# Munchkin Monk Build



## kha7id7ea (Mar 14, 2011)

Hello all,

I would like help building a optimized monk for an upcoming campaign. We are starting with 2000xp and level adjustments with buyoff are allowed. Furthermore, virtually all source books will be allowed. In addition, we will be using the pathfinder monk instead of the 3.5 version. The DM has modified the half-minotaur template into something more "acceptable to society". The new race/template will be large size, but will not benefit from the size increase. Something along the lines of a large sized human or any race for that matter. I was also considering playing a goliath. 

One idea I had was to play a Lion's Totem Barbarian/ Monk/ Psionic Class, with the tashalatora feat.

Notes
jotunbrud has been house ruled to actually give the character powerful build



Any info will help,

Thanks








Recently the DM has completely nerfed both metamagic and the polymorph/wildshape rules.


----------



## Alexander123 (Mar 14, 2011)

This is a good guide to building optimized monks Beating Batman: Sir Giacomo's Guide to Monks - Giant in the Playground Forums.


----------



## Dandu (Mar 14, 2011)

Yes. I agree. It is a good guide. You should read it and listen to his advice. Everyone agrees it is the best monk guide ever.


----------



## JamesonCourage (Mar 14, 2011)

Dandu said:


> Yes. I agree. It is a good guide. You should read it and listen to his advice. Everyone agrees it is the best monk guide ever.




Is it just me, or did you and a bunch of other people in that thread eventually get banned?


----------



## Ranger19k (Mar 14, 2011)

Clearly banned for too heartily agreeing with the guide's awesomeness


----------



## Empirate (Mar 14, 2011)

To clarify: Sir Giacomo has written perhaps the most misleading "guide" ever. His idea for playing monks is basically: "get lots of cross-class UMD ranks, and burn all your wealth on consumable magic items". It is NOT advisable to follow his suggestions. At least not if you want an optimized build or anything like that...

Also, OP, please refrain from using the term "munchkin" in any but the most crassly pejorative contexts. Optimization and munchkinism have nothing in common with each other.


----------



## JamesonCourage (Mar 14, 2011)

Empirate said:


> To clarify: Sir Giacomo has written perhaps the most misleading "guide" ever. His idea for playing monks is basically: "get lots of cross-class UMD ranks, and burn all your wealth on consumable magic items". It is NOT advisable to follow his suggestions. At least not if you want an optimized build or anything like that...
> 
> Also, OP, please refrain from using the term "munchkin" in any but the most crassly pejorative contexts. Optimization and munchkinism have nothing in common with each other.




Can't give you new experience points yet, but I pretty much agree with your post.


----------



## Icyshadowlord (Mar 14, 2011)

I actually find that guide to be somewhat helpful (actually not...), and very darn amusing. Of course, not everyone can agree on everything. Also, magic items are something EVERYONE USES. It's almost a fact, with the exception being low-fantasy settings or magic-dead ones.

Also, why are you so offended by someone using the word/term munchkin, Empirate? To some people they really don't make a difference.


----------



## Alexander123 (Mar 14, 2011)

Icyshadowlord said:


> Also, why are you so offended by someone using the word/term munchkin, Empirate? To some people they really don't make a difference.




Munchkin is a perjorative term for powergamer, just the way a sexually free woman would be offended if you called them a slut. It is not a word which has positive connotations.


----------



## Animal (Mar 14, 2011)

ok, i know what a slut is, but what is a sexually free woman/man?


----------



## Alexander123 (Mar 14, 2011)

Animal said:


> ok, i know what a slut is, but what is a sexually free woman/man?




http://oshouniverse.com/tag/gautam-buddha/http://oshouniverse.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/058d820a619fd31aca8cfcdf01c9eb4f.jpg


----------



## Dandu (Mar 14, 2011)

Icyshadowlord said:


> I actually find that guide to be somewhat helpful (actually not...), and very darn amusing. Of course, not everyone can agree on everything. Also, magic items are something EVERYONE USES. It's almost a fact, with the exception being low-fantasy settings or magic-dead ones.



When half or more of your WBL is tied up in partially charged wands (where are you going to find a partially charged wand of polymorph with exactly the number of charges you need?) that you have a moderate chance of activating at best, whose caster level is low enough that a dispel magic spell will make you cry, which max out at level 4 spells, *without whom your build cannot function*, I think we have a problem.

Or to put it another way:

Look at his example monk builds and ask yourself a few questions. How much HP does his level 10 monk have? What is his attack bonus? How high is his damage per round? How is he scouting for the party and to get a surprise round on enemies if he is permanently Enlarged? What is his UMD check and how likely is it that he will succeed in reaching the DC 20 check to activate a wand? A scroll? What is this masterwork tool of UMD that he is using to boost his UMD check?

Will it be enough to survive in combat against an 11 headed hydra? Monstrous Scorpion? Bebelith? Sorcerer of the equivalent level?


----------



## kha7id7ea (Mar 14, 2011)

Can I get any actual help? Rather than just arguing about the definition of munchkin. I am not interested in playing a wand using monk. Any classes, feats, races that would help in optimizing a monk would be nice.


----------



## Dandu (Mar 14, 2011)

Being a Dwarf lets you take the feat Hammer Fist, which allows you to add 1.5*Str mod on your unarmed strikes. Cannot be used in conjunction with Flurry of Blows, however.


----------



## Alexander123 (Mar 14, 2011)

kha7id7ea said:


> Can I get any actual help? Rather than just arguing about the definition of munchkin. I am not interested in playing a wand using monk. Any classes, feats, races that would help in optimizing a monk would be nice.




Read this Tier System for Classes, it may provide some much needed insight as you seem to be under the impression that monks are optmized.


----------



## Dandu (Mar 14, 2011)

Putting Psychic Warrior on a Monk actually works well provided that you don't take more than 2 levels of monk.


----------



## Empirate (Mar 14, 2011)

The Monk's Handbook over at BrilliantGameologists might help you out some. It's very detailed, and goes into even the more obscure stuff like alternate class features, items etc.


----------



## kha7id7ea (Mar 14, 2011)

Thanks for the help.  I am aware of the tier system, additionally no class (save the druid) is out of the box optimized. I would like to optimize a monk build to teach my DM not to be so lazy. Recently my DM has nerfed the polymorph/wildshape rules as well as the rules for metamagic reduction to the point that druids, wizards and clerics resemble their pathfinder counterparts. This happened shortly after playing a metamagic using wizard in the sinister spire module. I one-shot a large sized dessicator after he one-shot our tank, while only using a suddenly maximized and empowered fireball. My DM thinks that is far to overpowered, even though it was all possible form one feat from the PHB II and a relatively cheap empower soulshard.  I am trying to teach this DM not to be lazy, and that any pc can easily be put in check through careful planning.


----------



## Dandu (Mar 14, 2011)

> I one-shot a large sized dessicator after he one-shot our tank, while  only using a suddenly maximized and empowered fireball. My DM thinks  that is far to overpowered, even though it was all possible form one  feat from the PHB II and a relatively cheap empower soulshard.  I am  trying to teach this DM not to be lazy, and that any pc can easily be  put in check through careful planning.



_Someone_ ever _tries to kill you__, you try to kill 'em right back! _


----------



## supermansdead (Mar 15, 2011)

I like you, Dandu.


----------



## marcielle (Mar 15, 2011)

With regards to the first guide, just think, how often does the Joker win in the long run?
Go Goliath, if only because they look cooler. There are a few good monk guides out there, the ones I use are:
Whoops! Browser Settings Incompatible and
Whoops! Browser Settings Incompatible
Depending on your web browser, you might get an incompatibility message but the links will still work if you click them

First things first, despite being one of the monks defining features, don't use flurry a lot at low levels unless you suspect your enemy to have a low AC. Second, ALWAYS TAKE STUNNING FIST. It can be seriously buffed up as stated in the aforementioned guides. I highly recomend sandals of tiger's leap + flying kick for decent burst damage early on( Important: Use the Oriental Adventures version, it has higher requirements but is WAY better). I got my DM to give me +1 knockback boots as weapons(remember, monks can technically use their whole body including knees and elbows as weapons so get creative) and combined with a reach weapon and improved trip and combat reflexes (no need for proficiency because trip attacks are touch) you can pull of serious shenanigans in tight areas like dungeons and corridors.
You will never surpass an un-nerfed druid or wizard, but with some sourcebook scouring, you can threaten the lower limits of tier 3.
Finally look for dragon magazine 319 for the ability to GRAPPLE GHOSTS and create antimagic fields just by punching.

Also, I like Dandu too


----------



## Alexander123 (Mar 15, 2011)

supermansdead said:


> I like you, Dandu.




Why don't you marry him?


----------



## kitcik (Mar 15, 2011)

Alexander123 said:


> Why don't you marry him?




He's only in the market for groupies right now. Applications are available online.


----------

