# GOTHAM Gets Official Full Series Order at Fox



## trappedslider (May 5, 2014)

http://www.newsarama.com/21038-gotham-gets-official-full-series-order-at-fox.html

Hopefully if it's good Fox wont screw it over like it has other good shows......


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## sabrinathecat (May 6, 2014)

Don't worry: some executive won't understand it, and will order it destroyed. Or it will suck from the get-go. "CobblePot, Selina Kyle, and Alfred Pennyworth" will be in the show, but Batman won't because Bruce Wayne is only 11. Um, won't Selina then only be at most 15? Isn't she supposed to be roughly the same age as Bruce? hmmmm...


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## trappedslider (May 6, 2014)

sabrinathecat said:


> Don't worry: some executive won't understand it, and will order it destroyed. Or it will suck from the get-go. "CobblePot, Selina Kyle, and Alfred Pennyworth" will be in the show, but Batman won't because Bruce Wayne is only 11. Um, won't Selina then only be at most 15? Isn't she supposed to be roughly the same age as Bruce? hmmmm...




Depends on how they plan to use her..childhood friend?  and she's currently 23 as stated by ONE comic and so i guess it depends on what they plan to do..There's numerous comcic versions of Selina Kyle even one in which she died back in the 70s...


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## trappedslider (May 6, 2014)

[video=youtube;0d1zpt6k5OI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0d1zpt6k5OI[/video]

Well that answers the Selina question....


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## sabrinathecat (May 6, 2014)

Yeah, but what's with the sythesizer fog-horn?


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## trappedslider (May 6, 2014)

sabrinathecat said:


> Yeah, but what's with the sythesizer fog-horn?




Nit picky aren't you ..it's a sound effect for the trailer..

EDIT: do you go into new shows etc..looking for whats wrong with it? I'm just curious i think i asked oyu this before...


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## sabrinathecat (May 6, 2014)

trappedslider said:


> Nit picky aren't you ..it's a sound effect for the trailer..
> 
> EDIT: do you go into new shows etc..looking for whats wrong with it? I'm just curious i think i asked oyu this before...




Yeah, but they've been using it to the point that it's a trope, bordering on cliche'.
No, but I do try to figure out what's going on so I can weed out drek without wasting too much time. If a show is well done, I don't have time to notice the flaws--I'm too busy enjoying it. When I'm not enjoying something, I try to figure out why--then every tiny flaw starts to become jarring.


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## WayneLigon (May 6, 2014)

Production values certainly look high, the cast looks great, so I have to wonder why we get once again a superhero show with no friggin' superheroes?! It's just inane. I wish someone would someday be able to do a Batman and Robin show as a high-end cable series, where you have the cash plus the time to develop storylines.


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## Kramodlog (May 6, 2014)

sabrinathecat said:


> Yeah, but they've been using it to the point that it's a trope, bordering on cliche'.



For your enjoyment.

[video=youtube;830I9w7I7wM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=830I9w7I7wM[/video]


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## EricNoah (May 6, 2014)

It looks ok to me; I wonder if they will be able to constantly sustain a dark and heavy tone (or rather whether I will enjoy that). 

A show like this seems like very slowly setting the table for a banquet coming much later on (a banquet we won't even get to eat, mind you).  I hope it has its own arcs and mysteries that are shorter term.


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## Morrus (May 6, 2014)

I like Gordon and all, but I'd much rather watch Batman.  Instead I get Batman-wannabe Arrow (which is a great show, but it should be Batman!) and Batman's foes as children in Gotham City.  Gah! I know they have these weird rules about what properties can be used in different formats lest we all get horribly confused and start mistaking Batman for My Little Pony or something, but I would so love to see a well-made Batman show.


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## EricNoah (May 6, 2014)

Morrus said:


> I like Gordon and all, but I'd much rather watch Batman.




I think we can all agree on that. 

What I'll be searching for is a purpose beyond just setting the table.  An interesting story about how Gotham City is different from other cities, and how it gets to be the way it is.  How and why its criminals get so theatrical and strange. Why it ultimately will need a strange hero. I'm not sure how satisfying that story will be.


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## hopeless (May 7, 2014)

*Hmm...*

Makes me wish they reveal someone intervened preventing Bruce's parents killer from killing him.

Is it bad I wish they'd reveal someone using the identity of the Gray Ghost to actively try to fight crime in Gotham and in the process inspire Bruce?

The police can only do so much and its fine to have Gordon be the central character but where there so much dark and grittyness you need something to prevent this turning into another CSI or Law & Order something to set it apart using the Batman Universe to do so.

And if you don't want Batman then you need someone else...


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## Hand of Evil (May 7, 2014)

Cop show which will evolve into a teen drama, is my prediction.


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## hopeless (May 7, 2014)

*Bruce Wayne or Jim Gordon in Dawson Creek 2.0?*



Hand of Evil said:


> Cop show which will evolve into a teen drama, is my prediction.




Depends on when they want to show this.

9pm probably go very dark

5pm or so maybe you're right...


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## GMforPowergamers (May 7, 2014)

Sometimes I wonder if the pitch for these show are "I don't like superheroes but"


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## Morrus (May 7, 2014)

It's weird.  I don't usually watch US police/crime dramas; they're not really my thing.  I know I'll try this, when I wouldn't' normally, simply because I'm a Batman fan and so the word "Gotham" will draw me in. Which is ironic, because the word Gotham only has attraction to me in the context of Batman.... and he's not in it.


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## Derren (May 7, 2014)

I am not all that impressed.

Too much focus on Bruce and teeny soon to be supervillains. What has this to do with Gordon and police work in Gotham? And I do not want a Smallville situation where every hero and villain knew each other from childhood.


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## trappedslider (May 7, 2014)

I wonder if they are going to show Bullock's addiction to smoking or just do what the cartoon did and have him chewing on toothpicks.


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## sabrinathecat (May 8, 2014)

Like "Dark Knight Returns", a lot of comic geekdom makes a big fuss about "Batman: Year One" in which Batman barely appears, and the story is about Gordon as a Jr Police Detective--mr clean in a cesspit of corrupt police. This, to me, is (yet another) one of those over-hyped geekfests.
I sincerely hope this show doesn't follow that path.
Or the Smallville soap-opera path either.

I think part of what gave Green Arrow the popularity to get his own show was the Season 6 Smallville where he chews out Clark for just sitting on the sidelines instead of getting off his ass to actually help people.
Superman should not be a moping angsty teenager! And I don't want to see Smallville General Hospital room 271 through 275 again! (seems like every week, someone was in the hospital, just so they could get some mileage out of the set.)

I also don't want (yet another) show where everyone is a manipulative scumbag out to screw over everyone else. You know--the type of show which feels like swimming in a cesspool of humanity.

On the other hand, ordinary cops having to deal with rampaging psychos or other strange criminals suddenly cropping up could be interesting.


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## trappedslider (May 8, 2014)

http://www.newsarama.com/21069-goth...mises-to-surpass-the-dark-knight-trilogy.html



> Heller said all of the first season is already mapped out, and the series will feature not only young Bruce Wayne and rookie cop Jim Gordon, but also Harvey Bullock, the Penguin, Riddler, young Catwoman, Poison Ivy, former "tough marine" Alfred Pennyworth, and others — and "possibly Harvey Dent." The series will show what "inspired" the villains to eventually become their older selves.



 




> "There are so many iterations of the story and so many great versions [that] there is no one road to go down. And if you stick to one of those roads, then you lose other parts you could go down. I read everything I could and then — I didn’t throw it away, but I started fresh. I would hate to pick a particular Batman iteration because I would be dismissing others. But for me, The Killing Joke was one of the great ones in the comic books. Obviously the [Frank] Miller version [The Dark Knight Returns], as well."





Sounds like he's going to make another Earth for the dc verse lol


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## EricNoah (Sep 24, 2014)

So, Gotham is here. Any reactions? 

I liked what I saw so far.  Very far from "teen angst".  

I do fear that as the table is set and we get closer and closer to Batman, it will be less satisfying.


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## Crothian (Sep 24, 2014)

There was a a lot crammed into that pilot. I liked most of it. Poison Ivy was not that great, but She who will be Catwoman and Penguin were very good. I like the setting and noir feel. I like that Gordon is a Paladin in a place filled with corruption. It has a lot of potential to be good and bad.


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## Morrus (Sep 24, 2014)

Conceptually, I don't understand where it can go. The hero can't clean up Gotham; that's why Batman will one day be needed. I'm struggling with the idea of a long term story.

Then again, I haven't seen it yet, and won't for a month, so hopefully the first ep allays those fears a bit.


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## Crothian (Sep 24, 2014)

Morrus said:


> Conceptually, I don't understand where it can go. The hero can't clean up Gotham; that's why Batman will one day be needed. I'm struggling with the idea of a long term story.




This show is not about the destination it is about the journey.


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## trappedslider (Sep 24, 2014)

Crothian said:


> There was a a lot crammed into that pilot. I liked most of it. Poison Ivy was not that great, but She who will be Catwoman and Penguin were very good. I like the setting and noir feel. I like that Gordon is a Paladin in a place filled with corruption. It has a lot of potential to be good and bad.




I liked She who will be Catwoman's goggles...but yeah poison icy was meh and Nigma was okay, I look forward to seeing how he goes down the slippery  slope.


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## Morrus (Sep 24, 2014)

Crothian said:


> This show is not about the destination it is about the journey.




That's just a pithy soundbyte.


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## Crothian (Sep 24, 2014)

Morrus said:


> That's just a pithy soundbyte.




But it is true with a prequel. We know how this story ends. They set up a lot of characters some we know others that are new. It is going to be interesting to see how those characters get to where they are going. If that is not of interest to you then save yourself the heart ache and just don't watch.


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## Morrus (Sep 24, 2014)

Crothian said:


> But it is true with a prequel. We know how this story ends. They set up a lot of characters some we know others that are new. It is going to be interesting to see how those characters get to where they are going.




I think you don't get what I'm saying.

You can't have a journey without a destination. And there can be no destination here. Gotham will remain the same or worse. Gordon cannot affect anything.

Sure, he can arrest random bad guys each week, or have a soap opera personal life. But what journey can his character possibly take?

Does Commissioner Gordon differ much to Lt. Gordon? Other than having a higher rank and a moustache?



> If that is not of interest to you then save yourself the heart ache and just don't watch




A TV show won't cause me heartache. I will be checking it out. I'm just chewing the fat.


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## Crothian (Sep 24, 2014)

Morrus said:


> I think you don't get what I'm saying.
> 
> You can't have a journey without a destination. And there can be no destination here. Gotham will remain the same or worse. Gordon cannot affect anything.
> 
> ...




I get what you are saying we just have different opinions on what makes a destination. Gordon fighting a good fight against corruption and never fully succeeded I am fine with. He will clean up some gangs to make room for the new gangs that we know are coming like Penguin's gang. He can make a good dent into police corruption. I think he will handle the problems he can handle but other problems (super villians) will slowly come out of the woodwork that he can't but that will be down the road. 




> A TV show won't cause me heartache. I will be checking it out. I'm just chewing the fat.




You just sounds really negative toward a show you haven't seen.


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## Morrus (Sep 24, 2014)

Crothian said:


> You just sounds really negative toward a show you haven't seen.




I am very dubious. Thus the questions to those who have seen it.

Same things folks were saying before it aired over there. Only now some of you are in a position to shed some light on it.


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## Dog Moon (Sep 25, 2014)

Well my question is... assuming the Dark Knight and the other most recent movies where Batman makes his appearance... how was the state of the police force and the mayor's office at that point?

I know there was a ton of crime and people weren't feeling safe, but how corrupted were the officials and the police?  Maybe Jim isn't supposed to clean up the entire city, maybe all he's supposed to do is just clean house and make it so that when Batman shows himself he isn't shot in the back of the head by a police officer or something.


I know I'm not entirely sure where exactly the show is going to go, but the first episode drew me in well enough that I'm willing at least for now to sit back, enjoy the ride and see where it takes me.


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## Stormonu (Sep 25, 2014)

Having read parts of Batman: Year One, there's a lot in store for Gordan, and there's a lot he can do without actually taking down Falconi and the like.  I have a feeling we'll see a lot of Gordan's interaction with Cobblepot - they'll be the Smallville Clark Kent/Lex Luthor dynamic betwen the two:  I'm pretty sure they'll be working towards similar goals from opposite angles.  Gordan's going to be slowly working on cleaning out the low-level bad guys as will Cobblepot; though in Cobblepot's case it's so he can take their place.  Expect season finale face-offs between the two.

I hope we'll see "growth spurts" in Bruce throughout the series; it'd be nice if we see him as a teenager and starting to involve himself in facing down low-level thugs like in Batman: Year One.  Otherwise bleh - it's another Blue Bloods with DC names in it.

And I absolutely hate the "catwoman" bits.  All we've seen is her slink around.  Not a drop of dialogue, backstory or anything other than "eye candy" (as I can best describe it).


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## Crothian (Sep 25, 2014)

Stormonu said:


> And I absolutely hate the "catwoman" bits.  All we've seen is her slink around.  Not a drop of dialogue, backstory or anything other than "eye candy" (as I can best describe it).




She is like 15 so I'm not sure calling her eye candy is appropriate. I like them because of this. Its showing us a character that will become important later.


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## Morrus (Sep 25, 2014)

Dog Moon said:


> Well my question is... assuming the Dark Knight and the other most recent movies where Batman makes his appearance... how was the state of the police force and the mayor's office at that point?
> 
> I know there was a ton of crime and people weren't feeling safe, but how corrupted were the officials and the police?




Pretty bad.  Carmine Falcone owned judges and the cops. This scene summarizes it well:

[video=youtube;Xg913f8Tjqc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xg913f8Tjqc[/video]


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## EricNoah (Sep 25, 2014)

Pithy or not I agree with Crothian - the show is definitely about how Gotham goes from A to B ("A" place with no costumed heroes or villains, to "B"atman and friends). Also about how a good guy who initially really has no chance of changing the status quo builds key relationships that allow him to be one of Batman's go-to guys. 

Note that I'm not saying this is necessarily a good reason to make a TV show, or a satisfying way. I suspect for many it will just be a frustration.

edit: I will add, I was one of those who had no problem with much of Smallville's meanderings and ultimate destination. I did enjoy the ride.  I also didn't have a problem with a show like Lost where the journey really overshadowed the destination (I admit it was a letdown but it doesn't spoil the rest of the experience for me).  An interesting journey is worth it for me.


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## Morrus (Sep 25, 2014)

EricNoah said:


> edit: I will add, I was one of those who had no problem with much of Smallville's meanderings and ultimate destination. I did enjoy the ride.  I also didn't have a problem with a show like Lost where the journey really overshadowed the destination (I admit it was a letdown but it doesn't spoil the rest of the experience for me).  An interesting journey is worth it for me.




Smallville was a guilty pleasure for me. It's main appeal for me, though, was that there *was* a clear journey: Clark becoming Superman, albeit very slowly and often frustratingly.  Gordon doesn't really change.  Or does he?  I don't know how he's portrayed in this, other than that there's no moustache.  He's still the good cop in a city of bad cops?


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## EricNoah (Sep 25, 2014)

Morrus said:


> Smallville was a guilty pleasure for me. It's main appeal for me, though, was that there *was* a clear journey: Clark becoming Superman, albeit very slowly and often frustratingly.  Gordon doesn't really change.  Or does he?  I don't know how he's portrayed in this, other than that there's no moustache.  He's still the good cop in a city of bad cops?




Maybe think of the city as the star of the show, instead of Gordon?


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## Morrus (Sep 25, 2014)

EricNoah said:


> Maybe think of the city as the star of the show, instead of Gordon?




That's kinda what I was asking.  How does the city evolve to the point where Batman is needed?  Presumably it starts off corrupt, and it'll stay corrupt, and then Batman will appear in 20 years? I heard Falcone is the big crime lord, just like he is 20 years later? Corrupt cops like Bullock are around at both ends of the arc? 

The only angle I can think of is the birth of the Batman rogues' gallery. I guess if *they* are the main stars, that could work.

I guess I'll just have to wait and see.  I have a few weeks to wait, unfortunately, but I definitely plan to give it a shot, doubts notwithstanding.


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## EricNoah (Sep 25, 2014)

Morrus said:


> That's kinda what I was asking.  How does the city evolve to the point where Batman is needed?  Presumably it starts off corrupt, and it'll stay corrupt, and then Batman will appear in 20 years? I heard Falcone is the big crime lord, just like he is 20 years later? Corrupt cops like Bullock are around at both ends of the arc?
> 
> The only angle I can think of is the birth of the Batman rogues' gallery. I guess if *they* are the main stars, that could work.
> 
> I guess I'll just have to wait and see.  I have a few weeks to wait, unfortunately, but I definitely plan to give it a shot, doubts notwithstanding.




I think I can say without getting too spoliery that we will see shades of evil, flavors of corruption, and power struggles within the bad guy camp. Also can say without getting too spoilery that in fact Gordon does change, at least a little, even over the course of just the first episode.


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## trappedslider (Sep 25, 2014)

Regarding Gordon...he's going to go thru a marriage and then divorce at some point, depending how far they plan to go down the road.  (Edit: Unless they plan to use the character's story points from the new 52)

I see the show as separate from the Noalnverse as Burton's was from Nolan....

I do like that the pulled in Bullock and Montoya, I do wonder if they plan for the dynamic to change between those three ( Gordon,Bullock, Montoya) from uneasy cowrokers to something more align with what either the old BTA:S or the comics.


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## Crothian (Sep 29, 2014)

One thing it looks like they are doing that hopefully won't ruin the show is having Young Bruce Wayne in each episode. I would prefer that he was barely in the show at all and it focused more on the adults and the city.


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## calronmoonflower (Sep 29, 2014)

Morrus said:


> Conceptually, I don't understand where it can go. The hero can't clean up Gotham; that's why Batman will one day be needed. I'm struggling with the idea of a long term story.
> 
> Then again, I haven't seen it yet, and won't for a month, so hopefully the first ep allays those fears a bit.



Looks like it is going to be a great deal about Gordon's struggle with a world that intents to beat him down and break him for being a good person and trying to do the right thing. Anyway being that the world is so far from the goal of reforming the city and the police, he can accomplish a lot and still have heaps left over.

Just remember the old saying, it is a battle that cannot be won, but can be lost. Gordon might keep it from being lost.


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## Mustrum_Ridcully (Sep 29, 2014)

I think a difference between Gotham now and Gotham in the Batmen era is that the rules actually change. Yes, the city is corrupt. Police are paid of by Criminals. There are arrangements.

But then new villains establish themselves - and they no longer play by these rules, or follow these arrangements. 

Or maybe I am just projecting Nolan's Joker on this show?


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## Richards (Sep 30, 2014)

Gordon's got a lot of work cut out for him, but he's going to have to set his priorities.

Step one: grow a mustache.   He looks weird without it.

I'm sure the rest will all fall into place once he gets that crucial first step taken care of.

Johnathan


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## Crothian (Sep 30, 2014)

Second episode was good. Creepy villains with more talked about. The gore was a little more then I was expecting for an 8pm show. I wonder if the guy that fell down the hole is going to lead to anything.


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## Hand of Evil (Sep 30, 2014)

It is a better show than I expected.


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## EricNoah (Oct 1, 2014)

I actually was less excited by the second episode.


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## EricNoah (Oct 8, 2014)

Third episode was pretty good - the bad guy's schtick was appropriately comic-booky.  I don't get the relationship between Gordon and his partner, though - there was some attempt at humorous banter, but they clearly hate each other - awkward...


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## Morrus (Oct 8, 2014)

Saw the first episode on Monday. I quite enjoyed it. The look of the thing is gorgeous. I still have my doubts about where it can go, but it's definitely good enough to give a decent chance to.


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## Tonguez (Oct 8, 2014)

Is the Gotham story arc shaping up to be the rise of Penguin? 
I wonder if he's compelling enough to carry the show and provide a foil for Gordon to bounce off. I like Gordon being bland at the moment - he's the straight man in the seething pool of corruption, lets see if he can keep that path and earn the square jaw of Commissioner Gordon. I'm interested in some character development for Bullock and of course how he's going to fair in the upcoming gang war - especially with Montoya hovering. Cats not interesting yet but who knows where she might go. 
And its going to be interesting to see how they weave in Bruce becoming something more


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## trappedslider (Oct 8, 2014)

Tonguez said:


> Is the Gotham story arc shaping up to be the rise of Penguin?
> I wonder if he's compelling enough to carry the show and provide a foil for Gordon to bounce off. I like Gordon being bland at the moment - he's the straight man in the seething pool of corruption, lets see if he can keep that path and earn the square jaw of Commissioner Gordon. I'm interested in some character development for Bullock and of course how he's going to fair in the upcoming gang war - especially with Montoya hovering. Cats not interesting yet but who knows where she might go.
> And its going to be interesting to see how they weave in Bruce becoming something more




I'm interested to see if they pull in a young Rupert Thorne as an up and coming crime boss or lackey, I'm going to call it that at some point Gordon is going to come clean to Montoya.


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## EricNoah (Oct 15, 2014)

Uh oh ... I found myself fast forwarding through parts of the most recent episode.  Not a good sign.


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## Crothian (Oct 15, 2014)

I enjoyed it. Some of the parts like Penguin with the thieves I could see fast forwarding through because it was obvious what was going to happen there. The scenes with the singers were odd but I want to see where that's going and same with the Gordon/Barbara stuff.


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## Crothian (Nov 4, 2014)

Well, this is ramping up to be something epic.


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## trappedslider (Nov 4, 2014)

I really liked last night's episode..I'm thinking that by the end of the season Bullock will no longer be on the gangsters payroll

EDIT: Also liked how the pulled in 



Spoiler



victor zsasz


 if i am right,this has been his 2nd on screen appearance


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## EricNoah (Nov 6, 2014)

Last couple of episodes have been good.


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## Dog Moon (Nov 9, 2014)

I agree about the last couple of episode.  As soon as Penguin came in I was really interested in seeing what would happen in the following week.  It's been a while since I've ever felt the desire to watch the next episode ASAP in ANY TV show.


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## Richards (Nov 9, 2014)

I think _Gotham_'s Penguin is the most bad-ass I've ever seen Oswald Cobblepot in any media: TV, movies, or the comics themselves.

Johnathan


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## Scorpio616 (Nov 17, 2014)

Richards said:


> I think _Gotham_'s Penguin is the most bad-ass I've ever seen Oswald Cobblepot in any media: TV, movies, or the comics themselves.
> 
> Johnathan



Not sure I'd call that twist a Bad Ass, but the show is making him a very interesting villain.


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## Richards (Nov 18, 2014)

I'm not talking about the plot twist of him working for Falcone; I'm talking about him as written in the show overall.  Where he kills a carload of college kids for making fun of him.  Where he moves up the ranks by plotting to "save" part of the money he has thugs steal from his new boss's restaurant, then kills the thugs and pockets the rest of the cash himself.  Where he hires the thugs working for a guy about to kill him right out from under him and then stabs his cheapskate enemy in the guts himself and watches him die.  Where he can get stabbed through the hand by Fish Mooney and still smirk at her while calling his thugs off and calmly removing the implement from his hand.

This is a bad-ass Oswald Cobblepot, the likes of which I can't recall having seen anywhere before.

Johnathan


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## trappedslider (Nov 18, 2014)

Richards said:


> I'm not talking about the plot twist of him working for Falcone; I'm talking about him as written in the show overall.  Where he kills a carload of college kids for making fun of him.  Where he moves up the ranks by plotting to "save" part of the money he has thugs steal from his new boss's restaurant, then kills the thugs and pockets the rest of the cash himself.  Where he hires the thugs working for a guy about to kill him right out from under him and then stabs his cheapskate enemy in the guts himself and watches him die.  Where he can get stabbed through the hand by Fish Mooney and still smirk at her while calling his thugs off and calmly removing the implement from his hand.
> 
> This is a bad-ass Oswald Cobblepot, the likes of which I can't recall having seen anywhere before.
> 
> Johnathan




I'm also impressed with how they have done him, this is a  a considerably more evil Penguin than what we are used . He even pulled an epic batman gambit. He has earned the following titles in my eyes : Wild Card, The Chessmaster, Manipulative Bastard.


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## Tonguez (Nov 20, 2014)

trappedslider said:


> I'm also impressed with how they have done him, this is a  a considerably more evil Penguin than what we are used . He even pulled an epic batman gambit. He has earned the following titles in my eyes : Wild Card, The Chessmaster, Manipulative Bastard.




I'm loving his mother Mrs Kapelput too, especially her story about how she got revenge against her rival by reporting the mean girls father to the secret police. I can see why Cobblepot is a wee bit twisted.
This is certainly the best Penguin ever...


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## Scorpio616 (Nov 20, 2014)

Well, now I'm putting money on Babara winding up as a casualty. On screen infidelity is usually something they reserve for doomed characters. That plus being 'one that got away' from Zsasz also doesn't help her survival prospects. Her death would make good glue for Gordon and Montoya's workplace camaraderie.


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## trappedslider (Nov 25, 2014)

Well, tonight was a good episode...Ivy came back and scared even Cat....It opened up more questions and I wonder hwo Gordon will run into while out at Arkham...


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