# Help me understand my computers, and what to update!



## Nellisir (Dec 5, 2009)

I've got two "primary" computers and one significantly older one.

I'm trying to understand what my best courses of action are for updating and upgrading the computers.

No computer games on any of them.

My primary computer is a 1-year old HP Pavilion dv9700 laptop which I use for school. Common programs are AutoCAD, Photoshop, Sketchup, & illustrator (plus Word & Firefox & etc). I don't have graphic card info to hand right now; it would be whatever was installed at the factory. It works well but occasionally chokes on large files in Illustrator & sketchup.
Intel Core 2Duo CPU T5750 @2.00 GHz
4 GB RAM
64 Bit
Windows Vista
300 GB hard drive (mostly full; need to transfer stuff out)

I'm guessing more memory, and upgrading to Win 7. Beyond that, I don't know. Graphics programs are absolutely essential to what I'm doing, though, so the more I can do in that regard the better.

The desktop is a Black Friday special from 2 (?) years ago.  
Compaq Presario.
AMD Athlon 64 processor
3700+ 
1.79 Ghz
960 MB RAM
WinXP + updates.
hard drive around 250 GB

More memory, clearly. I'm not sure how much it can take. Ideally I'd set this up so I can work on either it or the laptop, but not sure what this can handle. Looks like Win 7 wants a minimum of 1 GB memory, so that would need an upgrade (not that it wouldn't otherwise).

There's also a 6-year old Toshiba laptop that needs to be reformatted, but otherwise has run flawlessly for 6 years. Wondering if it can be made into a netbook or something at some point. Runs Win XP with updates.

Thanks!

Crossposted from Circvs Maximvs


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## XCorvis (Dec 5, 2009)

Your primary is a perfectly fine computer. It comes with a GeForce 8600 series graphics card with 256 MB of RAM. Since it's a laptop, upgrading your RAM may not really be an option. I think that motherboard maxes out at 4 GB. Pretty much the only thing you might be able to upgrade is the hard drive, but I don't really think that would be helpful. An update to Win7 is very much worth it, it may help performance too. Just make sure your apps work with it first.

A minimal upgrade on the desktop would be to install Win7 and up the RAM to 2 GB. If you want to run graphics apps, drop ~$100 on a new graphics card and up the RAM to 4 GB. It should take at least that much, but it might be able to go more. I wouldn't bother with more than 4 GB since the processor is only single core. That's a larger limiting factor for performance.

For your old Toshiba, just wipe it and reinstall Windows XP. Load it with only lightweight, fast apps. Maybe visit some of the "make XP run faster" type websites and strip out extra junk from the OS. Voila! Instant (clunky) netbook.


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## Merkuri (Dec 5, 2009)

XCorvis said:


> A minimal upgrade on the desktop would be to install Win7 and up the RAM to 2 GB. If you want to run graphics apps, drop ~$100 on a new graphics card and up the RAM to 4 GB. It should take at least that much, but it might be able to go more. I wouldn't bother with more than 4 GB since the processor is only single core. That's a larger limiting factor for performance.




Even with Windows 7, the limit for RAM on a 32-bit system is 4 GB.  Any more than that simply won't be used.

However, a 64-bit version of Windows 7 can use 8-16 GB of RAM, depending on whether you get Home Basic or Home Premium.

Memory Limits for Windows Releases (Windows)

And you can upgrade memory in laptops, but it can sometimes be hard to get to.  I upgraded the memory in my Acer TravelMate a few years ago.  One stick was simple to get to (just flip the computer over and unscrew a panel), but for the other I had to remove the entire keyboard.  It was not actually that difficult for me, but I've been playing around in the inside of desktop computers since I was fifteen.

If you've never swapped components inside a desktop computer, or even if you have but you don't feel comfortable playing with the inside of a relatively tiny, delicate laptop, take it to a professional and ask them to do it for you.  If you want to try it yourself, make sure you read the manual carefully and take every precaution.  Frying a laptop motherboard with static electricity is an expensive lesson.

Oh, and remember that laptop memory is different than desktop memory.  Don't buy a "normal" stick of RAM and expect to stick it in a laptop.


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## Nellisir (Dec 5, 2009)

XCorvis said:


> Your primary is a perfectly fine computer. It comes with a GeForce 8600 series graphics card with 256 MB of RAM. Since it's a laptop, upgrading your RAM may not really be an option. I think that motherboard maxes out at 4 GB. Pretty much the only thing you might be able to upgrade is the hard drive, but I don't really think that would be helpful. An update to Win7 is very much worth it, it may help performance too. Just make sure your apps work with it first.



Thanks!  I did some more research last night, and insofar as I can tell, 4GB of RAM is max, so that's not an option.  I had was making Illustrator do things it shouldn't really be doing, so I'm working on improving my workflow & learning programs to use when appropriate so file size doesn't get so unwieldy - which takes care of the Illustrator problem.
I was planning on updating to Win 7 over winter break - no way was I going to screw with my computer just before all my projects were due!



> A minimal upgrade on the desktop would be to install Win7 and up the RAM to 2 GB. If you want to run graphics apps, drop ~$100 on a new graphics card and up the RAM to 4 GB. It should take at least that much, but it might be able to go more. I wouldn't bother with more than 4 GB since the processor is only single core. That's a larger limiting factor for performance.



OK; that's what I was leaning towards.
Now, from what I've just read, 32-bit vs 64-bit is not a hardware spec, or not hardware reliant?  In other words, I could potentially install 64-bit Win 7 on the desktop?  (I probably won't, since that would be a total install & require a full version of Win 7, which costs more $$$ than an upgrade - and I realize going from Win XP to Win 7 is a bigger jump than Vista to Win 7, but that's OK - everything on the desktop can be backed up to my external harddrive, and there's nothing on there that isn't duplicated on one of the laptops.)



> For your old Toshiba, just wipe it and reinstall Windows XP. Load it with only lightweight, fast apps. Maybe visit some of the "make XP run faster" type websites and strip out extra junk from the OS. Voila! Instant (clunky) netbook.



Thanks!  I researched this last night and came to the same conclusion.  Like I said, it's been running like a trooper since I bought it.  I got a new battery and upgraded RAM three or four years ago, otherwise never a problem.  The HP had far more issues, initially.


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## Nellisir (Dec 5, 2009)

Merkuri said:


> Even with Windows 7, the limit for RAM on a 32-bit system is 4 GB.  Any more than that simply won't be used.
> 
> However, a 64-bit version of Windows 7 can use 8-16 GB of RAM, depending on whether you get Home Basic or Home Premium.



Home Premium, without a doubt.  I commonly have several programs running at once when I'm working (Photoshop & Illustrator & Bridge & Firefox & Powerpoint & Media Player two nights ago, for instance, when I was pulling together a presentation)



> If you've never swapped components inside a desktop computer, or even if you have but you don't feel comfortable playing with the inside of a relatively tiny, delicate laptop, take it to a professional and ask them to do it for you.  If you want to try it yourself, make sure you read the manual carefully and take every precaution.  Frying a laptop motherboard with static electricity is an expensive lesson.



I upgraded RAM on an older desktop, so I'm a bit more comfortable there.  When I upgraded the RAM on my older laptop, I took it in.



> Oh, and remember that laptop memory is different than desktop memory.  Don't buy a "normal" stick of RAM and expect to stick it in a laptop.



That much I do remember.  

How do I determine how much RAM my desktop can handle, and the type of memory it needs?


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## Merkuri (Dec 5, 2009)

Nellisir said:


> Now, from what I've just read, 32-bit vs 64-bit is not a hardware spec, or not hardware reliant?  In other words, I could potentially install 64-bit Win 7 on the desktop?




You can only install a 64-bit operating system on a 64-bit processor.  A 32-bit processor can't handle a 64-bit operating system.  However, most of the time you could install a 32-bit operating system on a 32-bit processor, but that really depends on the processor itself.  Most modern 64-bit processors can operate in 32-bit mode if necessary.



Nellisir said:


> ...I realize going from Win XP to Win 7 is a bigger jump than Vista to Win 7...




Windows 7 and Vista are so similar that upgrading from XP to Win 7 will probably be no different than upgrading from XP to Vista.  Windows 7 is basically what Vista was supposed to be.

I work at a software company, and it took us no effort at all to get our products certified as compatible with Windows 7 because they were already compatible with Vista.  The jump from XP to Vista was leagues larger than the jump from Vista to Windows 7.

Of course, having said that, Windows 7 is much much better than Vista.  If you have a choice between the two then definitely go with Win7.  Vista is going to be one of those "best forgotten, you're lucky if you missed it" operating systems, like Windows ME.



Nellisir said:


> How do I determine how much RAM my desktop can handle, and the type of memory it needs?




The motherboard determines how much RAM your hardware can handle, but remember that it's possible your operating system may only be able to use so much of it.  If you search for your computer model number or motherboard model number online you can usually find out what kind of memory it takes.  

There are a lot of websites that sell memory that allow you to input in the make and model of your computer and it'll tell you how much memory it can handle and will show you a list of memory they offer that's compatible.  Last time I bought memory I went to one of these sites, typed in my computer info, wrote down the specs of the memory it thought I needed, then I went to search for the best price for that memory.  I think I actually went to a couple different memory-selling sites just to make sure they agreed on the type of memory I needed.

Edit: Oh, and just a thought about upgrading the video card for a desktop, make sure your motherboard can handle the type of card you buy.  My fiance and I had desktop machines that were ~5 years old and we realized that neither one of us could upgrade our video cards to play the types of games that were coming out now because our motherboards didn't have PCIe slots.  Most modern video cards require a PCIe slot.  And if you want to upgrade your motherboard then you might as well get a whole new PC and cannibalize the old one for parts.


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## drothgery (Dec 5, 2009)

Merkuri said:


> You can only install a 64-bit operating system on a 64-bit processor. A 32-bit processor can't handle a 64-bit operating system. However, most of the time you could install a 32-bit operating system on a 32-bit processor, but that really depends on the processor itself. Most modern 64-bit processors can operate in 32-bit mode if necessary.




... and almost all non-netbook CPUs sold since 2006 are 64-bit capable (including both of the original poster's).


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## Cergorach (Dec 5, 2009)

The slowest part of that laptop is it's hard drive, might want to look into an SSD (and possibly an external drive for storage). Intel X25-M (G2) in 80GB or 160GB look promising.

That PC really needs to be replaced! It's a sorry matter when your laptop outperforms your PC ;-) An I7 920 with 12GB or an I7 860 with 8GB would be a very nice replacement.


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## Thanee (Dec 6, 2009)

Cergorach said:


> An I7 920 with 12GB or an I7 860 with 8GB would be a very nice replacement.




While they are certainly nice, I can hardly see a justification for such an expensive CPU ($300+? and that's _just_ the CPU) for what Nellisir is doing. Unless he is doing some serious 3D rendering, a more economic choice should be pursued and totally sufficient for years to come. 


Upgrading to Win7 from Vista is certainly doable, just be sure, that you have all the specific drivers for your laptop hardware at hand (hp homepage should have those; hp is pretty good with driver support).

Bye
Thanee


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## Nellisir (Dec 6, 2009)

Cergorach said:


> The slowest part of that laptop is it's hard drive, might want to look into an SSD (and possibly an external drive for storage). Intel X25-M (G2) in 80GB or 160GB look promising.
> 
> That PC really needs to be replaced! It's a sorry matter when your laptop outperforms your PC ;-) An I7 920 with 12GB or an I7 860 with 8GB would be a very nice replacement.



Next computer in line is a new laptop for my wife, since she's the one stuck using the Toshiba right now.  (she could use the Presario, but apparently being able to sit on the sofa & watch tv is an important part of Facebook & bill paying.  I dunno.  All I know is the bills are paid and I get to hear about the lives of complete strangers that apparently went to high school with her in Bangkok.)

I feel like the desktop is really old, but frankly, it's not. I think a big part of it is that it has a pretty crummy & small monitor, and studying landscape architecture, which is pretty graphics intensive, I'm surrounded by pretty high end machinery at school.  I'd like to get a new monitor, but the lady with the money points out that I'm not really using it right now...I think there's a catch-22 involved in that, but since I can't promise I'll use it more with a new monitor, I'm not sure.

What would be nice would be working out a way to use the Toshiba as an extension of the desktop, so she could sit on the sofa & still use the bigger machine.


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## Thanee (Dec 6, 2009)

A good monitor has a lot of appeal for sure. A 22" TFT doesn't even cost much.

Bye
Thanee


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## ssampier (Dec 7, 2009)

Very good advice so far.

There is a common saying that upgrading a PC isn't worth it. You can buy new and get faster, better components.

I don't necessarily believe that. At some point, the upgrades can easily equal a new PC, however.

It's pretty clear that you need more hard drive space for your notebook. I'd recommend a USB2 external hard drive. You can pick up a 1 TB external hard drive for $100 or so

For your desktop, I'd probably wait and get a new PC at some point.

You can always get a large monitor now and use it with your new PC. Prices and sizes vary, but a well regarded 20 inch LCD Samsung is around $200.

Newegg LCD monitors


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## Mustrum_Ridcully (Dec 7, 2009)

Nellisir said:


> I've got two "primary" computers and one significantly older one.
> 
> I'm trying to understand what my best courses of action are for updating and upgrading the computers.
> 
> ...



Adding a second hard drive should be not too difficult. If most of the space on your drive is used for data storage, you can transfer most of that to the other drive. If it's applications, make sure you install them on the new drive. For security reasons though it would be better to ensure they still land in the _Program Files_ folder. If you want to upgrade to Windows 7 anyway, you could simply install it on the new drive instead of the old one.

I wouldn't ugprade much on your computer. More RAM is not necessary. I suspect a new graphics card might be one of your best options, I hope I am under no illusion when I think that graphics-intensive programs like AutoCad know how to use the graphics card. 

I would recommend Windows 7, definitely. 

Oh, and I am blind. Considering that it's a notebook, a better graphics card and a second hard drive might be hard or impossible. 



> The desktop is a Black Friday special from 2 (?) years ago.
> Compaq Presario.
> AMD Athlon 64 processor
> 3700+
> ...



That could use more work, focusing on RAM (2 GB should be enough unless you want games and 3D modelling maybe) and a second hard disk. 
Of course, consider whether you really need a second desktop if your wife prefers doing bills and facebook on the notebook anyway, and if a new notebook wouldn't be better. 
If I could read...

Er. Okay, 4 GB, Windows 7, and a second hard drive with the notes I made regarding the notebook might be a good choice. Check the Graphics Card, too. 

I personally never manage to keep up-to-date on the details of Graphics Cards (or processors), so I can't recommend anything specific in that area.



> There's also a 6-year old Toshiba laptop that needs to be reformatted, but otherwise has run flawlessly for 6 years. Wondering if it can be made into a netbook or something at some point. Runs Win XP with updates.



Well, what do you mean by "made into a netbook"? A netbook is basically a lightweight (literally and figuratively) notebook with a small display and typically with cheap components, but with networking (Wireless LAN specifically). All this ensures it is small, can be easily transported is and cheap. It won't allow you to do fancy stuff, but it gets you online. 
In a way, your notebook is already a netbook.  (Except it might be too big?)

Upgrading notebooks is not always easy, since they are built really tight. Younger notebooks allow easy access to hard drive and RAM, making it possible to upgrade those parts easily. More RAM and a bigger hard drive won't hurt. I am not sure upgrading to Windows 7 will do much. I haven't checked the benchmarks if it can outdo Windows XP in regards to energy efficiency, though it might. The Aspire 1420P I got on the PDC seems to run pretty well and long.

If your laptop does not have a dual core processor, I would seriously consider just getting a new one. It doesn't have to be a high end machine, it doesn't need to be a netbook either.


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## Nellisir (Dec 7, 2009)

Mustrum_Ridcully said:


> Oh, and I am blind. Considering that it's a notebook, a better graphics card and a second hard drive might be hard or impossible.



I'm going to look into a graphics card, regardless.  Couldn't hurt!



> Okay, 4 GB, Windows 7, and a second hard drive with the notes I made regarding the notebook might be a good choice. Check the Graphics Card, too.



I did some research last night; I've got a Compaq Presario Media Center SR2039x (there's a slight chance I'm wrong about the "20"), which seems fairly decent and upgradable.  I've actually got 1 GB of memory right now, with two slots open, so I can jump up to 2 or 3 GB without pulling anything.

I do have a 500-GB and a 100-GB external drives; the 100-GB I carry around and use for "extra" daily backups (everything I've done to date in the semester, on top of my assorted file backups on my flash drive); the 500-GB primarily receives sporadic full system backups. The biggest thing hogging space on my laptop right now is a nearly-100GB-pile of materials that's been handed around the studio and includes...a lot of stuff it shouldn't.    Most of that will go on the 500 GB when I get a chance.




> Well, what do you mean by "made into a netbook"? A netbook is basically a lightweight (literally and figuratively) notebook with a small display and typically with cheap components, but with networking (Wireless LAN specifically). All this ensures it is small, can be easily transported is and cheap. It won't allow you to do fancy stuff, but it gets you online.
> In a way, your notebook is already a netbook.  (Except it might be too big?)



Basically I was thinking it would be fun to play with Google Chrome, except it probably wouldn't be.  Easier to just stick with Win XP. Except for security.  <sigh>

<quote.Upgrading notebooks is not always easy, since they are built really tight. Younger notebooks allow easy access to hard drive and RAM, making it possible to upgrade those parts easily. More RAM and a bigger hard drive won't hurt. I am not sure upgrading to Windows 7 will do much. I haven't checked the benchmarks if it can outdo Windows XP in regards to energy efficiency, though it might. The Aspire 1420P I got on the PDC seems to run pretty well and long.</quote>
Accessing my current laptop seems to be pretty simple; there are 3 little plates on the underside to get into it.  I think I'm maxed on RAM, but upgrading graphics & HD are things I should look into.



> If your laptop does not have a dual core processor, I would seriously consider just getting a new one. It doesn't have to be a high end machine, it doesn't need to be a netbook either.



I'd love to just get my wife a new notebook, but considering she hasn't even opened the MP3 player I got her 6 months ago (after putting it off for 2 or 3 years...).


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## falcarrion (Dec 7, 2009)

to see what you need to upgrade to Windows 7 you can down load the following

Windows 7 Upgrade Advisor - Download - Microsoft Windows


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## ssampier (Dec 7, 2009)

Google Chrome has a lot of way to go still. For your old notebook, how about Linux?

Even if you don't like it, you're not out much, other than your time. If your type of person who likes to tinker, it could be right up your alley.

It will not run any of your applications, but the open source world has many equivalents.

Plus it can run faster and efficiently than Windows on old hardware.


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## Nellisir (Dec 7, 2009)

ssampier said:


> Google Chrome has a lot of way to go still. For your old notebook, how about Linux?



Yeah, I was overcome by temporary insanity.



> Even if you don't like it, you're not out much, other than your time. If your type of person who likes to tinker, it could be right up your alley.



In concept, I love to tinker.  In reality, not so much.  Like I said, temporary insanity.  



> It will not run any of your applications, but the open source world has many equivalents.



Which I wholeheartedly support in concept.  In practice, maybe not so much.



> Plus it can run faster and efficiently than Windows on old hardware.



And there's the carrot!


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## Mustrum_Ridcully (Dec 7, 2009)

I don't think Windows XP is bad off in regards to security. Service Pack 2 and 3 added fundamental improvements. Of course Windows 7 will be better.

In the end, often the security hole is not the Operating System, but common browser and especially browser plugins (Adobe Flash). But if you manage to keep your system up to date, use a firewall and an antivirus scanner, you're fine.

The safest system is useless if you can't get your everyday drivers and applications for it. (So before upgrading or changing in any direction, Win7, Linux, Google Chrome, check that you can get everything you need.)


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## Merkuri (Dec 8, 2009)

Nellisir said:


> I've actually got 1 GB of memory right now, with two slots open, so I can jump up to 2 or 3 GB without pulling anything.




Just because you have open slots doesn't necessarily mean you can use them.  Depending on how old your PC is it may only be able to use a certain amount of memory.  Make sure you see how much memory your machine can handle.

And I've heard that machines run better with equal memory sticks in all of the slots, but I don't know if that's still true.


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## Nellisir (Dec 8, 2009)

Merkuri said:


> Just because you have open slots doesn't necessarily mean you can use them.  Depending on how old your PC is it may only be able to use a certain amount of memory.  Make sure you see how much memory your machine can handle.
> 
> And I've heard that machines run better with equal memory sticks in all of the slots, but I don't know if that's still true.



From what I could dig up, and advice here, more than 2 GB is pointless without Win 7, but should work with Win 7.  The "what sort of memory do I have" sites all gave the same result, and seemed to think it was OK to have different memory, but pairs were the best arrangement, so 2 512 MB + 2 1 GB would be OK.


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## ssampier (Dec 8, 2009)

No, I understand. You're a busy professional. You may not have time to muck with Linux. But you'll never know until you try.

As to your direct questions, Windows XP 32 bit usually recognizes around 3.5 GB RAM so that ram is not wasted. I assume 32 bit Vista is the same.

With RAM ideally you want your timings to be the same as well as voltage.

CPU-z is a pretty neat free utility that can tell RAM speed, cpu type, speed, etc. It's too much information, but hey, it's free.

CPUID

Windows 7 Home Premium is around $110 for the boxed upgrade. Moving from Windows XP you must do a clean install (it's what I would recommend anyway).


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## Thanee (Dec 8, 2009)

Nellisir said:


> From what I could dig up, and advice here, more than 2 GB is pointless without Win 7, but should work with Win 7.




It has nothing to do with Win 7.

The important part here is whether it is a 32bit or 64bit OS.

A 32bit OS has an address space of size 2^32 (the 2 being the 'bit', which is either 0 or 1, so 2 states; and since you have 32 of them, there are 2^32 possible combinations you can differentiate with 32 bits), which happens to be exactly 4GB. Hence 4GB is the maximum of memory that can be addressed (and as such utilized). However, since you do not only have your system RAM, but also video RAM and some more stuff that has to go in there, the actual amount of system RAM you can use is limited to something like 3~3.5GB (depending on various factors, like how much dedicated video RAM your gfx card has).

A 64bit OS has 2^64 address space, which is _a lot_ more.

Bye
Thanee


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## Nellisir (Dec 8, 2009)

Thanee said:


> It has nothing to do with Win 7.



Right.  That was my error; I was conflating the fact that, if I move that computer up to Win 7, I'm also going to switch to 64 bit, with RAM relating to bits, not OS.  <sigh>

A full-price Win 7 Home Premium + monitor + memory is more than I can justify, though, so, we'll see how it shakes out.  My laptop gets Win 7, the desktop gets more memory, the Toshiba gets wiped out and redone with XP.  And I'll go from there.


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## Blue Sky (Dec 10, 2009)

ssampier said:


> Windows 7 Home Premium is around $110 for the boxed upgrade. Moving from Windows XP you must do a clean install (it's what I would recommend anyway).




If you're a student, or know a student, you can get it for $30, until January 3rd.


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## drothgery (Dec 10, 2009)

Thanee said:


> A 64bit OS has 2^64 address space, which is _a lot_ more.




... though no version of 64-bit Windows actually lets you use more than 2TB, and most cap out at 16-32GB (which is fine; no desktop x64 CPU actually supports a physical address space of more than 48 bits, which is 256 TB, and some only support a 40 bit physical address space, which is 1 TB).


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## Thanee (Dec 11, 2009)

Yep, but there is _a lot_ of room for growth still. 

Bye
Thanee


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## Rackhir (Dec 11, 2009)

You can also get the OEM version of windows home premium for about $105 (on newegg) which is about $80 less than the "full" retail version. There's no difference, it's just supposed to be sold to be people who are building a computer, but there's nothing in there that checks this or prevents you from using it on a system you already have.


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## Thanee (Dec 11, 2009)

Isn't the "normal" version 32 *and* 64 bit, while the OEM / SB versions are only either or?

Bye
Thanee


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## Rackhir (Dec 11, 2009)

Thanee said:


> Isn't the "normal" version 32 *and* 64 bit, while the OEM / SB versions are only either or?
> 
> Bye
> Thanee




Yes the OEM is either or, not both. However at this point in time, unless you have some specific reason for doing so, there is no good reason not to go with the 64 bit version. 

The OEM version vs Full Retail, is also tied to the hardware on the first machine you installed it on. Where as the Full retail can be installed on subsequent machines (though only one at a time). I'm not clear on what constitutes "the hardware", but it looks like you'd be locked to that motherboard AFAIK.


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## Merkuri (Dec 12, 2009)

Rackhir said:


> I'm not clear on what constitutes "the hardware", but it looks like you'd be locked to that motherboard AFAIK.




I seem to recall hearing that Windows identifies several different pieces of hardware, and that a certain number of those need to change before it'll declare, "This is a new PC!"  So you could change your hard drive and your processor and be fine, but if you then also changed your motherboard you'd be done.

Of course, I don't know if that goes for OEM disks or if I'm just thinking of some other copy protection in regular Windows.

Edit: While I'm thinking of it... how do those OEM disks work anyway?  I mean, how does the CD/DVD know whether it's already been installed on another machine?


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## ssampier (Dec 12, 2009)

*Windows versions and activation*

The legality of what version of Windows is murky, at best.

Keep in mind I am no lawyer.

OEM is designed only for system builders. You are on your own for support (you can't call Microsoft). Recently a post on Zdnet indicated that amateur system builders / DIY'ers are not allowed to use OEM Windows. If you buy it, you're in grey-market terrain, at best.

Upgrade versions usually check for previous version of Windows or require the disk. I haven't had good luck with this since most manufacturers don't give you the full Windows disk; just a disk image.

Full versions, you know what this is.

As for activation, I haven't checked what Windows 7 requires, but generally there is a "fingerprint" of system hardware; if this changes that re-triggers activation. 

I haven't tested this, but I understand the phone support folks are really understanding.


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## Janx (Dec 14, 2009)

I just built a new server that had "memory" limits.  It was an early model, which restricted how much I could actually put in (in my case, only 16GB).

The point is, research the memory limit on the hardware, AND the OS.

Be wary of upgrading Windoze, that never ends well, better off installing from scratch.

Consider doing Remote Desktop of the desktop unit, from the laptop.  It's free, and your craptop can take advantage of the desktop's power.  Mileage varies by what you're doing.  For work, I VPN from home and remote desktop into my office PC.  Performance is WAY better than trying to access work files from my laptop to work servers.

Odds are good, 4gb is the limit on the laptop.  You might be lucky and go higher, but I doubt it.  Laptops have 0-2 slots, and they're usually full.

The desktop only having <1GB is a warning sign it is an older unit.  Which means it is limited on max memory (though the good news, its prolly cheaper).

For most people with "old" PCs, I tell them to take $500 down to Worst Buy and purchase whatever falls off the shelf into their cart.  It is almost always better than what they own.

The exception for that advice is people who play high end games or do graphics/video work.  That usually requires better hardware, namely video.  For that, you should plan to spend more and do more research.

I bought my wife's Toshiba 3GHz dual core laptop for $300 from Frye's.  It works great.  She's happy with it for internet/facebook/email.


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## Nellisir (Dec 15, 2009)

Janx said:


> Consider doing Remote Desktop of the desktop unit, from the laptop.  It's free, and your craptop can take advantage of the desktop's power.  Mileage varies by what you're doing.  For work, I VPN from home and remote desktop into my office PC.  Performance is WAY better than trying to access work files from my laptop to work servers.




This sounds like A Good Idea.  Can you explain a little more about it?

Thanks!
N.


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## Thanee (Dec 15, 2009)

ssampier said:


> If you buy it, you're in grey-market terrain, at best.




Well, that certainly depends a bit on where you are. Like around here you can buy the OEM version and install it on several machines (unlimited, really), just not more than one at a time. Because the crap Microsoft pulls with their licensing stuff is not legal here. If you buy the software it's yours.

Bye
Thanee


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## ssampier (Dec 16, 2009)

Sorry about that, Thanee. I was coming from a US perspective.

I built my own computer 2 years. I actually did buy the OEM version thinking it was okay. Then I learned, no, it is not. I tried to do the right thing; I am not about to buy the full version now.


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## Thanee (Dec 16, 2009)

I can fully understand where you are coming from. That's not cool at all.

Bye
Thanee


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