# How Do You Fight A Swarm?



## The Spectrum Rider (Mar 19, 2004)

Whenever my players face a swarm of creatures sized Diminuative or less (that is, no weapon damage need apply), most of them run for the hills and hope they're faster than the swarm (or at least faster than their friends). This is a nice variety of six roughly 10th-level characters.

Then the sorcerer throws fireballs at the swarm until it's dead.

Frankly, the ranger, the bard, the cleric, the rogue, the monk - they're a mixture of frustrated and bored. "Nothing we can do about it," they say, if they don't have hefty energy-damage spells to throw around.

Any suggestions? Any tactics?

The Spectrum Rider


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## Darklone (Mar 19, 2004)

Flyswatter. Smoke grenades. Energy enhancements.


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## thullgrim (Mar 19, 2004)

oil flasks, acid attacks (splash damage and everything)


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## uzagi_akimbo (Mar 19, 2004)

burning brandy/rum/spirits, torches (obviously), tar, glue, solvents  running water (if available - decanter of endless water should do nicely, but up to GM-discretion; might be fun as a fire-brigade strength water hose for dispersal, too)

A group of mine did a death-roller crusher attack using a piece of a tumbled pillar (well, they had a skilled thief-acrobat  ) one time for some great fun and tense moments, but a barrel or round treetrunk might work, too.

Or use a large tarpaulin/blanket/carpet to smother and then crush them (again GM-discretion) by jumping/stomping around on it - the swarms low strength per  vermin should make escape from a heavy cover difficult.

Use summon monster/undead to get something immune  to swarm's damage or dealing damage by touch (such as a ooze, cube, incorporeal undead or with DR, like a mummy, fire  or air elemental ) to wipe out the swarm. Druid's summoning elementals are a major pain. Summoned mephits should do fine, too, as long as it is not an airborne swarm, killing slowly with repeated breath weapons while flying by or above the swarm.


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## Majere (Mar 19, 2004)

Swarms have very many 1/2 hp creatures.
Anyone with an area of effect damage ability should be fine, which basically means the magic users. (Clerics get flame strike off the top of my head for one)

If the fighters are upset, ask them how much use the spell caster is against something with SR40 .. Horses for courses and all that

Majere


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## FireLance (Mar 19, 2004)

Torches work too, but deal pathetic damage and are useless against a swarm with resistance to fire (a Hellwasp swarm, for example).

The fightability factor (for want of a better term) goes down significantly when the swarm is composed of Dimunitive or Fine creatures as they ignore weapon damage.  There really ought to be a feat that allows a character to deal weapon damage when fighting swarms, maybe half damage, and with bludgeoning weapons only.  Otherwise, all fighter-types ought to pack an energy weapon of some kind.

By the way, Spell Resistance isn't the spellcaster threat it used to be, with all the Conjuration spells that ignore SR.


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## anon (Mar 19, 2004)

Anyone notice the contradiction in the Bat Swarm entry?

Bat Swarms are Diminutive, which according to the Swarm traits entry means that they are immune to weapon damage.

Yet under Special Qualities it listed both: "half damage from slashing and piercing" as well as "swarm traits".


So, were Bat Swarms supposed to be Tiny? I find this option unlikely as Bat entry in the animals section has a Bat as Diminutive.

Was the "half damage..." entry incorrect? My personal guess.

Or are Bat Swarms a special exception to the normal swarm traits rule?  Also very possible.


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## The Spectrum Rider (Mar 19, 2004)

anon said:
			
		

> Anyone notice the contradiction in the Bat Swarm entry?
> 
> Bat Swarms are Diminutive, which according to the Swarm traits entry means that they are immune to weapon damage.
> 
> ...




Actually, I sent a note about this to WotC, when they were soliciting feedback on the newly-released MM 3.5. They thanked me (warm fuzzies all around) and said it was a mistake - weapon half-damage should apply to bat swarms.

The Spectrum Rider


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## anon (Mar 20, 2004)

So... what was the mistake?

Are Bat Swarms Tiny? or are they Diminutive and so immune to weapon damage? or are they an exception?


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## LGodamus (Mar 20, 2004)

my favorite...decanter of endless water set to "geyser" mode


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## Hypersmurf (Mar 20, 2004)

The Spectrum Rider said:
			
		

> How Do You Fight A Swarm?




With heart; faith; and steel.  In the end, there can be only one.

-Hyp.


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## Darklone (Mar 20, 2004)

I prefer heart, faith, steel and my wand of fireballs.


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## DM_Matt (Mar 21, 2004)

The Spectrum Rider said:
			
		

> Whenever my players face a swarm of creatures sized Diminuative or less (that is, no weapon damage need apply), most of them run for the hills and hope they're faster than the swarm (or at least faster than their friends). This is a nice variety of six roughly 10th-level characters.
> 
> Then the sorcerer throws fireballs at the swarm until it's dead.
> 
> ...




Use a vacuum.

Summon some air elementals.  In whirlwind form they can quite easily pick up a swarm (thereby neutralizing it), and then deal the swarm 1d6/HD/round.  IMC, our cleric with the Air domain's controlled air elemental companion has eaten quite a few Hellfire Locust swarms in his time.

Control Weather --> Tornado will do the same thing.


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## Barak (Mar 21, 2004)

I find the best solution is to have some DR, and walk through it.


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## Scion (Mar 21, 2004)

Barak said:
			
		

> I find the best solution is to have some DR, and walk through it.




Careful about suffocation.


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## James McMurray (Mar 21, 2004)

Scion said:
			
		

> Careful about suffocation.



How is that going to happen? None of the SRD swarms have suffocating abilities. Perhaps swarms from other sources?


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## Scion (Mar 21, 2004)

James McMurray said:
			
		

> How is that going to happen? None of the SRD swarms have suffocating abilities. Perhaps swarms from other sources?




Enough small flying creatures and walking through their occupied square would be 'bad'. That is the way that some swarm like creatures in real life kill after all  So I bet that at some point there will be a swarm that attempts to kill by swarming over and sufficating. Never can be too cautious about such things! I may at some point myself.. hmm.. massive butterfly swarm who like to lay eggs in dead bodies.. and they make them dead by suffocation.. interesting


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## James McMurray (Mar 21, 2004)

Ah, cool. I thought there was already something out there that did it. It would probably have to be  fast sufocation though. Standard suffocation ruls mean that you have to have a below average constitution to not be able to hold your breath for at least two minutes (20 rounds). If you can't kill or flee a bunch of butterflies by then, you can't really claim to be an adventurr, can you?


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## Scion (Mar 21, 2004)

James McMurray said:
			
		

> Ah, cool. I thought there was already something out there that did it. It would probably have to be  fast sufocation though. Standard suffocation ruls mean that you have to have a below average constitution to not be able to hold your breath for at least two minutes (20 rounds). If you can't kill or flee a bunch of butterflies by then, you can't really claim to be an adventurr, can you?




Wouldnt that be a cool visual though? the adventurers bravely leave town..only to be seen fleeing from a bunch of pretty butterflies.. not only fleeing, but screaming and running for their lives!


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## James McMurray (Mar 21, 2004)

Or some local kids see them fireballing butterflies.


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## Scion (Mar 21, 2004)

James McMurray said:
			
		

> Or some local kids see them fireballing butterflies.




poor kids, scarred for life 

after all, kids like to run and play with the butterflys right? lol


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## The Spectrum Rider (Mar 21, 2004)

anon said:
			
		

> So... what was the mistake?
> 
> Are Bat Swarms Tiny? or are they Diminutive and so immune to weapon damage? or are they an exception?




They're Tiny and subject to 1/2 weapon damage.

The Spectrum Rider


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## Hand of Evil (Mar 21, 2004)

Area of effect spells, walls of... 
Player that is a bard uses Gaseous Form and Wizard uses Levitate (only work for non-flying swarms).


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