# Divine Grace-like abilities



## RigaMortus (Mar 25, 2003)

Are there any Divine Grace-like abilities (maybe part of a Prestige Class) or feats available?  Preferably ones that mimic Divine Grace but go off another attribute...

Take a look at Armor Class "enhancing" attributes.  Everyone adds Dex to AC, that's a given.  The Monk can also add Wis to their AC.  Duelist can add Int to their AC.  I think there is another PrC that can add Cha to their AC.

Does anything like this exist for Divine Grace, where you can add  your Int modifier (for example) to your saves?

I'd be willing to look at some 3rd party books if you know of any where Divine Grace is simulated via other attributes (either class-based or feat based).


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## MerakSpielman (Mar 25, 2003)

The paladin gets his CHA bonus to his saves as a form of Divine Grace.


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## RigaMortus (Mar 25, 2003)

Gee, thanks.  Is this in a 3rd party book?


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## Voadam (Mar 25, 2003)

The closest I've seen is Green Ronin's Witch's Handbook which has swapping feats allowing wisdom to be used instead of other attributes in specific applications. For instance using wisdom instead of dex for reflex save bonuses.

Witch hunter in OA grants Kami grace but that is exactly the same as divine grace except that its in a prc that doesn't need to be lawful.


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## Chun-tzu (Mar 25, 2003)

The Mysticism prestige domain in DotF also grants Cha bonus to saves. It explicitly states that if the character already has this ability (i.e., is a Paladin), he gets another +1 to all saves.


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## LokiDR (Mar 25, 2003)

I have never see another application of stat->saving throws.  I think the rational is that there are already a lot of ways to increase AC, so other psedo-exclusive methods would be OK.  Saves are a different matter.

Major resistance, protection from spells, cloak/vest of resistance, and some feats that give luck bonus to saves are about as good as it gets.


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## Voadam (Mar 25, 2003)

The Harper Mage prc from magic of Faerun gives +2 to all saves versus spells or magic as the 5th level class ability.

Multiclassing like crazy is a good way to boost your saves as well as the iron will, great fortitude, lightning reflexes route, plus the improved versions from Joe's Book of Enchantment (the pdf sourcebook). There are also the school specific resistance feats which give +2 versus one school each but those are not that much bang for your buck feat wise.


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## Taren Seeker (Mar 25, 2003)

I've never seen anything like what you want.

Even if it does exist, I would hope that it's only for Str or Int, otherwise you get double stacking from the others that already add to your saves.

Actually, I doubt I'd ever see a Str based power since Str seems to be an extremely overvalued stat in 3e (look at the 1/2 Orc).

As far as game logic goes (_please_ dont roll your eyes like that at me  ) I can see the justification for Cha adding to your saves, but not the other two. How does being S-M-R-T help you resist poison that's been injected into your body?


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## LokiDR (Mar 25, 2003)

There are a series of feats from Savage Species called cumberous [blank] that allow you a large bonus on one save each at the cost of some penalty, usually at the end of the combat.


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## MerakSpielman (Mar 25, 2003)

edited (deleted) 'cause I didn't read things fully.


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## drnuncheon (Mar 25, 2003)

MerakSpielman said:
			
		

> *huh? It's right there in the core rules *




He thought you were being a smartass, Merak, since he was asking for abilities like Divine Grace, and you quoted Divine Grace at him.  So he gave you a smartass answer back.

J


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## MerakSpielman (Mar 25, 2003)

ME? A smartass?


> Preferably ones that mimic Divine Grace



Well, I guess I didn't read the original post that closely.

Hey, I'll delete my last post so I won't look like a _dumb_ass.


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## mo (Mar 25, 2003)

This thread  has the characters and mechanics stuff for sepulchrave's
 most excellent story hour (which deals with divine grace very well to my mind—through the application of templates.). You'll have to wade through a few pages to find it - he gives the stats for a paladin who has grace decend on him.


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## FireLance (Mar 26, 2003)

There is a feat in Dragon #306 that allows the character to use Wisdom in place of Charisma for Divine Grace (and other Charisma-dependent Paladin abilities).  However, the character has to be a Paladin to begin with, and it doesn't stack with Divine Grace.

I also seem to recall a feat in the Kingdoms of Kalamar Player's Guide (Child of the Earth?) that allows a character to add a luck bonus equal to his Constitution bonus to saving throws.  It sounded horribly overpowered to me.


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## Chun-tzu (Mar 26, 2003)

FireLance said:
			
		

> *I also seem to recall a feat in the Kingdoms of Kalamar Player's Guide (Child of the Earth?) that allows a character to add a luck bonus equal to his Constitution bonus to saving throws.  It sounded horribly overpowered to me. *




Good memory. You got the name and the benefits right, and I agree, that's definitely overpowered. Child of the Earth is a regional feat, available only at first level. A couple other Kalamar feats are similarly unbalanced (but a lot of them are pretty good).


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## Darklone (Mar 26, 2003)

My gf plays a paladin with Divine grace and Child of the Earth. CHA and CON are her best stats too. Yes, her saves rock. But her strength sucks 

The regional requirements to that feat are rather bad though for your average player.


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## Geoff Watson (Mar 26, 2003)

A Blackguard (DMG) gets Dark Blessing.
Shaman (OA): Spirit's Favour.
Witch Hunter (OA): Kami's Grace.

Geoff.


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