# So how did it come to pass?



## Fenris (May 12, 2003)

In reading the Eric Noah/Blackshirt5 thread a while back, many references to Nutkinland came out. Squirell Nutkin even weighed in and showed a long relationship with Eric and his moderating style. ENWorld and Nutkinland seem to be inexorably connected (posters, Mods). My question is, is how did this arise? Which came first and why are so many members (with even the same user names) on both? I don't visit Nutkinland but have always wondered why the two sites have such close similarities.


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## EricNoah (May 12, 2003)

Oh gosh, let's see, here's my version and I'm sticking with it!

My site, Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D Third Edition News, opened in 1999.  Sometime after that (maybe in 2000??) Squirrel Nutkin opened Nutkinland, an RPG site dedicated to covering all rodent-related happenings in the RPG world.  

After my site acquired message boards, it became clear that a lot of the posters wanted a place to hang out where my kindly yet tyrannical grandmother wouldn't stop them from saying naughty words and being mean to each other.  So the Nutkinland message boards were born.  Many of the original posters were part of my boards' first days and referred to themselves as "The Pantheon" (a sort of silly/surreal running gag thingy vaguely analagous to today's Hivemind but with more in-character foolishness and less general chit-chat).  

Then Nutkinland's boards were burned to the ground. Read all about it here.   But they rose again in various incarnations, attracted more members (from both within and outside of the EN World community), and there you have it.  

Now, for Nutkin's version!  (come on, nutkin, you know you want to!)


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## Coik (May 12, 2003)

Nutkinland was created when, after the Great Rain fell and the Fires of Vengence had cleansed the plains, the Squirrel of Yggdrasil fought the Creator of Wisconsin in a titanic battle over the distrbution of Columbian nuts.  After three months of fighting, the battle was finally over when the Squirrel struck the Creator a mighty blow and, having hewn off one of the Creator's arms, fled with it.  In a secret place he fashioned his own plane from it, and called it Nutkinland.


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## Coik (May 12, 2003)

The Book of Nutkine
_ _ _ _ _ _ As Transcribed by Coik, Childe of Malkav, from the
Ramblings of a Shadowy Beast

Part 1: The Beginning

In the Beginning, we languished deep the Uncharted wilderness, called by
some the ENboard.

We were lost and without Guidance

We did not Dance, for we had no Music

We did not See, for we had no Images

We did Nothing, for we were Nothing, and our [Lives] without Purpose.

But Lo, one day there came a stranger.

Red furred and diminutive was he.

He said unto us,

"I am Nutkin[e]

"You do not Dance...come, I have Music.

"You do not See...come, I have Images.

"You are Nothing...come, I will give your Lives Purpose."

Nutkin[e ]left then, and we who followed him did

Nutkin[e ]traveled to the three-fold [realm ]of Pod, and there established
his dominion.

And Lo, we Danced to our master's MIDIs

Gaped at his [Modified] Images

And Laughed and found Purpose.

Part 2: The Calling

But great Nutkin[e] was not satisfied

He knew that many others had not heeded his Plea

And Languished in the ENBoard wasteland

And so he gather us, his Followers, and bade us thus:

"Go, swiftly deliver my Missive

"For I have selected those who Languish behind and are Worthy of Ascension

"Go, deliver my message to the Robotic Zombie and her progeny

"Go, deliver my message to the Siblings, the Hunter of the Dead and the
Hunter of Elminster_ 

"Go, deliver my message to the Reefer Three: the [Kraut] bat, the Snow god,
and the It's

"Deliver my message in the Halls of the Dead, to the [Mini]-Lop and the
Dungeon Delver

"Deliver my message to the Master of Lore, and the dominatrix feline

"Deliver my message to all my Chosen."

And we did so, and the Chosen responded

Slowly they gathered in the three-fold realm of Pod

There they established the Chair of Anger

And there was much rejoicing.

There they established the Shack of Love

And there was much rejoicing.

And Nutkin[e] sat back in His chair and did Grin

And proclaimed to his Wife, the Dead-but-not-Dead Girl

"All is Well."

Part 3: The End

But all was not Well in the three-fold land of Pod

Enemies of Nutkin[e] and his followers gained Entrance

Throwing the assembled hosts into Confusion

And the Master of Lore

Long envious of Nutkin[e]'s Realm, for it far outshone his Own

Saw this and Plotted
He exposed how Vulnerable Nutkin[e]land  was to its Enemies

And began the Burning Times

Nutkin[e] fought Valiantly against the Invasion, but to no Avail

And then the ultimate Betrayal came

The very Land itself

The three-fold realm of Pod

Turned on Nutkin[e] and cast him Out

And thus we are here, Childe,

With the End Times staring at us

_If you enjoyed this book, look for these by the same author also:_ The Schreck Fragments, The Nutkin
Record, Nutkin Apocrypha, Chronicle of the Black Nutkinland, or Revelations of the Dark Margo


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## Janos Antero (May 12, 2003)

You see many posters on both boards for two primary reasons and a host of smaller ones.  The two biggest reasons are:

1. When EN first started off it was a small close-knit community as most message boards are, and many of the old time founders grew close and enjoyed one another's company.  But as time went on and thousands of new posters showed up, the less formal relaxed forms, and the spirit of knowing everyone faded.  In essence a generation passed.  Many posters wanted that feeling again.

The Pantheon was an embodiment of this feeling.  At one time it was a very light-hearted and accepted part of the board.  But as time went on and new posters arrived, they disliked it and wanted it handled differently on the boards.  These changes alienated some posters whose craving for another place to goof off increased.

So in time Nutkinland was formed at first for the first generation of posters to be with old friends, and later on as more of a refuge for those who didn't feel at home on EN World any longer.

Those who stayed behind still made frequent visits to NKL though as the friends they cherished were in both locations.  Most of the moderaters were part of this generation, and have strong ties to both forums because of that.

2. The second reason many people move to NKL, or post on both, is because of the differences in moderating style.  NKL has become home to those from EN World who want to act more rough and tumble with one another.  This means, among other things, more heated debate, different topics of debate, fewer rules about taboo topics.

This doesn't mean NKL is a free for all, but rather that it has fewer off limit topics.  The rules NKL does have are enforced just as effectively as they are on EN World, they're just different rules, and a different theory of conduct and interaction exists on Nutkinland.

Many posters on Nutkinland found it easier to discuss topics with heated words, and Nutkinland has a single forum for that sort of behavior.  That forum appeals to many wishing to escape EN World for awhile, so we have a few posters who bounce between boards with basically civil and uncivil moods, and use that one forum on NKL to be bad, and these forums, and the other 20 or so forums at NKL to just discuss games.


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## The It's Man (May 12, 2003)

I was (eh still am sort of) a lurker on ENworld with a weekly or so Pantheon post about getting spanked, selling ice-cream (in some shade of green) while tolling the bell at my ice-cream-vendor-cart, or looking after the child of Cyberzombie and Tim while they were fighting Forgotten Realm godly powers and similair annoying figures .

There was a thread (it involved Dwarfs and Women with Axes IIRC) that got heated and the fear that long posting members of ENworld would disappear to form their own board was expressed. 

I posted something like "That will never happen." and received an invitation to Nutkinland the next day (or the day after). I guess I was proven wrong... for a bit... as the NL-posters would still post at EN for quite a while (and some still do).

As to using the same nicknames on both boards - why not. It's nothing to be ashamed of, and otherwise it would get confusing. 

There are some posters who use another nick though - I guess they have their reasons... (like the name they have on EN could was taken already or maybe they are ashamed ).


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## Margo Schreck (May 12, 2003)

The It's Man said:
			
		

> *There was a thread (it involved Dwarfs and Women with Axes IIRC) that got heated and the fear that long posting members of ENworld would disappear to form their own board was expressed.*



That's true, back then there was no forum at Eric's board for in-character role-playing and between Nutkin, Lisa Nadazdy, Kwalish Kid, DWARF and other users there were several threads like that on every page in General Discussion. It was a little like the Pantheon I guess.

After a while Nutkin thought it was rude to keep posting nonsense on a board that was supposed to be for D&D discussions only, so he retired from Eric's and started the "Nutkinland" board where we could keep playing or just talk about anything we wanted. That led to all kinds of new discussions that Eric's grandmother would never have approved of!

At first Nutkinland was by invitation only, since it was originally just for the people who had posted in those in-character threads, but then more people joined and the next thing we knew we had hundreds of users!


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## Randolpho (May 13, 2003)

I fondly remember the early days of ENWorld; the speculation about 3e, the huge debates over the merits of the d20 system vs. 2e, the fisticuffs over the lack or inclusion of psionics, rogue vs thief, rogue vs rouge. Ahh, those were the days. Not that things appear to have changed much. 

Then, for reasons better not discussed, ENWorld ceased to be fun for me. Nutkinland became my new drug. I still lurk here, but rarely post here anymore. I suppose you could say I'm a true Nutkinland convert.

I *would* start hanging out here again if I ever started roleplaying again, but those days appear to be long over.


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## Squirrel Nutkin (May 13, 2003)

EricNoah said:
			
		

> *(come on, nutkin, you know you want to!) *



Eric, please, not in front of the other users!  

Seriously, I think just about everything I can think to add has already been posted to this thread! One thing that especially ironic is that while Nutkinland did split off from Eric's board so that we could post more in-character stuff, we very rarely do that sort of thing at NKL today. In fact the most popular forum at Nutkinland by far is "Church and State", where the users are free to have serious discussions about religion and politics to their hearts' content. That's a far cry from a half-dozen threads about mechanical robo-squirrels vs. an army of dwarfs and pirates.


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## Hand of Evil (May 13, 2003)

Thought there was an April Fools thing way back when, where the site was cloned to Nutkinland.  Maybe that was Eric's joke.  

so long ago.


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## Scutisorex (May 13, 2003)

I came to EN World about a month before discovering Nutkinland. Nutkinland, with it's debauchery and total lack of moral or dietary fiber appealed more to my baser instincts and stuff. I come to EN World on occasion, but only then, and never any other time, except that one which is in question.

Thanks Eric and Nutkin. It's all your fault.


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## Bill Door (May 13, 2003)

aH.  thE grEaT anD anCienT daYs.

siGH.


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## Snoweel (May 13, 2003)

bILLy d0oR still creeps me out, even now that I know whose alt. he is.

And let me just say that Nutkinland had such an effect on me that I separated from my wife shortly after registering.

I guess they're right when they say you can't have two true loves...


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## Hand of Evil (May 13, 2003)

Bill Door said:
			
		

> *aH.  thE grEaT anD anCienT daYs.
> 
> siGH. *




bILl DoOR wonderful to see you again!


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## diaglo (May 13, 2003)

admit it you are both offshoots of the AOL days of T$R  


i know several other boards have spun off from WotC for basically the same reason.

Mortality.net back in august of 2001 came into being over an Edition War waged in the OoP forum at WotC.


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## Kwalish Kid (May 13, 2003)

The sad thing is, most if not all of the Pantheon vs. DWARF war are gone.

And I haven't seen the Ghost of Kwalish Nutkin in a long time. Maybe he found his final peace. (Fans of White Wolf will prefer to think that he perished in the Relic Atomic Bomb explosion.)


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## Doc_Souark (May 13, 2003)

Snoweel said:
			
		

> *bILLy d0oR still creeps me out, even now that I know whose alt. he is.
> 
> And let me just say that Nutkinland had such an effect on me that I separated from my wife shortly after registering.
> 
> I guess they're right when they say you can't have two true loves... *




Another relationship bites the dust because of that darn Squirrel ! Don't feel like the only one Snowy I got a divorce 8 months ago, but Nutkinland didn't have nutin' to do with it.

 NutkinLand is where all the Kewl folk hang out at.


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## Fenris (May 13, 2003)

Well thank you all for the history lesson. I had lurked at Eric's old site and always had wondered about the Pantheon. And now I will leave you all to your impromtu reunion.


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## Henry (May 13, 2003)

_Henry starts blinking back tears and fanning his eyes..._

Oh, dear... it's just like Passions!

BWAAAAAAAAAAAA!

BOO-HOO-HOO-HOO!


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God, it's great to see these threads. Makes me nostalgic.


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## Robbert Raets (May 19, 2003)

_>Raised Eyebrow<_


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