# Why do drow have black skin?



## Mercurius (Nov 17, 2013)

Besides kewlness factor, that is. Has any book every explained this? I just don't get it. You're underground for thousands of years and your skin would likely lose pigment altogether and your eyes would turn darker, even without whites. Actually, that's how the "drow" look in my campaign world.

I do have a black-skinned variant of elves somewhat similar to the Ariane in Talislanta - mystics concerned with cosmic exploration who live in high mountain towers, contemplating the mysteries of the universe.


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## Morrus (Nov 17, 2013)

I guess it's magic!  I haven't heard of any explanations.  Though I've often seem them depicted with blue skin, too.


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## urLordy (Nov 17, 2013)

I guess someone had taken "dark elves" literally.


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## (Psi)SeveredHead (Nov 17, 2013)

And purple and brown...

German Unseelie appeared to have dark skin: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dökkálfar_and_Ljósálfar


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## HardcoreDandDGirl (Nov 17, 2013)

I don't know if it's cannon or not, but over the years I've been told by two different DMs who as far as I know did not know each other, Drow are subjected to some kind of magic radiation in the underdark. It is why so many things down there are purple and black and grey. It at the very least has been my head cannon since 3e came out.


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## Olgar Shiverstone (Nov 17, 2013)

Potential theories:

Camouflage. 
Allergic reaction to faezress radiation.
Ground-in dirt because they never take baths.
Cursed by the gods to look different than their brothers.
Unconscious game designer racism.
That's the natural color of all elves -- the ones who live above ground have a genetic defect.
That's the price of "kewl powerz".
Got tired of being called "Pinky".
"Once you go black, you never go back." -- Literally.
Tanning beds in every drow household.
Felt silly calling themselves "dark elves" with pale pink skin.


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## fjw70 (Nov 17, 2013)

I always thought that it was early D&D team's lack of science knowledge that assumed anything that lived below ground would have dark skin.


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## (Psi)SeveredHead (Nov 17, 2013)

I'm reacting way too seriously to Olgar's post, but drow bathe all the time. They're made of fanservice after all


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## SkidAce (Nov 17, 2013)

[MENTION=1165](Psi)SeveredHead[/MENTION] is the closest from what I recall.

Svart alfar and all that. Or was it dokalfar...


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## Tuft (Nov 17, 2013)

SkidAce said:


> [MENTION=1165](Psi)SeveredHead[/MENTION] is the closest from what I recall.
> 
> Svart alfar and all that. Or was it dokalfar...




Wikipedia has a bunch of stuff.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dökkálfar_and_Ljósálfar

Note that "dark elves" originally was synonymous with "dwarves"...


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## tuxgeo (Nov 17, 2013)

Short version of the myth (working from memory): Corellon's consort Araushnee (=Lolth) rebelled and lead her followers in civil war among the elves and against Corellon. (She wanted to be in charge.) She tricked their daughter, Eilistraee, into attacking Corellon with a bow and arrow, badly injuring him. Sehanine aided Corellon, and the rebels were defeated. 
Corellon cursed Lolth and her followers, turning their skin black and their hair white, and banishing them from the surface world for their treachery. He's a Greater God, so his curse remained permanently effective. (Source? I forget, now. I'll look for it.)


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## Kinak (Nov 17, 2013)

I tend to prefer albino elves myself, but traditional drow are black because that's how they've always been. The first mention of them I'm aware of (in the 1st Edition MM), refers to them as "black elves or drow."

The explination, of course, varies by campaign setting. It usually involves underdark radiation or some sort of curse.



SkidAce said:


> Svart alfar and all that.



Yeah, it's right in the name. "Black elves."

Cheers!
Kinak


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## Mercurius (Nov 17, 2013)

[Anal Retentive Moment]

Canon, not cannon. Cannons shoot things. 

[/Anal Retentive Moment]


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## Dannyalcatraz (Nov 17, 2013)

tuxgeo said:


> Short version of the myth (working from memory): Corellon's consort Araushnee (=Lolth) rebelled and lead her followers in civil war among the elves and against Corellon. (She wanted to be in charge.) She tricked their daughter, Eilistraee, into attacking Corellon with a bow and arrow, badly injuring him. Sehanine aided Corellon, and the rebels were defeated.
> Corellon cursed Lolth and her followers, turning their skin black and their hair white, and banishing them from the surface world for their treachery. He's a Greater God, so his curse remained permanently effective. (Source? I forget, now. I'll look for it.)




That sounds about right.


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## was (Nov 17, 2013)

If I remember the FR version, the black elves were just another variant called the Illithyri (close?).  You had elves with all sorts of skin colors: golden, pale white, coppery, dark brown and black etc..  The Illythiri were attracted to Lolth, and her children Vhaerun and Elistrae, because they were black skinned elven deities.  Eventually Lolth became their primary deity and used them to launch a war against all the other elven subraces.  
...So, in that creation mythology the drow were black skinned before they lost the war and were driven into the underdark.
...I believe that Corellon's curse changed her nature from divine to tanarii.  She eventually would reclaim her divinity.
...I think it's the FR novel _Evermeet_ that explains it.


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## tuxgeo (Nov 17, 2013)

was said:


> If I remember the FR version, the black elves were just another variant called the Illithyri (close?).  You had elves with all sorts of skin colors: golden, pale white, coppery, dark brown and black etc..  The Illythiri were attracted to Lolth, and her children Vhaerun and Elistrae, because they were black skinned elven deities.  Eventually Lolth became their primary deity and used them to launch a war against all the other elven subraces.
> ...So, in that creation mythology the drow were black skinned before they lost the war and were driven into the underdark.
> ...I believe that Corellon's curse changed her nature from divine to tanarii.  She eventually would reclaim her divinity.
> ...I think it's the FR novel _Evermeet_ that explains it.




Thanks for the clarification. 

Well, that's just _great_.* OK, I haven't read any of the novels, which fact could well explain my lack-of-being-up-to-date (as of 2E) about the nature of things in FR. . . .

* Italics for sarcasm.


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## Olgar Shiverstone (Nov 17, 2013)

tuxgeo said:


> Short version of the myth (working from memory): Corellon's consort Araushnee (=Lolth) rebelled and lead her followers in civil war among the elves and against Corellon. (She wanted to be in charge.) She tricked their daughter, Eilistraee, into attacking Corellon with a bow and arrow, badly injuring him. Sehanine aided Corellon, and the rebels were defeated.
> Corellon cursed Lolth and her followers, turning their skin black and their hair white, and banishing them from the surface world for their treachery. He's a Greater God, so his curse remained permanently effective. (Source? I forget, now. I'll look for it.)




That sounds like the FR canon I remember.

Drow predate FR, though -- anyone recall if the Greyhawk background story is similar?


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## DEFCON 1 (Nov 17, 2013)

I don't know how close the association of drow and spiders were to the origination of the drow in D&D... but if that background came in hand in hand with their creation in the game... that might've had something to do with it.  Lloth is Queen of the Spiders, the most famous spiders (tarantulas, black widows) are dark if not black.  So the association of black spiders to black-skinned elves might've gone hand in hand perhaps.


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## Mistwell (Nov 17, 2013)

In the days before the sun and moon, before even the trees of the Valar and the light captured by the Silmarilian stones, the dark elves fled beneath the ground to escape the wraith of Melkor.  And so, as their skin was never exposed to the light of the Valar, their skin remained dark, and they remained unchanged in appearance from the First of the Children, for all those centuries.


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## RangerWickett (Nov 17, 2013)

They live deep underground, but they haven't been there long enough to evolve out of having functional eyes. So there's still value in having dark skin, because it makes you less visible in circumstances when people have light sources.


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## Zardnaar (Nov 17, 2013)

Basically a curse or radiation burns.


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## WayneLigon (Nov 17, 2013)

Mercurius said:


> Besides kewlness factor, that is.




Coolness factor, more than likely. And the literal idea of svartalf = black elf. It helps to distinguish them from the normal depiction of very pale elves. I'm pretty sure that Gygax knew that cave creatures are usually pale and such, but also I can see him going 'the players are going to want bonuses for pale creatures in darkness, so I'll make their skin non-reflective black to provide more challenge and surprise them'. Also, black == evil.


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## Dannyalcatraz (Nov 17, 2013)

> Also, black == evil.




Hey!

(  )


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## Celebrim (Nov 17, 2013)

Mercurius said:


> Besides kewlness factor, that is.




1) It's a misunderstanding of Tolkien's Silmarillion, which has 'dark elves'.  These elves don't actually look different than other elves - they are dark of mind and soul, because of having no enlightenment.  
2) It's Germanic.  Unseelie creatures in Germanic myth are always dark of hue.
3) Black is the color of death in Western mythology.   It is symbolic of night, and hense also caves, sleep, and death - all appropriate for the Drow.



> Has any book every explained this? I just don't get it. You're underground for thousands of years and your skin would likely lose pigment altogether and your eyes would turn darker, even without whites. Actually, that's how the "drow" look in my campaign world.




Actually, mine too.   My Drow are pale white with black hair and eyes that very from pink to violet.   It's I think a more fitting appearance for troglodyte creatures.


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## Dannyalcatraz (Nov 17, 2013)

They drink a lot of coffee and prefer their chocolate with 72% cacao.  They also like licorice.

In addition, they consider themselves to be the pinnacle of "elfness", and that includes style.  And lets face it, black is always stylish...and slimming.


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## Cadence (Nov 17, 2013)

Picked up "Dungeons & Dragons and Philosophy" a month or so ago.  In the chapter titled "Elf Stereotypes" it discusses the subraces from Forgotten realms.  Some of it pops up if you enter:  philosophy of d&d racism in google books .  In particular pages 95-99 lay out the following in much more details...

wood [=copper] elves - coppery skin with brown or black hair living in harmony with their environment 

"In a way, that just makes sense: of course if you're going to have a fantasy race that longs to be one with nature, you are going to create a people that reminds you of the human race that most longs to be one with nature.  It isn't like there's a stereotypically Asian set of elves..."

sun [=gold] elves - high intelligence, hierarchical society, prestige of family names, martial arts 

moon [=silver] elves - the default, generally good traits 
dark elves - the good drow, brown skin not black 
drow - black skin, the bad ones, strong women, often die young due to violence, live separated from all the good elves

Regardless of its connection to how the subraces were actually designed... ouch.


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## Umbran (Nov 18, 2013)

Tuft said:


> Note that "dark elves" originally was synonymous with "dwarves"...




Yes, but Gygax wasn't known for being too worried about technical accuracy.  They're black because they are "dark" elves.



			
				Mercurius said:
			
		

> You're underground for thousands of years and your skin would likely lose pigment altogether and your eyes would turn darker, even without whites. Actually, that's how the "drow" look in my campaign world.




Well, using real earth biology... not quite.  Pigments take energy to create.  So, for critters who live in darkness, there's some small advantage for those critters who don't have them.  That tends to albinism - and that's pink irises, not dark.  There's no clear reason I can think of for your eyes be become dark.


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## Sunseeker (Nov 18, 2013)

Considering that elves who live in the sun always seem to be really pale, I just assumed that elves tanned in reverse.  That or demonic influence.


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## SkidAce (Nov 18, 2013)

shidaku said:


> Considering that elves who live in the sun always seem to be really pale, I just assumed that elves tanned in reverse.  That or demonic influence.




That actually makes sense...sorta.


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## Celebrim (Nov 18, 2013)

shidaku said:


> Considering that elves who live in the sun always seem to be really pale, I just assumed that elves tanned in reverse.  That or demonic influence.




If you really are insisting on a logical explanation, consider that in the Drow's current environment, pretty much everyone has eyes that work the way Aristotle thought eyes work.  Instead of eyes receiving ambient light reflecting off surfaces, creatures with Darkvision emit light from their eyes much like radar.   As such, there is an evolutionary reason to maintain pigmentation.  Perhaps the black skin evolved to partially thwart Darkvision.


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## Sunseeker (Nov 18, 2013)

Celebrim said:


> If you really are insisting on a logical explanation, consider that in the Drow's current environment, pretty much everyone has eyes that work the way Aristotle thought eyes work.  Instead of eyes receiving ambient light reflecting off surfaces, creatures with Darkvision emit light from their eyes much like radar.   As such, there is an evolutionary reason to maintain pigmentation.  Perhaps the black skin evolved to partially thwart Darkvision.




Psued-logic is okay.  But that might also work well with why Drow have disturbing red eyes.


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## Dannyalcatraz (Nov 18, 2013)

Celebrim said:


> Instead of eyes receiving ambient light reflecting off surfaces, creatures with Darkvision emit light from their eyes much like radar.   As such, there is an evolutionary reason to maintain pigmentation.  Perhaps the black skin evolved to partially thwart Darkvision.




...except that it doesn't thwart darkvision.

And if it _did_, it would make Drow sex lives...confusing, to say the least.


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## tuxgeo (Nov 18, 2013)

shidaku said:


> Considering that elves who live in the sun always seem to be really pale, I just assumed that elves tanned in reverse.  That or demonic influence.




That, or the elves who live in the sun live in the far northern/southern sun, where the sunbeams are striking the atmosphere at about a 30-degree angle--and mostly reflecting back into space. 

They need the minimum melanin in order to achieve the maximum solar absorption if they are to get any Vitamin D at all. (That doesn't apply to the underdark where the drow get to eat mushrooms that generate Vit. D for them.) (Yes, I just made that up.)


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## Celebrim (Nov 18, 2013)

Dannyalcatraz said:


> ...except that it doesn't thwart darkvision.




Well, it doesn't render them invisible, but maybe it thwarts darkvision in the same way that it could be said that camouflage thwarts vision.

Drow sex lives are already... unpleasant.


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## Dannyalcatraz (Nov 18, 2013)

I've got it!  _*FULL BODY TATTOOS!*_

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUzQvfRNJsE


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## trancejeremy (Nov 18, 2013)

I always thought it was because they were a negative image of elves.

You know, like when you take a picture, reverse the colors (like in a photograph negative or nowadays, a paint program) and skin turns an inky black-purple, and hair usually becomes white.

Obviously they aren't perfect negative images, they don't have black teeth. But it's something that always seemed to be the explanation. Something like that happens to a character in a Michael Moorcock novel (one of the Jerry Cornelius ones)


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## TerraDave (Nov 18, 2013)

The original D modules don't say too much. Basically they where bad elves. The good elves defeated them and drove them underground. Then they became bad-ass, and liked their new fairlyland, but still wanted revenge. So they will plot against the elves, but don't launch a full scale invasion, which they could win, as they are bad-ass.

I paraphrased a little. 

There is no mention off elf gods...and Lloth would actually be the first, as D3 was published in 78 and Dieties and Demigods in 80. (Gygax did not, ever, use the non-human deities in his campaign, though he OKed it for others. He did have Ehlonna, but she was not published until 82, and may not have featured much in his home game.)

Gygax does note that the drow are "handsome" "not unhandsome" and they do have an above average charisma. 

Whats interesting to ponder: where they always black? Based on some of the art in vault of the drow, maybe not.

You can see more here, this is one example:


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## jasper (Nov 18, 2013)

Not only did they lose the coin toss, they drew last from the color chair. gawd, "Sorry drow the only thing left is black skin and white hair."  And the other elves laughed at them.
Drow storm off to their basements to play intellvision swearing revenge!


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## Dungeoneer (Nov 18, 2013)

Ever since that Community episode, dark elves just make me think of Senor Chang.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0tsmjkKzT3w

"So we just gonna ignore that hate crime, huh?"


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