# Strange New Worlds trailer



## Morrus (Mar 9, 2022)

In case that one doesn't work:


----------



## Snarf Zagyg (Mar 9, 2022)

Thoughts, in no order-

1. Graphics are good, of course.

2. Still, a little disappointing?

3. And yet, Anson Mount.

4. I wanted more?

5. But at the end, with the Enterprise, and the old music, and the sound ... you know that sound.

Yeah, totally in.


----------



## billd91 (Mar 9, 2022)

What *IS *it about Star Fleet captains running off to bucolic lifestyles in their off times/retirements? Do no inactive Star Fleet captains live in urban centers so they can go to the theater and see the latest musical productions or check out the new chic restaurants? They all have to ride horses, farm, or grow grapes?


----------



## Marc Radle (Mar 9, 2022)

I’m a big Star Trek fan, but  I have no interest in paying for another streaming service.


----------



## Snarf Zagyg (Mar 9, 2022)

Marc Radle said:


> I’m a big Star Trek fan, but  I have no interest in paying for another streaming service.




You can't be a Star Trek fan and not have Paramount+ at this point.

Of course, that's easy for me to say because I have a free year of it.

But there is so ... much ... Trek on it, and they keep pumping it out. How you feel about all the different new shows ... well, I can't tell you. Discovery had a rough first couple of season and is now decent. Picard was fun, if only for Patrick Stewart, and now has a second season. And Lower Decks is genuinely funny.

Heck, you could pay for a month, catch up on everything, and then cancel- maybe wait until after all of Strange New Worlds has been released, though.


----------



## Morrus (Mar 9, 2022)

Oh god, here we go. Yet another Star Trek thread turns into a thread all about how many streaming services people won't get!

Can we talk about Star Trek please, folks? If you want to talk about streaming services, feel free to start a thread about it. Thanks!


----------



## Snarf Zagyg (Mar 9, 2022)

Morrus said:


> Oh god, here we go. Yet another Star Trek thread turns into a thread all about how many streaming services people won't get!
> 
> Can we talk about Star Trek please, folks? If you want to talk about streaming services, feel free to start a thread about it. Thanks!




I really like the Enterprise crew when they were already on Discovery.

I think that Anson Mount as Pike and Ethan Peck as Spock are excellent.

I also like Rebecca Romijn as Number One, but need to see more of her.

I'm curious to see what role La'an Noonien-Singh is going to play. We all know the name. 

Now, I think the show will succeed if it takes _the spirit_ of TOS (exploration, adventure, occasional fisticuffs and/or ripped shirts) and modernizes it somewhat.

On the other hand, I think the show will end up failing if all it is doing is providing fan service and/or memberberries - "Hey, that's where Kirk goes later! Cool, I remember that. That makes me smart!"

I am very hopeful!


----------



## Umbran (Mar 9, 2022)

billd91 said:


> What *IS *it about Star Fleet captains running off to bucolic lifestyles in their off times/retirements? Do no inactive Star Fleet captains live in urban centers so they can go to the theater and see the latest musical productions or check out the new chic restaurants? They all have to ride horses, farm, or grow grapes?




Do remember, this was originally pitched as "Wagon Train to the Stars".  These are cowboys.


----------



## payn (Mar 9, 2022)

Marc Radle said:


> I’m a big Star Trek fan, but  I have no interest in paying for another streaming service.



Amazon ran a Black Friday special of 2 months for 2 dollars. I was able to get my Trek fix in.


----------



## Morrus (Mar 9, 2022)

Snarf Zagyg said:


> I really like the Enterprise crew when they were already on Discovery.
> 
> I think that Anson Mount as Pike and Ethan Peck as Spock are excellent.
> 
> ...



Yeah, I think the danger is being overshadowed by TOS -- but that's the problem with all prequels; you know what happens in the end, and they can't discover or change anything too important.


----------



## payn (Mar 9, 2022)

Morrus said:


> Yeah, I think the danger is being overshadowed by TOS -- but that's the problem with all prequels; you know what happens in the end, and they can't discover or change anything too important.



Right?


----------



## Dannyalcatraz (Mar 9, 2022)

Personally, I’d love to see a ST series that focused on away teams, starships, and bases around the Federation, instead of a single crew.  Maybe even beyond the Federation, showing how they handle away missions…. It wouldn’t even have to be within a particular time setting.

Imagine a Tholian starship handling first contact within their empire, for instance.  Or seeing the events leading up to ”Arena” from the Gorn perspective.


----------



## Snarf Zagyg (Mar 9, 2022)

Dannyalcatraz said:


> Or seeing the events leading up to ”Arena” from the Gorn perspective.




Sir! I am reasonably certain the Pink-Skin Commanding Officer is .... _ripping his own shirt before going into combat_?

Is it some kind of dominance ritual?


----------



## Benjamin Olson (Mar 9, 2022)

Very excited about the show, but this trailer doesn't bring much to the table.

Maybe I just don't like "teaser" trailers. Stop teasing me and show me some stuff!


----------



## Ryujin (Mar 9, 2022)

billd91 said:


> What *IS *it about Star Fleet captains running off to bucolic lifestyles in their off times/retirements? Do no inactive Star Fleet captains live in urban centers so they can go to the theater and see the latest musical productions or check out the new chic restaurants? They all have to ride horses, farm, or grow grapes?



YOU try living on what's essentially a flying apartment block for 5 years, then see how much you want to be around people.


----------



## Hex08 (Mar 9, 2022)

I'm looking forward to this. A communicator that looks like a TOS communicator. The shuttle and Enterprise, while updated, look like Star Trek ships. Uniforms that look like updated versions of TOS uniforms. And, as Snarf said, the music and the sound...

With Lower Decks Paramount+ has shown it can _get_ Star Trek when it wants to. For as much as I enjoyed season one of Picard, just one episode of season two felt more like Trek than the entire first season. I am hopeful that P+ is learning from past mistakes and I am optimistic about this show. I just hope it is allowed to do its own thing and not fall into a bunch of fan service.


----------



## Ryujin (Mar 9, 2022)

Morrus said:


> Yeah, I think the danger is being overshadowed by TOS -- but that's the problem with all prequels; you know what happens in the end, and they can't discover or change anything too important.



I jut hope that they don't make the same mistake that Enterprise did, by going for a galaxy wide crisis. I have high hopes for it.


----------



## billd91 (Mar 9, 2022)

Morrus said:


> Yeah, I think the danger is being overshadowed by TOS -- but that's the problem with all prequels; you know what happens in the end, and they can't discover or change anything too important.



Going by the Star Trek: Discovery experience, the risk isn't being overshadowed by TOS - the risk is treading too heavily on it. It was a bit of a relief when Discovery jumped to the future and stopped stomping all over the things covered by or discovered by TOS.

I really enjoyed Anson Mount and Rebecca Romijn as Pike and Number One during Discovery's second season. And I'm thrilled by some of their choices of characters. But there's one looming thorn. How will they handle La'an Noonien-Singh? She's not simply Chekhov's gun waiting to go off - she's Chekhov's howitzer. She could be handled with some subtlety (which brings up the question why even have her obvious connection to Khan) or she can be an irritation intruding on TOS stories. Given Discovery's track record, I'm battening down the hatches in expectation of the latter but desperately hoping for the former.


----------



## MarkB (Mar 9, 2022)

billd91 said:


> What *IS *it about Star Fleet captains running off to bucolic lifestyles in their off times/retirements? Do no inactive Star Fleet captains live in urban centers so they can go to the theater and see the latest musical productions or check out the new chic restaurants? They all have to ride horses, farm, or grow grapes?



To be fair, this isn't a new example - it's the original example. Pike's rural homelife was established during one of the fantasy scenarios in the original pilot The Cage, complete with horse.


----------



## Morrus (Mar 9, 2022)

MarkB said:


> To be fair, this isn't a new example - it's the original example. Pike's rural homelife was established during one of the fantasy scenarios in the original pilot The Cage, complete with horse.



Yeah, and Kirk was basically a copy of him with a new actor.


----------



## MarkB (Mar 10, 2022)

Umbran said:


> Do remember, this was originally pitched as "Wagon Train to the Stars".  These are cowboys.



Plus it's Star Trek, they have transporters. You can live on the other side of the planet and still be no more than ten seconds away from your favourite bar, theatre or boutique.


----------



## Umbran (Mar 10, 2022)

Ryujin said:


> I jut hope that they don't make the same mistake that Enterprise did, by going for a galaxy wide crisis. I have high hopes for it.




IIRC, the producers have stated that they aren't doing long plot arcs.  The characters are expected to have their personal development and relationships develop over time, but that is supposed to be within the context of episodic stories.


----------



## Morrus (Mar 10, 2022)

Yeah, episodic adventures of the week is something I’m looking forward to.


----------



## payn (Mar 10, 2022)

Morrus said:


> Yeah, episodic adventures of the week is something I’m looking forward to.



I thought so too, but after Mando (I know different series but similar episodic style) I've already tired of it. Though, that's just me and I see this return to TV of yesterday being the pulpy goodness that ST really needs.


----------



## Umbran (Mar 10, 2022)

Dannyalcatraz said:


> It wouldn’t even have to be within a particular time setting.




Well, each individual story would have to be in a particular time setting, and you'd need to communicate that to the viewers in a satisfying way, which could get awkward.

But broadly - a Star Trek anthology series could be interesting.  It could be _really_ interesting if they made it a venue for prominent or upcoming sci-fi writers to engage with Trek.


----------



## Umbran (Mar 10, 2022)

payn said:


> I thought so too, but after Mando (I know different series but similar episodic style) I've already tired of it.




The Mandalorian was also filming in a style reminiscent of an old western... which meant a pretty slow pacing.  One would hope they'd not lean into that here.


----------



## payn (Mar 10, 2022)

Umbran said:


> The Mandalorian was also filming in a style reminiscent of an old western... which meant a pretty slow pacing.  One would hope they'd not lean into that here.



No doubt ST will be on a different pace. Though, was the "wagon train to space" thing something a fan said or something that the creators did?


----------



## Morrus (Mar 10, 2022)

payn said:


> No doubt ST will be on a different pace. Though, was the "wagon train to space" thing something a fan said or something that the creators did?



That was Gene Roddenberry’s original pitch.


----------



## Paul Farquhar (Mar 10, 2022)

billd91 said:


> What *IS *it about Star Fleet captains running off to bucolic lifestyles in their off times/retirements? Do no inactive Star Fleet captains live in urban centers so they can go to the theater and see the latest musical productions or check out the new chic restaurants? They all have to ride horses, farm, or grow grapes?



You have been cooped up in a flying tin can for years, why would you not want open space?!


----------



## Ryujin (Mar 10, 2022)

Morrus said:


> That was Gene Roddenberry’s original pitch.



Not sure if I'm remembering correctly, but I think that was what the network told him they wanted, after the first pilot "The Cage" was labeled "too cerebral." He came back with "Where No Man has gone Before" and while they bought the series based on that, they still went with "The Man Trap" (the one about the salt eating shapeshifter) as the first episode to air.


----------



## Mallus (Mar 10, 2022)

Paul Farquhar said:


> You have been cooped up in a flying tin can for years, why would you not want open space?!



Right. Who wouldn't miss Earth nature? On alien planets it seems like ever flower and muddle of mud is trying to kill you!


----------



## Ryujin (Mar 10, 2022)

Mallus said:


> Right. Who wouldn't miss Earth nature? On alien planets it seems like ever flower and muddle of mud is trying to kill you!



Some are trying to make you happy.


----------



## Umbran (Mar 10, 2022)

Ryujin said:


> Not sure if I'm remembering correctly




Sorry, you aren't.  



Ryujin said:


> ...but I think that was what the network told him they wanted




That's incorrect.  

Roddenberry presented a treatment to Desilu Studios, using the "Wagon Train to the Stars" as the working title. Lucille Ball was head of the studio, thought it had promise, and had the studio work with Roddenberry to develop his treatment into a script, which they then pitched to NBC.

NBC paid to make a pilot ("The Cage") which they rejected.  But seeing promise, they commissioned a second pilot ("Where No Man Has Gone Before") which eventually was shown as the third episode of the first season.

Note that there's a divide here: the _network_ and the _studio_ are two different entities.  Desilu studios eventually became Paramount.


----------



## Ryujin (Mar 10, 2022)

Umbran said:


> Sorry, you aren't.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I still feel blessed that I got to see the first aired episode, on CFTO (our local CTV affiliate) two days before folks in the US


----------



## Willie the Duck (Mar 10, 2022)

Morrus said:


> That was Gene Roddenberry’s original pitch.



To clarify, it wasn't 'wagon train to the stars,' it was '_Wagon Train_ to the stars.' As in, a very specific show that Roddenberry wanted to emulate, just in space. The primary comparison isn't that Star Trek would be a space western, but that it would have the same format -- protagonist group is mobile and every episode goes to a new location with new guest stars and a local conflict (or one generated by their presence) to resolve by the end of the episode. If Star Trek had been initially pitched in the mid-late 70s instead of the 60s, it would have been '_Love Boat_ to the stars.'


----------



## Dannyalcatraz (Mar 10, 2022)

Umbran said:


> Well, each individual story would have to be in a particular time setting, and you'd need to communicate that to the viewers in a satisfying way, which could get awkward.
> 
> But broadly - a Star Trek anthology series could be interesting.  It could be _really_ interesting if they made it a venue for prominent or upcoming sci-fi writers to engage with Trek.



I’m thinking a stardate prominently displayed at the beginning with the episode title should do it, _especially _if the prerelease ads & trailers made it clear it was an anthology show.  If the fanbase see unis & ship designs from a variety of eras, they’ll get it, and hopefully pass it along to newer viewers. Good teaser clips for upcoming episodes would help, too.

And as you suggest, using it as a gateway for bringing talent- old and new- into the setting, it would be a very good idea. (I hadn’t considered that myself, TBH.)


----------



## Dannyalcatraz (Mar 10, 2022)

Mallus said:


> Right. Who wouldn't miss Earth nature? On alien planets it seems like ever flower and muddle of mud is trying to kill you!



Welcome to Spacestralia!


----------



## Dannyalcatraz (Mar 10, 2022)

Willie the Duck said:


> If Star Trek had been initially pitched in the mid-late 70s instead of the 60s, it would have been '_Love Boat_ to the stars.'



Considering James Tiberius Kirk’s love life, _Love Boat_ was almost _Star Trek_ at sea.


----------



## Umbran (Mar 10, 2022)

Dannyalcatraz said:


> I’m thinking a stardate prominently displayed at the beginning with the episode title should do it...




No, that would definitely not do it.  Only a small segment of very detailed oriented fandom remembers what Stardates are associated with TOS, or TNG, or other series.


----------



## Rabulias (Mar 10, 2022)

Dannyalcatraz said:


> I’m thinking a stardate prominently displayed at the beginning with the episode title should do it...





Umbran said:


> No, that would definitely not do it.  Only a small segment of very detailed oriented fandom remembers what Stardates are associated with TOS, or TNG, or other series.



Maybe a standard Earth year instead would help? Or a relative date like "12 years before Kirk's 5 year mission" or "During _Star Trek II,_ in another part of the galaxy." 

It will still be confusing to new audiences only familiar with the Kelvin timeline films. :-/


----------



## MarkB (Mar 10, 2022)

Umbran said:


> No, that would definitely not do it.  Only a small segment of very detailed oriented fandom remembers what Stardates are associated with TOS, or TNG, or other series.



And only a moderately larger portion know what actual dates are associated with them. To the extent that they're even defined.


----------



## Mustrum_Ridcully (Mar 10, 2022)

MarkB said:


> To be fair, this isn't a new example - it's the original example. Pike's rural homelife was established during one of the fantasy scenarios in the original pilot The Cage, complete with horse.



I kinda feel it makes sense that many of those "explorer" type Captains that would go on a 5 year mission for Starfleet might seek out a "quiet" life in the wilderness. 
They went out to the stars to explore the unknown and a lot of that time is probably just holding watch while the ship hurls through space, retreating to your cabin between shifts. It is then interpunctuated by encountering some new civilizations and space anomalies. There is certainly also a lot of camaderie and tight-knit communities aboard these ships - but Captains like Picard, Kirk or Pike tends to keep some professional distance from a lot of that, and their job can be very lonely.
If you can't handle it well, chances are you won't even go on a 5 year mission...

When they decide to retire after some 5 year exploration missions, many will still need that quitness - and they can easily go to the next big city if they think it's time for some excitement again. Or, if they want just some camaderie, they might remain in close contact with some smaller town in the area. But they'll still have their Captain's cabin a bit further out...

Of course, that lone cabin in the wild will be the extreme spectrum - Riker and Troi built a family, for example - but they are still somewhat outside the big cities.


----------



## Zaukrie (Mar 11, 2022)

To build on an earlier comment.... I'd like a Klingon star trek. I know I won't get one, but I'd be interested in something different.


----------



## Hex08 (Mar 11, 2022)

Zaukrie said:


> To build on an earlier comment.... I'd like a Klingon star trek. I know I won't get one, but I'd be interested in something different.



I couldn't agree more. Back when Michael Dorn was trying to pitch a Captain Worf series I would tell my friends I was far more interested in a General Martok show. I would also love a Romulan show; the Tal Shiar would be far more interesting than the (possibly) upcoming Section 31 show.


----------



## Thomas Shey (Mar 12, 2022)

Morrus said:


> Yeah, I think the danger is being overshadowed by TOS -- but that's the problem with all prequels; you know what happens in the end, and they can't discover or change anything too important.




Maybe.  But TOS actually rarely really changed anything; the only thing that comes to mind was the Organians Peace Treaty and that came in pretty early so they could do Cold War stories instead of hot war ones.  Very little else perturbed the status quo in the series much.


----------



## Thomas Shey (Mar 12, 2022)

billd91 said:


> Going by the Star Trek: Discovery experience, the risk isn't being overshadowed by TOS - the risk is treading too heavily on it. It was a bit of a relief when Discovery jumped to the future and stopped stomping all over the things covered by or discovered by TOS.
> 
> I really enjoyed Anson Mount and Rebecca Romijn as Pike and Number One during Discovery's second season. And I'm thrilled by some of their choices of characters. But there's one looming thorn. How will they handle La'an Noonien-Singh? She's not simply Chekhov's gun waiting to go off - she's Chekhov's howitzer. She could be handled with some subtlety (which brings up the question why even have her obvious connection to Khan) or she can be an irritation intruding on TOS stories. Given Discovery's track record, I'm battening down the hatches in expectation of the latter but desperately hoping for the former.




Its going to be particularly hard to explain how Kirk never referenced her unless they play a similar card to what they did with Burnham.

(Or, honestly, just retcon that he did offscreen.  Its not like they've been hesitant to do that sort of thing in Trek canon, as is shown by the two radically different histories ascribed to Zefram Cochran).


----------



## Hex08 (Mar 16, 2022)

This news makes me nervous. Casting Kirk for Strange New Worlds seems like a potential mistake to me for reasons previously mentioned in this thread.


----------



## MarkB (Mar 16, 2022)

Hex08 said:


> This news makes me nervous. Casting Kirk for Strange New Worlds seems like a potential mistake to me for reasons previously mentioned in this thread.



We'll see. As I understand it, he's not appearing until season 2, so let's see what happens in season 1 before judging whether or not it's a good move.


----------



## Ryujin (Mar 16, 2022)

They could do a tie-in with a certain Lieutenant Kirk, on the USS Farragut, who had an encounter with a peculiar blood eating cloud creature 11 years before TOS occurred. TOS S2E13: "Obsession"


----------



## MarkB (Mar 16, 2022)

Ryujin said:


> They could do a tie-in with a certain Lieutenant Kirk, on the USS Farragut, who had an encounter with a peculiar blood eating cloud creature 11 years before TOS occurred. TOS S2E13: "Obsession"



Possible. This character is definitely already a captain, though - the rank bars on the uniform confirm it.


----------



## ART! (Mar 16, 2022)

MarkB said:


> Possible. This character is definitely already a captain, though - the rank bars on the uniform confirm it.



The pic in that article is Photoshopped (or otherwise doctored up).


----------



## MarkB (Mar 16, 2022)

ART! said:


> The pic in that article is Photoshopped (or otherwise doctored up).



I don't know if that's true, but he was also photographed on location in a captain's uniform, leading to mass wild speculation about whether this was a character we knew or some unknown captain, leading to the official announcement.


----------



## Hex08 (Mar 17, 2022)

ART! said:


> The pic in that article is Photoshopped (or otherwise doctored up).



Do we have proof of that?


----------



## Ryujin (Mar 17, 2022)

Hex08 said:


> Do we have proof of that?



I would say no to that. I just checked the Paramount+ Twitter feed and they posted the same picture there at 6:00pm, on March 15th.


----------



## ART! (Mar 17, 2022)

Hex08 said:


> Do we have proof of that?






Ryujin said:


> I would say no to that. I just checked the Paramount+ Twitter feed and they posted the same picture there at 6:00pm, on March 15th.



Yeah, after I posted my claim, I came across higher-res images and from more reliable sources, and yeah, it seems genuine! 

My daughter says that actor is "hot", so this casting may bring in some new viewers...


----------



## darkwillow (Mar 17, 2022)

i don't know any star trek lore to be offended, but the dude looks like he would be a good captain.  I thought he was going to be Pike not Kirk, I didn't read the blurbs carefully.


----------



## Ryujin (Mar 17, 2022)

darkwillow said:


> i don't know any star trek lore to be offended, but the dude looks like he would be a good captain.  I thought he was going to be Pike not Kirk, I didn't read the blurbs carefully.



It _is_ Pike. Seems that Kirk makes an appearance in season 2.


----------



## ART! (Mar 17, 2022)

Ryujin said:


> It _is_ Pike. Seems that Kirk makes an appearance in season 2.



This is perhaps confusing, so:

Anson Mount plays Captain Christopher Pike in SNW season 1, and potentially any seasons the show has after that.

Paul Wesley has been cast as "James T. Kirk" in SNW season 2. Some have observed the rank on his uniform in that one image released is a captain's rank, but I don't have the time or interest to confirm that. We don't know how much screen time he'll get or where he'll fit into whatever stories they tell in season 2.


----------



## MarkB (Mar 17, 2022)

ART! said:


> This is perhaps confusing, so:
> 
> Anson Mount plays Captain Christopher Pike in SNW season 1, and potentially any seasons the show has after that.
> 
> Paul Wesley has been cast as "James T. Kirk" in SNW season 2. Some have observed the rank on his uniform in that one image released is a captain's rank, but I don't have the time or interest to confirm that. We don't know how much screen time he'll get or where he'll fit into whatever stories they tell in season 2.



Yeah, Anson Mount is one of the show's big selling points - it was his performance in Star Trek Discovery that initially sparked calls for a spin-off, with even those who otherwise dislike the show praising his portrayal of the character. In the show's trailer he's the only character who gets significant screen time. It would seem very unlikely that they'd pivot to Kirk becoming captain of the Enterprise in season 2, barring Mount being unavailable for some reason.


----------



## Umbran (Mar 21, 2022)

MarkB said:


> Possible. This character is definitely already a captain, though - the rank bars on the uniform confirm it.




Well, we wouldn't expect the Enterprise to be his _first_ command.  Non-cannon (meaning, in novels and comics), he commanded the USS Aloia (in drydock at the time), USS Oxford (NCC-751) and the USS Lydia Sutherland (registry unspecified) before the Enterprise.


----------



## Doctor Futurity (Mar 21, 2022)

All of this looks good to me, and is the reason I finally caved and got the Paramount+ subscription.

(Okay, this and Halo)


----------



## Mustrum_Ridcully (Mar 27, 2022)

Umbran said:


> Well, we wouldn't expect the Enterprise to be his _first_ command.  Non-cannon (meaning, in novels and comics), he commanded the USS Aloia (in drydock at the time), USS Oxford (NCC-751) and the USS Lydia Sutherland (registry unspecified) before the Enterprise.



I thought he took over the Farragut at some point? Or did he just serve there and I am conflating his service record with Picard who took over the Stargazer at some point?


----------



## Morrus (Mar 30, 2022)

It's Uhura!


----------



## Umbran (Mar 30, 2022)

Mustrum_Ridcully said:


> I thought he took over the Farragut at some point? Or did he just serve there and I am conflating his service record with Picard who took over the Stargazer at some point?




I believe Picard took over on the Stargazer when the captain was killed, and was subsequently promoted to captain and officially given command of the ship, which was his for 20+ years.

Kirk was on the Farragut when it was attacked by a non-corporeal creature, and the captain and 200 crew were killed.  I don't recall if Kirk had to take command at that point, but if he did, it was only to limp home.


----------



## MarkB (Mar 30, 2022)

Umbran said:


> Kirk was on the Farragut when it was attacked by a non-corporeal creature, and the captain and 200 crew were killed.  I don't recall if Kirk had to take command at that point, but if he did, it was only to limp home.



Probably not. Kirk blamed himself for the incident, but was exonerated by the testimony of the ship's XO, so there was at least one more command officer still aboard even after the incident.


----------



## Paul Farquhar (Mar 30, 2022)

MarkB said:


> Probably not. Kirk blamed himself for the incident, but was exonerated by the testimony of the ship's XO, so there was at least one more command officer still aboard even after the incident.



Would have have been security chief at that point? I seem to recall reading somewhere that he transferred from security to command.


----------



## Umbran (Mar 30, 2022)

Paul Farquhar said:


> Would have have been security chief at that point?




Kirk was a phaser gun crew member at the time, probably not even on the bridge.

In TOS, despite how they sometimes depict it, phasers were not actually fired from the bridge - bridge crew would signal to the phaser gun crew, who would actually fire the weapons, rather like 20th century battleships.


----------



## ART! (Mar 30, 2022)

Paul Farquhar said:


> Would have have been security chief at that point? I seem to recall reading somewhere that he transferred from security to command.



Kirk transfered from either helm or navigation - helm, I think - to command.


----------



## Umbran (Mar 30, 2022)

By the way, before I spout about Trek history or continuity, I've been checking my memory against Memory Alpha, which can be an awesome resource for folks who are curious.









						Memory Alpha
					






					memory-alpha.fandom.com


----------



## Mustrum_Ridcully (Apr 1, 2022)

Umbran said:


> By the way, before I spout about Trek history or continuity, I've been checking my memory against Memory Alpha, which can be an awesome resource for folks who are curious.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It certainly is, but sometimes I like to rely on my own brain. (read: Sometimes I am too lazy to do my own research  )

The Strange New World character teasers have been pretty nice, by the way (we'll see if I am allowed to post that many videos in one post)






NEW TRAILER PROMO "LA'AN" Star Trek Strange New Worlds Season 1 | PREMIERE MAY 5 TH (Clip -Teaser)


----------



## ART! (Apr 1, 2022)

This show look snazzy!


----------



## Morrus (Apr 1, 2022)




----------



## Ryujin (Apr 1, 2022)

Wow. M'Benga really got hosed if he got bumped from chief medical officer when McCoy came on board.


----------



## Morrus (Apr 1, 2022)

Ryujin said:


> Wow. M'Benga really got hosed if he got bumped from chief medical officer when McCoy came on board.



Yeah how does that work?


----------



## Ryujin (Apr 1, 2022)

Morrus said:


> Yeah how does that work?



I assume that a captain can choose his ranking officers but yes, it seems rather odd. Can't think that M'Benga would like it much.


----------



## Umbran (Apr 2, 2022)

Ryujin said:


> I assume that a captain can choose his ranking officers but yes, it seems rather odd. Can't think that M'Benga would like it much.




It could be awkward, in that in an apocryphal, but popular (as in, 12th on the NYT Bestsellers List in November 1984) Trek novel, _The Vulcan Academy Murders_, it is established that McCoy recruited M'Benga.

Perhaps the answer would be for McCoy to be on sabbatical, detached service, teaching at the Academy or Starfleet Medical, or somesuch for much of the series - if M'Benga knows the main seat is McCoy's when he comes back, that makes it work a bit better.


----------



## Mustrum_Ridcully (Apr 2, 2022)

And now there is also a Number One, pardon, Una, trailer:

The M'Benga thing surprises me as well, but how often was M'Benga on the original show? Maybe he was only temporarily assigned or visiting during McCoy's tenure?

"I wanted to join Starfleet since I first saw the stars" - is she just speaking figuratively, or does that litearlly mean she knew about Starfleet before she had seen the first star? Might suggest an interesting origin - a subterran colony, or the planet of Krikkit?


----------



## Morrus (Apr 2, 2022)

Mustrum_Ridcully said:


> "I wanted to join Starfleet since I first saw the stars" - is she just speaking figuratively, or does that litearlly mean she knew about Starfleet before she had seen the first star?



It's a turn of phrase.


----------



## MarkB (Apr 2, 2022)

I'm intrigued as to what story they're going to tell regarding genetic enhancements. A lot of the speculation I've seen has been along the lines of how they can possibly downplay it enough not to intrude upon Khan's stories in TOS and the movies, but Nurse Chapel in her trailer telling La'an Noonien-Singh that she's going to tweak her genome suggests that they're not downplaying anything - possibly quite the reverse.


----------



## Ryujin (Apr 2, 2022)

Mustrum_Ridcully said:


> And now there is also a Number One, pardon, Una, trailer:
> 
> The M'Benga thing surprises me as well, but how often was M'Benga on the original show? Maybe he was only temporarily assigned or visiting during McCoy's tenure?
> 
> "I wanted to join Starfleet since I first saw the stars" - is she just speaking figuratively, or does that litearlly mean she knew about Starfleet before she had seen the first star? Might suggest an interesting origin - a subterran colony, or the planet of Krikkit?




M'Benga was only in two episodes of TOS and was touted as an expert in Vulcan medicine. He was in the episode where Kirk was attacked by the mugato and Spock was shot in the back, and he was in the episode about the wandering planet/ark with Lee Meriwether as Losira protecting the outpost. Was pretty sure that I remembered those right but verified them, just in case 

(Editied to fix the horny white ape's name from the character in Zoolander  )



MarkB said:


> I'm intrigued as to what story they're going to tell regarding genetic enhancements. A lot of the speculation I've seen has been along the lines of how they can possibly downplay it enough not to intrude upon Khan's stories in TOS and the movies, but Nurse Chapel in her trailer telling La'an Noonien-Singh that she's going to tweak her genome suggests that they're not downplaying anything - possibly quite the reverse.



"Tweaking the genome" might be more about eliminating inherited genetic diseases, rather than enhancements. In TOS (and DS9) it was stated that enhancements were banned, but genetic medicine wouldn't necessarily be also banned.


----------



## Umbran (Apr 2, 2022)

Ryujin said:


> "Tweaking the genome" might be more about eliminating inherited genetic diseases, rather than enhancements. In TOS (and DS9) it was stated that enhancements were banned, but genetic medicine wouldn't necessarily be also banned.




It is weird to be talking about that on the ship.  I mean, if she had a genetic disease or needed to be "tuned down" due to enhancements, wouldn't that have happened before she gets a notable position on a starship?


----------



## Ryujin (Apr 2, 2022)

Umbran said:


> It is weird to be talking about that on the ship.  I mean, if she had a genetic disease or needed to be "tuned down" due to enhancements, wouldn't that have happened before she gets a notable position on a starship?



I would tend to think so, so this is an odd exchange anyway. Guess we'll have to wait and see.


----------



## Dire Bare (Apr 2, 2022)

Umbran said:


> It is weird to be talking about that on the ship.  I mean, if she had a genetic disease or needed to be "tuned down" due to enhancements, wouldn't that have happened before she gets a notable position on a starship?



This is Star Trek, she probably got a genetic disease on her last away mission!


----------



## Rabulias (Apr 2, 2022)

Dire Bare said:


> This is Star Trek, she probably got a genetic disease on her last away mission!



Fair point, but the patient in the trailer is La'an Noonien-Singh, Khan's descendant, so I think any genetic tweaking is due to her enhanced heritage.


----------



## beancounter (Apr 2, 2022)

I'm looking forward to it. Discovery went downhill for me after season three. While I'm enjoying Picard, I know that it's going to end after three seasons, and is limited to Picard's story.


----------



## Hex08 (Apr 2, 2022)

Ryujin said:


> Wow. M'Benga really got hosed if he got bumped from chief medical officer when McCoy came on board.



And where does Dr. Phil Boyce fit in?


----------



## Ryujin (Apr 2, 2022)

Hex08 said:


> And where does Dr. Phil Boyce fit in?



Apparently he doesn't which is very strange, given that he was chief medical officer in the original pilot. Maybe he found himself a bar and settled down?


----------



## Umbran (Apr 2, 2022)

Dire Bare said:


> This is Star Trek, she probably got a genetic disease on her last away mission!




Or, they are giving her a slight modification for an away mission - which can then bring up the question of why that's okay, but full modification isn't.  That's a good Trek moral question.


----------



## Umbran (Apr 2, 2022)

Hex08 said:


> And where does Dr. Phil Boyce fit in?




Oh, that's simple - Dr. Boyce is already gone.  The mission to Talos IV has already happened, so he may have retired or moved to another assignment.


----------



## Ryujin (Apr 2, 2022)

Umbran said:


> Oh, that's simple - Dr. Boyce is already gone.  The mission to Talos IV has already happened, so he may have retired or moved to another assignment.



It will be interesting to see if the mention Talos IV as being in the past, or simply don't mention it at all.


----------



## MarkB (Apr 2, 2022)

Umbran said:


> Oh, that's simple - Dr. Boyce is already gone.  The mission to Talos IV has already happened, so he may have retired or moved to another assignment.



Or died tragically in some away mission gone horribly wrong.


----------



## Umbran (Apr 2, 2022)

Ryujin said:


> It will be interesting to see if the mention Talos IV as being in the past, or simply don't mention it at all.




They already mentioned it extensively while he was acting as Captain of the Discovery.  And, as I understand it, Strange New Worlds happens after that.  Indeed, I would expect Pike's knowledge of his impending doom shall be a major point in the series.

Which makes a lot of sense - we all know what happens to Pike.  So, for this fiction, let us see him _deal with that_, rather than just ignore it.


----------



## Umbran (Apr 2, 2022)

Oh, wait!  They just put out Pike's trailer...


----------



## Ryujin (Apr 2, 2022)

Umbran said:


> They already mentioned it extensively while he was acting as Captain of the Discovery.  And, as I understand it, Strange New Worlds happens after that.  Indeed, I would expect Pike's knowledge of his impending doom shall be a major point in the series.
> 
> Which makes a lot of sense - we all know what happens to Pike.  So, for this fiction, let us see him _deal with that_, rather than just ignore it.



Assume that I know virtually nothing about "Discovery", because that's the case here.


----------



## Morrus (Apr 2, 2022)

Ryujin said:


> Assume that I know virtually nothing about "Discovery", because that's the case here.



He has visions of his future in an episode of Discovery, so he knows what's going to happen to him in the end.

(I'm assuming you know his fate from TOS?)


----------



## Ryujin (Apr 2, 2022)

Morrus said:


> He has visions of his future in an episode of Discovery, so he knows what's going to happen to him in the end.
> 
> (I'm assuming you know his fate from TOS?)



Yes, that I'm aware of. They also alluded to that in the character introduction video, posted above.


----------



## Morrus (Apr 2, 2022)

Ryujin said:


> Yes, that I'm aware of. They also alluded to that in the character introduction video, posted above.



That’s about it, then. Pretty much all you need to know!


----------



## Ryujin (Apr 2, 2022)

Morrus said:


> That’s about it, then. Pretty much all you need to know!



I'm not so sure of that. They show his catastrophic burns and him in the life support wheelchair. That happens as a result of (if I remember correctly) him saving some children during a fire, in which he receives those burns. That's a separate incident from Talos IV and he goes back there, during the time of TOS, after Spock's "trial."


----------



## Morrus (Apr 2, 2022)

Ryujin said:


> I'm not so sure of that. They show his catastrophic burns and him in the life support wheelchair. That happens as a result of (if I remember correctly) him saving some children during a fire, in which he receives those burns. That's a separate incident from Talos IV and he goes back there, during the time of TOS, after Spock's "trial."



I’m sorry, I’m confused. What was your question? Clearly I answered it wrong!


----------



## Ryujin (Apr 2, 2022)

Morrus said:


> I’m sorry, I’m confused. What was your question? Clearly I answered it wrong!



No worries. I was wondering about the Talos IV incident in the original series pilot, that later became a TOS 2 episode for Spock's trial, but it seems that the Talos incident has already been discussed in Discovery, so should be in the past for the new series. As i don't watch Discovery, I was unaware of that.


----------



## Dire Bare (Apr 3, 2022)

Ryujin said:


> No worries. I was wondering about the Talos IV incident in the original series pilot, that later became a TOS 2 episode for Spock's trial, but it seems that the Talos incident has already been discussed in Discovery, so should be in the past for the new series. As i don't watch Discovery, I was unaware of that.



The events of "The Cage" (the original, unaired TOS pilot) take place before Discovery, and are referenced heavily in Discovery Season 2 when Pike takes command of the USS Discovery. Pike is given visions of his future as seen in "The Menagerie" from TOS, where Spock is on trial for taking Pike to Talos IV.

_EDIT: To be more clear, both ST: Discovery and ST: Strange New Worlds take place between the events of "The Cage" and "The Menagerie"._


----------



## ART! (Apr 3, 2022)

Morrus said:


> He has visions of his future in an episode of Discovery, so he knows what's going to happen to him in the end.
> 
> (I'm assuming you know his fate from TOS?)



One of many moments that sold me on Anson Mount's Pike - his blood-curdling scream when he sees his future hit me right in the feels.


----------



## Hex08 (Apr 3, 2022)

MarkB said:


> Or died tragically in some away mission gone horribly wrong.



That would be a tragedy. The galaxy can't afford to lose doctors who carry around a minibar.


----------



## Thomas Shey (Apr 5, 2022)

Rabulias said:


> Fair point, but the patient in the trailer is La'an Noonien-Singh, Khan's descendant, so I think any genetic tweaking is due to her enhanced heritage.




Well, one of the points made in the DS9 plotlines about enhanced individuals is that it was difficult (particularly with those with mental enhancements) not to get problems to go with it (as I recall _Bashir_ was so standout because it hadn't happened with him). Maybe its going to be the premise that the sociopathy that seemed to go with all the early Augments was partly genetic in nature, and it was necessary to do adjustments (maybe more than one) to keep that in hand.


----------



## Rabulias (Apr 5, 2022)

And now La'an Noonien Singh has a trailer:


----------



## Zaukrie (Apr 8, 2022)

Off topic... But we just started discovery, Andi can't believe how much it did what I've called for, a Klingon based trek. We are in early season two, and I'm liking the show a lot.


----------



## FitzTheRuke (Apr 8, 2022)

Zaukrie said:


> Off topic... But we just started discovery, Andi can't believe how much it did what I've called for, a Klingon based trek. We are in early season two, and I'm liking the show a lot.



I've always liked Disco, but I didn't think that it understood "Star Trek" very well in the first season. Primarily it lacked *hope* which is a big problem - fine for another sci-fi, but fundamentally _not_ Star Trek. Also characters were miserable and didn't get along. I don't mind conflict at all, but Star Trek characters (Federation ones anyhow) should at least seem like they have a basic understanding of psychology. And empathy.

They fixed that in the second season. Then they dialed it to 11. They've almost gone overboard in the 4th season. I won't spoil it for you, but it feels like everyone is hugging each other all the time. Like I said, it's almost too much (and YMMV) but it's kind of exactly what I need right now.

Strange New Worlds looks like it's got that feeling, while maybe fixing one more of Disco's weaknesses: I've watched them for 4 seasons, and I still can't remember half the non-core character's names. It's not that I don't like them, it's that I don't KNOW them.

These character profile trailers show that they're gonna try to do better about that. They're already succeeding at it, IMO.


----------



## Ryujin (Apr 8, 2022)

FitzTheRuke said:


> I've always liked Disco, but I didn't think that it understood "Star Trek" very well in the first season. Primarily it lacked *hope* which is a big problem - fine for another sci-fi, but fundamentally _not_ Star Trek. Also characters were miserable and didn't get along. I don't mind conflict at all, but Star Trek characters (Federation ones anyhow) should at least seem like they have a basic understanding of psychology. And empathy.
> 
> They fixed that in the second season. Then they dialed it to 11. They've almost gone overboard in the 4th season. I won't spoil it for you, but it feels like everyone is hugging each other all the time. Like I said, it's almost too much (and YMMV) but it's kind of exactly what I need right now.
> 
> ...



I've started watching "The Center Seat." One of the things stressed in the first episode is that in ST:TOS they wanted to make a character driven show. Know them, care about them, keep coming back for them.


----------



## Dire Bare (Apr 8, 2022)

Ryujin said:


> I've started watching "The Center Seat." One of the things stressed in the first episode is that in ST:TOS they wanted to make a character driven show. Know them, care about them, keep coming back for them.



ST: Discovery is character-driven, but focuses on a smaller group of main characters than TOS or TNG. The bridge crew are hard to remember, as they don't get the spotlight much. The show has improved on that in later seasons, but still has the basic issue.

That said, the characters that get the most love are amazing characters! Michael Burnham (mutineer to captain), Saru (played by the always amazing Doug Jones), Tilly (perky comic-relief), Stamets (engineer/mycologist) . . . . and the B-cast's shining moments in Season 4 are still too far and few, but are a lot of fun.

Actually . . . . I'm not sure Disco really is much different than TOS in that regard. Sulu, Chekhov, Uhura are beloved characters but . . . did they really get that much screentime as Kirk, Spock, and McCoy?


----------



## Umbran (Apr 8, 2022)

FitzTheRuke said:


> They fixed that in the second season. Then they dialed it to 11. They've almost gone overboard in the 4th season. I won't spoil it for you, but it feels like everyone is hugging each other all the time. Like I said, it's almost too much (and YMMV) but it's kind of exactly what I need right now.




So, weirdly, the problem I'm having with Season 4 (I am only a few episodes in) is that everyone's so gorram miserable.  



Spoiler: I mean...



Tilly is miserable because she has lost her passion.  Adira is miserable because there is so much change in their life that they can't find a stable point, and lives a life of anxiety as a result.  Saru is separated from his ship.  Book just had his entire planet blown up!  And Michael (who, honestly, is only barely qualified for her new position to begin with) is getting second-guessed by the freaking President of the Federation. 

My wife had to put a pause on us watching, because the guy playing Book is too good, and is making her _feel_ that loss.  Book doesn't need to focus on work, he needs freakin' therapy.


----------



## FitzTheRuke (Apr 8, 2022)

Umbran said:


> So, weirdly, the problem I'm having with Season 4 (I am only a few episodes in) is that everyone's so gorram miserable.




Yeah, but they're _supporting_ each other as best they can!


----------

