# Compiled list of 4e FR infos



## Derren (Aug 13, 2008)

Forked from:  Some people in Canada have recieved the 4E FRCG early! 


Here a small summary of Red Wizards, StarFyre2007s and Mad Eyed Cats posts who already got their copy of the FRCG. This post will be kept up to date and in Addition I will also post every addition from a different thread/board separatly to bump it.
*Now sorted!*

[sblock=Information from the FRCG]
[sblock=Zhentarim]

Orbakh is the only surviving Manshoon clone and leads the Zenths (mainly consisting out of Cyric guys now) from Stormwatch and Darkhold.
The Zenths fight the Yakuza.
The Baneites´made a deal with the Phaerim to controll the Dalelands.
The Shades heard from that deal and destroyed Zhentil Keep. After that the Baneites fled, leaving the Cyric guys in charge.
The goal of the new Zenths is freeing Cyric from his prison.
Zhentil Keep is still in ruins and apparently inhabited by robbers and pirates.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Deities] 

Mask is gone, but his exact faith is not mentioned.
Cyric is still imprisoned and gets more insane. His clerics are not affected by all this.
Deities have spheres again instead of portfolios
Shar is Shadow based now instead of Darkness.
Obould has the "Warrior" sphere.
Fzoul has the "Service to Evil" sphere (divine butler?).
 Every deity not on the list is unavailable, but their exact fates is not always stated (for example Mask).
Exarch = Demigod = ~Demigod Epic Destiny
Masks's realm still exists. His former chosen visit from time to time and it is rumoured that it is filled with treasure.
Torm got Tyr's Job and the sphere of Law and now sits in the realm of Cellestia. Hes especially worshipped in the Paladin realm of Elturgard.
Tyr was apparently killed while fighting off a demon invasion. Cryric or his followers had likely something to do with that or even stroke the killing blow.
Velsharoon was destroyed.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Bane] 

Hoar likely serves Bane.
Tiamat serves Bane.
Loviatar is Banes consort.
The church of bane is still strong, even with the loss of Zenthil Keep and the citadel of the Raven.
Bane taking Lovitar as consort was a political move. He is now worshipped also by evil dwarfs. Also, he absorbed the goblin deities further strengthening himself.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Afterlife] 

Kelemvor apparently has to deal with all the dead now, not only with the False&Faithless. The deities only pick souls up they really like.
No mention of the Wall found.
Souls can fade away out of existence.
Souls that refuse to pass on come back as ghosts and other incorporeal beings.


			
				Afterlife excerpt said:
			
		

> The souls of those who die travel through the Shadowfell to the Fugue Plane. There they await judgement. Some pass out of creation before any ruling comes, others after. Where these souls go not even the gods know. One that is of strong faith and capabilities might be taken to the dominion of it's deity, to serve him or her beyond life. others remain on the Fugue Plane as aides to the go of death, continuing on as ghosts or other insubstantial undead.



[/sblock]
[sblock=Former Chosen] 

Elminster went from superhero back to being a passive, slightly insane sage and lives in a farmhouse and doesn't want to use magic.
The Simbul is still around somewhere in the Dalelands.
Currently no known chosen in the Realms.
Masks former chosen still live.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Underdark] 

Menzoberranzan still exists and is the largest city in the Underdark.
The Spellplague created "Plaguecaves" in the Underdark
The Great Rift tore open exposing even greater depths called "Underchasm"
The Sea of Fallen Stars, Shining Sea, and Great Sea flow into theis Underchasm.
Earthmotes hover over this chasm, some containing tunnels originally from the Underdark whioch are inhabited by Underdark creatures.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Evermeet] 

Evermeet got transported into the Feywild.
A echo of Evermeet remains on Abeir-Toril (looks like a copy)
Everything on Sumbrar (dragons, soldiers, spelljammers) got destroyed.
Amlaruil is dead and Evermeet is without leader.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Evereska]

Evereska still exists and is currently being rebuild.
Evereskas Mythal is fully active and was barely affected by the spellplague.
The country is now more active and openly opposes the shades.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Thay/Red Wizards] 

Red Wizards are a pure organization now (no connection to any country) and only a shadow of their former selves.
Thay is destroyed and full of undead. Tam tried a ritual to make him stronger than the gods, failed and now wants to break out of former Thay and try again.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Rashemen] 

The Witches of Rashemen still exists.
Rashemen was not affected much by the Spellplague, except that it is now home of even more fey.
During the Thay civil war the witches eliminated the Durthans.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Lurien] 

Lurien was destroyed and now forms the Gulf of Lurien.
A part of Lurien survived. The Halflings there formed a seafaring/jungle society.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Abier] 

Abeir = World ruled by dragons and Primordials. Toril = FR we know. Was split apart by Ao when deities and Primordials fought. Now merged again.
Maztica was replaced by Abier.
Abier is about 1/8 the size of Faerun.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Genasi Kingdom]

The Genasi Kingdom was once only a part of a larger kingdom in Abeir.
It repleced Chessenta when it was transported.
Its cities are on Earthmotes connected to the ground by bridges.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Tymanther]

Has a strong military, but is also very open country.
Eager to make allies
Fought dragons for centuries which affected their architecture.
The Cult of the Dragon operates in this country.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Cult of the Dragon] 

The Cult of the Dragon is still there.
Active in Tymanther.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Order of Blue Fire]

Officially a group of spellscarred people who want to learn about the spallplague and help its victims.
Its masters are Sharn.
Its "masters" are believed to be trapped near the Underdark city of Imasker. 
Inofficially the group things the spallplague a holy event and wants to create another one or spread its effects over the world.
[/sblock]
[sblock=The Shades] 

The 12 Shade princes and the enclave still exists.
The Shades destroyed Zhentil Keep.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Waterdeep&Undermountain]

The Undermountain still stands and kept Waterdeep from collapsing.
Inside Undermountain dungeons are randomly shifted around.
Skullport is not inhabited.
Waterdeep patrols the first layer of Undermountain to prevent illicit trade.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Baldurs Gate] 

Baldurs Gate has grow really huge, likely the biggest city on Faerun now.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Calimshan]

Calimshan still exists
Calimport is now landlocked
[/sblock]
[sblock=Dambrath] 

Dambrath still exists.
The Crinti (half-drow) are gone
[/sblock]
[sblock=Sea of Falling Stars] 

The Sea of Falling Stars is nearly gone. It flows into the Underchasm.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Luskan] 

Luskan was destroyed.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Neverwinter] 

Neverwinter was destroyed.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Halruaa] 

Halruaa went "BOOM".
[/sblock]
[sblock=Mezro]

The landmass under Mezro collapsed and the whole city now lies underwater.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Kara-Tur] 

Kara-Tur still exists, but was affected by teh Spellplague, too.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Notable persons] 

Jarlaxle is a lvl 21 elite skirmisher.
Szass Tam is lvl 30 and the highest level statted thing in the book (full stat block).
[/sblock]
[sblock=Blood War]

The Blood War ended when the Abyss was thrown into the elemental Chaos as both parties didn't have an easy access to each other anymore. That means that Devils&Demons might still be hostile to each other when they meet.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Misc] 

No Psionics in this book.
[/sblock][/sblock]

[sblock=Information from other sources]
[sblock=Deities]

Mystra was killed by Cyric who was aided by Shar.
Gorm Gulthyn and Haela Brightaxe dies in a battle with Deep Duerra and Laduguer while following Moradin.
Deep Duerra is killed by Clangeddin during Moradins crusade.
Laduguer is killed by Moradin himself during his crusade.
Helm Is killed by Tyr in a Duel because of a misunderstanding.
Lathander becomes Amaunator.
[/sblock]
[sblock=Harpers]

The Harpers dissolve during the Spellplague. Some Harpers reformed in a new organization to oppose the Shades.
[/sblock]
[/sblock]

[sblock=Monsters and other statted things]
Fzoul Chembryl
banelar Naga
Dark Moon Monk
Kir-Lanan Wing
Blazing Rorn the Fury
Felljaw
Haraevor
Mordrin
Tentacled Torment
Fettered Dracolich
Draegloth (i hate the redesign off them)
Draegloth favoured one
Jarlaxle Baenre
Direhelm
Doomsept
Captain Shil Yargo
Jordaini Enforcer
Gibberling Bunch
Plague Gibberling Bunch
Arathluth Malaugrym
Luthvaerynn Malaugrym
Shade
Naramus
Thaalud
Veserab
Knight, Loremaster, & Commander Accordant
Sharn
Plaguechanged Ghoul
Terpenzi
Sath'fiss'ith the Skybinder
Wereserpent
several scathebeasts
Dread Warrior
Szass Tam
Warlock Knights
Shardsouls
Zairtail Swarms
Zhents
Manshoon
[/sblock]

[sblock=Deity list with spheres]
Greater Gods:

Amaunator: Sun
Asmodeus: Sin
Bane: Tyranny
Chauntea: Life
Corellon: Fey
Cyric: Strife
Ghaunadaur: Abominations
Gruumsh: Savagery
Kelemvor: Death
Lolth: Drow
Moradin: Dwarves
Ohgma: Knowledge
Selune: Moon
Shar: Shadows
Silvanus: Nature
Sune: Beauty
Tempus: War
Torm: Law

Gods: Serve the greaters

Angharraadh: Wisdom
Auril: Winter
Bahamut: Justice
Berronar Truesilver: Family
Beshaba: Bad Luck
Garl Glittergold: Protection
Gond: Craft
Ilmater: Suffering
Loviatar: Pain
Luthnic: Caves
Meilikki: Forrests
Sheela Peryroyl: Beauty
Sseth: Serpents
Talona: Plague
Tiamat: Greed
Tymora: Good luck
Umberlee: Sea
Waukeen: Merchants
Zehir: Poison

Exarchs/ Demigods: Ascended mortals mainly, some have mortal worshippers

Abbathor
Arvoreen
Baervan Wildwanderer
Bahgtru
Baravar Cloakshadow
Berronar
Brandobaris
Callarduran Smoothhands
Clangeddon Silverbeard
Cyrrollalee
Deep Seshalas
Dugmaren Brightmantle
Erevan Ilesere
Fenmarel Mestarline
Fzoul Chembryl: Sevice to Evil
Garagos
Hoar
Hruggek
Jergal: Fatalism
Labelas Enoreth
Lliira
Maglubiyet
Malar
Marthammor Duin
Milil
Obould: Warriors
The Red Knight: Tactics
Sharess
Shargaas
Shevarash
Shiallia
Siamorphe
Solonar Thelandrira
Thard Harr
Uthgar
Valkur
Vaprak
Vergadain

Primordials:

Akadi
Bazim-Gorag
Grumbar
Istishia
Kossuth
Seven Lost Gods. (Includes Dendar, Kezef, and Borem of the Boiling Mud)

Archdevils: One for each of the nine

Baalzebul
Bel
Belial
Dispater
Glasya
Levistus
Mammon
Mephistopheles
[/sblock]

[sblock=Deity alignment according to RPGA]
LAWFUL GOOD
Amaunator
Berronar Truesilver
Chauntea

Moradin
Torm

GOOD
Angharradh
Bahamut
Corellon
Garl Glittergold
Ilmater
Mielikki
Selune
Sheela Peryroyl
Sune
Tymora

UNALIGNED
Gond
Kelemvor
Oghma
Silvanus
Tempus
Waukeen 
[/sblock]

[sblock=Table of Contents]
Introduction

1: Loudwater
Basically an overview of the town, key personalities, and some short adventures -- 32 pages​2: Adventuring
Advancing the timeline, quick history lesson, some mundane (heroic, paragon & epic) treasures, and a glossary -- 9 pages​3: Magic
Spellplague effects on the land, critters & stuff, other fantasitc new features (like earthmotes) and some magic items & rituals -- 11 pages​4: Cosmology
A run down on the dominions, realms of the Elemental Chaos, the Feywild & the Shadowfell -- 9 pages​5: Pantheon
The Greater Gods, The Gods, The Exarchs (demi-gods), The Primordials & the Archdevils -- 10 pages​6: Fearun and Beyond
This takes up a big chunk of the book.  It has a quick overview and than launches into many different (new & old) regions of Faerun.  The end of the chapter also details Returned Abeir and The Underdark -- 90 pages​7: Threats
Here we get to see some of the bad guys.  We get updates on some oldies (Zhents, Thay) and some details on the new guys in town (Order of the Blue Fire).  We also get some stats for NPCs -- 46 pages​Index

New Monsters (actually an index showing where these monsters are located in the book)

Fold out map
[/sblock]


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## Jack99 (Aug 13, 2008)

Derren said:


> As the WotC board isn't very reliable I will repost everything what Red Wizard and StarFyre2007 post about the 4E FR in here and I will keep the OP updated when new informations emerge.




Thanks for doing this. I love that Fzoul is still alive and kicking, and now a demi-god! He has always been my favorite NPC in FR.


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## Derren (Aug 13, 2008)

Jack99 said:


> Thanks for doing this. I love that Fzoul is still alive and kicking, and now a demi-god! He has always been my favorite NPC in FR.




Technically Fzoul died, but Bane raised him to be an Exarch before he passed away.

Update:

The church of Bane is still strong, even with the loss of Zenthil Keep and the citadel of the Raven.
Bane taking Lovitar as consort was a political move. He is now worshipped also by evil dwarfs and he absorbed the goblin deities.
Torm got Tyr's Job and the sphere of Law and now sits in the realm of Cellestia. Hes especially worshipped in the Paladin realm of Elturgard.
Tyr was apparently killed while fighting off a demon invasion. Cryric or his followers had likely something to do with that or even stroke the killing blow.


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## Plissken (Aug 13, 2008)

> Luskan & Neverwinter are destroyed.



Wow.



> Baldurs Gate has grow really huge, likely the biggest city on Faerun now.



Computer game made this city really popular.

Is there any word on the Underdark? Drow cities like Menzoberranzan? Ched Nesad (I think it was destroyed but never read the novels about it), etc.? What of the Silver Marches region?

Wow, FR seems dismal and grim. Accompanies the points of light setting well.


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## Derren (Aug 13, 2008)

Plissken said:


> Is there any word on the Underdark? Drow cities like Menzoberranzan? Ched Nesad (I think it was destroyed but never read the novels about it), etc.? What of the Silver Marches region?




Sorry, I can't answer the questions. I just repost all the information I find on the WotC board here so people can read them when the WotC Board is down again (not that the ENworld boards are currently that stable) and to have a compiled list of changes and not have lots of tiny bits spread over 12+ pages of discussions.

Ask here: http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1073327


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## Jack99 (Aug 13, 2008)

Derren said:


> Technically Fzoul died, but Bane raised him to be an Exarch before he passed away.




Works just fine as well


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## Baumi (Aug 13, 2008)

For those like me, who are not knowledgable in FR ... how is the book itself(layout, graphic, usability,...)?


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## Derren (Aug 13, 2008)

Baumi said:


> For those like me, who are not knowledgable in FR ... how is the book itself(layout, graphic, usability,...)?




Again, I don't have the book, I just collect informations about it from people who have it. Either ask on the WotC board or at http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?p=4425085#post4425085

Update:

Menzoberranzan still exists.
The Spellplague created "Plaguecaves" in the Underdark
The Great Rift tore open exposing even greater depths called "Underchasm"
The Sea of Fallen Stars, Shining Sea, and Great Sea flow into theis Underchasm.
Earthmotes hover over this chasm, some containing tunnels originally from the Underdark an inhabited by Underdark creatures.
The Witches of Rashemen still exists.
Rashemen was not affected much by the Spellplague, except that it is now home of even more fey.
During the Thay civil war the witches eliminated the Durthans.


Infos from Mean Eyed Cat

A part of Lurien survived. The Halflings there formed a seafaring/jungle society.
Maztica was replaced by Abier.


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## StarFyre (Aug 13, 2008)

hey
menzoberranzan is mentioned as the most powerful underdark city.

the map is too large to scan/draw a quick scketch off but a large part of the country collapsed into the underdark making the ..forgot name, like sparkling sea or something..a underground sea (the water source was from the sea of fallen stars) and there are ..ruins, etc on the map in that collapsed section. haven't gotten to the section on what they are yet....the aboleth still exist in/around sea of fallen stars/underdark.

Sanjay


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## cangrejoide (Aug 13, 2008)

Anyone knows how the God Domains works for the cleric class?


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## Derren (Aug 13, 2008)

cangrejoide said:


> Anyone knows how the God Domains works for the cleric class?




In 4E every deity has a special feat which clerics of that deity can take which gives a special power exclusive for this deity. I guess it will be the same in the FR.
At least I think you meant that.


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## Protagonist (Aug 13, 2008)

cangrejoide said:


> Anyone knows how the God Domains works for the cleric class?




A post in the RPGA board states that there will be a CD feat for all FR deities in the PG.


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## Obergnom (Aug 13, 2008)

Thanks for  this! Saves me a lot of time 

I'm very unhappy with the the Zhents changes (how often do they want to destroy Zhentil Keep?) ... but with the beginning of 4th Ed. I startet my own seriously different realms anyway, so I will just buy the book for ideas to implement... I like what they did to Vaasa...


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## Derren (Aug 13, 2008)

Obergnom said:


> how often do they want to destroy Zhentil Keep?




This will likely be the last time as Zhentil Keep is still in ruins and inhabited by pirates and other scum.

Edit:
Lord Karsus started a similar compilation at the WotC board.
http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1074154

Most information is the same as the one found here, but in addition he also includes known FR facts from other sources.
Edit2: And now I have added this information here too.


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## The Little Raven (Aug 13, 2008)

Derren said:


> In 4E every deity has a special feat which clerics of that deity can take which gives a special power exclusive for this deity. I guess it will be the same in the FR.
> At least I think you meant that.




Paladins can take CD feats as well.


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## Derren (Aug 14, 2008)

New Information, including a table of content


Evereska still exists and is currently being rebuild.
Evereskas Mythal is fully active and was barely affected by the spellplague.
The country is now more active and openly opposes the shades.
The Genasi Kingdom was once only a part of a larger kingdom in Abeir.
It repleced Chessenta when it was transported.
Its cities are on Earthmotes connected to the ground by bridges.
Thymater, the dragonborn kingdom is military strong, but also very open country.
Eager to make allies.
Fought dragons for centuries which affected also affected their architecture.
The Cult of the Dragon operates in this country.
The Blood War ended when the Abyss was thrown into the elemental Chaos as both parties didn't have an easy access to each other anymore. That means that Devils&Demons might still be hostile to each other when they meet.
The Order of Blue Fire is officially a group of spellscarred people who want to learn about the spallplague and help its victims.
Its masters are Sharn.
Its "masters" are believed to be trapped near the Underdark city of Imasker. 
Inofficially the group things the spallplague a holy event and wants to create another one or spread its effects over the world.
For the Table of contents see the original Post.


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## The_Fan (Aug 14, 2008)

I'm curious about the no psionics comment. Granted, psionics have never been big in Faerun, but are they now explicitly banned, even before the book comes out? Odd, that.


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## Derren (Aug 14, 2008)

The_Fan said:


> I'm curious about the no psionics comment. Granted, psionics have never been big in Faerun, but are they now explicitly banned, even before the book comes out? Odd, that.




It means that there is no psionic in the book, not that it doesn't exist in the FR.
I'll clarify this entry.


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## Sonny (Aug 14, 2008)

Hey Derren, where did the information on Phlan come from? The only place I really saw anything about Phlan was Starfyre saying he didn't see it anywhere on the Sea of Fallen Star's map.

Of course, Phlan is actually located on the Moonsea, so he was looking in the wrong place. Someone in the thread pointed that out, but nothing about the city was mentioned again.


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## Derren (Aug 14, 2008)

Sonny said:


> Hey Derren, where did the information on Phlan come from? The only place I really saw anything about Phlan was Starfyre saying he didn't see it anywhere on the Sea of Fallen Star's map.
> 
> Of course, Phlan is actually located on the Moonsea, so he was looking in the wrong place. Someone in the thread pointed that out, but nothing about the city was mentioned again.




It is based on StarFyres post. I am not well versed in FR lore and can't really double check what information is posted. Just a note, when I say "Apparently" I do mean that this information is not 100% sure.
I will remove the Phlan entry.

And a small Evermeet update, Amlaruil is dead and Evermeet currently leaderless.


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## Sonny (Aug 14, 2008)

Derren said:


> It is based on StarFyres post. I am not well versed in FR lore and can't really double check what information is posted. Just a note, when I say "Apparently" I do mean that this information is not 100% sure.
> I will remove the Phlan entry.
> 
> And a small Evermeet update, Amlaruil is dead and Evermeet currently leaderless.




Thanks for the quick reply! I do appreciate you compiling all the info for us, it makes the wait for the book's release easier to handle.


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## Dragonhelm (Aug 14, 2008)

This change in the Realms reminds me so much of Dragonlance's Fifth Age.  The time jump, terraforming, and rules changes split fandom pretty badly.

I e-mailed Rich Baker about it, but he assures me that he thinks that won't happen this time around.  After all, it's still D&D (even if it is a new edition), rather than switching from AD&D to SAGA.  Despite Rich's assurances, I remain skeptical.

I will take a look at the FRCG and try to give it a chance, but I'm really doubtful at this point.  It's weird thinking about not buying the FRCG.  Then again, I have enough FR stuff from 2e and 3e to last me for years.


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## Derren (Aug 15, 2008)

Not much new information.


Calimshan still exists
Calimport is now landlocked


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## Mr. Wilson (Aug 15, 2008)

Dragonhelm said:


> I e-mailed Rich Baker about it, but he assures me that he thinks that won't happen this time around. After all, it's still D&D (even if it is a new edition), rather than switching from AD&D to SAGA. Despite Rich's assurances, I remain skeptical.




I wonder if Rich is just writing off the WoTC boards and Candlekeep as lost causes at the moment then.

Maybe taking the viewpoint that the silent majority actually approve of the changes.

We'll see.


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## Khaalis (Aug 15, 2008)

Dragonhelm said:


> This change in the Realms reminds me so much of Dragonlance's Fifth Age.  The time jump, terraforming, and rules changes split fandom pretty badly.
> 
> I e-mailed Rich Baker about it, but he assures me that he thinks that won't happen this time around.  After all, it's still D&D (even if it is a new edition), rather than switching from AD&D to SAGA.  Despite Rich's assurances, I remain skeptical.



I second the skepticism. While they may want to "think" its not going to tear a rift in the fan base they're out of their minds. Look at the rift that's formed just between 3X and 4E fans. In that viewpoint, changing form 3X to 4E is as bad as AD&D to Saga. Add the FR fan base split in there of those who are going to have the New FR and, well...




> I will take a look at the FRCG and try to give it a chance, but I'm really doubtful at this point.  It's weird thinking about not buying the FRCG.  Then again, I have enough FR stuff from 2e and 3e to last me for years.



I have to agree I'm not thrilled. I'll give it a look-see and decide then, but right now, from what I've heard so far, they would have been a lot better off presenting a totally new campaign setting than do the revamp of the FR. Granted they are using FR for the market penetration and traction the name carries but I think in the end, it was a bad choice. JMHO.


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## ProfessorCirno (Aug 15, 2008)

You know, I WAS thinking that the planned GSL changes meant that Wizards was trying to help heal up that fracture...and then this.

:|
*:|
:|
:|
:|
:|
:|
*


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## Jack99 (Aug 15, 2008)

Baumi said:


> For those like me, who are not knowledgable in FR ... how is the book itself(layout, graphic, usability,...)?




Quality seems to match the core books, (no smudging here though). Usability seems very high. Each area described has the information a player can have clearly outline, depending on which check is relevant, as well as some major cities/areas described, and a section called Plots and Adventure Sites.

All in all, enough to get a good idea of the land, while not burdening the DM with too much info. The meaty stuff is easy to find, which should save a lot of time, for those that do not have everything memorized.


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## Derren (Aug 15, 2008)

Finally some news


The Undermountain still stands and kept Waterdeep from collapsing.
Inside Undermountain dungeons are randomly shifted around.
Skullport is not inhabited.
Waterdeep patrols the first layer of Undermountain to prevent illicit trade.
The landmass under Mezro collapsed and the whole city now lies underwater.


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## Mean Eyed Cat (Aug 16, 2008)

Derren said:


> Not much new information.
> 
> 
> Calimshan still exists
> Calimport is now landlocked




Calimshan exisits, but its basically divided into three parts.  The Human controlled city of Almraiven, the genasi controlled city of Calimport (who are loyal to the djinn Calim) and the genasi controlled city of Memnon (who are loyal to the efreet Memnon).  Humans in the latter two cities have been enslaved.


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## Mean Eyed Cat (Aug 16, 2008)

I don't know if this has been mentioned yet, but Lantan is mostly gone.  Tsunamis flooded most of the island and many of its people and technology were lost.


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## ProfessorCirno (Aug 16, 2008)

Out of curiosity, anything on Talos?  I've heard that Talos just doesn't seem to exist, as if they forgot about him.


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## Jack99 (Aug 16, 2008)

ProfessorCirno said:


> Out of curiosity, anything on Talos?  I've heard that Talos just doesn't seem to exist, as if they forgot about him.




He isn't listed anywhere that I have seen in the book. Maybe under a new name? I haven't touched FR since 2e, so my realms-lore is a bit shaky.. Didn't he have an alias or something, at some point?

EDIT: Weird. No god has neither Storms or Destruction as sphere. So not replaced per say I guess.


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## ProfessorCirno (Aug 16, 2008)

Nope, was always Talos.  Great power, at that.

Also, its seems all the Drow gods except Lolth are now dead.  I guess non-evil Drow were getting in the way of Drizzt's angscapades.


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## Derren (Aug 16, 2008)

Apparently the book says that Talos always was just an alias for a other deity (Gruumsh I think). But there is much discussion about this so I am not sure.


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## ProfessorCirno (Aug 16, 2008)

Derren said:


> Apparently the book says that Talos always was just an alias for Gruumsh (or a other deity, not sure). But there is much discussion about this so I am not sure.




Well, the retcons were already in full bloom, so we'll see just how far they go.

I didn't even like the Realms, but...jeez.  They didn't deserve this.  It's like Wizards is purposefully trying to get rid of ANYTHING that would remind you of pre-4e FR.


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## Dragonhelm (Aug 17, 2008)

Any word on the town of Daggerford?  I used to run a campaign there and I hope it's still intact.


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## SPECTRE666 (Aug 17, 2008)

ProfessorCirno said:


> It's like Wizards is purposefully trying to get rid of ANYTHING that would remind you of pre-4e FR.



-Thats interesting.


*SPECTRE*


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## TarionzCousin (Aug 17, 2008)

Dragonhelm said:


> Any word on the town of Daggerford?  I used to run a campaign there and I hope it's still intact.



It got overrun and destroyed.

Oh, wait... that was just in my 2E campaign.

It was a nice little town.


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## Keefe the Thief (Aug 17, 2008)

ProfessorCirno said:


> Nope, was always Talos.  Great power, at that.
> 
> Also, its seems all the Drow gods except Lolth are now dead.  I guess non-evil Drow were getting in the way of Drizzt's angscapades.




They were removed because loads of people screamed about the proliferation of non-evil drow. Not that this will change anything. As you´ve shown, everything Wotc does with the Drow is seen by some as "just furthering Driizzt as a novel character."


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## ProfessorCirno (Aug 17, 2008)

Keefe the Thief said:


> They were removed because loads of people screamed about the proliferation of non-evil drow. Not that this will change anything. As you´ve shown, everything Wotc does with the Drow is seen by some as "just furthering Driizzt as a novel character."




The problem is that ALL non-Lolth drow deities are now gone, and it happened while Eilistraee was taking them down to gain her own power to challenge Lolth.  I mean, I guess they could make the story of Eilistraee taking the other drow gods down one at a time to gather her power, leaving only a titanic battle between her and Lolth, only to just die against Lolth like some random schmuck (For who knows why.  Maybe there is a reason other then "Drizzt would no longer be special."  If so, _clue me in_, because getting rid of such great potential for conflict makes no sense) but that would be...

...Well, actually, that would be rather in line with most of the other FR changes.  Huh.


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## Staffan (Aug 18, 2008)

Sonny said:


> Of course, Phlan is actually located on the Moonsea, so he was looking in the wrong place. Someone in the thread pointed that out, but nothing about the city was mentioned again.



Phlan is still there, but only mentioned in passing as one of a number of cities where both the Netherese and Cormyr are trying to extend influence.


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## Ruin Explorer (Aug 18, 2008)

ProfessorCirno said:


> The problem is that ALL non-Lolth drow deities are now gone, and it happened while Eilistraee was taking them down to gain her own power to challenge Lolth.  I mean, I guess they could make the story of Eilistraee taking the other drow gods down one at a time to gather her power, leaving only a titanic battle between her and Lolth, only to just die against Lolth like some random schmuck (For who knows why.  Maybe there is a reason other then "Drizzt would no longer be special."  If so, _clue me in_, because getting rid of such great potential for conflict makes no sense) but that would be...
> 
> ...Well, actually, that would be rather in line with most of the other FR changes.  Huh.




Why would you have her "die like a random schmuck"? I mean, what?

Why not have her die heroically, but die nonetheless. I mean Jesus Christ, just look at Jesus Christ! He "died for our sins", can't Eilistraee die for the sins of the Drow, as it were? Sure, Lolololololth won and Eilistraee (and her perv-baiting naked dancing) were cast down, but now there's small group of Drow, spread throughout Drow society, who believe SHE did this for them, that Eilistraee (Blessed her name) proved, once and for all, that Drow do not have to be evil. There heretics don't have power, and their goddess is dead, but they remain, and maybe through their belief in things not having to be this way, they will gradually change things. Though not until a whole lot of them have been fed to the neo-Otyughs.

Howzat?

Sure, you could have your yawn-inducing "Good god vs. Evil god" super-cliche "struggle for the soul of the Drow" idiocy, but I think I prefer my Christianity-rip-off take on things, and I think it'd be less of a horrible cliche and involve more chance for actual complex adventuring and cool scenarios". Certainly I think I've "clued you in", as requested, on how she could be more fun dead than active.

Of course, haha, this is the FR, and no such thing will happen, as in the FR, gaudy and melodramatic plots, as well as flash-y magic beat the power of the masses or of an idea every single time without exception.

EDIT - Except, I could see WotC (or TSR for that matter) doing a Drizzt as Drow Jesus deal. Maybe that's why they need any "confusing" factors out of the way. Oh god I hope not rofl.


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## Mean Eyed Cat (Aug 18, 2008)

Dragonhelm said:


> Any word on the town of Daggerford?  I used to run a campaign there and I hope it's still intact.





I haven't come across any info on Daggerford yet.  Its still on the new fold out map, so assume its okay


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## ProfessorCirno (Aug 18, 2008)

Ruin Explorer said:


> Why would you have her "die like a random schmuck"? I mean, what?
> 
> Why not have her die heroically, but die nonetheless. I mean Jesus Christ, just look at Jesus Christ! He "died for our sins", can't Eilistraee die for the sins of the Drow, as it were? Sure, Lolololololth won and Eilistraee (and her perv-baiting naked dancing) were cast down, but now there's small group of Drow, spread throughout Drow society, who believe SHE did this for them, that Eilistraee (Blessed her name) proved, once and for all, that Drow do not have to be evil. There heretics don't have power, and their goddess is dead, but they remain, and maybe through their belief in things not having to be this way, they will gradually change things. Though not until a whole lot of them have been fed to the neo-Otyughs.
> 
> ...




Sadly, that's not what happens from what I've read/heard.  Apparently in the book series, she DOES die like just some chump.  Despite all her successes, she somehow ends up stuck in some corner being ambushed by Lolth and both her and all her followers die.  Like chumps.


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## The Grumpy Celt (Aug 19, 2008)

The book is out now.


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## chaotix42 (Aug 19, 2008)

Yup, got it today at Borders. So far I'm enjoying it, though I've noticed a few errors in the Threats chapter.


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## rounser (Aug 19, 2008)

> Despite all her successes, she somehow ends up stuck in some corner being ambushed by Lolth and both her and all her followers die. Like chumps.



Plot protection...


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## Fenes (Aug 19, 2008)

Definetly sticking with my own Realms, and ignoring all this stuff.


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## Sonny (Aug 19, 2008)

Staffan said:


> Phlan is still there, but only mentioned in passing as one of a number of cities where both the Netherese and Cormyr are trying to extend influence.




Thank you good sir! I'm hoping to get the book tomorrow, but Phlan's been one city that I couldn't get an answer to at a couple of different boards. I was beginning to think it was wiped off the face of Faerun.


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## Weregrognard (Aug 19, 2008)

Just got the book yesterday afternoon 

At first glance:

Pros: 
- Newness!  The setting seems more digestible now, and it smells like teen spirit.  As in: it reminds me of when I first got the old Gray Box.

- Map!  The map is pretty and still looks like the Realms, despite changes.

- Comfort Zone!  Not all places have changed.  The Dales still exist.  The Moonsea is still a "hive of scum and villainy".

- Steal!  There's a sidebar saying its ok to not use the setting and steal stuff from it.  Most people don't need this "permission", but for those who do, your conscience is clear.

Cons:
- Gods!  Wish there were bulleted "tenets" a la _PHB_ in the entries.  Only the greater gods are described in detail.  The rest are left to tables.

- Anauroch!  The most striking landmark on the maps (in my opinion) has been reduced thanks to the returned Netheril Empire.  

- Missing!  There seem to be a few areas that are not detailed.  For example, the Shaar Desolation* doesn't have its own entry.  I guess they need something for _Dragon_.


*There is, however, an illustrated homage to the "Shaar horseman" art of the 1E Gray Box.


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