# Thanks for All the Fish



## Raven Crowking

There are many fine people on EN World who I hope will feel free to contact me if they so desire.  You can use ravencrowking at hotmail dot com.  Feel free to follow me on my blog, Raven Crowking's Nest, or not, as you desire. 

I will not be posting here again in the foreseeable future.

Good Gaming all,

Raven Crowking


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## Plane Sailing

Good luck with your RCFRPG, and thanks for your contribution over the years.

Cheers


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## jonesy

You're leaving? Damn, man. Your posts were always interesting, even when I disagreed with them. Especially when I disagreed with them.

Good luck with everything. I truly mean it.


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## Dice4Hire

I think leaving is a bit of an overreaction, but good luck in the future.


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## Holy Bovine

Plane Sailing said:


> Good luck with your RCFRPG, and thanks for your contribution over the years.
> 
> Cheers




Better start copy/pasting those contributions - he's deleting all of the "content" (i.e. posts to you and me) he's made over the years.  I can see wanting to leave but the rest...


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## wedgeski

I've enjoyed your posts over the years, good luck.


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## Thanee

Oops! Wrong thread!


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## Windjammer

Holy Bovine said:


> Better start copy/pasting those contributions - he's deleting all of the "content" (i.e. posts to you and me) he's made over the years.  I can see wanting to leave but the rest...




This, a hundred times this. So I wanted to check up on the latest "What's So bad about 4th Edition?" discussion (here), and it's a train wreck. I have no idea on the actual progression of the debate because RC removed all of his posts. 

It's precisely to prevent such things that Paizo doesn't enable users to edit their posts 12 hours after posting them. Editing posts is for correcting typos, not for disavowing content or responsibility retroactively (both are fine in their own right, but that's now that the Edit button is for). I'm usually not in favour of getting such policies into effect, but it helps to prevent childish destructive behaviour.

No hard feelings, RC, but I feel you could have left with much more dignity if you'd left the old discussions in tact.


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## Dannyalcatraz

> I have no idea on the actual progression of the debate because RC removed all of his posts.




It IS somewhat surreal.


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## billd91

I suppose surreal is one word for it. I can think of several others as well, but I won't use them because it's fundamentally pointless - rather like hacking up discussions by deleting all 12,000+ posts he made.


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## Dice4Hire

I suppose I could understand deleting blog posts or reviews and the like, but deleting posts is pretty extreme. Pretty childish, actually.


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## Holy Bovine

So RC is leaving but still commenting in XP comments.  Uh-huh.


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## Relique du Madde

Wow..  Guess I will never know what that was about...

*Heats up some popcorn*


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## El Mahdi

Stealth Check = 33

*Relique du Madde goes to retrieve his popcorn, only to find the microwave empty*


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## Relique du Madde

Damn my low perception skill.  If only I didn't use my power points to buy that power armor.


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## OnlineDM

I guess I missed something big. I enjoyed reading Raven Crowking's posts, though I evidently missed a thread where things got bad.

Well, I'm sorry to see you go.


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## StreamOfTheSky

OnlineDM said:


> I guess I missed something big. I enjoyed reading Raven Crowking's posts, though I evidently missed a thread where things got bad.




Same.  What happened here?


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## Asmo

You can read about it here:

Raven Crowking's Nest

Asmo


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## aurance

When I find the rare urge to start quoting famous figures in heated support of principles on a board such as this, I just take a step back and go "haha, why so serious, me?"

There are weightier things to invest your emotional energy in.


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## OnlineDM

Ah. Strange that he wouldn't include a link to that post in his farewell post. I guess maybe he figured that the people who would be interested in his departure would already understand the story behind it. Well, that obviously wasn't the case!

I guess I understand his rationale for deleting his past posts; I don't think it's a good decision, but it's his decision to make, I suppose.


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## Scott DeWar

El Mahdi said:


> Stealth Check = 33
> 
> *Relique du Madde goes to retrieve his popcorn, only to find the microwave empty*






Relique du Madde said:


> Damn my low perception skill.  If only I didn't use my power points to buy that power armor.




perception check

*chuckles as I watch El Mahdi slink off into the shadows*


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## Relique du Madde

I'm going by a statement that a lurker on CM told me... "This is normal RCK behavior.  He done it once before, so just wait a few months to a year and he'll be back."


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## diaglo

the answer is 42.


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## StreamOfTheSky

Asmo said:


> You can read about it here:
> 
> Raven Crowking's Nest
> 
> Asmo




Aaaaaaand....I STILL have no idea what's going on.  Was this "pro-rape thread" on ENWorld or CM?  What is this connection to Something Awful?  Also not sure what exactly he's upset about, but whatever.  I clearly just missed some big thread derailing argument of some sort.


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## Dog Moon

Plane Sailing said:


> Good luck with your RCFRPG, and thanks for your contribution over the years.
> 
> Cheers




Well, not as much thanks if he's going through and deleting all his posts...

Though I don't think I've posted much in RCK's threads, I've  been interested in most of them and feel that however he feels wronged, he should still leave some of his stuff for those random people who are browsing old threads, would come across his stuff and find use from them.  They have nothing to do with this current situation and should remain for the many people who have had nothing to do with this.

Just my opinion for whatever it's worth.  I mean seriously, how long would it take to go through 12.5k of posts and delete them all?  He should time himself.  

[I feel glad I missed this thread people seem to be talking about.]


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## Dannyalcatraz

StreamOfTheSky said:


> Aaaaaaand....I STILL have no idea what's going on.  Was this "pro-rape thread" on ENWorld or CM?  What is this connection to Something Awful?  Also not sure what exactly he's upset about, but whatever.  I clearly just missed some big thread derailing argument of some sort.




It was a series of threads here on ENWorld by Hunter99 that busted open this wasp nest: 2 of the threads involved discussions of villainous "Knightly" orders within his campaign world that were to be (seemingly) foes for the PCs to fight.  They had some nasty ideas about women...which is fine as far as setting up truly vile villains for players to fight.

The problem arose with some of his asides & explanations which at the very least blurred the line between his villains and his personal views.  So people complained.  Eventually, the threads got locked.

Beyond that, I don't know who got disciplined for what and in what fashion.  Clearly, though, somewhere along the way RC got POed.


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## Relique du Madde

Dog Moon said:


> Well, not as much thanks if he's going through and deleting all his posts...




Don't worry, RavenCrow King hinted to me that there is a possibility that his deleted posts may end-up in a future book he may write/compile.*


* Since that's what happened to many of his earlier deleted posts.


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## Asmo

There´s an interesting (?) comment to the blog from a former ENworlder:

 ProfessorCirno said... 

Splitting this up due to length.

I think it's worth mentioning that there was no sort of organized forum raid.

Grognards.txt is a thread on SomethingAwful that is literally more then a thousand pages long, devoted towards reposting awful things nerds say and do and laughing/groaning/crying about it, albeit also with some amazing tangents regarding tabletop game design, the nature of Catholicism, understanding privilege, and video game aesthetics vs graphics, to name a few.

When someone (not I, which I specify for hilarious reasons) posted the contents of the EN World threads - all three of them, in fact - we reacted as we would were it to happen anywhere else - shock, revulsion, etc. Your standard "I can't believe he's glorifying rape" reactions. At this time I was still posting at Circvs Maximvs despite having been perma-banned from EN World months earlier for the most boring reason imaginable. I and one or two others brought up these same threads in the "Asshats at EN World" thread and how awful it was, and questioned why the awful posts were allowed, but people stating that they were awful were not allowed.

Morrus reacted poorly when questioned about this. I've come to believe that it came down to a position of privilege - namely, he didn't understand that the "neutral response" would have been to shut the threads down entirely. Instead, he felt that the threads were not in any way insulting or demeaning to women. When he was called on this, the thread quickly grew ugly. Others from grognards.txt showed up after someone else linked the whole thing there.

By the end, Morrus not only refused to listen, regardless of how polite people tried to be in explaining what the problem was, he was stating that I had personally called in some kind of invasion to attack him out of revenge for being banned. I don't even know if he was involved in my banning! Nonetheless, he went so far as to claim that I had created grognards.txt in order to organize this. The thread, I feel the need to mention, was started in 2009. I don't believe I was even posting in EN World then. It didn't matter - Morrus painted me as some sort of batman villain who was leading his mooks to attack him personally, a vicious attack that was aimed at...trying to make him see that rape is bad. Truly a most dastardly plan. 

At any rate, it was not any sort of forums sanctified or organized raid. Several posters independently joined CM to try to explain to the forums, some kindly and some abrasively, that he was unintentionally condoning rape. The whole thing ended with Morrus declaring that CM would be shut down. Here is, I think, the appropriate place for mentioning the irony in this, considering CM was meant to be the "rougher" and "thick skinned" opposite of EN World.

Morrus, of course, did not shut down EN World, and wether he intentionally made the empty threat or if he really was going to shut it down will never be known. What is known is that everyone who criticized him (I don't want to name names) were banned not only from CM, but from EN World as well, while those who told people some rather vile things about murder and rape are not only left unbanned but were publically lauded by Morrus.

As for any sort of invasion on EN World, this is where things get a bit more distressing. Again, there was no organized raid against EN World. The thread in the Meta forums was linked to us, and we reacted in tears or laughter as we normally would. One poster from SA - one who was, I feel the need to point out, defending Morrus and EN World - posted in that thread, asking why it was ok to ban those who disagreed with Morrus, but not those who told us that we needed to be raped and murdered in quite a bit of gruesome detail. He was then banned on his post deleted.

It seems that all ones needs to do to constitute a "forums invasion" now is to be a "known poster at SA," a phrase that was used unironically quite a bit at the CM forums.

I know you and I very rarely saw eye to eye, Raven, but I felt this would be the best place to explain what happened from the viewpoint of The Anti-Rape Penguin. 

18 July 2011 00:17


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## Morrus

This thread is not to be used to reopen a closed topic please guys, thanks.


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## billd91

Asmo said:


> When someone (not I, which I specify for hilarious reasons) posted the contents of the EN World threads - all three of them, in fact - we reacted as we would were it to happen anywhere else - shock, revulsion, etc. Your standard "I can't believe he's glorifying rape" reactions. At this time I was still posting at Circvs Maximvs despite having been perma-banned from EN World months earlier for the most boring reason imaginable. I and one or two others brought up these same threads in the "Asshats at EN World" thread and how awful it was, and questioned why the awful posts were allowed, but people stating that they were awful were not allowed.
> 
> Morrus reacted poorly when questioned about this. I've come to believe that it came down to a position of privilege - namely, he didn't understand that the "neutral response" would have been to shut the threads down entirely. Instead, he felt that the threads were not in any way insulting or demeaning to women. When he was called on this, the thread quickly grew ugly. Others from grognards.txt showed up after someone else linked the whole thing there.
> 
> By the end, Morrus not only refused to listen, regardless of how polite people tried to be in explaining what the problem was, he was stating that I had personally called in some kind of invasion to attack him out of revenge for being banned. I don't even know if he was involved in my banning! Nonetheless, he went so far as to claim that I had created grognards.txt in order to organize this. The thread, I feel the need to mention, was started in 2009. I don't believe I was even posting in EN World then. It didn't matter - Morrus painted me as some sort of batman villain who was leading his mooks to attack him personally, a vicious attack that was aimed at...trying to make him see that rape is bad. Truly a most dastardly plan.




Looks like pure Cirno BS to me. Having seen the thread on CM, there was not much particularly polite about it, certainly not from Cirno. And at least one other frequent poster here hectored and hectored and hectored and hectored (see a pattern here?) on a personal level. 
While I believe the original thread crossed grandma friendly material pretty early on and the mods were slow to react, there were many who made their dislike of the subject matter known in asides and face palms and other methods without hectoring ENWorld moderation, without accusing any of them of supporting rape, and without generally getting themselves banned for poor behavior.

EDIT: Sorry, Morrus. Was still entering this when your mod message came through.


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## Asmo

Ah, yes; sorry Morrus, I´m just trying to understand what this is all about.

Asmo


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## delericho

RC, I'll be sorry to see you go. A big loss.

However, I think you're overreacting. I also think it's very poor form to go removing your posts en masse. Still, your call.

Farewell, and good luck.


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## StreamOfTheSky

It was those threads?  Apparently I read different posts than RC did.  I read a never ending stream of people (politely) telling the OP how utterly wrong he was, that those organizations were, sick, twisted, and evil, and how they wouldn't mind them existing in their games -- as evil entitities to mercilessly slaughter.


Have fun doing whatever RC....


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## Dannyalcatraz

Right.  But from what I understand from RC's posts- correct me if I'm wrong- some people may have been disciplined for being less than polite in those threads in response to either Hunter99's posts or the posts of others.  I never saw it myself, but that seems to be the gist of what RC's saying.


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## Rel

I wish to weigh in on this situation.  I do so not in my capacity as a moderator.  In fact I'm going through a very busy career transition and I'm on hiatus from my moderator duties at the moment.  But I have opinions as a long standing member of this site and here they are.

First of all, we play fantasy games with evil villains in them.  I see nothing particularly wrong with having these evil villains commit acts or hold attitudes that our modern sensibilities know are reprehensible.  However when the line blurs between our own beliefs and those of such villains then others are right to call us on them.  None of that changes the rules of ENWorld regarding being polite and respectful of course.

Speaking of reprehensible behavior, calling somebody a "rape-supporter" on the basis of not moving as quickly as the insult hurler would like in dealing with an unprecedented situation that hasn't been an issue in the history of this messageboard, is a great example.  It is simple, reactionary name calling and, in my opinion, grandstanding.  Furthermore, it was done repeatedly and with every intent to provoke a response.

Now the person crying "rape-supporter" may think that they are doing so for some greater good.  But what they are really doing is making it more difficult and frustrating to run this website.  There is a very real and reasonable concern that this will lead to others believing that hurling of insults across the internet being the best way to effect a policy change.  That's never going to be the case and reasoned words and a bit of patience will always serve you better.

If RC has determined that he doesn't care for how this all played out and the response of Morrus and the rest of the team here at ENWorld, that's his prerogative.  And, while I think it silly and time consuming, he can delete his posts if he wants.  I do think that doing all of that while still commenting via rep comments is a bit drama queen-ish but that too is his right.

The bottom line for me is this:  I think that Morrus approached an unprecedented situation the way a good leader should.  He did it with caution and did not act rashly.  If some felt it was too little too late then that's for them to decide.  But if they choose to go around throwing accusations of somebody being a "rape-supporter" when that person is nothing of the sort, then they can hardly be surprised when the insulted party chooses to sever any contact with them.

I, for one, am thrilled that those folks will not be posting at my favorite places on the internet any longer.


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## Erekose

RC leaving is a sad day for EN World - I can't comment on the reasons why or the thread in question but I can't help but think there must be an alternative option to leaving?


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## Scott DeWar

Erekose said:


> I can't help but think there must be an alternative option to leaving?




I have to echo this question. Though I am not sure if RCK will ever see any responses here.


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## Thanee

Dannyalcatraz said:


> some people may have been disciplined for being less than polite in those threads




And that is perfectly right.

Though the "sentence" should be chosen with the "emotionally charged" topic in mind... permanent bans might be a bit harsh (but I havn't seen the post, so maybe they are not).

*The end does not justify the means.*


And as far as "The Rules" go... AFAIK, the rule is, that topics that are perfectly game-related are ok as long as the discussion is on a reasonable level (in this specific case, it was apparantly decided, that despite the game-relation the topic should not be discussed further, probably because the level of discussion it spawned was everything but reasonable).

From what I can deduce here, Morrus and the Admins/Mods did the right thing.

Bye
Thanee

P.S. There is a Report button. If you think a post/thread is objectionable, use it! Replying to such a post is almost always the wrong choice, regardless of whether you think your opinion on the topic is "right".


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## Deset Gled

I'm going to try my best to not comment on actions taken against individuals in this case.  But I would like to question the way the mods are interpreting The Rules, because I'm not sure I understand or agree with them.

The first rule of ENWorld is:



			
				The Rules said:
			
		

> Keep it civil: Don't engage in personal attacks, name-calling, or blanket generalizations in your discussions. Say how you feel or what you think, but be careful about ascribing motives to the actions of others or telling others how they "should" think. People seeking to engage and discuss will find themselves asking questions, seeking clarifications, and describing their own opinion. People seeking to "win an argument" sometimes end up taking cheap shots, calling people names, and generally trying to indimidate others. My advice: don't try to win.




I am seeing a problem with the examples given, and with how the rule is being enforced.  Specifically, the rules only talk about being civil at the personal level, with the person you are actively in a discussion with.  Civility is not something that only exists on the personal level.  

A personal attack is uncivil, but so is a blanket attack, be it a gross generalization, religiously intolerant remark, or generally acting like a jerk.  It seems to me that many extremely uncivilized comments in these problem threads were allowed simply because they were being uncivil in general, rather than being insults of a personal nature.  There was frighteningly high number of blatantly sexist, homophobic, and racist remarks that went by without reprimand, seemingly because the mods didn't see a specific target to the comments (I can provide examples if requested).  

Frankly, I don't agree with this interpretation of the phrase "keep it civil".  If we really want to create a open, friendly community, we need to extend civility to groups, not just individuals.  You may not like gays or blacks or women, but ENWorld is not the place to discuss it (even if you don't insult any specifc gays, blacks, or women).


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## Umbran

Deset Gled said:


> Frankly, I don't agree with this interpretation of the phrase "keep it civil".




That's fine, because we don't use the "personal only" interpretation - the FAQ lists examples, but is not meant to be exhaustive.  

We frequently do moderate on the basis of incivility to groups - the "no religion" rule is largely such a case.  Same for "no politics".  In those topics, it is frequent that folks are uncivil to others with broad brushes.  And, now that it is clear that there's a new problem area, we've put up a new standing rule.


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## Darkness

Scott DeWar said:


> Though I am not sure if RCK will ever see any responses here.



He gave xp to the two posts right above the one you're replying to. (Among others.)


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## Dannyalcatraz

Thanee said:


> And that is perfectly right.
> 
> Though the "sentence" should be chosen with the "emotionally charged" topic in mind... permanent bans might be a bit harsh (but I havn't seen the post, so maybe they are not).
> 
> *The end does not justify the means.*



Agreed.

I couldn't say what got who punished, but I'm not surprised that Hunter99's posts might elicit some vitriol- enough to have gotten people to forget the "Report Post" button.  Or their "Ignore" lists.*







* which I don't use.  IME, the people in life I most wish to ignore are usually the ones I find I really need to pay attention to.


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## Aberzanzorax

You'll be missed, by me, certainly.


I'd wish that you'd take some time to make this decision, to shelve it temporarily, and come back when you've calmed down.

It seems as though mistakes were made, but they've been (or are being) set right.


My advice is to take some time, assess the community in a bit, and then choose to return, or not, as you like at that point.


Good luck to you.


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## El Mahdi

Dannyalcatraz said:


> * which I don't use. IME, the people in life I most wish to ignore are usually the ones I find I really need to pay attention to.




Very Well Said!


(*definitely deserving of XP, but I have to spread some more around first)


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## ThirdWizard

I don't read Meta often. 

But, when I do, longtime posters leave the forum.


Good luck to you, man. Enjoy your new found free time.


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## vic20

For the sake of conviction, RCK will be remembered, as the months and years go by, as the guy who ruined many scores of conversations by deleting his portion of the dialog.

Not the legacy he had intended, but the one he chose.


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## Dannyalcatraz

OTOH...

It could make some of those threads read like the David Tennant-era Dr. Who in the episode that introduced the Weeping Angels ("Blink").  You know, the 17 DVD dispersed Easter Egg 1/2 conversation he recorded?


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## eros

Good luck Raven Crowking


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## El Mahdi

Dannyalcatraz said:


> OTOH...
> 
> It could make some of those threads read like the David Tennant-era Dr. Who in the episode that introduced the Weeping Angels ("Blink"). You know, the 17 DVD dispersed Easter Egg 1/2 conversation he recorded?




Are you trying to tell us to not look away and don't blink, or RCK will get us...?


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## jaerdaph

There sure is a lot of "I quit the Internet, and I'm taking my stuff with me! (See you again in a day or two.)" in the online RPG community lately.


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## Dannyalcatraz

El Mahdi said:


> Are you trying to tell us to not look away and don't blink, or RCK will get us...?




Gosh, I hope not!

I was thinking more of the Easter Egg conversation.


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## Dice4Hire

DM Magic said:


> Did... Did I just get XP from a poster who no longer posts here?
> 
> What the heck?




Apparently lurking and giving xp is the new "leaving Enworld".


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## Dannyalcatraz

I call it "Schrödinger's XP"...


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## TarionzCousin

RC, if you are reading this, please send me a sign. Move the Ouija board. Flutter the curtains. Rattle the diceboxes... anything.



			
				DM Magic said:
			
		

> Did... Did I just get XP from a poster who no longer posts here?



DM Magic's XP total now needs an asterisk next to it.


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## Dice4Hire

Ghostwriting move over. The new boy in town is ghostxp.


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## the Jester

Deset Gled said:


> I am seeing a problem with the examples given, and with how the rule is being enforced.  Specifically, the rules only talk about being civil at the personal level, with the person you are actively in a discussion with.  Civility is not something that only exists on the personal level.
> 
> A personal attack is uncivil, but so is a blanket attack, be it a gross generalization, religiously intolerant remark, or generally acting like a jerk.  It seems to me that many extremely uncivilized comments in these problem threads were allowed simply because they were being uncivil in general, rather than being insults of a personal nature.  There was frighteningly high number of blatantly sexist, homophobic, and racist remarks that went by without reprimand, seemingly because the mods didn't see a specific target to the comments (I can provide examples if requested).




[MENTION=7808]Deset Gled[/MENTION], here's the thing: did you report those posts at the time?


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## CuRoi

Well...I go lurker for a bit and suddenly the whole place goes all World of Darkness on us... 

I haven't been around long but I liked RC's style and enjoyed his posts. Good gaming to the guy - and anyone else that got sucked into the drama. (You guys sure you can't just rock / paper / scissors a way out of this???)


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## Roland55

Sigh.

Goodbye -- and good gaming.

I, too, enjoyed reading your posts over the years.


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## Lanefan

See what happens when I leave you lot alone for a few weeks?  Sheesh!

Good luck RC, and I hope you find your way back here eventually.

Lan-"I'm out of it for a few days and everyone starts getting delusions of grandeur"-efan


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## nedjer

jaerdaph said:


> There sure is a lot of "I quit the Internet, and I'm taking my stuff with me! (See you again in a day or two.)" in the online RPG community lately.




Who and for what reasons?


Yeah I know the code's a bit much in the morning. Going to try a transparency later to tone it down


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## Dannyalcatraz

> Raven Crowking:
> Thanks....but I am imagining not.




I predict that 5 years from now, XP comments like this will be kind of like Bigfoot sightings or other urban legends.

"Hey, I got XP from Raven Crowking!"

"I'm calling BS on that- everyone knows there's no such poster as Raven Crowking!"

"Oh yeah?  Post his name 3 times in a thread and see what happens..."


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## Dog Moon

Dannyalcatraz said:


> I predict that 5 years from now, XP comments like this will be kind of like Bigfoot sightings or other urban legends.
> 
> "Hey, I got XP from Raven Crowking!"
> 
> "I'm calling BS on that- everyone knows there's no such poster as Raven Crowking!"
> 
> "Oh yeah?  Post his name 3 times in a thread and see what happens..."




I think in 5 years, most people will probably not even know who Raven Crowking is.  And not because of anything he's done, but just because that's how things are.

Who remembers Nightfall?  How many people know who Frukathka/Reveille was?  In 5 years, many of the people who know RCK won't even be here and there will be many new people who will have never heard of him.  I bet in 5 years someone will ask in a Necro'ed thread "Who is this Raven Crowking person and why are all the posts in this thread deleted?"  A lot of people will have no idea.


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## billd91

Lanefan said:


> See what happens when I leave you lot alone for a few weeks?  Sheesh!
> 
> Good luck RC, and I hope you find your way back here eventually.
> 
> Lan-"I'm out of it for a few days and everyone starts getting delusions of grandeur"-efan




Find his way back? He hasn't even *left* yet, that is unless someone is logging in as him to leave you XP.


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## StreamOfTheSky

I'm adding "lame sort-of leaving but still getting your word in without having to respond to anyone tactics" to my list of reasons I hate xp comments.


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## jaerdaph

Mod Edit:  Image removed.  Folks, you may think what you like about the gent, but let's have a little decorum, please. ~Umbran


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## Lanefan

It occurs to me that if RC is merrily deleting all his posts he'll eventually get around to deleting the ones in this thread, which would then make this an  exercise in surrealism of the highest order. 

Lanefan


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## Dice4Hire

Lanefan said:


> It occurs to me that if RC is merrily deleting all his posts he'll eventually get around to deleting the ones in this thread, which would then make this an  exercise in surrealism of the highest order.
> 
> Lanefan




Maybe we should make xp comments on the deleted posts about whatever contents we can imagine to make it more surreal.

I know this is a bad idea and I am sure the mods will agree with me. 

So don't actually do it.


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## Relique du Madde

Dice4Hire said:


> So don't actually do it.




Yeah... we don't want him to jump to #1 as a result of snark aimed at him.


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## Scott DeWar

we could either 
A) quote his posts for posterity, 

or
B) Xp exactly what  his says in his post. it woud give him lots of xp, though. Not sure if that is a good idea.


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## Hussar

Well, [MENTION=96020]ravencrowking[/MENTION], we've butted heads a number of times over the years, but, it is a shame to see you go.  You contributed good stuff to the boards and that's about as high a praise as it gets.

Take care.


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## StreamOfTheSky

Scott DeWar said:


> we could either
> A) quote his posts for posterity,




Probably the better idea.

Or, we could have some fun and make an intenet meme of sorts (not really since only we'd know about it and find it funny, so I guess more like an "in joke").  Post random quotes attributed to RC saying random or silly things in reponse to another post, things RC never actually said, but due to his total deletion of all his posts can never be conclusively proved that he did not say.


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## the Jester

It's rather a shame; one of my all-time favorite ENWorld threads was my first exposure to him in his awesome thread about fey adventures. Wow, was that eye-opening and awesome, and I've used fey extensively in my campaign for years.


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## vic20

RavenCrowking said:
			
		

> Posting random quotes attributed to my saying random or silly things in reponse to another post, things I never actually said, but due to my total deletion of all my posts can never be conclusively proved that I did not say.




It's like you saw this coming!

*No. As you probably know, this sort of spoofing is not something we tolerate. Please don't do it again. - Piratecat*


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## nedjer

By giving the dude no way back some of us are making ourselves look right proper tools here


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## vic20

nedjer said:


> By giving the dude no way back some of us are making ourselves look right proper tools here




I would LOVE it if he would/could come back. He'll need to cast a Fly spell though, as he removed all the bricks that made up his bridge to us.


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## nedjer

vic20 said:


> I would LOVE it if he would/could come back. He'll need to cast a Fly spell though, as he removed all the bricks that made up his bridge to us.




Those were his bricks and maybe they'd become a heavy load to carry. What might he build with a clean slate 

We should not allow our games to become troll bait and some of the behaviour all round, (and I ain't no saint myself), has been maybe a bit hasty.

Speak dudes, this is a pillar of your community driven to distraction by trolling, this is a guy who's gone the whole way and designed his own RPG . . . I vote Raven comes back and we (gamers not trolls) choose to put it behind us.


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## vic20

Raven Crowking said:
			
		

> Interesting times indeed.
> 
> By all means, tease away.  Stop your teasing short of intentional libel, though.  Or publicly encouraging actionable behaviour.  And if you are intending on committing libel, be a little smarter than this.  Don't publicly announce it.




Is it real, or is it memorex? 

Seriously, it would be great if RCK were able to find a way to come back, but it's all so sensitive and conviction-oriented I don't see it happening. Perhaps as an another identity someday....

"_Raven Crow Kenobi?_ Now that's a name I've not heard in a long time..."


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## nedjer

vic20 said:


> Is it real, or is it memorex?
> 
> Seriously, it would be great if RCK were able to find a way to come back, but it's all so sensitive and conviction-oriented I don't see it happening. Perhaps as an another identity someday....
> 
> "_Raven Crow Kenobi?_ Now that's a name I've not heard in a long time..."




This is not a pop at your post - just a continuance of how the thread comes across 

It's kind of interesting to see how taking a principled stand, a distaste for trolls' jibes and getting irritated about others' demeaning the hobby can transition into RCK is out-of-order.

Equally, if I read it correctly, as a result of RCK's stance EN reviewed their options and decided to recognise that the topic under discussion needs alarm bells all over it in future. So that'd be RCK 1, EN 1, and the trolls get a Nerf dart up the nose.


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## Piratecat

Folks, I'd have though by now that it was clear we don't allow post spoofing or general harassment. RC decided this isn't the place for him, and that's fine. While I agree that trying to go back and remove old posts is a little unusual, there's no need to fuss too much about it. 

Time to move on. Any comments on this before I swing this thread shut?


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## nedjer

While I lust after EN XP more than saffron-dipped truffles I'd rather see you just jump back in the saddle without another blink. $10, which is a huge amount for a Scot to wager, says no one else blinks either - and shame on them if they do.


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## vic20

RCK- I went to your site and read your thoughts on the Riddle in the Tomb of Horrors. It's a shame that you aren't getting the audience you deserve, as your thoughts clearly belong in the ongoing ToH thread right now here @ ENWorld, and your insights would be great fuel for the community.

If you can transcend the necessary gates and shed the ego to experience the miracle of rebirth, it would be a joy to see you again. 

Best of luck. Enjoy the fish!


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## Plane Sailing

nedjer said:


> Equally, if I read it correctly, as a result of RCK's stance EN reviewed their options and decided to recognise that the topic under discussion needs alarm bells all over it in future. So that'd be RCK 1, EN 1, and the trolls get a Nerf dart up the nose.




Nope.

EN reviewed the situation quite independently of RCK's decision, which (according to his blog) came after the original ENworld decision.


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