# WOIN Supers



## M3woods (Oct 2, 2016)

Looking at shifting to d10 dice pools for a supers game and I'm hoping someone would check my math here. Does this look accurate?

A WOIN Supers game could shift to a d10 dice pool, moving a Grade 5 PC's 50/50 success rate up the Difficulty Rating Benchmark table from Difficult to Strenuous. This allows Super characters to successfully achieve tasks that a Normal character would find more difficult.

A 5d10 Super, with an average Attack roll of 28, would likely sweep through common 5d6 mooks (average Defense 18).

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## Morrus (Oct 2, 2016)

My thoughts for supers  was that each "level" of superpower increases the dice type of one attribute by one stage.

So level one superstrength means you roll d8s for STR checks, level 2 is d10s, level 3 is d12s. Same for each attribute, individually. 

Mutants appear in NOW,  which is street level superpowers.


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## M3woods (Oct 2, 2016)

Super powers would be built along the same lines as powers in M&M3e, by Type, Range, and Effect. Types are General, Attack, Defend, Movement, Sensory, and Control. Ranges would be Personal, Close, Ranged, and Perception. Effect simply names the Power. Launching a fireball would be a Ranged Attack (fire). Perception-ranged Sensory (Illusion). Perception-ranged Attack (Mind Blast).

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## M3woods (Oct 2, 2016)

Morrus said:


> My thoughts for supers  was that each "level" of superpower increases the dice type of one attribute by one stage.
> 
> So level one superstrength means you roll d8s for STR checks, level 2 is d10s, level 3 is d12s. Same for each attribute, individually.
> 
> Mutants appear in NOW,  which is street level superpowers.



I can see that working, too. I'm sure you've given it more consideration than me. My thoughts were building baseline characters using the simpler dX system: Normal (d6), Street-level/Pulp (d8), Supers (d10). Each one would still maintain the Grade 5 setup and advancement.

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## M3woods (Oct 7, 2016)

Morrus, after some (more) thought on the matter, you're way would likely work best. I'm assuming the character would be built at a 5d6 (normal) baseline and move up a die type, incrementally, through choosing Powers and Power Levels (similar to Skill Ranks.)

My way assumed a baseline of Super (d10s across the board) but that doesn't work so well when I considered the max dice pool economy. The only way something like Superstrength could work would be to allow the character to increase the number of dice in the pool. I was thinking an additional die per two ranks so Superstrength 2 allows 6d10 on a STR check. I haven't looked at the math involved but I'm sure that throws it seriously out of whack.

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## thundershot (Oct 12, 2016)

I was literally just asking if this was going to be in the cards at some point on Facebook.. Supers and Wild West. They'd make great supplements... The trick would be making sure they can coexist with NEW, NOW, and OLD without making those characters redundant in a mixed game.


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## M3woods (Oct 16, 2016)

Just playing with ideas.

Changes to Origin/Career paths for a SUPERS game:

WOIN Origin replaced by a simple word change to Background.

ORIGIN
Accident, Alien, Endowment, Experiment, Mutant, Training

Standard Race/Species becomes Archetype. 

ARCHETYPES
Battlesuit, Construct, Crime Fighter, Energy Controller, Gadgeteer, Martial Artist, Mimic, Mystic, Paragon, Powerhouse, Psionic, Speedster, Shapeshifter, Warrior, Weapon-master

Power (POW) Attribute acts similar to Magic (MAG) or Psionics (PSI).

EXAMPLE:
Crime Fighter
AGI +2, INT +2, POW +1

Skills. Acrobatics, Unarmed, Intimidation, Investigation, Thrown Weapon, Stealth

Exploits.
*Wonderful Toys. You always have the right tool for the job. You gain +2 to Skill Checks.

*Fearful Legend. Criminals fear you, and rightly so. You may make a REP vs. MENTAL DEFENSE attack to inflict the afraid condition on a target until they shake it off. With a second attack, you can increase the condition to terrified.

*Territory. Choose a city or other area. In that area, you receive +1d6 on checks made to hide or move quietly while there.

*Athletic. Choose four [physical] skills. You gain these four skills at 1 rank (1d6). This does not increase the rank of an existing skill.

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## Morrus (Oct 16, 2016)

What does the POW score do? 

(Incidentally, the word "Origin" is more suited to supers than it is to any other genre - the Origin Story is a staple of supers media).


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## M3woods (Oct 16, 2016)

Sorry. I wasn't clear. Each PC has a Background, three Careers, an Origin, and an Archetype.

As for Power, I'm still working on that.

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## Marius Delphus (Oct 16, 2016)

Keep in mind that if you use the list of archetypes from the d20 Hero SRD, to play it safe you'd probably need to include the d20 OGL in your work if you publish it, adding a cite to the d20 Hero SRD in the Section 15.


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## M3woods (Oct 17, 2016)

Yes, that list of archetypes came from M&M but they're considered archetypes for a reason. They're standards of the superhero medium.

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## Marius Delphus (Oct 17, 2016)

After thinking it over I wound up making some substantive edits to my post. Please read the edited version and I apologize if I was being or sounding accusatory.


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## M3woods (Oct 17, 2016)

Marius Delphus said:


> After thinking it over I wound up making some substantive edits to my post. Please read the edited version and I apologize if I was being or sounding accusatory.



No worries, friend. M&M3e is my 'go-to' system for Supers. I think I'll stick with it for that genre. Still, W.O.I.N. seems to hit a sweet spot for all the rest. I'll continue using it for both my Apocalyptic Weird Western and my Fantasy Steampunk setting.

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## btccg (Oct 17, 2016)

One question for M3Woods: would the 'archteypes' that you envision not work better as Careers instead?  

The Character Origins you envision make sense to determine HOW the character got their superpowers, for sure.  But then, would it not be logical to have the Career the character selects be their archetype definition?

This would still allow specific exploits for each archetype you indicated, but also allow flexibility for a character to have a wide variety of powers if they so choose.  If a character selects all their available Careers from one specific archetype then that character is a solid version of that archetype (e.g. prototypical 'brick' like the Hulk would simply have multiple Career Paths in "Powerhouse" or "Warrior").  But if a character wanted a variety, they could still make a "Powerhouse Martial Artist", for example, by taking multiple Careers in Powerhouse and a single Career in Martial Artist.


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## AslanC (Oct 18, 2016)

Please don't emulate Champions of M&M with this, please?  We have enough builders in the world already.  Look to some other games like ICONS, or FASERIP for excellent power systems that can be adapted as well.  Hell if you want to use dice pools, look to SUPERS! and SUPERS! Revised Edition for great ways to do powers without having to have endless points pools and lego-plumbing 

Otherwise I am most curious to watch this evolve.


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## M3woods (Oct 20, 2016)

I'm taking a step back from working on ideas for WOIN Supers. I've got plenty to keep me busy. My tabletop group have finally decided to try N.E.W. so I'll be running another setting of my own design called 2212: Midnight Dogs (think TMNT meets Cyberpunk.)


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## M3woods (Apr 9, 2017)

A new idea for WOIN Supers popped into my head the other day. This is only a rough idea but I'll fiddle with it during down time and see how it looks.

A Character begins with their Origin, which would be your basic accident, mutant, non-human, etc; the origin story, so to speak. Then, the player chooses an Archetype: Paragon, Mystic, Vigilante, etc.

Here's the kicker, instead of careers the player chooses Power Sets. Here's an example:

ENERGY EMISSION
Attributes: END +1, WIL +1, POW +2
Skill Choices: [power], intimidation, perception, [physical], ranged ability, dodging

Exploits
Energy Blast (requires POW 6). You have the ability to fire blasts of energy from your body, with a range increment of 10'. If attack succeeds, blast does 1d6 per 2 PP [energy type] damage.

Force Field (POW 4). You create a force field of [energy type] centered on yourself, gaining SOAK 1 +1 per PP spent until your next turn. Pay 1d6 to extend the force field an additional 5' per 2 PP spent.

Draining Energy (WIL 4, POW 6). On a successful Grab, you can envelope an opponent with a cloak of energy which causes 1d6 +1d6 per 4 PP damage. Pay 2d6; you may forego the Grab and gain a range increment of 5' per additional 2 PP spent.

Energy Orbs (requires Energy Blast, POW 4). You have the ability to create and throw explosive orbs of energy. Energy Orbs affect opponents within 5' of target square and do 2d6 [energy type] damage to any within area of effect. (See Grenades in Future Equipment for details on throwing and area of effect.)

I was also looking at Power Shifts from the Cypher system. Power Shifts would allow a character to maintain a niche without changing any die types to justify things like super strength or invulnerability.

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## Morrus (Apr 9, 2017)

That's not dissimilar to the way Mike Myler treated martial arts in NOW. I think it works. It's mechanically a career with a time element of zero.


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