# EoM Question: Summon Construct



## Bayonet_Chris (May 16, 2007)

I was deciding on a new spell list to get the other day and I came upon this one. I have a question concerning summoning creatures with no intelligence.



			
				Summon said:
			
		

> You have no special control over the summoned creature. Creatures with an Intelligence of 2 or less are always Indifferent when they appear. Creatures with an Intelligence of 3 or higher are generally Unfriendly upon their arrival, and if they feel threatened or displeased, may depart as a free action, returning whence it came. You can use the Obedient enhancement, below, to make the creature arrive with the attitude Helpful, and prevent it from leaving. If a creature is willing to stay, you can spend a few minutes speaking with it, making a Diplomacy check to earn its services, though usually at a price.




So, if the construct is indifferent, how do you command it? Must you purchase the obedient enhancement to have control, or can you use diplomacy on something unintelligent?


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## sirwmholder (May 16, 2007)

Ummm, not sure Diplomacy would work on an unintelligent being... closer to Handle Animal (1 or 2 Int)... though for 0 Int that might not even work...  Either way just summon it... let whoever you are fighting think it's under your command and when they hit it, the construct will defend itself.  Otherwise you'll need the obedient enhancement or a charm spell to make it friendly to you and angry towards your enemies... or a strong Compel to bend it to your will.

Hope this helps,
William Holder


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## Primitive Screwhead (May 17, 2007)

I would require the Obiedient enhancement... this models the Golem that obeys only its creator quite nicely. No diplomancy or Handle X works... 

Side note, my last EoM character was focused on Summon Construct... so this isn't just a DM point of view


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## Night Watchman (May 17, 2007)

I have a somewhat related question.  As far as constructs go, what enhancements would one need to actually animate one, or animate anything for that matter?  Would you simply use a summon enhancement to summon an animated version of the object effectively "animating" it, or would you use a Move enhancement?


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## Bayonet_Chris (May 17, 2007)

*Animating*

Well, that was pretty much what I was thinking; thanks for confirming it.

As for animating constructs, a Summon Construct or Transform Construct would work nicely. Check out the permanent creature rules (under permanent spells in the magic item section) for rules on that - it would be the best way for something intended to last.


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## sirwmholder (May 17, 2007)

*Animating*

Move (Force) could do this... 







			
				EoM:R - Move (Force) said:
			
		

> Move Force is used on its own, you can only move objects, and only in minor ways, with a base speed of 30 ft. You could cause a wagon to roll forward on its wheels, make a taxidermied bird fly around, or make a chair skitter across the floor.



Hope this helps,
William Holder


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## Primitive Screwhead (May 17, 2007)

Summon construct would be cheaper, altho transform construct would be the 'proper' way of doing it.

Move Force would provide a user-guided item, not a fully animated object


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## Bayonet_Chris (May 18, 2007)

*"Proper Way"*

I don't know that Transform is any more proper than Summon. Summon doesn't have to be from thin air and I think it is probably the best way, all in all.


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## sirwmholder (May 18, 2007)

Primitive Screwhead said:
			
		

> ...Move Force would provide a user-guided item, not a fully animated object



True... kind of like a stop motion Frankenstien with jerky arm movements... it just makes me happy 

Using Move (Force) on any creature I see as being like Ella Enchanted.  They don't want to do it but are forced to.


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## Bayonet_Chris (May 18, 2007)

*Move Force*

I don't know - that's a lot of fine control. I see it more as using something or someone as a battering ram/blunt object. I would force the same restrictions of Move Force - no damage, just grappling, tripping, etc.


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## sirwmholder (May 18, 2007)

Bayonet_Chris said:
			
		

> I don't know - that's a lot of fine control. I see it more as using something or someone as a battering ram/blunt object. I would force the same restrictions of Move Force - no damage, just grappling, tripping, etc.



If you can use Move (Force) to untie a knot I'm pretty sure you can put a creature into locomotion... 







			
				EOM:R - Move (Force) said:
			
		

> ...You can even use Move Force for simple manual tasks, such as untying knots, but delicate activites require Intelligence checks (DC 10 or higher). If you combine Move Force with another Move list, you can give objects movement capabilities which you control. If you use Move Air, Move Space, or Move Time in this way, you can control the movements of creatures as well as objects.  You can only control the creature or object while it’s within range. If the creature or object moves beyond the spell’s range, the spell does not end, but you cannot control it.



Using Compel the creature feels as though the act was their idea... Move (Force) + Move (Air) they would be fully aware of what they were doing regardless of how they felt about it... hence the Ella correlation.

William Holder

EDIT: Added EoM Quote.


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## Primitive Screwhead (May 19, 2007)

Bayonet_Chris said:
			
		

> I don't know that Transform is any more proper than Summon. Summon doesn't have to be from thin air and I think it is probably the best way, all in all.




'Proper' in that you are changing an object into an animated object, altho since Summon does not have to be from thin air, its really all semantics. Hence the quotes


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