# Batman's Martial Arts



## Samloyal23 (Mar 21, 2020)

Comic book writers who do not necessarily know very much about martial arts have repeatedly said Batman just knows all the martial arts. Since more are created regularly, and there are many stylistic variations of most arts, this seems ludicrous. Trying to be as realistic as possible, if you wanted to be an unarmed fighter on par with Batman, which styles would you study and why?


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## Umbran (Mar 21, 2020)

Samloyal23 said:


> Since more are created regularly, and there are many stylistic variations of most arts, this seems ludicrous.




With respect, he is Batman.  

He dresses up as a bat and fights crime, against penguins, clowns, wrestlers, and HVAC technicians, and his martial arts prowess is the thing that strikes you as ludicrous?


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## Doug McCrae (Mar 21, 2020)

In 1940, boxing and jiu jitsu. At least those are what he teaches Robin in Detective Comics #38.


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## Tonguez (Mar 21, 2020)

It was stated at one point that he knows 127 fighting styles but focuses on around 7 main ones

Batman obviously knows Ninjitsu for his use of Batarang shuriken, striking from the shadows, smoke bombs and tai sabaki evasion and whole body strikes

He uses boxing for his body rotation in strong punch techniques, the open hand strikes of karate and the knee and elbow strikes of Muay Thai. Kung fu and Jeet Kune do are there too for defense and efficiency of strikes. Some kind of pressure point/nerve striking technique is in there too as are the throws of Jujitsu.

his brutal disarms and headbutts show evidence of krav maga

I also like to think that Batman knows Baritsu - because Sherlock Holmes

of course by now Batman as a Master of multiple arts has developed his own idiosyncratic form which can be summed up as “Because I’m Batman”


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## Blue (Mar 21, 2020)

This brings up a side question:  Canonically, does Supes know any martial arts?  With his ability to fly effectively bracing him all the time, I wouldn't necessarily think a human one, but still.


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## Morrus (Mar 21, 2020)

Blue said:


> This brings up a side question:  Canonically, does Supes know any martial arts?  With his ability to fly effectively bracing him all the time, I wouldn't necessarily think a human one, but still.



I always wondered why he looks so fit, given that it must be hard for him to exercise being super strong and stuff.


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## Tonguez (Mar 21, 2020)

Blue said:


> This brings up a side question:  Canonically, does Supes know any martial arts?  With his ability to fly effectively bracing him all the time, I wouldn't necessarily think a human one, but still.




Superman doesnt really have to be a 'good' fighter since being invunerable and super strong means that he just needs to land a basic punch to cause devastating damage.

That said he has been depicted as able to handle himself against multiple opponents and canonically trained with Wild Cat (Boxing) as well as learning techniques from both Wonder Woman and Batman. He's also got some knowledge of Kryptonian pressure points. He's also skilled with sword and hammer.

So anyway I'd say
Trained = Boxing, Karate and Shooting (Laser eyes) and Sword combat
Untrained = I'd allow that he knows some Klukor karate techniques and he also uses Tackling and Headlocks which he may have learnt from Football or by watching lots of WWF

Oh = theres also two Krytonian Martial Arts which Superman may be familiar with -* Torquasm Vo* is a mental style similar to Yoga whereas *Torquasm Rao* is similar to TaiChi

Interestingly Supergirl knows *Klukor* (Kryptonian Karate) and thus has greater fighting skill than her cousin including use of flight enhanced side and drop kicks.


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## Morrus (Mar 21, 2020)

Tonguez said:


> Superman doesnt really have to be a 'good' fighter since being invunerable and super strong means that he just needs to land a basic punch to cause devastating damage.



He meets people as tough as him all the time. He totally needs to know how to fight them.


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## Tonguez (Mar 21, 2020)

Morrus said:


> He meets people as tough as him all the time. He totally needs to know how to fight them.




yes but he's also shown to mostly get lots of beat downs when facing such opponents, until with his last breath he calls upon his inner spirit as a Hero to finish things on a devastating power move. (that could be an outcome of his Torquasm Vo mastery)

also when I say he's not a good fighter that doesnt mean he's a bad fighter just not as highly skilled as his peers- non-powered heroes like Wild Cat and Karate Kid can spar with him effectively and of course Batman has defeated him (Because Batman)


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## Morrus (Mar 21, 2020)

Tonguez said:


> yes be he's also shown to mostly get lots of beat downs when facing such opponents



I was responding to you saying "Superman doesnt really have to be a 'good' fighter".


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## MarkB (Mar 21, 2020)

I think Superman probably trains himself intensively to be able to deliver just _enough_ force with his attacks and counters, so that he doesn't accidentally punch through someone's chest. Martial Arts training could help with that.


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## Dannyalcatraz (Mar 22, 2020)

> Oh = theres also two Krytonian Martial Arts which Superman may be familiar with -Torquasm Vo is a mental style similar to Yoga whereas Torquasm Rao is similar to TaiChi
> 
> Interestingly Supergirl knows Klukor (Kryptonian Karate) and thus has greater fighting skill than her cousin including use of flight enhanced side and drop kicks.




As I recall, Superman received some training in Kryptonian martial arts in Kandor, back in the 1970s or 80s, possibly as part of his Batman-style crime fighting as half of Nightwing and Flamebird while there.  I suspect that most writers forget abou those details, and occasionally reinttro the concept without needing to.

I can’t speak to how many martial arts forms Bats knows, but some of the internal monologues of characters who consider themselves superior to him have criticized him more in terms of practical application of his skills.  

For example, when part of the final assault in the Paul Kirk Manhunter miniseries (waaaaaay back!), Manhunter observed that Batman was getting bogged down fighting the better combatants among the base’s forces while he (Kirk) was mowing down mooks in order to ger to the final objective more quickly.  In his mind, Bats was prioritizing his ego proving his prowess as a combatant over actually achieving the mission.


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## trappedslider (Mar 22, 2020)

In Mask of the Phantasm, we see Bruce practice jutsu or ninjutsu (i'll have to watch it again.)

anyway googling gave me this blog Boxing Upper West Side : How many martial arts does Batman know ?


*Batman knows 10 core martial arts*


Batman is proficient in ten core martial arts, cherry-picking the most devastating and tactical knowledge from each:




Aikido – throwing techniques
Boxing – punches
Judo – throwing techniques
Karate – open hand strikes
Krav Maga – headbutts and disarming techniques
Kung Fu – defensive skills
Muay Thai – elbow strikes and knee strikes
Ninjutsu – weapons throwing techniques and stealth
Savate – kicking techniques
Tae Kown Do – kicking techniques


*Today, Batman knows 127 martial arts*


Above all, fans appear to be very passionate about Batman’s skillset. Because of this, the tally of martial arts is at 127. It may sound unlikely but this is over more than 75 years of Batman on TV and in comics.



For example, the most significant and widespread martial arts from those 127 include:




Aikido
Ba Gua
Bojutsu
Boxing
Brazillian Jujitsu
Capoeira
Chin Na
Escrima
Fencing
Francombat
Hapkido
Hung Gar
Jeet Kune Do
Judo
Jujitsu
Kail
Karate
Kendo
Kenjutsu
Kenpo
Kickboxing
Krav Maga
Kung Fu
Kyudo
Muay Thai
Ninjutsu
Savate
Shaolin
Shorin Ryu
Silat
Taekwondo
Tai Chi
Varma Ati
Wing Chun
Yawyan
As for Sups, He's been taught by Muhammad Ali how to box way back when, anyway there's a whole trope based on it _ Boxing Lessons for Superman - TV Tropes



EDIT: Side note: jason bourne knows to fight using a whole bathroom including the sink._


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## Mercurius (Mar 22, 2020)

I just re-watched the Dark Knight Trilogy and his fighting style is pretty straight-forward. I would guess boxing, jujitsu, and ninjutsu, with bits and pieces from various styles.


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## Ulfgeir (Mar 22, 2020)

Superman (or rather superboy) had a match against Karate Kid from Legion of Superheroes, and the latter, managed to get to a tie (as part of his entry-test into the legion), even though he didn't have any powers. 

Superman does come across more as someone more in the line of throwing wild swings and haymakers.


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## Samloyal23 (Mar 22, 2020)

trappedslider said:


> In Mask of the Phantasm, we see Bruce practice jutsu or ninjutsu (i'll have to watch it again.)
> 
> anyway googling gave me this blog Boxing Upper West Side : How many martial arts does Batman know ?
> 
> ...



How many of these are actually effective? How many are redundant? How much actual training time would you need to be effective with each of them? It looks like Bruce Wayne would have to spend 30 years training in martial arts to become proficient in all of these...


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## Baba (Mar 22, 2020)

Doug McCrae said:


> In 1940, boxing and jiu jitsu. At least those are what he teaches Robin in Detective Comics #38.
> 
> View attachment 120095




Batman is also proficient in the art of conversing while being thrown through the air.


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## Olgar Shiverstone (Mar 22, 2020)

Baba said:


> Batman is also proficient in the art of conversing while being thrown through the air.



That's an epic-level skill, there.


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## Tonguez (Mar 22, 2020)

Samloyal23 said:


> How many of these are actually effective? How many are redundant? How much actual training time would you need to be effective with each of them? It looks like Bruce Wayne would have to spend 30 years training in martial arts to become proficient in all of these...




If we assume that Bruce Wayne was 8 when his Parents died then the years of training isnt so far fetched., especially if we accept Alfred being ex SAS, a field medic and an accomplished Martial Artist in his own right.

So from about age 8 Master Bruce learns boxing, archery,fencing and basic SAS Combat Training. As a child Bruce is also depicted rock climbing, so lets assume some wilderness survival and tracking too. Alfred may also have taught him first aid and biology (Alfred is an accomplished Rose breeder).

Anyway thats the first 10 years, then at 18 Bruce sets out on his world tour which takes another say 15 years. So after effectively 25 years of obsessive dedication to training Bruce returns to Gotham to become The Batman.


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## Eltab (Mar 22, 2020)

Morrus said:


> I always wondered why he looks so fit, given that it must be hard for him to exercise being super strong and stuff.



Clark Kent can still do jumping jacks, sit-ups, go jogging, &c - the things where you mostly interact with yourself, not the equipment.
Superman can get leg exercise by jumping over tall buildings in a single bound (no flying to assist).
Superman can get arm exercise by picking up the aforesaid buildings for weightlifting.


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## MarkB (Mar 22, 2020)

Baba said:


> Batman is also proficient in the art of conversing while being thrown through the air.



It's a work in progress. He's learning Quip-Fu from Spider-man.


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## trappedslider (Mar 24, 2020)

Talking is a free action


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## Garthanos (Mar 24, 2020)

Tonguez said:


> I also like to think that Batman knows Baritsu - because Sherlock Holmes



Oh definitely for that reason and only because we are both silly people


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## Samloyal23 (Mar 26, 2020)

Eltab said:


> Clark Kent can still do jumping jacks, sit-ups, go jogging, &c - the things where you mostly interact with yourself, not the equipment.
> Superman can get leg exercise by jumping over tall buildings in a single bound (no flying to assist).
> Superman can get arm exercise by picking up the aforesaid buildings for weightlifting.




The only way for a Kryptonian to have a challenging workout while under a yellow sun would be through body weight exercises and isometrics. Even with these techniques, it takes a long time to see even a small improvement.


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## Samloyal23 (Mar 26, 2020)

Garthanos said:


> Oh definitely for that reason and only because we are both silly people




Bartitsu (Doyle spelled it wrong) is a serious and effective martial art created by a British soldier who travelled around Asia, where he spent some time learning martial arts. It is a fairly complete art, including grappling, strikes, and weapon techniques.


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## Garthanos (Mar 26, 2020)

Samloyal23 said:


> Bartitsu (Doyle spelled it wrong)



Knew that  or at least that its assumed that is what he meant I am a holmes fan


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## Tonguez (Mar 26, 2020)

Garthanos said:


> Knew that  or at least that its assumed that is what he meant I am a holmes fan




Yes I am also familiar with Bartitsu

but I was specifically referencing Batmans link to Sherlock Holmes and Baritsu  -  silly me


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## Garthanos (Mar 26, 2020)

Tonguez said:


> Yes I am also familiar with Bartitsu
> 
> but I was specifically referencing Batmans link to Sherlock Holmes and Baritsu  -  silly me



hey we playeth games where people imagine themselves as elves and other things and throw dice to see what happens its kind of a universal thing around here I suppose.


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## Samloyal23 (Mar 26, 2020)

Academia Duellatoria in Portland, Oregon has Bartitsu lessons on Wednesday nights if you have the jink for it.


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## Mustrum_Ridcully (Mar 26, 2020)

Eltab said:


> Clark Kent can still do jumping jacks, sit-ups, go jogging, &c - the things where you mostly interact with yourself, not the equipment.
> Superman can get leg exercise by jumping over tall buildings in a single bound (no flying to assist).
> *Superman can get arm exercise by picking up the aforesaid buildings for weightlifting.*



That is not what you are supposed to do with a fitness studio. Or any building.


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## MarkB (Mar 27, 2020)

Mustrum_Ridcully said:


> That is not what you are supposed to do with a fitness studio. Or any building.



That's why they call it body-building.


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## Ulfgeir (Mar 27, 2020)

trappedslider said:


> Aikido – throwing techniques
> Boxing – punches
> Judo – throwing techniques
> Karate – open hand strikes
> ...




QUOTE="Samloyal23, post: 7947764, member: 21432"]
How many of these are actually effective? How many are redundant? How much actual training time would you need to be effective with each of them? It looks like Bruce Wayne would have to spend 30 years training in martial arts to become proficient in all of these...
[/QUOTE]

Is quite a bit of overlap.  The ones that are unique is Aikido (you need lots of practice to be effective though), Boxing, Judo (this is also the ony one listed that has grappling), Ninjutsu.  Kung fu will depend on which style..

But you will find lots of similar techniques in Karate/Savate/Tae Kwon Do/Muay Thai. 
I would say Krav Maga is the easiest of these to be good enoug fo self-defence.


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## wingsandsword (Mar 27, 2020)

Blue said:


> This brings up a side question:  Canonically, does Supes know any martial arts?  With his ability to fly effectively bracing him all the time, I wouldn't necessarily think a human one, but still.




Depends on which canon.

If you go back to the 1970's, there was a comic where Muhammad Ali taught Superman boxing, so he could fight on a planet orbiting a red sun where his powers wouldn't work.  

So, that's at least one version of Superman who was taught some kind of fighting art to use when he couldn't rely on superhuman speed and strength alone.









						Superman vs. Muhammad Ali - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org


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