# best feats for druids?



## wiseacre71

I'm developing a first-level druid in a campaign based largely on aquatic themes. Kind of overwhelmed about what kind of feats I should plan on.

Here's the info:

Druid 1
Race: Half-elf (sea elf parent)

I'm inclined to take Toughness at first level, but after that, do I focus on metamagic feats or physical feats to improve saves, AC? I'd like to hear what others would do in this situation.

Thanks much!


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## Grant_Stoom

Scribe Scroll is always a good feat for Druids and Clerics.  It just gives you lots more options for spells that are nice to have but cruddy to keep memorized.

If he's smart enough (i.e. INT 13) then Combat Expertise would be good for improving ACs.  Plus, this will work well later in Wild Shape.

At 3rd, you might look into Power Attack.  Not that useful until you get your Wild Shape, but you'll want it then.


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## youspoonybard

Natural Spell, of course...

Combat Reflexes.  Just wait until your Gargantuan, and you'll see how useful it is.


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## wiseacre71

So should I forego Toughness at first level, then? I like the 3 extra hit points, but I suppose other feats would help more in the long run.


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## welby

I'll second natural spell.  The rest depends on your character concept.


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## Dash Dannigan

Water Adaptation is a unique feat for Half-aquatic elves, and Rapid Swimming is neat if you're into making a character faster in water.

For spells I've always been partial to Scribe Scroll (even for a druid) because there alot of neat one-time use spells or back-up spells to have. 

You need to decide what sort of druid you wil be playing however. Will this be a strong meleer or a frail caster? Stealthy or loud? A diplomat or a warmonger? This will help narrow down folks responses.


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## jgsugden

You usually want to grab Natural Spell at 6th level. Not being able to cast in animal form is aloss of a huge portion of a druid's power.

Power Attack is nice, especially when you get to those forms with really high strength, but few attacks. It also allows you to pick up cleave.

Combat Expertise is also nice. A druid's AC is often his biggest problem. Giving up 5 points of AB for 5 points of defense can be very helpful. Dodge is also nice for this same reason.

Combat Reflexes has been mentioned. I like this feat as well, though I'd probably get it later on, at 9th or 12th level. Even if the druid has a low dex, many of his animal forms do not.

I'm a big proponent of quicken spell at 12th, 15th or 18th level. A druid gets few spells, but being able to toss off a quickend spell after a main spell or an attack is a huge advantage. A quickened resist energy, delay poison or produce flame (you can deliver these as part of a natural attack, you know) can be very helpful.

Some people will tell you that Spell Focus: Conjuration and Augment Summoning make a nice addition to a druid's power given his ability to spontaneously cast summon spells, but I disagree. There are few conjuration spells with saves for druids in the PHB. Unless you have a good alternative source for druidic conjuration spells with saves, the cost is too high for the benefit.

Leadership is always a nice feat. Druids are at a disadvantage because of their animal companion (which negatively affects his cohort max level), but it is still worthwhile.

My current druid, a dwarf, has the following progression planned (though he may change it if he grabs a level of fighter):

1: Power Attack
3: Combat Expertise (Edited)
6: Natural Spell
9: CLeave
12: Combat Reflexes
15: Quicken Spell
18: Blind Fighting


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## Velmont

Heavy Armor proficiency can be interesting at high level if you can have your hand on a Wild Dragonhide Full Plate Mail (which is AC 3 better than a Wild Dragonhide Breastplate or 5 than a Wild Hide).

If you can take it, almost a must: Energy Substitution. The great majority of druid offensive spell is Fire based, so against a fire subtype creature, you lost some firepower. You can choose Sonic, which is a pretty rare resistance or immunity, or Cold, which fire-subtype are vunerable, but still, you may fall on a Cold/Fire immune, but it is more rare than a simply fire immune creature.


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## Nifft

I think Toughness is a waste of a Feat for a Druid. You ought to have a high Con score -- your most important scores are Wis, Con, Int and Dex, in that order. High Con + d8 = tough enough most of the time.

What rules are you playing under? 3.0 + some accessories? 3.5 Core only? I'll assume 3.5 Core only, but do let us know.

1: Point Blank Shot -- works nicely with Produce Flame, your best 1st level spell.
3: Precise Shot -- now you can fling flames into melee, or use your sling to better effect (or take a level of Ranger, Barbarian or Fighter and use a Longbow).
6: Natural Spell -- enough has been said, it's gr-r-reat!

After this, it really depends on the kind of campaign you're playing in. Good choices are:

- Spell Penetration & Greater Spell Penetration -- if you're the spellcasting damage dealer.

- Skill Focus (Concentration) & Combat Reflexes -- if you're often in melee, or if your _Summon Nature's Ally_ spells keep getting disrupted. NOTE: Combat Casting is worthless compared to Skill Focus (Concentration).

- Spell Focus (Conjuration) & Augment Summoning -- "Say hello to my little friend!" -- if your Summons are doing most of your work.

- Negotiator & Skill Focus (Sense Motive) or Skill Focus (Diplomacy) -- you've got a high Wisdom and some bonuses from your racial heritage.

Druids are awesome in 3.5e. Enjoy!

 -- Nifft


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## youspoonybard

The reason why I recommend Combat Reflexes so fiercely is illustrated in the back of the 3.5 DMG, page 308.

Look at the Huge and Gargantuan Space and Reach squares.  Eventually, you will be able to control that much space.  More if you go epic.

Combat Reflexes...


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## jgsugden

youspoonybard said:
			
		

> The reason why I recommend Combat Reflexes so fiercely is illustrated in the back of the 3.5 DMG, page 308.
> 
> Look at the Huge and Gargantuan Space and Reach squares.  Eventually, you will be able to control that much space.  More if you go epic.
> 
> Combat Reflexes...




Gargantuan is not available to non-epic Core 3.5 druids. Huge is not available til 15th level. Large is available at 8th.

I'd wait until 9th level (at least) for combat reflexes. I might even wait til 15th.


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## jgsugden

Velmont said:
			
		

> Heavy Armor proficiency can be interesting at high level if you can have your hand on a Wild Dragonhide Full Plate Mail (which is AC 3 better than a Wild Dragonhide Breastplate or 5 than a Wild Hide).




If you're going to get heavy armor, consider multiclassing. Armor proficiency is useless unless you're in humanoid form. If you're going to be in humanoid form, picking up martial weapons is a nice idea. Picking up a level of a fighter class/prestige class that gives martial weapons and heavy armor proficiency can be a nice bonus, even though it slows your spellcasting down by a level.


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## youspoonybard

Ah, but what about Animal Growth?


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## Velmont

jgsugden said:
			
		

> If you're going to get heavy armor, consider multiclassing. Armor proficiency is useless unless you're in humanoid form.




Not necesserly. You won't ever be transform, so you don't want huge penalty to your attack while you are in heavy armor, and if you transform, and you have a WILD armor, you had the bonus of the armor to your transform form, that's why it is so interesting to take it, buit I would take other feats first, as you can live with a dragonhide breastplate easlity too.


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## Nail

Don't get toughness.  It's not necessary for you, and it's a wimpy feat to boot.

IIWY, I'd take Scribe Scroll.  Back up spells are real life-savers.


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## wiseacre71

Nail said:
			
		

> Don't get toughness.  It's not necessary for you, and it's a wimpy feat to boot.
> 
> IIWY, I'd take Scribe Scroll.  Back up spells are real life-savers.




Great information from everyone. Much obliged. 

I have decided to start with Scribe Scroll at 1st level; Natural Spell is definitely on the list.

Thanks!


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## jgsugden

youspoonybard said:
			
		

> Ah, but what about Animal Growth?




Uhhhh ... it is bad for your cholesterol. 

I blanked on it for some reason. Oh well. 

It is a fairly short duration spell. Druids don't get too many spells, so using it consistently will deplete your spell reserves. Being Gargantuan for a combat or two is a possibility, but being gargantuan for a majority of your battles may be difficult (depending upon the campaign).


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## jgsugden

wiseacre71 said:
			
		

> Great information from everyone. Much obliged.
> 
> I have decided to start with Scribe Scroll at 1st level; Natural Spell is definitely on the list.
> 
> Thanks!




Scrolls, much like every woman that ever turned me down, are cheap. Buy them if there is a market for them in your area. Any druid can cast any druid spell, so finding a scroll of the right spell is not too difficult if you can find any druid with the right feat.

Just my humble opinion.


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## Delemental

Here's my suggestions:

Natural Spell, of course, as has been mentioned numerous times.  I also like to combine this with Eschew Materials so you don't have to worry about material components.  I don't think this is as much as a problem in 3.5 though... also, in 3.0 you have to have another metamagic feat to get Eschew Materials (you don't in 3.5).  I took Extend Spell for my druid, as it's great with the buff spells.

One feat I took that worked well was Faster Healing out of Masters of the Wild.  It increases your natural healing rate.  To see the use of this, remember that when you use wild shape, you heal as if you'd rested for a day.  My druid rarely needed to get outside healing.


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## youspoonybard

*Deleted because of incompetence, on my part*


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## youspoonybard

jgsugden said:
			
		

> Uhhhh ... it is bad for your cholesterol.
> It is a fairly short duration spell. Druids don't get too many spells, so using it consistently will deplete your spell reserves. Being Gargantuan for a combat or two is a possibility, but being gargantuan for a majority of your battles may be difficult (depending upon the campaign).




Well, 1 min/level is 10x better than the 1 round/level...and it hits multiple targets...and could easily be extended for a small cost.

I see your point, but already at level 10 it's lasting 10 min, and it does even more at later levels, at an effective lower cost (a 5th level spell slot, or even a 6th, is not as important when you have level 8 spells).

Or just whup out 11k for the Extend Rod...

In any event, I think that combat reflexes is a strong feat in 3.5.  Remember, it only takes 1 trip (from a summoned wolf, animal companion, or your fighter ally) to get you extra attacks on your opponent from a huge area.  Fighter tries to close?  Grapple 'em.  

Right now, at level 3, the advantage of being a "large creature with reach" (Mounted Druid with Horse Animal Companion, longspear) and combat reflexes has been shown, simply with the huge amount of space I control.  Summon Nature's Ally II - 1d3 augmented wolves have also been useful with the tripping (longspear is a Druidic weapon in this campaign, scimitars are not).  Personally, I love the synergies of this build (Animal Companion mounts are stronger and easier to control (and you can do it as a free action), share spells is virtually always useable, mount gives you movement as you summon, large reach to control space, mount threatens close, you threaten far, etc).  Even without the mount, Combat Reflexes will become good.

That's my current build, and so far it's working.  Just a recommendation, though.  The important thing is you should enjoy your build.

*Edited* Because for some reason I keep thinking Animal Growth is 10min/level...idiot...


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## Rolzup

One idea that I had -- for a fighting Druid character, perhaps multiclassed with a level or two of barbarian -- was to go for the two-weapon fighting path.  Using the Shilleleigh spell (no doubt misspelled by me) on your quarterstaff, and then using it as a double weapon?

Nasty.  Combine it with Bear's Strength a level or two on, and a Barkskin that will protect both you and your animal companion....  And of course, you can use two-weapon defense to give your AC a bit of a boost.

I dunno.  I just like the idea of a druid kicking butt and taking names.

Rolzup


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## Trey Gray

I would actually trade the quicken spell for silent spell especially while using the natural spell...they would not ever see it coming if using hit and run tactics or just ready to kick off a good old fight. If you really wanted to be nice about it use a enlarge silent fireball spell while in wildshape of a rat!!! of course being the size of a rat they really wouldn't hear your squeaks.


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