# Thor: Love and Thunder spoilers



## trappedslider (Jul 8, 2022)

If you plan to wait for it to come to D+, there's no need to announce it to everyone in this thread.

There were 7 statues. Eternity, Death, the Living Tribunal, Eon, the Watcher, Infinity, and a Celestial.

 Daryll's back!

According to Chris Pratt, part of the reason Taika Waititi included the Asgardian goats Toothgnasher and Toothgrinder in this movie was to force James Gunn to incorporate them into _Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3_, since the latter film picks up where this one leaves them off at.

The girl with the stuffed bunny kicking ass was cool.


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## Mirtek (Jul 8, 2022)

Saw it yesterday and to me it's not only the worst Thor movie but one of the worst MCU movies. 

The MCU really starts to be torn apart by being pulled into too many directions at once.

Whereas the early phases seemed carefully orchestrated with an eye to the greater whole, so much stuff nowadays just makes no sense if set into context with the old stuff. 

It really went from "XY would have been usefull here, but was probably busy or not available due to such short notice" to "how could they react in such a way back then when this new lore here was just etablished as having been common knowledge all along"

E.g. after the infinity stones were lost Thor could have at least mentioned that there's this city where the most powerful deities hang out. Maybe they won't help out of goodness/responsibility  but they may have something that could be bargained for, stolen or they could be blackmailed or coerced to help.

And there's also this allmighty wish granter at the center of the universe. Maybe at least consider trying to get there to undo the snap?


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## trappedslider (Jul 8, 2022)

Mirtek said:


> Saw it yesterday and to me it's not only the worst Thor movie but one of the worst MCU movies.
> 
> The MCU really starts to be torn apart by being pulled into too many directions at once.
> 
> ...



At this point, we're going to be running into "why didn't they seek help from (new movie person) with Thanos or the snap?" with each movie during phase four more or less


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## Tonguez (Jul 8, 2022)

Mirtek said:


> E.g. after the infinity stones were lost Thor could have at least mentioned that there's this city where the most powerful deities hang out. Maybe they won't help out of goodness/responsibility  but they may have something that could be bargained for, stolen or they could be blackmailed or coerced to help.
> 
> And there's also this allmighty wish granter at the center of the universe. Maybe at least consider trying to get there to undo the snap?



did you miss Zeus’ dialogue where he tells Thor that gods only look after their own affairs? Or Gors whole premise that the gods dont actually care? Or Zeus beleiving that it was impossible to reach Eternity?

I loved that Darryl got to be in a real movie (and now I want a Darryl TV show).
I also thought it was cute that Taika put in a Maori goddess and a reference to Tumatauenga.

the movie didnt spend enough time exploring character moments (ie Gors story, Janes cancer, Thors midlife crisis) and the humour wasnt quite as funny as it was in Ragnarok.

still better than Thor Dork World

I also thought Eternity would be bigger (the green screen should have more eternity and less cloudy background)

lovely ending


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## Mirtek (Jul 8, 2022)

trappedslider said:


> At this point, we're going to be running into "why didn't they seek help from (new movie person) with Thanos or the snap?" with each movie during phase four more or less



Not if the "MCU continuity department" does their homework.

Either stick to introduce entities of a power scale that the answer to what they were doing back then can stay as "something, doesn't really matter anyway" or introduce new stuff in a way that doesn't create such questions. A billion dollar company with a high paid creative team should be able to manage that.

Introducing Daredevil is no issue. Yeah he and Kingpin were doing whatever at that time already. Low level street stuff doesn't matter. Having Thor just learn about the Omnipotent City or the Eternity would have taken care of that. He just didn't know that there's a way to un-snap without the stones

But now just coming out of the blue with Thor having known this for thousands of years is just bringing the question why a quest to the being that can easily unsnap everybody even after the stones were lost has never come up. Yes, getting the stones would have been the preferable first option. But they're dust. So how about we go to find the other way that I know could bring everybody back? Nah, I'd rather not tell anyone and just get fat.



Tonguez said:


> did you miss Zeus’ dialogue where he tells Thor that gods only look after their own affairs? Or Gors whole premise that the gods dont actually care? Or Zeus beleiving that it was impossible to reach Eternity?



But
a) Thor didn't know that before actually talking to Zeus
b) Doesn't really matter. If they don't care, then make them care (bargain, blackmail, coerce, steal)
c) Thor immediately not only believed that reaching Eternity was possible, but also that Gor would be able to do that any moment. So why didn't he bring that up when everybody was downtrodden after Thanos revealed the stones were gone?




Tonguez said:


> the movie didnt spend enough time exploring character moments (ie Gors story, Janes cancer, Thors midlife crisis) and the humour wasnt quite as funny as it was in Ragnarok.



Apparently there's a 4h version and much was cut for the cinema version. E.g. the whole GotG stuff that was left in probably felt so worthless because of that GotG stuff that was cut. 

Very minor spoiler, not even sure whether it's a spoiler at all but 



Spoiler



The trailer basically showed 95% of all dialogue between Thor and the GotG, there's really not much more left in the movie beyond what was already in the trailer.


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## pukunui (Jul 8, 2022)

I haven’t seen the movie yet (I’ve never cared about spoilers), but I’m wondering if perhaps the opening of the multiverse has something to do with this.

Perhaps Thor didn’t know about these things for thousands of years until after Sylvie killed He Who Remains and then suddenly he did. The multiverse went from being suppressed by the TVA to always being there all throughout history.

Maybe while the TVA was still in control, Thor _couldn’t_ think of these options (because they were previously part of the suppressed multiverse).


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## Tonguez (Jul 8, 2022)

pukunui said:


> I haven’t seen the movie yet (I’ve never cared about spoilers), but I’m wondering if perhaps the opening of the multiverse has something to do with this.
> 
> Perhaps Thor didn’t know about these things for thousands of years until after Sylvie killed He Who Remains and then suddenly he did. The multiverse went from being suppressed by the TVA to always being there all throughout history.
> 
> Maybe while the TVA was still in control, Thor _couldn’t_ think of these options (because they were previously part of the suppressed multiverse).



Its a convinient theory certainly and at least it would clean up the continuity gaps with the wave of Kangs hand


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## Imaculata (Jul 8, 2022)

Just watched it and enjoyed it. Not as good as Ragnarok, but then again, that was a high bar. Solid movie, despite obvious issues regarding Thanos.


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## Older Beholder (Jul 10, 2022)

I really enjoyed the movie. I thought it was fun. Silly, goofy fun. In some ways it reminded me a little of Guardians of the Galaxy 2, where both the comedy and emotion were dialled up from the previous film.

Russell Crowe as Zeus was a highlight, as was Christian Bale. 
The fight in the shadow realm where everything was black and white was visually striking.


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## Retreater (Jul 11, 2022)

I also really enjoyed it - not quite as much as Ragnarok, but it was darn good. I am legitimately having difficulty understanding why people dislike it. It was a fun action flick, good fights, humor, character development, a few emotional scenes, solid acting. What am I missing?
It was hard to not see Gorr's point of view, which makes him a compelling villain in my perspective. A little more "mortals should be in charge of their own destinies and not worship the 'gods' of the MCU (like what we saw in Zeus)," and I think I'd have rooted for him.


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## Marc Radle (Jul 11, 2022)

I kind of hate what Thor as a character has become, and I don’t like the direction Tika is taking these movies.

Thor used to be a mighty, dramatic character … now he’s a dopey, often clueless joke machine.

I like the occassional, organtic funny line or moment in a Marvel film when the movie is otherwise mostly serious. I don’t want what was once an awesome character to be in a mostly dopey comedy just filled with mostly lame jokes.

Just my opinion of course, but I didn’t like Ragnarok for the same reasons and this one was even worse. As you might imagine, I also thought the fat bro Thor in the last Avengers movie was an absolute travesty


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## Retreater (Jul 11, 2022)

Marc Radle said:


> Thor used to be a mighty, dramatic character … now he’s a dopey, often clueless joke machine.



Right. But the humor in the earlier movies was when he was out of place and acting a fool in the modern world - smashing coffee cups in a diner. 
And the dour Dark World is often considered one of the worst MCU films. 
I think this is a good way of making him fit in the MCU world.


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## pukunui (Jul 11, 2022)

_Ragnarok _is easily one of my favorites from the MCU. I don’t see Thor as just a big dope in that movie at all.


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## Zardnaar (Jul 11, 2022)

pukunui said:


> _Ragnarok _is easily one of my favorites from the MCU. I don’t see Thor as just a big dope in that movie at all.




 What one was Ragnorak again? Think I only enjoyed about 4 of the MCU films but there's a few I haven't seen.


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## pukunui (Jul 11, 2022)

Zardnaar said:


> What one was Ragnorak again? Think I only enjoyed about 4 of the MCU films but there's a few I haven't seen.



Taika's other MCU film, in which Odin dies, his daughter Hela returns, Thor and Loki end up on the trash planet, Thor fights Hulk, Thor meets Valkyrie, Thor seeks to save Asgard from his sister but in the end brings about Ragnarok, etc.


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## Zardnaar (Jul 11, 2022)

pukunui said:


> _Thor 3 _- where Odin dies and his daughter Hela shows up and Thor and Loki end up on the trash planet, and Thor has his head shaved and he has to fight Hulk and meets Valkyrie and in the end brings about Ragnarok to stop his sis




 Yeah seen it just been a while. Think I liked one Thor movie, Captain America didn't do it for me.


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## pukunui (Jul 11, 2022)

Zardnaar said:


> Yeah seen it just been a while. Think I liked one Thor movie, Captain America didn't do it for me.



I've generally liked all of them. The only ones I haven't seen are _The Incredible Hulk _and _Eternals_. _Ragnarok _is one of my favorites, along with the two _Guardians of the Galaxy _movies.


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## Zardnaar (Jul 11, 2022)

pukunui said:


> I've generally liked all of them. The only ones I haven't seen are _The Incredible Hulk _and _Eternals_. _Ragnarok _is one of my favorites, along with the two _Guardians of the Galaxy _movies.




 Yeah I like the first GotG, Avengers, Black Panther, Iron Man. None were bad. 

 Might be a cultural/generation thing. Didn't grow up with GI Joe/Superhero comics had War, Battle, Commando type comics and Asterix and Obelix. 

 Anything to red, white and blue ra ra ra  makes my teeth itch. Liked Blade and Batman. 

 And once the  gods and cosmic planet creating stuff come in it's a tune out.


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## Tonguez (Jul 11, 2022)

pukunui said:


> _Ragnarok _is easily one of my favorites from the MCU. I don’t see Thor as just a big dope in that movie at all.



Yeah Ragnarok, Avengers 1 and Black Panther are my top 3 MCU movies and I’m not sure how to sort them as they all have merits and all are far better than the rest (Winter Soldier comes in next on my list)

the rest are average to good - all entertaining but …

Thor Dork World is the only MCU property I couldnt watch right through



Zardnaar said:


> What one was Ragnorak again? Think I only enjoyed about 4 of the MCU films but there's a few I haven't seen.



Thor v Gladiator Hulk v Hela
Hela is a great villain, but her story is a C-plot to the Thor-Hulk comedy


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## Zardnaar (Jul 11, 2022)

Tonguez said:


> Yeah Ragnarok, Avengers 1 and Black Panther are my top 3 MCU movies and I’m not sure how to sort them as they all have merits and all are far better than the rest (Winter Soldier comes in next on my list)
> 
> the rest are average to good - all entertaining but …
> 
> ...




No idea only seen Eternals post end game.


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## pukunui (Jul 11, 2022)

Zardnaar said:


> No idea only seen Eternals post end game.



Which, by most accounts, was the worst of Phase 4 so far.


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## Zardnaar (Jul 11, 2022)

pukunui said:


> Which, by most accounts, was the worst of Phase 4 so far.




 Was kinda fun liked it better than a few previous movies. 

 It's a bit over the top though personally I prefer more grounded superheros otherwise it rapidly becomes a race of can you top this which rapidly becomes stupid.


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## pukunui (Jul 11, 2022)

Zardnaar said:


> Was kinda fun liked it better than a few previous movies.
> 
> It's a bit over the top though personally I prefer more grounded superheros otherwise it rapidly becomes a race of can you top this which rapidly becomes stupid.



If you haven't watched _Moon Knight _yet, that's worth a look then.


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## Zardnaar (Jul 11, 2022)

pukunui said:


> If you haven't watched _Moon Knight _yet, that's worth a look then.




 Nope watched the first few kinda got sicjk of them. Loki was kinda fun. 

 Just not that much into superheros if they crossover with another genre eg Blade also passes as an action film it's easier. 

 Batman (Nolan trilogy and 89) were also good.


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## Imaculata (Jul 11, 2022)

I've pretty much enjoyed every Marvel movie so far, but I skipped Eternals, and have forgotten Thor the Dark World completely.


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## Paul Farquhar (Jul 11, 2022)

pukunui said:


> If you haven't watched _Moon Knight _yet, that's worth a look then.



That the one that ends with a pair of kaiju-sized Egyptian gods punching each other out over the Great Pyramid?


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## Tonguez (Jul 11, 2022)

Paul Farquhar said:


> That the one that ends with a pair of kaiju-sized Egyptian gods punching each other out over the Great Pyramid?



Yeah thats the one, Im still not sure how to feel about finding a Hippo- woman and a demon Crocodile kinda hawt


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## pukunui (Jul 11, 2022)

Paul Farquhar said:


> That the one that ends with a pair of kaiju-sized Egyptian gods punching each other out over the Great Pyramid?



Yes, but Moon Knight himself is not a particularly over-the-top superhero. As Marc says himself, his only real superpower is Steven.


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## trappedslider (Jul 11, 2022)

Tonguez said:


> Yeah thats the one, Im still not sure how to feel about finding a Hippo- woman and a demon Crocodile kinda hawt





Spoiler



confused boner


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## Stalker0 (Jul 11, 2022)

I was pretty happy with the new Thor movie.

It was cool to see more of New Asgard, and how they have had to adapt into a tourist trap to stay afloat. I am sure that our new King Valkeryie has been approached by many governments to provide "warriors" to their forces, but so far seems to have stayed out of global politics (in that way). It would be interesting to see a New Asgard/Wakanda scenario....as now New Asgard might be a technological challenge to Wakanda in at least certain ways.

I wasn't sure about Jane going into this movie, but they did a good job with her. I really like the touch that it was Thor's wish to protect her that convinced Mjolnir to grant her powers (actually was it Mjolnir....see below). It doesn't take away from Jane's worthiness, but it does neatly answer the question, "out of everyone in the world is Jane REALLY the most worthy to get the powers?) It also ties in to something that happens later in the movie that I'll cover in a moment. But ultimately they handled her cancer respectably, and I was a fan of her death at the end, I think it felt appropriate, and it was cool to see her in Valhalla (though as a nerdy scientist is Valhalla REALLY going to be her ideal heaven? It would be interesting to see in Thor 5 her breakout because Valhalla "sucks" for her).

It was cool to get a Darcy and Selgwig cameo, though a little more Darcy would have been great

I think Thor as a primarily comedic character just works for him. I mean we are talking crazy over the top space vikings, the premise is BONKERS, so taking it seriously is probably the worst thing to do (which we see more of in the first two movies to questionable results).

I did like the villain, would have loved to see some more. I actually wanted to see a softer side with the children, I would have loved to see him actually careing for his hostages, a call back to a love for his daughter. now considering the corruption from the blade his actions were not "out of character" but it would have been a nice touch. But I did like that in the end, once the blade's corruption had been removed by its destruction, that his love for his daughter won out over his desire for revenge.

Now I think one of the biggest revelations in the movie, that was done subtlely....is that Thor has effectively taken control of the Odinforce. Thor isn't just wielding power, he's wielding magic. The scene where he gives the children power is very reminiscent on his father. Further, when we see his wish for Jane reflect in the runes of Mjolnir, we again see a possible use of the Odinforce. In fact....it might be argued that it wasn't Mjolnir that was giving Jane her powers, but Thor, using Mjolnir as a conduit. This would actually fix a possible plot hole, as it was established in Thor 3 that Odin created Mjolnir for Thor not to give him power....but to control his own power. Therefore....why would Mjolnir give Jane powers? It works however, if its actually Thor unconsciously using the Odinforce to give Jane powers and keep her safe.

Now that said, the biggest plot hole in the movie is the whole Omnipotent City. Its a cool scene, but it does bring up a whole lot of questions. Did none of the gods intervene when Thanos was going for the snap?.....its possible they were so out of the loop they didn't know so that's one explanation. But after the snap, Thor never thought to look them up for help? The counter is that the gods generally don't help....but this is the snap we are talking about. They would have lost half of their people to, and so would have been very very incentivized to undo it.

It was also weird that the gods knew about Eternity, but didn't seem to know the bifrost unlocked it? And somehow Gorr knew but noone else did? Also....are the Asguardians the only ones that can use the bifrost, some of those other gods seem pretty strong none of them can use it? Those are more minor points though that I can overlook, they didn't know because they didn't know, and Gorr knew because he was obsessed with finding it and so searched everywhere for the knowledge.

But the fact that the Omnipotent City existed at all is a pretty big plot hole. A far cleaner way would have been one of the guardians to reveal the info instead of Thor, one of the guardians that was conveniently dusted during the snap. That way we can have the info now, and it's very understandable why we didn't have it during the snap. Easy Peesy. Or maybe even better, the city was built after the snap....because watching half of the gods get dusted suddenly made safety and security way higher of a priority. That would help explain why Thor didn't know about it (if we go with a GoTG knows)....or why Thor does know but couldn't have gone there during the snap, as it might not have existed yet. This is always my issue with these kinds of holes.... I can think of a simple way out of them with like 5 minutes thought, and I'm not a writer. They can spend tons of time slipping little easter eggs on movie posters but can't be bothered to take just a bit of time and shore up their continuity.

but that one hole aside, overall I quite enjoyed the movie.


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## Staffan (Jul 11, 2022)

Stalker0 said:


> I wasn't sure about Jane going into this movie, but they did a good job with her. I really like the touch that it was Thor's wish to protect her that convinced Mjolnir to grant her powers (actually was it Mjolnir....see below). It doesn't take away from Jane's worthiness, but it does neatly answer the question, "out of everyone in the world is Jane REALLY the most worthy to get the powers?) It also ties in to something that happens later in the movie that I'll cover in a moment. But ultimately they handled her cancer respectably, and I was a fan of her death at the end, I think it felt appropriate, and it was cool to see her in Valhalla (though as a nerdy scientist is Valhalla REALLY going to be her ideal heaven? It would be interesting to see in Thor 5 her breakout because Valhalla "sucks" for her).




Jane's plot was one of those things I did not particularly like in the movie, perhaps because it doesn't have the same oomph the similar plot from the comics does.

In the comics, Thor becomes "unworthy" for some reason or other, and drops Mjolnir on the moon. He then goes on various adventures as "The Odinson" to try to regain his worthiness. In the meantime, someone else manages to summon and pick up Mjolnir, turning into a female version of Thor, and to begin with there's a bit of mystery regarding who the new Thor is. Eventually we learn that of course it is Jane Foster, who is battling cancer. But one of the horrid things is that when she transforms to Thor, Mjolnir purges her of all poison and sickness... but since the cancer is *part of her*, it can't do anything about that. What it does purge is the chemo, meaning that every time she transforms she backslides.


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## Argyle King (Jul 13, 2022)

I enjoyed the movie a lot more than I expected to. 

Not my favorite Marvel film, but it was a fun ride, and the style seems to be a love letter to 80's sci-fi, Flash Gordon, mythology, and rock music.


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## BrokenTwin (Jul 13, 2022)

I thoroughly enjoyed it. I liked how they didn't bother making it a mystery about who Mighty Thor was, since that cat would have been out of the bag LONG before the movie ever released even if they did try to keep it a secret. Valkyrie finally confirmed onscreen as bi was great, even if it was in "editable for international release" moments. Thor empowering the children to fight the shadow monsters was zany nonsense that I absolutely adored, though it's my personal headcanon that it only worked because Gor didn't want to actually hurt them. Waititi's style isn't for everyone, but it definitely works for me, and him directing it was the only reason I bothered to watch another MCU movie in theatres.

Ever since time travel and the multiverse were established, coherent canon was a lost cause anyway. At any moment a dead character can just appear and "be from a timeline OR 'verse where they survived". Even though they're not the same person, but they keep doing it anyway.


Spoiler: [Resurrections]



White Vision may have Hex Vision's memories, but he's still not OG Vision, time-skipped Gamora isn't Starlord's Gamora, TVA-Loki isn't Thor's Loki despite seeing footage of his life, pre-memorywipe MJ is dead and gone regardless of SpiderMan breaking his promise to meet her again


So I've stopped giving a fig about continuity on a large scale (and the MCU in general, to be honest). We hit comic-level overpowered convoluted nonsense a while ago in the MCU, so at this point I'm just here for the ride and to stan my favorite characters.


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## John R Davis (Jul 13, 2022)

Love & Thunder & Goats & Roses

1. "we're you not entertained" to quote the bard..........Yes, Yes I was. It was ridiculously silly and the goats on the GOTG ship had me nearly peeing myself

2. Now we have super-heroes, why would we believe in Gods who do nothing....


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## Janx (Jul 13, 2022)

We liked it.

I assume the Necrosword, like any intelligent weapon (there were at least 3 on screen), told Gorr what he needed to know.

It was a little ooky having Thor recruit a bunch of children to fight, but he did beef them up, and Gorr didn't seem to want to hurt the children. At least Thor sent them home as soon as Storm Breaker was free. Continuing to train them afterwards might be a bit child-soldiery, but then again, Asgard got wiped (any people nearly wiped out should be expected to have a "never gonna be defenseless again" mentality), and these kids prolly still have the power of Thor.

I liked that Gorr had a complete arc. He had a legitimate beef with the gods. Kinda like Killmonger. I am glad that his conclusion was not based on hitting him more.


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## trappedslider (Jul 13, 2022)

Janx said:


> these kids prolly still have the power of Thor.



I don't think do, he told the hammer how long he wanted it to last which was just long enough for them to fight and get away.


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## Stalker0 (Jul 13, 2022)

Janx said:


> Continuing to train them afterwards might be a bit child-soldiery



Asgard is still a warrior culture, it is absolutely expected that kids would start training early to become warriors. If it seems a little child-soldiery, its because.....it is.


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## Nutation (Jul 13, 2022)

Stalker0 said:


> It was also weird that the gods knew about Eternity, but didn't seem to know the bifrost unlocked it? And somehow Gorr knew but noone else did? Also....are the Asguardians the only ones that can use the bifrost, some of those other gods seem pretty strong none of them can use it? Those are more minor points though that I can overlook, they didn't know because they didn't know, and Gorr knew because he was obsessed with finding it and so searched everywhere for the knowledge.



I deduce that other gods have their own distinctive ways of getting around the universe. Thor uses the lightning bolt at one point, so that would be Zeus' method.


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## BrokenTwin (Jul 13, 2022)

Yeah, Asgardians are definitely a warrior culture, and that includes training their children to fight from a early age.


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## Stalker0 (Jul 13, 2022)

Nutation said:


> I deduce that other gods have their own distinctive ways of getting around the universe. Thor uses the lightning bolt at one point, so that would be Zeus' method.



But it begs an interesting question: of all the methods that have been devised, why would Asgardian magic be the key to Eternity? (that's not a plot hole or anything, just an interesting question....did Odin have something to do with sealing Eternity there in the first place?)


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## Thomas Shey (Jul 14, 2022)

Mixed feelings.  Went into it thinking the degree of farce was going to put me off, and it did, but the last third of the movie kind of made it up to me.


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## Imaculata (Jul 14, 2022)

I think the wacky humor often clashes with the more serious undertones. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. I think Ragnarok and Guardians of the Galaxy did a better job finding that balance. Especially Guardians 2 had an emotional heart to it, that grounded it among all the wacky jokes.


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## doctorbadwolf (Jul 14, 2022)

Stalker0 said:


> Asgard is still a warrior culture, it is absolutely expected that kids would start training early to become warriors. If it seems a little child-soldiery, its because.....it is.



Eh, having all your citizens train to be competent fighters isn’t child soldiery at all. 

Child soldiers are _slaves forced to kill for their captors_. Y’all get that, right? Like those kids aren’t going to be expected to fight as children (outside of emergencies like this), they’re just being trained to fight when they need to.


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## doctorbadwolf (Jul 14, 2022)

BrokenTwin said:


> Yeah, Asgardians are definitely a warrior culture, and that includes training their children to fight from a early age.



Tbh even peaceful cultures should do so. Training to fight is a wonderful way to stay healthy, form bonds with peers, mentors, and later with your own students, and have a confident and well adjusted (all other things being equal) populace.


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## BRayne (Jul 14, 2022)

Stalker0 said:


> Asgard is still a warrior culture, it is absolutely expected that kids would start training early to become warriors. If it seems a little child-soldiery, its because.....it is.



It was also explicitly referred to as "self-defense classes"


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## Thomas Shey (Jul 14, 2022)

Imaculata said:


> I think the wacky humor often clashes with the more serious undertones. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. I think Ragnarok and Guardians of the Galaxy did a better job finding that balance. Especially Guardians 2 had an emotional heart to it, that grounded it among all the wacky jokes.




Yeah, Guardians worked for me a little better, though I sometimes thought it got tedious there, too.  But it had the advantage that the goofier elements of the characters who ran in that direction there were baked in from the first time you see them, effectively; they're just how they roll.  Its more bothersome with Thor.


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## BrokenTwin (Jul 14, 2022)

doctorbadwolf said:


> Tbh even peaceful cultures should do so. Training to fight is a wonderful way to stay healthy, form bonds with peers, mentors, and later with your own students, and have a confident and well adjusted (all other things being equal) populace.



I 100% agree, actually. Did martial arts a lot as a kid and young adult, and it gave me a sense of respect for myself and others that I don't think I would have gotten otherwise.
Granted, there's definitely terrible teachers and dojos out there with some deeply unhealthy mentalities, but the concept itself is sound.


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## DeviousQuail (Jul 14, 2022)

Enjoyed the movie. I wished it was a bit longer for two reasons. 1) Dive more into the gods and how uncaring they are. There was a chance to make a deeper criticism there. All we got was enough to move things along. 2) Give me another minute of that shadow world fight please. That was awesome and I wanted more.

Overall, this movie is a lot like the rest of the Phase 4 movie offerings. It's enjoyable, the action is good, the visuals work, and the story is fine. We just haven't had that big breakout film like Iron Man and Avengers in phase 1, Winter Soldier and Guardians in phase 2, or half the movies of phase 3. There are still 6(?) movies to go in this phase so there is still time to make something great instead of good.


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## doctorbadwolf (Jul 15, 2022)

BrokenTwin said:


> I 100% agree, actually. Did martial arts a lot as a kid and young adult, and it gave me a sense of respect for myself and others that I don't think I would have gotten otherwise.
> Granted, there's definitely terrible teachers and dojos out there with some deeply unhealthy mentalities, but the concept itself is sound.



Absolutely. I started learning a fight sport at 23, and I really wish I’d done so as a kid.


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## pukunui (Jul 15, 2022)

Finally got to see this. I loved it! It rocked. As far as I'm concerned, the criticisms against it are all storms in a teacup.

I love that Taika got to have Thor give a shout-out to the Māori god of war, Tūmatauenga, and put an unidentified Māori goddess in the crowd in Omnipotent City.

I also had no issue with Thor not going to ask those gods for help to stop Thanos. I think the only reason he went to ask for help in this movie is because he thought they would help a fellow god. I still wouldn't be surprised if the opening of the multiverse had something to do with it as well, though.


One thing I'm ever so slightly disappointed about here, though, is the "truth" about gods in the MCU. I felt like Thor and his fellow Asgardian "gods" were originally portrayed as being not really gods but actually super advanced space aliens - although there was always something magical about them nevertheless. But this movie makes it seem like all the beings we think of as gods are both a) real and b) space aliens. They're not really supernatural beings from some other dimension. Well, I suppose some might normally live in other dimensions but they come to Omnipotent City to hang out there ... and Omnipotent City is just like a giant space station hanging in some nebula somewhere in outer space. Kinda weird really.


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## doctorbadwolf (Jul 15, 2022)

pukunui said:


> Finally got to see this. I loved it! It rocked. As far as I'm concerned, the criticisms against it are all storms in a teacup.
> 
> I love that Taika got to have Thor give a shout-out to the Māori god of war, Tūmatauenga, and put an unidentified Māori goddess in the crowd in Omnipotent City.
> 
> ...



Yeah I much prefer the gods to _be gods_.


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## pukunui (Jul 15, 2022)

doctorbadwolf said:


> Yeah I much prefer the gods to _be gods_.



I would prefer them to be either supernatural beings or space aliens but not both.

I liked the idea that the Norse gods were space aliens and that the Bifrost was some kind of wormhole connecting nine locations in real space (as opposed to other dimensions or planes of existence like in mythology). I feel like the MCU has muddied the waters a lot lately. It would seem that normal Asgardians are just humans from another world but their leaders are actual gods, not just space aliens with advanced magitech.

_Moon Knight _showed us that the Egyptian gods at least dwell in a different dimension ... but all these other Earth and alien gods just hang out on what is essentially a space station in outer space somewhere?

OK, there can be different types of gods, but I just find it all a bit difficult to get my head around.

EDIT: This article sums it up pretty well: The MCU’s gods mythology is a complete mess


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## pukunui (Jul 15, 2022)

On a different note, what do people think Jane’s final catchphrase was?


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## Davies (Jul 15, 2022)

pukunui said:


> _Moon Knight _showed us that the Egyptian gods at least dwell in a different dimension ... but all these other Earth and alien gods just hang out on what is essentially a space station in outer space somewhere?



Possibly when the space aliens have been around long enough, they transcend their material forms to become energy beings who reside in different dimensions. Possibly this, rather than dying, is what we see Odin doing in _Ragnarok_, explaining why he's able to offer some advice to Thor later in the film.


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## Janx (Jul 15, 2022)

pukunui said:


> On a different note, what do people think Jane’s final catchphrase was?



"Stop! It's Hammer Time!"


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## Bolares (Jul 15, 2022)

t


John R Davis said:


> 2. Now we have super-heroes, why would we believe in Gods who do nothing....



that's exactly Zeus's point in the post credit scene


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## doctorbadwolf (Jul 15, 2022)

pukunui said:


> I would prefer them to be either supernatural beings or space aliens but not both.
> 
> I liked the idea that the Norse gods were space aliens and that the Bifrost was some kind of wormhole connecting nine locations in real space (as opposed to other dimensions or planes of existence like in mythology). I feel like the MCU has muddied the waters a lot lately. It would seem that normal Asgardians are just humans from another world but their leaders are actual gods, not just space aliens with advanced magitech.
> 
> ...



Well, I strongly prefer messy to neat and tidy when it comes to things like mythology and world building, but yeah treating most of the gods as strictly space aliens sucks, IMO.


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## DeviousQuail (Jul 15, 2022)

A bunch of gods are hanging out in Omnipotent City but we don't know how many actually live there. It seemed like more of a United Nations building mixed with a 5 star resort than an actual home. Many of them were probably there at the time that Thor shows up because they were all hiding from Gorr. Safety in numbers and all that. Also, if you are going to have a place where gods do meet up then you probably want it to be somewhere that isn't someone's personal realm. A space station floating around in the "real" universe affords a neutral location and allows non-gods to also come around without any hiccups.

As for the Asgardians being aliens and their leaders being gods I wonder if that was something that was earned over time. Odin may have just been another Asgardian once upon a time but then he got/created the Odinforce and that turned him into a god. And now that Thor is showing more signs of using that power I wouldn't be surprised if he turns to gold dust when he eventually dies.


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## Stalker0 (Jul 15, 2022)

DeviousQuail said:


> A bunch of gods are hanging out in Omnipotent City but we don't know how many actually live there. It seemed like more of a United Nations building mixed with a 5 star resort than an actual home. Many of them were probably there at the time that Thor shows up because they were all hiding from Gorr. Safety in numbers and all that. Also, if you are going to have a place where gods do meet up then you probably want it to be somewhere that isn't someone's personal realm. A space station floating around in the "real" universe affords a neutral location and allows non-gods to also come around without any hiccups.
> 
> As for the Asgardians being aliens and their leaders being gods I wonder if that was something that was earned over time. Odin may have just been another Asgardian once upon a time but then he got/created the Odinforce and that turned him into a god. And now that Thor is showing more signs of using that power I wouldn't be surprised if he turns to gold dust when he eventually dies.



I like the head cannon, but Thor did say "at Omnipotent City we can raise an army". So that suggests to me that the city normally has quite a few gods, and its not just some "special circumstance"


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## Bolares (Jul 15, 2022)

About the gods thing with Thanos.... This whole movie was about showing how little the gods care. They didn't give a  about a dude with a godkilling sword, who had already killed a lot of gods, arguing that Gorr couldn't attack them there. I can see how they would think that Thanos was a "mortal problem" and go on to the next orgy.


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## Wolfram stout (Jul 15, 2022)

pukunui said:


> On a different note, what do people think Jane’s final catchphrase was?




I think it was right in the title and the last lines of the movie:

"LOVE AND THUNDER"


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## DeviousQuail (Jul 15, 2022)

Stalker0 said:


> I like the head cannon, but Thor did say "at Omnipotent City we can raise an army". So that suggests to me that the city normally has quite a few gods, and its not just some "special circumstance"



The other way to look at that line is that Omnipotent City is the best place to get the word out that an army is needed. The army doesn't have to actually be there. It just needs to be the place where you can get the ball rolling the fastest in order to raise an army.


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## Dire Bare (Jul 18, 2022)

Bolares said:


> About the gods thing with Thanos.... This whole movie was about showing how little the gods care. They didn't give a  about a dude with a godkilling sword, who had already killed a lot of gods, arguing that Gorr couldn't attack them there. I can see how they would think that Thanos was a "mortal problem" and go on to the next orgy.



Actually, when Zeus got up and personal with Thor he admitted his fear and concern of Gor, and also didn't want Thor to panic the other gods by stoking fears of the God-Butcher. It's not that the gods don't care about the God-Butcher, it's that they are hiding in a place they think . . . they hope . . . they will be safe.

Now, most of those gods didn't seem to care about others and how Gor's actions affected them. They seem not to care about mortals, or even other gods. Or at least nobody hanging out in that giant arena was willing to back Team Thor against Zeus . . .


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## Stalker0 (Jul 18, 2022)

Something brought up on Pitch Meeting. Gorr's whole reason for stealing the kids was to get the gods to come to him.... while believing gods care for no one but themselves......hmmm.


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## pukunui (Jul 18, 2022)

Stalker0 said:


> Something brought up on Pitch Meeting. Gorr's whole reason for stealing the kids was to get the gods to come to him.... while believing gods care for no one but themselves......hmmm.



In this case, he wasn't stealing mere mortal children. He was stealing Asgardian godlings (e.g. Astrid/Axl looks set to take his father's place as the god who watches over the other Asgardians).


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## trappedslider (Jul 30, 2022)

Miek’s Notes in Thor Love and Thunder is a Storyboard of the Entire Movie


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## Thomas Shey (Jul 31, 2022)

They should make a poster out of that.


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## Argyle King (Aug 16, 2022)

How much of the movie is supposed to be "this is what happened" versus "this is how Korg says it happened"?


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## DrunkonDuty (Aug 17, 2022)

Argyle King said:


> How much of the movie is supposed to be "this is what happened" versus "this is how Korg says it happened"?




Hmm. I don't get an "unreliable narrator" vibe out of the way Korg told the story. He paints thing in a particular light thanks to his innately friendly nature. But not actually unreliable.


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## DrunkonDuty (Aug 17, 2022)

On my phone ATM so won't say too much. I enjoyed it. Loved the goats. I laughed everytime they screamed. 

Not as good as Ragnarok but still good. I do feel swapping Led Zeppelin for the vastly inferior Gunners was mistake. Would have liked more of Jane's story.


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## Blue (Aug 17, 2022)

Was a bit delayed in seeing it to a few weeks back, and just saw this thread after some inactivity.  Sorry I'm late to the party.

First, some level setting.  I was rather meh on Ragnarok - the humor didn't catch me.  This is after seriously loving both of the GotG movies.  I know lots of people enjoyed it, but the first Thor was the strongest for me, and none of the Thor movies have been top-in-MCU list for me.

I enjoyed L&T quite a bit more than Ragnarok.  The humor in it worked for me more, and the quantity was toned down so it didn't feel like it was being forced to come at us that fast.  And Jane took some of the goofiness in ways that worked.

There were some strong action sequences, striking black and white, two separate tears-in-my-eyes scenes.  I loved the kids, laughed at the goats, and liked (but not loved) the chemistry between the characters.  Cheered at King Valkyrie and The Mighty Thor.  Quite liked our antagonist, not even sure I can call him a villain if it wasn't for kidnapping the kids.  I enjoyed the Korg biased-narrator bookends, which since I'm not a Korg fan is saying a lot.  Actually more leaning anti-Korg.  It had quotable lines.  "It's The Mighty Thor.  And if that's too hard, try Doctor Jane Foster!" was said many times.  And to repeat myself, I really loved the kids, especially their power-up scene, but really anything with Axl.

For me, this was a 7/10, and the just behind the orignal Thor in my rankings of Thor movies.  Solid, rewatchable, but not one of the outstanding stars of the MCU.


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## practicalm (Aug 20, 2022)

DrunkonDuty said:


> Hmm. I don't get an "unreliable narrator" vibe out of the way Korg told the story. He paints thing in a particular light thanks to his innately friendly nature. But not actually unreliable.



We need a Thor / Antman movie so we have Luis and Korg telling the story.


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## DrunkonDuty (Aug 20, 2022)

practicalm said:


> We need a Thor / Antman movie so we have Luis and Korg telling the story.




Brilliant! I would watch the hell out of that movie.


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## trappedslider (Aug 20, 2022)

practicalm said:


> We need a Thor / Antman movie so we have Luis and Korg telling the story.



Just a special feature with both of recounting everything in the MCU up to the movie.


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## Enevhar Aldarion (Aug 22, 2022)

Just announced today that this will debut in the US on Disney+ on Disney+ Day, Sept 8.


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## Blue (Aug 24, 2022)

practicalm said:


> We need a Thor / Antman movie so we have Luis and Korg telling the story.



Give this man an Oscar!

[*Muffled Moon Knight sounds from trunk.*]


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## Aeson (Sep 9, 2022)

Still not a fan of Thor or Thor movies. Put Chris Hemsworth in an ensemble cast with no lines, now that's a Thor movie. I found very little of it funny. I don't find awkwardness funny. Thor's obtuseness in the beginning was just uncomfortable. 

I liked the army of kids at the end. The stuffed bunny would be an epic magic item.


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## Enevhar Aldarion (Sep 9, 2022)

Now that I have finally been able to see it, I thought is was great. Lots of funny moments and lots of emotional moments. Bale does an amazing job at being a relatable villain.


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## GreyLord (Sep 9, 2022)

Enevhar Aldarion said:


> Just announced today that this will debut in the US on Disney+ on Disney+ Day, Sept 8.




What exactly is or was Disney+ Day?

I had heard that Sept 8 was Star Trek day as well...

What is up with people choosing Sept 8th as a channel day of some sort?


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## Bagpuss (Sep 9, 2022)

trappedslider said:


> At this point, we're going to be running into "why didn't they seek help from (new movie person) with Thanos or the snap?" with each movie during phase four more or less




Which is a stupid limitation to put on an expanding ever growing serial. You can't create any new content without having to explain why it wasn't involved in X significant event?

This is a comic book universe, in the comics they didn't need to go and explain what X and Y were doing while this and that was going on. It is a expected foible of an ever expanding (MC) universe. You really can't expect them to fit everything they introduce neatly into existing cannon.

Also in the comics, different comics have different tones, these films reflect the comics, some movies/characters have different tones to other characters. They are all still Marvel, you shouldn't expect the Thor movies to have the same tone as Captain America's movies. And like the comics even characters aren't always consistent and can change their tone to suit the genre/setting they find themselves.

Personally I liked this movie, especially the goats.


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## DrunkonDuty (Sep 9, 2022)

Yeah, goat love!

Wait, that didn't come out right...


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## MarkB (Sep 9, 2022)

Enevhar Aldarion said:


> Now that I have finally been able to see it, I thought is was great. Lots of funny moments and lots of emotional moments. Bale does an amazing job at being a relatable villain.



I thought it was okay, but nowhere near as good as Thor Ragnarok. The backing songs for the action pieces didn't resonate as much, and the Guardians of the Galaxy cameos at the start just somehow fell flat - I didn't get any sense of their characterisation, and it felt like they couldn't wait to get out of the movie.


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## Bagpuss (Sep 9, 2022)

MarkB said:


> Guardians of the Galaxy cameos at the start just somehow fell flat - I didn't get any sense of their characterisation, and it felt like they couldn't wait to get out of the movie.




I suspect because a different writing and directing team are responsible for those character usually they didn't really get the full attention. Apart from Star Lord they pretty much just stood around.


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## Rabulias (Sep 9, 2022)

GreyLord said:


> What exactly is or was Disney+ Day?
> 
> I had heard that Sept 8 was Star Trek day as well...
> 
> What is up with people choosing Sept 8th as a channel day of some sort?



_Star Trek _premiered on Sept 8, 1966, so it celebrates the "birthday" of Star Trek. Disney+ launched on Nov 12, 2019, so I am not sure why they chose Sept 8.

Edited to add: According to their Wikipedia page, Disney+ began taking pre-orders for the service in Sept 2019, so perhaps it celebrates that?


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## RuinousPowers (Sep 9, 2022)

I give it 2 stars. Jane and Gor's stories were much more interesting, but neither got the time it deserved (and Gor's conversion seemed way too fast, like the idea of wishing his daughter back had never occurred to him). Are the Asgardians back to being gods now? They hear prayers and stuff like Zeus? I thought they were just a technologically advanced society. I loved how the pre-Endgame movies felt like they were building to something, but everything now feels disconnected.


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## Ryujin (Sep 9, 2022)

RuinousPowers said:


> I give it 2 stars. Jane and Gor's stories were much more interesting, but neither got the time it deserved (and Gor's conversion seemed way too fast, like the idea of wishing his daughter back had never occurred to him). Are the Asgardians back to being gods now? They hear prayers and stuff like Zeus? I thought they were just a technologically advanced society. I loved how the pre-Endgame movies felt like they were building to something, but everything now feels disconnected.



That's exactly how I read it: That Gor was so wrapped up in the idea of revenge on those who he sees as having wronged him, that the thought of resurrecting his daughter hit like a bucket of cold water.


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## BRayne (Sep 9, 2022)

Ryujin said:


> That's exactly how I read it: That Gor was so wrapped up in the idea of revenge on those who he sees as having wronged him, that the thought of resurrecting his daughter hit like a bucket of cold water.



There was, after all, a very angry sword that he was holding that probably exerted some influence over his thought process for a while there. Something that was no longer present when wishing his daughter back was brought up.


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## MarkB (Sep 9, 2022)

RuinousPowers said:


> I give it 2 stars. Jane and Gor's stories were much more interesting, but neither got the time it deserved (and Gor's conversion seemed way too fast, like the idea of wishing his daughter back had never occurred to him). Are the Asgardians back to being gods now? They hear prayers and stuff like Zeus? I thought they were just a technologically advanced society. I loved how the pre-Endgame movies felt like they were building to something, but everything now feels disconnected.



Yeah, the change-over to "there are actual god's now, and Asgardians are some of them" was quite unsettling.

I also disliked that, after Infinity War and Endgame stomped all over the "your hammer wasn't the source of your power, it just channelled it, you no longer need it" character development, this movie just doubled down on that, having Mjolnir granting full-on Thor powers to Jane.

And please, send him back to Sakaar for another haircut.


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## doctorbadwolf (Sep 9, 2022)

MarkB said:


> Yeah, the change-over to "there are actual god's now, and Asgardians are some of them" was quite unsettling.



Or it was how it should have always been, and they just shrunk back from being too earnest with the material early on. 


MarkB said:


> I also disliked that, after Infinity War and Endgame stomped all over the "your hammer wasn't the source of your power, it just channelled it, you no longer need it" character development, this movie just doubled down on that, having Mjolnir granting full-on Thor powers to Jane.



I mean, the hammer clearly has power attached to Thor. I thought it was made clear by the army of powered up kids thing that Thor himself can _grant power_. Why wouldn’t a conduit of his power be able to do so?


MarkB said:


> And please, send him back to Sakaar for another haircut.



Gods above bo thank you.


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## DrunkonDuty (Sep 10, 2022)

MarkB said:


> I thought it was okay, but nowhere near as good as Thor Ragnarok. The backing songs for the action pieces didn't resonate as much, and the Guardians of the Galaxy cameos at the start just somehow fell flat - I didn't get any sense of their characterisation, and it felt like they couldn't wait to get out of the movie.




I agree, the GotG really added nothing and that whole opening segment could have been shorter by half or more. Freeing up more time for Jane's story. IMHO.

And I'll say it again, swapping out Zeppelin for Gunners, poor choice.


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## Blue (Sep 10, 2022)

MarkB said:


> I also disliked that, after Infinity War and Endgame stomped all over the "your hammer wasn't the source of your power, it just channelled it, you no longer need it" character development, this movie just doubled down on that, having Mjolnir granting full-on Thor powers to Jane.



Captain America used lightning in Avengers: Endgame, so we know that Mjolnir has mojo of it's own.  Which makes sense, we know that Stormbreaker has mojo of it's own.  Mjolnir might even have more, since the All-Father trapped Thor's power in it in the first Thor movie.

This is something that was already made canon in a previous movie, just with the dial turned up a bit.  Potentially explained by Thor's love, connection, and debt to Jane.  Or explained by Jane already having been the vessel for power in Thor: A Dark World and able to accept more of it, especially in her time of need due to the cancer.


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## GreyLord (Sep 11, 2022)

I finally saw the movie.  I don't know why people are complaining about it.  I didn't like it as much as Thor Ragnorak, but it is probably one of my favorite MCU movies that I've seen.  Definitely the best one I've seen for this phase  (personal tastes, obviously others have their own tastes).



We can post spoilers now...right?



Spoiler



I felt the story was stronger in this one than in Ragnorak, or at least the Villain was.  This wasn't a villain that just wanted to kill because they were evil and liked it, this one had character and one that you could actually understand and be sympathetic too.  If anything, their point was proven that a majority of the various pantheons were not worth being around as exhibited by Thor's visit to the immortal city of Omnipotence city, where they could care less about anyone or anything except themselves).

It was also why, Thor could convince him at the end as Thor was constantly trying to protect others, a dynamic NOT seen with any of the others.  I thought they also did Jane in a very good manner and showed a good relationship conflict and resolution between her (Mighty Thor) and Thor.



I actually really liked it.


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## Mallus (Sep 11, 2022)

I watched it last night (admittedly with a few glasses of Chardonnay) and thought it was... delightful? Funny and bittersweet and frequently absurd like the movies Taika Watiti made before getting budgets well in excess of 100,000,000 to shoot with.

I’m coming to really respect any director who can maintain some semblance of a personal voice when making a contemporary blockbuster. Like James Gunn, to cite another example.

Not sure if this is better than Ragnarok, but it’s a whole lot more cohesive. I guess having themes helps? Some of the visual jokes were brilliant (New Asgard with the docked cruise ships) and that set piece fight against spider shadows on the Little Prince’s planet if it were thrown in the Negative Zone might be my favorite fight in a Marvel flick. Thought the kids fighting while imbued with the power of Thor was a great comic book-y moment.

Taika and Gunn are the only people making visually interesting Marvel films.


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## Enevhar Aldarion (Sep 11, 2022)

GreyLord said:


> I don't know why people are complaining about it.




I think it may be because it was such a mixture of serious and silly, to the point it was too serious for the silly-lovers and too silly for the serious-lovers. I think the only thing off for me is that I may be getting tired of the Korg shtick. I almost feel like he is slipping into Jar Jar territory.


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## RangerWickett (Sep 11, 2022)

Mallus said:


> Taika and Gunn are the only people making visually interesting Marvel films.



Loki has some dynamic visuals. Wandavision played with classic TV aesthetics. And at least the first two episodes of Ms Marvel had fun intrusions of graphics to represent texting.


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## Mallus (Sep 11, 2022)

RangerWickett said:


> Loki has some dynamic visuals. Wandavision played with classic TV aesthetics. And at least the first two episodes of Ms Marvel had fun intrusions of graphics to represent texting.



Oh definitely. That’s why I said films. I could have been clearer. The three series you mentioned have fantastic art direction (and each is unique & well thought-out).


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## Umbran (Sep 11, 2022)

I saw it tonight.  It was... okay.  It had a bunch of good bits, but much of the comedy came off to me as forced.  Perhaps they were trying too hard to duplicate the feel of Ragnarok rather than make this one... itself, I guess.

I think Jane's arc would have been far better supported by a Marvel Miniseries than a movie.


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## Kaodi (Sep 11, 2022)

I enjoyed it but it was not very good. I am not sure it was trying to be though. I mean, the self-parody must have been kinda intentional? Anyway it almost made no sense whatsoever but was still kinda funny how Stormbreaker is jealous of what Thor and Mjolnir had, to the point of floating in from offscreen. It _almost_ makes sense if you consider that Stormbreaker is part Groot. Also kind of insane in a not bad way how much Thor has been a family affair, from his older brother being in the movies, to his wife subbing in for Natalie once during a reshoot, and now their daughter being in the film.


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## pukunui (Sep 11, 2022)

Kaodi said:


> Also kind of insane in a not bad way how much Thor has been a family affair, from his older brother being in the movies, to his wife subbing in for Natalie once during a reshoot, and now their daughter being in the film.



Chris Hemsworth's son also played young Thor in the scene where he's growing up as he runs through the woods, and his wife was the "wolf woman" Thor was romancing on the back of a "woman wolf".

Taika's kids had cameos in the movie as well.


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## billd91 (Sep 11, 2022)

Finally saw it on Disney+. My wife and I really liked it. The MCU Thor is really different from the constant straight-man Thor has been in the comics, and, for the most part, that’s a good thing.
Loved the screaming goats. Loved the choice Gorr made at the end and I was thrilled they took the story in that direction. It’s nice to see a villain have a real epiphany like that. Too many never do and never really change (and, unfortunately, have their epiphanies/changes undone by other writers).


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## Paul Farquhar (Sep 11, 2022)

We really liked this, and Christian Bale's performance as Gorr was brilliant.

It really highlights why having "canon continuity" is a bad thing though.


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## Bagpuss (Sep 11, 2022)

Enevhar Aldarion said:


> I think it may be because it was such a mixture of serious and silly.



I watched it the cinema when it came out and started watching it again last night.



Spoiler



They go from the comedy/action of Thor destroying the glass temple, cut straight to Jane getting a scan for cancer stage 4.



Which is kind of an emotional jump in tone.


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## Morrus (Sep 11, 2022)

Saw this yesterday on D+ and I can confirm that this is a film that I have seen.


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## pukunui (Sep 11, 2022)

Having rewatched this over the weekend, I am pondering three things:

What was up with Zeus talking about human sacrifice? At the end of the film, he complains about how no one worships the gods anymore, so who is killing people in their names?


If Stormbreaker has enough sentience to be able to be jealous of Thor’s relationship with Mjolnir and move itself through the air and such, why didn’t it resist Gorr using it to open the way to Eternity? Even just having Gorr struggle to get it into place in front of the door would've sufficed. 


I hope we find out more about Love. She’s clearly not just Gorr’s daughter reborn. She’s got Eternity inside her (or she _is_ Eternity in the form of Gorr's child).


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## Hussar (Sep 12, 2022)

Saw this a couple of days ago on D+.  

I'd plunk this solidly in the middle of Marvel movies.  I liked it better than some - Eternals, Iron Man 2, GoG 2, and didn't like it more than some others.  A solid B+ as far as I'm concerned.  

Yeah, I can see where some of the criticism is coming from - there was just too much going on - too many cameos and characters that really weren't all that necessary.  Sure, the bit with the Guardians is fun and all, good punchline and the goodbye scene is funny, but WOW, talk about dragging it out.  Yeah, we get it.   Thor sad, Quill wants to leave.  

I think I would have preferred a tighter movie with about half as many characters but a lot more time with Thor, Jane and Gorr.

I'm sure Love will be making appearances again before too long.  

And, I do agree that putting Korg and Luis in the same scene would be freaking hilarious.


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## Umbran (Sep 12, 2022)

billd91 said:


> Loved the screaming goats.




Eh.  That gag was good once, but the repeated use was one of the things that I thought was forced comedy.


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## billd91 (Sep 12, 2022)

Umbran said:


> Eh.  That gag was good once, but the repeated use was one of the things that I thought was forced comedy.



Nope. Committing to the joke and follow-through helped make the screaming goats as funny as they were.


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## Enevhar Aldarion (Sep 12, 2022)

Umbran said:


> Eh.  That gag was good once, but the repeated use was one of the things that I thought was forced comedy.




That is how I am starting to feel about Korg. I hate to think he had so much to do and say only because he is Taika's character. I don't know if his action parts should have been reduced or if they should have not had him doing the narrating. What was a good and fun and emotional movie, would have been better with about 5-10 minutes of stuff edited out. And I am saying this as someone who normally prefers Director's Cuts with the added scenes.


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## Paul Farquhar (Sep 12, 2022)

pukunui said:


> What was up with Zeus talking about human sacrifice? At the end of the film, he complains about how no one worships the gods anymore, so who is killing people in their names?



Whiny boy is feeling sorry for himself and having a good moan. When have folk ever needed a real issue to moan about?


pukunui said:


> If Stormbreaker has enough sentience to be able to be jealous of Thor’s relationship with Mjolnir and move itself through the air and such, why didn’t it resist Gorr using it to open the way to Eternity? Even just having Gorr struggle to get it into place in front of the door would've sufficed.



It's firmly held by the power of the evil sword of evil.


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## pukunui (Sep 12, 2022)

Paul Farquhar said:


> Whiny boy is feeling sorry for himself and having a good moan. When have folk ever needed a real issue to moan about?



When they first go to Omnipotent City, and Thor is fangirling over Zeus, and the Zeus mentions some sort of competition to see which god has the most human sacrifices, and then Thor’s like “Maybe he’s not so great after all.”

But then at the end, Zeus is complaining that nobody worships him anymore.

So who’s doing the human sacrifices? I suppose he could be lumping aliens in with humans. But still … just seemed kind of weird.



Paul Farquhar said:


> It's firmly held by the power of the evil sword of evil.



I guess.


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## Paul Farquhar (Sep 12, 2022)

pukunui said:


> When they first go to Omnipotent City, and Thor is fangirling over Zeus, and the Zeus mentions some sort of competition to see which god has the most human sacrifices, and then Thor’s like “Maybe he’s not so great after all.”
> 
> But then at the end, Zeus is complaining that nobody worships him anymore.
> 
> So who’s doing the human sacrifices? I suppose he could be lumping aliens in with humans. But still … just seemed kind of weird.



Why? The gods of many worlds were present. There is no reason to suppose Zeus was referring to Earth.


pukunui said:


> I guess.



I would also suggest that Stormbreaker has dog-level intelligence. There is no reason to suppose it understands the complexities of the situation.


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## pukunui (Sep 12, 2022)

Paul Farquhar said:


> Why? The gods of many worlds were present. There is no reason to suppose Zeus was referring to Earth.



Because humans are from Earth?


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## Paul Farquhar (Sep 12, 2022)

pukunui said:


> Because humans are from Earth?



It's pretty obvious he means "sentient beings" given that most of the audience he is addressing have nothing to do with Earth.


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## Thomas Shey (Sep 12, 2022)

Umbran said:


> Eh.  That gag was good once, but the repeated use was one of the things that I thought was forced comedy.




Its one of those things that really worked for some people.  My wife apparently thought it was funnier every time it happened.  I'm more with you (of course I'm also the person that found the first 2/3 to 3/4 of the movie mostly left me cold, while liking the last part, so...)


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## Ryujin (Sep 12, 2022)

Thomas Shey said:


> Its one of those things that really worked for some people.  My wife apparently thought it was funnier every time it happened.  I'm more with you (of course I'm also the person that found the first 2/3 to 3/4 of the movie mostly left me cold, while liking the last part, so...)



Waititi frequently beats a joke to death, in his works. After more than 300 years on Earth, Laszlo Cravensworth still hasn't learned that he doesn't need to shout "BAT!" in order to turn into a bat.

I'll give him a pass on it, though, for all the stuff he does, that does work.


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## Paul Farquhar (Sep 12, 2022)

Thomas Shey said:


> Its one of those things that really worked for some people.  My wife apparently thought it was funnier every time it happened.  I'm more with you (of course I'm also the person that found the first 2/3 to 3/4 of the movie mostly left me cold, while liking the last part, so...)



That was a joke? I just thought it was a realistic depiction of giant space goats. I mean normal earth goats are scary enough! There is a good reason giant goats are in the Monster Manual.


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## Umbran (Sep 12, 2022)

Ryujin said:


> Waititi frequently beats a joke to death, in his works. After more than 300 years on Earth, Laszlo Cravensworth still hasn't learned that he doesn't need to shout "BAT!" in order to turn into a bat.
> 
> I'll give him a pass on it, though, for all the stuff he does, that does work.




Sometimes I can give it a pass.  Sometime, the joke has an annoyance or problematic factor to it that's less forgivable.


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## Thomas Shey (Sep 12, 2022)

Paul Farquhar said:


> That was a joke? I just thought it was a realistic depiction of giant space goats. I mean normal earth goats are scary enough! There is a good reason giant goats are in the Monster Manual.




In a way it is, but the emphasis of the sound is pretty clearly used for comedic effect.


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## pukunui (Sep 12, 2022)

Paul Farquhar said:


> It's pretty obvious he means "sentient beings" given that most of the audience he is addressing have nothing to do with Earth.



I don’t know. The majority of the gods we are actually shown are from Earth cultures.


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## wicked cool (Sep 12, 2022)

This has to be the me of the worst mcu movies I’ve seen 

Positives
The beginning with guardians
Bale was good in the shadow realm 
Good guns roses 
The hammer and Jane plus her condition
The bad
Special effects at times are really bad. The creatures carrying the kids looked power ranger bad
Zeus-obviously a great actor but most of that scene was bad. The lightning bolt looked like something out of the target store Halloween aisle. At the end was that some villains watching them leave
The kids- awful acting. The best kids in my local theater area are better 
Matt Damon and was that his brother-just didn’t fit. Good actor but not feeling that 

I can’t tell if this was comedy like spaceballs . I literally fast forwarded through Thor and Jane scenes as they were that bad

Big step down from ragnarok. At times it felt like an old 80’s movie like Freddy Krueger. Not scary but just awful

There’s not a single actor/actress I don’t like normally and there was no 1 performance that ruined it . It was just crap. I watched this and the extended cut of Jurassic park . Both bad but if I had to rewatch I would choose Jurassic


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## Enevhar Aldarion (Sep 12, 2022)

pukunui said:


> I don’t know. The majority of the gods we are actually shown are from Earth cultures.




And on how many other worlds are they also gods? We may be humans, but we are also specifically Earthlings, so in a fictional universe there is nothing saying humans are not living on dozens, or hundreds, of other planets. Ancient Alien theorists say so.


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## pukunui (Sep 12, 2022)

Enevhar Aldarion said:


> And on how many other worlds are they also gods? We may be humans, but we are also specifically Earthlings, so in a fictional universe there is nothing saying humans are not living on dozens, or hundreds, of other planets. Ancient Alien theorists say so.



Hence why I said "I suppose he could be lumping aliens in with humans." I still find it a bit weird, that's all.


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## Irlo (Sep 13, 2022)

This one fell flat for me. It's just too goofy. Thor is better when he's funny AND taking himself seriously, and he wasn't taking himself seriously. Korg is not funny, and the narrations were especially not funny. I detected no chemistry between Hemsworth and Portman. 

I loved the goats and the new fractured Mjolnir. I would have liked a more thoughtful reveal of Jane's character arc. Bale was quite good and menacing, but the shadow-monsters were boring (typical MCU fodder for big fight scenes ala Ultron's army and Thanos' army and Hela's army).

At least the movie as a whole wasn't boring (_cough*Eternals*cough_).


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## Paul Farquhar (Sep 13, 2022)

Enevhar Aldarion said:


> And on how many other worlds are they also gods? We may be humans, but we are also specifically Earthlings, so in a fictional universe there is nothing saying humans are not living on dozens, or hundreds, of other planets. Ancient Alien theorists say so.






pukunui said:


> Hence why I said "I suppose he could be lumping aliens in with humans." I still find it a bit weird, that's all.



We have seen the inhabitants of the Marvel Universe. Most of them are indistinguishable from people from Earth, Or, like Gorr, are the same as earth people apart from skin colour/markings.

And there is no indication that these gods are limited to a single world, they may have followers across many worlds (Zeus was clearly known on Asgard for example).


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## Enevhar Aldarion (Sep 13, 2022)

pukunui said:


> Hence why I said "I suppose he could be lumping aliens in with humans." I still find it a bit weird, that's all.




So you are saying that humans are no longer humans if they are not from Earth? Does that mean if we colonize Mars, the first person born on Mars is no longer human because they were not born on Earth?


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## pukunui (Sep 13, 2022)

Never mind!


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## Arilyn (Sep 14, 2022)

I found this movie full of cringe humour. There's a decent enough story but it's layered over with awful dialogue. The villain is pretty good, but we almost quit watching because the rest of it is so bad.


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## Blue (Sep 14, 2022)

Enevhar Aldarion said:


> I think it may be because it was such a mixture of serious and silly, to the point it was too serious for the silly-lovers and too silly for the serious-lovers. I think the only thing off for me is that I may be getting tired of the Korg shtick. I almost feel like he is slipping into Jar Jar territory.



The only disagreement you'll get from me about Korg is that he has already previously slipped.  Endgame Korg would have been better on the cutting room floor, and even some of Ragnarok Korg I could have done with less.

It's funny - the whiplash between serious and silly to me seems like a core value of MCU.  This, the GotG movies, and the Ant-man movies are upfront about it, but starting with neurotic Tony "I'd like a cheeseburger" Stark from the first Ironman and we've had this.


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## Ryujin (Sep 14, 2022)

Blue said:


> The only disagreement you'll get from me about Korg is that he has already previously slipped.  Endgame Korg would have been better on the cutting room floor, and even some of Ragnarok Korg I could have done with less.
> 
> It's funny - the whiplash between serious and silly to me seems like a core value of MCU.  This, the GotG movies, and the Ant-man movies are upfront about it, but starting with neurotic Tony "I'd like a cheeseburger" Stark from the first Ironman and we've had this.



I would say that the MCUI movies are the closest thing that we have to '80s action movies, these days, and I'm sure that they're doing it on purpose to play on people's nostalgia for that sort of thing. And it works.


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## Enevhar Aldarion (Sep 14, 2022)

Arilyn said:


> I found this movie full of cringe humour.




I see you must be British, as you add a "u" to humor, so I will not rag on you too much for your odd sense of humor, as compared to American humor.   

But like others have said, the humor in this is basically the same as in the Ant-man and Guardians movies, and, to a lesser degree, in a lot of the other MCU films.


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## Arilyn (Sep 15, 2022)

Enevhar Aldarion said:


> I see you must be British, as you add a "u" to humor, so I will not rag on you too much for your odd sense of humor, as compared to American humor.
> 
> But like others have said, the humor in this is basically the same as in the Ant-man and Guardians movies, and, to a lesser degree, in a lot of the other MCU films.



It just felt like it was trying to have the same sort of humour and failing. I enjoy the Ant-man movies and Guardians. I laughed through most of Ragnarok. Love and Thunder has a few funny moments, but just doesn't feel the same. Pushed a step too far for me I guess? Humour's tricky.

Canadian, by the way.


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## Thomas Shey (Sep 15, 2022)

Enevhar Aldarion said:


> I see you must be British, as you add a "u" to humor, so I will not rag on you too much for your odd sense of humor, as compared to American humor.
> 
> But like others have said, the humor in this is basically the same as in the Ant-man and Guardians movies, and, to a lesser degree, in a lot of the other MCU films.




Maybe the Guardians, but I think other than Scott's personal dry approach to things and his back-up band, most of the rest of those movies were pretty straight.  They had some humor, but it was generally _far_ less over the top than either of the last two Thor movies.


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## MGibster (Sep 15, 2022)

Before watching this, I though Thor 2 was the worst Marvel movie.  Or maybe Iron Man 2.  Anyway, I prefer Thor 2 to this one.  Bale did a great job of acting, but most of the story just fell flat for me.  Balancing humor with tragedy is kind of a fine line to walk and they failed to do that when dealing with Jane's cancer.  I would have much preferred to see a stronger focus on Thor's relationship with Jane, her choice to continue being a hero despite it accellerating her death, and having to deal with the fallout.  But that probably would have been a less comedic movie which I would have been fine with.  I thought all the actors did a fine job with their roles, but the writing just wasn't there.


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## RangerWickett (Sep 15, 2022)

I wasn't a huge fan on my first viewing, but I rewatched it last week, bearing in mind that it's less an action movie, and more a story about characters trying to avoid dealing with grief and loss through denial, or throwing themselves into work, or humor, or seeking to hurt others. And with that perspective, I really enjoyed it.


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