# Rules for a Successful PBP



## GlassEye (Mar 15, 2010)

I'm sure this has come up before (so if you have a link I'd like to see it) but I'm considering running a game here and want to know:  What do you all think contributes to running a successful play-by-post game?  I'd like to hear what you have to say about all aspects of running a good pbp game, from recruiting to posting, necessary rules modifications (especially concerning combats), any ideas about every aspect of running a game here.


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## Dr Simon (Mar 15, 2010)

Keep things moving.

I don't think you need any specific rules mods (I play pretty much by the book), but don't be afraid to post actions for a character who hasn't responded for a while. Maps are *extremely* useful for running any kind of complex combat, otherwise its very easy to forget who is where, fighting what, over the course of a PbP fight.

In fact, take that and run with it - it's extremely easy to forget who, what and why for _everything_ with the extended time course. Keep each individual adventure quite short and simple, and you'll keep interest up. Example: I've seen a few attempts to run Shackled City on these boards, but as soon as they get to Jzadirune (big dungeon crawl), the game stalls. I'm impressed by Strahd for maintaining not only Temple of Elemental Evil but also Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth.

Useful housekeeping tip:
Reserve the first couple of posts in your OOC thread so that you can add in NPCs, treasure found and other details as they come up.


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## Shayuri (Mar 15, 2010)

Also: Have a Rogues Gallery, and _link to it in your sig._

People won't always have access to their sheet when they post, and the RG thread will fall off the forum in a matter of weeks. Keeping it linked in your sig means no one ever is without their sheet.


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## Scott DeWar (Mar 15, 2010)

We as players have a thread to link our own characters. did you know that? look at my sig for an example.


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## Theroc (Mar 15, 2010)

Scott DeWar said:


> We as players have a thread to link our own characters. did you know that? look at my sig for an example.




I only have a threadlink to my Living Characters, none from the talking the talk forum.  I LOVE when my DM's put the games in their sig, or in the first post of the OOC area(if it's in use), so I can easily access the RG.

I would have done the whole signature thing for all characters... but I'm lazy and that would take quite awhile.


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## kinem (Mar 15, 2010)

My advice:

- Establish up front how often you expect people to post.  Establish a time limit for how long you will wait for combat posts before acting for the PC.  In practice, acting for a PC _sucks_ because it could lead to a major plot fork - does the PC cast sleep or fireball?  Does he sound the retreat?

- Use a short adventure.  PBP games take a long time and are liable to peter out before you get very far. OTOH, you can always go for a sequel if things are working well.

- Limit party size to 4 or 5.  Having more players can provide the illusion of making things go faster because it's more likely that someone will post something on any given day.  It will come back to haunt you when everyone has to post about something, such as in combat or when voting on a path.  In the end, games with fewer players tend to get more done per day.

- The DM should make most rolls. That means that a player can roll on invisiblecastle if he wants and post the result, but otherwise you roll.  _Never_ ask players to roll something, like a saving throw or spot check, and post the results; you do it.  In a face to face game it increases the sense of player participation; in PBP it just slows things down.

- For combat, don't roll initiative for each PC.  Roll for the party as a whole, using their best init bonus, and for the NPCs as a whole.  When it's the PCs' turn to act, whoever posts first acts first.

- Don't use many random encounters.  Every encounter should either be relevant to the plot, or guarding some area, or else "cool" in some way such as making the PCs figure out how to deal with a new monster.  If the module had a lot of random encounters, you may need to beef up the fixed encounters to compensate.  Even fixed encounters in a module can be removed if they serve no purpose other than wearing down the party's resources; just beef up the interesting encounters.

- Don't give too much importance to any one PC.  You never know who is going to leave the game. If you have a 'chosen one' PC and the player leaves, you'll be stuck.  Also, other players will be rightly upset if you lavish attention and magic items on one PC.  Doing so may be tempting because some people post more than others.  Don't get into a long back-and-forth between a PC and an NPC while other PCs are left out.

- Don't use "DMPCs", which are NPCs who travel with the party and outshine the PCs.  Players hate that.  You might think it's easy to avoid, but that could change when players start dropping out, and you are left with ex-PCs who might be the only ones able to heal or cast fireballs.  Get rid of XPCs ASAP, whenever it would make sense in context.

- Some PBP players are jerks.  He will post normally one day.  Then it's his turn to do something important.  Then you wait a few days and there's been no new post from him.  That's actually rather normal even for a "daily post" game, so you wait a few more days.  You post OOC asking if he's around.  Eventually you realize he's not coming back.  Expect it.  He's not dead; perhaps in a couple of months you'll see him post again, apologizing for not telling you what was up.  If you take him back he'll post normally for a few months.  Then he's gone AWOL again.


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## renau1g (Mar 16, 2010)

kinem said:


> - Some PBP players are jerks.  He will post normally one day.  Then it's his turn to do something important.  Then you wait a few days and there's been no new post from him.  That's actually rather normal even for a "daily post" game, so you wait a few more days.  You post OOC asking if he's around.  Eventually you realize he's not coming back.  Expect it.  He's not dead; perhaps in a couple of months you'll see him post again, apologizing for not telling you what was up.  If you take him back he'll post normally for a few months.  Then he's gone AWOL again.






I think that you need to expect player attrition in PbP, I usually assume that about 1 player will drop in a short adventure. I've run 4 over in L4W and have had a player drop in each of them without warning. I also concur to remove them ASAP from the game. I usually allow one of the other PC's to control for the current battle (if it's in one). 

One thing I've learned is to never take someone leaving personally as you don't know what's going on in their lives. 

The others covered the main points, you need decent pace (like 1 post every 2 days at least), maps for combat (whether Maptools, excel, or ASCII) assuming you're running 3.xe, Pathfinder, or 4e where positioning is very important, one set of inits for players and enemies (increases swinginess, but helps the game tremendously), and cut out extraneous encounters. Each battle should be important or cool.


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## GlassEye (Mar 16, 2010)

Wow, good pointers.  Thanks, guys.    Still willing to hear more if anyone has anything else to add.


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## Theroc (Mar 16, 2010)

I don't know of any concrete rules, but I'd also say it's a good idea to make sure the players know what to expect from you as as DM, as many DM's have differing styles and the like, so everyone begins on the same page, to avoid confusion or any potential player infighting.  (Character infighting may not be a problem, but when players start fighting, it can get ugly).  I'm sure that's mostly common sense though.


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## HolyMan (Mar 16, 2010)

GlassEye said:


> Wow, good pointers. Thanks, guys.  Still willing to hear more if anyone has anything else to add.




Words of wisdom from a Holyman:

HAVE FUN!! 

HM


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## Dr Simon (Mar 16, 2010)

On player attrition, my experience is that the drop-out rate is usually highest before the game has started, or within the first few posts. People will submit excitedly to your call for players, then never produce a character, or decide that they don't have the time after all. At the beginning of play, some players will post for a bit, then perhaps decide that the style isn't for them, and drop out. Once you've got a hard core of 3-4 players they tend to stick with the game unless real life intervenes, if you don't let it stagnate. 

Although most people on here will respond to a game using D&D 4 or 3.x, PbPs are also very useful for trying out other systems, or for wierd one-off scenarios. This also goes for players; don't be afraid to let them try out wierd or unusual combos. The impact of any potentially broken characters is less in PbP because they amount of actual play time is less.

You will probably fail if you try to run an epic 1st-20th campaign (says he, running Curse of the Crimson Throne), as it will take you most of your life (I've been running Edge of Anarchy since Sept 2008, with a very regular group of players, and we're just about done). Hewligan seems to be doing well with Rise of the Runelords as well, so it can be done.

Allowing the players to have lengthy planning sessions tends not to work in PbP. It can waste an entire evening of a table-top game, so think how long it can take online. And that's without a nice map and props to play with.

Free-form experience tends to work quite well, and there's no reason why not unless you've got a crafter in the group. Simply let the characters level up when you feel like they've done enough, and make it faster than the usual rate.


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## covaithe (Mar 16, 2010)

kinem said:


> - Use a short adventure.  PBP games take a long time and are liable to peter out before you get very far. OTOH, you can always go for a sequel if things are working well.




This.  In my experience, PbP games start off with a burst of enthusiasm.  People are excited about new characters, new settings, new challenges, and can't wait to post.  It's great.  But sooner or later, every game slows down.  Someone gets busy at work, or goes on vacation, or gets sick, or loses their internet connection, or just has a case of writer's block.  While waiting for them, everyone else's posting rate falls off a bit, and it gradually... relaxes.  The longer the game goes on, the slower it gets.  Eventually, it will grind to a halt completely.  A dedicated DM and players can slow this trend, even reverse it for a while with effort, but never stop it completely.  Exactly how long it takes for a game to slow to a crawl depends greatly on the DM and the players and how much they put into it.  It might be a week, or six months, or, with an exceptional group, it might last years.   But sooner or later, _every_ PbP game will die of inactivity.  

That's okay; it's nobody's fault, it's just the nature of the medium.  As DM, the trick is to accept this and plan for it, by making sure your adventure finishes before the pace slows to the point where it becomes work rather than fun.  How?  Lots of ways, but it boils down to:  1) do what you can to keep the pace up, and 2) tighten your adventure to the bare essentials. 

I won't go deeply into 1, except to note that the easiest way to screw this up is to take on too many games at once.  We've all known, or been, someone who was having a great time playing or running a few games, and, having some extra free time, decided to fill it with more games, only to find that that free time disappeared a month down the road.  That's a quick recipe for burnout.  

With regards to 2, plan your encounters sparingly.  Use fewer encounters, but (depending on your players, your system, and the needs of the story, of course) make them slightly tougher.  If your adventure calls for 6 encounters, granting 1 level's worth of XP/treasure, consider finding a way to cut it down to 3 or 4 encounters, and simply award the same xp/treasure that you would have normally.  Combine encounters:  have the Big Bad fight alongside his lieutenant, rather than making them separate encounters, and drop some of the mooks and henchmen to balance it.  Be very cautious using traps; nothing will slow your party's posting rate down like the feeling that they have to specify all their movements explicitly and in detail.


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## Theroc (Mar 16, 2010)

Covaithe said:
			
		

> I won't go deeply into 1, except to note that the easiest way to screw this up is to take on too many games at once. We've all known, or been, someone who was having a great time playing or running a few games, and, having some extra free time, decided to fill it with more games, only to find that that free time disappeared a month down the road. That's a quick recipe for burnout.




Yeah... ~looks at his 17+ games he's struggling to keep up with...~


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## Myth and Legend (Mar 17, 2010)

You are wise to learn from the mistakes of others  My advice:

Recruit via your own biased opinion, don't do a first come-first served game, unless you want to run a very loose and fluid adventure where the main story progresses via NPCs/DMPCs and the PCs come and go. ENWolrd regulars with over 500 posts are less likely to go MIA than some brand new guy with 5 posts who does his PC sheet 30 min after you post the game, since he's so excited and all, and then gets bored out of his short attention span and leaves ENWorld.

Definitely plan out your adventure and stat out your NPCs long before the party encounters them. Otherwise you'll stall your game trying to figure out the mechanics behind your cool NPC ideas. (this is where i'm at right now)

Make sure to let the players know if this will be a hack n' slash or a RP heavy game. I advise RP heavy - roleplaying and long dscriptions/thoughts etc. are the forte of PbP. Combat is tedious at best.

Reward your players, and make sure the game is about your players. Don't get carried away with NPCs and don't try to force the plot on your players. Your ideas might be great, but the players are nuts! Literally! The will think of stuff you had never foreseen. Roll with it and adapt.

Don't try to "nerf" your players by denying them items/spells/classes. Just make encounters that would be hard for a regular party.

Don't allow things you can't balance against without making TPK-possible encounters that will be passed only if one (broken char) plays right.

Do not guard the party with a plot shield - they should understand that your world has consequences.

Don't pull stuff out of your arse if it will seem artificial and patched to the players.

There's more but i have to go  Plus i'm pretty new at DMing as well!


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## Dr Simon (Mar 18, 2010)

Myth and Legend said:


> Reward your players, and make sure the game is about your players. Don't get carried away with NPCs and don't try to force the plot on your players. Your ideas might be great, but the players are nuts! Literally! The will think of stuff you had never foreseen. Roll with it and adapt.




A lot of your other points are equally valid for face to face gaming, but I would like to add to this point and say that PbPs are excellent for this style of play. IN face-to-face, if your players throw you a curve you have a few minutes at most to adapt. In PbP you can go away for a day, muse over the consequences and roll with it much more smoothly.


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## renau1g (Mar 18, 2010)

Good point Dr. Simon. There's not a lot of advantages PbP has over RL gaming, but one of them is the ability to consider your actions (on both sides of the "screen"). Also, forgot to mention this, but it allows you to be more descriptive in your text also if you enjoy that part of the game.


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## Scott DeWar (Mar 18, 2010)

Dr. Simon makes a great point, hoever some dm's dont have inter net access at home and can only do this at work on week days or just the oppisite, where they don't have acces at work and have to wait until they get home.


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## Nebten (Mar 19, 2010)

Remove individual initiative. All it does is slow things down. I've seen DM's ask their players to roll initiative, then you have to wait for all the rolls to come in.

Next you have to wait for that one guy to get his one turn in, while others are chomping at the bit ready to post. 

If you do group initative, it will keep the momentum going. Players go, monsters go, rinse & repeat. Some players already post out of turn. Then when their turn comes up in the initiative, the events have changed and they have to re-cont actions.

I would also auto-post for people who don't in a predetermined time frame. Remember as a DM, you are accomidating to all your players, not just one.


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## Binder Fred (Mar 20, 2010)

I love the way Ryryguy is maximizing the use of Sblocks for perception and knowledge rolls in his Food of the Gods campaign (As explained here in Notes for Players, and demonstrated in the rest of the thread). Could be something to consider for other campaigns.


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## covaithe (Mar 20, 2010)

Binder Fred said:


> I love the way Ryryguy is maximizing the use of Sblocks for perception and knowledge rolls in his Food of the Gods campaign (As explained here in Notes for Players, and demonstrated in the rest of the thread). Could be something to consider for other campaigns.




Yeah, I've been impressed by that, too.


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## Kobold Stew (Mar 21, 2010)

This is a great question. The answer I offer is not from the perspective of a DM, but of a (frustrated) player. 

I'd say over the past 3-4 years, I have been accepted into about ten games, none of which has lasted more than two months of real play; most less. Almost all of them has stopped during the first combat, which drags into eternity.

Pbp are special games. I think they have a great potential as a medium for rpgs, I think, but I've yet to experience it over a reasonable period of time. I keep hoping, though.

Here are four and a half observations based on that experience: 

1. Four or five of the games have stopped because the DM got tired. Be sure that you can commit the time to running a game. 

2. Combat needs to go quickly. The previous comments about initiative are part of that, but two weeks of RL is too long for a single combat round. Players get bored. Be sure you know how you are going to represent the map (assuming there is one) and how you will keep it updated. 

(2b). Even though games have had a post-every-48hrs or whatever guideline, in combat weeks can go by without anything for a player to do, as the initiative order clicks through. For those of us who hit refresh many times a day, this builds the frustration. If I were running a game, I'd be sure everyone had the opportunity to post (and affect things) every three days. 

3. While I agree that some posters with only a post or two might drop quickly, I have seen multiple games broken by one poster with a high post count on this forum who regularly has prolonged absences. There's no real rule, but great amounts of goodwill (from me at least) is gained by considering posters who aren't already in three or more games. 

4. I would start assuming that players will get to level up once (I'm thinking D+D, 3.5 or 4e here). If they get more, that's only a win, but I'd suggest you start in what you think is the sweet spot -- if that's level 1, then power to you; if it's 5-6, 11-12, level 20; whatever. But let the players be where you think they can have best fun. I have yet to level up in a pbp game.

I hope this helps.


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## covaithe (Mar 21, 2010)

I feel your pain, KS.  I think that's one of the reasons the Living Worlds here are so successful.  They're designed specifically to address many of the problems you mentioned, and they seem to be doing a reasonable job.  In L4W, we have characters who started at level 1 and have reached level 6 over about a year and a half of play, spanning three or four successfully completed adventures.  I think we've only ever had one or two abandoned adventures, and the players in those were given partial rewards and returned to the tavern, and have since gone on to other, more successful, adventures.


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## renau1g (Mar 21, 2010)

Also in L4W (and LEB) the judges or another DM will usually pick up the reins if a DM disappears. I've picked up two adventures there myself, and I know covaithe has also. There's also a lot of prospective games coming up there so if you're interested now's a good time. The grouped initiative style that most of the DM's there use really works well.

We've got a number of PC's who've gone from 1st to 4th-6th over that year so about every 3 months or so you'd level up.


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## HolyMan (Mar 21, 2010)

In my Off to War campaign I give out XP twice a month. Not getting a reward for posting/playing was one of the things I dislike about some games also. 

Characters who started the game are now LVL 3 and it is only about 9 months old. Not bad for pbp. 

HM


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## Scott DeWar (Mar 21, 2010)

In LEW the judge picks up the game if the dm dissappears as well as L4W and LEB. That is a great rule for the living worlds.


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## Thanee (Mar 21, 2010)

I found it very useful (both for myself and for the players) to have a special topic just to keep information about the campaign handy.

Here's the inevitable example from my own campaign on this site. 

Bye
Thanee


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## GlassEye (Mar 23, 2010)

Kobold Stew, I've experienced some of those very things myself.  It _is_ very frustrating.

Wow, Thanee, that is a really nice thread!  Good idea, great info.  Thanks.


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## pneumatik (Mar 23, 2010)

Because of the pace of pbp I've learned the hard way that I need to prep differently. Normally when I prep I reduce the session to a set of notes that I can almost memorize. During play I skim the notes for an encounter right before that encounter starts and normally play the encounter from memory. Pbp encounters take so long that I've found what I thought my notes said is not what they actually said. There are places where my WotBS pbp deviates from the published adventure for no reason other than because I forgot stuff.

Blatant plug: my WotBS game is restarting after an extended hiatus and looking for new people. I'll have something in the recruitment thread later today.


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