# What's the best and worst D&D book you own from any edition?



## Olaf the Stout (Nov 10, 2013)

I was looking at my bookshelf of D&D books (2E, 3.xE and Pathfinder) and thinking about how "good" or "bad" some of the books I owned were.  Heck, several of them I'm not sure I've even done more than flicked through the pages once.

So I'm interested in seeing what everyone regards as their "best" and "worst" D&D book in their collection.  The book(s) can be made by TSR, WotC or Paizo or they can be a 3rd-party product.  It can also be from any edition.  It just has to be one you own.

Best and worst are entirely subjective.  You may decide your best book is the one that you got the most value for money from (i.e.  your PHB that you've used to get over 1000 hours of gaming out of) or it may be the book you enjoy looking at the most, even if you don't use it much.

Similarly, your worst book may be one that you found all the rules within it to be horribly broken, a book that you horribly overpaid for, or a book that had fluff that ruined for a particular setting or character for you.

For me, the best D&D book I own is the Shackled City Adventure Path by Paizo (3.5E).  It's my best D&D book because with it I ran a campaign for over 3 years and about 100 sessions, starting at 1st level and ending at about 18th-19th level.  It was the longest campaign I've ever DM'd and the only one that reached the end point I'd hoped for at the start of the campaign.  Yeah, I changed and added many things in the adventure (including a full re-write of the final adventure), but I definitely couldn't have come up with a campaign half as cool by myself.

Normally I'm complete bibliophile with my books.  I hate to write in them at all or get them damaged.  Almost all my RPG books are in pristine condition.  By the end of the campaign, my SCAP hardcover was completely trashed.  The front and back covers the book spine were all damaged.  That wasn't because the book was poorly made.  It was simply due to how much time the book spent in my bag as I took it to and from work to read on the train or on my lunch break.  The book earned it's keep and then some.

The worst D&D book I own would be the Epic Level Handbook by WotC (3.0E).  This is because of a couple of reasons.

Firstly, I paid around $80-$90 AUD (about $75-$80 USD on current exchange rates) for the book.  A combination of no knowing about buying books online and a very low AUD exchange rate meant I paid a lot more for the book than I should have.

Secondly, I've never had a PC reach 20th level, or ran a campaign where the PC's have.  So I've never used anything from the book in-game.  I read through the book a little when I bought it, but haven't cracked the cover in 5+ years.

Thirdly, having now run quite a bit of D&D 3.5E at Level 15+, I've discovered that it's not anywhere near as fun to run as it seems.  There are that many spells, magic items, abilities and effects in play that it's not much fun to keep track of as a DM.  So I don't think I'd enjoy running an epic level campaign.  So the book just won't be of any use to me in the future.

So that's my best and worst D&D book that I own.  What's yours?


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## Olaf the Stout (Nov 10, 2013)

Whoops, this should be in the D&D and Pathfinder forum.  Mods feel free to move.


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## Ahnehnois (Nov 10, 2013)

Best:
Probably Unearthed Arcana (3e). This is really what D&D is about: taking the published game and making it yours. Taking the variations and sharing them through the OGL. Every book should have looked more like UA.

Worst:
Probably Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil. I'm cheating a bit since this is an adventure and not a rulebook (OP didn't specify) and I'd likely say the same about any other adventure, but I received it as a gift and it just seems like some sort of cruel joke that as a DM I would be expected to use this instead of my own ideas.

There are some mediocre ones and some with very mixed ideas or poor editing, but I can't think of any rulebooks I have that disgust me on the same level.


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## Olaf the Stout (Nov 10, 2013)

Ahnehnois, there's no restrictions on the type of book.  It could be a core rulebook, a splatbook, a monster book, adventure, whatever.  I chose an adventure as my best book so RttToEE is a perfectly fine choice as a worst book.


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## Stormonu (Nov 10, 2013)

Best: <EDIT - oops, D&D> D&D Moldvay Red Box set.  It's the D&D I started with.  I still love to play it to this day.

Worst (that I still own): Cardmaster (for AD&D 2E).  It was a product that came out during the era of the likes of Heroquest and Warhammer Quest and computer games like Dungeon Hack (those three were good, Cardmaster is not).  It's a boxed set full of thin, cheesy dungeon cards and a "monster" deck.  Mostly designed for solo random dungeon play.  Utterly boring, thrown-together ruleset.  I'm not sure why I haven't purged it from my bookshelf.

P.S.:  Epic handbook is pretty up there for worthless for me for the same reasons.  It's a shame I was a completionist back then; I bought the autographed version (mainly for the Olidamara dice).


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## delericho (Nov 10, 2013)

Best is probably the "Campaign Sourcebook and Catacomb Guide" for 2nd Edition. That book probably taught me more about DMing than any other source.

Worst is a bit trickier... The "Epic Level Handbook" is pretty bad, as is "Deities & Demigods" (3e version). Indeed, the two together are shockingly bad - in order to really use the deity stats you need epic level PCs, but the ELH uses a largely-incompatible system for such powerful characters! "The Book of Exalted Deeds" is also remarkably poor.

But I think the _worst_ is probably "Scourge of the Howling Horde". It's an incredibly dull, railroady adventure, pretty much every stat-block is wrong (including several monsters drawn unchanged from the "Monster Manual"). But worst of all, it was clearly typeset assuming full colour, and then printed in greyscale, with the net result that several of the sidebars are nigh-unreadable.


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## Olgar Shiverstone (Nov 10, 2013)

Best:  Aurora's Whole Realms Catalog.  2E-era but really setting and edition independent; it's just a really fun flavorful book.

Worst: Toss up between Epic Level Handbook and Book of Vile Darkness.


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## Bedrockgames (Nov 10, 2013)

Best: Realm of Terror, ravenloft boxed set

worst: the 3.5 Expidition to Castle Ravenloft Adventure. The original Ravenloft module was amazing, this new version was awful, basically caused me to stop buying WOTc products for the remainder of the 3.5 run. Just reduced a cool setting and adventure to something that felt more like a video game.


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## Greg K (Nov 10, 2013)

Best Book? It depends.
Rules: Unearthed Arcana
Class (3e):  Psychic's Handbook (Green Ronin), Shaman's Handbook(Green Ronin), or Witch's Handbook(Green Ronin)
Class (2e): Complete Thief's Handbook
Class (1e):  Witches (Mayfair Games)
Setting:  Dark Sun or Al Quadim: Land of Fate 
Monster related: Advanced Bestiary (Green Ronin) or Book of Templates (Silverthorne/Goodman Games)

Worst Book?  I am not sure.  I pared down my pre-3e books, avoided most 3e WOTC supplement like the plague, and was selective about third party supplements that I purchased.  My worst supplement is probably, one of the free pdfs that I picked up on RPGNow or, maybe, B2: Keep on the Borderlands (not a fan of the caves themselves)


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## Crothian (Nov 10, 2013)

The best is Rules Cyclopedia. It has everything one needs in one book and the rules and game work great. 

Worst if I'm including 3rd party books then some of the FFE and Mongoose books were just terrible in the age of d20 bloat. For actual D&D books I have to go with WG7 Castle Greyhawk. After waiting for it and hoping it would be some awesome epic module we get a very bad parody comical thing that failed to be funny.


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## Grumpy RPG Reviews (Nov 10, 2013)

Best; The 3rd Edition Forgotten Realms Source book, which i argue is the gold standard for setting source books.

Worst; Well, Forest Oracle is comedy bad, redeeming it somewhat. So I will second the votes for Book of Vile Darkness.


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## Jan van Leyden (Nov 10, 2013)

Best: 3e Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting. Enjoying to read and extremely motivating to start a campign in the world.

Worst: 3e Hero Builders Guid Book. Utterly useless, layout-wise a big disappointment after the core books.

Notabene: I don't sell my books...


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## amerigoV (Nov 10, 2013)

Best - a tie for a few

 I agree third the 3e FR book. I was (and still am not) a FR fanboy, but I wanted to get it to see what the designers did to interweave the new rules into a setting. That part itself was meh, but the layout of the book was extremely good. I loved the 3 or 4 plot hooks at the end of each area/country write-up.
 3e PHB - it got be me back into D&D
 1e DMG - still a lot of nice nuggets in there

Worst - a tie for a few

 4e PHB - it was not the rules (the system itself is pretty good the times I played it), it was the layout and writing. It unfortunately was in competition with the Savage Worlds core book for what direction I was going to go. SW just screams "play me" - the 4e PHB is just a paperweight as it just is not a compelling book 
 FR Faiths and Pantheons - it cut/paste from the FRCS, maybe added a paragraph to each entry, then added a huge stat block. I thought I was getting a book on the FR religions, not an Epic NPC/monster manual. A counterpart that almost made the above list was Eberron's version of that book - exactly what I was looking for.
 There is a number of late 3e books that I picked up that I really have never read in detail (Complete Scoundrel, Dragon Magic, etc)


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## Meatboy (Nov 11, 2013)

Best is probably the 3e PHB it was the first dnd product I got that I really grokked and it hot me and my pals playing for years.

worst was the sword and fist supplement. That was overpriced and just generally an aweful book.


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## Jan van Leyden (Nov 11, 2013)

Meatboy said:


> worst was the sword and fist supplement. That was overpriced and just generally an aweful book.




Yeah, Sword and Fist is a very strong runner up to this coveted title!


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## Scrivener of Doom (Nov 11, 2013)

*Best:* Strictly speaking I have to go with _Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting_ for 3E but my heart has a special place for _Faiths & Avatars_ which not only launched a huge number of campaigns but brought me back to D&D.

*Worst:* _Underdark Adventure Guide_ by the grossly overrated Goodman Games and authored by Mike Mearls. For me this book defines the d20 glut and explains why I am not a Mike-Mearls-as-a-designer-fan. When you see 10 or more prestige classes each with their own unique saving throw progression for each of their saving throw categories, you are left wondering why some of the time inventing this little piece of pointless randomness wasn't spent actually making even one decent prestige class.


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## gweinel (Nov 11, 2013)

As best book(s) I would consider the Planescape box set(s). It was the RPG the marked me and our gaming group for the years. 
Very close i would put the Birthright box set(s) for the humongous inspiration for my home brew world. 
As a honorary mention I could not miss the Oriental book of 3e. A second PH and a game setting together. 

Througout the years i am playing i stumbled and many times i bought many really bad books. From these that I bought the first that crosses my mind is the 4e Manual of the Planes. Being a Planescape fan, I found it really unispiring.


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## howandwhy99 (Nov 11, 2013)

Best is the 1e DMG I think. That and the players really help define the game for me. (Still haven't been able to afford an original game, but that should be changing very soon).

Worst - I own - is Penumbra's Splintered Peace, which isn't all that bad, but its political rules, the reason why I bought it, are not at all something I would use know. And the adventure isn't exactly exciting if you don't use the abstracted, sort of competitive politicking and dialogue systems. (Actually, that one I'm trying to give away, so maybe not much longer for it either)


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## evilbob (Nov 11, 2013)

Bedrockgames said:


> worst: the 3.5 Expidition to Castle Ravenloft Adventure.



Ha!

Best:  Probably the 3.5 Expedition to Castle Ravenloft campaign (adventure).  I've used this book a million times for many different games and I love the style and the detail they put into some of the encounters.  Probably some of the best D&D games I've run.  To be fair, the layout is a bit frustrating and the typos, editing mistakes, and unfinished ending of the book make it a little infuriating.  It's also a straight-up murder machine against the PCs and you really have to be careful of a TPK at any moment (which can be good or bad).

(A close second for best is 4.0's Dungeon Delve.  Not particularly well written or well designed, but a fun book that makes 4.0 1-shots soooo easy.  The 3.5 Player's Guide is also an extremely well-made, well-written, and well-used book.)

Worst is probably the original 4.0 Player's Handbook, not because I disliked the system, but because 1) when it was printed it was FULL of so many typos and editing errors that I couldn't believe anyone would have signed their name to it, and 2) within months (weeks?  hours?) the book was worthless because they changed all the rules.  If it had been a PDF that got updated, that would have been one thing, but as a physical _book_ that meant that it was crap.  Eventually the game had so many changes the book was completely useless as reference material.


Edit:  Actually, I thought of another "worst" book, although I never bought it personally (my GM did, though, and we played it):  the first pre-made adventure released for 4.0, written by Bruce Cordell.  (Can't remember the title.)  That was one of the worst-written, dreary slog-fests I've ever experienced.  Talk about showing off some of the worst aspects of 4.0!  Our GM ended up scrapping a huge chunk of stuff just because it went on FOREVER with no real purpose.  It also had a near-certain TPK written into one of the earlier encounters.  Bleh.  Terrible design.


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## Manabarbs (Nov 12, 2013)

I'm mostly thinking of player crunch books. Other books just don't leave as strong of an impression on me.

Best is probably Expanded Psionics Handbook (3.5). It's a hard call, but I feel like that book contains the most total overall awesome of any book I own with the least dubiousity. (And the one big smudge of dubiousity, the Soulknife, is still at least cool conceptually.)

Runner-ups are 4e PHB2, 4e Dark Sun Campaign Setting, 3.5 Tome of Battle, and PF Advanced Player's Guide. (This isn't meant as a slight to pre-3.5 editions, I just don't remember any of the books well enough to call them the best.) I also think that the 3.5 environmental books - Sandstorm, Frostburn and Stormwrack - are underrated, but this isn't the underrated books thread.

Worst is also tough, but I think the worst (of first-party releases; I'm not going to drag out some d20-bloat-era book of garbage monsters or something) is the 3rd Edition Epic Level Handbook. It starts with a pretty lousy premise (let's take the very worst part of the game, the high levels where the game doesn't work at all and nobody ever plays, and then add on TOP of that), and then follows up with an uninspiring execution that addresses none of the problems that high-level play has mechanically. It also drops the ball on satisfactorily addressing the big conceptual issue for high-level play, which is what the characters might even reasonably be doing at that level. It's not entirely ELH's fault, on the grounds that it's a high degree-of-difficulty book to do well, but that doesn't stop it from being super useless.

Runners up: 4e Heroes of Shadow (The wheels came off on 4e's generally solid design here, and its layout is annoying and bad); BoVD and BoED.


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## Olaf the Stout (Nov 12, 2013)

I'm surprised that the Epic Level Handbook is the worst book for so many people.  I thought I would be alone in that being people's worst books, especially given how many horrible 3rd party books were released during the 3.0E era (looking at you Fast Forward Entertainment!).  Thankfully I was wise enough at the time to not actually buy any of those books.



Greg K said:


> Best Book? It depends.
> Rules: Unearthed Arcana
> Class (2e): Complete Thief's Handbook




Yeah, Unearthed Arcana would be up there for me as well.  I quite liked how they pulled back the curtain on some of the rules and explained why they worked they way they did.

Complete Thief's Handbook was the first ever splatbook I bought for D&D and, with my first ever D&D character being a thief, I remember it quite fondly.  The kits were good fun.



Olgar Shiverstone said:


> Best:  Aurora's Whole Realms Catalog.  2E-era but really setting and edition independent; it's just a really fun flavorful book.




I own the PDF of this and agree wholeheartedly about it being a very fun and flavourful book.  Definitely one of my favourites.  The 3.5E Magic Item Compendium is it's crunchier that I also love.  It has added a lot of diversity to my 3.5E game, but I also love also the descriptions and illustrations of the items in the book.


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## Hussar (Nov 12, 2013)

Let's see. Best books.  The Foul Locales: Urban Blight book from Mystic Eye Games is a fantastic book and one of the best setting (generic) books I've used.  It saw constant use in a lot of campaigns.

Worst:  3e DMG.  Hands down.  Poorly organized, dry and pretty much pointless for actually trying to learn how to DM.


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## Olaf the Stout (Nov 12, 2013)

Hussar said:


> Worst:  3e DMG.  Hands down.  Poorly organized, dry and pretty much pointless for actually trying to learn how to DM.




I don't know that I completely agree with you about the 3E DMG being horrible, but at least they made a lot of improvements in DMG II.  The 3.5E DMG II is probably one of the better books in my collection.


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## Jhaelen (Nov 12, 2013)

Best: Hammerfast - 4e adventure locale; a deceptively thin booklet that is full of awesome with probably hundreds of adventure hooks.
Worst: Complete Psionic - 3e supplement to the Expanded Psionics Handbook; a shoddy collection of tidbits, ranging from uninspired, over useless, to utter crap that really caused me to lose faith in Bruce R. Cordell. It even included errata to nerf perfectly reasonable powers in senseless ways. How this "thing" managed to get printed will always remain a mystery to me. It was a slap in the face for every fan of psionics in D&D.


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## Bedrockgames (Nov 12, 2013)

I thought the 3E DMG was one of the best.


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## Ahnehnois (Nov 12, 2013)

I don't know. As DM Guides go, I think the 3e DMG is pretty good, albeit with a lot of wasted space and bad advice (still better than the others I've seen), but the rationale for having a separate DMG has never been clear to me. It seems like a combination of stuff that could have been in the main book (magic items, environment rules), stuff that shouldn't be anywhere (XP rules, wealth by level, example campaigns), and advice.


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## GlassEye (Nov 12, 2013)

The things I consider 'best' are one that I enjoyed reading _and_ inspired me to create campaigns and got me excited to play.  In that regard the 3.5 DMG failed because I found it terribly boring to read and it didn't inspire me to do anything.  I would have a hard time narrowing my best down to one product but the ones I feel are contenders for best are: Den of Thieves (2e), Elements of Magic revised (3.5e), Magical Medieval Society: Western Europe (3.5e).  I also enjoyed reading the Binder section of Tome of Magic and the related 3pp Secrets of Pact Magic but I never got the opportunity to use them in play.

For 'worst': I second the horrible Castle Greyhawk adventure.  It marketed itself as one thing and turned out to be something totally different and it failed at what it was trying to be as well.  There are a number of totally uninspired and dull books that could also go on this list but I don't think any of them reach the badness of that adventure.


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## Halivar (Nov 12, 2013)

Best: Definitely Unearthed Arcana. 3rd Edition had been getting pretty stale, and we'd started playing other systems. UA brought us back into the D&D fold. Gestalt, in particular, became default D&D for us.

Honorable Mentions: Manual of the Planes was imaginative, and I loved some of the PrC's. Book of Exalted Deeds gets a bad rap, but I liked the focus on really, really good characters after what I thought were a spate of books intended for evil or unheroic campaigns (anathema in our group).

Worst: Arms and Equipment Guide. Utterly useless. Never used. 'Nuff said.

Dishonorable Mention: When one of my group's resident power gamers got his hands on a copy of Tome of Magic and cleared it with the DM, the game just went straight to hell. This book is emblematic of the power creep that cemented, IMHO, the necessity to kill 3.5 and take its stuff.


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## Scorpio616 (Nov 12, 2013)

Best: 1E DMG

Worst? That's hard since I sold off a few stinkers. Book of Exalted Furverts was sold off within a week of arrival.

For sheer incompatibility with the base game, 3.5 Magic Item Compendium is a real stinker. But so much of the Wotc Supplements had the same issue.

I can't say Hero Builder's Guidebook since that was the only time WotC actually did some codifying for their alignment system. That counts for a tiny bit IMHO.

Worst: Freedom from 2E Darksun. Not only did Troy Denning's novels ruin the setting, the PCs in this adventure get to watch it get done by high level NPCs while they sit on the sidelines.


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## Olaf the Stout (Nov 12, 2013)

Why do you say the MIC wasn't compatible with the base game? Because many of the items seem better than the DMG magic items?

Personally the MIC is one of my best books.


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## Manabarbs (Nov 12, 2013)

Olaf the Stout said:


> I'm surprised that the Epic Level Handbook is the worst book for so many people.  I thought I would be alone in that being people's worst books, especially given how many horrible 3rd party books were released during the 3.0E era (looking at you Fast Forward Entertainment!).  Thankfully I was wise enough at the time to not actually buy any of those books.



I singled out ELH over random terrible 3PP because I've actually put time into trying to bash ELH into something that even kind of works, while most bad 3PP products barely register with me enough for me to remember their names.

In undergrad, one or two of the campus houses and maybe the TTRPG club had these boxes of supplements that had been donated mostly by graduating students over time that were sort of community property, and while some of it was okay, a lot of it was some of the most confusing nonsense that I'd ever seen.  I'm not even talking so-bad-it's-good; I'm talking just, like, mishmashes of AD&D and 3e/3.5 stats and presentation in the same product, references to non-existent action types, new made-up bonus types for every bonus (A +2 Greater Seelie bonus to AC! A +4 Titania's Favor bonus to Bluff and Persuasion, which is presumably supposed to be Diplomacy or something?), that kind of stuff. I'm pretty sure that at least one of the box benefactors really, really liked fae stuff, because that sort of material was not only overrepresented (although to be fair, that was a pretty common well for 3PP to go to in general), but seemed to have the least quality control. I'm pretty sure you could have an entire fairly large party made up of people playing different takes on a stock Faerie PC race just using stuff from those books. And they'd almost all have at least one confusing ability that doesn't work quite right or be just hilariously unbalanced for a LA+0 PC race, or else "balanced" with infuriating RP things. Lots of trademark 3PP nonstandard templating, that sort of thing.


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## Keldin (Nov 12, 2013)

Olaf the Stout said:


> Personally the MIC is one of my best books.




Likewise here.  But, then again, one of my characters is an artificer, which makes this book particularly relevant.


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## Scorpio616 (Nov 12, 2013)

Olaf the Stout said:


> Why do you say the MIC wasn't compatible with the base game? Because many of the items seem better than the DMG magic items?



Uh, yeah. Either they changed the standard, or it's blatant power creep. I don't remember a chapter updating the DMG guidlines, though I certainly remember the huckster's spiel of



> with interesting items at every price point, and with exciting, aggressively priced options for every class and character level. Combining hundreds of revised and repriced items from previous sources with a wagonload of brand-new, never-before-seen-or-even-imagined magic items, this book is your D&D character's key to the candy store.




DMG items had pricing issues, and sadly the very book that should of fixed that didn't.


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## gamerprinter (Nov 12, 2013)

Best: UA 1e, Pathfinder Advanced Players Guide.
Worst: toss up between - Book of Vile Darkness, Epic Level Handbook, Tome of Battle (Book of 9 Swords).

The reason for no 3PP listed, is I didn't buy much 3PP before Pathfinder, perhaps only 1 or 2 books and they were decent books. Since PF, I've purchased a ton of 3PP and have had nothing but good luck there as well. I will more than likely purchase products from some PF 3PP before even considering other Paizo PF books.


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## Olaf the Stout (Nov 12, 2013)

Why Tome of Battle: Book of 9 Swords?  Power creep?

Personally I like it. When it came out it made melee guys "cool" again. In hindsight it was obviously a test case for 4E mechanics.

So far in my games I've had a PC take levels in Warblade and Crusader. They are definitely stronger than a fighter, but I think that is a good thing as the generic 3E fighter was the poor cousin to most other classes.


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## Mr. Patient (Nov 12, 2013)

Best: Ptolus.  Several lifetimes of great gaming in there.  Honorable mentions: 1e DMG, 3e Manual of the Planes.

Worst: 4e MM 1.  Never has a core book been made so completely obsolete.  There's almost nothing in there that's even usable, let alone inspiring.  Dishonorable mentions: Book of Exalted Deeds and Unorthodox Bards, which managed to take an underpowered class and make it weaker.  Also the worst-edited thing I've ever purchased.


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## Hussar (Nov 13, 2013)

Halivar said:
			
		

> Dishonorable Mention: When one of my group's resident power gamers got his hands on a copy of Tome of Magic and cleared it with the DM, the game just went straight to hell. This book is emblematic of the power creep that cemented, IMHO, the necessity to kill 3.5 and take its stuff
> 
> Read more: http://www.enworld.org/forum/showth...-you-own-from-any-edition/page3#ixzz2kTmng7w5




Really?  I loved this book.  Fantastic art and caster classes that were, if anything, underpowered.  What power creep did you see in Tome of Magic?


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## gamerprinter (Nov 13, 2013)

Olaf the Stout said:


> Why Tome of Battle: Book of 9 Swords?  Power creep?
> 
> Personally I like it. When it came out it made melee guys "cool" again. In hindsight it was obviously a test case for 4E mechanics.
> 
> So far in my games I've had a PC take levels in Warblade and Crusader. They are definitely stronger than a fighter, but I think that is a good thing as the generic 3E fighter was the poor cousin to most other classes.




Just not the direction I want to go in my games. I prefer the existing melee guys when I play - I almost never play casters, so I never 'needed' improved melee-ers, I was always happy with the way the were (I never thought they lost their 'cool'). I bought the book only to see what the stink was about, to be better informed, not for any need to bring it in my game. Of course I prefer ranger or paladin only, and never play fighter nor rogue.

I've never got the ToB fan's argument that this improved fighters. Fighters still exist, they didn't get improved, rather a bunch of bizzaro martial adepts showed up who weren't fighters in any sense of the word. If the word 'melee' characters were opted instead of 'fighter', the argument would have more meat, but ToB fans never say melee, they always say "it improves the fighter..." (a statement that makes no sense at all...)


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## Greg K (Nov 13, 2013)

gamerprinter said:


> Worst: toss up between - Book of Vile Darkness, Epic Level Handbook, Tome of Battle (Book of 9 Swords).



I own BoVD. For myself, if I view it, entirely, as a DM supplement and, as such, I don't find it to be that bad and find more usable content  than most WOTC non-setting or non-monster books
 If I was looking at it as a player resource, however, I would find it very disappointing.  However, I don't allow evil PCs. I do, however, allow one or two spells in my game for PCs.
So, viewing it as a DM supplement,  I find it to be one one of WOTC's better books despite me feeling it to be just an "average" D&D supplement- far below Unearthed Arcana or Fiendish Codex I


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## Greg K (Nov 13, 2013)

gamerprinter said:


> Just not the direction I want to go in my games.






> I've never got the ToB fan's argument that this improved fighters. Fighters still exist, they didn't get improved, rather a bunch of bizzaro martial adepts showed up who weren't fighters in any sense of the word. If the word 'melee' characters were opted instead of 'fighter', the argument would have more meat, but ToB fans never say melee, they always say "it improves the fighter..." (a statement that makes no sense at all...)




Personally, I didn't like the direction ToB took either.  I prefer Mearls's Book of Iron Might from Malhavoc one I got a major error in how they built one of the maneuvers (it was designed using the wrong base component)


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## Elf Witch (Nov 13, 2013)

There are several best for me. Races of Dragons inspired and entire world setting and campaign for me. The Kalamar Atlas is the best atlas of a fictional world hands down. 2E Deities and Demigods for the Realms brought a lot of good ideas for clerics and how the different temples work. 

The worst the 3.0 splat books they really didn't add anything to the game.


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## Elf Witch (Nov 13, 2013)

There are several best for me. Races of Dragons inspired and entire world setting and campaign for me. The Kalamar Atlas is the best atlas of a fictional world hands down. 2E Deities and Demigods for the Realms brought a lot of good ideas for clerics and how the different temples work. 

The worst the 3.0 splat books they really didn't add anything to the game.


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## dd.stevenson (Nov 13, 2013)

I'm looking for things that totally inspire me to run campaigns, and that don't utterly disappoint me when I do run them. Thus:

*Best*: 3E Forgotten Realms, Birthright Boxed Set, Al Qadim Boxed Set, 3E Eberron
*Honorable Mention*: Paizo's AP line, which continually gets me excited about running campaigns in Golarion, even though I can't stomach the rules.

*Worst*: 4E PHB (so joyless it hurts), and 3E PHB (for promising so much and then letting me down)
*Disreputable Mention*: Most published 2E adventures, sadly.


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## Jhaelen (Nov 13, 2013)

Halivar said:


> Dishonorable Mention: When one of my group's resident power gamers got his hands on a copy of Tome of Magic and cleared it with the DM, the game just went straight to hell. This book is emblematic of the power creep that cemented, IMHO, the necessity to kill 3.5 and take its stuff.



Err, what? Are you maybe confusing editions here? The 3e Tome of Magic contained three new types of magic that were generally considered flavourful but seriously underpowered.

I just remembered another candidate for the best D&D book: The 3e City of Stormreach supplement for Eberron. Just like Hammerfast, it's a brilliant starting point for a new campaign.


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## Halivar (Nov 13, 2013)

Ok, help me out guys, maybe it wasn't Tome of Magic, but it was one of the later splats. It had spells with the "Stygian" descriptor that could drain levels. The introduction of those spells killed 3.5 at our table.


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## Nagol (Nov 13, 2013)

Halivar said:


> Ok, help me out guys, maybe it wasn't Tome of Magic, but it was one of the later splats. It had spells with the "Stygian" descriptor that could drain levels. The introduction of those spells killed 3.5 at our table.




Hmm, all I can think of off the top of my head is _Fell Drain_ the +2-level meta-magic feat from _Libris Mortis_.  Any creature damaged by a spell also acquires a temporary negative level.  It is somewhat valuable if you used one of the ways to mitigate the meta-magic cost.


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## ThirdWizard (Nov 13, 2013)

Best: Planescape Boxed Set
Worst: Elven Handbook


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## Random Bystander (Nov 13, 2013)

I do not feel strongly enough about any D&D book I own to call one "worst" or "best". However, the fighter class as presented in the PHB is a failure, IMO.


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## Halivar (Nov 13, 2013)

Random Bystander said:


> However, the fighter class as presented in the PHB is a failure, IMO.



Which one?


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## Mallus (Nov 13, 2013)

gamerprinter said:


> I've never got the ToB fan's argument that this improved fighters. Fighters still exist, they didn't get improved, rather a bunch of bizzaro martial adepts showed up who weren't fighters in any sense of the word.



I thought the argument was ToB offered good _replacements_ for fighters and/or other existing martial classes. 



> If the word 'melee' characters were opted instead of 'fighter', the argument would have more meat...



I'm pretty sure that's what was meant. 

If I had to pick a best I'd have to say the AD&D DMG. 

My favorites by edition are:

AD&D - the Trinity (PHB, DMG, MM).

AD&D 2e - The Complete Bard's Handbook (no, I'm kidding), Faiths and Avatars (even though I'm not a big Realms fan).

3e - Arcana Uneathed, The Book of Nine Swords (it offers some excellent replacement fighters!), the Tome of Magic.

4e - none that I own (I liked the system, I don't like the way it was presented).

As for worst... most of the 3e-era splatbooks, particularly the ones with all the repeated material.


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## gamerprinter (Nov 13, 2013)

Mallus said:


> I thought the argument was ToB offered good _replacements_ for fighters and/or other existing martial classes.
> 
> 
> I'm pretty sure that's what was meant.
> ...




It's not worth looking up, but I am almost certain every post in this forum discussing the issue, not once is the statement that "here's a good replacement for fighters", rather "improvements to fighters". I don't believe I ever seen the argument for what it's meant, only how it's misspoken.


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## Random Bystander (Nov 13, 2013)

Halivar said:


> Which one?



Hmm...I have not played fighters from every edition, so I can not pick the worst fighter.


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## Jhaelen (Nov 14, 2013)

Halivar said:


> Ok, help me out guys, maybe it wasn't Tome of Magic, but it was one of the later splats. It had spells with the "Stygian" descriptor that could drain levels. The introduction of those spells killed 3.5 at our table.



Ah, okay. This sounds more like the 'Spell Compendium'. It included a couple of wonky spells from the 'Book of Vile Darkness', which was initially released at a time when 3.0 was quite finished and 3.5 not quite released. Originally, these spells had been balanced by causing the caster to accumulate 'corruption' or something like that, but for some reason in the 'Spell Compendium' they simply omitted that drawback without adjusting the spells' power. It also introduced a couple of other broken-good spells and was the main reason why many felt that clerics and druids were overpowered in 3e.


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## Mallus (Nov 14, 2013)

gamerprinter said:


> It's not worth looking up, but I am almost certain every post in this forum discussing the issue, not once is the statement that "here's a good replacement for fighters", rather "improvements to fighters". I don't believe I ever seen the argument for what it's meant, only how it's misspoken.



OK... but parsed that way it doesn't make any sense (because it's true the Bo9S classes/mechanics don't offer 'improvements to fighters'). I operate under the twin assumptions a) people usually _intend_ to make sense and b) people frequently misspeak. So I try to read for meaning, and not to find fuel for semantic arguments.

Truth be told, it makes me a terrible proofreader, and it don't help my code debugging any, either. But we all have our crosses to bear...


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## gamerprinter (Nov 14, 2013)

Mallus said:


> OK... but parsed that way it doesn't make any sense (because it's true the Bo9S classes/mechanics don't offer 'improvements to fighters'). I operate under the twin assumptions a) people usually _intend_ to make sense and b) people frequently misspeak. So I try to read for meaning, and not to find fuel for semantic arguments.
> 
> Truth be told, it makes me a terrible proofreader, and it don't help my code debugging any, either. But we all have our crosses to bear...




The thing is, I'd like to see a mechanical way to improve fighters, not a replacement set of melee classes that work in a completely different way.

While I am often misunderstood, in both forum discussions as well as in general conversation, I always use as precise of language as possible as there is nuance in exact language. I don't misspeak, so it's usually not my assumption that others are misspeaking when I discuss issues with them. I don't want to argue semantics, I want to discuss specific issues. However, it becomes semantics when the people you discuss issues with can't use the right verbage. I can't necessarily guess when people are misspeaking. Say what you mean (correctly) or don't say anything at all.


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## Hussar (Nov 18, 2013)

gamerprinter said:


> The thing is, I'd like to see a mechanical way to improve fighters, not a replacement set of melee classes that work in a completely different way.
> 
> While I am often misunderstood, in both forum discussions as well as in general conversation, I always use as precise of language as possible as there is nuance in exact language. I don't misspeak, so it's usually not my assumption that others are misspeaking when I discuss issues with them. I don't want to argue semantics, I want to discuss specific issues. However, it becomes semantics when the people you discuss issues with can't use the right verbage. I can't necessarily guess when people are misspeaking. Say what you mean (correctly) or don't say anything at all.




But... But... I was just told, repeatedly, many, many, many times, that there is no need to improve fighters.  That it's all just made up by DM's who lack the ability to run a balanced game.


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## Jester David (Nov 18, 2013)

Torn on the "best". 
As a Ravenloft fan I'm quite fond of _Carnival_ but that's a side product. And I really liked the 3e _Uneathed Arcana_.

But, then again, _Ptolus_ is inarguably the best product I have and a personal favourite. There's just so much to gush about that book before you even get to the content. 

The worst... hrm...
Wow, this is going to upset some people but the 4e core rules. I have the boxed set. Despite running 4e for a year and playing for two the books are pristine. They saw almost zero use being rendered irrelevant by updates and the online tools. I occasionally used the PHB for rules questions but once I got the _Rules Compendium_ the core books never left my shelf. I don't think I got my money's worth from them.


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## Ahnehnois (Nov 18, 2013)

Hussar said:


> But... But... I was just told, repeatedly, many, many, many times, that there is no need to improve fighters.  That it's all just made up by DM's who lack the ability to run a balanced game.



I sincerely doubt that anyone has ever told you that.

There's no need to improve fighters relative to any other particular class. There is plenty of room to improve all the classes.


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## Cadence (Nov 18, 2013)

1e DMG is my best - treasure trove of ideas, quotes, suggestions, and wacky tables.  Been my favorite since I first got it in the early 80s.   Runners up are the original B2 (still my favorite adventure) and the Moldvay Basic (although I don't think it does as good a job teaching a bunch of people to learn to play on their own as we nostalgize it doing). 

4e PhB is my worst - The 4e DMG would have beaten it if I still had it.   I've seen enough posts by @_*pemerton*_ and @_*Manbearcat*_  to know what a horrible job the DMG did selling the edition's mechanics (I wonder how my group would have reacted to it if we had it explained well at the time).  The PhB did the same kind of job for selling the edition's setting.   The 3e Book of Vile Darkness and Book of Exalted Deeds were pretty vile too, but I don't own the one I used to have anymore.


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## was (Nov 18, 2013)

Worst...Book of Nine Swords in 3.5


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## the Jester (Nov 18, 2013)

Best: Hard to say- but I think I'm going to come down on the side of the 1e DMG.

Worst: Not half as hard, but there are still a few contenders- but I think the 2e DMG wins.


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## Olaf the Stout (Nov 18, 2013)

was said:


> Worst...Book of Nine Swords in 3.5




What about it didn't you like?


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## pemerton (Nov 18, 2013)

This is a hard question: I've got a lot of D&D books, and have used them in different ways over the years.

For single best book I'll go 4e PHB, for showing me that D&D could really be the sort of game that I wanted to play.

For single worst book I'll nominate an adventure module that, in principle, I would have liked to use: Expedition to the Demonweb Pits. A shocking railroad that I could never use even close to how it's written in a million years.


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## Novaseaker (Nov 18, 2013)

Hmm, this is really hard.

I'm so torn for the best book, I have to separate it into categories for best rules and best flavor.

Best Flavor: Sharn, City of Towers. While the Eberron Campaign Setting (3.5) was obviously what got me into Eberron, the Sharn sourcebook pretty much stole my heart. I've run in and played games set entirely in Sharn, and in one game where me and friends were playing private investigators, we once went about 6 hours (real time) of just pure roleplay, getting into the setting and our characters. The crunch bits toward the back aren't much to talk about, but the setting of the City of Towers is fantastic and gritty and noir and so, so awesome.

Best Crunch: Tome of Magic (3e). This book stands out to me as a sort of masterpiece theater of sourcebooks, detailing three entirely new magic systems, each with its own class, prestige classes, monsters, and other crunch. It was fantastically laid out, and it sparked my imagination so well.


Worst stuff. Hmm. Also hard to pin down. There are lots of books I never got to use (Tome of Battle, Epic Level Handbook, Deities and Demigods) but I derived lots of enjoyment from anyway (the ELH was just fun for me to read, and Deities and Demigods was like number porn. Just got a kick out of seeing what Thor's attack with Mjolnir looked like!). But if I had to choose one...

Dragonlance Campaign Setting (3e). It just did nothing for me. It described a world much better described elsewhere, and the crunch was laughable (Hey, wanna play a bard that has no spellcasting and gets nothing to make up for it? How bout a class even weaker than that? Then the Noble is right for you! Want to play a Paladin of Paladine? Tough! They don't exist!) Overall just a worthless book.


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## HiLiphNY (Nov 18, 2013)

Best: Ptolus

Worst: Savage Species


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## NotZenon (Nov 18, 2013)

Best:  Unearthed arcana (3rd ed),  I got alot of use out of red hand of doom (although it has its flaws), and rise of the ruin lords
Trailblazer is by far the best 'fix' to 3rd, although i never got to run it for more than a session here or there cause everyone wanted to play pathfinder or 4rth at that point. 

Honorable mention:  i got more use out of the 2cnd ed players handbook than anything (mostly cause thats when i started gaming)  i must have read it 10 times. 

Worst:  the "splat" books from just about any edition, but in particular, complete warrior, sword and fist
Dishonorable mention:  The complete book of Elves,  i loved and hated this book,  it had lots of good stuff in it but in the end just made elves and their kits way to powerful.


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## Agamon (Nov 18, 2013)

Best?  The 1e DMG.  While B/X is my favourite edition, and the 2e Monsterous Manual was the epitome of monster books, the AD&D DMG is just a special book.

Edit: I noticed the OP allowed 3rd party options. If we're allowing retroclones (which, honestly, is what PF is), then Adventurer Conqueror King System by Autarch is slightly ahead of the DMG.

Worst?  Probably the stinktacular Epic Level Handbook for 3e.  The premise of high-level play seemed cool at the time.  Live and learn.  The Book of Vile Darkness and Stronghold Builder's Guidebook are the other contenders for "why did I spend money on this?"


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## Remus Lupin (Nov 18, 2013)

Best book: hard to say. The short answer is "whatever's grabbing my imagination RIGHT NOW!!!" But if I had to pick one: The red Moldvay basic book, because I started there and it basically fed my imagination for years when I was a kid.

Worst: Stronghold Builder's Guidebook. Just. Dreck. Completely useless for any practical purposes for building a stronghold for your character in an actual campaign context.


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## athos (Nov 18, 2013)

Best :  1st ed. AD&D core books.  It's hard to explain to people that didn't play in 1977 how wonderfully new and original these works were.  I still use ideas from the 1st edition to this day.

Worst :  4th ed. PHB.  I ended up selling all my 4th ed. books after about 4 months.  The system just sucked.  I tried it for a few months and just couldn't convince myself that this was D&D.


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## Olaf the Stout (Nov 19, 2013)

One book that I'm surprised hasn't been mentioned is Weapons of Legacy (3.5E book).

I really wanted to like that book as I think the concept of a cool weapon, with an interesting backstory, that gets better as you go up in levels is a really good one.  However, the mechanics behind them really didn't work.

I mean, who wants a weapon that, while being really cool, makes you have worse saves, less hit points, and less effective at wielding all other weapons.  Balancing cool weapon abilities by reducing the PC's saves, hit points and BAB was just not a good idea as it did not encourage people to want a Weapon of Legacy.

I tried hard to use this book in one of my campaigns, but gave up in the end because it just work well as written.  I do hope someone has another crack at the evolving weapon concept in 5E though.


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## NotZenon (Nov 19, 2013)

ah yes, the stronghold builders guidebook.  that was a HUGE waste of money!  To me the arms and equipment guide was right up there as well.


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## Jhaelen (Nov 20, 2013)

Olaf the Stout said:


> One book that I'm surprised hasn't been mentioned is Weapons of Legacy (3.5E book).
> 
> I really wanted to like that book as I think the concept of a cool weapon, with an interesting backstory, that gets better as you go up in levels is a really good one.  However, the mechanics behind them really didn't work.



Yup, that was an underrated book. I got some good use out of it, but only after reverse-engineering the math and changing cost to xp and gold, only. I created one item of legacy for each of my players plus a couple of extras for powerful npcs. Most players were pretty happy to have them, especially the one with the whip-master fighter who received the 'whip of concordant opposition' (created from the intertwined skin of a demon, a devil, an archon and an angel) that allowed him to bypass all kinds of damage reduction.


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## Ahnehnois (Nov 20, 2013)

Remus Lupin said:


> Worst: Stronghold Builder's Guidebook. Just. Dreck. Completely useless for any practical purposes for building a stronghold for your character in an actual campaign context.



I actually liked that one. Not that it was particularly well edited, but I thought it laid a sound foundation, so to speak. I've used it before.


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## Remus Lupin (Nov 20, 2013)

Ahnehnois said:


> I actually liked that one. Not that it was particularly well edited, but I thought it laid a sound foundation, so to speak. I've used it before.




Well, perhaps I was just using it wrong, or it wasn't well suited to our campaign. Needless to say, I didn't get much use out of it. I'll also cast a vote for Hero Builders Guide as a candidate for worst as well.


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## billd91 (Nov 20, 2013)

Olaf the Stout said:


> One book that I'm surprised hasn't been mentioned is Weapons of Legacy (3.5E book).
> 
> I really wanted to like that book as I think the concept of a cool weapon, with an interesting backstory, that gets better as you go up in levels is a really good one.  However, the mechanics behind them really didn't work.
> 
> ...




I didn't buy this one since I checked it out at my local library or borrowed a friend's copy (not sure which) and decided it just wasn't workable. This is, if you ask me, what over-emphasis on balance gets you - mechanics that nobody really wants to use or houserules anyway. I thought the idea of buying a feat to activate the next level of power for the weapon was a much better way to go than also imposing penalties to attacks, saves, and other miscellaneous stuff.


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## Enrico Poli1 (Jul 13, 2018)

THE BEST

- BECMI: I have a soft spot for the Mentzer Red Box because I started there. Great introduction to the game; great Elmore illustrations. 
My favourite BECMI adventure is Test of the Warlords (followed by other classics: the Isle of Dread, Master of the Desert Nomads, Red Arrow Black Shield, Sabre River...) 
I have to mention the fantastic Gazetteers (great setting products!), in particular the first one about the Grand Duchy of Karameikos (it set the bar) and the third about the Principalities of Glantri (simply the best in an outstanding series). 

-AD&D 1e/2e: I instantly fell in love with the setting boxed sets, in particular Dark Sun, Ravenloft (the revised, red box), and Planescape. 

-D&D 3/3.5: first of all, I have to mention the Age of Worms and Savage Tide Adventure Paths found in Dungeon Magazine (Paizo era). Best campaigns ever.
I am a supporter of the Tome of Battle/Book of the Nine Swords - it made fighter-types MUCH more appealing.
As a setting book, the Forgotten Realms sourcebook is really well done.

-Pathfinder: I love Paizo for their Adventure Paths. Reign of Winter is my favorite, followed by Curse of the Crimson Throne, Kingmaker, Skulls & Shackles, Strange Aeons and Shattered Star.

-13th Age: the system-seller here is Eyes of the Stone Thief, the best megadungeon ever! 

- D&D 5e: the Player's Handbook, Dungeon Master Guide and Monster Manual are outstanding, must-have works. 
I also consider Tomb of Annihilation a modern classic.



THE WORST

The worst D&D product I ever handled, to the point I wanted to dispose of it, was 3rd edition Book of Exalted Deeds. An abysmal, almost offensive rendition of the forces of Goodness.


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## Pauper (Jul 13, 2018)

Holy thread necromancy, Batman!

--
Pauper


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## Tony Vargas (Jul 13, 2018)

Whatever bug causes brand new people to see really old threads should really get fixed one of these days.


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## Li Shenron (Jul 13, 2018)

Tony Vargas said:


> Whatever bug causes brand new people to see really old threads should really get fixed one of these days.




Why? Do you think it's broken to give _Raise Thread_ to 1st-level posters?


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## Tony Vargas (Jul 13, 2018)

Li Shenron said:


> Why? Do you think it's broken to give _Raise Thread_ to 1st-level posters?



Yes, totally OP.   If a first-level thread dies, just roll up a new one!  

(I was going to say "that was good enough for us back in the day!"    But, back in the day, we dialed up a BBS on a 300 baud acoustic modem.... and were greatful we could do it!!!)


#getoffmylawn


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## Chad Hooper (Jul 14, 2018)

Well, since it came back from the dead, I may as well contribute

Best:

BECMI: I started with the pink (mauve? salmon?) edition of the Basic Set, contents 1 red rule book, 1 grease pencil, 1 set of dice, and a copy of The Keep on the Borderlands, so that one will always have a special place in my heart.  I also like the Blackmoor trilogy, Blackmoor, Temple of the Frog, and City of the Gods.

AD&D1e: Dungeon Master's Design Kit.  Going through the steps outlined in the books therein has saved me from a few cases of "prep block" over the years.  Filling out the forms is not even necessary.

AD&D2e: I'm one of the apparent minority that dearly *loved* the Spelljammer setting, so I'm going to go with that, the campaign boxed set.

Worst:  For me it's a toss-up between the (very late TSR era) supplements World Builders Guide and Shamans for AD&D2e.  Apparently the first staff at TSR to go at the last were the proofreaders, based on those two examples.

Bottom of the barrel IMO is D&D Essentials, which I only bought because they were 75% off cover price at a used book store.  Would never play or run that version.  Maybe kindling?


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## BronzeDragon (Jul 14, 2018)

The best is the Birthright Campaign Setting (I know it's not *a* book, but hey, today it would come out as a single volume instead of a boxed set). It's my favorite setting of all time, the art is amazingly inspired, the lore  is incredibly good, and I love the idea of the players as rulers (of either small fiefdoms, guilds, churches or flat out kingdoms).

The worst is probably the Everquest Player's Handbook, by SSS. Some stuff to be mined, but overall not a good product.


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## Celebrim (Jul 14, 2018)

Best:

1e: Dungeon Master's Guide, Runner Up: Ravenloft
2e: Complete Thieves Handbook, Runner Up: Return to the Tomb of Horrors
3e: Book of the Righteous, Runner Up: Player's Handbook

Worst
1e: There are several good candidates, but my vote would be Q1: Queen of the Demonweb Pits, edging out Forest Oracle and Castle Greyhawk.
2e: There are probably too many to name, but FRQ1: Haunted Halls of Evening Star would be one I personally despise as a total waste of money.
3e: Again, there are a ton of things to dislike for a ton of good reasons, but Book of Exalted Deeds edges out the rest for just having nothing slightly redeeming in it.

PS: I seem to have missed that this was necromancy.  I don't know; the old threads even with their graveclothes on seem livelier than many of the new threads.  I'm inclined to raise all of 2006 or 2010 or so and start over sometimes.


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## Lanefan (Jul 14, 2018)

Best D&D book I own: the 1e DMG.  And it's not even close, though there's lots of other very good ones.

Worst D&D book I own: well, define 'worst'.  Worst as in "I bought this but I'm never going to use it, I only have it to maintain a collection" - probably the 4e DMG1 and PH.  Worst as in "this is badly written/edited and the binding falls apart at one touch" - probably "The Seven Sisters" from 2e, though I no longer own it.  Worst as in "this is so bad it's good!" - pick any one of some ancient bad Judges' Guild modules e.g. "Portals of Torsh", "Restormel", "Portals of Twilight" etc.

As for the casting of _Raise Thread_ - I don't mind it at all, particularly a thread like this whose first life I seem to have missed.

Lanefan


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## Morrus (Jul 14, 2018)

Tony Vargas said:


> Whatever bug causes brand new people to see really old threads should really get fixed one of these days.




Pretty sure the bug is called “Google”.


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## Ath-kethin (Jul 16, 2018)

Happily beating on this no-longer-dead horse:

Best: _Secrets of the Lamp_, a 2nd Edition Al-Qadim sourcebox. It has seen extensive use in every campaign I have ever run since I bought it back in '94. Distant 2nd place: _Rules Cyclopedia_, tied with _DM's Option: High Level Campaigns_. One gives you all the tools you need to run a game; the other tells you how to use them.     

Worst: _Magic of Incarnum_. I'd be hard-pressed to think of a more lifeless and less interesting publication sold under the D&D banner. The only things that come close are the 3.5 _Dungeon Master's Guide II_ and _3.5 Spell Compendium_.

NOTE: I am only counting books I actually purchased here. There are many, even worse, that I didn't even bother picking up.


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## Emerikol (Jul 16, 2018)

The Best (1e)
There are many great modules.  Unless the book went beyond just being a module I don't list modules here.  1e had by far the greatest run of modules ever in my opinion.  So many classics.

1. The Dungeon Masters Guide.  Still a good read today!
2. The Wilderness Survival Guide

The Best (2e)
1.  Ravenloft.  
2.  The Castle Guide

The Best (3e)
1. Ptolus by Monte Cook
2. The Book of the Righteous.  

The Best (4e)
1.  Manual of the Planes.  While I hated the system, I did like their new take on the cosmos.  


The Worst
There is so much garbage in the world.  Why dwell on it?  In every edition since 1e, modules were bad generally.  Ravenloft is an exception of course.


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## Jhaelen (Jul 16, 2018)

Ath-kethin said:


> Worst: _Magic of Incarnum_. I'd be hard-pressed to think of a more lifeless and less interesting publication sold under the D&D banner. The only things that come close are the 3.5 _Dungeon Master's Guide II_ and _3.5 Spell Compendium_.



MoI was weird. I agree that DMG2 was mostly uninspired. The Spell Compendium, though, was an excellent investment, just like the Magic Item Compendium. While they surely didn't make for an exciting read, both were great reference books.

1e favorite: 'Fiend Folio', hands down.
The worst? I cannot think of one.
'sleeper hit': 'Deities & Demigods'. Not much use for the actual game, but such a great inspiration. Also my first contact with Lovecraft's Mythos...

2e favorites: Plenty. My favorite setting was 'Dark Sun'. And my favorite supplement 'The Complete Psionics Handbook'.
The worst? Perhaps the 'Book of Artifacts'.
'sleeper hit': 'Planescape Campaign Setting': Such a great read with awesome artwork, but nothing I ever wanted to play.

My favorite 3e book was probably 'Elder Evils'. Such an excellent resource on how to bring a campaign to an exciting conclusion!
The worst 3e book was definitely 'Complete Psionic'. This piece of drivel should never have been published. They should have taken the best parts (there wasn't much) and turned it into a Dragon article.
My 'sleeper hit': 'Weapons of Legacy': Brilliant concept, badly implemented.

My favorite 4e book was probably 'The Plane Below: Secrets of the Elemental Chaos': slightly better than its companion 'The Plane Above: Secrets of the Astral Sea'.
The worst? Probably the Essential PHBs 'Heroes of the Forgotten Kingdoms' and 'Heroes of the Fallen Lands'. Obviously targeted at players who didn't care for 4e, and deservedly largely failing to change anything about that. Also, this should have been a single book.
My 'sleeper hit': 'Hammerfast: A Dwarven Outpost Adventure Site': This is how the 4e adventure modules should have looked like! A sandbox chock-full of cool story ideas and npcs.

My favorite 5e book: '13th Age Core Book'.
Dunno about the worst. I haven't bought any 5e books.
Therefore no 'sleeper hit' either.


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## JonnyP71 (Jul 17, 2018)

A predictable 'best'

- the 1E Dungeon Masters Guide - without doubt the greatest RPG book ever published, it was a mess, but just so utterly inspirational, and full of juicy nuggets throughout.  (it just took a while to find them  ). Honourable mentions to modules U1, UK4 and WG4. 

- 2E - another vote for the Complete Thieves Handbook, a lesson in how all the 'Complete' Books should have been done

(no votes for 3E/4E as I ignored those editions as much as I could)

- 5E - it's Third Party, but the Adventures in Middle Earth Players Book - such a beautiful labour of love.


And the worst:

- 1E Wilderness Survival Guide - unnecessary fluff throughout

- 2E - everything from the Players Options range

- 5E - I hate the section on Playable Monster Races in Volos, but the rest of the book is ok, so I'll go for Hoard of the Dragon Queen - poorly written, needing a lot of DM work to make it workable and fun!


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## jasper (Jul 17, 2018)

Worst 1 E Dungeon Survival Guide
Best 5e PHB


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## pogre (Jul 17, 2018)

Best: The Lost City of Barakus
Worst: H1 Keep on the Shadowfell - the first adventure module of an edition needs to be a homerun - this, was not.


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## Emerikol (Jul 19, 2018)

Hussar said:


> But... But... I was just told, repeatedly, many, many, many times, that there is no need to improve fighters.  That it's all just made up by DM's who lack the ability to run a balanced game.




It's like there are two factions.  The ones that can't and the ones who can.  There are a lot who can't though so all this stuff helps those people.


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## Emerikol (Jul 19, 2018)

JonnyP71 said:


> A predictable 'best'
> 
> - the 1E Dungeon Masters Guide - without doubt the greatest RPG book ever published, it was a mess, but just so utterly inspirational, and full of juicy nuggets throughout.  (it just took a while to find them  ). Honourable mentions to modules U1, UK4 and WG4.



Couldn't agree more.




JonnyP71 said:


> And the worst:
> 
> - 1E Wilderness Survival Guide - unnecessary fluff throughout



Couldn't disagree more.

It's definitely a DM's book though and for people who are really into world building.  Both those are me in spades.


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## Mercule (Jul 20, 2018)

JonnyP71 said:


> A predictable 'best'
> 
> - the 1E Dungeon Masters Guide - without doubt the greatest RPG book ever published, it was a mess, but just so utterly inspirational, and full of juicy nuggets throughout.



Agreed. I still reference mine, even when running games that aren't D&D, or even fantasy. Sometime in the early 1990s, it started falling apart (too many trips in a backpack in the first 7 years), so I removed the spine, punched holes in each and every page, which I reinforced with little round stickers made for that purpose, and put it into a three-ring binder. I believe the pages have actually outlived one binder and been transferred to a second. The pages have been color-coded along the edges, by chapter, for easy reference, and several passages have been highlighted. Yes, I'm no longer a broke teen/college kid and could have afforded a "special edition", when they were released, but that book has been loved. It just wouldn't be right.




> And the worst:
> 
> - 1E Wilderness Survival Guide - unnecessary fluff throughout



Eh... I recall Dungeoneer's Survival Guide being worse. The isomorphic mapping wasn't a bad thing, but there wasn't much else. At least I used the random weather tables in the WSG. Both books were pretty stand-out as mediocre, compared to the rest of the 1E books, which were almost all pretty darn good (power-gaming accusations towards UA, aside).

Both the books that immediately came to mind were 1E books probably because that's the formative years in my gaming life. I still think the 1E DMG truly is of notably better quality, stylistically, than anything from at least 3E on. The DSG probably stands out because there were so few 1E books and most of them were pretty darn good.

From later editions, the standout good book would be the 3.5 Eberron Campaign Setting. Other than some 1E material (of which only the DMG and a couple Dragon mags actually get used), the only other non-current D&D books on my shelf are my Eberron material. The ECS is the core of that and Eberron is the only published setting that I actually get excited about -- I'm otherwise a pretty hard-core home-brewer.

I'm not sure I have another "worst" book. My pattern has always been that I get frustrated at some limitation of any edition of D&D, at some point, and move on to some other system before returning to D&D with the next edition. For 5E, the book I most regret getting is Hoard of the Dragon Queen, which I just disliked for aesthetic reasons.


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## Ancalagon (Jul 20, 2018)

I've been playing d&d for about 25 years.  Without hesitation, the best d&d book I have ever purchased is the Yoon Suin campaign setting.


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## pming (Jul 21, 2018)

Hiya!

*Best*: Tie between _Hackmaster 4th Edition Game Masters Guide_ and the _Rules Cylopedia_ (BECMI).

*Worst*: Hmmm...probably the "Castle Greyhawk" joke/pink-cover 'adventure' that I gleefully tore apart page by page with my friends as we smiled and tossed them into the fireplace.

^_^

Paul L. Ming


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## GMMichael (Jul 21, 2018)

Olaf the Stout said:


> So that's my best and worst D&D book that I own.  What's yours?




Best: Tome of Magic, for introducing Wild Magic.  No.  Tome of Magic, for introducing vestiges and shadow magic.  And making me work reaaaaaally hard to make truenaming work.  Nah...Dungeonscape, for a different perspective on dungeons.  Or Cityscape, since cities are a bit more common than dungeons, and can also make great dungeons.  Actually, Monster Manual, since it's useful for three editions of the game (3, 3.5, 5).  Or Villain's Handbook (?), since it's useful for ALL editions.  Of any game.

Worst: Player's Handbook 3.0.  For being rendered obsolete by one of its own supplements (Miniatures Handbook).


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## TheSword (Jul 21, 2018)

Best book Curse of Strahd 5e. The very epitome of what a hardback should be like. 

Return to Undermountain. Destroyed what could have been an awesome 3e setting but chose a lazy, and clumsy approach. Really disappointing, with almost no redeeming features. Even the maps were terrible.


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## EthanSental (Jul 22, 2018)

Best: Ravenloft boxed set.  Still sets the imagination on fire with gothic horror story ideas even now.  

Worst: PF Mythic.  Too much to complain about poorly balanced and barely playtested.  Felt like a Hardback money grab how bad it was.


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## Enrico Poli1 (Oct 3, 2019)

Ok, I want to express my opinions about this old topic. I only write about the Best books of all the editions I have played, divided in sub-categories. They are all must-own collectibiles.

BECMI

Ruleset: Basic Red Box. I'm proud to own the product that started it all for me. Still fond of Elmore's art. Runner up: Companion Cyan Box - I love high level play
Adventure: the adventure that I am happy to play the most is Red Arrow Black Shield. Runner Up: Test of the Warlords. But there are so many.
Setting: one has to mention the Gazetteer line. The Grand Duchy of Karameikos is the best overall, with The Principalities of Glantri as a close second.

AD&D 1e

Ruleset: I like the prose of Gygax in the Dungeon Master's Guide
Bestiary: the original Monster Manual is a precious prize.
Adventure: The original Ravenloft 1e without a dubt. Lost Caverns of Tsojicanth is second place, for me it's damn good.
Setting: the Forgotten Realms Gray Box is an incredible product.
Other: the Manual of the Planes for its aesthetics.

AD&D 2e

Ruleset: The Complete Psionic Handbook. Cannot stand psionics in more recent editions because of the distance from the original.
Bestiary: the Monstrous Compendium Binder was exceptional. Runner up: the Planescape Appendix I with Tony DiTerlizzi's art.
Adventure: Return to the Tomb of Horrors is truly a gem. Silver medal is Dragon's Crown, for the Dark Sun setting, it is really epic.
Setting: Dark Sun boxed set. So many dreams. Runner up: Ravenloft boxed set revised, beats Planescape boxed set by an inch.

3.0

Ruleset: Player's Handbook was truly brilliant in its rationalization of old rules.
Bestiary: MM and Draconomicon.
Adventure: The Lich Queen's Beloved from Dungeon Magazine was fascinating. Runner up: The Lord of the Iron Fortress. Again, I love high level play.
Other: Forgotten Realms setting book comes immediately to mind. Incredibile amount of detail and fantastic art. Second place: The Epic Level Handbook, a favourite of mine. Actually used in some campaigns.

3.5

Ruleset: Tome of Battle - The Book of Nine Swords. I absolutely adored it.
Adventure: I regard Age of Worms and Savage Tide, the Adventure Paths in Dungeon Magazine, the best adventures ever produced for the game.
Other: I have a soft spot for Fiendish Codex I: Hordes of the Abyss.

PATHFINDER

Bestiary: the original Bestiary for its aesthetics, even if it's not much different from 3.0's MM.
Adventure: Reign of Winter AP is a favourite of mine. There are so many others of high quality; if I had to chose one I'll take Curse of the Crimson Throne.

13th Age

Bestiary: the Bestiary is a gem.
Adventure: Eyes of the Stone Thief. You have to play this One Unique Thing!

D&D 5e

Ruleset: the Player's Handbook is a miracle, not a new edition. DMG Is also excellent.
Bestiary: the Monster Manual could even be better than the original.
Adventure: I think that Tomb of Annihilation is better than Curse of Strahd, but recently Descent into Avernus became my favourite.
Other: the Starter Set. Silver medal for Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes, its planar scope and high level monsters.


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## Celebrim (Oct 3, 2019)

Celebrim said:


> I'm inclined to raise all of 2006 or 2010 or so and start over sometimes.




Still true.


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## Xenonnonex (Oct 3, 2019)

Celebrim said:


> Still true.



Why did you just agree with yourself? And a post from last year no less.


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## Sacrosanct (Oct 3, 2019)

Xenonnonex said:


> Why did you just agree with yourself? And a post from last year no less.




Because self affirmation is important to self care.


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## ccs (Oct 3, 2019)

Best?  That's easy, my 1e DMG

Worst?  Also an easy pick.  Anything 4e I own.  Since 4e is not a single book, the PHB will represent them all.
I dislike 4e so much that these books don't even rate shelf space or the effort to give them away/sell them.  Since 2010 theyve resided in a cardboard box in the attic & the last time I checked even the mice had rejected them.


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## lowkey13 (Oct 3, 2019)

*Deleted by user*


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## doctorbadwolf (Oct 3, 2019)

Best: Heroes of The Feywild, from 4. It’s got folk lore with multiple takes, the precursor to Xanathar’s “this is your life” thing, tons of great lore, and wonderful art. It’s a delight at every turn. 
Runners up would be 3.5 Unearthed Arcana, and the 5e PHB. 

Worst: idk


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## Sacrosanct (Oct 3, 2019)

Best: The OD&D booklets.  Why?  Because of what they started.  The golden key to unlock imaginations all over the world

Worst: The OD&D booklets.  Why?  Because they were written horribly, no one could learn how to play by reading them; you had to have someone teach you, way overpriced, and the art was horrible (yes, by comparing against similar products of the time, not looking at it through a modern lens).

*copy machines have been around since the late 50s, and by the mid 70s, they were available at libraries, and business had them with a cost of "...Xerox print could be made for $0.03 including paper and labor." (That's $3.75 to print all three booklets, which had an MSRP of $10).  There is no excuse why prints of OD&D, especially subsequent printings, were as bad as they were from a typeset and layout perspective.  Gary literally could create one decent legible copy, then go make photocopies and still make a huge margin


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## DammitVictor (Oct 3, 2019)

So, I'm not going to break this down by edition or anything. I'm just going to present you with huge, sprawling lists instead of actually picking single "best" and "worst" items.

*BEST:* _Unearthed Arcana_ (3.5), _Pathfinder Unchained_, _Player's Option_ (AD&D 2e), _Rules Cyclopedia_ (Classic). Books that have dramatically changed what was _possible_ in D&D and which are still acting as major inspirations in everything I'm pretending to create.

*Runners Up:* _Thri-Kreen of Athas_, _Complete Spacefarer's Handbook_, Dreamscarred Press' _Ultimate Psionics_, Rogue Genius Games' _Genius Guide to the Talented_ [CLASS]

For the worst... much shorter list:

*WORST:* _Book of Exalted Deeds_ and _Gamma World Player's Handbook_ (6e, d20M). I have never been as angry about any roleplaying product, ever, and they are literally the only roleplaying products I have ever _regretted purchasing_.

They are, in fact, so bad that I can't think of any runners up.


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## Legatus Legionis (Oct 4, 2019)

.


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## Man in the Funny Hat (Oct 4, 2019)

Best - 1E DMG

So much history and nostalgia and bad design and good design and bad advice and good advice and I use it even with other editions.

"Worst" - 4E anything

I never even played 4E but quite foolishly bought all three core books without knowing anything of the system therein and care nothing at all for its take on D&D.  That's just my opinion so get your own.


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## ccs (Oct 4, 2019)

Man in the Funny Hat said:


> Best - 1E DMG
> 
> So much history and nostalgia and bad design and good design and bad advice and good advice and I use it even with other editions.




And all jumbled together, sometimes concerning the same thing at the same time.

+ the Random Harlot table.

Like yours, my copy also sees use regardless of the edition.


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## Parmandur (Oct 4, 2019)

Wow, interesting seeing some of these old answers.

Best: Xanathar's Guide to Everything. Chock-a-block with ideas, and very useful in prep and play.

Worst: I bought an old used copy of Greyhawk Adventures. I kind of like it, but dang, it's a mess.


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## Imaculata (Oct 4, 2019)

*Best:* Stormwrack (3.5); a brilliant book that is a great foundation for a naval/aquatic campaign.

*Worst:* Dungeonscape (3.5); This should have been the resource book for creating interesting dungeons, but what it really is, is extremely by the numbers and short. There's not really anything in this book that you couldn't come up with yourself.

*Runner up for worst:* Cityscape (3.5). Same problem.


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## Ath-kethin (Oct 4, 2019)

Agreed, it's been really interesting reading through all these old answers again. Again.

My votes haven't changed much, though I'll add Astonishing Swordsmen and Sorcerers of Hyperboria 2e Compleat to my "Best" category. Though it's a revision of a retroclone and therefore might not count.


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## Son of the Serpent (Oct 4, 2019)

Best - honestly...if i could just say *DRAGON MAGAZINE* i think i could easily pick a winner.  But thats only if i could list all issues as one combined mega book.  As im reasonably certain that would not be an acceptable answer I'll have to say *UNEARTHED ARCANA* from 3/3.5e is my pick for best.

Worst - i have to agree with a previous post.  *ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING 4E*.  As that is likely not a valid pick as its not a single book I'll have to be specific.  My nomination for worst is *WHICHEVER 4E BOOK HAS THE MOST PAGES* as more crap is never better than less crap.  And that whole edition is a trainwreck.  Their vision of d&d seems outright incompetent at times.  As if they didnt even understand how the game works sometimes.  Harsh i know im sorry but i mean it.


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## Blackrat (Oct 4, 2019)

Well, the best would actually be three books that are sort of a bunch of the same theme. AD&D era Faiths & Avatars, Demihuman Deities, and Powers & Pantheons. Those books have awesome images of the priestly clothing of pretty much every deity in FR, as well as really specific descriptions of the religious practices and customs of most faiths.

The worst. Well, I actually have a copy of the Book of Erotic Fantasy for 3e. I have no idea where I got it, or why, but that book is as crappy as it was controversial way back then...


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## Imaculata (Oct 4, 2019)

Ath-kethin said:


> My votes haven't changed much, though I'll add Astonishing Swordsmen and Sorcerers of Hyperboria 2e Compleat to my "Best" category.




I recently bought the Conan 2e rules book, and it is amazing. I don't know when we'll find time to actually run a Conan adventure, but I'm now intrigued by the books that you've mentioned. Could you share more details on what's great about them?


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## Bagpuss (Oct 4, 2019)

All time favourite would be the *Birthright Campaign* setting boxed set for 2nd Ed AD&D.

Best of more recent editions *Heroes of Battle* for 3.5, great resource, I would say much of the advice and the core system of Victory Points could be used in any version of D&D, or other games entirely.

I don't really have a worst.


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## lowkey13 (Oct 4, 2019)

*Deleted by user*


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## Maxperson (Oct 4, 2019)

Best book - Player: Complete Adventurer - I used that book more than any other single book when playing.
Best Book - DM: The 4 volume Magic Item Compendium.
Worst Book: Magic of the Incarnum - I went back to it several times trying hard to find something I liked and would play, but I just couldn't do it.


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## eyeheartawk (Oct 4, 2019)

*Best*

*OD&D/Basic: *_Rules Cyclopedia_ 100%. Everything you would ever need in one book.

*1E: *Gotta go _DMG _ here like everybody else. Damned difficult to read at times, but so many great nugs.

*2E: *This is a three way tie between _Priest's Spell Compendium, Encylcopedia Magica _and _Wizard's Spell Compendium_. Such a great reference and so convenient to have everything collected in one place with background notes and even telling you which setting it is from. Beautiful, to boot. Really hope 5E does something like this in the future, as I don't relish the thought of carrying 20 books in my backpack five years from now.

*3E: *Not really a FR guy at all, but the _Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting _is pretty great. I consider this and its following books in the line the high point for Forgotten Realms.

*4E: *Didn't play a ton of 4E, but for sheer convenience probably gotta go with the _Rules Compendium. _

*5E: *No 5E product has really blown me away to such a degree to be a clear favorite over another but if I had to pick I would say _Xanathar's Guide to Everything_. Just because it has a little bit for everything and everybody and some neat new options.

*Worst*

*OD&D/Basic: *Probably _Swords & Spells_. It was a backwards looking supplement to turn D&D back into a wargame, and nobody I have ever met or heard of ever used this. 

*1E: *The _Dungeoneer's Survival Guide _and _Wilderness Survival Guide _were probably the low point in 1E hardbacks. Filled full of useless junk nobody used. 

*2E: *So many bad books in this edition, if for no other reason, the amount of books published. But I gotta go with _WG7 Castle Greyhawk_. People waited so long to see what Gary's Castle Greyhawk looked like. Eventually, we got this and lo, it was bad.

*3E: *_The Slayer's Guide to Female Gamers_. This exemplifies the worst of the 3E era: third party splatbook glut and terrible gamer stereotypes. Of course it's written by James Desborough, what a surprise.

*4E: *I mean, it's gotta be the _Monster Manual, _right? Errata and math updates made this book worthless.

*5E: *_Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide. _Not at all surprising. Mechanically, only offers a few things of value. Lore wise it's as deep as a puddle.


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## Retreater (Oct 4, 2019)

*Best

2e:*  The 2nd edition AD&D Monster Manual (not Compendium) is the largest, fullest, most complete collection of monsters I've ever owned. The art can be lousy (or non-existent) for many entries, but as a one-stop-shop for critters, it's unrivaled. (Runner-Up: the PHB for complete nostalgic reasons.)

*3e: *The Maure Castle issues of Dungeon magazines. Especially the first issue. I love the setting, art, and high level challenges.

*Worst*

*2e:* Skills and Powers and the reprinted core books. The art is bad. The power creep makes the game nearly unplayable. 

*4e:* I am different than many posters here in that I actually enjoyed the edition, but none of the books stand out as anything I'd like to go back to. Well organized references for the game, but nothing to treasure.


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## Imaculata (Oct 4, 2019)

eyeheartawk said:


> *3E: *_The Slayer's Guide to Female Gamers_. This exemplifies the worst of the 3E era: third party splatbook glut and terrible gamer stereotypes. Of course it's written by James Desborough, what a surprise.




Oh my god, this exists?! I'm changing my vote right now. This is the worst book!






Also, what lovely cover art(!)
And it gets better:





Hahahaha. There is just so much to take in here... I don't know where to start. And people willingly attached their names to this?! Or were they threatened at clumpsily-drawn-swordpoint?

Oh, and if this list of contents seems offensive... the book is a hundred times more offensive than what you would expect. I mean, seriously... what were they thinking?!


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## eyeheartawk (Oct 4, 2019)

Imaculata said:


> Oh my god, this exists?! I'm changing my vote right now. This is the worst book!
> 
> View attachment 114517
> 
> ...




Either that, or somebody read page 30 and cast Feminine Magic on them to compel them to do so.


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## Imaculata (Oct 4, 2019)

eyeheartawk said:


> Either that, or somebody read page 30 and cast Feminine Magic on them to compel them to do so.




Funny... but then I opened page 30 out of foolish curiosity, and now I regret laying eyes on this so much!


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## eyeheartawk (Oct 4, 2019)

Yeah, fun fact, would you believe me if I told you that the guy who wrote this also wrote the Gor RPG?


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## Imaculata (Oct 4, 2019)

eyeheartawk said:


> Yeah, fun fact, would you believe me if I told you that the guy who wrote this also wrote the Gor RPG?




That is mind blowing.

Also, I have got to stop reading this book any further, before I start punching the screen. Anyone that voted for any other book as 'The Worst D&D Book', including 'The book of Erotic Fantasy', is now officially wrong. Even the book of erotic fantasy is a masterpiece compared to the 'Slayer's Guide to Female Gamers'.


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## Greg K (Oct 4, 2019)

I don't have a single best (keeping this to physical books to keep it short)
2e: Complete Thief's Handbook

3e: Unearthed Arcana (WOTC), Psychic's Handbook (Green Ronin), Shaman's Handbook (Green Ronin), Witch's Handbook (Green Ronin), Experts 3.5 (Skirmisher Publishing), Noble Steeds (Avalanche Press), Book of Templates (Silverthorne/Green Ronin). I use these these physical book (along with the 2e Complete Thief's Handbook) for reference and ideas for any fantasy campaign regardless of system.

Worst:
I like it as DM reference, but Book of Vile Darkness.


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## Tony Vargas (Oct 4, 2019)

Thanks to @eyeheartawk for the formatting and edition-by-edition precedent.  

(I'll bet I've posted before, and given different answers, too, but whatever, this version looks like fun.)

*Best*

*OD&D/Basic: *Men & Magic, for reasons that'll become evident.

*1E: *Gotta go _DMG _ here like everybody else.  You've got the definitive explanation of what hps really represent and how they really work, that has never been questioned since.  

*2E: * _Complete Priest's Handbook, _easily the best thing ever written for 2e, expanded the Priest into a highly customizeable class, a great resource for DMs and players who could get their ear, and a level of design openness we'd not see again until 3e.  It was written by the late great Aaron Alston, who also did a lot of writing for Hero Games, and published a few novels that are worth a read.

*3E: *I'm going to go with the 3.0 PH because, well, I don't own a huge number of 3e books (the group I was in at the time shared books a lot, and I didn't end up holding many of them), but I really did like some of the things that 3.5 ended up changing.

*4E: *Like Retreater said, 4e books were better references than memorable reads.  Suppose we'll have to go with the PH1, again, for introducing the revolutionary (even if the revolution has been successfully suppressed) take on martial characters, especially the Warlord.  I really don't much go in for setting/cosmology books, but Plane Above/Below and HotFw deserve mention, too.

*5E: *Nothing about the 5e rules much stands out, as befits a well-crafted compromise, but Curse of Strahd seems like the best adventure so far.

*Worst*

*OD&D/Basic: *Greyhawk Supplement I, for introducing the Thief and thus ruining the game forever.  ;P  (Oh, and it also introduced the Paladin.) 

*1E: *A close contest between the "flaming dumpster fire" (c)Lowkey13 of _Unearthed Arcana _and the flaming _gomi-xiang _(which is exactly like a western dumpster, but superior in every way, and has Ki powers) fire of _Oriental Adventures_.  Really, nothing to salvage from 1e after those fiascos. 

*2E: *My regret here is that I don't own the notorious most broken complete books of the line, like the Complete Book of Elves - well, regret only in the context of this post, since I really, really don't regret not spending money 'em.  I guess I'll have to go with the giant multi-volume compendium of magic items that included the hilarious search-and-replace editing error that changed every instance of "damage" to "dawizard."   Though, for format alone, that nice idea that didn't work out so well, the loose-leaf Monstrous Compendium also deserves a nod.

*3E: *Again, don't own a lotta 3e for logistical reasons, but, I did end up holding the execrable _Sword & Fist_, which featured both what was perhaps the worst cover art in D&D history, and truly pathetic content, so I'm golden.

*4E: *I ended up not owning KotSf, or HoS or HotFL/K nor much of Essentials at all beyond the RC, so... 
...oh, y'know: all the adventure tools after monster builder: _for being vaporware_.  (But, you don't own them!  ... no, but it was a subscription service, so I *paid for them*.  But I'm not bitter, no, not me.)

*5E: *_Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide. _Not at all surprising. Mechanically, only offers a few things of value. Lore wise it's as deep as a puddle.  (No I didn't stop, I just had to agree - and I don't actually own HotDQ, or that would obviously win.)


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## eyeheartawk (Oct 4, 2019)

Tony Vargas said:


> *2E: *My regret here is that I don't own the notorious most broken complete books of the line, like the Complete Book of Elves - well, regret only in the context of this post, since I really, really don't regret not spending money 'em.  I guess I'll have to go with the giant multi-volume compendium of magic items that included the hilarious search-and-replace editing error that changed every instance of "damage" to "dawizard."   Though, for format alone, that nice idea that didn't work out so well, the loose-leaf Monstrous Compendium also deserves a nod.




Never forget.


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## Celebrim (Oct 4, 2019)

Imaculata said:


> Funny... but then I opened page 30 out of foolish curiosity, and now I regret laying eyes on this so much!




How in the world....

Seriously, what was anyone involved in this project thinking? 

There has been a ton of useless poorly written crap written for D&D over the years, but this goes straight to the bottom of that stack for being not only useless and poorly written but tasteless and offensive.

I can't even... I have no words. People's ability to imagine and create evil continually leaves me astounded.


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## Arnwolf666 (Oct 4, 2019)

I think domains of dread for 2nd edition ravenloft is the best setting book ever made. Followed by the al-qadim sourcebook. And that is purely for the fluff and the way they presented the material. I have not seen as good of a presentation for a setting since those two books. Although there are several others i still love.

The worst was skills and powers and that entire line of books.


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## Ath-kethin (Oct 4, 2019)

Imaculata said:


> I recently bought the Conan 2e rules book, and it is amazing. I don't know when we'll find time to actually run a Conan adventure, but I'm now intrigued by the books that you've mentioned. Could you share more details on what's great about them?



I don't want to derail this thread, but shortly: 

1. The incredibly simple class progressions, as befits a retroclones, coupled with the incredibly evocative subclasses. Different wizard specialities have different spell selections; you can tell a necromancer from a cryomancer just by what they cast.

2. The book is, indeed, compleat. At 700 or so pages, it covers everything you need. Think Rules Cyclopedia complete. 

3. The art is incredible, and incredibly evocative in and of itself. A nice mix of colors plates and them atic black-and-whites.

I could go on.

My only real gripe is that classes top out at 12th level; it's probably just 30 years of D&D talking, but a class-based system that doesn't go to 20+ just feels wrong to me.


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## uzirath (Oct 4, 2019)

For best I'd have to go with the AD&D _Dungeon Master's Guide_. As others have said, many problems, but I pored over those pages for years. The appendices alone were worth the price of the book.

For adventures, from the old days, I loved the _Desert of Desolation_ series. I've run portions of it in three versions of D&D and two editions of GURPS. 

Worst... hmm. It's been long enough since I've played much D&D that I don't remember the worsts very clearly. Someone upthread mentioned _Castle Greyhawk_, though, and I clearly remember my disappointment when that came out.


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## Arnwolf666 (Oct 5, 2019)

uzirath said:


> For best I'd have to go with the AD&D _Dungeon Master's Guide_. As others have said, many problems, but I pored over those pages for years. The appendices alone were worth the price of the book.
> 
> For adventures, from the old days, I loved the _Desert of Desolation_ series. I've run portions of it in three versions of D&D and two editions of GURPS.
> 
> Worst... hmm. It's been long enough since I've played much D&D that I don't remember the worsts very clearly. Someone upthread mentioned _Castle Greyhawk_, though, and I clearly remember my disappointment when that came out.



Everyone should read the 1E dmg Just to read Gygaxian prose. It was so different and really still is. I just liked his style.


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## aramis erak (Oct 5, 2019)

Olaf the Stout said:


> What's yours?




Best: D&D Cyclopedia. A thick all-in-one, excellently presented and run to run.

Worst: AD&D 1E DMG. This pile of steaming excrement is almost unusuable, with rules buried in bad places, some of the worst GM advice ever written. Not to mention unpleasantly bad line art in the older editions. (I totally freaking hate the gygaxian spew.) Even BoVD is better. It's right on par with FATAL for "needlessly bad ideas"...


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## Maxperson (Oct 5, 2019)

Imaculata said:


> That is mind blowing.
> 
> Also, I have got to stop reading this book any further, before I start punching the screen. Anyone that voted for any other book as 'The Worst D&D Book', including 'The book of Erotic Fantasy', is now officially wrong. Even the book of erotic fantasy is a masterpiece compared to the 'Slayer's Guide to Female Gamers'.



I don't consider third party books to be "D&D books."    I'm going to keep my votes for best and worst confined to official D&D books.


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## Son of the Serpent (Oct 5, 2019)

@Imaculata so I'd never even heard of the book "slayers guide to female gamers".  Curious to see just how bad it was i looked it up and read some of it.  I didnt really get the impression of it being close to "worst".  Boy was it weird though.  Real weird...


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## Arnwolf666 (Oct 5, 2019)

aramis erak said:


> Best: D&D Cyclopedia. A thick all-in-one, excellently presented and run to run.
> 
> Worst: AD&D 1E DMG. This pile of steaming excrement is almost unusuable, with rules buried in bad places, some of the worst GM advice ever written. Not to mention unpleasantly bad line art in the older editions. (I totally freaking hate the gygaxian spew.) Even BoVD is better. It's right on par with FATAL for "needlessly bad ideas"...



I love this list just to see what people are saying. I so agree with the d&d rules cyclopedia. Your assessment of the 1E DMG shocks me. But to each his own. Love this thread.


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## Arnwolf666 (Oct 5, 2019)

ccs said:


> Best?  That's easy, my 1e DMG
> 
> Worst?  Also an easy pick.  Anything 4e I own.  Since 4e is not a single book, the PHB will represent them all.
> I dislike 4e so much that these books don't even rate shelf space or the effort to give them away/sell them.  Since 2010 theyve resided in a cardboard box in the attic & the last time I checked even the mice had rejected them.



Eh. I see where u r coming from. I didn’t like the rules. But I did like some of the setting stuff and thought the nentir vale was great.


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## Arnwolf666 (Oct 5, 2019)

I must have repressed memories of Forest Oracle. That one is pretty bad.


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## JeffB (Oct 5, 2019)

Are we talking strictly rulebooks? If so...

*OD&D-* 
Best= Greyhawk, despite the Thief and Paladin, it really opened up the game otherwise.

Worst= Blackmoor: God awful rules variants. But TotF and Steve Marsh's/Tim Kask's monster additions help it from being complete garbage.

Honorable Mention for Best- Original Holmes edited Basic Set. AD&D Monster Manual (this is a OD&D supplement, mechanically)

*B/X/BECM*I-Different games in their presentation of style of play , but I'm lumping them together for brevity

Best= Moldvay/Cook/MArsh B & X booklets. My fave edition of the game ever. Clear, concise, fantastic presentation of the ruleset.

Worst=Companion Set. Huge disappointment. Shelved, never used. 

*AD&D*
Best= 1E DMG- as an in game reference, not great. As a work of DM advice and inspiration? Amazing.

Worst=Most of the bad hardcover books came out long after I had given up on D&D for RQ and other RPGS, so for early titles-Fiend Folio: Amazing cover that totally blew me away the day it arrived on bookshelves- Full of mostly crap monsters I never used.

*AD&D2*- I came into this later in it's life
Best=Monstrous Manual

Worst=2.5 hardcovers. 
Dishonorable Mention=Tome of Magic

*D&D 3.0*
Best=Manual of the Planes (I tire of what has become of the Great Wheel post Gary, but this is a good read)

Worst=PLayer's Handbook. Like all WOTC books, here we have the beginning if the "lacks an Author's voice " problem which makes for a horrible un-inspiring read. Hate the presentation/aesthetic. 
Dishonorable Mention= DMG. Horrible advice about making the game your own because everything is countered with 'you probably will break your game'. The Yeah, thats great, but... DMG. Only useful for full blown NPC stats and some magic items.

*D&D 3.5*
Best=I don't have a best here for rules. The only thing I still own is Secret's of Xen'drik

Worst= The entire 3.5 change. So PHB,DMG, MM.

*D&D 4.0*
Best= DMG 1. A DMG that's actually great at teaching a DM how to be a DM on the creative side (Some of which reprinted in the 5E MM) , and at the table, and tools you need.

Honorable Mention=Monster Manual 1. For finally making all the boring monsters interesting in combat, all the samey monsters different in combat, and self contained stat blocks. Yay! I'm fine with the minimal fluff. I grew up with OD&D monster descriptions. I also like the knowledge check mechanics to figure out the lore.

Worst=I prefer the Essentials changes in nearly every way, but in retrospect Monster Vault sacrificed it's word count too much in the direction of fluff. It sorely lacks a variety of creatures. Overcompensation.

*D&D 5.0*
Best= DMG. Solid guide for a DM on the creative side and the table side., good presentation of Magic Items, and nice section at the end with rules variants (could be bigger though, as implied through the playtest).

Worst= Monster Manual for it's huge step backwards to earlier edition non self contained statblocks which require referencing the PHB  for spells, and removal of interesting  monster powers/combat abilities in the name of simplicity (hint for WOTC , you can keep monsters simple in the stat block, AND make them interesting combat encounters, check out 13th Age Monsters for a textbook example)

Dishonorable mention=Volo's. In the buildup I figured I would be all over this. After spending roughly 2  hours with it, back on the shelf- it's like the Fiend Folio was for me in 1E, except I was smart enough this time around not to purchase it first.


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## Fanaelialae (Oct 5, 2019)

My absolute favorite is 2e Creative Campaigning. Lots of good advice and inspiration for games.

Other editions:

Basic - Rules Cyclopedia

1e - DMG

3e - Savage Species
The implementation was imperfect, but we had a lot of fun with this book nonetheless.

4e - Rules Compendium
It was a good rules reference, but I still reference the early chapters for inspiration from the Nentir Vale setting.

5e - PHB
The first book of my favorite edition.


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## R_J_K75 (Oct 5, 2019)

Best for me, hands down 2E FR Empires of the Shining Sea and Lands of Intrigue; I consider those one boxed set, or the former being a continuation of the latter.  As far as campaign settings go, it doesnt get much better than those two IMO.


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## Nebulous (Oct 5, 2019)

Stormonu said:


> P.S.:  Epic handbook is pretty up there for worthless for me for the same reasons.  It's a shame I was a completionist back then; I bought the autographed version (mainly for the Olidamara dice).




Epic Level Handbook was indeed useless and near if not the top of my most despised book.  Favorite though?  That's tough to say.  I do have very fond memories of reading through the MM2 AD&D when I was young....and yes I still have it.


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## ccs (Oct 5, 2019)

Imaculata said:


> That is mind blowing.
> 
> Also, I have got to stop reading this book any further, before I start punching the screen. Anyone that voted for any other book as 'The Worst D&D Book', including 'The book of Erotic Fantasy', is now officially wrong. Even the book of erotic fantasy is a masterpiece compared to the 'Slayer's Guide to Female Gamers'.




You do realize that the original question was in regards to the best/worst books you own.
Therefore I CANNOT  be wrong in my answer.
Sure, 100% there's worse D&D books out there. (Ever hear of FATAL?)  And I've read some of them.  Or parts of some of them.
But they aren't in MY collection - physical or digital.


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## aramis erak (Oct 6, 2019)

Arnwolf666 said:


> I love this list just to see what people are saying. I so agree with the d&d rules cyclopedia. Your assessment of the 1E DMG shocks me. But to each his own. Love this thread.




From my point of view, I can't understand how anyone can find it good, let alone the best, other than perversity, ignorance, or nostalgia.


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## Arnwolf666 (Oct 6, 2019)

aramis erak said:


> From my point of view, I can't understand how anyone can find it good, let alone the best, other than perversity, ignorance, or nostalgia.



Mainly the prose. They have gotten better at writing dungeon masters guides over 40 years. Just remember Gygax didn’t have a template to improve upon.


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## aramis erak (Oct 6, 2019)

Arnwolf666 said:


> Mainly the prose.



THat's the part I least comprehend the fixation with


Arnwolf666 said:


> They have gotten better at writing dungeon masters guides over 40 years.



I've played plenty of games that are now 30+ years old.  the AD&D1E DMG before revision was outclassed by many games that predate it's 1979 release... including the Holmes Basic D&D.


Arnwolf666 said:


> Just remember Gygax didn’t have a template to improve upon.



That's both disingenuous and unlikely to be true... 
Unlikely to be true as the AD&D DMG was being written in 1977-78, and the much better laid out, more clearly written, and much better at imparting information style of Classic Traveller was already on the market. Before the DMG's release, a better styled and better written RuneQuest 1E was out. And Starships & Spacemen - all of which were better organized, better worded for conveyance of the information...  and that's also ignoring the much simpler Tunnels and Trolls, which, by 1976 was into 3rd edition, with Steve Jackson (not certain  which) having modified into Monsters! Monsters!, which was a beautiful exemplar of well presented. Gygax would have to have been hiding to not have known of these, especially as they were advertised in Dragon.
And disingenuous, as the layout staff at TSR were doing a very professional bit of work on Dragon, and even on Strategic Review....

Apologetics for not meeting the editorial nor layout standards of the same company? does nothing to raise my opinion of Gygax...


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## Enrico Poli1 (Oct 6, 2019)

I've already posted about my "best" choices.

Reading the comments made me remember the "worst" one. By far, it is Book of Exalted Deeds. No other product was so gross that made me want to sell it as soon as possible.


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## Paul Masao Wisham (Oct 6, 2019)

DMG 1e (AD&D)
Great writing ... And loved the dark tomb like feel with that artwork.

Honorable mention: Ravenloft orig.
And Dungeoneer’s Survival guide. (Orig. Deities as well...)


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## Son of the Serpent (Oct 6, 2019)

I feel prompted to list the worst books of my favorite edition(s) (3/3.5).  I cant pick a single worst.  Sorry.  I can only par it down to a section.  Too many bad ones to pick definitively.

First of all i must agree with the previous poster.
Exalted deeds actually makes my list.  That out of the way, the list is:

Exalted deeds:  i refuse to exalt this book.  I disavow.  (i have no idea why people bother saying bovd when boed exists.  What complaints you have that are valid and many that you dont even make about bovd are as applicable or more to boed without fail and it is bad in so many more ways than bovd.  Besides bovd is actually a pretty useful book when hamdled with care and boed generally doesnt even have that going for it.  Its like its neutered retarded twin with chicken wings growing out of its divine ass.)

Oriental adventures:  nails on chalkboard.  This book really rubs me the wrong way.  Also i dont like the content.  I tried so hard to get into this book and be excited but just found myself bored.  Eh...also just didnt like much about it.  Also what an odd name.

Anything psionic:  for the pure raw abyssal cancer.  Get these things away from me.  My body is not ready.


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## Tony Vargas (Oct 7, 2019)

Of the general adulation of the 1e AD&D DMG...







aramis erak said:


> From my point of view, I can't understand how anyone can find it good, let alone the best, other than perversity, ignorance, or nostalgia.



I assure you, it's not out of ignorance!


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## NineLizards (Oct 7, 2019)

Best and worst...

Best... either something Planescape (love that setting) or Ptolus (unfortunately I don't have an original print, I had to buy the PDF's and print them and have them bound in hardcovers, looks fantastic though). I also like the old AD&D 2e PHB, but that's probably just me.

Worst? Without a doubt the 2e Magic Encyclopedia. Worst product ever, probably. Utterly useless. Closely followed by most 4e stuff...


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## Son of the Serpent (Oct 7, 2019)

blueznl said:


> Worst? Without a doubt the 2e Magic Encyclopedia. Worst product ever, probably. Utterly useless. Closely followed by most 4e stuff...



What was so bad about the magic encyclopedia?  Just curious.


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## NineLizards (Oct 7, 2019)

Son of the Serpent said:


> What was so bad about the magic encyclopedia?  Just curious.




Well, all it is is an index / price list. Admittedly, that's what it says on the back cover so I only have to blame myself buying it. It would have been a great book if the two thin volumes would have been combined into a thick hardcover, with descriptions of different variations. For example, a Death Rattle is worth 500 GP and described in AC04-059, but the book doesn't tell me what it does, what the difference is between a death rattle and a summoning rattle etcetera. And how is a violin / wine bottle rack magical in any way?

In other words, it's not an encyclopedia, it's an index. So yeah, as an index it's useful. As an encyclopedia? Not so.

(Heh. Coming to think of it, I can think of other bad products, it's just that this particular one was such a personal disappointment that it immediately came to mind, probably related to wrong expectations )


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## ccs (Oct 8, 2019)

aramis erak said:


> From my point of view, I can't understand how anyone can find it good, let alone the best, other than perversity, ignorance, or nostalgia.




With that attitude it'd just be a waste of effort for us to explain it to you.


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## R_J_K75 (Oct 8, 2019)

Son of the Serpent said:


> Exalted deeds: i refuse to exalt this book. I disavow. (i have no idea why people bother saying bovd when boed exists. What complaints you have that are valid and many that you dont even make about bovd are as applicable or more to boed without fail and it is bad in so many more ways than bovd. Besides bovd is actually a pretty useful book when hamdled with care and boed generally doesnt even have that going for it. Its like its neutered retarded twin with chicken wings growing out of its divine ass.)




Have you ever actually used anything from the Book of Exalted Deeds?


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## Nebulous (Oct 8, 2019)

Celebrim said:


> How in the world....
> 
> Seriously, what was anyone involved in this project thinking?
> 
> ...




To be fair, they knew it was naughty word, and poorly written, merely to get a rise out of people by "tweaking your nipples" and run away laughing.


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## Celebrim (Oct 8, 2019)

Nebulous said:


> To be fair, they knew it was naughty word, and poorly written, merely to get a rise out of people by "tweaking your nipples" and run away laughing.




Some people think kicking over apple carts and tripping old people is both funny and profound.  But there is really no less self-aware response than, "I was just joking."   It makes it worse, not better.


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## eyeheartawk (Oct 8, 2019)

blueznl said:


> Well, all it is is an index / price list. Admittedly, that's what it says on the back cover so I only have to blame myself buying it. It would have been a great book if the two thin volumes would have been combined into a thick hardcover, with descriptions of different variations. For example, a Death Rattle is worth 500 GP and described in AC04-059, but the book doesn't tell me what it does, what the difference is between a death rattle and a summoning rattle etcetera. And how is a violin / wine bottle rack magical in any way?
> 
> In other words, it's not an encyclopedia, it's an index. So yeah, as an index it's useful. As an encyclopedia? Not so.
> 
> (Heh. Coming to think of it, I can think of other bad products, it's just that this particular one was such a personal disappointment that it immediately came to mind, probably related to wrong expectations )




I'm at work right now so my copies aren't handy. But that's not how I remember it. I remember them having an XP value and gold value, followed by the description of its effect and various notes. This can be seen here


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## uzirath (Oct 9, 2019)

eyeheartawk said:


> I'm at work right now so my copies aren't handy. But that's not how I remember it. I remember them having an XP value and gold value, followed by the description of its effect and various notes. This can be seen here




I think that's a different product. @blueznl was referring to the Magic Encylopedia (as opposed to Encylopedia Magica). 

_Encylopedia Magica_ is a true encyclopedia. I have used it for just about every fantasy game I've ever run for any game system since it was published. I often just open it to random pages to get ideas for magical goodies.


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## eyeheartawk (Oct 9, 2019)

uzirath said:


> I think that's a different product. @blueznl was referring to the Magic Encylopedia (as opposed to Encylopedia Magica).
> 
> _Encylopedia Magica_ is a true encyclopedia. I have used it for just about every fantasy game I've ever run for any game system since it was published. I often just open it to random pages to get ideas for magical goodies.




Whoops! I think you're right, my bad everyone!


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## NineLizards (Oct 9, 2019)

No problem, and yeah, those two products are _completely_ different! I wouldn't mind having the Encyclopedia Magica on my shelf...


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## Garthanos (Oct 9, 2019)

Best : Heroes of the Fey Wild... with the DMG2 as a close second.






Worst is Hard for me to pick ... I am going with the
 monster manual 1 and only because its out of date


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## Tom B1 (Oct 10, 2019)

Best Adventure Module - One of T1:Village of Hommlet, U1:Sinister Secret of Saltmarsh, or B2: Keep on the Borderlands - the three best campaign starter environments one could want. 

Worst Adventure Module - Castle Greyhawk.... we all waited for awesome... and it was a mish mash of stupid. Sad, just sad. And Undermountain I and II were more of the same although without the overt comedy. Dungeonland was a bit ludicrous too. 

Best Hardcover - The Player's Option variant of 2E (Skills and Powers, Spells and Magic) which let you build very different styles of casters with different sources, with magic that exhausted you, with fatigue for fighters and all the gods in my world had custom build cleric classes and spell lists. It felt like a whole new game and worked really well with miniatures and a grid (better than latter attempts like 3E Miniatures Handbook). 

Worst Hardcover - Take your pick from the 3E splatbooks... argh.

Worst Hardcover II - Legends and Lore.... which was totally Dieties and Demigods with a new cover. I gained nothing but an emptier wallet. What a bloody rip off. 

The AD&D Dungeon Masters Guide could have been my other Best Hardcover -> Great tables, lots of atmosphere, good gaming advice here and there, good art, and an amazing cover. 

Ravensgate, the Living City also was idiotic. A teen-level MU using his millions of XP worth of levelling to fly kids around at the circus.... I guess we know what really happened to Gandalf...


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## NineLizards (Oct 10, 2019)

Tom B1 said:


> Ravensgate, the Living City also was idiotic. A teen-level MU using his millions of XP worth of levelling to fly kids around at the circus.... I guess we know what really happened to Gandalf...




Yeah, he started wearing spandex and changed his name to Robin 

(Re. best book: today I received my hardcover Ptolus... Holy Crap Game Books (re: the Ptolus book) )


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## Hussar (Oct 11, 2019)

Heh, it's funny the amount of poo being flung at 4e, but, for the money, the 4e DMG is by FAR the best DMG in D&D.  Hands down.  It remains the best guide to actually running games that has ever been published for D&D.  

While I get the love for the 1e DMG, it really is a terrible guide to running a game.


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## Garthanos (Oct 11, 2019)

But but DMG 2 has gooderest SC rules







Hussar said:


> Heh, it's funny the amount of poo being flung at 4e, but, for the money, the 4e DMG is by FAR the best DMG in D&D. Hands down. It remains the best guide to actually running games that has ever been published for D&D.
> 
> While I get the love for the 1e DMG, it really is a terrible guide to running a game.


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## aramis erak (Oct 12, 2019)

Hussar said:


> Heh, it's funny the amount of poo being flung at 4e, but, for the money, the 4e DMG is by FAR the best DMG in D&D.  Hands down.  It remains the best guide to actually running games that has ever been published for D&D.
> 
> While I get the love for the 1e DMG, it really is a terrible guide to running a game.



For a rulebook, shouldn't being useful be the #1 criterion?

I didn't like 4E _as D&D_, but it was set up for utility in both the PHB and DMG. It was beautiful, and it was well laid out for use.


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## Hussar (Oct 12, 2019)

aramis erak said:


> For a rulebook, shouldn't being useful be the #1 criterion?
> 
> I didn't like 4E _as D&D_, but it was set up for utility in both the PHB and DMG. It was beautiful, and it was well laid out for use.




Yeah, I gotta agree with this.  Like I said, the 1e DMG is chock a block with all sorts of interesting tidbits, but, good god it's an organizational mess.  The 4e DMG, for a book about teaching or guiding someone to being a DM, is a fantastic book.  Great advice, easy layout, and actually fairly easy to read.  

Even if you don't like the advice being given (which is perfectly fair, the 4e DMG suffers from having a too strong "voice" IMO ), it does remain the gold standard for what a DMG should look like.


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## pemerton (Oct 12, 2019)

Hussar said:


> the 4e DMG suffers from having a too strong "voice" IMO



I have quite a different view on this. The 4e DMG's voice is too weak, in that it equivcoates and wobbles back and forth in its vision of what play is meant to look like (eg it advocates skipping the guards and cutting to the fun, and puts forward a skill challenge non-combat resolution framework, but at the same time seems to advocate classic D&D style dungeon design with its minutiae of doors and room contents and the like which is the opposite of skipping the guards and is an obstacle to successfully running skill challenges). Contrast the Moldvay Basic advice in this respect, which is clear with a a firm voice and never loses sight of (what is taken to be) the goal of play.

The best guide I had for GMing 4e was not a WotC publication at all, but Luke Crane's Adventure Burner - intended for Burning Wheel, but excellent for 4e. In part because of its clear voice.


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## aramis erak (Oct 12, 2019)

pemerton said:


> The 4e DMG's voice is too weak, in that it equivcoates and wobbles back and forth in its vision of what play is meant to look like (eg it advocates skipping the guards and cutting to the fun, and puts forward a skill challenge non-combat resolution framework, but at the same time seems to advocate classic D&D style dungeon design with its minutiae of doors and room contents and the like which is the opposite of skipping the guards and is an obstacle to successfully running skill challenges).



That advice really isn't dichotomous... 

The D&D style dungeoneering isn't incompatible with story-forward play. (If it were, Tochebearer would not work. And it works fine for its fans. - for others who don't know: Torchbearer is a variant of Mouse Guard, which is itself a variant of Burning Wheel, and the design team is the same, but in different roles, than for BW or MG.)

But also, 4E doesn't say, "Run traditional adventures differently" - it just says here are the tools, here are the setting standards, here are the typical activities and how to run them; next up we have how to balance encounters...


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## Hussar (Oct 12, 2019)

Maybe "too strong" is the wrong way of putting it.  But, "not pandering enough to a small group of annoying critics that couldn't be bothered to actually try to understand what was being said" is maybe a bit too bitter and insulting.


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## NineLizards (Oct 12, 2019)

Hussar said:


> ... the 4e DMG is by FAR the best DMG in D&D.  Hands down.  It remains the best guide to actually running games that has ever been published for D&D.




Okay, I didn't like the 4e rules, or the overly focus on miniatures / tokens, but your words made me grab my 4e DMG and check it out. (Almost mint, I bought PHB, DMG and MM for 4E, but couldn't stomach it after working my way through the 4e PHB.)

Well, yes. Disregarding the rules it's actually pretty good, and gives some good instructions / tips for DM's, stuff that's not mentioned at all in the 5e DMG.

Hmmm. I'll add it to my 'interesting for new DM's' stack. Again, 4e (rules) didn't do much for me, but yeah, the 4e DMG isn't that bad at all.

As for the 'DM stack'... Two other books that might prove to be very interesting reads, especially for DM's planning longer, more complex / higher level games, are the old 2e _The Complete Book of Villains_, and the Penumbra's newer _Dynasties & Demagogues_. Don't spend all your pocket money on those two, they're not _that _good, but still... Why not give the players an antagonist with some depth? They deserve it


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## Stormonu (Oct 16, 2019)

Coming back to this after several years is interesting.  I'm revising my original answer, as others have, by edition.  Limiting to "official" books, and what I'm familiar with.

*BECMI/Basic*

*Best:*  Rules compendium - an entire D&D game in one book.  I don't think that's a feat we'll ever see again
*Worst:  *Immortal Rules Set.  I've never been much for high level play and the whole Immortal line just made me wonder "why?"  every time I read through it.  The adventures for it didn't help, as the first two stripped your characters of their magical abilities for the majority of the adventure...*

Honorable Mention:*  Moldvay Basic Ruleset - this was what I cut my teeth on.  I did have the Holmes book first, but I didn't understand it.  This set got me actually playing the game for real.
*Dishonorable Mention:* B9 - Journey to the Rock. An insipid adventure, railroady and plain bad.

*AD&D 1E

Best:  *I7 - Ravenloft.  Just so good.  Doesn't hurt I played Dracula himself back in our 8th grade play.  I've used Ravenloft in every version of D&D I've played
*Worst:  *Greyhawk Adventures.  As much as I like the World of Greyhawk, I've never used anything from this book nor felt there was really anything of value in it worth using.  *

Honorable Mention:  *DL1 - Dragons of Despair. Really, the whole Dragonlance series kept me from moving away from D&D to other pursuits. The module itself isn't the best, but it was my introduction into the greater Dragonlance world
*Dishonorable Mention: *S1 - Tomb of Horrors.  I used to love reading through this adventure, until I actually used it in play.*

AD&D 2E

Best: *Aurora's Whole Realms Catalog.  I'm a sucker for shopping lists, and this just was shopping madness at its best.*
Worst:* Oy, there's a lot of bottom-feeders for 2E; practically all of the adventures for 2E were either too mundane, too railroady or both. Probably the worst was GA2 - Swamplight. It was like a bad attempt at retelling U2 - Danger At Dunwater.
*
Honorable Mention:* Dark Sun boxed set (the 1st one). Really got to give TSR a hand for this one. It was one of their few non-traditional fantasy worlds that actually resonated as cool and fun to play in. It's still the only one where psionics feel right at home.
*Dishonorable Mention: *Complete Book of Elves.  Banned the damn book from my game at one point.*

D&D 3E

Best:  *Ghostwalk.  A fun and interesting campaign setting with an equally intriguing look at life after death.*
Worst: *Epic Level Handbook.  The worst and most useless book out of the original 3E books.  It came to truly cement why I hate high-level play.*

Honorable Mention:  *Forge of Fury.  I probably would have put Sunless Citadel here too, but I never ran that one.*
Dishonorable Mention:   *Stronghold Builder's guide.  A worse version of 2E's castle guide and completely useless to boot.  Hero Builder's Guide goes here too.
*
D&D 3.5E
Best:  *Dungeon Master's Guide. This was the last DMG I could stomach reading cover to cover (5+ editions and countless other rule systems will do that to you).
*Worst:*  Book of Nine Swords.  Worst. Book. Ever.

*Honorable Mention:* Frostburn & Stormwrack. These got me out of my mundane mindset instilled by the old Wilderness Survival Guide and made me think about how "natural" phenomenon would be affected by a magical world.
*Dishonorable Mention:* The entire 2nd round of "Complete" books and "Core Rulebook II" books at the tail end of the edition. Looking back it was clear they were all attempts to "3E" the incoming 4E rules, and they ported extremely poorly.
*
D&D 4E
Best:  *Hammerfast. The only 4E book I kept
*Worst: *Keep on the Shadowfell - This module epitomized my hate of 4E. I tried my best to get through it and make it fun for everyone involved, and I just couldn't.  Irontooth didn't help one bit.*

d&D 5E
Best:  *Curse of Strahd - A much better return to the original and revision than awful 3.5E Expedition version.*
Worst: * Yet to find it, as I have been _very_ picky about what I buy so far.

*Honorable Mention:*  Xanathar's Guide to Everything.  Some really great additions to the game for everyone.
*Dishonorable Mention: * Dragon Heist.  I don't own it, but it gets mentioned here for the misleading title.  It should have featured a heist - from a dragon, and that's the main reason I never picked it up.


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## Emerikol (Feb 24, 2021)

Hussar said:


> Heh, it's funny the amount of poo being flung at 4e, but, for the money, the 4e DMG is by FAR the best DMG in D&D.  Hands down.  It remains the best guide to actually running games that has ever been published for D&D.
> 
> While I get the love for the 1e DMG, it really is a terrible guide to running a game.



I would not agree on that point.  I would say that 4e DMG is targeted at getting DMs to play the prevailing style of that generation well.  I do not though think all of the advice is good for playing my style of play.  So sure with DMG 1e, it may take me a bit longer to get started as it does suffer from being the very first.  For getting me excited to play and ultimately for teaching me how to run long lived campaigns I think it is good.   So no poo on 4e or 4e DMG from me.  It's not my preferred style and the game strongly supports a particular style.   And by all means there are good things in the 4e DMG.   It's just not universally good advice for me given what I want from a game.


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## Emerikol (Feb 24, 2021)

My favorite books:
City:  Ptolus hands down and it really ain't close.
Dungeon: Low level B2 is still the king.  Higher levels the D series is pretty good.
Rules Supplement:  Book of the Righteous.  The best book published since 2000A.D.
D&D Rulebook: Probably the 1e DMG
OSR game: Adventurer Conqueror King
Rules Light:  Don't like these that much but FATE is pretty good.  To play it though I'd have to get rid of FATE points which would radically shift the game.


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## eyeheartawk (Feb 24, 2021)

Emerikol said:


> ...
> OSR game: Adventurer Conqueror King
> Rules Light:  Don't like these that much but FATE is pretty good.  To play it though I'd have to get rid of FATE points which would radically shift the game.



Controversial take! Most people I know that are also into the OSR deride ACKS as D&D but with spreadsheets. Why that and not say, Labyrinth Lord or Old School Essentials?


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## CleverNickName (Feb 24, 2021)

Woah, nice thread necromancy!

The best book I own is the D&D Rules Cyclopedia.  It's the best edition of D&D ever released, in my opinion, and it is really nice having all of the rules from the first four core rulebooks combined into a single tome.  (Plus a few Gazetteers thrown in, for good measure.)  The artwork wasn't great; I wish they had used the art from Elmore and Easely and others, but that's my only complaint.

The worst book I own is probably AC11, "The Book of Wondrous Inventions."  I can appreciate it now for what it was intended to be (tongue-in-cheek, lighthearted fun), but at the time I was extremely disappointed at the lack of useful content.


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## TheSword (Feb 24, 2021)

_Best_: *Lords of Madness.* So much gribbly wickedness in here. It has advice and crosses over into Eldritch horror as well as good old fashioned monster hunting... accept these monsters have culture and plans and they’re coming for you in the night. I particularly like the organizations fighting back like the Cerulean Sign - i always thought would make a great secret society.
*Runner up: *Curse of Strahd. Best campaign released for D&D since day 1

_Worst_: *Magic of Incarnum.* It just felt like a weird bloated addition at a point where 3.5 was already bloated enough. It didn’t resonate with other products. Instead trying to come up with something completely different. It felt more like a test balloon for 4e, and therefore pretty useless for 3.5e. One of the few products where I felt I got literally nothing positive from. Should never have bought it.
*Runner up: Book of Nine Sword. *Ridiculously broken in 3.5e. Similar issues to Incarnum.


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## Gorg (Feb 24, 2021)

Wow- tough decision.  I own so very many books...

Best:  Really, it's a toss-up between my OG Moldvay boxed set;  the 3rd ed  Forgotten Realms campaign setting;  and the OG Unearthed Arcana.

  Runners up would be the 1st ed PHB and DMG;  Kingdoms of Kalamar campaign setting;  the Linked adventures for 3rd ed beginning with Sunless Citadel;  Ravenloft (the og module)  and a lot of other stuff, lol.

Worst:  Epic Level Handbook.  Interesting ideas, but not at all what I was looking for- and we never used even a single thing out of it.   There are a couple of 3rd party OGL books I bought that weren't as interesting/useful as I thought they'd be, but I'm not home and don't recall any names.   Ended up being expensive dust collectors...


  Best AND worst:  The DM's Book of Dirty Tricks and Misfit Magic.   (1st/2nd ed 3rd party publisher)   Fiendishly evil, lol.   Boy did it ever live up to it's name!!   A lot of stuff was utterly broken, but ended up making for some extremely memorable games!    One particularly memorable item was called the Girdle of Oxen Strength.   It was a "cursed" item that doubled your strength score- and halved your intelligence.   Of course we gave it to the Half ogre fighter: Gorg. (my namesake!)  He became a total meme of a character in a party full of meme characters- inc a Drizzt clone.   But we didn't care- Gorg's player rp'd it to the hilt, and Strong like OX- dumb like rock!!  Became really really fun.   And true to the claim in the Dungeon article we got the race from, Gorg WAS the world's best door opener,  scared the wits out of most weaker humanoids- and most a-holes in bars;  and provided some very memorable moments.   Just, for the love of Fizban NEVER tell him he's under arrest...  (and don't give his little gully dwarf pal any crap- Gorg gets annoyed)


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## Hex08 (Feb 25, 2021)

Best - For a cool bit of fluff that can be used in any setting it's Aurora's Whole Realms Catalog from 2nd ed. AD&D. Otherwise it's Monte Cook's Arcana Unearthed; a cool take on D&D 3.0 which is heavily influenced by my favorite fantasy books, The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant. Ask me again tomorrow and I will probably change my mind - so much good stuff over the years. Crap, forgot Ptolus - so good....

Worst - That's tough, just about every edition put out some stinkers, especially later in their lives. D&D 3.0 PHB/3.5 PHB/Pathfinder CRB would probably be my pick. I love those games and played what is essentially a single edition longer than any prior one (and I played all except Chainmail until 4th ed.) but they caused the game to become really complicated and crunchy and made combat more of a focus than role playing. It's because of burnout after decades of play that I moved onto Castles & Crusades, Savage Worlds and other games that are simpler. Once again, aske me again tomorrow.....


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## GreyLord (Feb 25, 2021)

I stand the right to change my answers at any time....

I'm not going to say I have a specific Best...but I will list some of the bests...

Bests ---

Rules Cyclopedia - As many have noted, this is a GREAT, self-contained book.  I just got bought some of the new copies so that I could give a copy to my kid.  I hope that he'll pick it up and be impressed enough to try to run a campaign with it!

2nd edition Players Handbook - Despite it being 2e, this version I felt was a better value than 1e's version.  The reason...you could actually run a game with just this book.  You may be missing items, but overall, you could run a game.  One reason...it actually had the combat charts and Saving throw tables which were missing from the 1e PHB.  Yes, there were reasons for them missing from the 1e version, but that doesn't negate that I always felt that at a minimum they should be in the PHB overall.

3e Players Handbook Initial printing - This thing had enough to run the game (see a trend here) completely.  It one upped the 2e version because it ALSO had a few monsters and XP tables.  Printings after the initial one don't make the cut, but the first printing holds a spot close to my heart because it enabled one to play the game with just that book if they so desired.

For a campaign setting --- The best Campaign setting book ever released, in my opinion, is the FRCS for 3e.  Absolutely jampacked to the gills.  Liked it better than the Grey Box, liked it better than the various Dragonlance releases (and Dragonlance is my preferred game world over FR even).  It was excellent.

Worsts...

Wrath of the Immortals - I've have it.  I even downloaded it from DMs guild so now have it in PDF.  I've never used it.  Ironically I don't like some of how the ideas are presented.   Brings me to question why I keep pursuing it...actual answer...don't know.

Epic Level Handbook - This puts me into the frame where you should NEVER have two completely different rule sets for leveling up (maybe this is why I'm not as big a fan of Wrath of the Immortals as well).  You should not neuter things and make it so things really are inconsistent (for example...is it better to be a 20/20 Wizard/Fighter or a 20/20 Fighter/Wizard...these two are not equal and one is absolutely better than the other because the Epic Level Handbook's rules were screwed up in a major fashion).  Because it was so flawed, epic level was more of a house-ruled hodgepodge for us.  I used the Advanced Players Guide (Swords and Wizardry I believe) instead, though sometimes tossed in some of the Epic Level feats system.  At least the APG was more consistent with the base 3e/3.5 rules than the Epic Level Handbook.


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## Gradine (Feb 25, 2021)

I *loved *Magic of Incarnum. A very fresh and interesting concept that allowed for the creation of many different types of characters. Having recently finally gotten through the MCU Dr. Strange movie, its use of "relics" (especially Mordo's boots) gave me major Incarnum feels.

Alas and alack, I never _owned _it myself, or else it would definitely be my top book.

So instead, I'll go with *Heroes of Horror *for 3.5 for the best D&D book I've ever owned. I mean, it's really a tie between that and the original *Eberron Campaign Setting*, but HoH did a really great job of introducing horror as a concept that could work incredibly well, even in the high power 3.X era. Also the Archivist is probably the best new class of the 3.x era.

As for the worst D&D book I've owned... that's tougher. Probably the *Arms & Equipment Guide*.


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## Remus Lupin (Feb 25, 2021)

The worst book in any edition is clearly _The Stronghold Builder's Guidebook_ from Third Edition. I was so looking forward to that. What a piece of garbage.


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## Emerikol (Feb 25, 2021)

eyeheartawk said:


> Controversial take! Most people I know that are also into the OSR deride ACKS as D&D but with spreadsheets. Why that and not say, Labyrinth Lord or Old School Essentials?




First I am not one of those people who think any edition of D&D was perfect.  I want the feel of an edition and not necessarily the funky mechanical crunch.  I think ACKS seriously addresses issues addressed in the 1e DMG.  It covers a lot of things a new DM might not fully grasp.  

1.  So first, I believe ACKS fully embraces the old school concept that bad things can happen to a character and that is okay in fact it's essential to a fun game.   So energy drain, stat loss, etc... are built in.   Wandering monsters in the wilderness are at a certain level.  You may want to run sometimes.
2.  ACKS advocates sandbox design and gives you a lot of tools for building that sandbox effectively.  It gives good advice to DMs on how to play that style.
3.  ACKS has a clear system that is more modern but doesn't get in the way of the old school feel.  Precalculate everything and get to a number.   Then during the game it's only addition.  You throw your number or you don't.   Addition only math is a good thing.
4.  As for the complaint there are lots of tables.  Well there are for things the DM has to manage out of game but when in combat there really aren't that many tables.   The tables are there to build PCs and monsters but once you've done that you can go.  No need to look at tables otherwise.
5.  It is old school enough that it can run almost every module with very little change.  Treasure is x.p. and fighting every enemy is not always best.  
6.  Proficiencies provide enough extra crunch to be fun but they aren't a burden.  They cover skills, feats, and etc...   

I guess I see it as the second edition of 1e D&D done right.


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## Dioltach (Feb 25, 2021)

CleverNickName said:


> Woah, nice thread necromancy!



The third time it's been resurrected, by my count. The thread that couldn't die...

My personal favourite ... Too many to choose from, so I'm going to go with the Mentzer Basic PHB, for giving us Aleena.

Least favourite is probably Weapons of Legacy, for being cast aside after less than an hour for taking a really exciting concept and making it so disappointingly unusable.


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## Olaf the Stout (Feb 25, 2021)

Dioltach said:


> The third time it's been resurrected, by my count. The thread that couldn't die...
> 
> My personal favourite ... Too many to choose from, so I'm going to go with the Mentzer Basic PHB, for giving us Aleena.
> 
> Least favourite is probably Weapons of Legacy, for being cast aside after less than an hour for taking a really exciting concept and making it so disappointingly unusable.



Weapons of Legacy has some really cool ideas executed in a poor way. I can see what they were trying to do, but they totally flubbed the landing.

I love the concept of it, but have never figured out a way to get the cool bits of it without the horrible drawbacks side of things without making the weapons overpowered at the same time.


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## Bluenose (Feb 26, 2021)

Best: D&D Rules Cyclopedia, like several other people. Honourable mentions to Eberron Campaign Guide (3e, the 4e one was also very good), Corsairs of the Great Sea (the Al-Qadim line was surprisingly good compared to the OA material), and Havens of the Great Bay (2e, Birthright), 4e Dark Sun Guide, and the Poor Wizard's Almanacs.

Worst: Actually is very hard to pick, because there's a lot of stuff that should never have been published, but the product that got me out of D&D is the 5e PHB. DisHonourable mentions to BoVD and BoED, Oriental Adventures, Maztica and Complete Book of Elves (2e).


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## eyeheartawk (Feb 26, 2021)

Bluenose said:


> Worst: Actually is very hard to pick, because there's a lot of stuff that should never have been published, but the product that got me out of D&D is the 5e PHB. DisHonourable mentions to BoVD and BoED, Oriental Adventures, Maztica and Complete Book of Elves (2e).



Remember, we got an apology for the Complete Book of Elves!


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## TwoSix (Feb 26, 2021)

eyeheartawk said:


> Controversial take! Most people I know that are also into the OSR deride ACKS as D&D but with spreadsheets. Why that and not say, Labyrinth Lord or Old School Essentials?



Because if you're type of person that likes spreadsheets (_raises hand_), ACKS has some REALLY good spreadsheets.  

Considering OSR games should be sandboxy simulations, strong simulation rules enhance the game.


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## AmerginLiath (Feb 26, 2021)

No book will ever top the 1st edition AD&D Dungeon Master’s Guide. Pure Gary straight into your veins — and the lack of any clear organization means you can effectively open to any random page and drink in of Gygax’s mad wisdom!


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## Gradine (Feb 26, 2021)

Clearly, the 3.5 *Tome of Magic* is the best D&D book. Also, the worst D&D book


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## eyeheartawk (Feb 26, 2021)

TwoSix said:


> Because if you're type of person that likes spreadsheets (_raises hand_), ACKS has some REALLY good spreadsheets.
> 
> Considering OSR games should be sandboxy simulations, strong simulation rules enhance the game.



I think that's fair. For alot of people OSR = very stripped down rules. But that isn't always the case see Traveler's charts and system/planet creation method and terminology and Rolemaster etc.


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## TwoSix (Feb 26, 2021)

eyeheartawk said:


> I think that's fair. For alot of people OSR = very stripped down rules. But that isn't always the case see Traveler's charts and system/planet creation method and terminology and Rolemaster etc.



Yea.  You're right in that very loose, making it up as you go along play is really common in the OSR, but I do think more detailed simulation is also a pretty common strand.


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## Dire Bare (Feb 26, 2021)

Olaf the Stout said:


> For me, the best D&D book I own is the Shackled City Adventure Path by Paizo (3.5E).  It's my best D&D book because with it I ran a campaign for over 3 years and about 100 sessions, starting at 1st level and ending at about 18th-19th level.  It was the longest campaign I've ever DM'd and the only one that reached the end point I'd hoped for at the start of the campaign.  Yeah, I changed and added many things in the adventure (including a full re-write of the final adventure), but I definitely couldn't have come up with a campaign half as cool by myself.
> 
> Normally I'm complete bibliophile with my books.  I hate to write in them at all or get them damaged.  Almost all my RPG books are in pristine condition.  By the end of the campaign, my SCAP hardcover was completely trashed.  The front and back covers the book spine were all damaged.  That wasn't because the book was poorly made.  It was simply due to how much time the book spent in my bag as I took it to and from work to read on the train or on my lunch break.  The book earned it's keep and then some.



I never had the Shackled City hardback, and I never managed to run the campaign, but I have vivid memories of reading about the adventures in Dungeon Magazine at the time. I found the city inside the caldera of a volcano a fascinating setting!


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## innerdude (Feb 26, 2021)

Currently there are exactly 2 WotC branded books and 1 Paizo book on my shelf. I purged all of my actual D&D / PF hardcovers maybe 5 years ago, other than:

-- The 3.x Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting,
-- The 3.x Eberron Campaign Setting
-- The 3.5 Pathfinder Chronicles Campaign Setting

All of them are excellent, but if I had to rank them top to bottom, Golarion/PF would be #1, and Eberron #3. So the "worst" D&D book I own is the Eberron Campaign Setting.


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## Marc_C (Feb 26, 2021)

*The worst:  *2e Monster Manual *binder*, great concept but TSR couldn't make it work. Unearthed Arcana (AD&D 1e) is close second as a major disappointment. I'm told the Wilderness Survival Guide and Dungeoneer's Survival Guide are also very bad.

*The Best:* The World of Greyhawk folio. Simply because it opened my eyes to the true possibilities D&D had to offer. Before that I had been running modules only, one after the other.


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## glass (Feb 26, 2021)

*Worst:* AD&D 2e _Complete Barbarian's Handbook_. Mostly because I missed it when it was new, but picked it on eBay a few years back and regretted it pretty-much immediately.

*Best:* This is trickier, but I would probably have to go with the Bo9S.

_
glass.


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## Deset Gled (Feb 26, 2021)

Best: A toss up between the Red Box set, which was my first D&D book ever, and the 3.5E Player Guide, which is my "home" edition.  Both were great reads for very different reasons.  Both were definitive books for my RPG life.

Worst:  I'm going to go with Races of Destiny from 3.5e.  

There are lots of D&D books that I dislike with a passion.  I hated the lack or organization in 2e material.  I hated how the Magic Item Compendium and Book of 9 Swords completely changed 3.5E.  I hated stealth errata in Complete Psionic, and terrible spells like Melf's Unicorn Arrow in the PHBII.  But all of those books had some actual ideas and some actual value, even if I personally dislike them.

Races of Destiny, OTOH, is without a doubt the least remarkable book in my RPG library.  It came in a box set with the other Races Of series.  I read it, I put in on a shelf, and it was done.  It's not terrible; it doesn't break the game, it isn't annoying, it isn't offensive.  But there's nothing useful in it.  There are no new ideas, and none of it's concepts are flushed out.  It is by far the most boring and worthless RPG book I own.  I don't think WotC ever referenced any of the material in it ever again.  The only thing remarkable about it is how unremarkable it is.


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## Ibrandul (Feb 26, 2021)

So, when I glanced at the thread title, I mistook "any" for "every," and that still seems like a more fun list, so I'm making it.

You'll notice a theme.

pre-2e
Best: _Waterdeep and the North_ — Incredibly imaginative, it feels like this book plus the grey box constitute the real start of the 2e era
Worst: N/A — This is the only category I can't fill, because I only have a few pre-2e books and they all rock

2e
Best: _Faiths and Avatars_ — Nearly overwhelming in its rich detail, but still very usable
Worst: _Realmspace_ — Reads like it was written by a nine-year-old high on fumes

3e
Best: _Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting_ — A stunning achievement that should remain the model for any such book
Worst: _Faiths and Pantheons_ — Cut-and-paste reprint of the previous edition's winner that adds too little new material

4e
Best: _Neverwinter Campaign Setting_ — The only excellent 4e Forgotten Realms book
Worst: _Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide_ — Cover to cover just about as bad as it could possibly be

5e
Best: _Out of the Abyss_ — Still the only really original 5e hardcover adventure
Worst: _Explorer's Guide to Wildemount_ — The only 5e book I wish I hadn't bought


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## Dire Bare (Feb 26, 2021)

Deset Gled said:


> Best: A toss up between the Red Box set, which was my first D&D book ever, and the 3.5E Player Guide, which is my "home" edition.  Both were great reads for very different reasons.  Both were definitive books for my RPG life.
> 
> Worst:  I'm going to go with Races of Destiny from 3.5e.
> 
> ...



Didn't Races of Destiny have the killoren and the illumien? I loved those races . . . although never did play one of them . . .


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## Jack Daniel (Feb 26, 2021)

I don't actually own a huge number of official D&D books at the moment. (I pruned the collection a while ago, and I'm not sure if or when I'll ever build it back up again.) The best that I have is definitely the Rules Cyclopedia, that's a no-brainer… but the worst?

…Actually, I've just remembered that I have a copy of the adventure _In the Phantom's Wake._ Which, to be fair, has a cool full-size poster-map of a ship's deck and interior for it's "dungeon"—but it's also a God-awful railroad of an adventure, with an unkillable ghost-pirate "boss monster" and a stupid puzzle-mystery that has to be figured out by the PCs within a time-limit on pain of unfair character death. The only way to win is not to play, making it a negadungeon published decades before the likes of _Death Frost Doom, Tower of the Stargazer, _and _Maze of the Blue Medusa._


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## Deset Gled (Feb 26, 2021)

Dire Bare said:


> Didn't Races of Destiny have the killoren and the illumien? I loved those races . . . although never did play one of them . . .



Googling shows that the Illumian was in this one, but Killored was from Races of the Wild.  I remember RotW being a step up from RoD.  Races of Stone was the best of the series IMNSHO.

I think the fact that you never actually got around to playing an Illumian, and the fact that the race and mechanics they used never show up anywhere else, illustrates my point fairly well.


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## Dire Bare (Feb 26, 2021)

Deset Gled said:


> Googling shows that the Illumian was in this one, but Killored was from Races of the Wild.  I remember RotW being a step up from RoD.  Races of Stone was the best of the series IMNSHO.
> 
> I think the fact that you never actually got around to playing an Illumian, and the fact that the race and mechanics they used never show up anywhere else, illustrates my point fairly well.



The illumian certainly didn't have traction, pretty sure they never appeared again in D&D! But I still love the race, or at least, the idea of the race.


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## fearsomepirate (Feb 26, 2021)

Best: 4e's Open Grave: Secrets of the Undead. Not quite a setting book, not quite a monster manual, but an overall excellent trove of ways to them your campaigns around the undead. I used this quite a bit when I ran an Eberron campaign centered in Karrnath.

Worst: 4e's Monster Manual. Ugh. What a piece of crap.


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## Olaf the Stout (Feb 27, 2021)

Dire Bare said:


> I never had the Shackled City hardback, and I never managed to run the campaign, but I have vivid memories of reading about the adventures in Dungeon Magazine at the time. I found the city inside the caldera of a volcano a fascinating setting!



And you just know the “dormant” volcano is definitely not going to erupt at some point in the campaign.


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## Olaf the Stout (Feb 27, 2021)

innerdude said:


> Currently there are exactly 2 WotC branded books and 1 Paizo book on my shelf. I purged all of my actual D&D / PF hardcovers maybe 5 years ago, other than:
> 
> -- The 3.x Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting,
> -- The 3.x Eberron Campaign Setting
> ...



What system are you running currently?


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## Blue Orange (Feb 27, 2021)

I've always wondered how much of the charm of the 1e DMG, particularly in retrospect through the rose-colored glasses of early adolescence, was precisely due to its bizarre disorganization. Reading it and trying to make sense of the contradictory rules felt like being a wizard puzzling through an occult tome of eldritch secrets, what with the tables for minutiae (there was a random condiments table!), and of course Gygax's grandiloquent, archaic, and sesquipedalian prose. The whole thing was full of complicated digressions, rarely-used tables, and long disquisitions on every possible permutation of something simple (has the magic item list ever been so long?).

There was also the vaguely disreputable feel of a lot of it--in addition to the now-famous random harlot table, there were rules for summoning and random generation of demons (and this was back in the 70s and 80s when Satanism was something people had real moral panics about), tables for torture chamber items and sexual perversions, and the notorious cheesecake pictures, including one near the back of a succubus. Every major magic item type had a booby-trapped version. It was like reading a book written by that dangerous (?) guy in high school who wore a black leather jacket and listened to heavy metal music (this was what rebellious older kids did in Gen X, for the younguns), if he had had the vocabulary of a professor of medieval studies. It was a nerd's idea of rebellion, if rebellion involved reading about stuff you weren't supposed to instead of taking drugs and committing petty crime.

What, you think I'm _picking_ on the book? I used to take it with me when getting dragged to try out clothes by my parents and pore over it trying to figure out why some monster had a 3% chance of appearing in a swamp while another had a 4%. I generated 12 monsters from Appendix D (yes, I can still list half of them besides Appendix N) in grade school and turned them into a personal set of demons with a hierarchy and everything. I stuck bits from the dungeon dressing tables into school essays as metaphors (don't ask). I thought the gal in Darlene Pekul's Aubrey Beardsley homage was cute.

But if the golden age of science fiction is thirteen, well, maybe that's the golden age of RPG books as well.


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## innerdude (Feb 27, 2021)

Olaf the Stout said:


> What system are you running currently?




From 2010 to 2011, I ran Pathfinder 1e. It was actually a lot of fun, but by the time the characters reached 8th level, prepping for sessions was exhausting. From 2012 until this year, I mostly ran Savage Worlds.

In that time I ran campaigns in a fantasy homebrew setting, a LotR hack, and the Weird Wars Rome setting from Pinnacle Entertainment. Two other GMs ran campaigns in Shaintar (a high-fantasy setting specifically for Savage Worlds) and War of the Dead / zombie apocalypse.

*Edit -- another group member tried GM-ing a GURPS superhero campaign for maybe 4 months in 2019, loosely based in Brandon Sanderson's Reckoners universe, but we were lucky if the game rose to the level of mediocre most sessions. Having tried GURPS in 3 different settings now, I can definitively say I dislike the system immensely.

We also dabbled for 4 sessions in Dungeon World in 2018, which was going . . . okay, mostly, other than it was hard shifting into the right GM mindset, and one of the players (who's no longer in the group) bounced _hard_ off the system.

After 8+ years of almost exclusively playing Savage Worlds, everyone in the group was ready to branch out, including me.

Last year just before Covid hit I started an Edge of the Empire campaign that played just 2 sessions, but was going well. I was actually pretty disappointed we didn't get to keep that one going.

Last week we played our first remote session of Ironsworn (a PbtA / FitD derivative), and it went very well. The plan right now is to alternate between Ironsworn and a Tiny D6 / Tiny Frontiers (space opera) campaign being GM'd by the group member who ran the Shaintar campaign.

We'll see what shakes out this year. I'm pretty sure I'm going to pick up Swords of the Serpentine at some point, and my kids looooove _The Dragon Prince_ TV series, so Tales of Xadia is probably in the mix at some point too.


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## Bluenose (Feb 27, 2021)

eyeheartawk said:


> I think that's fair. For a lot of people OSR = very stripped down rules. But that isn't always the case see Traveler's charts and system/planet creation method and terminology and Rolemaster etc.



And to some extent the majority of 1970s RPGs don't really qualify as simple (too much influence from 1970s wargames among the writers, I suspect), though equating Old Game with Old School has always seemed unreasonable to me as someone who played in the 1970s. And if the inclusion of a lot of random charts and tables disallow a game from being OSR, then I'm pretty sure the 1E DMG cuts AD&D out of the list. Which is patent nonsense considering how OSR material uses that as one of the main sources (along with Original and Basic D&D).


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## Blue Orange (Feb 27, 2021)

Bluenose said:


> And to some extent the majority of 1970s RPGs don't really qualify as simple (too much influence from 1970s wargames among the writers, I suspect), though equating Old Game with Old School has always seemed unreasonable to me as someone who played in the 1970s. And if the inclusion of a lot of random charts and tables disallow a game from being OSR, then I'm pretty sure the 1E DMG cuts AD&D out of the list. Which is patent nonsense considering how OSR material uses that as one of the main sources (along with Original and Basic D&D).




You do raise a very good point, though--there are a lot more B/X clones than AD&D clones. I suspect one of the attractions of OSR is simplicity of rules.


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## aramis erak (Feb 28, 2021)

Olaf the Stout said:


> So that's my best and worst D&D book that I own.  What's yours?



Best, as in one I've used most hours of play: D&D 5E PHB
Best, as in one I used longest: Cyclopedia,
Best, as in one with the best neat ideas: Tie: Voyage of the Princess Ark, Spelljammer
Best visually? (no longer in my posession) D&D 4E PHB.

Worst:
AD&D 1E DMG. Ugly art. Poorly worded. Unclear writing. Convoluted rules. Poorly organized.  Good ideas buried under bad ones.

I Never  got Book of Vile Darkness, but from what I've seen, it would be the content worst, while AD&D 1E DMG would be the everything else worst.

Edit: I'd forgotten I'd previously responded... The alternate bests differ, slightly.


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## Alzrius (Feb 28, 2021)

The sheer multiplicity of D&D products put out across almost fifty years and several editions makes this a very hard question to answer. I'll tentatively nominate the following:

*Best:* _Return to the Tomb of Horrors_ (AD&D 2E). This is an epic campaign, starting out with a simple mission to root out some giants, which leads you to infiltrating a college of necromancers, only to then brave the Tomb of Horrors itself, and that's just the beginning! It really contributed a lot to the legend of the original _S1 Tomb of Horrors_, and has become a classic in its own right ever since.

*Worst:* _WG7 Castle Greyhawk_ (AD&D 1E). I honestly can't get past how mean-spirited this product is, being one big put-down of Gary Gygax's legendary castle/dungeon.

_Please note my use of affiliate links in this post._


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## S'mon (Feb 28, 2021)

delericho said:


> But I think the _worst_ is probably "Scourge of the Howling Horde". It's an incredibly dull, railroady adventure, pretty much every stat-block is wrong (including several monsters drawn unchanged from the "Monster Manual"). But worst of all, it was clearly typeset assuming full colour, and then printed in greyscale, with the net result that several of the sidebars are nigh-unreadable.




The copy of _Scourge_ I got had been partially eaten by animals - this was probably an improvement. 

Favourite book is the 1e DMG, a timeless classic. I like the 5e PHB & MM a lot, despite some issues (terribad PHB index, hard to find section in PHB, no encounter tables or NPC race mods in MM) - presumably though in some distant future I'll be running a new version of D&D and won't need them anymore. But I'll still be referring to the 1e DMG until I die/am too sick/too senile to play D&D.


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## Olaf the Stout (Mar 1, 2021)

S'mon said:


> The copy of _Scourge_ I got had been partially eaten by animals - this was probably an improvement.
> 
> Favourite book is the 1e DMG, a timeless classic. I like the 5e PHB & MM a lot, despite some issues (terribad PHB index, hard to find section in PHB, no encounter tables or NPC race mods in MM) - presumably though in some distant future I'll be running a new version of D&D and won't need them anymore. But I'll still be referring to the 1e DMG until I die/am too sick/too senile to play D&D.



It annoys me that WotC still can’t get indexing right. Indexes should not refer you to another page in the index. Just give me the page numbers directly. It’s not that hard.


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## Maxperson (Mar 1, 2021)

For the best I'm going to go with 2e's Encyclopedia Magica.  Awesome book set.  

For the worst it's a toss up between 1e's Dungeoneers Survival Guide and 3e's The Magic of Incarnum.


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## Ath-kethin (Mar 1, 2021)

Olaf the Stout said:


> It annoys me that WotC still can’t get indexing right. Indexes should not refer you to another page in the index. Just give me the page numbers directly. It’s not that hard.



I'm almost certain the the PHB's horrible index exists entirely for the THAC0 reference. Which was not worth it in any way.


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## Ath-kethin (Mar 1, 2021)

I responded to this thread back in its first life, and it's interesting to me how little my answers have changed in the time since.

Out of the hundreds of D&D and TTRPG books and boxes I've purchased over the years, the ones I've USED the most have been the 2e Al-Qadim sourcebox Secrets of the Lamp and the D&D Rules Cyclopedia. If I have to pick one as the Best, it's the Rules Cyclopedia, though it's far from perfect; it's riddled with typos and errors. But for someone who knows their way around a rulebook and a chart, the issues are easy fixes.

Now, as mentioned previously, I've purchased hundreds of books, and I keep buying them to this day. I buy tons of stuff I know I'll never use, tons of stuff I hope I'll be able to use someday, and tons of stuff I find myself using in unexpected ways. C'est la vie.

But there are only two books I've ever actually regretted purchasing (well, three really, but the third is regretting giving money to the cretin who wrote it, and I wish I'd known more about that person before the purchase. The book itself is fine).

Anyway, the two books that were to me an absolute waste of money and resources were Magic of Incarnum and the 3.5 Dungeon Master's Guide II. Those two books were so devoid of value to me I felt they represented actual contempt for the audience.

Others like them, and that's fine. I don't hate. But holy moly, I did not find one scrap of value in either book.


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## Olaf the Stout (Mar 1, 2021)

Ath-kethin said:


> I'm almost certain the the PHB's horrible index exists entirely for the THAC0 reference. Which was not worth it in any way.



What THAC0 reference are you referring to?


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## Olaf the Stout (Mar 1, 2021)

Maxperson said:


> For the best I'm going to go with 2e's Encyclopedia Magica.  Awesome book set.
> 
> For the worst it's a toss up between 1e's Dungeoneers Survival Guide and 3e's The Magic of Incarnum.



The Encyclopedia Magica books would be up there for me too. I didn’t use them much during an actual campaign, but teenaged me just loved reading through all the different magic items. I spent hours just imagining all the different possibilities.


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## Ath-kethin (Mar 1, 2021)

Olaf the Stout said:


> What THAC0 reference are you referring to?



Check THAC0 in the PHB index. It's there, I promise. At least it is in my 1st printing copy of the book.

It directs us to "attack roll." It's a dumb joke that somehow I feel inspired the whole scavenger-hunt nature of the index. 

That's just my opinion; I don't have any input from anyone who actually assembled that index. But it's an opinion/observation that fits the facts as far as I can tell.


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## Emerikol (Mar 1, 2021)

TwoSix said:


> Yea.  You're right in that very loose, making it up as you go along play is really common in the OSR, but I do think more detailed simulation is also a pretty common strand.



I think the key is that most of the simulation is for campaign management.  There aren't that many charts during the adventure.  If you are trying to run a domain then yes there are some charts to manage that.   So it's very much like 1e in that sense and what is an OSR but harkening back to older editions in style.


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## Emerikol (Mar 1, 2021)

Alzrius said:


> The sheer multiplicity of D&D products put out across almost fifty years and several editions makes this a very hard question to answer. I'll tentatively nominate the following:
> 
> *Best:* _Return to the Tomb of Horrors_ (AD&D 2E). This is an epic campaign, starting out with a simple mission to root out some giants, which leads you to infiltrating a college of necromancers, only to then brave the Tomb of Horrors itself, and that's just the beginning! It really contributed a lot to the legend of the original _S1 Tomb of Horrors_, and has become a classic in its own right ever since.
> 
> ...



Tomb of Horrors was a legend long before 2e.  And that is not taking away from Return to ToH.  

Agree on WG7.  We never really got Castle Greyhawk and now never will sadly.


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## Maxperson (Mar 1, 2021)

Olaf the Stout said:


> The Encyclopedia Magica books would be up there for me too. I didn’t use them much during an actual campaign, but teenaged me just loved reading through all the different magic items. I spent hours just imagining all the different possibilities.



I used them then and I still use them.  It's pretty easy to adapt the incredibly diverse items to whatever edition you are playing.


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## DaveMage (Mar 2, 2021)

Beware of Dawizard!

My faves:
1E - DMG, MM2
2E - Planescape Box Set, Return to the Tomb of Horrors, Ruins of Undermountain Box Set, Faiths & Avatars, Encyclopedia Magica Books
3xE - Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting, Oathbound Campaign Setting (Bastion Press), Ptolus (Malhavoc Press)
Pathfinder 1E - Slumbering Tsar (Frog God Games)

My Worst:
2E - Randal Morn Trilogy of Adventures (Sword of the Dales/Secret of Spiderhaunt/Return of Randal Morn).  Railroad hell.


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## Olaf the Stout (Mar 2, 2021)

DaveMage said:


> Beware of Dawizard!



That find and replace error provided so much unintentional hilarity when reading the Encyclopedia Magica!


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## Pauper (Mar 2, 2021)

The thread that would not die, indeed. May as well put in my $0.02US...

The list of best books I own for any edition of D&D is a pretty short list. Nominees would include the AD&D era Deities and Demigods (though the 'divinity construction kit' of the 3E version was pretty useful when building my own pantheon), the 3PP supplement Hollowfaust, City of Necromancers by Sword and Sorcery Studios, and the Neverwinter Campaign Setting. All of those were both good reads and gave me ideas that I worked into my own games. The winner, though, has to be Van Richten's Guide to the Vistani, a supplement that I discovered in PDF form years after it went out of print and found so good that I tracked down an old print copy just to put it in my collection of Ravenloft books. 

The worst books I own are not necessarily the worst books I thought existed in each edition; check my nickname, and realize that it came from a real place -- I couldn't afford to buy books that I had zero interest in just to be a 'completist', at least prior to roughly 15 years ago. With that said, I do have a few books that I've found myself disappointed in: the d20 adaptation of Call of Cthulhu, the 3PP supplement Requiem for a God, and Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil. Probably not a coincidence that these are all Monte Cook jams -- I just don't find Cook's 'games are meant to be broken' approach to design to be all that entertaining or inspirational. I also don't own the Slayer's Guide to Female Gamers (mentioned earlier in the thread), or that one would certainly be on the list. The winner, though, without any doubt, has to be the Book of Erotic Fantasy. I got it because of all the hype surrounding its publication, but ended up being disappointed at the time by the 'artwork' that was largely poorly-edited photographs, and the game material that was somehow both too mature for folks who wanted to just play and have a good time, and yet too silly for folks who wanted to take their games more seriously and explore stories in greater depth. Not to mention that the particular brand of sexuality espoused in the book (very cishet male focused, which while good for the expected demographic leaves a lot out when it comes to the cornucopia of human sexuality) turned out to be very much of its time, and honestly has not aged well since.

I also had a very different experience of some books listed by others on their lists than they did, which honestly is to be expected, as I suspect they have different ideas of what they enjoy and find interesting in a game than I do. Some examples:


Stronghold Builder's Guidebook (3E): I liked this, not least because it was a stepping-stone into realizing that well-designed strongholds in a D&D universe would likely look nothing like well-designed strongholds in our universe, because both magic and the existence of monsters who can easily fly, burrow, and teleport would make real-world design principles effectively obsolete.
Curse of Strahd (5E): I liked the stand-alone Death House adventure, but Chris Perkins's take on the classic Ravenloft adventure left me cold (and not in a fun way), and dreading what WotC might end up doing with the Ravenloft campaign setting as a whole, which is why I'm awaiting the new Ravenloft book with trepidation.
Weapons of Legacy (3E): Liked it, but didn't get as much use out of it as I'd hoped, because the idea of legacy weapons that grow with PCs, while it sounds good on paper, actually ends up going against a fair number of traditional D&D tropes, not the least of which is the Christmas Day feeling you get when looting a dragon horde and finding a great weapon.
Book of Exalted Deeds (3E): Loved this one -- the Vow of Poverty was utterly broken, but with some work, it was still usable in games. One of my favorite PCs had a cohort (via the Leadership feat) who was a gold dragon monk with a Vow of Poverty. Not everything in the book was top-shelf, but I feel you could say that about most of the hardcover books that came out after the 'big three' and the various campaign setting guides.
Pathfinder 1E in general: Left, and still leaves, me cold. I own just six PF 1E books (and zero 2E books) and at least half the books I do own I got for free at GenCon as part of different swag packages. I know people who love this game, but it's just not my speed, for much the same reasons that Monte Cook's work doesn't move me.

Them's my thoughts!

--
Pauper


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## Emerikol (Mar 3, 2021)

Pauper said:


> The worst books I own are not necessarily the worst books I thought existed in each edition; check my nickname, and realize that it came from a real place -- I couldn't afford to buy books that I had zero interest in just to be a 'completist', at least prior to roughly 15 years ago. With that said, I do have a few books that I've found myself disappointed in: the d20 adaptation of Call of Cthulhu, the 3PP supplement Requiem for a God, and Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil. Probably not a coincidence that these are all Monte Cook jams -- I just don't find Cook's 'games are meant to be broken' approach to design to be all that entertaining or inspirational. I also don't own the Slayer's Guide to Female Gamers (mentioned earlier in the
> 
> --
> Pauper




I don't know that I am a good judge on any of those games you mentioned.  I have no interest in Cthulhu and don't own the others.   I do think Ptolus is one of the best ever made though.  And while 3e is a bit too busy for me, I still think for it's time it was a great design.  I do not like Monte's new system as it brings in the metagame far too much for my preferences.

So I guess my short answer is:  don't pass Ptolus by even if you generally don't care for Monte's work.


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