# NFL Playoffs and Superbowl



## Dimwhit (Jan 3, 2005)

So the playoffs are set. Any guesses? I'm bummed that the Bills fell short. They got the loss they needed from the Jets but came up short against Pittsburg. I was looking forward to them being in the playoffs. And as a Falcon fan, I guess I should be glad the Panthers are out (they were good), but it would have been fun seeing them there too.

Funny, but for all the talk mid-season, no 10-6 team in the AFC missed the playoffs. A 9-7 or two missed out, but that's not unusual. Of course, the NFC has two 8-8 teams in there.

I'm of course pulling for the Falcons, but I think Green Bay is very dangerous in the NFC. For the AFC...I'm clueless. San Diego seems to be on quite a tear, but Pitt and NE are the ones to beat. So I don't know...


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## Crothian (Jan 3, 2005)

It was a great day of games even with some teams sitting the starters.  

AFC
Denver at Colts
Jets At Chargers
Bye: New England and Pittsburgh

NFC
Vikings at Green Bay
Rams at Seatle
Bye: Atlanta and Phili

How often do all 4 wildcard games end up being rematches from the reguliar season?  That's very odd.  

Personally, I see all the home teams winning.  Rams I think having the best chance to pull the upset (not much of one since the beat them twice), but I gotta go with the Seahawks there.

Looking forward I see Colts beating the Patriots in an upset, and Green Bay getting revenge for the playoff lost a few years back against the Falcons.  In the Superbowl I see Steelers verse Green Bay (who give Phili another lose in the NFC Championship game), but my bias is with the Steelers.


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## Stone Angel (Jan 3, 2005)

Playoffs are looking to be great fun this year. While to ealry for me to make any real predictions I will say that A lot of people seem to be underestimating the Pats, in favor of the Steelers. They are still a rock solid team and have more successful experience in the playoffs than any other team. That said I think that the Colts we'll beat them if they meet them. I look to the Chargers to give Pittsburgh a great game but I imagine that the Steelers will pull it out. I have no clue about the NFC this year. 

Good luck to everyone this year.

The Seraph of Earth and Stone


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## Crothian (Jan 3, 2005)

If the Colts win, they go play the Patriots.  I agree this is a very hard year to predict and there are few teams that I think have no chance.


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## monkeyshines (Jan 3, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> I agree this is a very hard year to predict and there are few teams that I think have no chance.




Except the Vikings.


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## Crothian (Jan 3, 2005)

I said there are few teams, Vikings and Jets really being them.


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## Mystery Man (Jan 3, 2005)

While I'd love nothing more than to see Green Bay get into the Superbowl I don't think they're going to do it with their defense. I think the Steelers are going to get close but not make it. 
  Teams out early (depending on who they play) will be the Eagles, Colts and New England will run out of gas.


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## Greylock (Jan 3, 2005)

As much as I'd like to see the Pack have another shot in Philly, I think they'll be playing Atlanta. Should be some dandy games, despite all the gloom-and-doom about .500 teams in the playoffs.


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## Crothian (Jan 3, 2005)

well, if the pats beat the Vikings they go on to play Atlanta.  If the beat Atlanta the probalby play Phili, because I don't see Seattle or Rams beating Phili.  a .500 team in the playoffs has never won a game.


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## GlassJaw (Jan 3, 2005)

I think it's awesome that everyone is once again underestimating the Pats.  I'm sure Belichick and company wouldn't want it any other way.    

They would like nothing better than to go into Pitt and give them a good kick in the pants.


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## Crothian (Jan 3, 2005)

not so much as underestimating the Pats, as seeing the Colts and Steelers are a lot better teams then last time they faced off.  I will not be supriused if the Pats do make it to the big game


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## Laurel (Jan 3, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> AFC
> Denver at Colts
> Jets At Chargers
> Bye: New England and Pittsburgh
> ...



Have to go with Colts and Seahawks for those two games.  The other two I really can't say, but far reaching randomly just picking two I'd say Vikings and Chargers.  

This line up does seem strange, but next year already looks like it might be a better year and more challenging for some (like the Eagles).

I think the Eagles will end up on top for the NFC, but they won't win the playoff games by much of a margin.  

I would love to see the Seahawks play Atlanta again!


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## drothgery (Jan 3, 2005)

I'd like to see the Pack and the Colts, and it might even happen. The wild card teams can safely be written off; the Vikings, Jets, and Broncos will certainly be gone after week 1, and I think the Rams will join them (2/3 of the time teams will get that 3rd win over a team they've defeated twice before, but no 8-8 team has ever won, and I still like the Seahawks here). But I suspect any of the division champs except the Seahawks have a decent chance.

There's no team in the NFC without gaping holes, mostly on defense. The Eagles have been awful while resting their stars for the playoffs and without TO; I don't know if they can turn things up a notch in the playoffs. It's impossilbe to have much confidence in Atlanta; they depend too much on a fragile Mike Vick, who just isn't a good passer. Seattle should have rolled through the season and into the playoffs, but stumbled to 9-7 instead, and they have injury issues now. The Vikes have already proven they can't win a shootout with the Packers. And the Pack have to get into shootouts, because they can't stop anybody.

In the AFC, the Steelers have a rookie quarterback, the Pats have been winning ugly, the Chargers have no pass D, and the Colts have no D at all. Still, they're giant steps ahead of the Jets and Broncos. And this is an offensive year.


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## GlassJaw (Jan 3, 2005)

> as seeing the Colts and Steelers are a lot better teams then last time they faced off




The Pats didn't have Dillon when they played the Steelers!!


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## Crothian (Jan 3, 2005)

GlassJaw said:
			
		

> The Pats didn't have Dillon when they played the Steelers!!




You are right.  It will be impossible for the Steelers to realize anything about this Dillon guy considering they only played against him twice a year since he got into the league.  :\

most people know the Pats are the team to beat, that's why everyone is gunning for them.


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## Captain Tagon (Jan 3, 2005)

Steelers are coming on strong, again. With their second string playing so well against the Bills and Staley being back they seem to have hit their second stride in this thing. The scary thing about Pittsburgh this year is they have four guys who are at least decent running backs they can put in there and just pound it out to the point that I'm not sure any defense in the NFL could stop them from doing it.

The Patriots are dangerous yes, but they've showed weakness this year with Brady getting rattled in both the loss to Miami and the earlier loss to the Steelers. Nobody in the NFC is what I'd even call a 'good' football team.

Chargers are scary however, as are the Broncos. The Broncos have the talent that if they don't self-destruct they might be the best team in the league.


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## DaveStebbins (Jan 4, 2005)

Dimwhit said:
			
		

> I'm bummed that the Bills fell short. They got the loss they needed from the Jets but came up short against Pittsburg.



Came up short? It pains me (as a long-time Bills fan) to say this, but they folded like an accordian. They played very well the second half of the season but, as soon as they faced the real possibility of making the playoffs, and playoff pressure, they choked big time. Pittsburgh turned the ball over a few times, but that's to be expected considering how many second-stringers they played. However, there was no excuse for the sloppy play of the Bills.  :\ 

I only hope J. P. Losman is ready to start at QB next season.


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## Silver Moon (Jan 4, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> AFC
> Denver at Colts
> Jets At Chargers
> Bye: New England and Pittsburgh
> ...




Okay, here are my predictions.  Bear in mind that last year I correctly guessed 10 of the 11 games.   Note I'm only talking winner here not point spread. 


For the weekend of Jan 8 & 9 I'm saying Colts, Chargers, Green Bay and Seahawks

For the weekend of Jan 15 & 16 I'm saying New England, Pittsburgh, Phili and Green Bay.

For the weekend of Jan 23 I'm saying Pittsburgh and Phili. 

And for the Feb. 6 "Pennsylvania Bowl" I'm picking Pittsburgh as the winner. 


Of course, being from New England, I won't cry if I'm wrong and the Pats win it all.


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## Keeper of Secrets (Jan 4, 2005)

Pittsburgh has to be the favorite for the AFC at this point.  They are doing so many things right on both sides of the ball.  Though, they win lots of close games (which is good and bad).

The NFC, gee, I dunno.  I like Philly and Green Bay despite the Pack's problems in the early season.  Green Bay has more talent all way around on offense but defense is somewhat suspect. (I will also admit to being a huge Green Bay fan.)  But they could get upset at home against the Vikings (it is really hard to beat the same team three times in a season).

So I am seeing either Pittsburgh against Philly or Green Bay in the big game with most likely Pittsburgh winning (unless the mafia can get to them again like they did in the mid 90's when they clearly got to Neil O'Donnell).


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## drothgery (Jan 4, 2005)

Keeper of Secrets said:
			
		

> But they could get upset at home against the Vikings (it is really hard to beat the same team three times in a season).




Everyone says that, but there have been 15 playoff games that matched teams that had played twice before. The team that won the first two won 10 times. The only reason I like Seattle over the Rams anyway is because St. Louis' win Seattle was very flukey (the Seahawks dominated the game for 55 minutes), and it's one of the rare times where the team that won both games is the one with the worse record.


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## Dimwhit (Jan 4, 2005)

Call me crazy, but I kind of like the Chargers in the AFC. Not saying they'll make the Superbowl, but they're a good darkhorse pick to get there.

The NFC is wide open. Atlanta could surprise everyone and got to the Superbowl, similar to what they did in '98. Philly is hurting without T.O., you never know which Green Bay team is going to show up (same goes for Minnesota), and Seattle and St. Louis are both very suspect. Not that Atlanta isn't up and down as well. Should be interesting.


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## Crothian (Jan 4, 2005)

Chargers is not a crazy pick.  I think they would have the toughest time against the Colts, and they can only meet them in the AFC championship game and it would be in Indy.  

NFC I'm still leaning toward Green Bay.  Phili can't win without TO.  The Falcons are a good team, but Favre magic trumps them this year.


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## Dimwhit (Jan 4, 2005)

I thought the Chargers were playing the Colts this weekend? Maybe I'm wrong.


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## drothgery (Jan 4, 2005)

Dimwhit said:
			
		

> I thought the Chargers were playing the Colts this weekend? Maybe I'm wrong.




The Chargers and Colts won their divisions; they play the wild-card teams (the Jets and Broncos, respectively) this week.

If I were to guess

This week -
Chargers over Jets
Colts over Broncos

Packers over Vikings
Seahawks over Rams

Next week

Steelers over Chargers
Colts over Patriots

Eagles over Seahawks
Packers over Falcons

Championship games

Colts over Steelers
Packers over Eagles

Super Bowl

Colts over Packers


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## Crothian (Jan 4, 2005)

Colts Packers??  that could be ther highest scoring Supre Bowl of all time!!


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## LeifVignirsson (Jan 4, 2005)

Ah yes, another award winning year for my Vikes.  I was openly routing for them to lose and not make the playoffs, but it seems that the other teams wouldn't comply.  Oh well, there is always next year for us to screw up...

Anyway, onto Super Bowl predictions.

My heart says that it should be Green Bay and Pittsburgh, get our best of the 60's and best of the 70's, but I know that GB has terrible defense and Pittsburgh is just ripe for a letdown.

My brains says Atlanta and New England, which would be an exciting Super Bowl because of Vick but... it is the Patriots and the Falcons... *yawn*

Eh, either way, it will probably be an exciting playoffs...

Now, if there was only a way for my Vikes to lose points to get into the negavite value... Maybe a 31 to -17 score?

Yes, I love my Vikes, but I know we suck.  Moss is starting to show flashes of his younger self by walking off of that feild with 2 seconds left.  I know it wasn't going to do anything, but that was a clear statement for me.  Maybe we can trade Moss to SF for that first pick... Hmmm....


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## Crothian (Jan 7, 2005)

Ouch, Ty Law out for the post season for the Pats.  I know their patch work secondary has been doing well, but it is still not good news for them.


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## Mark (Jan 8, 2005)

Go Colts!


(The two horsie teams are playing each other...  )


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## Crothian (Jan 8, 2005)

Mark said:
			
		

> Go Colts!
> 
> 
> (The two horsie teams are playing each other...  )




I'm hoping Plummer has a great game, so it isn't a blow out.  I want scoring and passes, passes, and more passes.


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## NTZ (Jan 8, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> Ouch, Ty Law out for the post season for the Pats.  I know their patch work secondary has been doing well, but it is still not good news for them.



  My thoughts exactly and as a Pats fan this is not good news.  No Law and no Poole.  If the Pats have to play the Colts next weekend it will very difficult for them.  

One guy on ESPN had a funny comment on the Pats chances though - something to the effect that "someone will fall out of the sky" for the Pats and they will find a way to win.  

If the Pats don't make it, I would be happy to see the Steelers take it all.

NTZ


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## Crothian (Jan 9, 2005)

Wow, this first game is a good fight!!!


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## Dimwhit (Jan 9, 2005)

Yeah, who'd have thought Seattle and St. Louis would provide such a good game?


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## Crothian (Jan 9, 2005)

The regular season games between them were not too bad.


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## Mark (Jan 9, 2005)

Dimwhit said:
			
		

> Yeah, who'd have thought Seattle and St. Louis would provide such a good game?




Yeah.  27 seconds, 4th and goal, 7 point game.  It's a nail biter.


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## Mark (Jan 9, 2005)

Should he have run it in himself?  Was the pass a little stingy?  If it is on the numbers or in the hands, should it be caught?  Goodnight, Seattle...


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## Crothian (Jan 9, 2005)

well, it figures...if Seattle was going to lose the game after the season they had, it was going to be lost on a dropped ball......


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## Crothian (Jan 9, 2005)

Mark said:
			
		

> Should he have run it in himself?  Was the pass a little stingy?  If it is on the numbers or in the hands, should it be caught?  Goodnight, Seattle...




It was dropped.  Hasslebeck is an ok runner, but I think the pass was the way to go.


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## Mark (Jan 9, 2005)

So, Jets or Chargers?  I kept an eye on the Jets a bit this year because I had Curtis Martin on one of my Fantasy Teams, but aside from hearing everyone be surprised again and again by the Chargers game after game all season, and knowing about the "Coach of the Year", I'm not all that familiar with the components (players, style of play, coaching foibles, etc.).


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## Mark (Jan 9, 2005)

Well, a little quick research says smart money is on the Chargers.  If Brees can hit his receivers and the 3rd best run defense can shut down Martin, it should be their game.  I'm going to go ahead and cheer for the Jets, anyway.  Call it my Sentimental favorite of the opening weekend of the playoffs.


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## Crothian (Jan 9, 2005)

Ya, Chargers win by 10.  Pennington, Jets QB, is not at 100%.  Brees is playing better then he did at Perdue, and at Perdue he broke all the records.  Chargers defense I see stacking up against the run to see if Pennington can beat them in the air.  THe Jets havea good defense, but the Chargers are really balanced on offense and they can beat you with LT running or Brees throwing.


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## Mark (Jan 9, 2005)

Ya know, I failed to mention that on my other Fantasy team I had McCareins.  Because I had not seen many games, personally, and really had only followed the Jets through the stats, I kept thinking that McCareins really wasn't living up to his potential.  But now that I am seeing some of the passes he was supposed to catch, I wonder how much was him this year and how much of it was poor passing by Pennington.  I mean, he had 16 TDs and over 2,600 yards, but when it came to McCareins was he just not giving him catchable passes for much of the 13 games he played?


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## Crothian (Jan 9, 2005)

looks like a huge penalty leads to OT


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## Crothian (Jan 9, 2005)

Wow, what a game...of course I'm now 0-2 on predicting these games.  I was hoping to see the Chargers play the Steelers, but will have to wait for next year to see that.  Looks like the Jets are going to be playing all teams they've played before, at least next week.


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## Mark (Jan 9, 2005)

Next...my Colts.


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## mythusmage (Jan 9, 2005)

*Quoting Myself*

"The New York Jets won 20 to 17, with the capable assistance of the San Diego Chargers."

(Can't link to my blog, it has _politics_   )


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## Stone Angel (Jan 9, 2005)

Boy did I never see this one coming Jets in OT guess they deserved to be in their after all. Nice to see the AFC a little shaken up since this season was pretty much yes or no for most teams. 

What about the Rams the first team with a losing record to win a post season game! I didn't watch it but wow. 

Go Colts BABY


The Seraph of Earth and Stone


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## Dimwhit (Jan 9, 2005)

That Chargers game was a bummer. I think the natural reaction is to blame the kicker, but in wet weather, a 40-yarder isn't a gimmie. I tend to blame the calls on the three plays previous. 1st and 10 from the 23 or so and they call three straight running plays that are designed for nothing but to run out the clock, which is pointless in OT. They should have done a better job getting it a bit close and more to the center.

Still, the kicker should have made it. Poor guy is a rookie. I hope it doesn't trash his whole career.


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## Crothian (Jan 9, 2005)

Well, after yesterday I dare say the AFC is happy and the NFC is not.  I'm pretty sure the AFC is happier to face the Jets then the Chargers, and in the NFC no one wants to face the Rams with that offense.


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## drothgery (Jan 9, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> Well, after yesterday I dare say the AFC is happy and the NFC is not.  I'm pretty sure the AFC is happier to face the Jets then the Chargers, and in the NFC no one wants to face the Rams with that offense.




... or the Vikes with that offense or the Pack with that offense. Lack of offense is not a problem in the NFC playoffs.


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## Captain Tagon (Jan 9, 2005)

Ah, this Denver/Indy game is just getting ugly.


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## Dimwhit (Jan 9, 2005)

I don't think Indy has been talked about enough as a Superbowl team. We'll see if a good D like Pitt or NE can stop Indy. It will be interesting. (I am, of course, assuming that Indy is going to go on to beat Denver, but I don't think it's a stretch to assume so.)


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## Captain Tagon (Jan 9, 2005)

I don't know. The Texans and the Ravens both did a good job on defense against the Colts and Pittsburgh and NE both could do that and actually have offenses enough to win the game. Especially playing in the cold weather.


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## Crothian (Jan 9, 2005)

drothgery said:
			
		

> ... or the Vikes with that offense or the Pack with that offense. Lack of offense is not a problem in the NFC playoffs.




Ya, but the Rams I think with the coach and an offense that is built for speed, some teams like the Falcons who play on a field the Rams can take advantage of won't want to see them.  But ya, this year is the year of the Offense.


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## Crothian (Jan 9, 2005)

Dimwhit said:
			
		

> I don't think Indy has been talked about enough as a Superbowl team. We'll see if a good D like Pitt or NE can stop Indy. It will be interesting. (I am, of course, assuming that Indy is going to go on to beat Denver, but I don't think it's a stretch to assume so.)




People are talking about it, but Indy also has trouble outside.  Worst case scenerio for Indy is actually at Pitsburgh.  Heinz field has horrible footing, the speed of Indy will have problems there as does every visiting teams.  The talk for Indy will increase drastically if they can get by the Patriots.  A Steelers Indy Championship game will be interesting since both Dungy and Cowher are said to not be able to win the big games.


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## Crothian (Jan 9, 2005)

And the Broncos win!!  ...the third Quarter.  The Colts win the other three and the game.


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## Stone Angel (Jan 9, 2005)

The Broncos go down in crushing defeat, the Colts drown them after a great third quarter effort. 

So Indy goes into the Pats and the Jets face the might Steelers. 

Predictions? Factors? Wants?


Steelers 28 Jets 20:  I kind expect the Jets to run out of steam in the 2nd half against Pittsburgh. This will all depend on the Jets running game so Pennington can get a chance to pass without any pressure. If their defense can force a few take aways and they play exceptionally well in the first and third they will have a good shot. For Pittsburgh I believe there rest allowed them to heal up and feel fresh on the field. Look for a powerful and pounding running game with the big pass play from Big Ben. I expect them to just play both sides of the ball great as usual.

Colts 41 Pats 30: The Patriots secondary isn't as strong as it used be especially with Law not making an appearance. Wayne being more a threat than ever. The Colts are a much better team on both sides of the ball. The offense is a fine tuned destroying machine and they have the chance to beat anybody in the league just because they can score so much in so many various ways. The defense is more focused and the pass rush is really starting to develop. Foxborough itself poses a major factor being outdoors and such and who knows what the weather will be. Not that I am counting the New England defense out far from it, that will make or break them I think. And the New England has a very good good coach with a defensive mind who will through many tricky formations.

Look forward to hearing everyone else views and I am sure I will see my sports analysist nemesis in Glass Jaw. All in good fun and sportsmanship of course


The Seraph of Earth and Stone


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## Crothian (Jan 9, 2005)

Next weekened is looking like another good weekend of games.  

Steeler 24, Jets 13: The Steelers are rested and with their physical style of playing, that is scarey.  They wil rush with Bettis, rush with Staley, rush with Parker...and then throw with Ben.  Special teams though can really be a big facotr as both have good returners.  I imagine that Martin will not rush well and Pennington will be under a lot of pressure.  This could be a huge defensive game like the first time they played, and in that game the Jets lost because of penalties.  

Colts 35 Pats 27: With the rules clarified about how the seocndary can bump and the patch work secondary of the Pats, I see a good game for Manning.  The key for the Pats defense will be getting pressure on Manning and getting him out of the pocket.  Of course that could leave one on one coverage and Manning could kill them if he can get a bit of time that way.  Pats need a control game from Dillon.  He needs to run and run well.  That will open the play action for Brady and he can have a good passing day against the Colts.  But he also will need time in the pocket, and the Colts Dline has become good at getting to the passer.


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## Dimwhit (Jan 9, 2005)

I don't have explanations, but I'll just on the Steelers/Colts bandwagon.

How about the Vikings? Their offense is running all over Green Bay.


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## Mark (Jan 9, 2005)

Okie doke.  Now that Favre has lulled them into a very real sense of security, time to turn this game around...


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## Mark (Jan 9, 2005)

Pack on the board!


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## Crothian (Jan 9, 2005)

not by much though...the Vikings are just looking great today


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## Captain Tagon (Jan 9, 2005)

Man, Green Bay got robbed on that "incomplete" interception.


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## Crothian (Jan 9, 2005)

Captain Tagon said:
			
		

> Man, Green Bay got robbed on that "incomplete" interception.




That was just wierd...but ya, refs seem to blow whistles too fast


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## Captain Tagon (Jan 9, 2005)

And the Pack defense made a good stop that time. They could get back in the game.


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## Crothian (Jan 9, 2005)

Captain Tagon said:
			
		

> And the Pack defense made a good stop that time. They could get back in the game.




With Favre the Packers are rarely out of any game.


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## Mark (Jan 9, 2005)

Ba-BAMM! 


_It's because I am now eating cheese..._


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## Captain Tagon (Jan 9, 2005)

Touchdown Packers!


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## Keeper of Secrets (Jan 9, 2005)

Watching the Packers beat the Vikings is the most sweet event in football.  I just hope I get the opportunity to see it today.


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## Keeper of Secrets (Jan 9, 2005)

Captain Tagon said:
			
		

> Touchdown Packers!




Whoo-Hoo!


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## AGGEMAM (Jan 9, 2005)

Keeper of Secrets said:
			
		

> Watching the Packers beat the Vikings is the most sweet event in football.  I just hope I get the opportunity to see it today.




Doesn't seem so likely anymore does it ... GO VIKINGS


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## Keeper of Secrets (Jan 9, 2005)

Don't be so sure . . .


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## Captain Tagon (Jan 9, 2005)

AGGEMAM said:
			
		

> Doesn't seem so likely anymore does it ... GO VIKINGS





Except it's only a two touchdown lead, isn't even the second half, GB is driving, and they get the ball ack at the start of the second half. Way, way too early to call.


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## AGGEMAM (Jan 9, 2005)

I'm not    But my Vikings are looking great today .. and what a game and it's only first half.


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## Keeper of Secrets (Jan 9, 2005)

AGGEMAM said:
			
		

> I'm not    But my Vikings are looking great today .. and what a game and it's only first half.




As someone who has seen plenty of Vikings games, I have so much faith in the Vikings great ability at ineptitude.


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## Captain Tagon (Jan 9, 2005)

The Vikings, along with apparently most of the NFL this year, don't seem to know how to finish games.


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## Keeper of Secrets (Jan 9, 2005)

Captain Tagon said:
			
		

> The Vikings, along with apparently most of the NFL this year, don't seem to know how to finish games.




Thankfully.


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## AGGEMAM (Jan 9, 2005)

Neither does Packers by the looks of it


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## Captain Tagon (Jan 9, 2005)

AGGEMAM said:
			
		

> Neither does Packers by the looks of it





Eh, they didn't finish the second half, it is yet to be seen how they finish the game.


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## GentleGiant (Jan 9, 2005)

As long as it doesn't come down to a field goal attempt from either team   
At least it wasn't Andersen's fault. The holder let go too early


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## AGGEMAM (Jan 9, 2005)

What the? We have a defense that is actually working? That must be a first!


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## Mark (Jan 10, 2005)

Ba-Ba-Ba-BAMMMM!


It's just a seven point game, now....


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## Keeper of Secrets (Jan 10, 2005)

Despite the fact that the Packers may end up losing, the fact that the Vikings have a hard time closing the deal makes me happy.  It goes further to show that the Vikings will never be a solid team.


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## d20Dwarf (Jan 10, 2005)

Possibly the worst team to ever play in a professional playoff series is about to advance. 

Gee, thanks NFL pass interference rules, you really made the game better.


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## AGGEMAM (Jan 10, 2005)

Now the game isn't over yet but with a 14 point lead, possesion, and 2 TOs to 0, I think it's as good as.

How can you say that it's the worst team? Doesn't winning the game count anymore?


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## GentleGiant (Jan 10, 2005)

I don't think it's getting ahead of myself when saying that that game should be in the bag.
Should bring in a nice amount at the bookies if you had the nerves to bet against the Packers.


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## d20Dwarf (Jan 10, 2005)

AGGEMAM said:
			
		

> How can you say that it's the worst team? Doesn't winning the game count anymore?




I've been in a lot of competitions, and the idea that the best player always wins is ludicrous.


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## Mark (Jan 10, 2005)

Congrats to the Vikings.  I think the early lead and the four Favre interceptions were too much to overcome.  Well, I was 3 for 4 this weekend and the Colts won, so it was a good time for me.


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## AGGEMAM (Jan 10, 2005)

GentleGiant said:
			
		

> I don't think it's getting ahead of myself when saying that that game should be in the bag.
> Should bring in a nice amount at the bookies if you had the nerves to bet against the Packers.




Absolutely   I bet on a 11+ point win to Vikings so I'm really happy


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## Captain Tagon (Jan 10, 2005)

Man, four teams I don't care about but two really boring games today. At least yesterday was exciting.


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## GentleGiant (Jan 10, 2005)

Man, Moss' afro is scary!


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## Keeper of Secrets (Jan 10, 2005)

Sadly, we can't say the best team won.


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## Mark (Jan 10, 2005)

d20Dwarf said:
			
		

> Gee, thanks NFL pass interference rules, you really made the game better.




Did we watch the same game?  It was the four interceptions that probably cost the Pack the game, which had nothing to do with the new-ish pass interference rules.  They've been the same all season and effect both teams.  It's ridiculous to suggest that those rules made any difference in the outcome of this game.


----------



## d20Dwarf (Jan 10, 2005)

Mark said:
			
		

> Did we watch the same game? It was the four interceptions that probably cost the Pack the game, which had nothing to do with the new-ish pass interference rules. They've been the same all season and effect both teams. It's ridiculous to suggest that those rules made any difference in the outcome of this game.




Really? It's ridiculous to think that the Vikings' "toss and pray" style of offense could win without safeties and corners being forced to play 3 feet from receivers to avoid a flag.


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 10, 2005)

Just thought I'd mention it here, in case we have some wealthy Vikings fans:
A danish auction house, along with the Danish TV channel which shows NFL games, are auctioning off 4 unique items. All the money go directly to the relief help in Asia (Red Cross, UNICEF etc. etc.).
The pages are in Danish, sorry, don't know if there's an English version. If anyone are interested, I'd be happy to translate.

The items are as follows:
Randy Moss game jersey (the real deal!), signed:
http://www.lauritz.com/s_j/4.asp?itemid=408663&lang=2

Daunte Culpepper game jersey (the real deal!), signed:
http://www.lauritz.com/s_j/4.asp?itemid=408662&lang=2

Morten Andersen game jersey (the real deal!), signed:
http://www.lauritz.com/s_j/4.asp?itemid=408657&lang=2

Morten Andersen special designed (by Reebok) kicking cleat, signed:
http://www.lauritz.com/s_j/4.asp?itemid=408660&lang=2

Edit: changed the links to the English pages. The description is still in Danish, but the navigation should be in English now.


----------



## d20Dwarf (Jan 10, 2005)

GentleGiant said:
			
		

> Morten Andersen special designed (by Reebok) kicking cleat, signed:
> http://www.lauritz.com/s_j/4.asp?itemid=408660&lang=1




Hopefully bidders on this item weren't watching the game today.


----------



## msd (Jan 10, 2005)

Do we want to start taking bets as to how much Randy Moss' endzone "celebration" is gonna cost him?

I say 10k.


----------



## AGGEMAM (Jan 10, 2005)

Ok, the text isn't translated yet, but if you want the american/english version of the bidding page change the lang=1 part to lang=2 in the links posted by GentleGiant.

Current bids are around $4,000 for the jerseys, and $1,000 for the cleat.


----------



## Mark (Jan 10, 2005)

d20Dwarf said:
			
		

> Really? It's ridiculous to think that the Vikings' "toss and pray" style of offense could win without safeties and corners being forced to play 3 feet from receivers to avoid a flag.




The Packers rely on the passing game much more than the Vikings.  If anything, the new way they are ruling things helps Green Bay more.  And, again, it was the four interceptions (which you somehow conveniently ignore) that cost them the game.


----------



## Crothian (Jan 10, 2005)

THe Vikings were the better team today, they won and the played better then the Packers.  But I think that Moss needs a fast recovery ot the Eagles defense will destroy them.  Of course the Eagles offense will have trouble with the Vikings defense now that Wingfield (he was great at Ohio State!!) is back.  I think the Eagles squeeze out a close win with little offense on either side.  

Rams vers the Falcons is also and interesting match up.  Defense verse offense again, and as most of the Falcons games come down to, it will depend on Vick.  I see Atlanta coming out with the win though.


----------



## Crothian (Jan 10, 2005)

msd said:
			
		

> Do we want to start taking bets as to how much Randy Moss' endzone "celebration" is gonna cost him?
> 
> I say 10k.




Nothing.  It really wasn't that bad.  Now, if he'd have actually mooned the fans, ya.  But what he did was at worst just dumb.


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 10, 2005)

msd said:
			
		

> Do we want to start taking bets as to how much Randy Moss' endzone "celebration" is gonna cost him?
> 
> I say 10k.



Compared to Lynch's fine I think 10K is way too much, if they're even going to fine him.
Frankly I don't think either of them should be fined.
At least Moss didn't bring any "foreign objects" unto the field or anything like that. T.O. wasn't fined for tearing down those poster either, was he?


----------



## AGGEMAM (Jan 10, 2005)

My God we have some sour grapes in here today.

The best team won. End of story. You can't refute a 14 point win. Had it been a game like the two in regular season both settled on a last minute FG you could, but really, the Vikings made an early lead, and played for the single purpose of maintaining that lead. Didn't take silly chances. Was it boring in the second half? Possibly! But this is the play-offs .. you don't get second chances!


----------



## Dimwhit (Jan 10, 2005)

d20Dwarf said:
			
		

> Possibly the worst team to ever play in a professional playoff series is about to advance.




Hmm, that sounds like the gross exaggeration of a Vikings hater. Minnesota is far from the worst team to ever play in a professional playoff series. They're not even the worst this year. Either Seattle or St. Louis could fill that. And ever? Not even close.

It is funny, though, that two 8-8 teams could meet in the Championship game. I've gotta think that my Falcons will take care of the Rams, but they're too unpredictible. As for the other side, I'm thinking the Vikings offense will be better than the Eagles defense, and without TO, I'm not sure Philly can keep up. I would still pick them to win, but I could easily see an upset.

Should be...well, bizarre.


----------



## Keeper of Secrets (Jan 10, 2005)

AGGEMAM said:
			
		

> My God we have some sour grapes in here today.
> 
> The best team won. End of story. You cen't refute a 14 point win. Had it been a game like to two in regular season both settled on a last minute FG you could, but really, the Vikings made an early lead, and played for the single purpose of maintaining that lead. Didn't take silly chances was it boring in the second half? Possibly! But this is the play-offs .. you don't get second chances!




Nope.  I just hate to see unclassy people advance.  Kind of like wondering why wealthy people win the lottery.


----------



## Crothian (Jan 10, 2005)

Keeper of Secrets said:
			
		

> Nope.  I just hate to see unclassy people advance.  Kind of like wondering why wealthy people win the lottery.




Unclassy people?  What does class have to do with football?  It is a very unclassy sport.


----------



## AGGEMAM (Jan 10, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> Unclassy people?  What does class have to do with football?  It is a very unclassy sport.




I thought that was the beauty of the game ...


----------



## LeifVignirsson (Jan 10, 2005)

Well, I got the numbers right but I had them in the wrong places and a negative in the way.  Of course, I didn't believe that I was watching my team win and I know that I am rather diegusted with Randy Moss.  Really, we would be better off in getting rid of him for something else that will work.  I know that there isn't anyone else like him but he has been a lot of trouble recently...

Anyway, I am not sure that the Vikes will make it past the Eagles without TO.  I will still pull for them but will probably still be anxious about it.


----------



## Keeper of Secrets (Jan 10, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> Unclassy people?  What does class have to do with football?  It is a very unclassy sport.





I dunno.  Manning seems classy.  Favre sems classy.  McNabb seems classy.

No matter what you think about football players Randy Moss is an exceptionally unclassy even by football standards.


----------



## LeifVignirsson (Jan 10, 2005)

Keeper of Secrets said:
			
		

> I dunno.  Manning seems classy.  Favre sems classy.  McNabb seems classy.
> 
> No matter what you think about football players Randy Moss is an exceptionally unclassy even by football standards.




Ummm, it crosses all sports and all people in the sports world.  Not to say that Moss is a saint, you can see from my posts I am sick of his garbage, but there are other people who are worst (ron Artest for one, "The Answer" is another...)


----------



## Crothian (Jan 10, 2005)

Keeper of Secrets said:
			
		

> I dunno.  Manning seems classy.  Favre sems classy.  McNabb seems classy.
> 
> No matter what you think about football players Randy Moss is an exceptionally unclassy even by football standards.




First off there is a differeence between the QBs you have listed and widse recievers like Moss.  He acts like TO, like Chad Johnson,  Plaxico, and the rest of the recievers who really hog the limelight.


----------



## d20Dwarf (Jan 10, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> Rams vers the Falcons is also and interesting match up. Defense verse offense again, and as most of the Falcons games come down to, it will depend on Vick. I see Atlanta coming out with the win though.




I agree, in fact I predicted Atl vs. NE in the Superbowl.


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 10, 2005)

Keeper of Secrets said:
			
		

> I dunno.  Manning seems classy.



Well, I'd like to respectfully disagree on that one 
I don't think it would go over well to write what I think of him. But the words snob and redneck would probably be among the nicer things  (and I know that those two words seem strange in the same context)


----------



## d20Dwarf (Jan 10, 2005)

Keeper of Secrets said:
			
		

> I dunno. Manning seems classy. Favre sems classy. McNabb seems classy.
> 
> No matter what you think about football players Randy Moss is an exceptionally unclassy even by football standards.




He's not the only one, though...Culpepper is almost his equal, with his stupid "I'm so smart" dance every time he throws a long bomb that doesn't get intercepted.


----------



## Dimwhit (Jan 10, 2005)

I like the Vikings. They're my #2 team after the Falcons. Personally, while Moss doesn't things that make you scratch your head (or worse), I'm glad the Vikes have him. He's still an amazing player. And his latest episode didn't hurt the team. Seemed to actually solidify them a bit and come out really aggressive. Not that I think he should be pulling a stunt like that every week, but this last one was really blown out of proportion, IMO.


----------



## Keeper of Secrets (Jan 10, 2005)

d20Dwarf said:
			
		

> He's not the only one, though...Culpepper is almost his equal, with his stupid "I'm so smart" dance every time he throws a long bomb that doesn't get intercepted.





Oh I will take on Culpepper's antics another day . . . 

Today I am focused on Moss, the dirty weasel . . .


----------



## Stone Angel (Jan 10, 2005)

Why would anyone not say Manning is not classy. I understand I am probably the biggest Indy fans on these boards. But I am intrigued, your redneck comment you can keep to yourself and arguably you can say that about anyone from Indiana. But why do you think he is a snob. I always see him go out and shake the opposing teams hand, coaches and he never talks smack before or after the game regardless of the outcome. If you have a specific instance that is fine, if you just get that feeling well then.....


I really feel the Moss is the biggest victim of himself, but you know what they say any PR is good PR. But it was disrespectful and I didn't appreciate it. On the other hand I feel that the Pack was just right there but just couldn't take care of business on the defensive side of the ball. Tough loss at Lambo.

I predict the Rams will win over Atlatnta I just get that feeling that they have the backed into a corner, kill em all mentality.

The Seraph of Earth and Stone


----------



## Keeper of Secrets (Jan 10, 2005)

The only bad thing I have ever heard about Manning was a story about a sophmoric prank in college when he was a, well,  . . .  sophmore.  Apparently he flashed a female trainer when he was in the locker room.


----------



## Mystery Man (Jan 10, 2005)

Keeper of Secrets said:
			
		

> The only bad thing I have ever heard about Manning was a story about a sophmoric prank in college when he was a, well, . . . sophmore. Apparently he flashed a female trainer when he was in the locker room.




 I still remember fondly the way Nebraska's defense manhandled him in the national championship game.


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## Mystery Man (Jan 10, 2005)

Dimwhit said:
			
		

> That Chargers game was a bummer. I think the natural reaction is to blame the kicker, but in wet weather, a 40-yarder isn't a gimmie. I tend to blame the calls on the three plays previous. 1st and 10 from the 23 or so and they call three straight running plays that are designed for nothing but to run out the clock, which is pointless in OT. They should have done a better job getting it a bit close and more to the center.
> 
> Still, the kicker should have made it. Poor guy is a rookie. I hope it doesn't trash his whole career.




 ah Marty.

 We have "The Fumble", "The Drive" and now "The Field Goal". Those who know Shotenhiemer's history will get that one. 


 The man is cursed.


----------



## d20Dwarf (Jan 10, 2005)

Mystery Man said:
			
		

> ah Marty.
> 
> We have "The Fumble", "The Drive" and now "The Field Goal". Those who know Shotenhiemer's history will get that one.
> 
> ...




Well, cursed with bad play calling in this case. They should have stayed with their offense and gone for a TD, or a much closer field goal. The three runs up the middle was terrible playcalling, especially for a team with arguably the best RB in football and one of the least intercepted QBs. I just hated that call, what a disappointing finish to a great season. The Chargers were one of the playoff highlights for me, now I just have to root for St. Louis and NE.


----------



## Laurel (Jan 10, 2005)

http://www.peytonmanning.com/

If you have questions for or about Payton Manning visit his site 

I would not put him in a room full of world leaders, as he is a good ol' boy from down south.
He seems genuine and even was through his years at UT.  He does not have the normal attitude issues that some in his record breaking position would.  He does have the drive to push him self, and he seems to be making good choices on how to bring in extra cash with sponsorships.


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## Stone Angel (Jan 10, 2005)

d20dwarf I am shocked and ashamed. Rooting for NE after all that good, down home Hoosier Hospitality you enjoyed at the lake house despite my lack of posting the Anti Jared and the boxer story. You had better throw up a hell yeah for the blue nation.

lol

The Seraph of Earth and Stone


----------



## drothgery (Jan 10, 2005)

First the Chargers loose a heart-breaker, just when I was starting to warm up to them. And then the Packers attemted to rip my football-fan's soul from my body; every time I turned on the TV to check on the game, something bad happened.

With a limping Walker and Davenport, and no Ferg, though, the Packers were missing a lot of their offense. Only two teams left that I actually like (Indy and Philly).


----------



## Crothian (Jan 10, 2005)

I'm hoping the Chargers season was not a fluke, and they come back next year strong.  THe PAckers just didn't look all in sinc and had timing issues.  Plus the balkl just seemed to bounce the Vikings way.


----------



## Mystery Man (Jan 10, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> I'm hoping the Chargers season was not a fluke, and they come back next year strong. THe PAckers just didn't look all in sinc and had timing issues. Plus the balkl just seemed to bounce the Vikings way.




 Chargers - no the season wasn't a fluke. 

 Packers - needs a new defensive coordinator. Maybe Bo Pellini is looking for a new job.


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## GentleGiant (Jan 10, 2005)

Stone Angel said:
			
		

> Why would anyone not say Manning is not classy.



Well, erm... that's what I did  (gotta watch out for those double negatives )



			
				Stone Angel said:
			
		

> I understand I am probably the biggest Indy fans on these boards. But I am intrigued, your redneck comment you can keep to yourself and arguably you can say that about anyone from Indiana. But why do you think he is a snob. I always see him go out and shake the opposing teams hand, coaches and he never talks smack before or after the game regardless of the outcome. If you have a specific instance that is fine, if you just get that feeling well then.....



The redneck comment is just a humorous note to his drawling southern accent. If you take too much offense from that, then you need to lighten up and don't take yourself so serious. 

Granted, I haven't seen a lot of interviews with him and such, but I'm also more looking at his general demeanor on the field/sideline/etc.. I'd love to be proven wrong (no reason to think ill of anyone if it's not true), but I always get this smug and haughty/"better than thou"  vibe from him.
I do not question his abilities with the pigskin, clearly he's a phenomenal player at times. But maybe the constant chatter of being "the greatest QB of all time" has finally gone to his head?
Feel free to disagree with me, and I think you will, as long as we can agree on the fact that we can have different opinions and impressions of the guy


----------



## RatPunk (Jan 10, 2005)

GentleGiant said:
			
		

> I'd love to be proven wrong (no reason to think ill of anyone if it's not true), but I always get this smug and haughty/"better than thou"  vibe from him.
> I do not question his abilities with the pigskin, clearly he's a phenomenal player at times. But maybe the constant chatter of being "the greatest QB of all time" has finally gone to his head?




Speaking as someone from Central Indiana who is exposed to Colts media constantly, I can assure you this is most definately not the case. Peyton is one of the nicest, classiest guys you could ever hope to meet.


----------



## d20Dwarf (Jan 10, 2005)

Stone Angel said:
			
		

> d20dwarf I am shocked and ashamed. Rooting for NE after all that good, down home Hoosier Hospitality you enjoyed at the lake house despite my lack of posting the Anti Jared and the boxer story. You had better throw up a hell yeah for the blue nation.
> 
> lol




Well, I picked ATL vs NE in the Super Bowl, so now I have to root for them. Indy's defense is looking more impressive lately, so I'm starting to believe they're a more complete package than I thought. I'm a defense-lover at heart, though, so I can't see myself rooting for the Colts unless they end up in the Super Bowl, in which case I'll definitely be looking for them to put on a show (and hopefully not sputter like the offense-laden Raiders of a couple of years ago).


----------



## Dimwhit (Jan 10, 2005)

And Manning does some of the best commercials of any athlete.


----------



## Crothian (Jan 10, 2005)

Mystery Man said:
			
		

> Chargers - no the season wasn't a fluke.




Hard to say at this point.  They were 4-12 in 03 and they could be back there.  They have a QB problem now, and that alone has taken down many good teams.


----------



## RatPunk (Jan 10, 2005)

My greatest Super Bowl fear is Falcons vs Colts. 

Why, you ask? 

Living in Central Indiana, I am, of course, a Colts supporter and fan. But my favorite team is and has always been the Falcons. If one or the other make it to the Big Dance, I can cheer away with no concern. 

But if they both make it? I'll have to cheer for the Falcons. And that makes my annual Super Bowl Gaming party much more lonely for me...


----------



## RatPunk (Jan 10, 2005)

Dimwhit said:
			
		

> And Manning does some of the best commercials of any athlete.




Let's go Insurance Adjusters, Let's GO!!


----------



## Crothian (Jan 10, 2005)

d20Dwarf said:
			
		

> Well, I picked ATL vs NE in the Super Bowl, so now I have to root for them. Indy's defense is looking more impressive lately, so I'm starting to believe they're a more complete package than I thought. I'm a defense-lover at heart, though, so I can't see myself rooting for the Colts unless they end up in the Super Bowl, in which case I'll definitely be looking for them to put on a show (and hopefully not sputter like the offense-laden Raiders of a couple of years ago).




If the colts make it to the superbowl they won't be facing a defense like the Raiders did.  Phili and the Falcons have some D, but it isn't as smothering like the Bucs was.


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 10, 2005)

RatPunk said:
			
		

> Speaking as someone from Central Indiana who is exposed to Colts media constantly, I can assure you this is most definately not the case. Peyton is one of the nicest, classiest guys you could ever hope to meet.



Well, and I should have mentioned this in my other reply, when you're a "celebrity" you almost always have 2 faces. The public face and a private one.
Maybe I'm just too cynical, but it seems to me that the "nice guy" facade slips a bit when not doing interviews, promotions or whatnot.
Again, just a feeling I have from watching him more on the field than at publicity functions (interviews, charity etc. etc.).


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 10, 2005)

*shoot, my first double post*


----------



## Crothian (Jan 10, 2005)

GentleGiant said:
			
		

> Well, and I should have mentioned this in my other reply, when you're a "celebrity" you almost always have 2 faces. The public face and a private one.
> Maybe I'm just too cynical, but it seems to me that the "nice guy" facade slips a bit when not doing interviews, promotions or whatnot.
> Again, just a feeling I have from watching him more on the field than at publicity functions (interviews, charity etc. etc.).




And that is true, but it doen't mean his private face is that of an ass.  There really are superstars that are actually nice people.  And there are ones that are not, but it is not always easy to know the difference.  And asusming one way or another seems pointless.  It would be like guessing if the posters are EN World are actually nice or not away from the boards.


----------



## Dimwhit (Jan 10, 2005)

RatPunk said:
			
		

> My greatest Super Bowl fear is Falcons vs Colts.
> 
> Why, you ask?
> 
> ...




You know, I had a similar situation back in '98. I, too, am a lifelong Falcons fans. My next favorite is the Vikings. That championship game was murder for me. Part of me wanted the Vikings, because they would likely have beat the Broncos in the Superbowl. But, of course, Atlanta had never been, so I really wanted them to win. Worked out well in the end. Except for them losing the Superbowl. 



			
				RatPunk said:
			
		

> Let's go Insurance Adjusters, Let's GO!!




Yep, that's the one. Kills me. I also like the one where he takes all the Linebackers to a spa. I still think it should be a law that all commercials should be funny or entertaining...


----------



## Stone Angel (Jan 11, 2005)

"You are my favorite tax lawyer ever, right there never gonna wash this hand see that" lol

Gentle Giant you are entitled to your opinion thats fine I was just curious why you would say that.  And I had a little redneck joke in there myself so no beef here even though I used a double negative. I have seen him at a few charity events and he always does his best to talk to people and be civil. I even seen him out at a resteraunt last year and he was very nice untill he was mobbed and then he had to "escape". But what else was he to do, he couldn't even enjoy his meal.

And I am hardly offended by anything posted unless it insults me directly or calls into question my integrity. Thank you for your clarification and reply.


The Seraph of Earth and Stone


----------



## DaveStebbins (Jan 11, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> Of course the Eagles offense will have trouble with the Vikings defense now that Wingfield (he was great at Ohio State!!) is back.



Antoine Winfield also had a handful of probowl-caliber years with the Buffalo Bills, he just didn't get as much publicity when he played in the league's second-smallest market. He has always been a great cover guy and an excellent tackler.


----------



## Crothian (Jan 11, 2005)

DaveStebbins said:
			
		

> Antoine Winfield also had a handful of probowl-caliber years with the Buffalo Bills, he just didn't get as much publicity when he played in the league's second-smallest market. He has always been a great cover guy and an excellent tackler.




Agreed, I followed his carrier to some degree like I try with all the Buckeyes that make it to the NFL.


----------



## drothgery (Jan 11, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> Agreed, I followed his carrier to some degree like I try with all the Buckeyes that make it to the NFL.




I still think it's a bit crazy that almost all of the skill-position players from McNabb's Orange offense made the NFL, at least for a time. There was a time when SU had talented players that weren't tailbacks...


----------



## Crothian (Jan 11, 2005)

drothgery said:
			
		

> I still think it's a bit crazy that almost all of the skill-position players from McNabb's Orange offense made the NFL, at least for a time. There was a time when SU had talented players that weren't tailbacks...




Ya, they had a really good team back then.  Having one of the best QBs and best wide recievers in the game come from your school is pretty good.


----------



## msd (Jan 14, 2005)

msd said:
			
		

> Do we want to start taking bets as to how much Randy Moss' endzone "celebration" is gonna cost him?
> 
> I say 10k.




http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs04/news/story?id=1966180

Ahem...(whistles quietly while looking down).


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 14, 2005)

msd said:
			
		

> http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs04/news/story?id=1966180
> 
> Ahem...(whistles quietly while looking down).



No Fun League indeed... I'm with his agent, it's blown out of proportion.
Nobody got hurt, he didn't touch anyone... except the ego's of the stiff-necked league officials. And it seems like they could use someone touching them. Lighten up folks!


----------



## Dimwhit (Jan 14, 2005)

Yep, it was a ridiculous fine. I hope he appeals it.


----------



## Crothian (Jan 14, 2005)

ah, he should just pay it with a smile, not like the fine actually hurts him finacially.


----------



## Stone Angel (Jan 14, 2005)

Coach Dungy made an interesting comment on the moss celebration, Dungy said he thought it was humorous because all the packer fans moon your bus (opposing teams) as you leave the stadium. LOL


The Seraph of Earth and Stone


----------



## Crothian (Jan 14, 2005)

Ya, that was an interesting point and not one I'd heard of.


----------



## Crothian (Jan 15, 2005)

10-10 tie at half, once again Steeler special teams gives up the big one


----------



## Silver Moon (Jan 16, 2005)

Incredible game so far.  Pitt. is far from out of it but this is not what I expected from this game.   The Jets seem to want it more.


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 16, 2005)

If he's really cool, he'll hit the joint on the other upright


----------



## Krug (Jan 16, 2005)

Man I feel bad for Brien... Gah! Hope the Jets still win otherwise he's going to be remembered as a goat.


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 16, 2005)

GentleGiant said:
			
		

> If he's really cool, he'll hit the joint on the other upright



Heh, he crumbled instead...
I'm still rooting for the Jets, though, they're the weakest team of the two in my eyes and an easier opponent to beat for my Patriots


----------



## Dimwhit (Jan 16, 2005)

Krug said:
			
		

> Man I feel bad for Brien... Gah! Hope the Jets still win otherwise he's going to be remembered as a goat.



 Which is ironic, since he was the hero last week.

Man, what is it with kickers these days? They can't seem to hit the big ones. Pittsburg handed the Jets this game twice already and they blew it both times. Weird.


----------



## Crothian (Jan 16, 2005)

and I can breath!!  THat was the typical way for the Steelers to lose, if they were going to.  Special teams and defensive scores.  Their defensive stops the other team, but the other two areas fail.  I'm just glad they pulled out the win, man that was a damn good game!!!


----------



## Krug (Jan 16, 2005)

for Brien.


----------



## Dimwhit (Jan 16, 2005)

Wow, was that an impressive first drive for Atlanta or what?! The Rams had that designed rollout stuff, then Vick just shot out like a canon and bolted down the field. Nice TD pass to Crumpler, too.

My Falcons just may pull this off.  But there's a long way to go. Nice start, though.


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 16, 2005)

Hmmm... Rams @ Falcons might be a fairly high scoring affair if the start is anything to go by... Should be fun


----------



## Crothian (Jan 16, 2005)

If it were anybody but the Rams, I'd almost say the game was over.  But the Falcons have scored TDs on all three of their possessions so far?  That's impressive.  Vick is really showing he is unlike anyone I've ever seen.  He reminds me of the old single wing days almost.


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 16, 2005)

Now, what's the highest scoring post-season game again? Hahaha   
This one might just top it if they keep it up. Damn!


----------



## Dimwhit (Jan 16, 2005)

I can't believe how much rushing yardage Atlanta has in the first half. And that punt return...

What an exciting game so far. Go Falcons!!


----------



## Mystery Man (Jan 16, 2005)

Okay so Vick might actually be a good quarterback.


----------



## Crothian (Jan 16, 2005)

well, against the Rams defense, my brother might look like a good QB....


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 16, 2005)

Mystery Man said:
			
		

> Okay so Vick might actually be a good quarterback.



Nah. He's a good running back. His throwing skills still leave much to be desired.


----------



## Dimwhit (Jan 16, 2005)

Mystery Man said:
			
		

> Okay so Vick might actually be a good quarterback.



 Well, I'm biased, but Vick has always been an awesome QB. He's unorthodox, and his numbers show it (passing numbers are never that great). But Atlanta has won twice as many games as they've lost when Vick has started. That says it all, IMO. 

Even tonight, he only has, what, 65 yards midway through the third? But he's having one heck of a game!


----------



## Mystery Man (Jan 16, 2005)

Well, I dissed him pretty hard in the beginning of the season. Atlanta is in the playoffs so I'll have my large helping of crow with cole slaw.


----------



## Crothian (Jan 16, 2005)

GentleGiant said:
			
		

> Nah. He's a good running back. His throwing skills still leave much to be desired.




A QB is way more then throwing the ball.  Vick is an Old school QB, way old school.  Plus, huis passing isn't that bad considering his wide recievers really haven't been all that great this year.


----------



## Dimwhit (Jan 16, 2005)

Man, I didn't expect such a domination by the Falcons. It never really was in question, was it?

Way to go, Falcons!!!


----------



## Crothian (Jan 16, 2005)

Once again, bring a good defense and a running game and the playoffs are yours!!


----------



## drothgery (Jan 16, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> A QB is way more then throwing the ball.  Vick is an Old school QB, way old school.  Plus, huis passing isn't that bad considering his wide recievers really haven't been all that great this year.




Throwing the ball well is necessary but not sufficient. If you can't throw well, you can't last as a quarterback in the NFL. Quarterbacks get hit way too much for him to keep his speed for more than a three or four more seasons, and he's a mediocre passer at best. So he better learn to be a pocket passer by then, or he'll never see half of his contract.


----------



## drothgery (Jan 16, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> Once again, bring a good defense and a running game and the playoffs are yours!!




It can be done that way. But I maintain that a good defense and a good passing game works better. I believe a few guys named Montana, Young, Favre, Warner, and even Brady (all of which won Super Bowls with pass-oriented offenses) can explain the details. If you can't pass, you can't make many big plays except by luck. And if you can't make big plays, it's very hard to score.


----------



## LeifVignirsson (Jan 16, 2005)

Steelers game was a classic!  What happened to Brien is something that will kill kicker's careers. And we finally got to see what the Steelers looked like when they were under some serious pressure.

The Lams game was terrible, thank goodness I didn't stick around to watch that.  However, I am glad the Lams got slaughtered so that way I can at least cling to the slimest of ropes that my Vikes might make it another day...

And Randy Moss won't whip his junk out against the Eagles... Falcons/Steelers superbowl it is!


----------



## Stone Angel (Jan 16, 2005)

Good lord what a couple of games. Falcons brought there A game tonight for sure. I say that everytime I watch Vick play "he's fast" Rams just well I am not real sure what they did wrong kind of seemed to just not have as much intensity as the ATL. 

Oh Jets what happened, man I don't even know what to say about that one. I just stared at the TV in disbelief  I can't even imagine how Brien feels right now. I mean once, but twice dang.


I almost afraid to watch the rest of the playoffs. 

GO COLTS


The Seraph of Earth and Stone


----------



## Silver Moon (Jan 16, 2005)

Stone Angel said:
			
		

> I can't even imagine how Brien feels right now. I mean once, but twice dang.



They even got a crack about that into the opening of Saturday Night Live.   I think he would have been forgiven for the first one, it was mighty long and he barely missed it.  The second one however earned him permanent Goat status.   Not sure what they were trying with that bonehead play that shaved two seconds off the clock.  If anything, blame that for throwing off Brien's momentum (and prolonging the pressure). 

Wish the second game had been a little closer.    Let's see how today goes.  My picks have been poor this year, but that's true for most people given the three wildcard upsets last weekend.


----------



## Mark (Jan 16, 2005)

Except for how close the first game was, Saturday went as most thought it would.

I'm not sure why people feel badly for Brien.  I feel badly for everyone associated with the Jets except him.  It's like dropping your paid bills in the mailbox and having your postman lose them all down the sewer drain.

The Eagles should mop the floor with the Vikings, and would have with TO, but I suppose the door is open for the Vikings to pull an upset.  Still, it's only open a tiny crack, IMO, and I'm not sure Moss's ego can squeeze through.  Go Eagles.

The only game this weekend that, on paper, should have been a toss up is Colts/Pats.  Go Colts.  If the Colts can get past the Pats, I think they have the tools to go all the way.


----------



## Dimwhit (Jan 16, 2005)

I'm hopeful for a Colts/Falcons Superbowl. I'd be surprised it it happened, but it would be a cool game.


----------



## Stone Angel (Jan 16, 2005)

IF the Colts make it through Foxborough today I really think that Pittsburgh has their number. A slow grinding running game slowing the pace of the game down and keeping Indy's offense off of the field. 

But hey lets worry today. Go Blue Nation!

The Seraph of Earth and Stone


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 16, 2005)

Silver Moon said:
			
		

> Not sure what they were trying with that bonehead play that shaved two seconds off the clock.  If anything, blame that for throwing off Brien's momentum (and prolonging the pressure).



Simple clock management really. There were 6 seconds left and they knew that Brien's kick would take 4 seconds off the clock, thus leaving the Steelers with 2 seconds left and the possibility of a kick-off return. 
But with the 2 second play the time would run out with the kick.


----------



## Captain Tagon (Jan 16, 2005)

GentleGiant said:
			
		

> Simple clock management really. There were 6 seconds left and they knew that Brien's kick would take 4 seconds off the clock, thus leaving the Steelers with 2 seconds left and the possibility of a kick-off return.
> But with the 2 second play the time would run out with the kick.





Except it extended the kick and served no real purpose.


----------



## drothgery (Jan 16, 2005)

Stone Angel said:
			
		

> IF the Colts make it through Foxborough today I really think that Pittsburgh has their number. A slow grinding running game slowing the pace of the game down and keeping Indy's offense off of the field.




... but if the Steelers get down by a couple of touchdowns quickly (and that's very possible), then Big Ben has to try and keep up with Manning in a throwing contest, and, well, he looked very much like a rookie yesterday.


----------



## Captain Tagon (Jan 16, 2005)

drothgery said:
			
		

> ... but if the Steelers get down by a couple of touchdowns quickly (and that's very possible), then Big Ben has to try and keep up with Manning in a throwing contest, and, well, he looked very much like a rookie yesterday.





But will he look like a rookie next week? Look at it this way. The Ravens slowed down the Eagles defense and still lost while the Steelers then killed the Eagles. The Ravens slowed down the Colts offense and still lost...


----------



## Crothian (Jan 16, 2005)

There is a slight difference between the Jets defense and the Colts defense.  Plus, the Steelers have done a nice job of scoring fast and firt and grabbing early leads.  Look what they did to the Patriots.

But we get ahead of ourselves.  Eagles of Vikings and Colts over Patriots are my predictions, but I'm really thinking that second game might go the other way......


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 16, 2005)

Captain Tagon said:
			
		

> Except it extended the kick and served no real purpose.



Erm, yes, it served the purpose I just wrote, to make sure the Steelers didn't have any time left for a kick-off return. Sure, it added 1 or 2 yards more, so it was a 43 instead of a 41 yard FG attempt. But as was evident, the distance wasn't the problem, since it had plenty of height, it just wasn't accurate enough.


----------



## Stone Angel (Jan 16, 2005)

When it was apparent that the Jets would run another play I really thought they were gonna go for lateral movement to hit Briens sweetspot plust they wanted the steelers to have no chance of a possession at all.


The Seraph of Earth and Stone


----------



## NTZ (Jan 16, 2005)

Anxiously awaiting the Pats - Colts game.    

After watching the Steelers - Jets I'm glad the Patriots have Vinatieri.   

NTZ


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 16, 2005)

WOAH! That HAS to be the luckiest TD of the season!!!!


----------



## Mark (Jan 16, 2005)

Vikings have just been given a major, MAJOR gift.  If they can't comeback now, and at least make a game out of this, they simply don't deserve to move ahead. Pre-challenge-NFL, this game is virtually over and the Eagles advance.


----------



## Crothian (Jan 16, 2005)

The NFC showed what we already knew, there was a huge difference in the amount of talent between Phil and Atlanta verse the rest of the division.  The NFC divsional games have really not been that good.  But I'm hoping for a hell of agreat Championship game.  4 times for Phily, and 4 different opponents...the last three all from the NFC south.


----------



## Stone Angel (Jan 16, 2005)

Woot gettin stoked for the Pats Colts game!! Vikings just scored but only 2 minutes left and it's running out fast. The Vikings just didn't take enough chances downfield I think. 


The Seraph of Earth and Stone


----------



## Crothian (Jan 16, 2005)

and the snow starts to fall in New England...this could be interesting....


----------



## Captain Tagon (Jan 16, 2005)

GentleGiant said:
			
		

> Erm, yes, it served the purpose I just wrote, to make sure the Steelers didn't have any time left for a kick-off return. Sure, it added 1 or 2 yards more, so it was a 43 instead of a 41 yard FG attempt. But as was evident, the distance wasn't the problem, since it had plenty of height, it just wasn't accurate enough.





No, taking two seconds off the clock and going backwards serves no purpose. Taking time off the clock and running an actual play to move the ball sideways or to gain some yardage does serve a purpose. This is the playoffs, play conservative and die.


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 16, 2005)

Captain Tagon said:
			
		

> No, taking two seconds off the clock and going backwards serves no purpose. Taking time off the clock and running an actual play to move the ball sideways or to gain some yardage does serve a purpose. This is the playoffs, play conservative and die.



I agree that they should have moved laterally instead of backwards, no question about that, but saying that what they did served no purpose is only half-true at best.


----------



## Captain Tagon (Jan 16, 2005)

GentleGiant said:
			
		

> I agree that they should have moved laterally instead of backwards, no question about that, but saying that what they did served no purpose is only half-true at best.





Well in the scheme of things it did serve no purpose as they lost the game.


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 16, 2005)

Captain Tagon said:
			
		

> Well in the scheme of things it did serve no purpose as they lost the game.



Of course... but hindsight is always 20/20


----------



## Crothian (Jan 16, 2005)

wow, what a really close and frustrated game this must be.....


----------



## Mark (Jan 16, 2005)

Man, Stokley can take a hit!


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 16, 2005)

Mark said:
			
		

> Man, Stokley can take a hit!



And what a hit!!! Booya!


----------



## Stone Angel (Jan 16, 2005)

And he took it like a man. Weather worsen Colts get a little rythm and are on the board. That was a beautiful trick play too, to bad it didn't work!


The Seraph of Earth and Stone


----------



## Crothian (Jan 16, 2005)

and now the Pats drive...as long as the Colts can keep holding them to field goals, they have a good chance.  But Dillon seems to be running better......


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 16, 2005)

Wohoo! A 10 minute drive and a touchdown! Oh yeah, now we're talking!
Tag team running game and a few well placed passes, that's the key to success it seems


----------



## noretoc (Jan 16, 2005)

Balance and disruption is how it is going this year.  Keep your attack balanced and unpredictable.  Do the small stuff perfectly, and have you defence make small but troubling moves.


----------



## Laurel (Jan 17, 2005)

WAHOOOOO! Eagles won!

As many have said the Vikings did a good job though.  They got the ball, they made good plays moving the ball.  THey just missed that final stage.

For the first tiem this season the eagles looked like one team.  THey had an offence with more then two people, and they had a defense that held the line.  They did a few plays with amazement and the rest with precision.  If that team had not shown up to phili today the vikings very well could have been the ones moving one.

Next week Eagles vs. Atlanta

Now to continue the hope that the colts will pull ahead!


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 17, 2005)

Okay, no way the Colts are coming back after that. 
Go Pats!

Edit: P.s. Bruschi is my hero


----------



## Crothian (Jan 17, 2005)

yaq, that's game.....damn, I was hoping the Colts would win since the Steelers would have a better chance to beat them.


----------



## Pseudonym (Jan 17, 2005)

Ah, a fumble and a recovery.  Great game.  I just hope I don't loose power before it is over.


----------



## Crothian (Jan 17, 2005)

So, that leaves us: Atlanta verse Phil and Pats verse Steelers.  

I'll give Atlanta the edge in their game.  Both offenses will be slowed down since both defenses are better then other teams they've faced this playoff, but the Atlanta O is better then the Phili O.  But as usually it will depend on Vick and if the Phili D can keep him contained.  

The second game I'mm picking the Steelers but just because that's my team.  It's going to be a physical game and running to set up the pass will determine the winner.  

4 teams left, all with really good defensives and running games.


----------



## NTZ (Jan 17, 2005)

Pats @ Steelers next week.  A rematch from this season, hopefully with different results!  

In the first game the Pats didn't have Dillon and T.Law went out early with an injury.  I am hoping Dillon will be the difference next week.  And I am hoping Seymour will be back and ready to play.

Today's Pats - Colts game was fun to watch as a Pats fan.  Bruschi had a big game and I think Mcginest had a lot of great plays as well.  I would never have thought the Pats could hold the Colts to 3 points!

NTZ


----------



## Dimwhit (Jan 17, 2005)

Hey Crothian. I'm right there with you! The Falcons are my team, and I'm hoping they play the Steelers. That would be a fun Superbowl. Here's to hoping.


----------



## Mark (Jan 17, 2005)

Goodnight Colts!  Better luck next year!


----------



## drothgery (Jan 17, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> I'll give Atlanta the edge in their game.  Both offenses will be slowed down since both defenses are better then other teams they've faced this playoff, but the Atlanta O is better then the Phili O.  But as usually it will depend on Vick and if the Phili D can keep him contained.




I've been horribly wrong in forecasting most of the playoffs, but how do you figure Atlanta's got a better offense than Philly? The Eagles have superior numbers in points per game and yards per game, and, unlike Atlanta, have a legitimate passing game.



			
				Crothian said:
			
		

> The second game I'mm picking the Steelers but just because that's my team.  It's going to be a physical game and running to set up the pass will determine the winner.
> 
> 4 teams left, all with really good defensives and running games.




Again, I don't see this at all. Philly's running game was 10th in the NFC (they're the #4 passing offense). New England's running game ranks 6th in the AFC (they're also the #6 passing offense); what makes them a powerful offense is their balance. Atlanta and Pittsburgh are run-oriented, but the Falcons beat the statistically worst team ever to make the playoffs in order to advance.

The Falcons have the #6 defense in the NFC by both yards and points, so rating them as anything better than slightly above-average is pushing it. New England is #2 by yards and #6 by points; Pittsburgh is #1 by both yards and points.

My guess is that Philly is clearly superior to Atlanta, and will win the game convincingly.They're better an offense, better on defense, the home team, and have far more playoff experience. Besides, I'm a Syracuse guy, and so will always take McNabb over Vick.

Pittsburgh and New England are more evenly matched; the Steelers superior defense against the Patriots superior offense. I think that New England's offensive edge is greater than the Pittsburgh's defensive edge and New England isn't starting a rookie QB. But the Steelers are at home, and it takes a lot of luck to get to 3 Super Bowls in four years. Hmm... I guess I favor throwing the ball, so I'll take New England by a field goal.


----------



## Crothian (Jan 17, 2005)

drothgery said:
			
		

> I've been horribly wrong in forecasting most of the playoffs, but how do you figure Atlanta's got a better offense than Philly? The Eagles have superior numbers in points per game and yards per game, and, unlike Atlanta, have a legitimate passing game.




No TO.  You don't lose your best reciever, one of the best in the league and not have your passing game suffer.


----------



## drothgery (Jan 17, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> No TO.  You don't lose your best reciever, one of the best in the league and not have your passing game suffer.




That'd be a reasonable assumpiton, except that there was pretty much no Westbrook (the Eagles other playmaker, both as a reciever and a running back) for most of the second half of the season. Also the Eagles tanked their last two games; if anything, the raw numbers understate how much better they are than the Falcons. The more sophisticated DVOA rankings at www.FootballOutsiders.com put the Eagles as the #4 team in the NFL, and the Falcons as #19.


----------



## DaveStebbins (Jan 17, 2005)

Stone Angel said:
			
		

> Oh Jets what happened, man I don't even know what to say about that one. I just stared at the TV in disbelief  I can't even imagine how Brien feels right now.



No, but I bet Scott Norwood can...


----------



## GlassJaw (Jan 17, 2005)

Steelers looked VERY beatable in the Jets game, and that was at home.  If it wasn't for a stupid kicker, they should have lost.  Pats looked unstoppable today.  Big Ben is in for a wake-up call next Sun.  All the critics looked like fools for picking the Colts.  Pats are already favored next week by 3 against a 15-1 team at home.  Go figure.

My predictions:

Pats over Steelers
Falcons over Eagles

Pats over Falcons in the SB


----------



## Crothian (Jan 17, 2005)

drothgery said:
			
		

> The more sophisticated DVOA rankings at www.FootballOutsiders.com put the Eagles as the #4 team in the NFL, and the Falcons as #19.




I haven't looked at it, but any system that ranks a team in the NFC Championship game as 19th in the league is flawed.  It probably pays too much attention to stats and not enough to the bottom line, winning.  At the very least having the sixth best record in the NFL has to make the team a little better then 19th.


----------



## Crothian (Jan 17, 2005)

GlassJaw said:
			
		

> Steelers looked VERY beatable in the Jets game, and that was at home.  If it wasn't for a stupid kicker, they should have lost.  Pats looked unstoppable today.  Big Ben is in for a wake-up call next Sun.  All the critics looked like fools for picking the Colts.  Pats are already favored next week by 3 against a 15-1 team at home.  Go figure.




The Pats are the winners of 2 of the last 3 superbowls.  THe Pats have played very imporessively and win the big games.  Pats are going to be the favored team and they deserve to be.  

Oh, and the Colts looked unstopible for much of the year that's how the critics and most people picked wrong.


----------



## drothgery (Jan 17, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> I haven't looked at it, but any system that ranks a team in the NFC Championship game as 19th in the league is flawed.  It probably pays too much attention to stats and not enough to the bottom line, winning.  At the very least having the sixth best record in the NFL has to make the team a little better then 19th.




Would you take the Falcons over _any_ AFC playoff team, or even any of the AFC near-miss teams (Buffalo, Baltimore, Jacksonville) on a neutral field? I'm guessing the answer is no. Also grant that the Eagles are better than the Falcons. So they're to #11 without dropping into stat-head territory.

The rest of the Falcons status by their rankings is a bit more complicated. They're statistically an average team that ran away with their division by being very lucky while the other teams in the division -- none significantly better or worse -- were unlucky, and which beat a truly awful, but just as lucky, St. Louis team (#30 in the NFL) to advance to the NFC championship game.

It's probably also worth noting that there's not all that much difference in their ratings between #12 Carolina and #21 Green Bay; the big drop-offs are from #3 Indy to #4 Philly, from #9 Baltimore to #10 Cinci, from #21 Green Bay to the #22 Giants, and from the #30 Rams to the #31 Bears.


----------



## Crothian (Jan 17, 2005)

I'd rate the Falcons over Baltimore, Bills, and Denver at least.  Against the Jets and Chargers and Jacksonville I'd call it close to even.  

I always hear how teams are lucky, and luck has to be near impossible to judge.  I mean we all know OSU was lucky to win the national championship, and the Patriots were lucky with their season in 2001.  At least those teasm were called lucky at the time.


----------



## Stone Angel (Jan 17, 2005)

AAAAAAAAAAAAND we are crushed. Dang I just don't know if we will ever beat the Pats. They just outplayed us and played great. 

Looking forward to the playoffs next weekend I am gonna take the Pats over the Steelers thinking that their experience will take them through the big game.

I am going for the Eagles over Atlanta next week. For some reason it is just hard for me to take atlanta seriously. I understand that they are good and they had to be good to get this far but I just see Philly as a better team.


The Seraph of Earth and Stone


----------



## msd (Jan 17, 2005)

This one really can't be pinned on Manning (believe me...I spent half the night trying to figure out a way how ).  The guy can't do his stuff if he is never on the field and let's face it, he was practically never on the field.

The other thing is that this "banged up secondary" routine is getting a little out of date.  Most of the injuries that people are talking about (mainly Law and Poole) happened in the first couple weeks of the season.  Our "banged up secondary" filled with misfits and second and third string guys did manage to go about 10-1 after those injuries picking up a little bit of experience on the way.

I actually feel kinda bad for Manning.


----------



## drothgery (Jan 17, 2005)

Crothian said:
			
		

> I always hear how teams are lucky, and luck has to be near impossible to judge.  I mean we all know OSU was lucky to win the national championship, and the Patriots were lucky with their season in 2001.  At least those teasm were called lucky at the time.




Luck is pretty easy to judge. When a stastically unimpressive team wins a lot, they're either lucky or playing other bad teams. And it's pretty easy to see, too; usually teams that massively overachieve (like the 2001 Pats) take a step back the next year when it comes to wins and losses, even if they improved. The Pats were able to turn that 2001 team into the base of a dominant team (the statisticcally very impressive 2003 and 2004 teams) largely because Bellicheck understood that he'd just had a charmed season, and didn't stand pat.


----------



## drothgery (Jan 17, 2005)

Stone Angel said:
			
		

> I am going for the Eagles over Atlanta next week. For some reason it is just hard for me to take atlanta seriously. I understand that they are good and they had to be good to get this far but I just see Philly as a better team.




There's good reason not to take the Falcons serously. Statistically, Atlanta's a mediocre team. Philly is a good team. The Pats and Steelers are the two best teams in the NFL -- and the Pats are better. Stats can't say who's going to win any one game, but they can say who's likely to win, and the Eagles should be heavily favored.


----------



## Captain Tagon (Jan 17, 2005)

I'm going to take the Falcons and the Steelers in the Super Bowl. I really want to see if that line backing core can contain Vick at least a little.


----------



## Dimwhit (Jan 17, 2005)

Well, I have to pick the Falcons, since they're my team. If they play Philly like they did the Rams, I think they have a shot. Should be an interesting game: a team that doesn't let QBs run (Eagles) vs a team with the best running QB (Falcons). Something has got to give...


----------



## Crothian (Jan 17, 2005)

Captain Tagon said:
			
		

> I'm going to take the Falcons and the Steelers in the Super Bowl. I really want to see if that line backing core can contain Vick at least a little.




Heck, I wouldn't mine seeing the Patriots linebackers contain that run game of the Falcons.....


----------



## Welverin (Jan 18, 2005)

I'm hoping for an Eagles/Steelers Super Bowl, but being a pessimist I expect a similar result to what happened the last time both teams made their respective conference championship games. Plus it scares me that Salisbury is already picking the Eagles to win, if Hoge picks them as well, I know they’ll lose.



			
				Dimwhit said:
			
		

> Well, I'm biased, but Vick has always been an awesome QB.




No he’s not, he’s an average to poor QB, who is the best runner outside of Barry Sanders from the last twenty years or so. He is however an awesome _player_, and once his passing ability comes around he’ll be an awesome quarterback.

In fact I think Vick is in the same place in his career McNabb was at a two or three years ago, not quite developed passing skills, no quality receivers to throw to, and the need to rely on his feet to make plays.



			
				Silver Moon said:
			
		

> They even got a crack about that into the opening of Saturday Night Live.   I think he would have been forgiven for the first one, it was mighty long and he barely missed it.  The second one however earned him permanent Goat status.




Maybe, but it shouldn’t. This one lies at the feet of the coaching staff, right along with the Scott Norwood miss, 43 and 47 field goals aren’t gimmies, especially in a stadium like Heinz Field, and to settle for long field goals like that is a sure way to lose a game.



			
				drothgery said:
			
		

> Pittsburgh and New England are more evenly matched; the Steelers superior defense against the Patriots superior offense. I think that New England's offensive edge is greater than the Pittsburgh's defensive edge and New England isn't starting a rookie QB. >snip<




I’ve been thinking since Saturday night that maybe Pittsburgh should play Maddox, start Ben, but if he starts to slip make a change. Ben’s play has being going down over the course of the season, so…



			
				GlassJaw said:
			
		

> Steelers looked VERY beatable in the Jets game, and that was at home.  If it wasn't for a stupid kicker, they should have lost.




Keep in mind though that A) The Jets played the Steelers close in the regular season (closer than the Pats in fact), B) have a good D and a good running game, so were hardly chopped liver, and C) Were only close in the game because of a punt return touchdown and an interception return TD, or in other words the Steelers defense *shutdown* the Jets.

So don’t go over reacting to hat happened in the previous week, just like a lot of people did after the wild card round.



			
				msd said:
			
		

> This one really can't be pinned on Manning (believe me...I spent half the night trying to figure out a way how ).  The guy can't do his stuff if he is never on the field and let's face it, he was practically never on the field.




I’d say the third biggest problem was the case of Seahwakitis his receivers had at the start of the game, which fueled the second biggest problem the Colts had in the game, the case of here we go again syndrome.

Of course the biggest problem was the fact the Pats are just a better team.



			
				Dimwhit said:
			
		

> Well, I have to pick the Falcons, since they're my team. If they play Philly like they did the Rams, I think they have a shot.




Please, that's no way to judge this game. It's similar to how all the talking heads gave the Rams and Vikings a chance against the Falcons and Eagles, they saw impressive performances in the previous games and failed to take into consideration that the teams they beat were _bad_, so judging how ATL will do against PHI based on their drubbing of the Rams is misguided at best.

To sum up, predicting how a team will do against someone based on their play against inferior competition is a mistake.

The Rams, Vikings, Seahawks, and even the Packers didn't deserve to be in the playoffs, and only got in because everyone behind them was even worse. The NFL should excluded them given the Falcons and Eagles an extra bye and a pass straight to the NFC championship game and had a few exhibition games in between with the also rans to fill timeslots.


----------



## drothgery (Jan 23, 2005)

drothgery said:
			
		

> There's good reason not to take the Falcons serously. Statistically, Atlanta's a mediocre team. Philly is a good team. The Pats and Steelers are the two best teams in the NFL -- and the Pats are better. Stats can't say who's going to win any one game, but they can say who's likely to win, and the Eagles should be heavily favored.




Can I be smug now that the Eagles have won handily?


----------



## DaveStebbins (Jan 23, 2005)

drothgery said:
			
		

> Can I be smug now that the Eagles have won handily?



I think you've earned that.


----------



## GentleGiant (Jan 24, 2005)

Pittsburgh needs a SERIOUS comeback to make it now... Hehehe


----------



## Pseudonym (Jan 24, 2005)

GentleGiant said:
			
		

> Pittsburgh needs a SERIOUS comeback to make it now... Hehehe




 They had a rough first half, and that TD after the challenged call was a tough blow.  I'm all for NE, but I'm not willing to count the Steelers out yet.

 On a side note, if it ends up being Philly/Pittsburg for the Superbowl, who does the governer bet against?  Does he sit out and it go to the mayoral level?  Has this happened before?


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## GentleGiant (Jan 24, 2005)

Pseudonym said:
			
		

> They had a rough first half, and that TD after the challenged call was a tough blow.  I'm all for NE, but I'm not willing to count the Steelers out yet.



Hmmm, yes, maybe I spoke in haste...   
Gulp... well, I have confidence in the Pats, they'll pull through


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## NTZ (Jan 24, 2005)

Whew!  Nice to have the Patriots back in the Superbowl.   

Hold the Colts to 3 and then score 41 v. Steelers.  Pretty good stuff.

First line for SB is Pats favored by 6.

NTZ


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## d20Dwarf (Jan 24, 2005)

NTZ said:
			
		

> First line for SB is Pats favored by 6.




Damn, I'm jumping on that quick before someone comes to their senses! Pats by 13, at least.


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## drothgery (Jan 24, 2005)

DaveStebbins said:
			
		

> I think you've earned that.




Of course, I also thought Pats/Steelers would be close, but Big Ben apperently turned back into a pumpkin last weekend.


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## DaveStebbins (Jan 25, 2005)

drothgery said:
			
		

> Of course, I also thought Pats/Steelers would be close, but Big Ben apperently turned back into a pumpkin last weekend.



Don't lay it all at Ben's feet, the vaunted Steeler defense allowed a mess of points and was just plain outplayed by the Pats offense. Of course, since I don't like either of them, I'll be rooting for Philly in the Super Bowl (and watching the commercials more closely than the game).


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## Crothian (Jan 25, 2005)

DaveStebbins said:
			
		

> Don't lay it all at Ben's feet, the vaunted Steeler defense allowed a mess of points and was just plain outplayed by the Pats offense. Of course, since I don't like either of them, I'll be rooting for Philly in the Super Bowl (and watching the commercials more closely than the game).




They could not place pressure on the QB like they needed to.  Give Brady time and he'll dice any defense as he did.


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