# SquareForge - Modular Dungeons (Tile System for RPG Mapping)



## SquareForge

If you are an RPG gamer and use figures on a map with square tiles, then this may interest you. 

I will be launching a Kickstarter Campaign for a new Modular Dungeon Tile Mapping System for RPG Gamers. The system will allow you to create maps for your RPG sessions on the fly. The Kickstarter is NOT live just yet. I kind of wanted to reach out and get to know some of the people who might be interested in seeing this project through so that I could gather some feedback, and properly prepare for this campaign.

Although, I'm too new on this Forum to share any links, I have posted a few pics, and a simple video demonstration on my website. Please let me know if you'd like to check it out. If you can't already tell, I'm new to Forums, so please bare with me.. With a little bit of experience, I'm sure I'll get the hang of this social stuff 

*About The Tiles*
The SquareForge tiles are comprised of 16 individual patterns. We offer decks of 60 dual-sided 3.5 inch square cards with different terrains pictured on either side. For example; Dungeon tiles on one side, with Forest tiles on the reverse, or Caverns on one side with Water on the reverse. We will launch with these two decks, but plan to introduce many other terrain decks too, including;



Desert/Marsh 
Hell/Ice-Snow 
Mountains/Jungles 
Tombs/Graveyards 
Castles/Ruins 
Cities/Sewers 
Villages/Forts 
Roads/Trails 
Plus: Urban, Space, Technology, Gothic, Zombie Apocalypse & more! 

The basic concept is to keep the map tiles relatively simple, and square-ish. The 16 patterns allow a lot of flexibility for constructing rooms, hallways, open forest and so on. Plus, the decks are designed to be compatible with one another. Dungeon Masters will appreciate the freedom and flexibility of working with this system.


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## SquareForge

Here's a couple of snapshots of the game tiles.


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## Dice4Hire

What is the tile quality? Laminated cardstock? Or thicker?

It looks a bit thicker, about a mm?


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## SquareForge

Dice4Hire said:


> What is the tile quality? Laminated cardstock? Or thicker?
> 
> It looks a bit thicker, about a mm?




All cards are die-cut, have rounded corners, and are printed in full  color on both sides. All cards are printed on 3.5 x 3.5 inch heavy clay  coated 165lb card stock which gives them a nice texture and good  heft.


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## am181d

I'm having trouble telling from these images, but these look like they have only limited modularity to me. (Certain tiles clearly assume that they are laid next to certain other tiles.) The quality seems pretty nice overall, but I'm not sure if they're flexible enough to be an improvement over existing solutions. (Dungeon Tiles, Flipmats, Battlemat, etc.)


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## SquareForge

am181d said:


> I'm having trouble telling from these images, but these look like they have only limited modularity to me. (Certain tiles clearly assume that they are laid next to certain other tiles.) The quality seems pretty nice overall, but I'm not sure if they're flexible enough to be an improvement over existing solutions. (Dungeon Tiles, Flipmats, Battlemat, etc.)




I uploaded 2 more photos. These images show the 16 different tile types. I have used other tile sets, including Dungeon Tiles, and thought that those systems were extremely limited by comparison. (Although they do add more detail, there are only a few configurations)

The idea for SquareForge came to me when I began developing RPGs for the computer. I discovered that most isometric tile system video games, use 16 various tile types for all of their maps. I've basically done the same thing here, except instead of a computer putting all of the pieces together, the Dungeon Master gets to decide. We beta tested these tiles for 2 years before I finally decided to offer them to the general public. 

But, yeah, you're absolutely right. Some tiles won't fit next to other tiles. However, there's a lot of creativity that can be incorporated too. There isn't a single tile in my 60 card deck that I wouldn't consider using. You might not use them all for every map, but you'll certainly benefit from having them.


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## darjr

I like it. My concern is with tile movement. What if someone bumps the table?

I'm having visions of only laying out the tiles that the characters can see, a much better way to do fog of war or torchlight reveals.


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## darjr

Oh and the link.

http://www.squareforge.com/


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## SquareForge

darjr said:


> I like it. My concern is with tile movement. What if someone bumps the table?
> 
> I'm having visions of only laying out the tiles that the characters can see, a much better way to do fog of war or torchlight reveals.




I should have mentioned that this system is excellent for 'fogs of war'..  Good Call!

And although my photographs don't show it, I always place my tiles over one of those rubberized drawer-liner (or toolbox-liner mats) The rubbery surface material helps the tiles adhere, without causing them to get gummy in the process. Without the rubberized mat, these cards do tend to slip and slide around on the table. But this is true with just about all tile systems, regardless of the thickness.. right? 

Thanks for posting 'my' website link, by the way!


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## SquareForge

I took a couple of photos of the tiles using a rubberized 'toolbox liner' beneath the cards. As you can see, the bright blue material is rather ugly, but you can purchase this stuff in any color that you prefer, and it's pretty cheap stuff too! Best of all, it solves the problem of slippery cards on a smooth tabletop.


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## GX.Sigma

They look really nice, but a lot of dungeons are drawn in 10-foot scale on graph paper, and 10-foot-wide corridors are pretty standard in D&D... Any plans for a tileset that would be more compatible with that?


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## the Jester

These look worlds better than Dungeon Tiles.

Nonetheless, I've found that preprinted map bits don't do it for me- they are simply too restrictive. GX.Sigma mentions the 10' corridor as one example; I'd add "anything with an unusual shape" to the list. For instance, how would you do a circular room? What about irregular caves with winding passages? 45 degree angle intersections? Etc. I've given up on prebuilt walls and terrain pieces for this reason (I have a bunch of old wall pieces from some cool company or other, but they're all straight).

For me, unless premade terrain features can give me _exactly_ what I have on my own map, I've found myself completely dissatisfied. So, while these are cool- and honestly, for the tiles crowd, they are probably a win- I personally wouldn't be interested. 

Don't take that as discouragement, though; like I said, if I was a tile guy, I'd jump on them as a "better than what I have seen out there right now" option.


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## SquareForge

the Jester said:


> What about irregular caves with winding passages?




The Cavern/Water tile set is a good example of tiles that have more jagged edges. I'm still waiting to proof the finished product, the deck should arrive in the mail by Monday, but for now, take a look at this early prototype that uses cavern walls. I'm doing the same thing with water too... And I can do the same thing with rounded walls, and can cover a lot of other trouble areas too. Diagonal paths could present a problem without some sort of special connector piece, but I'm already considering creating an add-on deck for 10' wide corridors. Keep those ideas coming.. 

By the way, thanks for the compliments too!  I really appreciate your feedback.


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## Dice4Hire

Well, ten foot wide corridors just need tiles that have three in a row on one edge the corridor. Put them side by side and you are set. 

Looking at the sets above, it seems a bit weak on ten foot wide corridor possibilities, so might be something to change a bit.

I do have to say the pictures are definitely winning me over. I have tons of flip maps and dungeon tiles and dungeon command tiles and WOTC boardgame tiles, but these could be another option for me to pursue.


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## Nytmare

Though I would never really have a use for them, these look really spectacular.  Had these been an option while I was still fumbling around trying to find my mapping style they would have definitely been one of the top contenders.  

These stand head and shoulders above Dungeon Tiles.


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## the Jester

Okay, now you've impressed me again!

One thing I'd add to this discussion- though it looks like you're probably already on the same page- is not to add in arbitrary features like dead bodies, magic circles, etc. Those REALLY limit how useful a lot of Dungeon Tiles are. 

If these do well, you might consider adding an urban/city set. 

Good luck!


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## SquareForge

I made these two mock-up images to demonstrate the use of the Cavern/Water deck. Keep in mind, this was created in Photoshop, so the finished cards are going to look a little different (rounded corners, for example). But this should give you at least one idea of how these tile sets look assembled..  By the way, I should receive the Cavern/Water deck in the mail on Monday or Tuesday. If they pass my personal quality control inspection, then I'll be sure to post some actual photos. (fingers crossed)


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## SquareForge

the Jester said:


> Okay, now you've impressed me again!
> 
> One thing I'd add to this discussion- though it looks like you're probably already on the same page- is not to add in arbitrary features like dead bodies, magic circles, etc. Those REALLY limit how useful a lot of Dungeon Tiles are.
> 
> If these do well, you might consider adding an urban/city set.
> 
> Good luck!




Yeah, I totally agree... Arbitrary features should never be added to a modular tile set. We can add our own props later. (as in the last couple of photos that I posted, you can see the inclusion of a bunch of handmade clay props and figures)

By the way too... I'm launching this product-line with the Dungeon/Forest and the Cavern/Water decks, but I intend to create a lot more over the course of the first year.. Here's a list of the terrain sets that I have on my list for development so far.. (I'm always looking for more ideas!)



Desert/Marsh
Hell/Ice-Snow
Mountains/Jungles
Tombs/Graveyards
Castles/Ruins
Cities/Sewers
Villages/Forts
Roads/Trails
Plus: Urban, Space, Technology, Gothic, Zombie Apocalypse & more!


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## darjr

I think some of those props as separate punch out tokens would be a fantastic stretch goal. Doors and secret doors, furniture, fires, some terrain, bodies, carts and small huts and tents and market booths and....


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## mach1.9pants

Dude this is awesome! Having loved the tiles in the WotC board games I was waiting for them to release more, a no brainer. But they didn't and you have so when can I send you my money!?


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## SquareForge

mach1.9pants said:


> Dude this is awesome! Having loved the tiles in the WotC board games I was waiting for them to release more, a no brainer. But they didn't and you have so when can I send you my money!?




Man, I love feedback like this!  I'm almost ready to sell these decks. I'm proofing the Cavern/Water deck early this week. (I just want to inspect the finished cards, and make sure they meet my quality control) If they pass my personal inspection, then I gotta figure out how I'm going to package them. I may need to design a box, or something. Finally, they'll be made available on the website, although the price will be about $25/deck. (ouch! I'm sorry, but they are so expensive to print-on-demand like this) but at least they'll be available.

The whole purpose of the Kickstarter Campaign is to help reduce the price. If I can purchase about 500 decks in advance, then I will pay a lot less to have them made. the end result is a much cheaper price for you guys. So that means, if you really wanna help drive the price down, then you should order you cards through the Kickstarter campaign. But then you gotta wait till April, cuz I am still working on the video, and may even fine-tune the cards if they don't pass my personal inspection.

Anyway, thanks for your vote of confidence. I'll try and keep things moving, so we can get these things in your hands as soon as possible!


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## mach1.9pants

I can wait til April I guess, cos I also have to have them shipped to New Zealand


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## SquareForge

Dice4Hire said:


> Well, ten foot wide corridors just need tiles that have three in a row on one edge the corridor. Put them side by side and you are set.
> 
> Looking at the sets above, it seems a bit weak on ten foot wide corridor possibilities, so might be something to change a bit.
> 
> I do have to say the pictures are definitely winning me over. I have tons of flip maps and dungeon tiles and dungeon command tiles and WOTC boardgame tiles, but these could be another option for me to pursue.




hey Dice4Hire, your point about the 10' wide hallways has been bugging me since you posted  I just dug out a deck of my regular Dungeon cards and tried making a basic 10 foot corridor, and although the cards weren't designed to do so, I actually succeeded. (sort of) I tested to see if I could go around corners, and it's just another way of thinking about the same set of tiles. The only drawback is the edges are flat, and you lose the dropshadow effect on the tiles when you use the cards like this. 

I got to thinking more about this problem, and think I may have stumbled upon something rather interesting. The 16 tile types work great for single-square width hallways, but to enhance the deck for double-square width halls, and an even wider array of options, I'd have to design the same 'floor/wall' texture with 16 mirror patterns. For example, take a basic single wall tile (wall covers 3 squares along the edge of the tile) The mirror of that would be a tile with 3 squares of floor along the edge, and the remaining 6 squares filled in with wall texture. By having access to the mirror 'floor/wall' patterns, one could seamlessly create 10' corridors, and a whole lot more.

Note: The image below is the result of using my existing 60-card Dungeon deck to try and emulate 10' corridors. I also threw in some 20' corridors, and the smaller 5' halls to see how they all mingled together. Not too bad, although I'm not really using the tiles as intended. You would notice some of the problems if I tried to do this with a tile set with jagged edges, such as the Water, or Cavern set.

I'll see what I can do to improve upon this, and post new pics soon. Thanks for the tips!


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## Dice4Hire

The image posted above looks pretty good. I'll be interested to see what your rethinking comes up with.

BTW, a friend of mine is interested, so you have two backers when you get the kickstarter live.


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## Ratskinner

the Jester said:


> One thing I'd add to this discussion- though it looks like you're probably already on the same page- is not to add in arbitrary features like dead bodies, magic circles, etc. Those REALLY limit how useful a lot of Dungeon Tiles are.




Amen to that. I prefer tiles like these to be as "generic" as possible. Two-tone is best.


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## GX.Sigma

SquareForge said:


> hey Dice4Hire, your point about the 10' wide hallways has been bugging me since you posted
> 
> I got to thinking more about this problem, and think I may have stumbled upon something rather interesting. The 16 tile types work great for single-square width hallways, but to enhance the deck for double-square width halls, and an even wider array of options, I'd have to design the same 'floor/wall' texture with 16 mirror patterns. For example, take a basic single wall tile (wall covers 3 squares along the edge of the tile) The mirror of that would be a tile with 3 squares of floor along the edge, and the remaining 6 squares filled in with wall texture. By having access to the mirror 'floor/wall' patterns, one could seamlessly create 10' corridors, and a whole lot more.
> 
> I'll see what I can do to improve upon this, and post new pics soon. Thanks for the tips!



Your eagerness to respond to criticism/suggestions (as well as your apparent intelligence and good judgment) make me feel good about supporting you. Count me as a backer too!


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## SquareForge

I'm in the process of developing and testing an Expansion Set which will address the issues pointed out with 10' corridors, as well as a few other glitches I recently discovered. I should be busy for the next few days as I figure everything out, and nail down this thing once and for all  

Thanks for all of the tips and advice.. You guys have all been great! These modifications may slow down the Kickstarter project, but it'll be a much better product by the time it's ready to launch.


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## dogoftheunderworld

SquareForge said:


> ... These modifications may slow down the Kickstarter project, but it'll be a much better product by the time it's ready to launch.



That is what Stretch Goals are for


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## chrisdojo

These look great!


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## Alarian

Any progress to report?


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## slykly1

Cool I hope it succeeds.


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## Perram

I dig the idea, and I can see how it could be rather neat.  But I worry the tiles are too small.  If they were on chip board or something thicker, it wouldn't be a problem, but because they're curling up it means lots of little gaps to catch wind / the bottoms of miniatures as they're moved over things.


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## darjr

I think those were just his paper prototypes. .... where did you see the curling?


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## Perram

darjr said:


> I think those were just his paper prototypes. .... where did you see the curling?




http://www.enworld.org/forum/showth...RPG-Mapping)&p=6102372&viewfull=1#post6102372

On the bottom of those sets of images, you can see it rather well on the forest tiles.


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## darjr

hmmm didn't look like curling to me, at first, just maybe that the underlay wasn't even. But I think I can see a bit of curling.


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## SquareForge

SquareForge has just launched downloadable PDF Tiles available for purchase on our website. Now you can download our tile sets and print them yourself. 

We will still be releasing our professionally printed decks, but are still working on the tile sets. We've nearly quadrupled the size of our decks from the original 16 tiles to the 60 tile patterns now available in two 30-pattern sets (The Master Set and Expansion Set). To further complicate things, we've decided to create 4 variations of each tile pattern for a total of 120 cards per set (That's 30 patterns with 4 variations per pattern). With the Master & Expansion Sets that a total of 240 individual tiles between the two sets. And this is just for one of the Terrains (We are launching with four Terrain choices; Dungeons, Caverns, Forests and Waters).

Soon, we'll upgrade the downloadable PDFs on our website to include the same tile sets as the printed cards. Any purchases made now will be rewarded the missing variations when they are released. As a matter of fact, any upgrades, enhancements, fixes, or improvements that we make will always be available to you at no additional costs! 

http://www.squareforge.com/pdf-modular-tiles.html

If PDF tiles interest you, please be sure to check out the new SquareForge tiles. If you're still waiting for the printed cards, please hang in there just a little bit longer. Once the 4 variations of all of our terrain sets are complete, we've got to upload them to the printer, order a copy for ourselves, proof them, and then make any adjustments as necessary before these cards can be sold to the general public. We expect this process to take about 2 more weeks. (fingers crossed) 

The Kickstarter Campaign will be the last step (if we go that route at all) We'll make announcements as we learn more.


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## howlingmime

Neat idea.  Could also lead to some nice random dungeon creation -- either by the DM before the session or live as the players crawl through the wizard's maze.

Couple this with a thematic gaming mat (or even 12"x12" tiles that provide the dungeon or exterior terrain base and you've got something really neat.  The issues I could see with these cards is that 1) it might be too easy to walk off the edge of the map and 2) the possibility of the edges and corners curling up, especially if played in humid conditions, or if a drink is spilled near them.

If the cards are laminated and thicker than typical cards, this becomes less of a concern.  Also, since they're available as a pdf, they could be printed and glued to a thicker cardstock or foamboard.

Good luck with this as a Kickstarter campaign.


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## Baddreams

Very nice! I just checked out your video. I just started a Kickstarer myself that might work pretty well with yours. Mine is a Table that you custom design and I've been seeing a lot of Table Top gamers create their own Terrain/Boards and using it with my Table. You're able to put the Terrain/Boards on one side of my Table and flip the Table over when youre done playing so it's back to a "normal" table with a nice wood stain of your color choice. Please search "Limitless Table" on kickstarter if you have a few seconds. Thanks!


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## SquareForge

It's been quite a while since I've posted anything. I thought I'd share the latest Square Forge updates...

When I started this thread, Square Forge consisted of 16 different tile patterns. I followed your guidance and increased my tile selection. I spent long hours, manually selecting from hundreds of variations, until I came up with 60 tile patterns that I felt really needed to be included in my sets. From 16 to 60! I divided those tiles into two groups. The Master Set contains 30 of the most useful tiles, while the Expansion helps to fill in the gaps with the remaining 30 patterns.

The next step was to create the missing tiles for each of my 4 terrain sets. I accomplished that feat, and made the tile sets available in PDF format through the website. Then I moved on to the next challenge... To find a professional printing company who could produce the decks in high quality, but at a price most people could live with.

After play-testing with these cards, I realized that the cards need a little bit of revision. My original 16 patterns provided 4 variations of each pattern (a total of 64 cards). These slight variations allowed the playing field to take on a much more organic look. I liked that aspect very much, so I've spent the past couple of weeks updating my 4 terrain sets to include an additional variation for each card. The work is still under-way, but I'll be doubling the size of my decks in the coming weeks. Anyone who has already purchased the PDFs will be able to re-download them at leisure (once they are launched) at no extra costs. When you purchase any PDF from Square Forge, you get lifetime access to any adjustments or upgrades at no additional fees. If you have already purchased our tiles, just watch for our Newsletter posts in the coming weeks. We'll be sure to announce this when the tiles are ready to download.

After much consideration, I've finally decided to stick with this formula. Each Master (or Expansion) Set will consist of 30 unique tile patterns, with 2 graphic variations per pattern. That's a total of 60 cards per set. Since there are two sets, that means there will be 120 cards per terrain type. The variations are intended to give your map-making scenarios more randomness.

WHAT'S NEXT?

* Double the size of our PDFs. (in the coming weeks)

* Professionally printed decks. (both print and pdf options will be available through our website once the PDF updates are completed)

* FREE sample PDF (hand drawn ink pen on aged paper) Note: The free PDF will be available to anyone who registers on our website, as an incentive to get more people interested in the Square Forge tile system. I'm hoping people actually like the free set, and use them in their games. In the meantime, I've dropped the price of our Water Tiles to just $0.99, which could serve as a sampler for now. This temporary price reduction will be restored once I launch the free sample PDF.

* New terrain types. I've got a long list of terrains that I want to develop, and would encourage you guys to shout out some of your ideas so that I can see what is most anticipated. I'm not looking for new or interesting ideas, because the list is already so long. I hope you guys will shout out only the ideas that you want to see developed immediately. You guys have already been extremely helpful in the development, so chances are, I'll listen to your requests. 

As far as the Kickstarter Campaign is concerned.. I've somehow managed to squeeze by without it. The printing company that I found is willing to print on demand, which means I don't need to invest in large inventories of product. I may consider Kickstarter for future enhancements, such as apps, or accessories, but for now, it just doesn't seem necessary.

Oh yeah.. One last thing... If you live in Las Vegas, and wanna get together to play-test the Square Forge tiles... Then consider contacting me. I'd love to sit in on a session, and see how your Dungeon Master integrates these cards into your game. I'd love to film some of your game, and post some of the footage on the website.


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## Dice4Hire

Sorry to hear about the kickstarter not being done, but when physical products are available, be sure to let me know.


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## SquareForge

Dice4Hire said:


> Sorry to hear about the kickstarter not being done, but when physical products are available, be sure to let me know.




I'll definitely announce the printed tiles when they are ready.  Thank you! 

You guys really want this Kickstarter thing, don't you? lol... It could  be helpful in the promotional awareness department, so I guess I  shouldn't write it off completely just yet.


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## SquareForge

*SquareForge Revisited*

Hi everyone! 

Wow! I can't believe how long it's been since I've posted anything about the SquareForge project that I started nearly 2 years ago. I still haven't heard enough feedback to help me drive this idea to the next level. I am moving out of Las Vegas in about a week. My job has changed in such a way that I can focus on my side-projects once again. (Which is good news for SquareForge!) Here's a few of the things that are on my mind lately...

PDF VS PRINT: 
I've thought long and hard about producing a professionally printed deck of my dungeon tile sets. There really is no problem with fabricating this idea. I've already constructed the individual tiles long ago. I have found several printing companies who have shown interest in producing the decks with drop shipping options. The problem I keep encountering is the high costs associated with these pre-printed decks. I just don't feel good about asking $15 to $25 for a deck of cards. Plus, there are limitations to the pre-printed decks.. You would only get X number of each available tile. By printing the cards yourself, you give yourself the freedom of picking and choosing which tile variations to print, making as many copies as you desire, and putting them on whatever media you prefer (i.e. heavy card stock, foam board, etc). 

The pre-printed decks require a slightly different format than the PDFs. More specifically, there's a bleed around the edge of the cards intended for machine-cutting. Because of this difference, I have to create two completely different sets of cards for each deck. It doubles the task of designing new cards. 

So, at least for now, I've decided not to produce any pre-printed decks. 

Now that I will have more available time, I do plan on designing a few more terrain sets. Originally, SquareForge was just 16 patterns. More recently, I have developed 120 individual tile patterns for each terrain. The number of tiles allows for an enormous range of variations. This really is one of the best methods for laying out dungeons that I have ever used.  Whether I'm creating dungeons on the fly, or reconstructing a dungeon from an existing module, this system is compact and versatile. 

For anyone who has been watching this thread, especially if you've downloaded any of my tile sets. I'd love to hear your feedback. I'm getting ready to design some new terrains.


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