# Suggest some improvements!



## Morrus (Dec 9, 2002)

I thought I'd give everyone a chance to suggest some improvements to the site.

Before we start, though, there is a caveat - I'm NOT talking about large, sweeping changes.  I'm referring to little things - maybe something has vanished in the last year or so that you miss, or maybe you can think of a useful little addition.  

For example - a few people recently have told me they miss the WotC Product Schedule on the main page.  That's the sort of thing we're talking about here, not a whole new section or system.  Things I can do (relatively) easily.

Oh, and a request - could we try not to make this one of those "let's all thank Morrus" threads?  While I certainly do appreciate them, that would kind of clutter up this thread.  So let's stick to suggesting improvements, as opposed to saying what you already like about the site.  Thanks!


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## Terraism (Dec 9, 2002)

First thing that comes to mind is the avatars - I _really_ liked having those.  On the other hand, if they'd become a problem (I'm not sure because my "time on boards" dropped down to about five minutes a day for a while there,) it's not a big deal.  But chalk one up who likes the things.


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## orbitalfreak (Dec 9, 2002)

Give members read-only access to the super-secret moderators-only forum?  

On a serious note, I second the "avatar" suggestion.


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## jgbrowning (Dec 9, 2002)

*reviews*

Don't know if I'm dumb, but I can't seem to find a link back to the home page when in the greeting page of the reviews.

Wow, typing one-handed really slows you down, but improves spelling and grammar.

Messy cheeto hand,

Joe B.


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## Terraism (Dec 9, 2002)

*Re: reviews*



			
				jgbrowning said:
			
		

> *Wow, typing one-handed really slows you down, but improves spelling and grammar.*



I've noticed the same thing...


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## tleilaxu (Dec 9, 2002)

maybe time to change the background color?


oooh oooh...  weekly top ten lists... 

EX: for the week of Dec 8: Top Ten NWN modules, or
Dec 15: Top Ten d20 Demon and Devil suppliments (since there are at least ten of them out there)...

SOmething like that, similar to Monte's Raves and Rants, but make it the universal poll of the week


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## Darkness (Dec 9, 2002)

tleilaxu said:
			
		

> *maybe time to change the background color? *



Of the news page or the boards?

'cause I still like the background color better than that on, well, just about any other board out there...


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## tleilaxu (Dec 9, 2002)

i don't mind the color, i think it is fine, but maybe a change would spice things up...

Dec 22: Top Ten 1e modules


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## hong (Dec 9, 2002)

*Re: reviews*



			
				jgbrowning said:
			
		

> *
> Wow, typing one-handed really slows you down, but improves spelling and grammar.
> 
> Messy cheeto hand,
> *




Is "messy cheetos" what they're calling it these days?

Kids.


Hong "messy cheetos... with mayo!" Ooi


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## Blacksway (Dec 9, 2002)

*Re: reviews*



			
				jgbrowning said:
			
		

> *Don't know if I'm dumb, but I can't seem to find a link back to the home page when in the greeting page of the reviews.
> 
> Joe B.    *



You mean the link "Back to EnWorld", second option on the menu on the left?

Sorry, back to the improvements list...


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## jgbrowning (Dec 9, 2002)

*Re: Re: reviews*



			
				Blacksway said:
			
		

> *
> You mean the link "Back to EnWorld", second option on the menu on the left?
> 
> Sorry, back to the improvements list... *





yah!

Wow, Morrus you're really fast.... Thanks!


joe b.


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## dcollins (Dec 9, 2002)

(1) A link to the SRD at the top of the D&D Rules forum.

(2) A switch away from the Pepsi-esque holiday logo (see also here: http://enworld.cyberstreet.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=32851 )


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## Sir Osis of Liver (Dec 9, 2002)

> 1) A link to the SRD at the top of the D&D Rules forum.




That'd be cool in the house rules forum too.

I was also wondering about the status on Avatars.

The return of the wizards product scedule would be nice. I also have a soft place in my heart for your message board round ups, I'd love to see those pop up more often.


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## alsih2o (Dec 9, 2002)

perchance a small thumbnail changed every week or couple of weeks that represents something cool happening in the art gallery?

 it would reek of visitor involvement and lend a cool graphic to the front page


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## Knight Otu (Dec 9, 2002)

i second the call for the SRD and avatars.

The art gallery sounds nice, but could be somewhat hard to implement.

[sidenote]No more custom title changes, alsih2o?[/sidenote]


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## Morrus (Dec 9, 2002)

OK, suggestions so far:

1) Avatars.  This will happen some time, but I have to manually delete the entries (one at a time) for about 1000-odd avatars which got lost in one of the server moves.  I haven't yet been able to face that task! But it's going to happen, don't worry. 

2) Top 10 Lists.  I quite like that idea.  May work as a poll on the main page.  Any suggestions as to subject matter?

3) Background colour.  Nah, that's staying the same.  I'm kinda attached to it in a foolish sentimental way. 

4) SRD links.  vB doesn't actually allow for individual announcements at the top of each forum - instead it used sticky threads.  I don't mind putting a sticky thread in those forums though.

5) Logo.  Staying the same, sorry!  The one thread about the logo turned into a religious debate.

6) Messageboard roundup.  Okey dokey, I'll start doing them again.  I wasn't sure whether they were popular or not.

7) WotC product schedule.  Is this something that most people want?  If so, I'll put it back on the main page.

8) Art gallery thingy.  Hmmm, sounds a little ambitious, to be honest.


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## KnowTheToe (Dec 9, 2002)

Morrus said:
			
		

> *
> 
> 
> 
> ...




On point 5.  I thought that was the funniest degradation of a thread ever.  Who would of thought so much could come from a red hat.

On point seven, I kinda miss the WoTC List, I don't know why, but I do.


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## Blacksway (Dec 9, 2002)

WotC schedule: yeah, this seems to have been missed... hence TalonComic's posts in the d20 publishers list recently...


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## Ravellion (Dec 9, 2002)

KnowTheToe said:
			
		

> *
> On point seven, I kinda miss the WoTC List, I don't know why, but I do. *



Perhaps a link to the WotC schedule would serve better, or a link to a page with a matrix table of scheduled releases of several companies in the upcoming months, with months going down the y axis and companis being listed on the x axis.

Rav


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## Blacksway (Dec 9, 2002)

> Perhaps a link to the WotC schedule would serve better, or a link to a page with a matrix table of scheduled releases of several companies in the upcoming months, with months going down the y axis and companis being listed on the x axis.



Sounds a bit like what the D20Reviews "Upcoming" page already does. If you want to suggest improvements to this page then let me know.

http://www.enworld.org/reviews/upcoming.php


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## HellHound (Dec 9, 2002)

NICE redesign on the reviews main page. Looks VERY clean and sharp without being a complete rebuild.


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## Blacksway (Dec 9, 2002)

x 10

Thanks


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## alsih2o (Dec 9, 2002)

Morrus said:
			
		

> *8) Art gallery thingy.  Hmmm, sounds a little ambitious, to be honest. *




 i honestly have/had no idea what this takes time or tech wise. i just thunked it would be enjoyable \

 [sidenote]we will have to see, wars have lulls[/sidenote]


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## Dagger75 (Dec 9, 2002)

The WoTC product schedule would rock.


 Also, how about a featured  link of the day.  There are tons of D&D3e sites out there. Even other peoples home campaigns.  I probably miss tons of them.  

 Just my 2 platnum.  (My thoughts are more valuable than yours   )

  Edit: I saw a poll again on the main page. Maybe I should go there more than once every other day


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## Buttercup (Dec 10, 2002)

I'll add my vote for the WotC product schedule and the message board roundup!


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## Terraism (Dec 10, 2002)

I always liked the roundups, too.  Another vote for those.


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## tleilaxu (Dec 10, 2002)

2 dumb questions
1. what is SRD?
2. what constitutes a msg board "roundup"?


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## GnomeWorks (Dec 10, 2002)

*Moderators...*

I don't know if this fits here, and I am also uncertain of how these kind of requests work...

I think that, after looking at the lists of those who mod throughout the boards, that the four people (Darkness, Dinkeldog, Henry, nemmerle) who mod the General boards are also modding... 14 other boards.

That's just a few too many, I'm thinking.

My request is that - at least for the IC and YB forums - that a few people who are "regulars" to those forums be promoted to mods of those forums.

For the IC forum, I would say creamsteak and Sollir Furryfoot for mods.  They are almost always present there, and both are involved in many of the games.  I'm uncertain about the YB forum, as I'm less involved there.

However, I am certain that the other boards would also appreciate more mods.

This isn't a complaint about the mods - just that there seem to be very few of them spread out over a large number of forums, and that some things that need some attention suffer because of the small number of mods.

Sorry if I'm overstepping any bounds here...


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## garyh (Dec 10, 2002)

*Re: Moderators...*



			
				GnomeWorks said:
			
		

> *My request is that - at least for the IC and YB forums - that a few people who are "regulars" to those forums be promoted to mods of those forums.
> 
> For the IC forum, I would say creamsteak and Sollir Furryfoot for mods.  They are almost always present there, and both are involved in many of the games.*




What am I?  Chopped liver?   

I was wondering a couple days ago if the mods even went to the IC forum, actually.  I don't recall ever seeing them there.  Of course, we just play there, so there's never been flame wares or other unpleasantness that would necessitate a mod.

EDIT:  Nothing against Sollir and CS, I must say.  They're both stand up guys, and would make good mods.


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## Liquide (Dec 10, 2002)

Blacksway said:
			
		

> * x 10
> 
> Thanks *




Just you take care of my baby will you lad, she do hold a very dear place in my heart.

Don't kill her you hear, don't you dare kill her.


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## Morrus (Dec 10, 2002)

OK, so we now have avatars, SRD links and WotC's upcoming schedule all done.  Getting there.


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## Chun-tzu (Dec 11, 2002)

I didn't think the logo thing really got out of hand in any way, but YMMV. Everyone seemed to be trying to pre-empt any "this is not fair" responses, and no one responded that way.

Anyway, here are a couple ideas stolen from a comic board I used to frequent. One is a "question of the week" for the General RPG board, where questions are submitted by posters (to the mods) for open discussion. This may seem superfluous, but I think it stimulates posters to think about interesting discussion topics, and may add a bit more emphasis to those topics.

The other thing that was done on that board was (and I don't know how you'd feel about this, given the logo debate) a banner of the week. We have a lot of graphics-savvy posters here, who would probably submit some interesting EN World banners. Of course, which ones actually get chosen are up to the mods. You might do this on just one forum, if not all of them.


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## Dakhran the Dark (Dec 11, 2002)

There's already alot of great features online, it'd be hard to improve on it...

Perhaps a release schedule could be tied into a version of the PostCalendar block for the main page...


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## tleilaxu (Dec 11, 2002)

tleilaxu points up at his unanswered questions....


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## Morrus (Dec 11, 2002)

tleilaxu said:
			
		

> *2 dumb questions
> 1. what is SRD?
> 2. what constitutes a msg board "roundup"? *




1.  Well, you now know where to find the SRD, so why don't you take a look? 

2.  It's where I post a news item pointing out some interesting threads on the messageboards.


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## Dragongirl (Dec 11, 2002)

How about hide the Moderators Only forum so no one can even see it existis hehe.  Keep seeing people want to look in it.  If your version of this BB is the same as the free one in that regard it is not hard to hide a forum from all that can't post in it.


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## Liquide (Dec 11, 2002)

Pardon the high-jacking

Check your e-mail DragonGirl


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## tleilaxu (Dec 11, 2002)

hey chun, your avatar has a very good meaning. do you know what it is?

i may switch mine to a character as well... hope you don't mind


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## Chun-tzu (Dec 11, 2002)

tleilaxu said:
			
		

> *hey chun, your avatar has a very good meaning. do you know what it is?
> 
> i may switch mine to a character as well... hope you don't mind  *




Yes, I chose the character based on the meaning. For anyone interested, it means "compassion." The world could certainly use more of it. I will probably change it in a few weeks, but may stick with the Chinese character theme.

But I don't recognize your avatar, tleilaxu (my Chinese is extremely limited). What does it mean?


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## tleilaxu (Dec 11, 2002)

um, i've changed it a couple of times. right now it is the simplified version of "ma" or horse, but I am looking for a page that has traditional character animations as we speak...


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## tleilaxu (Dec 12, 2002)

*the most awesome suggestion ever*

there was a whole thread about this about a month ago:

Morrus, for the reviews section, in addition to the 1-5 ranking could you please add something that says "This product is rated higher than n% of other products reviewed on ENworld". Also perhaps a comparitive rating of the books that cover similar territory:

Example: 'Of sound mind' has an average ranking of X. This is better than n% of all suppliments ranked on ENworld, is better than n% of 1st level adventures and n% of psionic suppliments.

Book of Righteous might is ranked better than 100% of all suppliments, and better than 100% of all religion suppliments.


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## Dragongirl (Dec 14, 2002)

I would like to suggest a link to reviews on the news page that is not buried in the menu.   A nice button near the top would be peachy.


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## johnsemlak (Dec 14, 2002)

My suggestions


(I made this suggestion a long time ago) Improve the search options in the d20 reviews guide.  Establish 'product categories' such as Fantasy setting, Fighter splatbook, high/mid/low level adventure, etc.  Allow for category overlap.  

(also RE reviews site)Also allow people to search for PDF products

(also RE reviews site)Provide a 'Back to Main Enworld" link at the d20 reviews site. (I can't find one)

Will think of some more later.  I've had various ideas but don't remember them now.  I have wanted to see the D&D links section expanded, but as I see that is being done.


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## johnsemlak (Dec 14, 2002)

Dragongirl said:
			
		

> *I would like to suggest a link to reviews on the news page that is not buried in the menu.   A nice button near the top would be peachy. *




I would add that the messageboard link could be more prominantly displayed.

Another way to make the more popular links more prominite would be to enlarge and/or boldface them.


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## Blacksway (Dec 14, 2002)

johnsemlak said:
			
		

> *My suggestions
> 
> 
> (also RE reviews site)Also allow people to search for PDF products
> ...




1) This, or something similiar is in the pipe-line
2) Why can no-one ever see the link, top of the main menu that says "Back to ENWorld"?


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## johnsemlak (Dec 14, 2002)

Blacksway said:
			
		

> *
> 2) Why can no-one ever see the link, top of the main menu that says "Back to ENWorld"? *




Ahh, sorry.  I'm not sure why I didn't know about that. I think I tried it a while ago and it didn't work or something, and since then I've assumed there wasn't such a link.

However, it would be nice if the big "Enworld" logo at the top of the reviews page was a link to the main news site (which would be more consistant with the rest of ENworld).


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## BigFreekinGoblinoid (Dec 15, 2002)

*Links to Errata?*

Not a new idea, but one that seems to have stalled: I often never hear about errata for a product or a relevant web enhancement.  It would be useful to have links to these things from the appropriate ENWorld Reviews Product description page. 

I think this is supposed to be happening, thus the header that reads "Previews, errata, enhancements and other links".  They don't seem to get posted here very often though. 

Here's a sample page if I'm not explaining myself well, and you're not sure what I'm talking about:

http://enworld.cyberstreet.com/reviews/index.php?sub=yes&where=currentprod&which=SatS


From reading another thread here it looks like the trend for the future is to have the publisher ( when possible ) add product info to the upcoming product lists - Perhaps they can add their own links for samples, errata and enhancements too?


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## Blacksway (Dec 15, 2002)

Yes indeed, that is the trend, to get as many people as possible updating the products of their own accord.

Lots more work is being done in this very area as we speak


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## Liquide (Dec 15, 2002)

Even though I dun work with the d20reviews any more I make sure BlackSway treats my baby right  , and my suggestions you do know about already.


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## Sir Osis of Liver (Dec 16, 2002)

Well, we've has some cool improvents today, but wouldn't it be better if Gamers seeking gamers and marketplace were in the non rpg specific group?

and how about putting house rules into bits n pieces then renaming that group DM toolkit?


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## tleilaxu (Dec 17, 2002)

morrus, you planning on responding to any of the recent suggestions or is this thread gone by the wayside?


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## Piratecat (Dec 17, 2002)

Of course it hasn't gone by the wayside. He can't do everything simultaneously.


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## InShambles (Dec 17, 2002)

Fix the messageboard clock.


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## Piratecat (Dec 17, 2002)

Tell me about it; I've notified them twice. Sheesh.


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## AaronLoeb (Dec 17, 2002)

*Review Scores*

I would suggest basing the overall review score for products on the... oooh, I always get these wrong... median (I think) rather than the mean. The one where you drop the highest and the lowest and average the ones in-between. That way, one crap review couldn't tank a great product and one super pie-in-the-sky review couldn't pull a lousy product out of the "stay away at all costs" territory. There's always one person out there willing to write a completely off-base review just to affect the score. Two are harder to find.

And, for the record, this is something I've always thought would be a good idea, before I had a book reviewed here. 

AJL


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## Blacksway (Dec 17, 2002)

Review system suggestions:

Ranking (tleilaxu's suggestion):
This relies on a) the rating system meaning more than it does, and by this I mean that at the moment we use a 1-5 system, which gives some indication of how much someone liked or disliked a product, but it is the actual review you should be worried about not the rating. Do have something being better than X% of other supplements doesn't really mean that much and further pushes the rating to the fore rather than the review. This is only my opinion on the whole rating/percentage/out of 10/5 thing of course. It also would reply on b) johnsemlak's suggestion...

Categories (johnsemlak's suggestion):
This one is a good suggestion in priniciple, unfortunately it suffers from many practical problems. 1) it is technically complex, 2) who decides what the categories are/called? 3) who goes through putting all the products into the categories? Trust me - if we run out of other things to do then we'll serisouly consider this, just don't hold your breath 

Search enhancements (the other half of johnsemlak's suggestion):
There are some search enhancements in the pipeline 

Average not being average? (AaronLoeb's suggestion):
Firstly, what your talking about is not median either (median is where you put all the number in a row, in order and pick the one in the middle, e.g. the median of 1 1 1 4 4 is 1 (the third number of five), the mean is 2.2 (11/5))
Secondly, I don't think it would work - a) because as I mention above the curent rating is simply an estimate of how much the user liked/diskliked the product, hence the average is just a general indication of average opinion, excluding some because they happen to disagree with someone else is surely not fair? b) how do you decide which ones to exclude? say you only have three reviews, 1, 4 and 5. Should your new average exclude both 1 and 5? giving an average of 4, but based on only 1 review? is an average of 3.3 really that different, and perhaps more accurate because its based on 3 reviews? Who says the people who scored it at 4 and 5 are right? and the one on 1 wrong? its only their opinion after all. If you really want to find out what the product is like, then read the reviews and find out WHY they liked/disliked the product.

Well enough of my ranting. If you have any comments on a particular one of these issues then start another thread (or email me), and leave this one for more suggested improvements, for both messageboards, news and reviews!

Oh, and my new email address is sam@blacksway.net for those who have my old blueyonder one.


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## Mark (Dec 18, 2002)

Is there anything that can be done (and I mean by this, practically done) that would allow for search words to be as few as three letters?  Searching by even the term D&D or d20 will halt the search with the warning that you need four letter words or higher.  I wanted to do a search by the word "war" the other day, which seemed reasonable.  Under the current situation you cannot search by thread titles for company acronyms either, which is somewhat problematic, I think.  Just a thought for the in box pile.  Thanks to Blacksway, Morrus, Piratecat and all of the mods, admins and members who help everyday to make these boards continuously useful and helpful to all of the rest of us knuckleheads...


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## Liquide (Dec 18, 2002)

Mark said:
			
		

> *Is there anything that can be done (and I mean by this, practically done) that would allow for search words to be as few as three letters?  Searching by even the term D&D or d20 will halt the search with the warning that you need four letter words or higher.  I wanted to do a search by the word "war" the other day, which seemed reasonable.  Under the current situation you cannot search by thread titles for company acronyms either, which is somewhat problematic, I think.  Just a thought for the in box pile.  Thanks to Blacksway, Morrus, Piratecat and all of the mods, admins and members who help everyday to make these boards continuously useful and helpful to all of the rest of us knuckleheads...  *




Even I can answer this one, the reason why you cannot searh for a string shorter then 3 letters is due to clogging and the wildcards.

When searching for three letter it looks for that sequence in all words and all instances in the database you specifiy (in this case description, publisher and product title fields).

And in order for it to work pleaseble fast (and not clog the server badly) it was capped (orignially by me) at 4 letters minimum.

If BlackSway however can input some specific 3 letter combos that are allowed in a seperate database table this can be done, but is no a direction you want to take with a search function.

Just my 2 cents.


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## Mark (Dec 18, 2002)

Are you saying that with four letter words, they have to be words that stand alone, but when you add three letter words, it will also include three letters in a sequence even within another word?


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## Liquide (Dec 18, 2002)

Mark said:
			
		

> *Are you saying that with four letter words, they have to be words that stand alone, but when you add three letter words, it will also include three letters in a sequence even within another word? *




much lesser chance of a 4 letter series to come up with results that aren't wanted then 3 letter series.

3 letters tend to mess up a bit (and I would like to see someone search for "and" for example).

It is a level of security, not to clog up and make the server come to a standstill. Also the common way of coding a search that *CAN* have hundreds of multiple searches (or more) at the same time.

As long as you keep them simple they do not cause you headaches, when you start to make them more advanced/allow for shorter words/letter combos the server starts to rapidly clog up and come to a standstill.


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## Mark (Dec 18, 2002)

So you are saying that it will not search for words that have those three letters in the middle of another word, correct?

If this is the case, perhaps there is a way to negate certain words such as "the" or "and" to avoid the problem rather than negate the ability to search by three letter words completely {I.E. "MEG" (or any publisher acronym), "hex", "war", "rod", "NPC", "ice" or "Elf"}?  Not to mention all of the character class abrreviations.

I understand the difficulty, but am hoping that there is a better solution than just turning it off completely under four letter words...


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## Liquide (Dec 18, 2002)

Mark said:
			
		

> *So you are saying that it will not search for words that have those three letters in the middle of another word, correct?
> 
> If this is the case, perhaps there is a way to negate certain words such as "the" or "and" to avoid the problem rather than negate the ability to search by three letter words completely {I.E. "MEG" (or any publisher acronym), "hex", "war", "rod", "NPC", "ice" or "Elf"}?  Not to mention all of the character class abrreviations.
> 
> I understand the difficulty, but am hoping that there is a better solution than just turning it off completely under four letter words... *




Actually I mean it does search for words with those in the middle of themselves.

"or" will result in hits for: fortitude, fortress, armor and or for example.

Sorry if I made that unclear


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## Liquide (Dec 18, 2002)

sorry all, I talked about the d20reviews section not the messageboards. It is late here and my brain does not work to 100%.


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## Mark (Dec 18, 2002)

Liquide said:
			
		

> *sorry all, I talked about the d20reviews section not the messageboards. It is late here and my brain does not work to 100%. *




Ah, I see.  We're on two different tracks, then.  

Well, although this isn't about the main site pages, and deals with the message boards, perhaps Blacksway could comment on what would need to be done to make this happen?  Thanks.


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## Blacksway (Dec 18, 2002)

I think everyone is getting confused (I know I am).

The d20 reviews pages _will_ let you search on any length string (ok, longer than 1 - you can't search for just "a") and it searches for whatever you type anywhere in the product (so "war" will bring back "Warrior", "Dwarves" and "Award" as well as "War").

I'm might implement a 'whole word' option, so the above example would only return "War" but thats another thing to add to the list of improvements.

---

The messageboards on the other hand wont let you search for anything less than a 4 character word. This is I presume built into the software, in an attempt to avoid the problem above. (Note, you can get around this by by searching for "war*" but I wouldn't advice it, as you get thousands of matches, most of which have nothing to do with war!

The messageboards are a commercial product, so we can't change it as easily as other things.


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## The It's Man (Dec 18, 2002)

Since I'm a non-paying member and don't have acces to the search option, I can't test it, but can you add a space to a search string? So if you're looking for the word "war", you type in " war ".
Unfortunatly this way you will not find where the word war is in front and/or followed by a punctuation mark.


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## johnsemlak (Dec 19, 2002)

> _ quoted by Blacksway_
> Categories (johnsemlak's suggestion):
> This one is a good suggestion in priniciple, unfortunately it suffers from many practical problems. 1) it is technically complex, 2) who decides what the categories are/called? 3) who goes through putting all the products into the categories? Trust me - if we run out of other things to do then we'll serisouly consider this, just don't hold your breath




Ok, Blacksway, I get the idea .  BTW I'd be very willing to help out in doing the grunt work for that task.

John


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## Dreaddisease (Dec 27, 2002)

Put some distance between the New Thread Button and the Post Reply button.


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## The It's Man (Dec 27, 2002)

_The It's Man doesn't fail a saving throw and so won't start a new topic with "Yeah what Dreaddisease said"_


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## Welverin (Dec 28, 2002)

Dreaddisease said:
			
		

> *Put some distance between the New Thread Button and the Post Reply button. *




Better yet get the new thread button out of threads all together and leave it on the individual forum pages.


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