# New Post-Apoc Game



## Insight (Sep 12, 2007)

I'm enjoying the game I'm currently running (see sig), and am mulling over the possibility of starting another one.  What I'd like to do is get a read on what people would be interested in playing and see if I get enough responses that match up with something I'd be comfortable running.

What I'd like to get are some responses along the lines of:

1.  What sort of game system you'd like to play (it should be something D20 since this is EN World after all; also, I do not own the new Star Wars, so that's out, although I do own the prior version)

2.  What sort of setting you'd like to play in (I will state right off the bat I do not own Eberron or FR, so forget those)

I'd like to run something that isn't all that common, but people would like to play.  That doesn't necessarily mean that D&D is out of the question, but I'd say there are quite a few D&D games going on right now, so maybe something else would be interesting.


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## Kaodi (Sep 12, 2007)

Mecha Crusade? The mini-game version or the d20 Future version. I do not have the issue of Polyhedron, but the only real difference between the two is Wealth vs. Point Value and the whole Metabot thing that was never translated, eh?

Or d20 Future's mecha rules with any homebrew setting. I'm thinking PL 6/7 though.


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## Caliber (Sep 12, 2007)

I know a few are in play right now, but Star Wars would be interesting (I don't own Saga either). Mutants and Masterminds or Deeds Not Words (or Project Phoneix, the almost finished new version of DnW) would likewise be interesting ... all three are games I've bought but never gotten a chance to use (at least as intended.)

For that matter, looking at my bookcase, a d20 Modern, CoC, or AU/AE could all be lots of fun, and all are more off-beat d20 games of various genres/styles. I liked them all enough to buy them, but my lazy group just likes DnD!  (Fading Suns and Everquest d20 are fun too, but I think those systems are a bit shakier than the ones I listed ... but never having played them, maybe I'm wrong!)


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## Insight (Sep 12, 2007)

Yeah, I can't get my group to play anything other than D&D either.  That's why I come here for something different!

I'd be interested in a D20 Modern.  Does anyone have any preference, if I choose to run a D20 Modern, in terms of style/setting/genre?


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## Caliber (Sep 12, 2007)

Hmm, tough to say. A GammaWorld type game would be interesting, as would a more modern day (or slightly before/after modern day) with some supernatural elements. If the idea is to move away from DnDisms, a game where the supernatural is squarely in the hands of the big bads, and the players are those puny mortals who have to fight it, might be an interesting twist from DnDs general assumptions.


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## Kaodi (Sep 12, 2007)

If you wanted to do Modern, as opposed to Future, maybe something like a combination between Fallout and one of X-Files, Men In Black or Alien Nation.


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## Shayuri (Sep 12, 2007)

Oh...oh...

I'm definitely up for a post-apocalypse setting.

Gritty a la Fallout, or cartoony a la Gamma World...it's all good.

I've got D20 modern and future SRD stuff so I can do the basicks.


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## industrygothica (Sep 12, 2007)

Post-apocalyptic would be fun.  I've also been anxious to try something based in the old west.


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## Rhun (Sep 12, 2007)

I'm always up for a d20 Modern game.


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## Drerek (Sep 12, 2007)

I would like to try D20 Modern.  Post-Apocalyptic or Alien Invasion.

Is there an SRD to D20 Modern?


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## Caliber (Sep 12, 2007)

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20/article/msrd (Google is your friend!   )


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## Necro_Kinder (Sep 12, 2007)

Post-apocalyptic or cyber punk  would be pretty awesome. I'd be in for some d20 Modern.


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## Insight (Sep 13, 2007)

Post-Apoc is definitely doable.  I actually own D20 Apocalypse, so that's certainly a possibility.  Sounds like we have a few votes in that direction, so let's say it's a PA game.

That said, those of you interested in such a game, give me an idea of what sort of PA game you'd like to play.  I've got a number of supplements, and really nothing is out of the question in terms of magic, cyberware, robots, etc.  I'm not all that interested in mecha per se, but let's see what people would like to play.


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## Kaodi (Sep 13, 2007)

Post-Apocalyptic Mecha? 

Actually, I think if you take Fallout and add in an Alien Nation element (the aliens came after we screwed our selves over, but they were screwed themselves anyway), but put it somewhere other than the U.S. Maybe Europe for a change, perhaps even around the north-eastern edge of the Mediterranean, or whats left of the Mediterranean, hehehe...


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## Caliber (Sep 13, 2007)

Lots of directions to go with PA. You could go GammaWorld, or Fallout (I loved Fallout!) and use the technological crash, with varying levels of sci-fantasy (I'm looking at you GammaWorld) thrown in. Or you could go the magical PA direction, maybe like ShadowRun but with magic's return WAY more devestating (like Rifts, perhaps). 

Either way, color me interested!


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## Voda Vosa (Sep 13, 2007)

I would like to play a post apocalyptic world, if it got some magic, well then thats better, if not, who cares ? ^^


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## Shayuri (Sep 13, 2007)

I'm leaning towards gamma world myself...we might even use Mutants and Masterminds, as I think its rules could really do well with that mix of tech and mutation...

But I'm openminded! I don't have d20 Apocalypse though, so I might need some hand holding if we went that way.

I'm also open to a grittier Fallout style game. It's all good.


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## Moon_Goddess (Sep 13, 2007)

d20 Apocolypse is mostly a GM's toolkit so you don't really need it to play in a game.

I'm interested in a d20 Apocolypse game...   Fallout would be cool, anything would be cool.   Silly, Gamma Worldy even cooler.


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## Necro_Kinder (Sep 13, 2007)

Terminator or Matrix type apocalypse? Machines rise and take over?


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## Jemal (Sep 13, 2007)

I second Necro-Kinder's... A Terminator styled game with D20 Modern rules and a few futuristic weapons would be HELLA fun.


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## Drerek (Sep 13, 2007)

Terminator!  Daddy like as long as we're not expected to go jumping through time.  I hate time travel.  But just humanity's last stand against the machines?  Very cool.


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## Shayuri (Sep 13, 2007)

Aww...no mutants?

Ah well, no biggy.


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## Rhun (Sep 13, 2007)

I've actually got a d20 Terminator PDF.


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## Insight (Sep 13, 2007)

Interesting.  Lots of votes for a Terminator-style game.  Basically, your killer robots trying to take over the world.  IF I run this sort of game (I'm not 100% sold on the idea, but we'll see), it will NOT be like the Terminators movies.  I'm not a big fan of adaptations in gaming.  I don't think they work very well.

Those of you that are interested in this sort of a game (killer robots trying to take over the world), tell me what you like about this kind of setting, and why you'd want to play in such a game.  It'll help me get a feel for the sort of game people want, and see if I can accomodate this.


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## Shayuri (Sep 13, 2007)

There's a lot of Fallout/gamma world references too.

maybe we should have an out and out vote

And I feel I should point out there's no reason you can't integrate. You can have a "rise of the machines" setting in a post nuclear world that includes elements of fallout/gamma world. It doesn't have to be a literal translation of Terminator/Matrix.


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## -SIN- (Sep 13, 2007)

I reckon a mature, dark natured Post-Apoc game would be cool.

No laws. No Morals. Pure survival.


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## Wystan (Sep 13, 2007)

I would be interested in a Fallout/Post Apoc game like that where it is a small party of Vault Dweller survivors going out into the world....


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## Rhun (Sep 13, 2007)

I like to see a bit of everything in these games. I could definitely go for a Gamma World feel, though I don't have the d20 version. Mutants, a scattering of high-tech gadgets and or robots, lots of strange foes, and a constant struggle for resources and survival!


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## Drerek (Sep 13, 2007)

Now would we be the humans or the killer robots?


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## Insight (Sep 13, 2007)

Rhun said:
			
		

> I like to see a bit of everything in these games. I could definitely go for a Gamma World feel, though I don't have the d20 version. Mutants, a scattering of high-tech gadgets and or robots, lots of strange foes, and a constant struggle for resources and survival!




It definitely wouldn't be straight Gamma World as I don't own that.  I do have a pretty good idea of the basics of Gamma World, however, so I could do something along those lines.

It could be robots and mutants and etc.  No reason it couldn't be.


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## Mandy Pandy (Sep 13, 2007)

What ever you end up playing this certainly sounds like it'll be an interesting game.  So interesting that my husband has finally wrestled me into making an account.  ^^<3


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## Insight (Sep 13, 2007)

Mandy Pandy said:
			
		

> What ever you end up playing this certainly sounds like it'll be an interesting game.  So interesting that my husband has finally wrestled me into making an account.  ^^<3




Welcome to EN World!

Everyone, keep your suggestions coming!  I hope to have something together in the next couple of days.


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## industrygothica (Sep 14, 2007)

Definitely sounds like fun, though I've no experience with Gamma World, Fallout, or any other similar setting.

Of course, that may make it even more fun, not knowing exactly what to expect.


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## Shayuri (Sep 14, 2007)

I kind of like the idea of a certain level of free for all...

Say you have a large area dominated by the thinking machines and their human slaves (in whatever capacity said slaves might serve...Matrix-esque power cells, medical experiments, jobs too lowly for robots to do...etc ), but they avoid the 'burned' zones, where atomics and/or biological agents have left a legacy of genetic chaos. In the fragile circles around the Burns, but still outside the machine dominion, are places where new ecosystems are starting to stabilize, with mutant strains of human/animal/plant/etc achieving species status and carving niches for themselves.

Plenty of room for high tech human refugees/rebels from the machine realms with futuristic equipment and even cybernetics to team up with mutants from the low-tech villages and palisades of the green zones that are constantly wary of robot spy drones and hungry monsters from the Burns.

Adventures could involve joining the Human Resistance (the presence of which may be all that's keeping the Machine Dominion from expanding inexorably over the planet), incursions into the wildly dangerous Burn to unearth ancient artifacts, discovering hidden Vaults full of the descendents of original pre-war humanity....flavor to liking.


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## Jemal (Sep 14, 2007)

The part of it I think I would like is the 'human resistance' part.  I've heard of gamma world but never played, and know nothing about it.  My vote would be for using d20 Modern b/c it's got an SRD for quick online reference, is easily accesable by everyone, and is the only one of the 'suggested' systems that I personally own.  As for the mutants & Machines, I'm all for it, but I think playing the 'normal' humans trying to survive would be the most interesting.  At least for me.  Using your wits & Skills, teaming up with the mutants and stealing the machines tech to fight back.


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## Shayuri (Sep 14, 2007)

Arr...I like the idea of the human resistance too...but it'd be cool to open up the background and setting a bit to allow all kinds of characters.

Of course, there's no reason why the 'human resistance' couldn't include mutants. Maybe they're even Machine-created...attempts to create a 'better' organism, or biological infiltrators.

All kinds of possibilities!


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## doghead (Sep 14, 2007)

ooc - PA

Gamma World was in some ways ahead of it time in its use of factions or groups. They provided a really good source of adversaries and allies. Funny what you remember.

I think a key question would be; what was the nature of the Fall. Was it a sudden apocalyptic event - like a large scale nuclear or biological exchange? Or was it a slower gradual disintegration of society as we know it - increasing conflict between national, religious and corporate groups, a gradual attrition of the infrastructure and rule of law required for 'modern' society to survive.

I tend to be partial to the latter; an inextricable march towards destruction everyone could see coming. Resulting in something more like a Firefly'esque setting than a Terminator one, I would think. 

Another key question would be how long after 'the fall' is the game set? Would the characters remember life in the days of mobile phones, traffic jams and big screen TV's? The further down the track, the more things would have settled into some sort of order. I like the idea (stealing from Dune here) of guilds or associations that horde technology and knowledge, and do their best to prevent others from acquiring it. The Makers who build things. The Shapers retain genetic engineering skills. Something like that.

Anyways, enough random ramblings from me.

doghead
aka thotd


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## Wik (Sep 14, 2007)

God, I love post-apoc, especially the d20 Apocalypse rules.  They're the best!  

I like the idea of a "against the machines" game, especially if it was set in the "aftermath" timeline - more or less, the PCs remember a time before things went sour, and the ruined buildings and whatnot still hold valuable stuff. 

Robots would be pretty cool, and they always make great enemies.  But really, anything's possible with post-apoc.

***

Were it me, I think a post-apoc game where the enemies all have genetic mutations, or are demons and angels (I like the angels & Demons option in D20 Apoc) would also be pretty sweet.  But, yeah, it's just such a great genre.


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## Insight (Sep 14, 2007)

Here's what I'm considering in the most basic terms.

The setting is part post-apocalytpic, part dark future.  

The world was not completely destroyed during the apocalypse (the nature of which I have not settled on, but it will be something more insidious than all-of-a-sudden)... but a majority of the world was set back significantly.  There will be areas of high radiation, dangerous, lawless places called the Wasteland (even though these are not necessarily contiguous areas, they are collectively called the Wasteland).

The cities that survived became self-contained arcologies, and the cities close to each other (for example LA and San Diego, Minneapolis and St. Paul, the NYC area) became even _bigger_ arcologies.  Within these arcologies, The Machine reigns supreme.  The Machine is the collected Robotica, all self-aware machines, interconnected through the Net, whose main goals are to maintain control and gain control of more things.  At the left hand of The Machine are the six MegaCorps that comprise 90% of the world's economy.

So I'm thinking Progress Level 6 for the most part, though there will be some mix of PL 5 (in the Wasteland) and PL 7 (restricted to the wealthy and connected within the MegaCorps and The Machine).  There'll be mutants, cyborgs, purestrain humans, robots, martial arts, lasers, and all sorts of fun.

I'll present more of the rules stuff, and some expanded setting information, sometime soon.  What I need from interested parties is what sort of characters you'd like to play in such a setting, so that I can get an idea of what sort of game to run.  There's a lot of possibilities at this point, and I'd like to focus my efforts on what material we'll actually be using.

I do _not_ need statted characters at this point.  What I need are basic character concepts, and what role you'd like to play in this setting.  Once we have a simple majority of one sort of game, I'll start a recruitment thread and make the call for actual characters.


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## Mandy Pandy (Sep 14, 2007)

Insight said:
			
		

> Welcome to EN World!
> 
> Everyone, keep your suggestions coming!  I hope to have something together in the next couple of days.




Thank you very much!  

*works on a character concept*  ^^<3


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## Shayuri (Sep 14, 2007)

HMMMM

I like what I see so far.

Let me pry at your sweet brain meats for a moment to help give shape to my ideas.

1) Are all the arcologies/megaplexes essentially the same, or is each dominated by a different AI/corporation with its own laws and ways of doing things?

2) Are the arcologies aggressive in terms of acquiring new resources...and what constitutes resources? 

3) Is the Wasteland the only source of genetically altered (ie - mutated) organisms, or is genetic manipulation used in one or more arcologies as well?

4) Are there organizations in the Wasteland, or is it still the law of the biggest gun? (examples might include tribes of raiders, nascent towns and cities, guilds or unions of merchants and/or tradesmen, and so on)

5) To what extent has knowledge of the pre-Oops world been lost?

6) What kind of rights are recognized for human beings? What about sapient nonhuman beings? Is there friction between those populations? Where is the line drawn between a 'pure' human and a humanoid (but not human) mutant?

7) Can we make some details pertinent to our characters and concepts up? 

That'll do to get me started.


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## industrygothica (Sep 14, 2007)

Shayuri said:
			
		

> HMMMM
> 
> I like what I see so far.
> 
> ...





That's all?


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## Shayuri (Sep 14, 2007)

For a start.


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## Voda Vosa (Sep 15, 2007)

> In the fragile circles around the Burns, but still outside the machine dominion, are places where new ecosystems are starting to stabilize, with mutant strains of human/animal/plant/etc achieving species status and carving niches for themselves.




I, as a biologist, must disagree with that. Anyway, it doesn't affect the feel of the game, but its just a pain in my eyes I have to erase XD. Nothing personal =P

General and basic Character concept. 

Malacos, pure breed human scientist, working in on of the MegaCorps, wishing to eradicate all The machines from the face of the earth, and reestablish human control. Skeptic and cold, Malacos tried everything to achieve his goals from inside the Corps, but when he was discovered, attempting to produce a massive shutdown, he could barely scape alive thanks to his contacts. 
He now lives in the wastelands, planning how to cut off The machines, once and for all. He is working in the development of a biological agent that could terminate The machines, like the black plague did with human kind, centuries ago.


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## Shayuri (Sep 15, 2007)

lol...it wasn't meant to be in any way a scientific suggestion. Just a brainstorm.


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## Insight (Sep 15, 2007)

Shayuri said:
			
		

> 1) Are all the arcologies/megaplexes essentially the same, or is each dominated by a different AI/corporation with its own laws and ways of doing things?




As a foundation, The Machine controls them all, though each of the "big six" MegaCorps has a presence in every arcology and serves as a human face to the Robotica that truly reigns supreme.

The law is, essentially, do as The Machine commands, or be vaporized.  There are thousands upon thousands of lines of legal code atop that premise, but it all boils down to that simple yet charming sentiment.



> 2) Are the arcologies aggressive in terms of acquiring new resources...and what constitutes resources?




Yes.  The Machine always wants to grab more and more for itself, and this includes land and resources outside its current control.  It runs into trouble trying to acquire resources and territories that it really can't keep under its thumb, and The Machine is sometimes put in the unfortunate position of bargaining with The Wasteland for resources.

Energy and natural resources (such as minerals and agriculture) are the two main things that the arcologies need to keep going.  Some are more successful than others at self-sufficience.  There are certainly robotic mines and farms outside the arcologies, but these are heavily guarded and watched.  In terms of energy, The Machine harnesses solar power for most of its needs, and is exceedingly efficient in terms of its overall consumption.



> 3) Is the Wasteland the only source of genetically altered (ie - mutated) organisms, or is genetic manipulation used in one or more arcologies as well?




Oh no, there are mutants on both sides of the arcology wall.  Mutants within the arcologies tend to be of the engineered variety (those few 'accidental' mutants found within an arcology don't last very long).  Within the arcology, the type of 'planned' mutants you find are servants to The Machine, and are sometimes clones of useful members of human society.

In The Wasteland, 'accidental' mutants are all over the place.  This is related to the 'apocalypse', but essentially, the thing that caused all the upheaval also causes humans to be highly susceptible to radiation-induced mutations on the scale of what you find in D20 Future.  Note that, in almost every case, these 'accidental' mutations result in early death; any mutant characters will be the exception, not the rule by any means.



> 4) Are there organizations in the Wasteland, or is it still the law of the biggest gun? (examples might include tribes of raiders, nascent towns and cities, guilds or unions of merchants and/or tradesmen, and so on)




The Wasteland _IS_ an organization of sorts.  It's essentially a collection of the most powerful warlords of the abandoned rural areas.  The leaders of The Wasteland gather periodically to discuss policy and strategy, but on the whole, the warlords are left to rule their own areas.

There are little towns and trade posts within The Wasteland.  These tend to be heavily defended, and exist for the purpose of trade and the residence of whatever warlord calls it home.  Structures outside of these armored forts are few and far between, and highly coveted as bases by bandits and mutant tribes.

There is some society within The Wasteland.  If you've read Car Wars, it's sorta like that, except without the media coverage and organized medical care.  For entertainment, there are gladiatorial death matches between both individuals and vehicles (sometimes both), and other blood sports, but the organization of said events is up to the local warlord and tends to be haphazard at best.

In terms of trade, people in The Wasteland are on the barter system.  There is no credit whatsoever, and no currency.  The warlords prize only physical goods they can use, even precious items, such as gold and jewelry, have little value.  Merchants do exist, and tend to be skilled at acquiring valuable goods and selling them at the trade posts.  Trade between The Wasteland and the arcologies is a bit trickier, but still happens, and some merchants specialize in this interface.  It is much easier to sell items of 'perceived value', such as gold and jewelry, to the arcologies, but also services, such as exploration of The Wasteland, or transport of goods or people to another city.



> 5) To what extent has knowledge of the pre-Oops world been lost?




Physically, much outside the arcologies has been destroyed.  Buildings, roads, and the physical infrastructure are somewhat intact (let's say 35% remain from pre-apoc).  

In terms of society, everything that existed pre-apoc can only be found within the arcologies, but what is there is mostly intact.  There is no 'knowledge gap' or anything along those lines.  Much of pre-apoc culture has changed, however, with The Machine's rise to power.  Pre-apoc culture hasn't been lost so much as forgotten, but the knowledge of that history hasn't been lost, just buried.  Outside of the arcologies, it is barbaric and lawless, but some remnants of pre-apoc society have survived (such as language).



> 6) What kind of rights are recognized for human beings? What about sapient nonhuman beings? Is there friction between those populations? Where is the line drawn between a 'pure' human and a humanoid (but not human) mutant?




The Machine runs a fascist state.  It makes all of the rules, and the only rights anyone has are what are necessary for The Machine to get what it wants.  Humans and mutants are treated the same - poorly.  Humans often are disdainful of mutants, especially 'planned' mutants.  Clones are especially looked down upon by everyone, seen more as pets and objects than people.  It's important to point out that cloning technology has not been perfected, and many clones are defective in some way.

The Purity (a humans-only organization) believes that mutants of all kinds are an affront to humanity's rightful place as rulers of the world, and that all mutants should be destroyed.  They are also against cloning, and destroy all clones they come across.  Eventually, the Purity plans to try to take down The Machine, but they realize this is a lofty goal that will be some time in coming.

Most humans, however, feel a certain amount of pity for 'accidental' mutants, and harbor them no ill will.  Mutants that have obvious outward physical mutations often face prejudice and fear in the arcologies, but have power and influence in The Wasteland.



> 7) Can we make some details pertinent to our characters and concepts up?




To an extent.  Use the material I release as a guide, and understand that I may ask you to change things that don't fit in with my vision of the setting.


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## Insight (Sep 15, 2007)

Voda Vosa said:
			
		

> I, as a biologist, must disagree with that. Anyway, it doesn't affect the feel of the game, but its just a pain in my eyes I have to erase XD. Nothing personal =P




There probably won't be any sentient plants or animals.  Sorry.



> General and basic Character concept.
> 
> Malacos, pure breed human scientist, working in on of the MegaCorps, wishing to eradicate all The machines from the face of the earth, and reestablish human control. Skeptic and cold, Malacos tried everything to achieve his goals from inside the Corps, but when he was discovered, attempting to produce a massive shutdown, he could barely scape alive thanks to his contacts.
> He now lives in the wastelands, planning how to cut off The machines, once and for all. He is working in the development of a biological agent that could terminate The machines, like the black plague did with human kind, centuries ago.




This character's scientific skills might be highly prized in the Wasteland, especially to some warlord looking to get an edge over his rivals.


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## Shayuri (Sep 15, 2007)

Beautiful! Thank you!

As usual, when presented with hugely cool game concepts, my brain spits up not one character, but a litter. I'll narrow 'em down, but if any of them strike you (or anyone else) as being particularly fun-sounding or inappropriate to the game let me know and I'll factor that into which one I wind up developing as a full PC.

...I'm overfond of numbered lists. 

1) Mutant savage from the wasteland! A member of a low-tech tribe of mutants who's fellows were abducted by a mad AI for reasons unknown (perhaps for labor outside of arcology or in areas where robots can't function, or perhaps they have genetic traits of interest to the Machine...etc). This character would have plenty of wilderness skills and would probably be a sneaky and/or melee smashy combatant.

2) Scavenger with a secret! A self-sufficient wasteland wanderer who makes a living trawling what ruins are (reasonably) safe to enter and retrieving artifacts and supplies to sell to merchant centers. No visible mutations, but conceals some abilities in the interests of not running afoul of the Purity as well as maintaining a professional edge. Both envies and pities the denizens of the Arcology, who have so many amenities, yet so little freedoms. Fears that one day the Machine will overrun everything... Most likely this would be a stealthy shooter type in terms of combat role...a lot also depends on what sort of filthy parahuman ability is taken.

3) Refugee! A 'accidental' mutant human from the Arcology who is forced to flee! After living on the ragged edge in the gutters of the Arcology, this character has been part of the underclass, living like rats under the streets and in abandoned buildings and unobserved corners. Always dodging detection due to genetic impurities, the character is finally forced to flee to the nigh-mythical outside...a land that seems like paradise in comparison. At first. 

4) Renegade! An agent of the AI's who somehow manages to transcend the obedience engrams and become a free-willed being. Could be a cybered up gene-mod or an actual humanoid robot with true AI. While grappling with existential questions, this character joins the fight against the Machine...either to bring freedom to the others under its rule...or because even AI's are oppressed, individually, by being slaved to the dictates of the massive central processors!

So many ideas...are there documents for d20 Apocalypse online? An SRD?


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## Voda Vosa (Sep 15, 2007)

"There probably won't be any sentient plants or animals. Sorry." I didn't understood that =P


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## Jemal (Sep 15, 2007)

So, what system is this using then? I find it very interesting, but don't have d20 future/apoc, only modern..  Your use of the term "progress level" confuses me, as I've never encountered it before.  I presume it refers to technology?

Is it possible to play with the modern rules if you're using future/apoc?


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## Shayuri (Sep 15, 2007)

D20 Modern and Future are both on an SRD.

Apocalypse, from what I can tell, doesn't really have much in the way of unique rules, so it shouldn't be too much of an issue. The main item of interest would be the Advanced Classes in it, and even then there's really only two that are new.

So no worries.


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## Insight (Sep 15, 2007)

Jemal said:
			
		

> So, what system is this using then? I find it very interesting, but don't have d20 future/apoc, only modern..  Your use of the term "progress level" confuses me, as I've never encountered it before.  I presume it refers to technology?
> 
> Is it possible to play with the modern rules if you're using future/apoc?




Yes, you could play in this game with only D20 Modern if you wish.  Your character would likely be living in the Wasteland, probably born there, with little knowledge of modern advances.  

That said, I believe at least some of the D20 Future material is available thru the SRD.


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## Insight (Sep 15, 2007)

Shayuri said:
			
		

> Beautiful! Thank you!
> 
> As usual, when presented with hugely cool game concepts, my brain spits up not one character, but a litter. I'll narrow 'em down, but if any of them strike you (or anyone else) as being particularly fun-sounding or inappropriate to the game let me know and I'll factor that into which one I wind up developing as a full PC.
> 
> ...




This sounds like a good concept.  I don't foresee any problems there.



> 2) Scavenger with a secret! A self-sufficient wasteland wanderer who makes a living trawling what ruins are (reasonably) safe to enter and retrieving artifacts and supplies to sell to merchant centers. No visible mutations, but conceals some abilities in the interests of not running afoul of the Purity as well as maintaining a professional edge. Both envies and pities the denizens of the Arcology, who have so many amenities, yet so little freedoms. Fears that one day the Machine will overrun everything... Most likely this would be a stealthy shooter type in terms of combat role...a lot also depends on what sort of filthy parahuman ability is taken.




Again, this looks fine and would fit in with the setting.  Your character could make a fair amount of money / trade for a plethora of valuable goods and services if he were a reliable transporter.



> 3) Refugee! A 'accidental' mutant human from the Arcology who is forced to flee! After living on the ragged edge in the gutters of the Arcology, this character has been part of the underclass, living like rats under the streets and in abandoned buildings and unobserved corners. Always dodging detection due to genetic impurities, the character is finally forced to flee to the nigh-mythical outside...a land that seems like paradise in comparison. At first.




A character who's been on the 'inside' would likely be very valuable to the group as a whole, if the idea I have for the game sticks.



> 4) Renegade! An agent of the AI's who somehow manages to transcend the obedience engrams and become a free-willed being. Could be a cybered up gene-mod or an actual humanoid robot with true AI. While grappling with existential questions, this character joins the fight against the Machine...either to bring freedom to the others under its rule...or because even AI's are oppressed, individually, by being slaved to the dictates of the massive central processors!




I like the idea of a robot who turns against The Machine.  I don't want more than one of these, but on the whole, it sounds like an interesting RP opportunity.  Your character would be a pariah, distrusted everywhere you go, trying desperately to understand humans and the society that exists beyond the arcology walls.



> So many ideas...are there documents for d20 Apocalypse online? An SRD?




I don't think so.  D20 Apocalypse is closed content.  :\ 

I'm not planning to include a ton of game mechanics from the closed content books, and when I have to, I'll post the relevant info so that those of you without the books don't suffer.


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## Kaodi (Sep 15, 2007)

I was thinking of a almost normal looking mutant who is skilled in building, repairing, salvaging and using all sorts of vehicles. Perhaps a bit of a nomad, he is working on vehicles and mecha designed to be able to traverse the most hazardous areas of the Wastelands.


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## Insight (Sep 15, 2007)

Kaodi said:
			
		

> I was thinking of a almost normal looking mutant who is skilled in building, repairing, salvaging and using all sorts of vehicles. Perhaps a bit of a nomad, he is working on vehicles and mecha designed to be able to traverse the most hazardous areas of the Wastelands.




No mecha, but the other stuff, yes.  Sounds like a useful character.  Mecha are well beyond the PL for this game.


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## Shayuri (Sep 15, 2007)

Kaodi said:
			
		

> I was thinking of a almost normal looking mutant who is skilled in building, repairing, salvaging and using all sorts of vehicles. Perhaps a bit of a nomad, he is working on vehicles and mecha designed to be able to traverse the most hazardous areas of the Wastelands.




Hmm! It might be cool if some of the PC's knew each other before game start. I could see this idea and my wasteland scavenger concept working well together.


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## Insight (Sep 15, 2007)

Shayuri said:
			
		

> Hmm! It might be cool if some of the PC's knew each other before game start. I could see this idea and my wasteland scavenger concept working well together.




I would prefer that the characters knew each other (or knew _of_ each other) prior to start, or at the very least, lived in/operated in the same general area.


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## Drerek (Sep 15, 2007)

I'd probably go with a guy who is the weapons expert:  
Chain gun: check
RPG: check
Mini-nuke:  ...... now where did I put that thing?

I don't plan on him being stupid, but merely of the belief that force is the primary method of accomplishing goals.  There is no compromise and no quarter, although surprise and stealth tactics as a means to the end of blowing the bad guys to kingdom come is perfectly acceptable.

I have to look up the d20 future SRD now.


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## Jemal (Sep 16, 2007)

Two concepts : 
A) Standard Rough & Tumble survivor guy with an axe and a BFG. ()
B) Mutant Telepath.


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## Shayuri (Sep 16, 2007)

Dude. Chainsaw for an arm. Shotgun. You know you want to. 

Hmm! I guess d20 Modern doesn't let you take PrC's from non d20 Modern...I'd love to play a pyrokineticist in this setting, but that's a D&D class.

Maybe a battlemind...hurm.


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## Voda Vosa (Sep 16, 2007)

So my character would be like Charles Xavier? =P


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## Jemal (Sep 16, 2007)

I don't think I'd have it attached to the arm, but I could substitute a Chainsaw for the Axe... Assuming we have gas.

That would definitely be.... Groovy.


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## Moon_Goddess (Sep 16, 2007)

I don't wanna have a chainsaw for an arm but I'd like to play a cyborg from one of the arcologieses.   Is that passible?  does the progress level support cybernetics?


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## Insight (Sep 16, 2007)

To answer a few questions...

No FX abilities at start beyond the mutations as presented in D20 Future.  Characters will not have access to magic or psionics right off the bat.  That doesn't mean there will never be magic or psionics, but not right away.

Cybernetics are definitely a possibility.  Read the basics in D20 Future (or the online SRD), and note that I'll be using D20 Cyberscape as well - expanded list of enhancements et al.

The game is PL 6, but some PL 7 cyberware and robotics are available to the rich and connected.  I'll present the rules on how to acquire 'experimental' and 'bleeding edge' gear at a later time.


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## Shayuri (Sep 16, 2007)

Hurm.

Are there any classes or prestige classes that have more mutation points?

It's gonna be really hard to do a mutant concept when the only source of MP's is flaws...


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## Insight (Sep 16, 2007)

Shayuri said:
			
		

> Hurm.
> 
> Are there any classes or prestige classes that have more mutation points?
> 
> It's gonna be really hard to do a mutant concept when the only source of MP's is flaws...




Well, that's kinda the point.  The flaws are a balancing factor.  Otherwise, you'd be taking on a level adjustment.

I'm not aware of a class that allows more mutations, but I'd need to check D20 Apoc to know for sure (that seems the most likely place to have such things).


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## Caliber (Sep 16, 2007)

A trader type, mutant. Think traveling salesman, riding through the waste, making money where he can.


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## Shayuri (Sep 16, 2007)

Hmm...I managed to sneak a peek at Apocalypse. Seems there might be a few options.

I dunno if we're starting at 1st level or what, but if LA is possible, they have a guideline of 8 MP for +1 LA...

They also allow a feat to be purchased for 5 MP...maybe you can spend a feat to gain 5 MP? Didn't have time to read in detail. Just brainstorming...


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## Insight (Sep 16, 2007)

Shayuri said:
			
		

> Hmm...I managed to sneak a peek at Apocalypse. Seems there might be a few options.
> 
> I dunno if we're starting at 1st level or what, but if LA is possible, they have a guideline of 8 MP for +1 LA...
> 
> They also allow a feat to be purchased for 5 MP...maybe you can spend a feat to gain 5 MP? Didn't have time to read in detail. Just brainstorming...




Probably starting above 1st level, so the basics of what you posted should be OK, but I need to read the specifics.  I don't have my copy of D20 Apoc right now, but I'll post something when I've had a chance to look at it.


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## Jemal (Sep 16, 2007)

so if telepath is a no-go, then what's the biggest gun I can get?


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## Voda Vosa (Sep 16, 2007)

Do not judge by size, remember MIB


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## Drerek (Sep 16, 2007)

Does d20 Modern have feats every 3 levels and attribute point increases every 4?


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## Insight (Sep 16, 2007)

Drerek said:
			
		

> Does d20 Modern have feats every 3 levels and attribute point increases every 4?




Yes.  In addition to that, your base class gives you feats from a select group every even-numbered level.


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## Caliber (Sep 16, 2007)

I know in GammaWorld d20, extra feats/talents were given for each of the base classes to select from. Is there anything like that in d20 Apoc? I looked through the SRD but couldn't find anything like that for d20 Future.


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## Necro_Kinder (Sep 17, 2007)

How about a character born in the Arcologies and cyberneticly or genetically enhanced by the Machines. He's escaped into the Wastes and is on the run, and hopes to bring down the Machines someday.


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## Insight (Sep 17, 2007)

Necro_Kinder said:
			
		

> How about a character born in the Arcologies and cyberneticly or genetically enhanced by the Machines. He's escaped into the Wastes and is on the run, and hopes to bring down the Machines someday.




Nothing wrong with that concept.


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## Jemal (Sep 17, 2007)

Voda Vosa said:
			
		

> Do not judge by size, remember MIB




Tiny Cricket's a nice little toy, but if I'm gonna be blasting toasters, I want a BFG.  It's the thought that counts. 


BTW, was there a link to d20 Future?  I can't find the SRD


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## Insight (Sep 17, 2007)

The D20 Future material that's open content is on the WOTC site somewhere.  I'll see if I can find it.

BINGO


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## Insight (Sep 17, 2007)

I'm planning to start a recruitment thread soon, so watch for it.  Just waiting to get my D20 Apocalypse back from someone.


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## Voda Vosa (Sep 17, 2007)

If we where to start creating pcs how much points do we use?


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## Insight (Sep 17, 2007)

Voda Vosa said:
			
		

> If we where to start creating pcs how much points do we use?




I haven't decided yet.  All pertinent character creation guidelines of that nature will be provided in the recruitment thread.


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## Drerek (Sep 19, 2007)

You haven't posted the recruitment thread have you?  I wouldn't want to miss it.


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## Insight (Sep 20, 2007)

No recruitment thread yet.  I still need to get my D20 Apocalypse and see if there's anything in there that I've missed.


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## Jemal (Sep 23, 2007)

Many apologies for my unscheduled dissapearance, I was only supposed to be gone for a day or two but couldn't get back until now.

Still don't see the recruitment thread, though, so guess I'm not too late.


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## Insight (Sep 23, 2007)

I appreciate the interest, guys, but I'm still not quite ready to do this.  I'll post a recruitment thread when I have what I need to get started.


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## Insight (Sep 25, 2007)

I think I'm going to drastically change what I had planned for this game.  I'm still interested in running a post-apoc game, but I want to put less of a burden on myself to get this game rolling.  More info to come soon.

What I want to do is make it purely PA and not so much dark future.  If I make the game too hard to start and run, I'll just give up on it.  Just trying to be realistic here.  I'll need a few more days to process and I should have something to present to potential players.


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## Shayuri (Sep 25, 2007)

Arr, I be still interested. PA's always good.


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## WarShrike (Sep 25, 2007)

Heyas. 

Jumping on the band-wagon a bit late. Like this idea. Love Fallout. 

Was wondering if a sorta shapeshifting mutant would fit in. Like being able to grow natural weapons like claws, spines, scales or armored shell sorta stuff, or change body build between biped and quadruped. Abilities powered by radiation, allowing greater versatility the stronger the rads are, and vice versa. 

WarShrike


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## Insight (Sep 25, 2007)

WarShrike said:
			
		

> Heyas.
> 
> Jumping on the band-wagon a bit late. Like this idea. Love Fallout.
> 
> ...




I'm not entirely certain mutants as such will be part of this.  We'll see.


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