# Best Weapon for a Swordmage?



## Rechan (Oct 12, 2008)

Title says it all.

What is the best weapon for a Swordmage to use? 

Since he needs his off hand to be free to get that fat +3 to AC, I would assume the best weapon would be a one-handed weapon.

When considering this question, I want to point out two things.

1) The Swordmage is not _limited_ to light and heavy blades, he merely is proficient in those. You can take feats for other weapons.

2) With that said, the Swordmage uses light and heavy blades as his _implement_. So even if you picked up a maul, you'd still need some sort of blade to carry out your implement-keyword powers.


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## aurance (Oct 12, 2008)

Depends on how you want to build him.

In no order:

- Bastard sword, for power accuracy and defense.

- Scimitar, for higher DPR at paragon+ levels (although it's incredibly difficult to arrange a suitable ability array for Scimitar Dance, for a swordmage). Alternatively, fullblade for offense to spare you the crazy stat requirements of scimitar.

- Glaive, if you want reach.

- Long sword, if you are going to multiclass from Wizard.


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## Rechan (Oct 12, 2008)

aurance said:


> Glaive, if you want reach.



But a glaive is two-handed. So you lose your +3 to AC.



> - Long sword, if you are going to multiclass from Wizard.



This one, I don't get. What does a longsword have to do with a wizard?


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## aurance (Oct 12, 2008)

The +3 AC option is just an option. Some people prefer to use a two handed weapon anyway, for reach or harder hitting Aegis of Assault. Afterall you still get the +1 to AC. It's up to you.

Long sword can be used as an implement for both wizard spells and swordmage spells, if you take the Wizard of the Spiral Tower paragon path.


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## 1of3 (Oct 12, 2008)

Spiked Shield and free off-hand. Full Swordmage Warding AND shield bonus to AC. It's an Implement, too.


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## aurance (Oct 12, 2008)

1of3 said:


> Spiked Shield and free off-hand. Full Swordmage Warding AND shield bonus to AC. It's an Implement, too.




Ahh yes, this too, for maximum defense.


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## That One Guy (Oct 12, 2008)

..soo... the ultimate cheese hand-jiving would be quickdrawing a Full blade off of the ground, moving, attacking, dropping it, and then repeating. Possibly trying to quickdraw a parrying dagger or spiked shield at the end would be cumbersome, but more effective for the cheese. (Granted, multiples would have to be carried)

Please note, this was suggested with a sad sad grin. While pretty much legal, I would try to impale a person with their own dice if they tried it.

In seriousness, khopesh, bastard, and longsword seem like sound options. If one has a free feat, Bastard is probably one of the best options. Khopesh is a decent weapon, and it's a paragon feat away from high crit (assuming a strong Str/Con swordmage). A brutal 1, high crit, versatile +2 Prof, 1D8 is quite nice combined with HBO & Booming Blade for fun. Free action to change hand usage, so +1 damage all the time. While scimitar dance would be a good feat, the Dex 17 is pretty much impossible for the swordmage without gimping oneself.


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## Mirtek (Oct 12, 2008)

Rechan said:


> Title says it all.
> 
> What is the best weapon for a Swordmage to use?
> 
> ...



If you use other weapons you completly lose your swordmage warding, you won't even get the reduced +1 warding anymore.


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## Ravingdork (Oct 13, 2008)

That One Guy said:


> ..soo... the ultimate cheese hand-jiving would be quickdrawing a Full blade off of the ground, moving, attacking, dropping it, and then repeating. Possibly trying to quickdraw a parrying dagger or spiked shield at the end would be cumbersome, but more effective for the cheese. (Granted, multiples would have to be carried)




I don't think you can quick draw an item that is on the ground--only those items on your person.


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## Cadfan (Oct 13, 2008)

That One Guy said:


> ..soo... the ultimate cheese hand-jiving would be quickdrawing a Full blade off of the ground, moving, attacking, dropping it, and then repeating. Possibly trying to quickdraw a parrying dagger or spiked shield at the end would be cumbersome, but more effective for the cheese. (Granted, multiples would have to be carried)
> 
> Please note, this was suggested with a sad sad grin. While pretty much legal, I would try to impale a person with their own dice if they tried it.



The real problem is that you don't get the +3 ac if you aren't wielding anything at all.  You have to be wielding a one handed blade.

Seriously, a longsword works just fine.  A fair amount of your powers won't use your weapon's bonus, so its not that big of a deal.  If you have to, you can cheese it up with a handjive.  If you intend to hand jive, a two handed weapon (greatsword) provides basically no advantage at all, so just stick with the versatile weapon.


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## Remathilis (Oct 13, 2008)

My genasi swordmage is using a broadsword from Adventurer's Vault (+2, 1d10, versatile)


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## Arivendel (Oct 13, 2008)

Well if you ask me i would say double sword, the AC becomes +1 but then you get the bonus of Defensive, add to that two weapon defense for the extra +1 so you can retain the +3 to AC you wanted.

The reason i mention Double Sword is because i like to multiclass into Ranger sometimes.


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## Caliban (Oct 13, 2008)

Generally, you want to use a Versatile blade - usually a Longsword or Bastard Sword for the +3 proficiency bonus. 

The advantage is that you can take a two-handed grip when attacking for +1 damage, then using a free action to take a single-weapon grip to get the extra +2 AC.

Only downside is if you get hit with an Immediate Interrupt or Opportunity Attack - you will be down 2 AC while you attack.


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## Engilbrand (Oct 13, 2008)

It all depends. For me, I created a Stormsoul Genasi Swordmage with the Shard of Myrdoon. The Shard is a spear with a lot of lightning powers. From what the players saw in the few rounds that he pounded on them, they really liked it. The Warlock now uses it.
Basically, choose a weapon that has some kind of overlap with your main abilities.


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## inati (Oct 13, 2008)

I'm a big fan of the Khopesh for my swordmage.  The Brutal property has paid big dividends for me in my games.

Using a spiked shield is an interesting proposition, but wouldn't that require two feats (one for light shield prof, one for spiked shield) in order to gain the benefits?  +1 AC/Reflex combined with a 1d6 weapon seems to be a terrible waste of feats and weapon selection for a swordmage.

Where are people getting this '+1 damage' from for two handed grips?  I don't recall this being anywhere in 4E...


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## DracoSuave (Oct 13, 2008)

inati said:


> Where are people getting this '+1 damage' from for two handed grips?  I don't recall this being anywhere in 4E...




It's the 'versatile' ability of some weapons.


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## inati (Oct 13, 2008)

Wow, and here I've been missing out on that rule for months.  Thanks


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## Gloombunny (Oct 13, 2008)

inati said:


> Using a spiked shield is an interesting proposition, but wouldn't that require two feats (one for light shield prof, one for spiked shield) in order to gain the benefits?  +1 AC/Reflex combined with a 1d6 weapon seems to be a terrible waste of feats and weapon selection for a swordmage.



The spiked shield's entry doesn't say anything about needing other proficiencies as a prerequisite.  It looks to me like you just spend a feat on Weapon Proficiency: Spiked Shield and now it's a shield that you're proficient with, so you get the AC/Reflex bonus.  (But you wouldn't get anything from a regular light shield.)


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## Baumi (Oct 13, 2008)

Gloombunny said:


> The spiked shield's entry doesn't say anything about needing other proficiencies as a prerequisite.  It looks to me like you just spend a feat on Weapon Proficiency: Spiked Shield and now it's a shield that you're proficient with, so you get the AC/Reflex bonus.  (But you wouldn't get anything from a regular light shield.)




I'm quite sure that you need to learn the light shield proficiency before or it would be quite unbalanced, since you don't need any prerequisites (Shield Proficiency needs Str 13) and it is simply superior to a regular shield thanks to the attached Weapon and the same defense-bonus.


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## Donovan Morningfire (Oct 13, 2008)

The Eladrin Swordmage in my Saturday group went with the longsword and took the Eladrin Soldier feat for added goodness.  And since the vast majority of her attack effects have the weapon keyword, she gets the +2 damage bonus on pretty much everything, and with the +3 attack bonus from the weapon, she also does a pretty good job of hitting her targets, and her general damage output is on par with my Human broadsword'n'board Fighter.

So based on that, I'm gonna have to suggest a longsword if you want that +3 AC bonus.  She almost considered a bastard sword, but felt that if she was going to spend a feat, she might as play to her race.


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## Klaus (Oct 13, 2008)

Rechan said:


> But a glaive is two-handed. So you lose your +3 to AC.
> 
> 
> This one, I don't get. What does a longsword have to do with a wizard?



Swordmage -> Multi into wizard -> Wizard of the Spiral Tower -> Longsword becomes wizard implement, nifty sword powers.


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## Danceofmasks (Oct 13, 2008)

Main class has to be wizard.
Spiral Tower only allows a longsword to function as an implement the wizard _specialises_ in.


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