half of them are just 'You can crit on a 19 or 20 with this weapon'.

-Artifacts are an absolute abomination that shall never be spoken of again.

-Magic items are good.

-It'll be interesting to see how mounted combat works in play.

-Epic destinies are a letdown considering there's only four of them, but paragon paths are great. It's easy to see that doing the extra multiclassing in place of taking a paragon path is suboptimal, though.

-All in all, my enthusiasm went from a 10 at the announcement to a 5 during the pre-release stuff and now back up to an 8 or so after spending some time with the books.


----------



## Kosj

Bishmon said:
			
		

> Level 18 solo huge Dracolich
> Level 23 solo gargantuan Blackfire Dracolich
> Level 29 solo gargantuan Runescribed Dracolich




Odd. The lowest level gargantuan Dracolich is a lower level than the lowest level gargantuan dragon (the Elder white, which is level 24...).


----------



## mneme

*Stacking?*

So we've seen hints that you can't stack bonuses from feats, but you can clearly stack them with other things (class abilities, weapon ability, stat bonuses, power results...).

So what -are- the stacking rules?  I'd think it would be "you can't stack the same thing on top of itself" and nothing more, given the paucity of bonuses, but is there more to it?  Is it "take the highest bonus of each type from your feats, plus all other bonuses"?  Or what?


----------



## RandomCitizenX

mneme said:
			
		

> So we've seen hints that you can't stack bonuses from feats, but you can clearly stack them with other things (class abilities, weapon ability, stat bonuses, power results...).
> 
> So what -are- the stacking rules?  I'd think it would be "you can't stack the same thing on top of itself" and nothing more, given the paucity of bonuses, but is there more to it?  Is it "take the highest bonus of each type from your feats, plus all other bonuses"?  Or what?




All the book says about stacking is that bonuses of the same type do not stack. Take the highest bonus of each type that you need and roll away.


----------



## MindWanderer

Xanaqui said:
			
		

> Note that the continual re-roll on max result ends up being less than adding +1 to the mean of each roll. For example, doing this with a d6 gives a mean around 4.2 (instead of 3.5).



True, but if you're using a vorpal falchion with a power that does 7[W], you're looking at an extra 9 damage or so--plus the sheer visceral factor of getting to roll more d4's than most players even own (I know I'd have to buy some more).


----------



## Derren

Sorry if that has been asked before.

1. How does elemental resistance work in 4E? Like in 3E?
2. How easy is it to obtain elemental resistance?
3. Are the Succubus tactics still the same then in the preview and if yes has she a way to enforce that the charmed character stays next to her?
4. A small summary what rituals can do if that is not too much work.
5. Do monsters have any out of combat abilities or at least a line which says if/which rituals they can use?
6. How different are the playable monster versions from the real monsters?
7. Are there any real tactics you can use instead of just moving enemies a few squares?
8. Can every character trip or disarm or is that a fighter power?
9. What are the general advices about skill challenges?
10. Any advice of how to integrate power use into skill challenges (for example what if instead of rolling a skill a character uses a power to achieve the result)?
11. Any world building advice about how to make sense with all the "gameist" rules other than "Ignore it" or "Don't think about it"?
12. Do Skill DCs for skill challenges scale with the party level? Is there any difference between a challenge at level 2 compared to level 20?
13. Any obviously broken things?
14. How many "If you are bloodied you can do superattack X feats/abilities are there and how good is the combo value of them?

If some (all) of that question have already been answered please link the post.
Thanks.


----------



## pukunui

Do the 4e skills have "trained only" uses like SWSE? I can't remember if this has been answered already or not. Sorry if it has.


----------



## Oompa

Derren said:
			
		

> Sorry if that has been asked before.
> 
> 1. How does elemental resistance work in 4E? Like in 3E?
> * From the PHB, lvl 10 wizard utility:
> Effect: Against a particular damage type chosen by you, the
> target gains resistance equal to your level + your Intelligence
> modifier until the end of the encounter or for 5
> minutes. Choose the damage type from the following list:
> acid, cold, fire, force, lightning, necrotic, poison, psychic,
> radiant, or thunder.
> *
> 
> 2. How easy is it to obtain elemental resistance?
> *An minor action to get effect from above*
> 
> 3. Are the Succubus tactics still the same then in the preview and if yes has she a way to enforce that the charmed character stays next to her?
> *The same and i couldnt find if the pc stayed, but i think he does.*
> 
> 4. A small summary what rituals can do if that is not too much work.
> *see the las excerpt*
> 
> 5. Do monsters have any out of combat abilities or at least a line which says if/which rituals they can use?
> *I can only find monsters that are summoned by rituals, not monsters that use them, there is an box about how to become an lich*
> 
> 6. How different are the playable monster versions from the real monsters?
> *?*
> 
> 7. Are there any real tactics you can use instead of just moving enemies a few squares?
> *Enemies have abilities that can shift, push, slide you or teammates, they have abilities that can do great damage or use some sort of magic*
> 
> 8. Can every character trip or disarm or is that a fighter power?
> *Rogue and Fighter, offcourse, multiclassing is always an option, couldnt find anything about disarm*
> 
> 9. What are the general advices about skill challenges?
> *?*
> 
> 10. Any advice of how to integrate power use into skill challenges (for example what if instead of rolling a skill a character uses a power to achieve the result)?
> *I think dm's discretion*
> 
> 11. Any world building advice about how to make sense with all the "gameist" rules other than "Ignore it" or "Don't think about it"?
> *?*
> 
> 12. Do Skill DCs for skill challenges scale with the party level? Is there any difference between a challenge at level 2 compared to level 20?
> *Don't know, but an level 2 trap shouldnt be any problem for an level 20 i think*
> 
> 13. Any obviously broken things?
> *not that i know*
> 
> 14. How many "If you are bloodied you can do superattack X feats/abilities are there and how good is the combo value of them?
> *don't know yet*
> 
> If some (all) of that question have already been answered please link the post.
> Thanks.




ok?


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## RigaMortus2

pukunui said:
			
		

> Do the 4e skills have "trained only" uses like SWSE? I can't remember if this has been answered already or not. Sorry if it has.




Not that I have seen.  Each class starts off with one or two free skills, then can usually pick 3 or 4 more of their choice.  After that, you can pick Skill Training and select any skill you want, and it doesn't have to be from your starting list either...


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## Derren

Oompa said:
			
		

> ok?




1. I rather wanted to know if the resistances work like in 3E (subtract the number from every attack) or like thresholds (subtract it if the damage is lower than the resistance, otherwise its full damage) or like the Star Wars shield rules, etc.

2. Is there any other ability to get elemental resistances, for example with magical items?

6. I assume that "?" means you didn't understand the question.
I wants to know how much the "PC Gnome" differs from the "monster gnome" (Same for all other MM monsters with PC rules)

7. And is there any way to exploit those shifts and pushes? Or are they just to create the illusion of tactical combat while they don't serve much of a purpose besides very basic ones?

9. Any advice in the DMG about how much the players should decide when a skill challenge starts? For example when the PCs want to break into a castle, how much planning should they do before the skill challenge starts?

10. I take that as no.

11. You know, any DMG advice on how to explain "You cure everything in 8 hours rest" and "Circles are squares" to the players who care about those things.

12. That was more aimed at those general "Lets replace planning/roleplaying" skill challenges instead of traps or other things in a combat encounter.


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## That One Guy

Baka no Hentai said:
			
		

> That makes sense.  Follow-up question, is there simply one "Passive Perception" skill, or is there a Passive Spot and Passive Listen?
> 
> Additionally, does the DMG give any guidance as to around when these checks should take place?



Perception is Search/Spot/Listen in one skill. Passive Perception = 10 + Perception. They oppose hidden things (like doors/traps/passages) and set a DC for stealthed characters. An active perception check can be made to specifically look for something 1D20 + Perception old school style.

I hope that helps.


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## AkaKageWarrior

Hi, 

thanks for the answer, so warlocks have the Thievery skill!

Amazing!

Does that include trapfinding, or is that part of the skill rogue only?

thanks,
AKW


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## pukunui

RigaMortus2 said:
			
		

> Not that I have seen.  Each class starts off with one or two free skills, then can usually pick 3 or 4 more of their choice.  After that, you can pick Skill Training and select any skill you want, and it doesn't have to be from your starting list either...



 Thanks, but that's not really the answer I was looking for. Star Wars breaks each skill into a bunch of different uses, some of which are "trained only", meaning that you have to have that skill as a known skill in order to attempt that use. Uses of a skill that don't have the "trained only" tag are things that anyone can attempt to do regardless of whether or not it's a known skill.

As an example, the Star Wars Acrobatics skill includes balancing, crossing difficult terrain, escaping from bonds, reducing falling damage, tumbling, and a few other things. Anyone can attempt to balance or escape their bonds with a successful Acrobatics check, but only characters who have Acrobatics as a known skill can attempt to Tumble or reduce falling damage.

Are the 4e skills like that at all?

What I'm getting at is: what do the 4e skills allow you to do?


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## Rechan

pukunui said:
			
		

> As an example, the Star Wars Acrobatics skill includes balancing, crossing difficult terrain, escaping from bonds, reducing falling damage, tumbling, and a few other things. Anyone can attempt to balance or escape their bonds with a successful Acrobatics check, but only characters who have Acrobatics as a known skill can attempt to Tumble or reduce falling damage.
> 
> Are the 4e skills like that at all?



Yes, that's how 4e skills work.

Also, Thievery = Trap defusement, no rogues need apply. 

What I'm getting at is: what do the 4e skills allow you to do?[/QUOTE]


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## baberg

pukunui said:
			
		

> What I'm getting at is: what do the 4e skills allow you to do?



<font=4e_hype.ttf>ANYTHING YOU WANT!</font>

Yes, there are "Trained Only" skills.  The only default "Trained Only" skills are Reduce Falling Damage (Acrobatics) and Detect Magic(Arcana).  There are notes on most of the other skills that limit them to DM discretion - Thievery in particular says that DMs will probably make some of those skills trained-only.


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## chaotix42

Derren said:
			
		

> 1. I rather wanted to know if the resistances work like in 3E (subtract the number from every attack) or like thresholds (subtract it if the damage is lower than the resistance, otherwise its full damage) or like the Star Wars shield rules, etc.




Any time you take damage from an attack that you resist, reduce the damage by the amount of your resistance. 



> 2. Is there any other ability to get elemental resistances, for example with magical items?




- Be a tiefling.

- Resistance is a Wizard Daily power that grants resist = level + Int mod to one creature for the encounter or for 5 minutes. You can choose to resist one damage type from pretty much every type there is. 

- Cloak of Resistance (Daily): Minor action, +1/+2 cloak gives resist 5 to all damage till start of next turn. +3/+4 gives resist 10, +5/+6 gives resist 15. 

- Cloak of Survival: has a Property (always active) that grants a bonus to Endurance and resist cold and fire 5. +4/+5 cloak grants resist 10, and +6 cloak grants resist 15. Much more expensive than the Cloak of Resistance. 

- Dragonslayer Weapon: also has a Property that grants resistance to dragon's breath weapon attacks (any color). The +2 version grants resist 5, the +3/+4 grants resist 10, and the +5/+6 version grants resist 15. Same cost as the Cloak of Survival, actually.

- Guardian Shield (Daily): Immediate interrupt, when adjacent ally is hit by an attack you are hit by it instead and gain resistance to all damage = 1/2 the damage the attack dealt, till the start of your next turn. The lvl 20 version can protect anyone within 5 squares, and the lvl 30 version anyone within 10 squares.

That's every way to get resistance in the PHB.

There are a lot of other ways to gain resistance too.

- A Berserker weapon has a Daily minor action power that, among other bonuses, grants resist all (amount based on level, like pretty much every item) till end of encounter or until you get KOed.
- Tombforged armor is chain that has a property that resists necrotic damage.
- Sunleaf armor can be cloth, leather, or hide, and resists radiant damage.
- Ghostphase armor is cloth only and at +3 and beyond grants a resist necrotic property. Also lets you turn insubstantial as a Daily minor action!
- Flamedrinker armor is plate only and has resist fire property. Can also as a Daily interrupt grant massive fire resistance to you and all allies in 5 squares till SONT - very sweet.
- The Ironskin Belt has a Daily that resists weapon damage until EONT. 
- The Stormwalker's Cloak has a property that resists up to 15 lightning and thunder. 
- An Amulet of Health resists poison. 
- Helm of Ghostly Defense has a property that resists necrotic damage. 
- The Shield of Warding has a Daily immediate interrupt that grants an ally 15 or 20 resistance based on the item's level.
- The Shield of Protection grants you + adj. ally resist a lot vs. all till EONT!
- Shield of Deflection has a resist vs. ranged attack damage property.
- The Dragondaunt Shield has a property that grants resist all vs. any dragon's attacks!

There are more...


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## pukunui

baberg said:
			
		

> <font=4e_hype.ttf>ANYTHING YOU WANT!</font>
> 
> Yes, there are "Trained Only" skills.  The only default "Trained Only" skills are Reduce Falling Damage (Acrobatics) and Detect Magic(Arcana).  There are notes on most of the other skills that limit them to DM discretion - Thievery in particular says that DMs will probably make some of those skills trained-only.



 Interesting. Thanks. I think I'll probably borrow heavily from SWSE.

I know some people are quite disappointed with the "incomplete" feel of the first 4e books, and while I share in that disappointment to a limited extent (not having seen the books for myself yet), I am also actually pleased that they actually encourage DMs to work some things out for ourselves and also provide us with fairly easy-to-use tools in order to customize the game to our and our groups' tastes. I felt that 3.5 was too clumsy and awkward to customize easily. That was one of the main things that started to make me sick of it, even before 4e was announced.


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## Baragos

Mourn said:
			
		

> And is simply disrespectful towards the team of people that developed it with the intention of it releasing on a particular date in a particular format. But then again, I'm not surprised, as John Gabriel's Greater Internet F-ckwad Theory usually holds true.




I agree that downloading illegal copies of the books is disrespectful to the "artists".

But I also kinda think it is disrespectful to release D&D 4th edition on June 6...


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## RigaMortus2

> Death Saving Throw: When you are dying, you need to make a saving throw at the end of your turn each round. The result of your saving throw determines how close you are to death.
> Lower than 10: You slip one step closer to death. If you get this result three times before you take a rest, you die.
> 10–19: No change.
> 20 or higher: Spend a healing surge. When you do so, you are considered to have 0 hit points, and then your healing surge restores hit points as normal. You are no longer dying, and you are conscious but still prone. *If you roll 20 or higher but have no healing surges left expressed as a negative number*, your condition doesn’t change.




Maybe I am tired of reading, but can someone explain what they mean with the text I bolded?


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## cdrcjsn

RigaMortus2 said:
			
		

> Maybe I am tired of reading, but can someone explain what they mean with the text I bolded?




It means that you've found errata most likely, a mistake with copy + paste.


----------



## Derren

So it looks that single element enemies like Devils and Dragons are very gimped when fighting agains PCs with those cloaks.
There was already a calculation that a 15 fire resist cuts the damage potential of a Pit Fiend in half.


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## RigaMortus2

Regarding magic rings...

I know there was talk about characters below level 10 not getting any use out of magic rings (as in, they would not function if you were lower than level 10).  However, I can't find anywhere (in the PHB anyway) that states this is the case.  I can't seem to find any level requirement for magic rings.

The lowest level magic ring however is a lvl 14 item.  So what I think they meant was, normally you are around level 10 before you would find such an item (since it states that you often get items whose levels are higher than your current level).  I don't see anything stopping a DM from dropping a magic ring into a level 5 campaign for example, or anything preventing a player of level 9 or lower from utilizing it...

If anyone found anything to the contrary, please reply...


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## RigaMortus2

cdrcjsn said:
			
		

> It means that you've found errata most likely, a mistake with copy + paste.




Yeah, appears that way.  Later it states if you have no healing surges, you go to 1 hp of health and become concious.  I wonder, if a Cleric heals you with their "add 1d6" to the amount you get healed (and you have no surges left), do get the 1hp plus the 1d6 or do you still just go to 1hp?


----------



## Aage

1. Is perception a fighter class skill?

2. What much benefit does a fighter have from Con/Wis?


----------



## hbarsquared

*Ahem*

Skill Challenges info?  Please?


----------



## The Little Raven

Aage said:
			
		

> 1. Is perception a fighter class skill?




No.



> 2. What much benefit does a fighter have from Con/Wis?




Certain powers, when paired with certain weapons, grant bonuses that are ability score dependent. For example, there's a power called Giant's Wake, which gives you a damage bonus equal to your Con modifier when using an axe.


----------



## chaotix42

Derren said:
			
		

> So it looks that single element enemies like Devils and Dragons are very gimped when fighting agains PCs with those cloaks.
> There was already a calculation that a 15 fire resist cuts the damage potential of a Pit Fiend in half.




Well if the DM hands out the best items for resisting the attacks his monsters use, who is to blame?

Also, feel free to give the Pit Fiend's mace attack a secondary attack vs. Fort. that negates any fire resistance till the end of the encounter. Increase it to level 27, buff it accordingly and call it a Pit Fiend Baron.


----------



## baberg

jeremy_dnd said:
			
		

> *Ahem*
> 
> Skill Challenges info?  Please?



Pretty much what we already know.  Complexity goes from 1-5, with the Success/Failure ratio being 4/2, 6/3, 8/4, etc.  There are 9 pages talking about them with 5 "example" SCs.


----------



## pukunui

Am I missing something or did they drop the whole Egyptian-style body/soul/animus thing for undead? I quite liked that idea when I read about it in the preview books. I guess it was too complicated mechanically or something.


----------



## tophu

*Linked Portal*

Could somebody tell me how linked portal functions? I have a wizard in an impenetrable tower that needs a backdoor, and I think that might be what I need.  Somebody with books please post the effect for the Linked Portal ritual.


----------



## baberg

tophu said:
			
		

> Could somebody tell me how linked portal functions? I have a wizard in an impenetrable tower that needs a backdoor, and I think that might be what I need.  Somebody with books please post the effect for the Linked Portal ritual.



That sounds about perfect.  The ritual links a circle you draw on the ground (temporary portal) to a permanent portal elsewhere on the same plane.  It also states that most major wizard guilds, large cities, and temples have permanent circles in place, so it would be reasonable to think a tower with no doors would have one on the inside.  Destination is chosen by the sigils you put on your temporary circle - match the permanent circle and that's where you go.

So the "backdoor" would be kept secret because only some people would know the proper sigils to draw on the ground.


----------



## tophu

*Fireball?*

Can wizards still cast a fireball?  What does it do?


----------



## chaosmoon

> Can wizards still cast a fireball? What does it do?




Yes Fireball is a Wizard attack 5 and it is a daily power  its area is burst 3 within 20 squards and its attack is Intel vs Reflex and does 3d6 + int mod damage.


----------

