# Help with Halfling Ranger Build



## brockg777 (Mar 4, 2011)

Hi, I'm new to the forum. Just want to get some suggestions on building/changing my character.  I started with a concept and want to stick with concept while making the character as efficient as possible.  i have been playing the character in LFR but am starting a home campaign, so essentially, I can change him in anyway I want.  I believe we will be starting at level 2 or 3 since some of us have characters that level.  

The concept is a halfling(from Chondalwood) who was raised by wolves as a child, no one knows what happened to his original family and then found by wild elves who brought him up as a hunter/archer.  The reason i have beyond this is that he has a special birthmark( which I hope the Dm will somehow relate to his original family).  So I have a primarily ranged ranger who is pretty feral, and as a result darts in and out of melee, often shooting arrows and point blank range, always gets prime shot, etc.  I was inspired by artwork of dark sun halflings, but adapted the image to LFR. I RP him not speaking common too well, to account for his upbringing, and speaking of himself in 3rd person. He's quite articulate in elven though. He grunts and howls during combat and refers to enemies as squirrels, ie "here little squirrel"...

Here's my character and I will list play strategies and some other ideas i thought about as well.
LVL 1 snapshot
Race: Hafling
Class: Ranger
Fighting Style: Hunter
Bonus Feature: Prime Shot
STR-10
CON-13 +1
DEX-20 +5
INT-10
WIS-14 +2
CHA-8 -1
Background: Auspicious Birth(birthmark), also thought of possibly taking chessenta background as he would excel when using speed, acting quickly, wolf-like abilities...
HP:32
bloodied- 16
surges- 7
surge value-8
AC-18 10+5(dex) +3(armor)
Fort- 12
reflex-16
will-12
Initiative- +7 10+5(dex) +2(quickdraw)
speed-6
Racial Powers- Second Chance, +5 vs fear, +2ac on oa
At wills-
Twin Strike, Fading Strike
Encounter-
Two fanged strike
Daily- 
Sure Shot
Skills- 
Acrobatics- +11-+5(dex)+5(skill)+2(halfling)-1(armor)
Athletics- +5
Nature-+7- +5 +2(wis)
Perception- +7- +5 +2(wis)
stealth-+9- +5 +5(dex)-1(armor)
Feats:
quick draw(ranger bonus feat)
Halfing shortbow hunter- 20/40 range 1d8 brutal 2 damage
+4 oa provoked by ranged attacks(hunter fighting style)
Gear:
Shortbow
90 arrows
Longsword
Climber's kit
Hide armor
standard adventurer's kit

Level 2 Changes-
+5HP
+1 to attacks, defenses, and checks
magic items found - sylvan armor- +1 ac, +1 athletics, +1 Stealth
cloak of resistance- +1 to all defenses, resist 5 as daily for 1 turn
potion of healing(1)
new feat- weapon Focus- Bow- +1Damage
new utility power- unbalancing parry
retrained daily to- skirmishing stance( to go along with mobility, give defenses for getting in close, extra damage for whole encounter instead of 1 strike)

Basic strategy is like this, he naturally uses quick draw to switch to longsword to be able to make oas with longsword after each attack.
First round he will attack quarry with ranged twin strike at point blank.  target gets an oa back at +6 ac(he's at 26 for the roll) after the likely miss he can then instead(using quick draw) use unbalancing parry to slide the opponent and gain combat advantage for next attack to use two fanged strike.  Should this work, or is that abusing quick draw?  If not I suppose i could take invigorating stride or yield ground, but i like the idea of an offensive acting utility.  Then at the final encounter he uses skirmishing stance and darts around the battlefield form opponent to opponent twin striking with an additional d8 on first strike, capable of doing 3w damage each turn, with a base ac on 22 during the encounter.
I also thought that maybe bow expertise would be better to try and land more hits with twin strike, but i'm not sure. I've also noticed most enemies seem to be frequently not adjacent to allies, so maybe I'd get +1 damage anyway?  what's your opinion?

Another strategy I had was to take manticore's fury instead of weapon focus and alternate between ranged and melee for + 2dam each round( if I can keep hitting). It might also befit me, then, to take commanding confrontation as my daily instead of skirmishing stance, though I could certainly keep it this way as well.

I could have also just stuck to sure shot as a daily as well, but overall the play seemed kind of boring.  Although I could get plusses to each roll if I had the chessenta background, and then I reroll all 1s or 2s anyway with shortbow hunter featm plus I can then reroll any 3s or 4s( once each) If i wanted to...

As for the future I think I am leaning toward either dark strider  or sharp shooter as a paragon path, darkstrider since he is rather stealthy for a ranger, but only if he has plenty of dungeon adventures and learns dungeneering to justify it storywise.  Sharpshooter, kind of self-explanatory. 

So, what are your opinions on the character, how would you build/change for 2nd level, level up to  third level(we might start at third due to another playing being near there), as well as plan for afterward? Please keep suggestions within my character concept. Thanks to all in advance and I hope I get some insightful advice.


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## brockg777 (Mar 5, 2011)

No ideas?


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## Nemesis Destiny (Mar 5, 2011)

You could try this link:
Ranger build handbook


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## Mad Hamish (Mar 6, 2011)

Until you get Melee Training (dex) there's not much point worrying about making opportunity attacks. With 10 str you're rarely going to hit.


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## The Human Target (Mar 6, 2011)

The lack of replies is probably due to the sheer amount of text you posted. The more people have to read the less advice you'll get.

My suggestion- have you looked into the melee archery builds? It would fit your theme and be really cool.


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## brockg777 (Mar 7, 2011)

You can make OAs with fading strike, which uses dex for melee.


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## brockg777 (Mar 7, 2011)

Where could I find those, would they be in the ranger build handbook?


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## Robtheman (Mar 7, 2011)

brockg777 said:


> Where could I find those, would they be in the ranger build handbook?




This would require us to go read the book for you, then report back. That's not really something most folks have time to do.

Alternatively you could read the guide that was posted. In addition, that guide will probably be a forum thread of it's own. You will find lots of useful information and quite a few players who have experience with your specific questions.

If this sounds like trolling, it is not intended as such. Rather, you aren't getting the information you are requesting; The above is probably the fastest way to get it.


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## brockg777 (Mar 7, 2011)

Robtheman said:


> This would require us to go read the book for you, then report back. That's not really something most folks have time to do.
> 
> Alternatively you could read the guide that was posted. In addition, that guide will probably be a forum thread of it's own. You will find lots of useful information and quite a few players who have experience with your specific questions.
> 
> If this sounds like trolling, it is not intended as such. Rather, you aren't getting the information you are requesting; The above is probably the fastest way to get it.




Yes, I used the Ranger's handbook to build the character, I did actually go over most of the builds in that build handbook but didn't find a melee archer one as was suggested. Regarding my last post, I figured people that would suggest a guide probably had read it or had experience with it... is there another thread in the forum specifically about builds/char op?  If so,  then I apologize for posting this here.  Otherwise, I'm just asking 4e questions on a forum for 4e discussion.


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## Robtheman (Mar 7, 2011)

I have not played that class, however I would be pretty surprised if there was a really awesome melee archer build. If you want to play it for flavor you'll probably end up making some concessions on the crunch.

I've read that Prime Shot is a pretty underused class feature. You might try searching for things like "The problem with prime shot" and see if someone has blogged about its failings. That might lead to the insights you are looking for.

I'm pretty sure there is a Character Optimization forum on this site where you'd find more like minded people.

As far as receiving few responses is concered:
- your original post had tons of information we didn't need to read to answer your question.
- you posted the supporting data first and put your questions at the end. I'm guessing most folks never got the your request.
- finally, asking us to respond to how to build the entire character at level 2 or 3 is a pretty big undertaking. I'm guessing if you started a new post and asked people to discuss the strengths of Prime Shot for a close quarters fighter you might get a decent discussion going. Then you can take the results to build up your character.


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## Nemesis Destiny (Mar 7, 2011)

If there is a melee archer build (I haven't read that guide I linked), it would likely be built around the use of Hunter class feature from MP2, combined with Defensive Mobility for a total of +6 vs OAs. You will need the Fading Strike power, and likely the ubiquitous Twin Strike.

Then look for anything that bumps Prime Shot. Most of the good stuff appears in Paragon - Called Shot and Prime Quarry are the lynchpins. The former gives 5 extra damage on all attacks for which you get Prime Shot, and the latter bumps your PS attack bonus to +2.


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## Mad Hamish (Mar 8, 2011)

brockg777 said:


> You can make OAs with fading strike, which uses dex for melee.




yeah, I'd forgotten about that. I considered it for my Archer ranger but it's only usable by a hunter for Attacks of opportunity so I ended up not bothering.


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## Mad Hamish (Mar 8, 2011)

The battlefield archer build gets close to a melee archer build
One of the big points with it is that
a) you get an action point when you kill something 1/encounter
b) once you spend an action point you get +5 AC vs opportunity attacks on top of the bonus feat (Defensive Mobility) which gives you +2
So that's +7 AC versus a lot of opportunity attacks 

and you can add things like Predator Hide Armour to make things better as well...

If you want to stay with a Hunter build and sharpshooter you can pick up Defensive Moviblity early and have +6AC versus AoO all the time so it's another option.


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## Herschel (Mar 8, 2011)

I like the character concept, but wonder why you're taking Weapon Focus so soon. There's a lot more useful feats to take early on. Heck, I'd probably put off weapon focus until a retrain at Paragon. With the feral, darting in and out of melee range concept I might be tempted to go with a throwing weapon and melee training. That would be a lot of fun and keep you from "needing" multiple magic weapons and a way to change them all the time.


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## brockg777 (Mar 9, 2011)

Mad Hamish said:


> The battlefield archer build gets close to a melee archer build
> One of the big points with it is that
> a) you get an action point when you kill something 1/encounter
> b) once you spend an action point you get +5 AC vs opportunity attacks on top of the bonus feat (Defensive Mobility) which gives you +2
> ...



Yes battlefield archer is great but gives up a lot in taking archery fighting style early on.  Right now I'm at +6ac for OAs from ranged attacks because of hunter+halfling.  I figured I could put off taking defensive mobility for a bit...
Predator hide would be great, just haven't had the opportunity to get it yet, Sylvan was for the taking.


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## brockg777 (Mar 9, 2011)

Herschel said:


> I like the character concept, but wonder why you're taking Weapon Focus so soon. There's a lot more useful feats to take early on. Heck, I'd probably put off weapon focus until a retrain at Paragon. With the feral, darting in and out of melee range concept I might be tempted to go with a throwing weapon and melee training. That would be a lot of fun and keep you from "needing" multiple magic weapons and a way to change them all the time.



I'm thinking I'm going to stick with the bow for the brutal ranged damage and increased range for shortbow. Depending on the way I go, I could end up retraining fading strike and not using a sword at all at higher levels, so I may not need multiple magic items.
I thought about not taking weapon focus, but read about the importance of increasing static damage mods for twin strike.  What feats might you go with instead?
I've thought about:
Bow Expertise for increased accuracy AND damage when no ones adjacent?
Defensive Mobility?- I could maybe hold off till later or just take sharpshooter later and not provoke OAs form ranged attacks?
Cunning Stalker for CA against lone foes(If you interpret it working at range)?
Increased Reflexes- which also adds CA first round of combat?
Or go with mixing bow and sword attacks and take Manticore's Fury followed by Master At Arms( or in the reverse order)?


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## UngeheuerLich (Mar 9, 2011)

Don´t know if it was mentioned, but lost in the crowd is a terribly effective feat as it more or less negates combat advantage from flanking.


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## jbear (Mar 9, 2011)

People are usually more friendly and helpful here. Sounds a bit like you've been told off for not having formatted your original post correctly. 

You should have called yourself DwarfBarbie and said you were the new girl. You would have received a lot more of a response. If you don't believe me see General Forum.

Anyway...

Welcome to Enworld!

In my humble opinion it's not the easiest making a fun and interesting bow ranger, they are by definition one of the simplest characters to run: Stay out of range, use Twin Strike and don't think about it. I guess one that can hang in melee range is slightly more challenging, but although you have pumped your HPs with Auspicious Birth you only have 7 HSurges. If you're deliberately taking risks to provoke OAs even though your defenses are super high vs OAs, you will get hit more often simply because you will be in the front line.

This can work nicely if you have 1 or 2 defenders in the group and the OAs you provoke trigger their marks, making it even more difficult to hit you and provoking the defender's attacks/damage on whoever is taking a swing at you.

I think how I would play your character tactically would be to skirt around the fringes of melee attacking isolated targets and moving in on marked enemies to provoke OAs when appropriate. But I wouldn't want to be caught in the middle of things too much. The powers you have allow you to get out of the middle of things easily so that shouldn't be too hard. Which makes Prime Shot less attractive. You are going to benefit more from Running Attack by remaining highly mobile skirting around the fringe of melee and moving in when it is advantageous and not to risky to do so.

Here's a quick look at the build, very similar to your own:

level 4
Halfling, Ranger
Fighting Style: Hunter Fighting Style
Ranger: Running Attack
Background: Auspicious Birth (Auspicious Birth Benefit)

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 10, Con 13, Dex 21, Int 10, Wis 15, Cha 8.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 10, Con 11, Dex 18, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 8.


AC: 21 Fort: 15 Reflex: 19 Will: 15
HP: 48 Surges: 7 Surge Value: 12

TRAINED SKILLS
Nature +9, Acrobatics +13, Endurance +7, Stealth +11, Perception +9

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Arcana +2, Bluff +1, Diplomacy +1, Dungeoneering +4, Heal +4, History +2, Insight +4, Intimidate +1, Religion +2, Streetwise +1, Thievery +8, Athletics +1

FEATS
Level 1: Halfling Short Bow Hunter
Level 2: Bow Expertise (This is the one I'd go for at lvl 2, +1 Attack and +1 dmg vs isolated targets which will happen fairly often, especially if you have a wizard or a sorceror in the group, monsters will spread out if the are being bombarded)
Level 4: Weapon Focus (Bow) (Yep, boring I know, but despite other comments on pg 1, for Twin Strike to become truly noteworthy, especially with only a shortbow, brutal or not, you have to build your static damage at every chance; You will want to aquire Bracers of Archery asap)

POWERS
Ranger at-will 1: Twin Strike
Ranger at-will 1: Fading Strike
Ranger encounter 1: Two-Fanged Strike
Ranger daily 1: Skirmishing Stance (This combines with Running Attack very well)
Ranger utility 2: Invigorating Stride (Get the hell out of here Shift power that lets you use Second Wind at the same time, meaning you can move without provoking OAs,use your Second Wind and still attack! Pretty cool!)
Ranger encounter 3: Disruptive Strike (Out of turn interrupt attack to either defend yourself or an ally)

As for Magic items, you can pick up a Point Blank Short Bow (lvl 3 Item) if you are starting at level 2 or 3. It gives you +2 vs OAs and 1/encounter allows you to make a ranged attack that doesn't provoke OAs. Right up your alley I think.

Anyway, good luck! You can't go too far wrong no matter what you do! 4e is good like that!


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## brockg777 (Mar 9, 2011)

jbear said:


> People are usually more friendly and helpful here. Sounds a bit like you've been told off for not having formatted your original post correctly.
> 
> You should have called yourself DwarfBarbie and said you were the new girl. You would have received a lot more of a response. If you don't believe me see General Forum.
> 
> ...



Thanks for taking the time to provide me some insight.  The problem with running attack, as I read it, is that you have to making an attack with a power that has movement attached to it.  So I would only get the bonus on using fading strike or doing a charge.  I would need to take other movement hunter powers like skirmish shot, to really use running attack.  Am I correct about this? Durable would probably be a good feat to up my healing surges, no? Thanks for the advice on the point blank bow, I will try to get that.


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## jbear (Mar 9, 2011)

No you have understood that correctly. I,on the other hand totally missed that it had to be part of a standard action.

So, yeah, scratch that and take Prime Shot. You can always get behind the lines and nail the enemy artillery sitting back behind their melee allies. Anyway, even if you don't gain the benefits of Prime Shot, with Bow Expertise and 20 DEX you are already pretty accurate.

At least figuring out where best to move to gain your Prime Shot bonus will give you something to keep things entertaining for you


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