# what is the strongest D&D race?



## Havoc123456 (Aug 29, 2010)

the title says it all. what is the strongest D&D race without racial hit dice and preferably a LA of +1 or +0


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## HoboGod (Aug 29, 2010)

That depends on what you're after. Optimizers will say human. Beatsticks tend to take dwarf. Rogues will take halflings.


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## Herobizkit (Aug 29, 2010)

Paladins also take Aasimar (+1).  Half-Orcs (+0) are arguably the "strongest" with +2 Str.  Suprisingly, Hobgoblins (+1) get +2 Dex and Con with no drawbacks.


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## anest1s (Aug 29, 2010)

Great wyrm gold dragon, 46-47 average strength. (it says so on page 8 PH 3.5 edition)


EDIT: that happens when you *think* you did read the question but you actually didn't...


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## Freakohollik (Aug 29, 2010)

For LA+0 I'd go with orcs and warforged for fighting types. Kalashtar and Elans make good psions. For wizards and clerics it doesn't matter too much, so just pick something that gives you some good defensive bonuses unless you need the extra feat from being human. Dwarves are good for the +2 con and +2 on saves vs spells.

I never think +1 LA is worth it, but half giants make good psychic warriors. Goliaths are good at any fighting class. Hobgoblins are just generally good. For any caster I would never take the +1 LA.


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## Andion Isurand (Sep 1, 2010)

Arcane Gnomes, Deep Imaskari, Grey Elves, Fire Elves (UA) or Sun Elves for a Wizard or Archivist

Arcane Gnomes from Dragon 291:
as standard gnome except
+2 Int, -2 Wis
UMD is always a class skill (!!!)
no speak with animals
favored class wizard.


Whisper Gnome for Rogue


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## irdeggman (Sep 1, 2010)

Goliaths from Races of Stone (+1 LA) +4 Str. +2 Con, -2 Dex and powerful build and dark vision (monstrous humanoid type ability) 



> Traits: A monstrous humanoid possesses the following traits (unless otherwise noted in a creature’s entry).
> —Darkvision out to 60 feet.
> —Proficient with all simple weapons and any weapons mentioned in its entry.
> —Proficient with whatever type of armor (light, medium, or heavy) it is described as wearing, as well as all lighter types. Monstrous humanoids not indicated as wearing armor are not proficient with armor. Monstrous humanoids are proficient with shields if they are proficient with any form of armor.
> —Monstrous humanoids eat, sleep, and breathe.




Now that is the* strongerst *race witha +1 (or less) LA, maybe not the most powerful one.


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## LordMonty (Sep 2, 2010)

Honorable mention for 'Feral Creature' template from Savage Species which is definately the best +1 mod ever, totally broken. 

P.S Never used myself, waiting for the truely asskicking DM who needs counter balancing


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## Deset Gled (Sep 2, 2010)

irdeggman said:


> Goliaths from Races of Stone (+1 LA) +4 Str. +2 Con, -2 Dex and powerful build and dark vision (monstrous humanoid type ability)
> 
> Now that is the* strongerst *race witha +1 (or less) LA, maybe not the most powerful one.




I see your goliath and raise you a half-ogre from Savage Species.  +1 LA for a +6 Str (-2 Dex, +2 Con, -2 Int, -2 Cha).  Also, they are true Large creatures, instead of just having Powerful Build, have darkvision, and get +4 natural armor.  Kinda broken, IMO.

In just the core, I consider dwarfs to be the most powerful race, although humans are more versatile.


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## StreamOfTheSky (Sep 2, 2010)

I'm going to stick to LA +0.

Dwarves have the most sheer power.  Most widely useful stat in the game is higher, and lower for the "most common dump stat."  Nice martial weapons, insanely good save bonuses, stability, darkvision... not even halfway through all their benefits.  Even a Wizard could do much worse than being a Dwarf even if he never once uses half the racial benefits.

Humans are a close second, the bonus feat alone just proves to be more important than anything else a lot of times.  Strongheart Halflings I'm not familiar with the exact rules of, but apparently also get a bonus feat and thus could even be better than humans for nonmartial classes.

Warforged round out the top 3 just because of their massive immunities list and the ability to be healed by arcane or divine.  I'll admit human and dwarf is usually better, but the nature of what makes warforged overpowered makes me hate them the most...



HoboGod said:


> Rogues will take halflings.




Maybe a flask or knife throwing rogue would consider it, but no special vision alone makes them a crappy rogue race.  Halflings do make the best core spellcasting race if the DM won't even allow Monster Manual racial variants, though.  Actually, even if he does, they probably make the best druids in core and come close to forest gnome for best core sorcerer.  (Fire Elf and Grey Elf obviously make the best wizards in core...or Human I guess...).


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## LordMonty (Sep 2, 2010)

Now i think of it the Faerun Sunelf with just the Otherworldly(Darkvision 60ft/+2Dip) the feat, the toon does pretty well as the best wizard/other int classes at +0(and a racial feat).


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## Dandu (Sep 2, 2010)

The Otherwordly feat is good, but not for the reasons you mentioned.


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## LordMonty (Sep 2, 2010)

Dandu said:


> The Otherwordly feat is good, but not for the reasons you mentioned.




Oh sorry ofc and you become a native outsider.

P.S Also availible for Wood elves and Moonelves of that setting.


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## Particle_Man (Sep 3, 2010)

Gray Elves from the MM get +2 Int and are LA +0.  Nice boost for Wizard types and others that base power off of Int.


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## Dannyalcatraz (Sep 3, 2010)

LordMonty said:


> Honorable mention for 'Feral Creature' template from Savage Species which is definately the best +1 mod ever, totally broken.
> 
> P.S Never used myself, waiting for the truely asskicking DM who needs counter balancing




The original +1LA Half-Ogre from that same sourcebook (_Savage Species_, for those who don't know) rocks as well...and is as broken:


+6Str, -2Dex, +2Con, -2Int, -2Cha
Size L (-1AC, -1Att , 10' Reach)
Darkvision
Giant blood- which means they're proficient with simple & martial weapons, + armor in their entry
Natural Armor +4

Now...make _THAT _Feral...
_
EDIT: Just noticed Deset Gled beat me to posting about the Half-Ogre._


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## StreamOfTheSky (Sep 4, 2010)

Yeah, there's a reason Savage Species is my most hated book, even more than C.Psionics (to be fair, I also don't care about psionics much, the book's just so offensive to my sense of decency I find it impossible not to hate).


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## aarondirebear (Sep 4, 2010)

Havoc123456 said:


> the title says it all. what is the strongest D&D race without racial hit dice and preferably a LA of +1 or +0




 i am going to take you literally. ORCS. They have the highest STRENGTH score, thereby making them the STRONGest (Same root word).


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