# Anybody interested in playing Shadowrun?



## Xael (Mar 8, 2003)

I just started playing Shadowrun with my friends and although we haven't really played much yet, the world and rules of Shadowrun started to interest me quite a lot.

So I'm just checking if anybody here would be interested in starting a Shadowrun game, as there seems to be none.

And one thing clear: If people are interested, I absolutely won't GM.


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## Starman (Mar 9, 2003)

I wouldn't mind playing, although like you I wouldn't GM. I just don't have enough experience with the rules and setting to GM it. Playing would be a blast, though.

Starman


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## Douane (Mar 9, 2003)

I would be absolutely interested in _playing _ this. SR has been one of my most favorite setting since it's early days of 1st Edition.


Folkert


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## Xael (Mar 9, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *SR has been one of my most favorite setting since it's early days of 1st Edition.
> 
> 
> Folkert *




Which means that you have to be Shadowrun world & rules Mr. know-it-all-mastah.  

_*Adds you to the "potential Shadowrun GM's" -list.*_


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## Douane (Mar 9, 2003)

Xael said:
			
		

> *
> 
> Which means that you have to be Shadowrun world & rules Mr. know-it-all-mastah.
> 
> *Adds you to the "potential Shadowrun GM's" -list.*  *





Actually, this might be less than ideal. Due to the fact that I started with 1st Edition SR and and a mounting dissatisfaction with the published modules, my world of SR differed in many points from the "official" version. No "Dunkelzahn for President" (well, not yet), no Corp War (well, on a different level  ), no Arcology shutdown and so on. Instead we had a massive riot that almost tore Seattle into pieces. (Oh, and we had Chicago, too.) Not to mention that we only in the year 2053/2054, since we started 2050.
So I'm somewhat out-of-touch with "modern" SR.

Ruleswise, there should be nothing to worry about. I always scrounged the newer editions for usefull stuff. (Though I tended to tinker with the established rules a lot, like adding body loactions for combat.)


Folkert


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## Starman (Mar 9, 2003)

My current GM feels much the same way as you. He hated the Arcology shutdown, the whole Chicago incident, and Year of the Comet. He started us in 2053, but even though we can't use a lot of the new stuff, it has been a blast.

Starman


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## reapersaurus (Mar 10, 2003)

I'd be interested in whether this game takes off (i.e. if you can find a sucker - I mean - a DM to run it.  )

Unless everyone's intimately familiar with SR, I'd request/suggest that a base game is played, that doesn't require in-depth knowledge of the world.
Just a (relatively) quick run-thru of an adventure, or few scenes.

This was it doesn't rely on everyone having the same world-view, and might dodge some of the less-universally-accepted 'canon' that may get in the way of just having fun in a cyber-magic World.


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 10, 2003)

I love Shadowrun, so I'm in too. 

Unfortunately only as a player, since every shadowrun game that I've been involved with for the last couple of years I have been the GM.


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## Wippit Guud (Mar 10, 2003)

I'm in for playing. Hard to DM when I don't own any of the books... but I miss the game a lot, so I can wing it playing.


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## mistergone (Mar 10, 2003)

Hm I love Shadowrun, and have both GMed and played, although that was a while back now, when 2nd Edition was big. I would like to run a game, and play by post might work out well, but I would have a tendancy to throw out a lot of the rules and go freeform, or use a very very simplified ruleset, as it seems that the rules would ironically bog down an online game. which would be more roleplaying heavy than combat and complex matrix running or spellcasting. Eh, I am really lazy, and more looking to run in-person games at this point.


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## Xael (Mar 10, 2003)

mistergone said:
			
		

> *Hm I love Shadowrun, and have both GMed and played, although that was a while back now, when 2nd Edition was big. I would like to run a game, and play by post might work out well, but I would have a tendancy to throw out a lot of the rules and go freeform, or use a very very simplified ruleset, as it seems that the rules would ironically bog down an online game. which would be more roleplaying heavy than combat and complex matrix running or spellcasting. Eh, I am really lazy, and more looking to run in-person games at this point. *




Role-playing heavy like "no fighting, unless you screw up" or more like V:TM game here on the boards which looks like a (good) novel to me? I'd have to say that my english skills aren't enough for the novel-type game...  

I kinda like the "GM rolls everything" type of playing, so as long as character's abilities are even remotely taken to notice on GM's decicions, the "screw the rules" attitude wouldn't bother (at least me).

And since when has spellcasting been complicated?  I think it's quite simple compared to some other rules. I have absolutely no idea about the differences between 2nd and 3rd edition though.


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## Douane (Mar 10, 2003)

Howling Coyote said:
			
		

> I love Shadowrun, so I'm in too.
> 
> Unfortunately only as a player, since every shadowrun game that I've been involved with for the last *couple of years * I have been the GM.





I would like to mock your "insignificant" plight  with the comment I had only two characters who lasted more than a one-shot in x years, but then this would reveal I have been GM'ing SR for 13 years. Oops!!! 


Folkert


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## mistergone (Mar 11, 2003)

Xael said:
			
		

> *
> 
> Role-playing heavy like "no fighting, unless you screw up" or more like V:TM game here on the boards which looks like a (good) novel to me? I'd have to say that my english skills aren't enough for the novel-type game... *




The first. I'm not here to wrote a novel either. Combat would probably happen enough, but it would be "fast and loose" as the ysay.



			
				Xael said:
			
		

> *
> I kinda like the "GM rolls everything" type of playing, so as long as character's abilities are even remotely taken to notice on GM's decicions, the "screw the rules" attitude wouldn't bother (at least me).*




Yeah, character abilities are important. I'd prolly figure a way to randomize success/failure other than rolling a lot of dice (my desk is too small for dice rolling). I don't know if a fully statted out SR character would be important, so much as a basic stat block, what skills you're good at, and what special abilities you have (racial, magic, cyberware). Oh and what weapons you carry.



			
				Xael said:
			
		

> *
> And since when has spellcasting been complicated?  I think it's quite simple compared to some other rules. I have absolutely no idea about the differences between 2nd and 3rd edition though. *




I was just thinking about ritual magic and all the rules for summoning spirits and astral travel and etc. I'd really simplify all that for online play. 

Ah... If I was gonna run online. Again, it's tempting, it might be fun, and I've even been thinking about running a shadowrun game in the real world lately.. but... I don't know if my heart is in it right now.


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 11, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *
> 
> 
> I would like to mock your "insignificant" plight  with the comment I had only two characters who lasted more than a one-shot in x years, but then this would reveal I have been GM'ing SR for 13 years. Oops!!!
> ...




Well that's only twice as long as I (guess the word couple gives a bit wrong impression.) Truth to be told that x years sounds pretty accurate in my case too, but only because that’s all I usually can stand players who try to sneak into Renraku HQ without a plan, or goes into a melee with a vampire adept when they have assault rifles with explosive ammo.


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## Douane (Mar 11, 2003)

Unfortunately, that x amounts to almost all of my 13 GM years, so I haven't really played much. (Including the 3 one-shots I have managed to get in as a player.)

Concerning player behaviour, if those are your worst examples, consider yourself blessed. 


Folkert


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## VorpalBunny (Mar 11, 2003)

I'm in as a player (or alternate), assuming we can find a GM...

I've been GM'ing SR since the second edition (early nineties), and like Douane have had an average of a kill a session , but haven't really ran a decent game (more than one or two sessions) since D&D 3e came out - my SR GM'ing chops are severely rusty.


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 12, 2003)

Yeah, it truly seems for some reason that the average survivability rate of PCs is one or two sessions in shadowrun. 

And yes, I've heard much worse cases than those, and if you have been involved in one I feel sorry for you. Those just were the worst that I can remember straight. The vampire things was my last try in January, and the Renraku incident was one of the first SR games that I GMed.


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## VorpalBunny (Mar 12, 2003)

Still no GM huh?  OK - I really want to see this game get off the ground.  After thinking about it and looking over the rules again, I'd be willing to try it as GM.  

The thing is, if you guys want to give it a try It'll probably be a relatively quick, "introductory", most likely PUBLISHED adventure for 4-6 players (this may change) set in 2061 - 2063 (post Dunklezahn/Corp War and pre-_Year of the Comet_) that follows the canon _Shadowrun_ timeline.

If there's still interest I'll create a separate recruitment thread that includes do's and don't's tonight or tomorrow.


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 12, 2003)

Sure I'm interested.


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## Douane (Mar 13, 2003)

Great minds think alike, VB!

I was thinking of offering my meager GM skills to start this (and working on a campaign announcement), since we had so many potential players and not one GM. But of course this saves me that work. 


Folkert


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## VorpalBunny (Mar 13, 2003)

Whoa! Slow down there Douane!  if you want to GM I'm not going to stop ya - you seem like you're ready to go now.  The adventure I'm planning still needs a day or two before I'm ready for a campaign announcement...


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## Douane (Mar 13, 2003)

Well , it's not like I have a full campaign outline lying around here, but I had a few ideas for a possible full campaign and some adventure plots flying through my mind.

Still, there are some negative aspects to myself running a campaign:

1. I'm not a native english speaker and it tends to show. (sometimes badly)
2. It would be my first PbP campaign.
3. My own SR world is still stuck in the year 2054. (So no Dunkelzahn, yet.) [This is mainly aimed at the offical SR world developments. I never had a problem allowing that cyberware, weapons and equipment from later sourcebooks.]
4. All NPC'S are named Hans, Fritz or Konrad. 


Considering this,  I might not be the best choice to run a SR campaign on these boards.

So, it depends somewhat on you, VB. If you would rather play than GM and can live with the above-mentioned [assuming the others also can] I'd be willing to give it a try.

If not, not a problem here. 


Folkert


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## Xael (Mar 13, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *1. I'm not a native english speaker and it tends to show. (sometimes badly)
> 2. It would be my first PbP campaign.
> 3. My own SR world is still stuck in the year 2054. (So no Dunkelzahn, yet.) [This is mainly aimed at the offical SR world developments. I never had a problem allowing that cyberware, weapons and equipment from later sourcebooks.]
> 4. All NPC'S are named Hans, Fritz or Konrad.
> *




1. Me neither. As long as you get the general idea clear it won't bother ME. I have some absolutely horrible translations on some games here, and nobody has whined about them yet. In fact, I'd probably *prefer* non-native english speaker GM.

2. So? You said you've been GM for 13 years, it's not that much different (in fact, I find board games easier to GM, though I'm only running one).

3. If we get all the stuff, what's the fuzz?  

4. What's wrong with those names? (exept that they sound a little germanish, but hey...) 

As long as SOMEONE GM's (and for some reason decides to take me in), I'm happy.


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## Douane (Mar 13, 2003)

To get this going, I'll try to post my (very general) campaign info tomorrow or at the latest on saturday (depending on whether my professor has got any last minute assignments for me). Then we can see who's interested and go further into the details.


Folkert


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## VorpalBunny (Mar 13, 2003)

So you're running this puppy Douane? GREAT!  I'm looking forward to the campaign announcement...


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## Douane (Mar 13, 2003)

I didn't mean to step on your toes, VB, since you offered your adventure first. [I meant to email you about this, but didn't get to it.]

I just thought, if you wanted to play SR, this might be a possible solution to our dilemma. (I also admit that you can't GM SR for that long a time without taking to like it.)

So, if you want to GM, I'll step back without any problems. If not, wait for the announcement and see if you still want to play with me as GM. 


Folkert


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## Douane (Mar 13, 2003)

Just to make something clear:

Point 4. on the above list was meant entirely in jest and aimed at all to common practice of many stories/films  to have a german minor villain, who's almost always named Hans, Karl or Fritz. You won't meet any of these in my campaign! 


Folkert


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## VorpalBunny (Mar 14, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *I didn't mean to step on your toes, VB, since you offered your adventure first. [I meant to email you about this, but didn't get to it.]*




Trust me - my toes aren't squished and I'm not offended at all!!   I was kind of hoping to get a chance to play (if I'm accepted), but when I saw no one was coming forward to DM I offered my meager services.  If you're voulnteering I'm more than happy to step aside for you.


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## VorpalBunny (Mar 15, 2003)

Just a good natured <bump>...

Douane?  Are you still interested in running this puppy?


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## Douane (Mar 15, 2003)

Still am, VB!

Unfortunately (well, relatively seen) something got in the way, i.e. our weekly gaming session got transferred from tomorrow evening to today, so I'm sitting at the DM's computer at the moment while we are making plans to kick those "Britishers" out of Narvik. 

Will have that intro up either today (probably rather incomplete) or tomorrow.


Folkert


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## Douane (Mar 16, 2003)

Sorry for the delay, folks! (Well, gaming till 8 AM did not help! )

Here it is!


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## Douane (Mar 16, 2003)

> January 1st, 2054
> 
> Welcome to _the_ city of the Sixth World,welcome to Seattle!
> 
> ...


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## Douane (Mar 16, 2003)

Welcome to the "Apocalypse Noir" SR campaign!

So much for the (unfortunately rather slim) campaign intro, but I can't really post anything concerning the first adventure until we have proceeded to CharGen!


So, here are few rules for the campaign:


1. NO OTAKU! (Sorry, but I can't stand them and don't really fit into my continuity.)

2. Other races: Of course any of the standard races; creatures from the SR compendium  will be judged on a case-by-case basis.

3. CharGen: I prefer the standard priority-based system from the 3rd Ed SR handbook. (I assume most of you have played already by that system.)

4.  Equipment: Like in 3rd SR, no rating above 6 or availability above 8. (Exception: If you really need that piece of equipment for your character concept, convince me. Oh, it will cost ya! )

5. Further sourcebooks: Please keep in mind that I do not have access to either the Magic or the Matrix sourcebooks of 3rd Edition. If there's something in there you absolutely need, you'll have to supply the material and we will talk about it.

6. Any further questions, please ask!


Folkert


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 16, 2003)

Any specifics/preference about the characters? 

What books are allowed? 

Do we use priority or point buy? (Please say point buy)

How many points, if point buy?

EDIT: Oops, you already posted the info


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 16, 2003)

I prefer the point buy (I want my 50 skill points and 1,000,000 nuyen), and haven't used the priority system for ages. But I guess I can make an exception just for the change.


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## Shalimar (Mar 16, 2003)

Sum to 10 is pretty good as well, its the one system that doesn't give human mundanes the shaft.


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## Xael (Mar 16, 2003)

I want to play (surprise). Though I'd prefer the point-buy system (it allows me to get ambidexterity edge). If I get in (Please?) I would like to use some stuff from the Magic in the shadows sourcebook (mainly spells). Also, what sourcebooks do you have (=we can use without asking first)?

...and how much would I have to beg to get a weapon facility?


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## Douane (Mar 16, 2003)

@Xael:

Probably not the answer you wanted to hear, but I haven't bought a sourcebook since 1992.

Considering "Ambidexterity", I have thought that I might allow the use of Edges and Flaws on a 1:1 basis, ie one point of flaws for one point of edges. Will this help?

Weapon facility: I would prefer this to be an earned reward somewhere along the road.


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## Xael (Mar 16, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *Probably not the answer you wanted to hear, but I haven't bought a sourcebook since 1992.
> 
> Considering "Ambidexterity", I have thought that I might allow the use of Edges and Flaws on a 1:1 basis, ie one point of flaws for one point of edges. Will this help?
> 
> Weapon facility: I would prefer this to be an earned reward somewhere along the road. *




1. I thought so, not really a problem. If you allow it, I can just scan some stuff from the sourcebooks. I only "need" (=would like to have) few things. Besides, I have absolutely no idea when the 3rd edition has been released, so the 1992 doesn't tell me anything.

2. Sure, but do you have shadowrun companion, or do I have to scan the stuff for you. And uhh... is there and upper limit on points? (the maximum point cost for the ambidexterity edge is 8, which is pretty high...)  I'm a terrible min-maxer sometimes...

3. The weapon facility was mainly meant as a joke.


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## Douane (Mar 16, 2003)

1. Well, 1992 was the year the second edition was released. (IIRC, 3rd came in 1998) The product was "Shadowbeat", a media sourcebook. (Ever heard of it? )

2. Not at moment, but if it concerns the edges/flaws, no problem. (Amazing what a good memory, a pen an a piece of paper can do. )

3. Like I said above: Fortunately, noone of you seems to have met the kind of people I have gamed with in the past.


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## Xael (Mar 16, 2003)

1. Never heard of it. I was 7 by 1992...  Not really old enough to get interested in RPG's.


Ahh... character almost ready (just edited one of my already made characters), exept for equipment (and I've go 400 000! Yeah! Time for the Cyber-mage!  ).

...Oh yeah, the history/background...


And uhh... I kinda have 10 points worth of edges & flaws... (10 points BOTH!) ...just wondering if it's okay... (I might have gone a bit too far...)


Character concept: A pistol-mastah elf magician with cyberware. 


Now... must... sleep...


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## Douane (Mar 16, 2003)

1. Thought so. Ah, I already feel like an old man. 

Concerning Flaws/Edges: 
If they make sense and not because you needed those extra points (Ambidexterity ain't cheap!), no problem with me at all.


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## Xael (Mar 17, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *Concerning Flaws/Edges:
> If they make sense and not because you needed those extra points (Ambidexterity ain't cheap!), no problem with me at all. *




Hehee...  ...now I just have to make up a good explanation to _Bad Karma_...         ...Mission Impossible.

I lowered both to 8 points, which was the most I could reasonably explain. ...but now I have the ambidexterity.


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 17, 2003)

My priority placement

A Money
B Skills
C Attributes
D Ork
E Mundane

The character will be a goblinized ex-marine biologist, who barely survived the night of rage. The experience left him seriously traumatized, and instead of doing research at sea he’s in the city carrying a gun (read highly educated wannabe sammy.)

My edges and flaws count goes around 10 points too. The flaws will be a mild allergy, flashbacks, and a phobia. Is large fire's common or uncommon phobia?

The edges are still bit undecided but probably look something like this: water sprite, college education, human looking, bonus attribute point, resistance to toxins.

The avail 8 just sucks, since I can't get a sniper rifle for him.
Can I make a custom weapon?


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## Xael (Mar 17, 2003)

Rules questions: 

1. Do we have to take the street index into account when buying stuff in character creation?

2. Why the hell do magicians have to use optical vision magnification instead of electrical?

3. How much affect does the SIN actually have? Is it even possible to have a SIN and be a shadowrunner? 

4. I've got 7 things not from the main SR rulebook. Do I scan & send the stuff for you to be judged?

1) Ares predator III
2) Concealable quick-draw holster
3) High power eye laser system (cyberware)
4) Tool laser (needs the latter, cyberware)
5) Smartlink-2 system
6) Nutrition (spell)
7) Wind (spell)


My edges & flaws at the moment are:

Ambidexterity (8)
Low Pain Tolerance (-4)
Astral Impressions (-2)
Infirm (-1)
Weak Immune System (-1)

Priority system: CADEB

Concept: Character is an elf, who was born at Tir Tairngire and left to Seattle. Has worked at (insert a gunmaking corporation here. Ares?) building weapons. Now working for money as a shadowrunner. Strong feelings against humanis policlubs and racists.


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## Shalimar (Mar 17, 2003)

Xael, according to the rules Magicians have to use optical vision Mag instead of electronic vison mag for the same reason that they cannot cast spells through electronic binoculars.  Its the way the image is compiled.

Optical mags work like glasses more or less, its not replacing the image your brain sees, just magnifying it.  Electronic mag does replace the image with what the electronics can see, and then it paints that directly on your brain.  

At least that is what I gleaned from the Dumpshock forums where the Authors of the game system hang out to answer questions.  Its pretty much the official web forums for shadow run without being official because there are no official ones(If that makes any sesne).

Douane here is my concept if you are still accepting:
A female elf ex-bodygaurd from Tir Na Nog, 

her merits and flaws:
Good looking and knows it +1
Extra enemy -1

Priorities:

Money
Attributes
Elf
Skills
Mundane

The only things she has that aren't from the main book are:

Smart link 2 (same as smart-link 1 only called shots are +2 tn instead of +4)

Range finder Accessory to the Smart link  (-1 to tn at long -2 at extreme, as vision mag cycer is not compatible with smart links)

Internal smart-link 2 equiped Ingram Smart Gun

Predator 3(its an Ares Predator 2 with a smart-link 2 instead of 1)

If this is ok with you let me know, I will email you her history, and give everyone else a heads up on what she can do so we get our bases covered as far as needed skills.


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## Douane (Mar 17, 2003)

Howling Coyote said:
			
		

> Is large fire's common or uncommon phobia?
> 
> *Fire is an uncommon phobia (even if you lived in barrens during the recent riots)*
> 
> ...


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## Douane (Mar 17, 2003)

Xael said:
			
		

> Rules questions:
> 
> 1. Do we have to take the street index into account when buying stuff in character creation?
> 
> ...


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## Xael (Mar 17, 2003)

Ok, changing to electronic vision magnification (takes less essence  ).



> Unfortunately this brings up another point I should have mentioned earlier: IMC cybereyes still count as artificial sensory apparati, ie. they are unaffected by mana-based illusion spells. Sorry, if this puts a crimp in your plans.




Err... what?



> 3-4: Eeww, freak!!!




What!?!  He's a gunsmith! He needs tools! ...not to mention some utility stuff for melting those darn maglocks... 



> 6-7: Please send them over to me!




On their way.

Oh damn, I also bough a uhh... a police motorcycle from rigger 3. I'll send that also.



> Nice flaw for mage with not enough stat points, isn't it?  But as fits well with the rest, carry on.




I thought about changing it to distinctive style, but are long black coat, black clothes, long black hair, black motorcycle and 2 big pistols distinctive enough?  (OR, I we could make a new flaw called "tends to shoot racists on sight"... no wait, can I do that with compulsive?)


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## Shalimar (Mar 17, 2003)

> I thought about changing it to distinctive style, but are long black coat, black clothes, long black hair, black motorcycle and 2 big pistols distinctive enough?  (OR, I we could make a new flaw called "tends to shoot racists on sight"... no wait, can I do that with compulsive?)




Hehe



> Ok, changing to electronic vision magnification (takes less essence  ).
> 
> 
> quote:
> ...




Well Mana based illusions would be something along the lines of invisibility, the physical version that would affect machines would be more draining to cast, hence, Improved Invisibility is +1(M) to drain.


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## Douane (Mar 17, 2003)

1. Re: Cybereyes

IIRC, as per canon cybereyes should be deceived by mana-based illusions, since they were paid for with essence and therefore part of the whole being. I always judged them to be small mini-cameras and therefore a technological device, ie. they don't "see" mana-based spells.


2. Sorry for that, but I still remember taking a look at "Man and Machine" when it came out. When I saw the cybereye-laser, I basically said "Aargh, that's too Cyberpunk 2020-ish!" and turned away in disgust.
(Well, like I said in the intro: It's time for the new generation of shadowrunners. Oldtimers just don't cut it anymore.)


3. I sincerely apologize for that remark, but unfortunately I still felt kind of edgy after dealing with some really stupid students for the last two hours. Guess it bled into my writing. (It was meant to be funny, but, when I looked at it a second time, it read like I was accusing you of munchkinism, so I deleted it.)


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## Shalimar (Mar 17, 2003)

Douane, what do you think about the vision enhancement bonuses stacking with Smartlink bonuses?  ie... do they?

For example:  

Kate is firing off her smart-linked pistol at joe Ganger who is at medium range for the predator 3.  The difficulty would normally be 5 for the shot, but with her vision mag it brings it back down to 4, further her smart-link system knocks 2 off the TN, dropping it to 2.

Or would it be one or the other?  If it is one or the other smartlink is kinda wimpy as vision mag 3 will bring a shot from up to the weapons maximum range down to difficulty 4.  Meaning that the only things the smart link will affect positively are short and medium range, Making vision mag much cheaper and much better essence wise, not to mention the other benifits better eyesight brings.


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## Xael (Mar 17, 2003)

Well, I would have picked Improved Invisibility anyway. In our first SR session, our characters dropped at the top of a van, improved invisibility on. There happened to be a BIG remote (through camera) controlled turret at the roof... Thank goodness I didn't pick invisibility...

And I took that remark as fun. And that wouldn't have been munckinism, it would have been min-maxing. And you can freely  accuse me of min-maxing. 

Oh yeah, and I changed the infirm to distinctive style.


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## Douane (Mar 17, 2003)

@ Shalimar:

Welcome to the group! (It's not like we are overrun with potential players.)


However, I feel obliged to "warn" you. Your citing of the dumpshock forums shows that your knowledge of canon SR obviously is far superior to mine. However, as seen by the cybereye-thing, I do not agree with every decision/rule and therefore I do not feel obliged to handle everything in my SR universe in a certain way because they done "that" way in the canon material. (Please note that in no way this is done to spite or screw over my players. It's just that, after 13 years of gaming SR, certain things tend to grow on you. Also it doesn't mean these "habits" are bound in iron.)
[Also: Please understand this rant the way it was meant: In no way as an insult to you; but since I know it might cause dissatisfaction and frustration for a player if the GM doesn't do the things the way they are supposed to be, I felt it only fair to say so.]

Please feel free to disagree and discuss those things with me; I still might see the light! 


Folkert


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## Douane (Mar 17, 2003)

@Xael:

Hopefully you went for something a little more distinctive than this? (especially as a Shadowrunner in Seattle of the Sixth World) "long black coat, black clothes, long black hair, black motorcycle and 2 big pistols"

BTW, got your mail. Thanks!

However, the "Wind" spell was not included!


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## Douane (Mar 17, 2003)

@Shalimar:

Tough question! The way we originally handled it was to divide the actual range by the magnification rate +1, so at best the range was to be quartered. Then smartgun boni were applied.


Another suggestion recently made by a friend was to apply only one step of magnification in combat, since combatants would lack the time to let it properly focus.


I'm still somewhat fond of our first rule.


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 17, 2003)

Actually I really doubt I have much more of a foundation in shadowrun, the only books I own are the 3 "core" books, man and machine, magic and the shadows, and Sr3.

Well anyway the reason I was asking was that there really isn't a consensus on the above question.  This character isn't really min maxed, so she might not be perfect for the group, but she fits herself, so thats good, if she doesn't fit, I have a face mage that wold work  same elf different directions.

So what we have so far is:
an elf Cybermage
an elf Sam(Me)
an ork Sam(I geuss he is a skill Sam)
and Vorpal Bunny


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## VorpalBunny (Mar 17, 2003)

Hey guys - 

Sorry, but I'm going to have to drop out of this game.  It sounds like a great campaign - I'm sure Douane will do a wonderful job, but I have too much going on right now to devote as much attention as I want to this game.

Have fun!


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## Shalimar (Mar 17, 2003)

> Tough question! The way we originally handled it was to divide the actual range by the magnification rate +1, so at best the range was to be quartered. Then smartgun boni were applied.




That sounds pretty fair, better then the way the sr3 rules handle it at any rate, I like it, kiss and all that.  It also isn't open to the abuse that some interpretations of the rule is.  Like one interpretation held that vision mag 3 automatically nocked the range down by 3 categories making all shots at the closerange difficulty, and with the smart link it made every single shot difficulty 2... ick

If the above rule is what you are going to use I can take off the range finder(Man and machine) accessory from my smartlink 2.  It just was -1 at long range, and -2 at extreme.  Effectively making it 2,3,3,5 at short through extreme range respectively.


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## Douane (Mar 17, 2003)

@ Shalimar:

I just wanted to put it up, because I myself experienced such a situation once. (And it was frustrating to say the very least.)

Anyway, for your character:

"[...]but she fits herself[...]"

In my opinion this is the most important requirement for a good character.

I've long ago given up the search for a "perfect SR group", since there is certainly no such thing. I always tried to tailor the adventures somewhat to fit the characters, not the other way 'round. (Sure, there still will be situations, where you wish "you had a ....", but that always happens.)

Considering Min/maxing, I really do not think this is necessary to have an enjoyable character/adventure. In fact as someone who still plays by the 1st edition rules, I am somewhat suspicious of all that min/maxing going on with 3rd Ed., especially the Companion rules.

In conclusion of this rambling of an Oldtimer , your bodyguard is fine. (I also like to keep magic somewhat rare.)


Hope it made some sense!

Folkert


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## Douane (Mar 17, 2003)

Sorry to see you go, Vorpal Bunny!

Good luck on your PulpCthulhu game!


Folkert


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## Douane (Mar 17, 2003)

@To all:

Shalimar put up a good point. If you don't want to make your PC public knowledge, just sent it to me and do not post it here.


Folkert


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## Douane (Mar 17, 2003)

Shalimar said:
			
		

> *
> 
> That sounds pretty fair, better then the way the sr3 rules handle it at any rate, I like it, kiss and all that.  It also isn't open to the abuse that some interpretations of the rule is.  Like one interpretation held that vision mag 3 automatically nocked the range down by 3 categories making all shots at the closerange difficulty, and with the smart link it made every single shot difficulty 2... ick
> 
> If the above rule is what you are going to use I can take off the range finder(Man and machine) accessory from my smartlink 2.  It just was -1 at long range, and -2 at extreme.  Effectively making it 2,3,3,5 at short through extreme range respectively. *





If noone objects, we will use it.


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## Shalimar (Mar 17, 2003)

I don't mind posting my character sheet, as it'll give everyone ideas about her,  its just her background that I don't want everyone to know.

so here she is:

Angel

 Body		6
Quick		8(7)
Strength	6(5)
Charisma	4
Intelilligence	5
Willpower	4

Combat pool	8

Essence		1.8
Reaction	7(5)
Initiative	3d6

Cyberware: (All alpha grade) 5.2 essence

-Boosted reflexes 3
-Datajack
-25 megapulses of Headware memory
-Smartlink 2
-Muscle replacement 1

-Cyber Replacemment Eyes (Elf shaped)
+electronic Vision mag. 3
+Flare compensation
+Low-light
+Thermo
+Image link

-Cyber Ear replacement (Elf Shaped)
+Selective Sound Filter 5
+Hearing Damper
+Hearing Amp

Active Skills:
Pistols (Predator):	6(4)
SMGs (Ingram Smartgun):	6(4)
Edged Weapons (Katana):	6(4)
Unarmed (Subdual):	5(3)
Etiquette (Elven):	5(3)
Stealth (Sneaking):	3(1)
Bikes (Yamaha Rapier):	3(1)
Athletics:		3

Knowledge Skills:
Elven Society:		4
Metahuman Polotics:	4
Meta-Humanity:		4
Cybertechnology:	3
Mega-corp Security:	3
Elven Wines:		2
Magic:			2
Humanis Policlub:	1

Language Skills:
Sperethiel:		5
English:		5


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 18, 2003)

Well here's the weapon that I made using Cannon Companion. It's basically a cross between an assault rifle and a sniper rifle. The street index and availability are chosen by comparing the other rifles in the books.

Sport Rifle                  C A      M       D   W A              C       SI RC
(Name still unknown) - 30(c) SA/BF 9S 5 8/20 days 2680 3   2

Options: Barrel Extension, Gas Vent II

I think you got it wrong he's not a marine (soldier). He's a marine biologist (biologist who specialises in sea life); he's even got a MD. Since I'm not a native speaker I might be using a wrong term.

I'll send the character when I have the time. The start of the week is really busy for me.


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## Douane (Mar 18, 2003)

Well, watch my red face. 

Sorry for my misunderstanding. I'm just reading everything I can find around here about the invasion of the Normandy 1944 and the following battles for a pet project of mine, so I took it to be an "ex-marine" who then became a "biologist". The Marine Corps kind of naturally was the first thing to come to my mind. (The sniper rifle didn't help.)


As for the rifle: Sorry, but I won't be allowing this , since it is a little bit _too_ good.  Also, regarding his background, I think he would have even less an opportunity than a Marine to have a custom built weapon.




Folkert


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 18, 2003)

The military background would be great way to explain his combat skills (which are quite good), but I can't reasonably fit it with the university. The rifle skill is easy to explain, and so are martial arts, but smg 6 is bit different story with his background. Well I guess he learned that after night of rage, or he's just a natural.

Actually I didn't even expect to you to accept that weapon. It's just a demonstration how broken some of the rules in 3rd edition are.


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## Shalimar (Mar 18, 2003)

Why not just go with the pricier, but availible weapons that Douane okayed?  I mean heck if you are really that strapped for cash we probably wont need a sniper right off the bat anyway, and if we do, we could always bargain thee tools for the job as part of the upfront of the pay.


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 18, 2003)

I'm thinking about it, but like Douane they are really hard to get. Still with a fixer contact it's not impossible. Money is not really the problem, since I still got around 50000 to spend, but I think I rather spend it upgrading some of my cyberware to alpha grade.

Btw. The sniper rifle idea is just a tribute for the incident in the US while back (No I'm not going to start shooting people at random)


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## Xael (Mar 18, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *Hopefully you went for something a little more distinctive than this? (especially as a Shadowrunner in Seattle of the Sixth World) "long black coat, black clothes, long black hair, black motorcycle and 2 big pistols"
> 
> However, the "Wind" spell was not included! *




Well, actually I didn't. I tend not to think clearly when tired.  Blandness would have been more appropriate... Changed it (again) to better fitting Compulsive (hates racists and makes it clear).

Agh! I'll resend the Wind spell.

Oh, and he's not really a cybermage. He is just a mage with cyberware for precaution and a fondness to pistols.  ...uhh, okay he is a cybemage.

Shalimar: That character is scary.


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## Xael (Mar 18, 2003)

Xerd Siannodel

Body 2
Quickness 4
Strength 3
Charisma 3
Intelligence 6
Willpower 6
Essence 5.02
Magic 5
Reaction 5
Initiative 5+1d6

Combat pool 8
Spell pool 5
Astral combat pool 7

Cyberware (all alphaware) 0.98 Essence

-Smartlink-2 (with added induction pad at left hand)

-Cyber replacement eyes
 +Electronic Vision Magnification 3
 +High Power eye laser system
 +Tool laser

-Cyber replacement ears (elven)
 +Hearing amplification
 +Dampener

Active skills:

Pistols 4
Pistols B/R 6
Sorcery 6
Etiquette 3
Negotiation (Bargain) 1 (3)
Car 1
Bike 3
Bike B/R 2

Knowledge skills:

Magic 4
Pistols 6
Pullyap 4
Humanis policlubs 4
Gang Identification 3
Corporate Security 2
Cybertechnology 2
Metahumanity 3
Seattle dumps 2

Language skills:

Sperethiel 5
English 4

Spells: Name & Force

Ball Lightning 6
Armor 6
Heal 6
Resist Pain 3
Improved Invisibility 1
Levitate 1
Nutrition 1
Wind 1

Edges:

Ambidexterity 8

Flaws:

Low pain tolerance -4
Astral Impressions -2
Weak Immune system -1
Compulsive (Hates racists/Humanis Policlubs and makes it clear) -1


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## Shalimar (Mar 18, 2003)

Xael, just a few questions.



> Pistols (B/R) 4 (6)
> Sorcery 6
> Etiquette 3
> Negotiation (Bargain) 1 (3)
> ...




1st question
Build and repair is not a specialization of the main active skill, so whats listed in the parenthesis is the build and repair skill for the listed skill right, and not a specialization right? so you took skills as your lowest priority ie 27?

2nd
You appear to be a full mage, at least by your spell points.  Um, since you didn't put any points in conjuring, Can I ask out of curiosity why you didn't choose to be a sorcerer?


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## Xael (Mar 18, 2003)

Shalimar said:
			
		

> *Xael, just a few questions.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




1. I took them as differents skills, just saving space.  (I'll change it to be more clear.)

2. I left room for potential improvements.   (Besides, I'm kind of a perfectionist, don't want to be called "half-awakened".)


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## Douane (Mar 18, 2003)

@Howling Coyote:

Perhaps for the moment you should just go with that Remington 950?

Concerning the "marine biologist", I really like that, since it would fit very well with an idea that I had on my mind.


@Xael:

Received the wind spell, thanks!


Reviewed your character:

You seem to be missing one active skill point (should be 27; you have 26)

Just read the magic chapter within the 3rd Ed rules. WOW! I never knew they had made magic that overpowered.

Concerning those spells at force 1 (that's what I call min/maxing  [especially after reading the descriptions]), just be aware that any opponents might do the same. Otherwise, cast away! 


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 18, 2003)

Xael said:
			
		

> *Shalimar: That character is scary.  *




No she isn't, and thats the point 

She wouldn't have been quite so effective if she looked tough.  None of modifications are illegal with the proper permits, and none are obvious.  The same with all her gear.  She is totally legit, and harmless looking.


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## Xael (Mar 18, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *You seem to be missing one active skill point (should be 27; you have 26)
> 
> Just read the magic chapter within the 3rd Ed rules. WOW! I never knew they had made magic that overpowered.
> 
> Concerning those spells at force 1 (that's what I call min/maxing  [especially after reading the descriptions]), just be aware that any opponents might do the same. Otherwise, cast away! *




Well I wasn't really sure about that specialization cost. Oh well, I'm not complaining.

It kind of a depends, my character can't toss any good offensive spell without dropping uncoscius. Utility spells are a different thing. No idea about earlier edition magic.

I just can't think of any reason to take some of the spells higher than force 1 other than fear of them being dispelled, or if one would value speed in levitate. And yeah, it's min-maxing.


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## Xael (Mar 18, 2003)

Shalimar said:
			
		

> *
> 
> No she isn't, and thats the point
> 
> She wouldn't have been quite so effective if she looked tough.  None of modifications are illegal with the proper permits, and none are obvious.  The same with all her gear.  She is totally legit, and harmless looking. *




Ok, but stat-wise she is a KILLING MACHINE!  (And douane talks about magicians being over-powered... *grumble, grumble...*) But hey, she's got enough strength to carry the unconscius Xerd away after he has cast the Force 5 Ball Lightning. Which is a situation hopefully not gonna happen, as it's kind of a "last resort".

Ps. You seem to have a typo in either your left essence, or the cyberware essence cost. The totals come up to 7.


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## Douane (Mar 18, 2003)

Argh, please don't make  face. My comment was meant in a teasing way. I certainly won't fault anyone for going by the rules. 

Regarding the min/maxing: might be as well that my own min/max instincts took over, since I searched immediately for any possibilites of exploitation.
[ie. "Levitate" sustained 15M attack;
      "Improved Invisibility" 6 sorcery dice + 5 spell pool vs. TN 4
      with a drain of 2M - mighty powerful ]

Re 1st Edition: the dice used for spell success were equal to the force of the spell, sorcery was only used to determine the Spell pool. With the 3rd Ed. you cast all spells with equal ability due to your sorcery skill.


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## Douane (Mar 18, 2003)

Xael said:
			
		

> *
> 
> Ps. You seem to have a typo in either your left essence, or the cyberware essence cost. The totals come up to 7. *




Left essence is right, probably a typo for the cyberware cost. In fact she could have had even 50 MP of memory without a change to left essence. [How's that for min-maxing?]


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## Xael (Mar 18, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *Regarding the min/maxing: might be as well that my own min/max instincts took over, since I searched immediately for any possibilites of exploitation.
> [ie. "Levitate" sustained 15M attack;
> "Improved Invisibility" 6 sorcery dice + 5 spell pool vs. TN 4
> with a drain of 2M - mighty powerful ]*





I can almost imagine our first shadowrun: Flying, Improved Invisible, Armored, Stealthy mages.      ...with granade launchers. 

Oh, and I'm trying to finish Xerd's history/background tomorrow. Try. If I can't finish it tomorrow, it's going be friday earliest.


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 18, 2003)

Stephen Streep aka Swart

B 6
Q 6
S 4
C 4
I 6
W 2 
E 0.509
M -
R 6 (10)

INIT: 6 (10) + 1D6 (3D6)

Dice Pools: 
Karma 1
Combat 7
Task 2

Race: Ork
Height: 179 cm
Weight: 109 kg
Eyes: Grey
Hair: None

Money: 5905
Lifestyle: 
- Middle 2 months
- Low 2 months

Contacts:
Ghillie Fixer/Ex-Navy SEAL
Amytal Street Decker/Shadowrunner

Edges & Flaws: 
Bonus Attribute Points 2
Exceptional Attribute (INT) 2
Resistance to Toxins 1
Water Sprite (Distance Increase, Fatigue) 2
College Education 1
Human-Looking 1
Essence Reduction 2
Moderate Uncommon Allergy (Dry Air) –3
Flashbacks (Night of Rage) –4
Moderate Uncommon Phobia (Large Fires) –3
Day Job (Street Doc Assistant) -1

Active Skills:
Rifles 5
Submachine Guns 6
Unarmed Combat/Jujitsu 3/5
Athletics/Swimming 5/7
Diving 4
Stealth 6
Etiquette/Scientific 2/4
Biotech 6

Knowledge Skills:
Arms Dealers 2
Biology 6
Chemistry 6
Demolitions 2
English/Scientific 4/6
Forensics/Pathology 4/6
German 4
Medicine 6
ParaZoology 1
Scientific Gear 2

Cyberware (All alphaware and registered):
Encephalon 2
Math SPU 1
Cyberears
- Dampener
- Hearing Amplification
- High Frequency
- Low Frequency
- Select Sound Filter 5
Ultrasound Vision
Cyberfins
Air Filter 2
Blood Filter 1
OXSYS Cybergill
Wired Reflexes 2
- Reflex Trigger

Bioware
Nictitating Membranes

Weapons:
Unarmed 4M Stun or 3L
Colt Water Carbine [SMG, SA/BF, 6M, 30c]
Range: 0-10 (4), 11-40 (5), 41-80 (6), 81-150 (9)
- Gas Vent II
- 100 Ammo
- 2 Spare Clips
HK227 [SMG, SA/BF/FA, 7M, 28c]
Range: 0-10 (4), 11-40 (5), 41-80 (6), 81-150 (9)
- Stock
- Laser Sight
- Gas Vent II
- 100 Ammo
- 2 Spare Clips
Remington 950 [SR, SA, 10S, 5m]
Range: 0-100 (4), 101-250 (4), 251-500 (5), 501-750 (6)
- Permit
- Magnification 1
- Silencer
- 40 Explosive Ammo
Dart Pistol [LP, SA, 6D Stun, 5c]
Range: 0-5 (4), 6-15 (5), 16-30 (6), 31-50 (9)
- 10 Narcojet Darts
- 2 Spare Clips

Armor (5/3 or 6/4):
Secure Vest 2/1
Form-Fitting Half-Body Suit 3/1
- Fire Resistance 3
- Insulation 1
Diving Armor 4/2
- Chemical Seal 4
- Insulation 2
- Nonconductive 4

Gear:
2 Flash-Pak
Nav-Dat GPS
Respirator
Survival Kit
Wrist Phone w/ Flip-Up Screen
Micro-Tranceiver 6 
Subvocal Mic
Scanner 6
Maglock Passkey 4
Sequencer 4
General Toolkit
Chemistry Kit
Medkit
Load-Bearing Harness
- 3 Pistol Ammo Pouches
- Rifle Ammo Pouch
- 2 Large Equipment Pouches

Sources used: Man and Machine, Shadowrun Companion, Cannon Companion, State of the Art


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## Douane (Mar 18, 2003)

Xael said:
			
		

> *
> 
> 
> I can almost imagine our first shadowrun: Flying, Improved Invisible, Armored, Stealthy mages.      ...with granade launchers.
> ...




Well, I do remember a tale best forgotten. When a new player handed me his character sheet, he did so with the backside first and I got to read his carried equipment: Rocket Launcher with ammo, Sniper rifle and full security armor + minor things. I thought "Even for a street samurai that's a "just a little bit" too much.", then I turned the sheet.

Surprise, I was wrong, it was no samurai, it was a hermetic mage. 


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 18, 2003)

Xael Casting spells isn't quite so dangerous as you make it seem, though there are a few things you should do to make it a tad safer.

1)You don't need to have any force 6 spells, bad idea, very bad idea drain wise, especially with only having a magic rating of 5.  That said, you can always cast them at a lower force.  Personally if I was always going to be casting them at force 5 to avoid phsical drain damage, I would just take them at 5 to save the spell points.

2)With the three spell points you would save you could buy an exclusive limited Stunbolt spell at force 5.  Non-fatal can be good in a lot of situations.

3)If your interested, I can give you some of my starting spell lists that I have found very useful

Here's an example of casting Ball Lightning:

Jonny the mage decides to throw a ball lightening at a bunch of street gangers.  Not wanting to take physical drain he decides to cast it at force 5 and moderate damage level.  He has a sorcery skill of 6 and a spell pool of 5, he decides to roll all of his sorcery dice, and half of his spell pool dice, saving the other half for drain.

He rolls 9 dice against TN 4: 6,6,5,4,4,3,3,2,2 he gets 6 success, staging the damage up from moderate to deadly damage, and because it goes 2 success over deadly, he raises the difficulty to resist the damage by 1.  The spell goes off dealing deadly damage to each and every thug in its radius.

He now has to pay for his fun, he has to resist 3(Deadly) stun damage.  He has 8(6 willpower + 2 spell pool) dice for his drain test.  He rolls 6,6,5,4,3,3,3, and 2 staging the drain down from deadly to light.  He turns his back on the still twitching gangers and walks away whistleing.


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## Shalimar (Mar 18, 2003)

I do have a question.  I thought we were confined to SR3 with the exception of a few MINOR things, like smartlink 2 and merits and flaws.

Bioware is a big deal, and If I had known we could use it, Kate would have gone for Bio over cyber out of not wanting unliving things in her body.  And not just bio, there are few other toys I would have liked as well like form fitting balistic armor, etc.  Its a little late to change now, so whats the deal? Sr3 or all the books?


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## Douane (Mar 18, 2003)

Shalimar said:
			
		

> *I do have a question.  I thought we were confined to SR3 with the exception of a few MINOR things, like smartlink 2 and merits and flaws.*





That was my impression as well; in fact, that was why I posted "If you really need it, tell about it and also tell what it does."

So you raise a very valid point: bioware for one = bioware for all (I'm somewhat disinclined to allow bioware, since there some items that are mightily overpowered, ie. enhanced articulation [40,000 for +1 on all physical skills? Every self-respecting Samurai should have one.]) So is bioware really needed?

BTW, Shalimar, what is FFBA?


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 18, 2003)

Form fitting Body Armor


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## Shalimar (Mar 18, 2003)

Xael, here is a spell list that I have used in the past, it includes all the spells you had, but many more as well:

StunBall (Exclusive) : Force 5
StunBolt (Fetish) : Force 5
Heal (Exclusive) : Force 5
Detox (Exclusive) : Force 2
Physical Mask (Fetish) : Force 3
Improved Invis (Fetish) : Force 3
Levitate (Fetish) : Force 1
Ball Lightening (Exclusive) : Force 5 (Fetish for drain)
Detect enemies (Exclusive) : Force 2
Armor : Force 5
Resist Pain (fetish): Force 3
Nutrition (fetish): Force 1
Wind: Force 1

Edit:  Depending on Folkert, you might want to take a Geasa on that Cyberware.  A gaesa is either a thing you must do, or must not do.  If you took one, it would ofset the lost point of magic, and allow you to keep your 6.  And if for some reason you broke the geasa your magic would go back down to 5 for 24 hours


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## Douane (Mar 18, 2003)

So what's your opinion on this, Shalimar?

I take it you are in favour of adding bioware?


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 18, 2003)

Actually, I think we should keep to as few rules as possible.  I think that SR3 with merits and flaws is fine.  No need to really make it more complicated


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## reapersaurus (Mar 18, 2003)

My god - this campaign got off to a quick start! (I hadn't checked back to the thread since page 2)
But that's great, to see so many experienced SR players.

I'm afraid I don't know enough about SR to play with you guys.
My wife (Vychtorya on the boards - the Vampire game) and I played in ONE.. count in one game, played for 3 sessions before it ended.

I had a physical adept character, and she a street samurai.
But we know nothing about canon, or any history of the world, and limited rules knowledge...


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## Valara (Mar 18, 2003)

All it really takes is the main sr3 rulebook.  If you have that then you should be fine.  As far as I know thats all we are using, and I sure would like more players, and would be willing to explain things.

EDIT: Sigh, this is Shalimar


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## Shalimar (Mar 18, 2003)

If it makes you feel better, I have only played in 2 games, but they were rather long lived.


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## Douane (Mar 19, 2003)

@reapersaurus:

Everybody's got to start somewhere, so welcome to the world of Shadowrun!




			
				Valara said:
			
		

> *All it really takes is the main sr3 rulebook.  If you have that then you should be fine. *



And even that can be faked, believe me!


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 19, 2003)

If you want a really easy way to make characters, I can give you a link to a character generator that has all of the books up to date included in it.  This generator is great, its stream-lined and it is set up so that you can easily allow, and disallow any given book, with the exception of Man and Machine, Magic in the Shadows, SR3 (Duh).  And even in these cases, beside each entry, it lists book and page number.

The generator, known as the NSCRG, is very good for starting players because it automatically calculates things.  For example, it knows that priority A skills is 50, so in the skills page it has a sliding bar that states x/50 and disallows you from going above.  It auto calculates essence, and automatically deducts your cash as you buy anything.  Quite user friendly.

Here it is: Character Generator


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 19, 2003)

So I take it you want me to remove the bioware. Darn, lot of the character was based on that cerebral booster.


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## Shalimar (Mar 19, 2003)

[No message]


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 19, 2003)

Shalimar said:
			
		

> *The generator, known as the NSCRG, is very good for starting players because it automatically calculates things.  For example, it knows that priority A skills is 50, so in the skills page it has a sliding bar that states x/50 and disallows you from going above.  It auto calculates essence, and automatically deducts your cash as you buy anything.  Quite user friendly.
> *




NSCRG is good for making a quick sketch of the character, and that’s what I use it for. After that I create the character using the output as a base doing all the calculations by hand.


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## Douane (Mar 19, 2003)

@Howling Coyote:

Sorry for not posting anything further on that matter. I  like the concept of your character (at least what I've seen so far) and, like I said, it would really fit very well into some plans of mine, but perhaps it would be possible to rebuild the PC without the bioware? Considering possible involvement of Reapersaurus and myself lacking access to most sources, it would be great if we can find a way around it. I realize this is a serious blow to your concept but I sincerely hope it is possible and that I haven't alienated you with my ruling/plea.


Folkert

P.S.: Could somebody help me with a rules point? I have the nagging memory that cultured bioware wasn't even available to beginning characters, but I don't seem to be able to find anything on it. Or am I just imagining things?


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 19, 2003)

I'm already fixing the character (stopped swearing already). Only problem is that now I have serious essence problem, since I'm trying to take at least some of it in cyberware. At least cyberware is lot more cheaper so I can afford to take everything alpha.


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 19, 2003)

You're probably correct about the cultured stuff. I was only looking the avail. It's something that I'm using with my players, and forgot that it's a house rule.


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## Xael (Mar 19, 2003)

Shalimar: He is going to be casting those spells at Force 5. They're supposed to be accuired before he installed cyberware, so I wanted to leave them there. Not to mention that at least the armor spell can easily be casted without any drain.

And well, I might be a bit over scared of the spells, which might have something to do with my other character having sorcery of 3.

Most of Xerd's uhh... combat styles need at least one spell sustained. So exclusive is not really an option. Besides, I said that I was kinda perfectionist. And this just leaves me one area in the game which I DIDN'T min-max.   ...much.

I know about Geasa, but I'd prefer not to take limitations to the spellcasting. I can always convince Douane to allow initiation... 

And reapersaurus: I'm currently playing my FIRST SR campaing with my friends. And my GM is a freak.  My knowledge of the world is basically what I've managed to dig up from the main soucrebook.


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## Shalimar (Mar 19, 2003)

No, cultured Bio is not availible to beginning characters without a gm ruling.

If it as, I definitely would have played a mage with a trauma damper.  Trauma dampers take one box away from any wound, effectively making light wounds do no damage (including Drain).

Anyway, If not for your want to make magic rare I would make Kate a sorcerer adept, since I know the magic rules pretty well, and am used to mages and Shamans.


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## Douane (Mar 19, 2003)

Howling Coyote, thanks for your reconsideration.

There are some things I wanted to remark:

1. Bonus Attribute can only be taken once.

2. Edge: Essence Reduction - what does it do?

3. Flaw: Allergy (Dry Air) - I'm no expert, but in my opinion this would be uncommon.

4. Ultrasound Vision: I understand the reasoning, but would it possible to put it into cybereyes. I'm just not comfortable with the thought of having such an apparatus in an organic eye.

5. Would it help if I were to reverse my prior decision for priority based PC design and change it to point buy? This is something I've been thinking about already.

6. Is the PC a former Navy Seal?


Folkert


P.S. Regarding Point 5 - What do all of you think about it? A discussion with a former player of mine showed me that I might have been too prejudiced against it, probably another notion of that "Oldtimer-mentality".


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## Shalimar (Mar 19, 2003)

I don't know, as a system Build Points leaves elves worse of then the priority system, the same for mages, but much worse.  I wouldn't want to use it.


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## Xael (Mar 19, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *P.S. Regarding Point 5 - What do all of you think about it? A discussion with a former player of mine showed me that I might have been too prejudiced against it, probably another notion of that "Oldtimer-mentality". *




The priority system is just fine I think. (in other words, I would lose stuff if we changed to point-buy.  )


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## Vychtorya (Mar 19, 2003)

(this is  reapersaurus)

Just a note:
Vych's Street Samurai's old, probably rules-flawed sheet is littered with cyberware AND bioware.
It's tricked out so bad, it would probably make you sick looking at the cheese...   LOL


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## Douane (Mar 19, 2003)

@Shalimar:

I will freely admit to my want of keeping magic a rare occurence; however this should not force you into a certain direction. [It seems that I already do too much forcing as it is. ] 

Are you comfortable with the non-magic bodyguard concept, or do you to want to change?


Folkert


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## Douane (Mar 19, 2003)

@ Shalimar:

Once again forgot something: If you still want that FFBA, get it. If there Predator III's around, why not that armor.


Folkert


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 19, 2003)

1. Okay I'll fix it.

2. It's a surgical option from Man and Machine. It can be taken as an edge and gives you 5% reduction for essence costs in character creation.

3. This is a though question that I'm not sure about either so I change it as uncommon if you like. It’s actually more of a mental flaw for him, not physical, which makes it only a mild allergy.

4. I don't see the reason since the three components involved can be installed just as easily as retinal modifications as camera or a display link. He even has high frequency hearing, which makes the process even simpler. Of course there's also the thing that I don't want to lose my natural low light vision

5. It would be nice, but since we have gone this far already it's really unnecessary.

6. NO, Swart has no prior military background. His fixer contact has a Navy SEAL background, and still some military contacts.


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## Shalimar (Mar 19, 2003)

Well, I would most rather be the  sorceror adept version.  It does leave most of the magic rules out, no astral projection, no conjuring.  I meant what I said about the fact that she was the same history, contacts, and for the most part equipment wise.


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## Douane (Mar 19, 2003)

Then go ahead. 

There's just one point I have concerning this (it's nothing personal, it's my beef with the rules):

Please try to not "go overboard" with your spell selection, since I have no prior experience with 3rd Ed's magic system and I'm still very wary of the insane amount of power it gives to mages (and sorcerous adepts).


Folkert


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## Douane (Mar 19, 2003)

@Howling Coyote:

Just saw your revised PC: You really want that task pool, hmm?

Have you thought of going for the Edge: Exceptional Attribute to get the INT up?



> 4. I don't see the reason since the three components involved can be installed just as easily as retinal modifications as camera or a display link.




Not that you wanted to hear it, but I always ruled these to be not installible as retinal modifications, since they are obviously mechanical in design.  (But I guess there can be such things as too many rules.) So, go ahead. 


Once again, thanks for reworking it!

Folkert

Edit: Would it be possible to send me info on the stuff not in core SR3 book?


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## Douane (Mar 19, 2003)

So, reaper, are you going to play?


Folkert


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 19, 2003)

Sure I'll send it (more work for me), but not today, since I'm going to GM SR for my group

I really though about Exceptional Attribute, but since it doesn't give an extra point I didn't choose it. I might take it to consideration now that I lost the cerebral boosters bonuses. I guess I could squeeze a point out of strength or willpower.

And no need to thank me since I always make extreme case characters and tune it down when the GM says no


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## Xael (Mar 19, 2003)

Shalimar said:
			
		

> *Well, I would most rather be the  sorceror adept version.  It does leave most of the magic rules out, no astral projection, no conjuring.  I meant what I said about the fact that she was the same history, contacts, and for the most part equipment wise. *




You think she might interested in creating a magical group?  (=even more headache for Douane.)


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## Douane (Mar 19, 2003)

OH YES! Put salt into my wounds! 

Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 19, 2003)

I don't know that she would.  Maybe eventually, but she doesn't know anyone in seattle enough and trust anyone enough to join with them in that way, with the exception of one person.

Plus, and I think Folkert will agree, its way too complicated.  I think we don't really need it, and shouldn't plan on doing anything with it for a while.


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## Shalimar (Mar 19, 2003)

Here is Kate as a sorceror adept(Hermetic)

*Attributes*
Body  3
Quickness  5
Strength  2
Charisma  3
Intelligence  6
Willpower  6

Essence  5.2
Magic  6(Can Not Kill Gaesa)
Reaction 5
Initiative  1d6

*Pools*
Magic Pool  6
Combat Pool  8
Karma Pool  1

*Cyberware  (Alpha)*
-Smartlink 2
-Eyes : (Thermo, Lowlight, flare comp, Vision mag 3)
-Ears : (Amp, Damp, Filter x5)

*Skills*
-Pistols (Predator)  4(6)
-Sorcery 6
-Stealth (Sneaking)  1(3)
-Bike (Yamaha Rapier) 1(3)
-Negotiation  3
-Etequitte  3
-Athletics  3
-whips  3

*Languages*
English  5
Sperithiel  5

*Knowledges*
Magic 6
Spell Design  5
Elven Society 5
Meta-human politics 4
Meta-humanity  3
Philosophy  2
Paranormal animals  2
Humanis Poli-club  1
Elven Wines  1

*Spell List 35 points*
Stunball [Exclusive] force 5
Stunbolt [fetish] Force 5
Heal [Exclusive] Force 5
Armor [fetish] Force 4
Physical Mask [fetish] Force 3
Physical Barrier Force 3
Improved Invisibility [fetish] Force 3
Detect Enemies [exclusive] Force 2
Detox [exclusive] Force 2
Magic Fingers [fetish] Force 2
Levitate [fetish] Force 1
POWER FOCUS BONDING force 2(10 points)

*Fetishes, Foci, and Magic Gear*
-Force 6 Sorcery Library
-Power Foci force 2 - A silver spiral armband on her upper arm
-Stunbolt fetish - a silver celtic cross earing on her left ear
-Armor fetish - a tiny shield on her charm bracelet
-Physical Mask fetish - a small phantom of the opera type mask on her charm bracelet
-Imporved Invis fetish - a silver celtic cross earing on her right ear
-Magic Fingers fetish - A charm bracelet that the other fetishes hang on
-levitate fetish - A silver pendant with angel wings

*Equipment carried*
-Predator 3 w/ 15 gel rounds
-1 extra clip w/ 15 normal rounds
-Secure long coat (as a point of style I would like this to be a hooded cloak, reversible, with a black outside, and a silver inside with various symbols and sigil done in gold thread)
-Fine clothing (black leggings, calf high grey leather boots, and a cream tunic)
-Standard credstick rating 5 (Kate Stevens identity)
-earplug cellphone
-pager
-platinum Doc-wagon contract

*Equipment owned*
-Ebony Credstick rating 6 (Cathlene Reilly)
-Ares Predator 3
-Silencer
-10 spare clips
-150 gel rounds
-60 regular rounds
-2 sets Tres Chic clothing
-2 sets fine clothing
-2 sets Regular clothing
-1 secure clothing
-1 secure jacket
-1 secure vest
-1 Sub-vocal mic
-1 rating six micro-transceiver

*Vehicle*
Yamaha Rapier

*Contacts*
level 3 Tir Na Nog Noble
level 3 Elf Mage
level 2 Elf Decker
level 2 Human fixer
level 1 
level 1


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## Douane (Mar 19, 2003)

@ Shalimar:

1. I might have been miscounting, but I think you still have 4 Force points left. (Unless you took "fetish" or "exclusive" somewhere to reduce drain, though I assume not.)

2. Sorry for not mentioning it earlier, but while studying your character it occured to me that I have some serious doubts concerning the use of a geas, since it just provides a bonus without any kind of malus.

3. No longer interested in the form-fitting armor? 


@ all Magic-users:

I've been thinking about reviving an old houserule of mine:

"The maximum number of spell pool dice that a player can use in sorcery tests is equal to the force of the spell."
[Reason: The more work/study you have invested into a spell, the better you are able to tweak it.]

Your thoughts on this? (Other than "Bah!")


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 19, 2003)

1)Oops I left out 1 spell
Fireball (exclusive) : Force 5 [Fetish for casting]

the other 1 point goes into detect enemies, I mistakenly listed it as exclusive instead of fetish

2)It does take from her the ability to kill if she wants all 6 magic points, pacifists(well the flaw I took) are allowed to kill in self-defense only.  But If your uncomfortable, I quite understand. Consider it ungaesed.  Besides I still have the power focus, so I am effectively magic 7, and 5 is all I really need for my spells as is, though the two dice from the focus are quite welcome.

3)Don't need it, the other version of her had a higher quickness, so she could afford to wear more armor without penalties.  Right now a secure jacket is the most she can wear without being slowed, besides I like the image of the Cloak style secure long coat, it just seems like her.

@ all magic users:  Would we still be able to use our sorcery skill as normal?  If so then isn't that what the rule is now?


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## Douane (Mar 19, 2003)

2) Motivation-wise(?) I have no problem with the choice and I understand your reason for taking it, however the mechanics give me a headache: 
- Angel takes the geas: check
- Angel gets a bonus for adhering to geas: check
- Angel breaks her geas: she loses her bonus, however there no "real" malus associated with it. Why wouldn't every mage want to get a geas, since he never really loses anything, he only gains (while acting according to his geas).  [Hope it makes sense.]

[1st Ed rules for geas were a "bit" harsher: for every 2 magic points losts, you had to take a geas; if you broke, you got a +2 on all TN of magical tests.]


"Houserule"
Let me go through this once again in case I got anything wrong:

Original:
Use of sorcery skill for spell casting; apply additional Spell Pool dice at will (maximum number: equal to sorcery skill).
[Reason: ?] 

"Houserule"
Use of sorcery skill for spell casting; apply additional Spell Pool dice at will (maximum number: equal to force of spell).
[Reason: The more work/study you have invested into a spell, the better you are able to tweak it.]


If I went wrong somewhere, please point it out!


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 19, 2003)

2)Quite understand, fine by me, not taking the geas does drop a point out of her spell pool, but the power focus effectively adds 2, so its a net gain, and more utilitarian because the focus dice can be added anywhere.

'House rule'
That seems reasonable to me for a house rule as far as spell pool.  Consider me happy with it.


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## Douane (Mar 19, 2003)

Shalimar said:
			
		

> *2)Quite understand, fine by me, not taking the geas does drop a point out of her spell pool, but the power focus effectively adds 2, so its a net gain, and more utilitarian because the focus dice can be added anywhere.*




Of course, but the power focus was never in question! (Or did I give such an impression somewhere?)

Geas: I certainly wouldn't mind to include geasa, but, according to my reasoning given above, they should have a negative side for breaking them, for example reducing Magic by 1 point for 24 hours. Running around, in Angel's case for example, with a magic of 4 doesn't seem very attractive. (Of course, there would be no negative effect due to her power focus, but still.) This way one would have to think whether the potential gain is worth the potential loss.


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 20, 2003)

Well, I would be willing to go with the breaking of the Geas costing an extra point of magic.  You made a pretty good point about it not costing anything to break it.  If your willing to go with what you posted above, I would as well.

On that note, do you think a spirit counts as far as that?  Even if she just used her stunbolts on it it wouldn't kill it only disrupt it I believe, but if she put too much behind it, it would still be possible to kill it.  I mean I doubt she'll be able to totally fill up 2 full bars with a single stun spell.


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## Douane (Mar 20, 2003)

1. If you really willing to put up with my "improved rule", great! (Of course I stand by that proposal.)


2. A very good question! At first I was inclined to say "No". However, after looking back on the stories I read and reading the descriptions of spirits, especially nature spirits, I changed my mind. Since spirits do seem to have individual personalities, I would say "Yes", killing them counts against the geas.

But when do you "kill" a spirit? In my opinion/conception such thing can only be done on the astral plane by doing full lethal damage; otherwise you will only disrupt it's manifestation, unless it is bound/forced into it. [Hope that answers your question.]


Folkert


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 20, 2003)

Shalimar said:
			
		

> *3)Don't need it, the other version of her had a higher quickness, so she could afford to wear more armor without penalties.  Right now a secure jacket is the most she can wear without being slowed, besides I like the image of the Cloak style secure long coat, it just seems like her.*




Form-Fitting armor does not count when calculating combat pool loss.


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## Shalimar (Mar 20, 2003)

even when layering it?  Hmm did not know that.  I just might have to pick some up then.


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## Xael (Mar 20, 2003)

Howling Coyote said:
			
		

> *
> 
> Form-Fitting armor does not count when calculating combat pool loss. *




Huh!? I'll take it...  

Douane: The sorcery house rule is fine by me. (I usually put all those spell pool dice to resist drain anyway.)


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## Shalimar (Mar 20, 2003)

> FFBA does not count when calculating Qui penalties or CP loss. it otherwise layers as normal--take the highest value, and add half the lower value. so, armored fatigues (5/3) and FFBA (4/1) would count as 5/3 for CP loss, but would have an armor rating of 7/3 and would not incur any Qui penalties at all.




I really did not know that form fitting body armor ignored combat pool and quickness penalties.  I think I'll take it.  At the very least, it would have been useful, and discrete when she was acting as a bodygaurd.


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## mistergone (Mar 20, 2003)

Hey, would there still be room in this game? I had stopped reading the thread, but I'd be interested. I don't have the 3rd edition book, but I played and ran @nd ed. for years (years ago).

If I could play, I'd like to play a straight-up Troll street samurai, unless that's already been done.


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## Douane (Mar 20, 2003)

Holy tights, Batman! 

I think I need to houserule that!  


[BTW, HC, where is that rule from?]


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## Douane (Mar 20, 2003)

@Mistergone:

Welcome!

However, I feel obliged to give the same "warning" as before, just in case. I stopped buying sourcebooks over ten years ago, with the consequence that my SR universe might differ somewhat from the "canon" one. (If you really the dig the published material, this might be frustrating for you. However, I never changed anything just for the sake of change.)
If you are willing to put up with that, go for that troll samurai. 

Oh, and I see the need to houserule some things, as evidenced by this thread. 


Folkert

[Edit: Please mail me, so we can work out the new priority system of 3rd Ed. and stuff. (email's in the profile)]


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## reapersaurus (Mar 20, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *So, reaper, are you going to play? *



Thanks, but I'm afraid I couldn't keep up with the rapid pace of the game (as it seems), and there's no way I could grok such a rules-heavy system, from what I read here.

Have a cool game, and keep with it, plug away, and have another system (SR) thrive on the boards!


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## Douane (Mar 20, 2003)

Come on, Reaper! 

We haven't even started yet, so this preparation thread should be no indication of our future pace. (In fact, this won't be going anywhere near once/daily, since I as GM couldn't keep up with that.)

Concerning the rules, SR is anything but rules-heavy (and nothing like D&D 3rd). Most of the stuff mentioned here is only important once, during PC creation. Anything else will mainly be handled by the GM, ie. me. 

Please consider this:

I stepped forward into GM duty only because I love this game, since I got so much fun and enjoyment out of it in those 13 years. These are the important points for me when playing SR, not strenously clinging to the rules. I've played SR sessions without ever rolling a dice, because the story went so smooth that I didn't want to disrupt it with dice rolling.

Yes, we were discussing rules here, but that's only because I'm used to a different set of rules than the players. So once we established them, that's it.

To summon this up:

_If you are interested in the world of SR and would like to play, please join. I'll do my best to make it an enjoyable trip. _


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 20, 2003)

Come on Reap, we really want you to play if your interested.  Remember the rules of the game are only a guideline, having fun is what is important.  I really think we can all have fun together.


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## Douane (Mar 20, 2003)

@all:

Concerning the Background of the PC's, this is what I ideally would like to see (well, read  I think it's for the best if you send the BG to my email-adress.):

1. Connections:
- name 
- short description

2. PC:
- Physical description
- history (esp. any memorable highlights) [please keep in mind, that you are no top shadowrunners (yet), but mere beginners (in this field of work)]
- familiy?
- cyberware?
- connection to Seattle
- notes on behaviour/habits
- attitude towards Humans and metahumans
- perhaps some explanation conerning your unusual skills
- reason for shadowrunning
- anything else you would like to mention

With this info I will do my best to tailor the campaign towards the PC's.


Folkert


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## Douane (Mar 20, 2003)

@ Xael:


> Concept: Character is an elf, who was born at Tir Tairngire and left to Seattle. Has worked at (insert a gunmaking corporation here. Ares?) building weapons. Now working for money as a shadowrunner. Strong feelings against humanis policlubs and racists.




A few questions/comments on this:

1. Why did he leave the Tir? From what I know it's a rather unusual direction, usually it's the other way round.

2. I think the megacorps would be very cautions to employ someone with even the slightest Tir ties. Smaller firms, however, might not be so choosy.
Leaving a megacorps? Reminds me of something from our campaign:
Corporate: "You should really join the corp. Due to all the benefits nobody has ever left the corp."
PC: "Really? I knew this guy once, who ..."
Corporate: "Let me rephrase that. Nobody, who is still alive, has ever left the corp."
PC: "Oh!"


Folkert


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## Xael (Mar 21, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *1. Why did he leave the Tir? From what I know it's a rather unusual direction, usually it's the other way round.
> 
> 2. I think the megacorps would be very cautions to employ someone with even the slightest Tir ties. Smaller firms, however, might not be so choosy.
> Leaving a megacorps? Reminds me of something from our campaign:
> ...





1. Argument with his parents, couldn't stand them. Relative lived in Seattle. 

2. Any gun-making firm will do it for me (suggestions?). I just don't know really anything besides the megacorps. And he was fired by a racist and dragged to "detention centre". He's officially dead because of night of rage.

I've got a longer version coming around, I'll try to finish it today.


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## Douane (Mar 21, 2003)

Xael said:
			
		

> *I've got a longer version coming around, I'll try to finish it today. *




Take your time! 

One thing I meant to post, but didn't due to falling asleep: 

Have you thought on reworking/bolstering your spell choices with that "options" of fetishes and/or exclusive?


Folkert


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## Xael (Mar 21, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *Have you thought on reworking/bolstering your spell choices with that "options" of fetishes and/or exclusive?
> *




I'll need to check the rules for those, as it seems that I've completely missed them.  Probably not, as both are restrictive.


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## Douane (Mar 21, 2003)

It just occured to me when I compared the adept's spell selection to that of the full mage. 


Folkert


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## Douane (Mar 21, 2003)

While I'm at it:

@ Shalimar

Sorry, because this comes kinda late. Could you consider reallocating a force point each at the spells Levitate, Detox and Detect Enemies. The way they are now is that without the special option they have no force at all, and I would like to have every selected spell have at least one force point.


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 21, 2003)

Consider it edited, I had to play around with my list abit to make it work, and ditch a few spells.

Spell List 35 points
Fireball [Exclusive] Force 5 [Fetish drain]
Stunball [Exclusive] force 5
Stunbolt Force 5
Heal [Exclusive] Force 5
Armor [fetish] Force 4
Physical Mask [fetish] Force 3
Physical Barrier Force [fetish] 3
Improved Invisibility [fetish] Force 3
Detect Enemies [Fetish] Force 2
Levitate [fetish] Force 2
POWER FOCUS BONDING force 2(10 points)

Fetishes, Foci, and Magic Gear
-Force 6 Sorcery Library
-Power Foci force 2 - A silver spiral armband on her upper arm
-Fireball fetish - a silver celtic cross earing on her left ear
-Armor fetish - a tiny shield on her charm bracelet
-Physical Mask fetish - a small phantom of the opera type mask on her charm bracelet
-Improved Invis fetish - A piercing in a rather provocative area
-Physical barrier fetish -  A charm bracelet that the other fetishes hang on
-Detect Enemies fetish - a silver celtic cross earing on her right ear
-levitate fetish - A silver pendant with angel wings


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## Douane (Mar 21, 2003)

Hope it wasn't too awkward. [My argument on this is such: These options should be helping to learn a spell, but not substituting the work/study, so you have to invest at least a minimum of force it. Hopefully this isn't unreasonable.]

BTW, should I add that FF BA to your character?


Thanks,

Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 21, 2003)

Please, add it.  I can afford the one suit of full, but after that, I have about 350 nuyen left of my resources.  How are you going to handle starting cash?  I mean the dice roll, just tell us how much, or what?


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## Douane (Mar 21, 2003)

Added!

Either way: roll yourself or tell me to roll. 


Folkert


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## mistergone (Mar 21, 2003)

Hey, well, what you said is fine, I'm pretty much in the same boat, as I haven't bought any books or run a Shadowrun game since 2nd ed. I have little idea what went on after 2053.

Here's the thing though, I'm not gonna go out and get the 3rd Ed. book. I already have a list of rpg books I want and it just ain't on it. So, I wouldn't really be able to make a character, unless it's exactly the same as 2nd ed. If someone could make a character for me, that would be keen. I could add the personal details. I know this sounds liek I don't care enough to play, but I would like to play, I am interested, I just don't have the materials to make a character. And yeah, I am lazy.

That being said, if it's still possible, I'd still like to play. I just need a character (male troll street samurai preferred) Heck, I'm not picky about cyberware, or weapons, or anything. To me, the important parts of a character are in the concept and details the player puts in to them. If it's too much trouble, I'll just pass on the game, no problem. If you want/need another player, I'm around.


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## Douane (Mar 21, 2003)

mistergone said:
			
		

> *Here's the thing though, I'm not gonna go out and get the 3rd Ed. book. I already have a list of rpg books I want and it just ain't on it. *




Understandable; in fact I only possess the 3rd Ed Core Book (well, most of it). That is why I posted that the two of us should get in touch about creating a character. Right now I have a few errands to run, but I'll mail you as soon as I get back and we'll talk about that troll. 


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 21, 2003)

If your serious about it I'll make one for you, just give me a bit more to go on.  Give me an idea of the character so I know what grade of cyber he would buy, what skills he would have.

Well here's an idea, the SR3 mainbook has all of the archrtypes stated out, you could just go with the troll Mercenary from there I put it up here and you Yea or nae it.

Body 12(10)
Quickness 7(5)
Strength 11(9)
Charisma 2
Intelligence 4
will power 4

essence 1.04
Reaction 5
Initiative 2d6

Combat pool 7
Balistic/ impact 1/1

Cash 13,964

Cyber
Bona-lacing Titanium Alpha
Smartlink Alpha
Muscle-replacement 2 Alpha
Electronic vision Mag 1 Alpha
Flare Compensation Alpha
Boosted reflexes 2 Alpha

Skills:
English 5(R/W 2)
Mercenary Groups 4
Mercenary Hotspots 4
Weight Lifting 4
Desert Wars 4
BK: Electronics 4
Unarmed Combat 6
Heavy weapons 6
Assault rifles 5
Launch Weapons 4
Pistols 4
stealth/sneaking 2/4
Etiquette/merc  1/3

Gear:
Ares Antioch (under barrel Gernade Launcher) + smartlink
10 offensive HE mini-gernades
Ingram Valiant (light Machine Gun)+ Deluxe Gyromount+smart link
200 regular rounds
100 explosive rounds
Beretta model 110-T (Heavy Pistol) +smart link
50 regular rounds
FN Har (assault rifle) + Smart link
100 rounds

Armored Vest w/plates  B/I 4/3
Camo Full Suit  B/I 5/3

Goggles: Thermo + Low Light
Micro-Transceiver 5
Navigational GPS
10 days ration bars
Survival kit
3 trauma patches

3 months middle lifestyle


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## mistergone (Mar 22, 2003)

Looks okay... some of that is bioware though, and I've always disliked muscle replacement... plus, no vehicle skills, which is a negative.. I'm going to respond to Douane's email here soon....


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 22, 2003)

_Douane:_

Do you want write-ups from the SR Companion edges & flaws also, or just the CC, MM, and SOTA stuff?

Swarts essence is bit low. What's your opinion, should I try ditching some of his ware?

_mistergone:_

Muscle replacement isn't bioware; its bioware equal is muscle augmentation and muscle toner.


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## Douane (Mar 22, 2003)

@Howling Coyote:

No need for the edges/flaws, thanks!

Well, I've to say that he is a little bit on the "inhuman" (as in machine-like), but this is really your decision. Perhaps ditch some of the stuff not central to your maritime theme? (ie. Bone lacing or those low-level filters?)

One thing, HC: Yesterday I got a chance to take look at Man and Machine at my LGS; while going through I read about some piece called "NIctating membranes" (?), wouldn't these be a perfect addition to the PC?


You surely meant to say: 



> Muscle replacement isn't bioware; its *cyber*ware equal is muscle augmentation and muscle toner.





Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 22, 2003)

> Looks okay... some of that is bioware though, and I've always disliked muscle replacement... plus, no vehicle skills, which is a negative.. I'm going to respond to Douane's email here soon....




Nope, no bioware in it at all.  That is the sample troll merc from the main SR3 book.  It is all from that one book.  I don't mind if you don't like it, just posted it up since I didn't know what you wanted.  Feel free to ignore it, and it is just the sample character from the book, so you could change the skills if you wanted to.


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 22, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *Well, I've to say that he is a little bit on the "inhuman" (as in machine-like), but this is really your decision. Perhaps ditch some of the stuff not central to your maritime theme? (ie. Bone lacing or those low-level filters?)
> 
> One thing, HC: Yesterday I got a chance to take look at Man and Machine at my LGS; while going through I read about some piece called "NIctating membranes" (?), wouldn't these be a perfect addition to the PC?*




I was thinking that bonelacing was unnecessary also, so I guess they are gone.

Nictitating Membranes are nice and all, but unfortunately they happen to be bioware.


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## Douane (Mar 22, 2003)

Thanks for doing so, Shalimar!  [And for the offer of creating a PC]


Just to clear things up, I had mailed mistergone about character creation the last evening (mentioned the no bioware rule), but didn't give a look at the boards (and therefore did not see your kind offer) due to a surprise visit from some friends.


Folkert


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## Douane (Mar 22, 2003)

Howling Coyote said:
			
		

> *Nictitating Membranes are nice and all, but unfortunately they happen to be bioware. *




Oops! Should have read more thoroughly, but I guess the shopkeeper wouldn't have liked that. 

Still, since they fit the concept so nicely, I would have nothing against them. (And it's not like they are a piece of powergaming.)


Folkert


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 22, 2003)

Well it is flare compensation and protective covers in one without the essence cost. I guess I could take them since I still got lots of money to spare.


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## Xael (Mar 22, 2003)

Douane:

I E-mailed Xerd's (almost) complete history and stats to you. As I aren't really too familiar with the world of Shadowrun, please tell me of any not-world-fitting things in the history. I must confess that I suck when making up names, which can be seen at the "contacts" part of the document. Anybody know a good name generator? 

And I probably have forgotten something.

Edit: And of course I notice some stuff placed at idiotic places. Xerd's carried stuff weights about 20 Kg (The straining limit for Xerd is 30 Kg, right?).


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 22, 2003)

I'm in slight troubles with Swarts age, since he would be in his fifties now, if he goblinized during his 7th year in the university, with the rest of the world. At first I figured he would be in his thirties or maybe forties, but the SR timeline is too sparse for that. So any suggestion how I should approach this problem?


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## Douane (Mar 22, 2003)

@ HC:

I just reread the stuff concerning this: 2021 was just the first occurence of goblinization. Even today it seems possible for people to transform, even though the goblinization usually sets in during your adolescense, if you aren't born an ork. Perhaps in his case there was some delaying factor, so he got hit during university, for example a magic factor or some genetic aspect. In fact, his genetics seem to be somewhat different, hence his "essence reduction". Perhaps this contributed to the delay?


Just a few thoughts, [Hope they help!]

Folkert

[EDIT] P.S.: Thanks for the mail with tech info! At least I do know now, what exactly Swart can do.


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## Shalimar (Mar 22, 2003)

Well, goblinization still happens its much much much rarer than being born one but it still does happen.  There is no reason at least by shadowrun he has to have goblinized way back when.  And remember, those who goblinize live a lot longer.


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 22, 2003)

Actually the essence reduction is meant to represent better quality of surgical implantation. Swarts cyberware is 100% alphaware, so I figure he got at least some point of his life access to high-end facilities, probably in the university. It does not affect any future implantations unless the proper quality surgical facilities are used.

I'm aware that goblinized orks retain their normal lifespan, but even a 55-year-old human is bit old for a shadowrunner. 

I'm thinking that an optimal thing would be that he was born 2009, goblinized in 2031 (ten years late) at the age of 22. The Night of Rage was 2039, so he was 30 then. Now in the year 2054 he would be 45, that's still bit old, but acceptable for an academic character.


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## Shalimar (Mar 22, 2003)

I think is fine personally.  So long as you have fun with him does his age truly matter (Says the elf)?


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## Douane (Mar 22, 2003)

Howling Coyote said:
			
		

> *Actually the essence reduction is meant to represent better quality of surgical implantation. Swarts cyberware is 100% alphaware, so I figure he got at least some point of his life access to high-end facilities, probably in the university. It does not affect any future implantations unless the proper quality surgical facilities are used.
> *




Er, I always knew that, just wanted to suggest an alternative way of looking at the edge.  [Oops!]



> I'm thinking that an optimal thing would be that he was born 2009, goblinized in 2031 (ten years late) at the age of 22. The Night of Rage was 2039, so he was 30 then. Now in the year 2054 he would be 45 [...]




If you are comfortable with this, make it so! Otherwise knock the age somewhat down, until it fits. After all it's the Sixth World!


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 22, 2003)

Douane, I have just calculated all my cash that I have left before it gets divided by 10.  I have 10, 015 left after the ffba.  Would you mind terribly if I used that money to purchase a few spell formulas?  I know I can't learn them right away, but they could still be useful when I do.  I could pick up the formulas for the spells I had to drop.  I could also eventually just write the spells using my spell design skill, but it easier this way.


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## Douane (Mar 22, 2003)

Shalimar said:
			
		

> *Douane, I have just calculated all my cash that I have left before it gets divided by 10.  I have 10, 015 left after the ffba.  Would you mind terribly if I used that money to purchase a few spell formulas?  I know I can't learn them right away, but they could still be useful when I do.  I could pick up the formulas for the spells I had to drop.  I could also eventually just write the spells using my spell design skill, but it easier this way. *




Please, go ahead. 


Folkert


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## mistergone (Mar 22, 2003)

Shalimar said:
			
		

> *
> 
> Nope, no bioware in it at all.  That is the sample troll merc from the main SR3 book.  It is all from that one book.  I don't mind if you don't like it, just posted it up since I didn't know what you wanted.  Feel free to ignore it, and it is just the sample character from the book, so you could change the skills if you wanted to. *




Oh, I thought that Bossted Reflexes was bioware.. I seem to remember it first appearing in... hm, okay I guess you're right.
And yes, thank you, I forgot to say thanks before. 

I'm just gonna pass on the game. Thanks for considering me. I'm just too lazy to make a character right now, plus I got other things on my mind. Good luck and have fun.


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## Shalimar (Mar 23, 2003)

These are the formulas I've purchased, I'll email you the stat blocks later For those in MITS: They have * next to them

Spell------------------------Formula 
*Makeover Force 1------------------------------2(M)
*Clean Element(Air) Force 1-------------------2(S)
*Fashion Force 5---------------------------------6(L)
*Sterilize Force 1--------------------------------2(M)
Healthy Glow Force 3--------------------------3(L)
Detox Force 1-----------------------------------1(D)
Trid Entertainment Force 2-------------------3(L)
Detect Object(Guns) Force 3-----------------4(S)
Detect Object(Explosives) Force 3----------4(S)
Detect Magic Force 3---------------------------3(L)
Detect Idividual Force 5-----------------------5(L)


Wow, cheaper then I thought they would be, in everything except karma to learn but you can have everything  

My starting Cash is 1,361.


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## Shalimar (Mar 23, 2003)

Well, here are those spell texts, hmmpf with all these formulas added to her spell list she wont need to run to make cash, she'll have all those spells that the rich use to show their status (Healthy Glow, Makeover, Fashion, Detox):

Makeover:
Type: P  Target: 6  Duration: P  Drain: +1(M)
  This spell creates a complete makeover for a volutary subject, including cosmetics, hair and clothes.  It even polishes teeth and eliminates plaque.  Changes are as permanent as those made in a Beauty Salon. The number of successes measures the degree of style in the makeover.

Clean Element:
Type: P  Target: 6  Duration: P  Drain: +1(S)
  This area spell clears all impurities out of a volume of air, earth, or water leaving it completely clean.  Each element requires a seperate spell.  For example, Clean Air, could be used to clean a room of toxic fumes, or Clean Water could purify a drinking supply.  Successes determine how thoroughly the element is cleaned;  muddy water would only require 1 or 2 successes to clean,  but contaminated runoff could require as many as 5 successes to make drinkable.

Fashion:
Type: P  Target: 6  Duration: P  Drain: +1(L)
  This spellinstantly tailors clothing, transforming garments into any fashion the caster wishes.  The successes measure the degree of style in the tailoring.  The spell cannot change clothing's protective value, only its cut and its fit.  The weight of the clothing does not change, and it must cover approximately the same amount of area (a jumpsuit could not be converted into a bikini).  This spell cannot change clothing with a total Armor Rating (ballistic and impact) higher then force (+1 per 2 successes).  The caster must touch the clothing.

Sterilize:
Type: P  Target: 4  Duration: I  Drain: +1(M)
  This area-effect spell kills bacteria and other microorganisms and destroys material such as skin flakes, stray hairs and spilled blood.  Organic material affected by this spell cannot be used as a material link.  Because it does not affect biomaterial attached to a living being, it does not kill the various helpful and harmful microorganisms living inside a creature.  In game terms, each success acheived in casting the spell (up to a maximum equal to the spells force) adds a +2 target number modifier to any skill tests made to collect and use sterilized biomaterial to identify someone.


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## Douane (Mar 23, 2003)

Oh no, I've opened the Box of Pandora! 


Consider them added to my version of the PC and thanks for posting the spells. 


Folkert


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## Douane (Mar 23, 2003)

Sorry to see you go, "mistergone"! 

But unfortunately there is nothing that can be done against other commitments.  Please post here again if you can free yourself.


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 23, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *Oh no, I've opened the Box of Pandora!
> 
> 
> Consider them added to my version of the PC and thanks for posting the spells.
> ...




Naw, no need to worry, they really are all flavor spells, things that either fit her club-going personality(Fashion, Makeover, Detox, trid-entertainment)  or fit being a bodyguard: all the detects, Clean Air(get rid of those pesky sleeping gas gernades and what have you), and sterilize just because she has to learn one spell thats good for a runner.

But they really make spell formulas cheep.  The most I spent on one was something like 2k for the two force 3 detects.


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## Douane (Mar 23, 2003)

Shalimar said:
			
		

> *Naw, no need to worry, they really are all flavor spells [...]*




I wasn't really worried; my post was entirely meant in jest, hence the smiley.

I have to admit, though, that I'm surprised how much magic (theoretically) one can gain for such a small amount of money.
Well, that's the future. 


Folkert


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## Xael (Mar 23, 2003)

So how is the complete character scene going? Has everyone finished their characters? 

Unless Douane has something to say about Xerd, he's pretty much ready (ok, still need to think those contacts a bit).


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## Douane (Mar 23, 2003)

@ all:

Here is another point for your consideration:

So far we have:

- an elven Bodyguard/Sorcerous Adept
- an elven Gunsmith/Mage
- an orcish Marine Biologist with a gun 


Mistergone has other commitments.
Reapersaurus also (Since he responded to neither of my two emails, I don't think he's going to play.)
A friend of mine, whom I intended to invite, has dropped off the surface of the earth.


This leaves us with the above-mentioned three.


Question: Should I open a general recruitment thread? 

(The reason why I have not done so from the beginning was to give the posters on this thread the first opportunity to get in; I figure if they haven't posted by now, they are not going to.)

If so, how many openings?

(My preferred option would be four, as this is my first GM PbP abd I do not want to overextend my GM abilities to the the detriment of the story/game. Perhaps I'm wrong on this. Any opinions from the more experienced PbP'ers?)


Folkert


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## Douane (Mar 23, 2003)

Xael said:
			
		

> *Unless Douane has something to say about Xerd, he's pretty much ready (ok, still need to think those contacts a bit). *




Xael, didn't you get my email?


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 23, 2003)

well none of these spells had variable drain codes, if they did they would have cost much more.  Since its sold off max drain of a spell Buying a force 5 heal or any force 5 combat spell would cost 5,000, but for the ones I bought, mostly light and moderate its more like 50 times the force of the spell, or 100 times, even Serious drain is only 500 times.

Remember the monetary costs aren't the only ones associated with learning spells, so yes its easy to pick up spell formulas with the right contacts, but its the karma cost to learn thats going to be the sticking price, off the top of my head she'll need 28 karma to learn those spells.  Besides after character gen there is a street index of 2 if buying illegaly.  

If you want to buy legally you have to register any spells you buy force three and up since they require licenses.  Not many shadow runners want to register the spells they buy as they are probably highly illegal like hellblast etc.  For a legally upstanding citizen who has a SIN buying the spells I bought would be pretty easy and considered harmless, I might get a letter asking if I was interested in Joining a corp. as I am sure that corps cast a wide net for mages, and making purchases that leave records would be like dangling a hunk of meat in a pirahna cage.


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## Shalimar (Mar 23, 2003)

Unless you feel we need more players three can be fine at least from my perspective.  As long as we gave them a piece of the take I am sure we have the contacts to act as deckers (I do for sure) We would need a rigger, maybe, the only thing I can drive is my Yamaha rapier and thats with me being specialized in it to get to 3.

I am not sure we would get anymore if they haven't posted by now.  Though it wouldn't hurt to try it.  Something like: Shadowrun (Recruitment)  that being the general format for recruiting.  Again not sure, but it can't hurt.

A good thing to put in that is that you already have 3 players, and list what we are, so there is some knowledge there for anyone who is thinking about it, this thread is getting rather long or people to want to jump into it.


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## Douane (Mar 23, 2003)

Shalimar said:
			
		

> *Remember the monetary costs aren't the only ones associated with learning spells, so yes its easy to pick up spell formulas with the right contacts, but its the karma cost to learn thats going to be the sticking price, off the top of my head she'll need 28 karma to learn those spells. [...]*




This should be a very good point, the last Mage I GM'ed used to burn most of his karma just to stay alive.


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## Douane (Mar 23, 2003)

@ Shalimar:

2 things concerning Angel just popped up in my mind: (and since you are online now)

1. How about a talismonger connection?

2. Your contact "Seamus" is written to have founded a firm in seattle, What kind of firm, ie, what services does it provide, legal or illegel, etc.? (Left intentionally vague to not spoil any secrets.)

Could you email me on this?


Folkert


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## Xael (Mar 23, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *
> 
> Xael, didn't you get my email?
> 
> ...




I did now.   (Note to self: Check e-mail more often.)

0. What is "convoluted"?

1. Hmm... I didn't know the fact. Maybe they moved away when the Tir formed. I'd like to keep them human (and they're too old to be elves I think).

2. First part: Lets say born there before Tir formed. Second: Modifying guns for money to street gangs (Ancients, Princes...etc.) and studying?  

3. Ok. 

4. I didn't think of that, I just took Magic knowledge. Hmm...

5. Ok, I'll change _some_ of them. But "half-awakened" D ) have 10 points head start anyway.

6. Ok. (Note to self: Make a spell called "Message Raven"  .)


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## Xael (Mar 23, 2003)

Revised spell list:

Ball Lightning 5
Armor 6 (Drain M! Come on!)
Heal 5 (Exclusive. *Sigh*)
Resist pain 3
Improved Invisibility 1
Levitate 1
Nutrition 1
Wind 5


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## Douane (Mar 23, 2003)

@ Xael:

0. Hmm, don't really know how to explain it, what about : "not in a straight line, complex"?

1. NO, not another native american elf!!!  

2. Born somewhere around 2020? (Just to get in synch with the Night of Rage.)

4. No pressure, if you like it that way. 

5. Could be really useful, that spell, especially within the barrens.


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 23, 2003)

I don't mind putting this part on the boards Folkert.  This Xael might actuallly know of.

1)Well I just hadn't though about it as she has a totally SIN and can just buy things legally.  I always thought contacts were more more of a less then legal nature as far as procurement of things from the way the book presents them.  Hrmm, Then I geuss she should probably get 1 for her less then legal needs, hmmm.  I think, that she'll just take one as her level 1 contact.  I'll leave that up to you FOlkert, though it might be interesting if both Xael's and my Talismonger is the same person.  I am not planning on much contact with the person since she can be much cheaper and much safer legally.


2)Seamus's firm is actually a legal business.  He and his staff act as magical tutors, sort off.  Between him and his staff, they know a heck of a lot of spells.  They contract themselves out to train corporate mages, to teach people individual spells, to do wards, to bind elementals as gaurdians around sites, the stereo typical jobs done by mages, they even have one mage that works heavily with the entertainment industry as a special effects mage.


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## Douane (Mar 23, 2003)

Xael said:
			
		

> *So how is the complete character scene going? Has everyone finished their characters?  *




I've just received HC's background, so we have 3 characters ready-to-run. 


Folkert

[EDIT
P.S. When I find something, ie, some run, to bring these rather disparate personalities together.

P.P.S. How about: "You meet in a bar and decide to slay the dragon." ? [Folkerts ducks and runs. ]


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## Xael (Mar 23, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *
> 
> I've just received HC's background, so we have 3 characters ready-to-run. *




Except that my contacts still haven't got names.


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## Douane (Mar 23, 2003)

Well, (just a quick brainstorming)

1) Andrew?

2) John Shalene? ...Benson?

3) Shorty? Cog? Hermes?

4) Slick? Gears?


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## Shalimar (Mar 23, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *
> 
> I've just received HC's background, so we have 3 characters ready-to-run.
> 
> ...




If we have to slay a dragon Kate is going straight.  Those things are scary, flat out scary.

Do have a question though.  Being as there are  only three of us and our areas of expertise are Stealth, Protective spells, Healing Magic, small arms, and Swart's long gun.  Will the runs be modeled around our skills for the most part or no?

And we as a group really really need another player, a skilled one.  We don't have electronics, or computers between us, so there goes data steals and having to get around all of the goodies.  Perhaps an npc?


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## Douane (Mar 23, 2003)

Don't worry, no dragons! As it is traditional for SR, they work too far in the background.



> Being as there are only three of us and our areas of expertise are Stealth, Protective spells, Healing Magic, small arms, and Swart's long gun. Will the runs be modeled around our skills for the most part or no?




They will of course be tailored to take your skills into account, as I've always done with any group; however, there's no guarantee that it will be a custom-fit. 




> And we as a group really really need another player, a skilled one. We don't have electronics, or computers between us, so there goes data steals and having to get around all of the goodies. Perhaps an npc?




Well, I'm still hoping for my friend to re-surface. [In fact I hope for this without any regard to gaming, that would be just an added bonus.] 
Perhaps, in the meantime, a NPC would be indeed in order. What about a rigger with those needed technical skills?


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 23, 2003)

That would probably work in the mean-time yes.  The best solution for this would be to find another player be it your friend or just someone from the boards.  That way we could have someone with the skills permanently.


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 24, 2003)

Any ideas how to spend 80000?


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## Shalimar (Mar 24, 2003)

Here are a few general things:

mag-lock passkey  rating 4-----------8k
keypad sequencer  rating 4----------8k
Scanner  rating 7-----------------------700
Micro-tranceiver rating 8--------------8k
Sub-vocal microphone-----------------500
Nav Dat GPS-----------------------------700
Flashpacks-------------------------------250/1
Survival kit-------------------------------100

Add Thermo damping to your clothes, Insulation, and non-conduction.

Purchase a credstick for each SIN you have, the higheset quality you can get so that it stands up to security checks, a rating 8 credstick costs 30k or so, though for a legal SIN there is no nead to buy the top rating credstick as you have no reason to hide anything.


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## Shalimar (Mar 24, 2003)

Ooh, back up life-styles, weapons, extra clips prefilled, and a few cartons of ammo.  Just back ups of any of your important gear that have higher street index prices.


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 24, 2003)

Just to note the max rating for gear was 6. Still those are good suggestions, thanks.


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## Shalimar (Mar 24, 2003)

oops, mixed availibility and rating, sorry


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## reapersaurus (Mar 24, 2003)

Douane (and all):
I just got your email today (I don't check my hotmail account regularly), and that was awful nice of you to go out of your way like that. I'm sorry I hadn't responded yet - 

I have been going back and forth, back and forth with this....

Douane, you sound like a very experienced DM, and I trust you when you say the game won't require lots of time, but... this thread certainly does require keeping up with, and unfortunately, my time is very limited as of late. 

I would just back out, to make it simple and clean, but it looks like fun still, and you say it won't require multiple readings a day once it's going, and you mention wanting a couple more players...

Tell you what.
I'll have you decide.
If you guys want a couple part-time players, to add in our 2 cents to your lead(s), I could probably post the characters we have, and then ask for help from anyone that'll offer to clean 'em up and make 'em additions to your game. I remember some of the rules, and can play by them, it's just the character-generation process, as you explained, Douane, IS rather rules-intensive (which normally -given time- I like).

Or if you guys want to stay as a small, tight unit, I totally understand, and we'll back out.
Or if you want more experienced (in SR) players, I totally understand that, too.

It's up to you guys, either way.

Oh, Vych's character is very loosely based on Molly Millions from you-know-where. A bad-ass females Street Samurai with street contacts and firepower.
My character is loosely inspired by the (ninja?) assassin in Neuromancer, as well. A former corp assassin physical adept who fell in love (was entranced?) by a rebel leader gal who he was ordered to take out.


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## Shalimar (Mar 24, 2003)

I would love to have you two, I really would.  And he is completely right, ther is no reason to need to have to read the In game thread more then 1 time a day, or more then once every two days.  The reason there is so much posting now is that this IS the most rules intensive time of the game, Character creation.  After this I expect it will slow down to a much more regular pace.



> Or if you guys want to stay as a small, tight unit, I totally understand, and we'll back out.




Ick, heck no, its better to have more people to play, more characters means more availible skills, and more availible straight up fighters by the looks of those two.  The only question I really have is does either character have any skill with computers and electronics?  Doesn't matter either way, but it would be very very useful as we all lack it.


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## reapersaurus (Mar 24, 2003)

If you'd be willing to help, Shalimar, I'd be leaning on you (and anyone willing) to help make our characters legal.
If I get time tomorrow, I'll post the monstrosity Cyberware & Bioware enhanced Street Samurai, Bowie.
I'm pretty sure my phys-ad will be by the rules, except for the little flavor of cyberware included for character's sake (someone can probably guess what piece of cyberware it is...)


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## Shalimar (Mar 24, 2003)

Sure, feel very free to lean.  Just note that there is no bioware in this game.  I'd love to help you and vych.



> (someone can probably guess what piece of cyberware it is...)




Smartlink 2?

If you really are adding Cyber to the adept, I would suggest you pack in the most possible in that 1 point of essence, it wont cost any more of your magic so long as you don't go below 5.  Some of the best things to pack into that one point of essence, If you can afford it, is (All Alpha) smartlink 2, Cyber Eye replacement with Low-light, Thermo, Flare Comp, and electronic vision mag 3;  and Cyber ear replacement with hearing amp, Damp, and Sound filter 5.  Its cheaper to shove all of the sense wear into that 1 point of essence then to buy it up with adept powers.  But that is totally up to you, just an observation.


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## Xael (Mar 24, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *Well, (just a quick brainstorming)
> 
> 1) Andrew?
> 
> ...




1. Ok

2. John Benson

3. Hermes

4. Slick

Wohoo!


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## Douane (Mar 24, 2003)

Hi Reaper, welcome back!

First thing: I hope I didn't give the impression of implying anything negative with my above remark; when you didn't reply I had just assumed that you were too busy. (Well, I had considered the account thing, too, and had planned on giving it another try by mailing your wife some time during the week.)


Concerning the sacrifice of time:

I will freely admit to my own fault in making this thread so cumbersome with all of my "Have you thought about this" and "I have a houserule on that", but I'm doing this to get a feel for the characters involved in order to provide a better game. However, most of this is limited to the actual PC creation, so it won't get in the way later on.

In regard to a possible posting frequency, I can assure you that it will be once every two days at most. (Due to my own situation [ie. translating my thoughts from german into english and then cleaning them up] this would be the optimum I deem possible for me.)



> Or if you want more experienced (in SR) players, I totally understand that, too.



Please let me tell you that this would be the worst reason for not playing.

In my rather long years of GM'ing SR I hace met many a newcomer, who - would we have been put into direct comparison concerning our gaming abilites - would have surely put me to shame.
On the other hand, I had my share of "veteran/oldtimer" players whose main effect was to have everyone at the table considering quit playing SR. (I hope that I don't fall into this category myself.)


In conclusion:

*We would really love to have both of you playing!* 


Concerning the characters, please post them. I know Shalimar will do her best to adjust them to the campaign. (I would offer my assistance as well, but, given my rather old-fashioned attitudes, Shalimar is really your best choice.)


[Hope all of this makes sense, since I'm typing it with a cold and a monstrous headache.]

Folkert


P.S. I hope the boards don't swallow this post, too.


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## Douane (Mar 24, 2003)

@ all

While I'm at it, there's one thing I would like all of you to think about. I'm very sure that we all have different conceptions of SR (I know I have ) and of what constitutes a good campaign/story.

So if you could state the aspects you are not fond of, I will try to manage that and avoid if them, if possible.

Also, if there's something you would really like to see, please speak up.


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 24, 2003)

The only things I didn't like about shadowrun was decking and rigging, but thats only because they have so many complex rules, they just seemed to leave the rest of the group twiddling its collectve thumbs while they waited for the person to get done what they had to.  The easiest fix that I found was just to make npcs do that stuff so that the GM can just say what happens and not have to dwell in it.

I would like a little to see some free spirits and not neccessarily evil ones, again if your up for it.  I like the fact that they can have their own goals and not just be servants.


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## Xael (Mar 24, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *Also, if there's something you would really like to see, please speak up.*




Guns, lots of guns.  (Though preferably NOT pointed at Xerd...)

Seriously, no idea. T-Birds and/or helicopters that Xerd could steal?


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 24, 2003)

What I strive for is a complex and intriguing plot, I just love a good story.  

Btw. I'm not going to be very active this week, since I have an exam, and have to finish three projects (two haven't even been started yet.)


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## Douane (Mar 24, 2003)

Shalimar said:
			
		

> *The only things I didn't like about shadowrun was decking and rigging, but thats only because they have so many complex rules, they just seemed to leave the rest of the group twiddling its collectve thumbs while they waited for the person to get done what they had to.  The easiest fix that I found was just to make npcs do that stuff so that the GM can just say what happens and not have to dwell in it.
> 
> I would like a little to see some free spirits and not neccessarily evil ones, again if your up for it.  I like the fact that they can have their own goals and not just be servants. *




Myself, I just love rigging/riggers. (In fact, the first PC I ever made was one.) But that was back in the day and not quite as rules-intensive as it today.

Concerning decking there is nothing I could agree more with. (This is why I am quite happy have noone playing one.)


Free spirits, hmm? The campaign background has in fact one, though I thought that its own story had come to an end. Well, maybe not.  [And yes, I'm very proud that I had introduced that one into my campaign, before any official SR product had done anything in that direction.]


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## Douane (Mar 24, 2003)

Xael said:
			
		

> *Guns, lots of guns. *




Hmm, no problem! 



> *(Though preferably NOT pointed at Xerd...)*




Hmm, big problem! 




> Seriously, no idea. T-Birds and/or helicopters that Xerd could steal?




What is he going to do with them? "No guys, seriously, one point of skill is enough to fly it properly!"


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## Douane (Mar 24, 2003)

Howling Coyote said:
			
		

> *What I strive for is a complex and intriguing plot, I just love a good story.  *




I'll do my very best, sir! 



> *Btw. I'm not going to be very active this week, since I have an exam, and have to finish three projects (two haven't even been started yet*




I wish you an extraordinary amount of success, Howling Coyote!

[Sorry, but I've been taught to never wish luck, since it is a fickle thing.]


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## reapersaurus (Mar 24, 2003)

(checking in from work)
Thanks for the words.

As for what I prefer (if it means anything from a total newB to SR), I would rather not have a ton of canon thrown in (i think this was already addressed), since the more the world is detailed, the less flexibility you have in adventuring.

I agree about the decking boredom.

As for my take - I don't like the aspect of SR that we are all just schmucks, with little to no power to really affect anything.

Here's my worries - someone please tell me why it's not an issue:
In SR, don't we play flunkies of either a fixer or a corp?
If we are independant, the minute we're successful enough to accomplish anything, won't we register as a blip on the corporation's radar, and we'll either be assimilated or exterminated as competition?
If we're corp, aren't we kinda stuck, with no free-will?

It's my main question with both Shadowrun, and Vampire: the Masquerade.
IMO, Both systems aren't "heroic" systems because of it, and I've never understood how a campaign can be run IF we're playing 'heroes'.

IF we aren't playing heroes, how long are corp lackeys or doomed or incompetent independants interesting to play?

Thanks for helping me understand.


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## Shalimar (Mar 24, 2003)

> since the more the world is detailed, the less flexibility you have in adventuring.




We aren't adventurers, we aren't the good guys, we are criminals.  Its just a question of how criminal we are that is up to us.  We can say no to runs that we are against.  For example, Angel, my character will not take any jobs that require killing someone (Wet Work), she like most elves doesn't like killing, she will only do it to save her own life, or that of someone she is protecting.



> In SR, don't we play flunkies of either a fixer or a corp?




Hell no, we are not funkies in any sense of the word, if we were "flunkies" we would die very fast.  We are professionals, fixers have the contact info for shadowrunners yes, but that means nothing, the runners don't have to accept the runs at all.  Fixers simply set up Johnsons (Corporate reps) with people who can do the runs that they need done.  Its up to the runner to negotiate a price, whatever price they can get for themselves, decide whether they are going to do the run, plan it out, and do it.

This isn't DnD, we aren't the righters of wrongs, we aren't heros, but what we are is people, people trying to get by in a world where people slip through the cracks and are treated like filth.  Just because we are criminals doesn't make us murderers.  We play real people, we have feelings, and we have goals.

Just remember we aren't lackeys, we are professionals, we are effectively a group of mercenaires thats hire ourselves out.  And yes Shadowrunners can change the world, but it depends on the power level of the campaign.


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## Douane (Mar 24, 2003)

@ Reaper:

I will try to answer your questions to the best of my abilities:

[Please be aware that the statements concerning the world of SR are made from my PoV, one not necessarily shared by other SR players.]

1. "Canon". 
Don't worry about that, PC actions won't be limited because things are supposed to happen in a certain way.


2. "Independence"
I do not consider the PC's to be flunkies of either megacorps or fixers. 
In the case of Megacorps this is due to the "this time with you, next time against you" nature of SR. Runners are hired for one specific job, not put on retainer. Though someone might work several times for a specific corps on preference or for other reasons, there is still the chance that someone else might offer better incentives. (Anything else is selling out to the corps.)
[IMO corps-campaigns don't work that well, due to the danger of them becoming a series of "point and fire" missions.]

The fixer is just a middleman, doing his work for a cut. He has no hold over the PCs to make them take a certain job. (Unless you still owe him that "one favour".) He gets the job proposals from the corps, and, like an agent, checks his database of available "talent" for appropriate people.

Why or how do successful Shadowrunners survive? Because they are needed! There are enough newbies/wannabees on the streets, but you need the competent ones to do jobs for you, so there's no point in killing them. And if you hire the good ones, well, they are no longer deniable. Even if they somehow managed to harm you beyond concilation, are they worth the continued waste of company resources?


3. "Heroic"
I agree that SR is less heroic than other RPG's and somewhat more mercenary in nature, ie. you don't save villages, countries or the whole world. But there is still a heroic bent possible (if only on a smaller scale), because sometimes you manage to save one or even a few persons. Perhaps you are able to expose that nefarious scheme which could have caused grievious harm to an entire neighbourhood or even a district. By doing so you are crucial to a change for the better, but you don't get to be a hero. The media won't be talking about this and in fact it would be better if noone knew what you did, except for a select few. (And you'd better hope someone pays you for it.)

You can accomplish something, but it will always be"small stuff", ie. you won't change the world. But then, perhaps it doesn't want to be changed.


4. "Interesting to play?"
I've always tried to avoid making my campaigns a series of runs, ie. one job following the next time without downtime. In fact, I consider the time spent while not on a run to be far more interesting and with much more potential for a good story.



I hope I've managed to answer your questions about the peculiarities of SR at least a little bit.

Folkert


[EDIT: One thing to remember might be that SR thrives on the cyberpunk-ish feeling "rebel against the system". ]


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## Xael (Mar 25, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *What is he going to do with them? "No guys, seriously, one point of skill is enough to fly it properly!"  *




Of course not! More like: "No guys, seriously, defaulting to reaction is enough to fly it properly!"


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## Tory Adore (Mar 25, 2003)

Hey there Shal  All this is directly from my old character sheet. We actually only got to play a couple of times, and I KNOW Bowie is WAY off base from what I can have for the game, but anything you can do to or add to her to make it work is fine with me. I have hardly any experience in SR, so anything you can help me with is much appreciated. You mentioned you needed someone with computer ability? Feel free to add whatever will help. Geez...she's actually kinda scary as is now that I take another look at her. LOL

*Vitals*
Street Name: Bowie – real name unknown
Archetype: Street Samurai
Race: Human
Sex: Female
Height: 6’5”
Weight: 187lbs
Hair: Black with red streaks – cut short sometimes spiky on top
Eyes: Blood red
Birthdate: Unknown
Birthplace: Industry Hills, Los Angeles, California

Total Karma: 7.5 (17)
Remaining Karma: 3.5 (13)

*Attributes*
Body 4 (Aug 5)
Quickness 7 (Aug 10)
Strength 6 (Aug 9 – 3pts recoil reduction w/cyberarm)
Charisma 2
Intelligence 6 (Aug 8) 
Willpower 4
Essence .29 (low)
Reaction (Aug 15) 
Initiative 1d6 (Aug 3d)

*Pools*
Karma Pool 2
Combat Pool 11
_(Q+I+W/2)_

*Cyberware*
Wired reflexes 2 (cost 3) 14 reaction + 2d6 initiative dice (total 3d6)
Reflex trigger (cost –2)
Synthetic cyberarm (left) (cost 1)
-               retractable spur
-	smart link - level 2 (cost .25)
-	strength enhancement 
-	razor darts
-	recoil compensators
Magnetic insulated
(Beta Grade)Cyber eyes – blood red (cost .5)
-	low light (cost .2)
-	magnification (cost .1)
-	flare compensator (cost .1)
-	display link (cost .1)
(Beta Grade) Eye laser - medium (cost .3)
-	laser microphone (cost .1)
-	eye light system with super flash (cost .2) 
(Beta Grade) Internal air tank (cost .25)
(Beta Grade) Internal GPS (cost .1)
(Beta Grade) Chemical analyzer (cost .2) – (m&m rating 4(+2) = chemical skill of 6
-	gas spectrometer
(Beta Grade) Transducer (cost .1)
(Beta Grade) Subdermal speaker (cost .1)
(Beta Grade) Orientation system (cost .25)

_5.71 Essence used_

*Bionetics*
Super thyroid gland (cost 1.4) +1 body, +1 quickness, +1 strength, +1 reaction
Reflex recorder (cost .25) +1 to firearms
Reflex recorder (cost .25) +1 to cyber implant combat
Enhanced orientation (cost .6) +1 die for any active skill, +1 to reaction
Muscle augmentation (cost 1.6) 2 levels +2 Q, +2 St
Synthecardium (cost .3) +1 dice to athletics
Cerebral booster (cost .8) +2 intelligence (1 die in task pool)
Damage compensator (cost .6) No penalties unless over a moderate wound
Nano tattoo – tattoo that changes shape, color, and size over time

_5.8 Bioware_ 

*Skills*
Firearms 6 (7 due to reflex recorder – 8 using Ak-98)
Armed combat 6 (7 due to reflex recorder)
Cyber implant combat 6 (7 for claws and razors – 8 for cyber limb)
Athletics 5 (7 for synthecardium)
Intimidation 4
Street Etiquette 5 (7)
Driving 2

*Knowledges*
Gang turfs 6
Protection tactics 6
Magical threats 6
Police / security procedures 6
Shadow runner haunts 6

*Languages*
English 4
Chinese 2
Japanese 2
Elven 2

*Edges and Flaws*
Toughness 3 (1 extra for DR test)
Bonus attribute point (+IQ) 2
Good reputation 1

Incompetent (knives - rather ironic since her name is Bowie) -2
Spirit bane (basilisk) –2
Vindictive –2

*Armor*
Floor length black leather coat (Bllstc 4) (Impct 2)

*Weapons*
Die-coated (sp) Katana (Str + 4 or 5)
Retractable claws in cyberarm (11,500)
Ak-98 Smartgun (customized for Bowie’s use) +1 to skill (8m)
Ares Viper Slivergun Smartgun (mode SA / BF) (Ammo – 30) 95ft (pg 116)

*Equipment owned*
Camping gear stored in H2
First aid kit
Weapons
2 sets clothes
Hummer H2

*Vehicle*
Hummer H2 – seating 6


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## Shalimar (Mar 25, 2003)

Wow, that was a very high powered game.  Most games don't allow higher then alpha ware at character creation.  I'll do my best to recreate her for the game with allowable stuff and then you say yea or nae, what do you think?  All of her skills will have to be redone though, the things you listed are simply not skills.  Like Fire-arms is broken up into weapon types pistols, smgs, shotguns, rifles, heavy weapons, Launch weapons, etc.  All of the different melee combat skills are broken up as well into: clubs, polearms, edged weapons, and a few others.

Of course we can't start with any karma, but I'm sure we can figure out what you spent it on.  She will end up losing alot of capabilities because there is no bio, but also because beta cost less essence so I wont be able to fit it all in.  You simply can't afford the stuff, even at alpha grade, don't know how you did before, I'll try to aproximate it as best I can.

As far as th knowledges, some of them don't exist anymore, and you'll have almost double the knowledege or tripple the magical knowledge of most mages.


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## reapersaurus (Mar 25, 2003)

If Tory gets a chance to respond, I'm sure she'd give you carte blanche to make whatever modifications you think would be best, Shalimar.

She knows that lots of that stuff will have to go, and the stats lowered. (of course no Karma)

If you could make the stats match a savvy Street Samurai, based very loosely on Molly from Neuromancer (she liked the razors, of course - the retractable spur seemed cool to her, also), and try to keep what you think she'd like (don't worry about the Bioware) to help her be a kick-ass, can-do, no-$hit-taking tuff.

If you have to, make her less Strength based, and more dexterity, firearms, and computer-knowledge based.

If you could keep just one frivolous thing (which I think is classified as 'bioware'), could she keep the nano-tattoo?
She loved the idea of a tattoo that changes color and shape.

I'm sure she could give you more info about the character, but we don't really have long backgrounds (didn't know the world info) - but she could explain her approach, and attitude, I'm sure.

My monk is very reserved and respectful - he's surprised that he left the corp, and is learning rebellious attitudes and self-interest, after being a vat-grown assassin for the Shiawase corporation.
My only request, Douane, is that he can get monofilament whips on his fingers without an essence cost.
I know that's not standard, and if it can't work, than I'll take Shalimar's suggestion, and try to cram in as much cyberware-for-the-essence-buck in that one point - those seemed like great suggestions, Shal - probably better than the one point I had spent on Missile Deflect (?).
The phys-ad powers always seemed kinda weak - if anyone has suggestions, maybe they've made them more interesting over the years.


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## Shalimar (Mar 25, 2003)

Here is what you ended up with as far as attributes, augments or skills when I redid her, tell me what you think.

Bod - 4
Quick - 8(6)
Strength - 8 (6)
Charisma - 2
Int - 6
Will - 4

Combat pool - 9
essence -  .26
Reaction - 8
Initiative - 3d6

Cyber - (All Alpha for essence)
-Muscle replacement 2
-Boosted 3
-Smartlink 2
-Retractible Cyber spur
-Cyber replacement eye (Blood-red)
+low-light
+Vision mag 3
+Flare comp
+Image link
+Light system with superflash
+Eye laser Med
+laser mic rating 6
-internal air tank
-gps
-orientation system
-chem analyzer rating 6

Skills:
Assault rifles/AK98 - 4/6
Pistols/Ares Viper Sliver gun - 4/6
Computer - 5
Electronic - 5
Cyber-imlant combat/spurs - 3/5
Athletics 4
Etiquette/ street - 1/3 (Anything above this takes 2 skill points)
Intimidation - 2 (Anything above this takes 2 skill points)
Car - 2

Languages: 9 language point + 2 knowledgepoint
English 5(Fluent)
Chinese 2
Japanese 2
Sperithiel 2

Knowledges: Trying to go with what you intended here, but to be successful you really need to diversify your knowledges a bit more.

Police Security procedures 4
Mega-corp Security procedures 4
Security procdures 4
Cybertechnology 4 (Every Street Sam needs to stay up to date)
Gang Identification 4
Magic 3
Shadow runners 3
Mega-corp polotics 2

So, Tell me what you think, whether you want me to go on and do gear or scrap this version.


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## Douane (Mar 25, 2003)

@ Shalimar:

Thanks for doing the hard work on "Bowie"!

I had started, but didn't get too far before other stuff came up.

I have a few suggestions, though:

Have you thought about lowering her str and int to reduce the stat points to 24, since this would free up some skill points. For a hard-bitten woman of the street, she sure could use some negotiation, also beneficial would be launch weapons for that AK98 integral grenade launcher and, perhaps not necessary due to her spur, some unarmed combat.

I would also exchange english for cityspeak.

Perhaps these suggestions are worth thinking about.

Folkert


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## Douane (Mar 25, 2003)

@ Reaper:

The nano-tatoo is certainly no problem. 


Considering the whips, I'm not sure I understand:

Do you want them to be customized, ie no regular handle or to be part of your body? In that case, unfortunately there's no way around the essence loss.

In regard to adept powers, did you have something special in mind? Even if it is non-standard, we might be able to work it out. 


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 25, 2003)

This might work better:
Lowered strength by 2 to 4(6 with the muscle aug)
lowered Will by 1 to 3

switched Priorites to make skills B instead of C

Added:
Launch weapons/gernades - 3/5
Negotiations - 2

Languages:
Cityspeak 5
English 3
japaense 2
Chinese 2
Sperithiel 2

Knowledges:
Police Security procedures 4
Mega-corp Security procedures 4
Security procdures 4
Cybertechnology 4 (Every Street Sam needs to stay up to date)
Gang Identification 3
Magic 2
Shadow runners 2
Mega-corp polotics 2


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## reapersaurus (Mar 25, 2003)

No, I didn't have anything in mind re: adept powers.

I'll have to borrow the SR book from a guy at work...

About the monofilamant whip:
I know this is just my opinion, but it never made sense to me that if you have the tip of a finger replaced, then you suffer essence loss.

Is this one of those areas where it's just a "balance issue"?
Because I know that IRL if you get your arm replaced, or if you lose a finger, you certainly don't have less spirit, or soul, or humanity, or less of anything.
It always seemed to me that SR placed an over-emphasis on the impact that replacing small parts would do to you.

Oh - and if I remember correctly, Bowie took as her most important (whatever it's called), she took Priority A: Money. So she had a million nuyen to equip, right?


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## Douane (Mar 25, 2003)

@ Reapersaurus:

Re adept powers, I can mail you a list of powers and their responding costs or post it here, if that would help.


Surely balance is issue here, since you get an advantage over normal people, in this case an undisarmable weapon. It also prevents PC equipped with a slew of "small" modifications.

Another point would be theme of losing you humanity, which is quite common to cyberpunk, I believe. Sure, you can make yourself better, but there is a price to pay for that.

There is also the factor that the essence loss wouldn't really do anything to you, except if you are an awakened being. In this case almost everything disrupts your conncetion to the "magic source".


Folkert


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## reapersaurus (Mar 25, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> [BThere is also the factor that the essence loss wouldn't really do anything to you, except if you are an awakened being. In this case almost everything disrupts your conncetion to the "magic source".[/B]



Yeah, I get that it only applies to "awakened beings", I guess I just never "bought" that a phys-ad effectively would be less powerful if he replaces the tip of a finger.

Just my hang-up, and non-acceptance of the game's convention, is all.

edit: unless you have more adept powers to choose from than the 3rd edition corebook, or the adept's guidebook (whatever that was called) I didn't see anything I wanted more than what I had listed on my sheet.
Wait for the kind offer of the email, and I'll post Inue' (In-you-ay) tonight.


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## Tory Adore (Mar 25, 2003)

Hey Shal! Thanks 
I trust you in what you think will work the best, so she looks fine to me. As I remember (it was a few years ago that I played her), I doubt we started out at 1st level. Reap would remember better than I. SO whatever you do to tone her down and make her playable is okay with me. 

I just REALLY appreciate your taking the time to fix her and help me. Thank you very much 

EDIT:
Oops - I forgot to ask you if I will be able to keep the nano tattoo.


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## Shalimar (Mar 25, 2003)

Well, everything costs essence as a balance issue reap, even to none awakened.  There is just so much you can do to your body before it loses your soul, according to the game.  The more cyber you get the more disassociated you get from everyone.  People with lots of Cyber like Bowie are unpleasant as hell to be around, its just a certain menacing air that hangs about them.  Just their reactin enhancing cyber makes them super twitchy and liable to react before they can think.

Well heres the equipment list I filled out for Bowie it includes everything she already had on it, and goes into the specifics so we know exactly what is where.  I couldn't Get a Humvee so I got the closest thing an Ares City Master.  Well here goes, oh and nano tatoos aren't bioware, or cyberware that costs essence.  So its a simple 5k

276k left for purchase of contacts or other gear any thats left is divided by 10 and given for starting cash.

Armor
-Form Fitting Body Armor 4/1 (2/.5 when worn with other armor)
-Secure clothing 3/0 (For everyday wear)
-Secure long coat 4/2 (For everyday wear)
-Secure Jacket 5/3
-suggested run wear - Secure Jacket + FFBA 7/1.5

Weapons: (Each weapon has a back-up stored elsewhere)  I would suggest not carrying any of it except the pistol unless running
-Viper Sliver gun (Smartgun 2 equiped) 30 flechettes
-AK-98 (Smartgun 2, Ares Antioch grenade launcher, Gas Vent 3 system -3 recoil, Shockpads -1 recoil) 38 reg rnds
-Ares Antioch (Smart Gun 2) 2 HE-OF, 2 AP-OF, 2 concussion

Ammo: Again I suggest only carrying a small selection of ammo tailored for the run, you'll be weighed down too much otherwise.
-1 clip with 30 flechette rounds
-300 flechette rounds
-2 clips reg rounds for AK-98
-1 clip Gel Rounds for AK-98
-1 clip Ex-explosive rounds for AK-98
-380 EX-explosive rounds
-380 reg rounds
-1 clip HE- Offensive mini-grenades
-1 clip Anti personnel Offensive mini-grenades
-1 clip Smoke Mini-grenades
-1 clip Concussion Mini-grenades
-1 clip Flash Mini-grenades

Gear:
-Clothing(Tres chic, Fine, and ordinary 1 set each)
-pager
-wrist-phone
-Micro-Tranceiver rating 6 (would have gone cyber but with essence cost you'd be dead)
-subvocal mic (would have gone cyber but with essence cost you'd be dead)
-2 sound suppressors (don't believe silencers work on assault rifles)
-pocket flash light
-survival kit
-Cyberware toolkit
-Computers toolkit
-Electronics toolkit
-Maglock passkey Rating 4
-Keypad sequencer Rating 4
-White noise gen lev 6
-Jammer lev 6
-Bug Scanner lev 6

Vehicles:
-Ares Citymaster


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## Douane (Mar 25, 2003)

@ Reaper:

Sent you that list of adept-powers to your hotmail account!

Hope it helps!

Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 25, 2003)

I would like to say that there is nothing for free in shadowrun, and it would be very much against the feel of the game to allow an essence free mono-whip.  Just a single fingertip compartment is worth .1 essence.  Its the rules of the game that we all have to follow, its just balance issues.

@Reap, I understand that she went with priority A money.  Beta-ware is very very very very expensive, she could never afford half the stuff on that list even with 1 million.  Cyberware in general is not a cheap thing, and buying all alpha-ware to save on essence costs as Bowie did is extremely expensive.  But the real limiting factor in her cyberware is her essence.  A body can only be polluted so much.  It gives her areas to improve later.  As we make more money and get contacts who have access to the very rare and very exclusive beta and delta clincs, she can go under the knife and upgrade her systems to more essence friendly variants.  There is simply a limit to what you can do at character creation.


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## Douane (Mar 25, 2003)

Please excuse my ignorance, but is this a humvee like the one Bowie has?

If so, I don't think it is anywhere near a Ares Citymaster, an "urban riot control vehicle which doubles as a command post" (and costs 582,000 nuyen )


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## Douane (Mar 26, 2003)

Next try:


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## Shalimar (Mar 26, 2003)

Well, vehicles aren't my specialty, thats magic so feel free to ignore and do what you think is best, I was never a vehicle kind of girl, more likely used the public transport.  I always got schaufered around


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## Douane (Mar 26, 2003)

Sorry, Shalimar, I meant no criticism! 

I'm certainly no expert either, but I connected something else with "Humvee" and tried to confirm my vague memory. The image was googled by me.

IIRC, the Citymaster is something like a sealed APC. (Like I said I'm rigger kind of guy.)


Folkert


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 26, 2003)

Actually the closest thing to a Humvee in SR is GMC MPUV from rigger 3.


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## Shalimar (Mar 26, 2003)

So how is everything coming?  What still needs to be done that I can help with?


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## Tory Adore (Mar 26, 2003)

Bowie looks good Shal! Thanks!

Should I pick up a contact or 2? or anything else you can think of that I should do with the cash left?

I don't have any books, so I'm a little clueless when it comes to stuff. I got a pretty good idea on the car though by the explanations people gave. It's close to what I was thinking. So it's cool.


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## Douane (Mar 26, 2003)

Hi Tory!

Hope you don't mind, if I pipe in here with a little request. 

This is a small questionnaire I handed to the other players to get a grip on their background. Perhaps you could think about it and mail me at folkert.siedler@t-online.de  .

Don't mind the setting-specific stuff, it's not really that important. 

1. Connections:
- name 
- short description

2. PC:
- Physical description
- history (esp. any memorable highlights) [please keep in mind, that you are no top shadowrunners (yet)]
- familiy?
- unusual cyberware?
- connection to Seattle
- notes on behaviour/habits
- attitude towards Humans and metahumans
- perhaps some explanation conerning your unusual skills
- reason for shadowrunning
- anything else you would like to mention


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 26, 2003)

Well You have 2 free level 1 contacts that everyone gets.  On top of that you have 276k left as well.  Additional level 1 contacts are 5k, level 2 contacts(Buddies) are 10k, and level 3 contacts(Friend for life) are worth 200k.

I would suggest since you are the SOTA Street Sam you buy at least the following contacts, (if they fit your history that is)

-level 2- Armorer of some sort to supply you with weapons, ammo, etc.
-level 2- Fixer to set you up with other runners and possible jobs
-level 2- Street Doc to get you access to shadow clinics for cyberware implantation as well as maintenance on the cyber you already have
-level 2- Cybertech Guru to get you those SOTA (state of the art) goodies as well as a heads-up when new things are in development
-level 2- a techie to get you some electronics goodies, like higher rated maglock passkeys, and whatever other things that you as the electronically inclined member of the group might need.


I only bought you 1 month of middle lifestyle as I didn't know what her living conditions would be.  So I would sink whatever is left after contacts into this, it is afterall the dream of all runners to make enough money to live out the rest of their life in luxury. Usually about 1 million nuyen (Permanent high lifestyle) or 10 million (Permanent Luxury life-style).

Lifestyle per month (100 months=permanent)
Luxury 100,000
High 10,000
Middle 5,000
Low 1,000
Squatter 100
Street 0


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## Douane (Mar 26, 2003)

Re: "Bowie"

Reworking the edges/flaws I came up with this:

Edges and Flaws
Toughness 3 (1 extra for DR test)
Bonus attribute point (+IQ) 2
[I would like to let "Good Reputation" stay an edge that is to be earned.]

Incompetent (edged weapons - to keep the irony) -2
Distinctive Style -1 [Please forgive me but I think a 6'5" female street sam with blood-red eyes has earned this.]
Vindictive –2  or  Spirit Bane(?) -2  or  else [I should get a better idea for this when I have some kind of mental picture of her.]


Folkert


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## Douane (Mar 26, 2003)

Aargh, I was just typing the contact info up! 

Thanks, Shalimar!


BTW, Shalimar, I sincerely hope I didn't offend you with my above post. In no way I meant to jump at your throat, but your mentioning of the "ares citymaster" immediately conjured up the image of an APC and I went "Huh?". [Hopeless rigger-fanboy] This is why I asked about the humvee.

Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 27, 2003)

Oh no, no, you didn't offend me at all Folkert.  I probably shoudn't have said anything about it.  It was just what I imagined her driving from what I understood of her.  I am sorry about how off I was.


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## Shalimar (Mar 27, 2003)

> *Distinctive Style -1 [Please forgive me but I think a 6'5" female street sam with blood-red eyes has earned this.*




Wow Angel is going to look absolutely tiny compared to everyone else, she is only 5'3"


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## Douane (Mar 27, 2003)

Thank you, Shalimar!




			
				Shalimar said:
			
		

> *
> 
> Wow Angel is going to look absolutely tiny compared to everyone else, she is only 5'3" *




Yeah, we really need a dwarf!


Regarding your above question, I don't think there is anything to be done. Thanks for the offer, though.
I'm waiting for reaper to post/send his physad, then we should be good to go. BTW, thanks for doing the hard work on "Bowie". 


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 27, 2003)

No problem, Tory is a really great person and I don't mind doing things to help her, or anyone thats in the game.  So your quite welcome.


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## reapersaurus (Mar 27, 2003)

Here's the ex-assassin, trying to make his way in the world outside of the corp...
_________________________
*Vitals*
Street Name: unknown
Real Name: Inue Chu (In-you-ay Choo)
Archetype: Physical Adept
Race: Human
Sex: Male
Height: 5’10”
Weight: 175 lbs
Hair: Black
Eyes: Black

*Attributes*
Body 6
Quickness 6 (8 when boosted)
Strength 4
Charisma 2
Intelligence 6 
Willpower 6
Essence 5
Magic 5
Reaction 6 (Augmented 10, 11 when boosted) 
Initiative 1d6 (Augmented 3d6)

*Pools*
Karma Pool 2
Combat Pool 9 (10 when boosted)

*Cyberware*
Monofilament Whip
smartlink 2
Cyber Eye replacement with Low-light, Thermo, Flare Comp, and electronic vision mag 3
Cyber ear replacement with hearing amp, Damp, and Sound filter 5

_?.?? Essence used ??_

*Abilities*
Improved Reflexes   Level 2 Cost 3 (+4 Reaction, +2 initiative dice)
Improved Ability   Level 5 Cost 1.25 (+5 to Stealth)
Attribute Boost (Quickness)   Level 2 Cost .5
Improved Scent   Cost .25

*Skills*
Athletics 6
Stealth 6 (11) (-1 to all Stealth roll difficulties from Aptitude edge)
Etiquette (corporate) 2
Firearms (rifles) 2 (4) 5 with Inue's rifle
Throwing Weapons 1 (3) shuriken
Unarmed Combat 2 (4) shock gloves
Whips (monofilament) 5 (7)
Electronics 2

*Knowledges*
Pressure Points 6
Psychology 4
Ventriloquism 5
Corporate Security Tactics 5
Magical Threats 4
Magic Background 4
Japanese Art (gardening) 1 (3)

*Languages*
Japanese 6
English 3

*Edges and Flaws*
Aptitude (Stealth) +4
Blandness +2
Phobia -2
Hunted -2
Allergy -2

*Armor*
Lined Coat (Bllstc 4) (Impct 2)
Security Helmet  +1  +2

*Weapons*
Monofilament Whip (in fingertip compartment, conceal 10)  Reach 2  Damage 10S
Shock Gloves (pair)  conceal 9, reach 0 Damage 7S Stun
Shuriken (15, dikote-coated - pg 91, Man & Machine)  Damage STR+1
Remington 950 Rifle  Damage 9S (customized for Inue, with cutter bullets)

Smoke/Flash Grenade (pg 283) with thermo cloud, some with spore cloud
Gas Grenades (some Hyper, some Cyanide, some Neuro-Stun X - pg 250) 10 m radius

*Equipment owned*
Smartgun
Silencer
Pocket Secretary
Flashlight
Pack
Grapple Gun (stealth)
Micro Flares
Spare Magazines
Improved Magazines (pg 34)

*Gear*
Security Helmet (Infrared, external transducer)
Retinal Tailors? (pg 94, Man & Machine) re-maps retinal patterns
Breakable Tooth (pair, with Kamikaze drug, or P4MO (pg 113, M&M), or CRAM (4M))
Fingertip Compartment  3,000 cost

Ruthenium Polymer-treated Lined Coat (+5 on attempts to see Inue')
Holographic Projector (with retrieval line and speaker with 7 stored 'shows')
(suction)  Gripper Gloves & Boots
__________________________


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## Shalimar (Mar 27, 2003)

Reap, I have a few quick comments so that we are all using the same rule set.

Everyone starts off with a karma pool of 1,  to raise your karma pool up you as a human put every 10th karma point into your pool.  The rest of us being metas besides bowie only put every 20th in.

As far as skill: firearms... it doesn't exist in Shadowrun 3rd edition.  What does exist is the different types of fire arms skills that must be bought by their class.
Here is the list:

-Pistols: this covers Hold-out, Light, Machine, and Heavy pistols
-Assault rifles
-Heavy Weapons
-Launch Weapons
-Laser Weapons
-Rifles:  this includes sniper rifles as well as hunting rifles
-Shotguns
-submachine guns

I noticed you had Etequitte (Corporate) 2.  Adding a specialization does not drop the base skill to 0 so the lowest it could be is  Etequitte (Corporate) 1/3 costing 2 skill points.

Oh and I wanted to let you know about a nifty little power in MITS that just screamed Inue Chu to me.  Its called nerve strike.  It costs 1 powerpoint, but it allows you to temporarily drop an opponents quickness attribute, and if done well enough it can paralyze them (You have to drop their quickness to 0).  I thought of this because you took knowledge pressure points 6, and this power is the way you could express that into game terms beyond simply knowing them.

I do want to throw out the fact that since you have a magic of 5 you only can have 5 power points to start with.  Even so, the loss of the power point is still a bargain as it would cost you more then 1 power point ot buy the equivalent to all the cyber you had installed and even then you wouldn't be able to approximate a smartlink.


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## Douane (Mar 27, 2003)

Hi Reaper,

here‘s a changed version of Inue, based on Shalimar‘s suggestions and the limits of money. What do you think about it?


Attributes
Body 4
Quickness 6 
Strength 6
Charisma 2
Intelligence 6 
Willpower 6
Essence 5
Magic 5
Reaction 6 (Augmented 10) 
Initiative 1d6 (Augmented 3d6)


Pools
Karma Pool 1
Combat Pool 9


Cyberware (all alpha)
Monofilament Whip in fingertip compartment
Smartlink II
Cyber Eye replacement with Low-light, Thermo, Flare Comp, and electronic vision mag 3


Abilities
Improved Reflexes Level 2 Cost 3 (+4 Reaction, +2 initiative dice)
Improved Ability Level 3 Cost 0.75 (+3 to Stealth)
Improved Scent Cost .25
Nerve Strike Cost 1


Skills
Athletics 4
Stealth 6 (9) (-1 to all Stealth roll difficulties from Aptitude edge)
Etiquette (corporate) 1 (3)
Spec. Ranged Weapon Skill 4
Throwing Weapons 1 (3) shuriken
Unarmed Combat 6    _ (to make that nerve strike work)_
Whips (monofilament) 5 (7)


Knowledges
Pressure Points 6
Psychology 4
Ventriloquism 5        _ (I‘m having some trouble here: Since I doubt that you will be using the skill just for entertainment purposes, I am somewhat loathe to classify it as anknowledge skill.) [If I err, please correct me.]_
Megacorp Security 6
Megacorp Policies 2
Megacorp Politics 2
Magic 3
Gardening (Japanese) 1 (3)

Languages
Japanese 6
English 3

Edges and Flaws
Aptitude (Stealth) +4
Blandness +2
Phobia -2        _(against what?)_
Hunted -2 
Allergy -2        _(against what?)_

Armor
Secure Long Coat (B4) (I2)
Camouflage Full Suit (B5) (I3)
Form-Fitting Full Body Suit (B4) (I1)


Weapons
Monofilament Whip (in fingertip compartment, conceal 10) Reach 2 Damage 10S _(Since your heart seems to be set on this, I‘m going to allow it though normally it wouldn‘t be available. Unfortunately, it comes with a price, in this case Street index.)_
Shock Gloves (pair) conceal 9, reach 0 Damage 7S Stun
Remington 950 Rifle Damage 9S (Smartgun II)


Equipment owned
Silencer
Pocket Secretary
Flashlight
Pack
Grapple Gun (stealth)
Micro Flares
Spare Magazines
Improved Magazines (pg 34)

Gear
Breakable Tooth (pair, with Kamikaze drug, or CRAM (4M))
(suction) Gripper Gloves & Boots


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## Douane (Mar 27, 2003)

@ Howling Coyote:

If you still want that Sniper rifle, go ahead under the same rules as in my post above, ie. factor in the Street index.


Folkert


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## reapersaurus (Mar 28, 2003)

a lot of that work looks great!
I'll reply later with a more detailed post.


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## Xael (Mar 28, 2003)

Douane: Just noticed, that I miscalculated the concealibility of my Ares Predator III's. The real concealibility for those is 6, not 9.


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## Shalimar (Mar 29, 2003)




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## Xael (Mar 29, 2003)

Shalimar said:
			
		

> * *




What?  I just forgot to add the gas vent penalty...


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 29, 2003)

I'm back! Finally got everything sorted out (well almost), and can post (and read the board) again pretty regularly.

I updated Swarts equipment, and converted his money to his starting amount. I think that's going to be the final version, unless someone has something to say about it.


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## Shalimar (Mar 29, 2003)

So now that everyone's back, and ready when can we look forward to starting this?  If you couldn' tell I'm actually quite excited as everytime before that I made a background for a Shadow run game, I handed it in and the GM put it into a folder and it was never seen or heard from again.


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## Douane (Mar 29, 2003)

Shalimar said:
			
		

> *[...] the GM put it into a folder and it was never seen or heard from again. *




Ain't going to happen! 

Just now I'm going over the characters and backgrounds for the last time, checking for any open questions. If any arise, I will post them tomorrow, so we can get them out of the way.

After that I'm waiting for Reaper's statement/wishes for changes  on the adjusted adept and his and Tory's background.

Our sixth player  should have his PC ready on monday; finetuning him shouldn't take more than one or two days.

After this we should be ready for adventuring into the Sixth World!


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 29, 2003)

Wowie, a 6th, we are really filling out.  Hmmm,  Looks like we will probably havet he skills for a wider variety of runs then I initially thought.


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## reapersaurus (Mar 30, 2003)

adjusted adept questions:
I could have sworn I saw on your post once where you had listed the Ruthe-whatever Polymer suit (to make him Stealthier). Was I smoking something when I saw that?  

1) Do you guys think that the Nerve Strike will be more effective than increased Stealth and Quickness?
2) Do you know why I had chosen Aptitude as an edge? I think I've seen other people with edges that increased an attribute by 2 - is there an edge that increases quickness by 2?
(my idea of him was a very hard to see (Stealth god) and lightning quick assassin.)
3) Is that all the cyberware I can get for 1 essence? 
Is that stuff good to have?
4) Can I have some gas grenades? (I can do without the cutter bullets) What about the Holographic projector? It's the reason (as I remember) why I gave Inue Ventriloquism : I was thinking he would use the holographic projector to distract people, using Ventriloquism to throw his voice to make the illusion more effective, then attack with surprise when striking.

Those're the questions off the top of my head....
oh! and thanks so much for working it up, Shali, and editing it, Douane!


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## Howling Coyote (Mar 30, 2003)

1) It's just a personal opinion, but nerve strike isn't as useful as stealth or quickness.

2) You can only raise an attribute by 1 with edges.

3) That’s pretty much it. The chosen eye options, and the smartlink are really useful.

4) Gas grenades avail is 8, so you can buy them; the cost is 60 each. I don't remember seeing a portable holoprojector anywhere.


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## Shalimar (Mar 30, 2003)

I'll go through it in a point by point fashion from my perspective feel free to ignore Reap, Folkert.

1)Well, You could buy 4 points of stealth, or 2 point of quickness, or 2 stealth and 1 quickness with that point.  You already have a combined stealth score of 9, more then good enough.  The two points of quickness is up to you, but if you don't take nerve strike then that pressure points knowledge has no way to be expressed in game.  Knowledge skills don't work like active skills, you wouldn't be able to do anything with it, so you would be, I wont say wasting, as your character might actually know it, but there is no benifit to having that knowledge skill.

2)Because apptitude is an edge, There is a hugely complex edges and flaws system thats not covered in the main game, but added in in a latter book.  Each edge is worth a certain amount of points, and each flaw is worth a certain amount of points.  You need to balance these out when working with the priority system as we are.  For example, Aptitude is a 4 point edge, buying it as an edge, is the only way to get it.

There is an increase attribute edge, it is a 2 point merit, but it can at most be taken 1 time.  So no, there is no way through edges to increase your quickness by 2.

3)Lol, isn't that enough?  Your very lucky with what Folkert did.
All of this includes the reduction for getting alpha-ware
Cyber Eyes: .16
Smartlink 2: .4
Fingertip compartment: .08

leaving .36 for the Mono-whip, very, very cheap all things considered, retractable cyber-spurs are .24 essence, and they aren't 2 meters long.

(Before I forget, just a note, the skill for use with the whip would be cyber-implant combat/ mono-whip 5/7, not whips)

4)With the ventriloquism, unless you buy it as an active skill, it can't be used in that way, as is, its just for entertainment purpouses.  The skills were divided into Active and knowledge for a reason, its the active skills that do the physical stuff, and the knowledge thats the brain stuff, its the background knowledge of what to do, what can be done, whats the best way to do it, but the active skill is what does the actual doing.

5)I don't know of there being any holo-projectors in shadow-run.  The closest thing would be the Trid Phantasm spell which can only be cast by people with Sorcery, Though I think with what your after you mean more like an invisibility spell, and again, that can be done only with a spell.

What you are reffering to above is a Ruthenium Polymer modification to a suit(You'd still have to buy a suit).  You couldn't afford it.  Even if that was the only thing you spent money on (ALL of your 90k) you could barely afford a good one (One that would leave you concealed more then 3/4ths of the time), and that would leave you without anything else, only street lifestyle, no guns, no cyber, not really anything at all.  Things cost a lot in shadow run, a heck of a lot, and 90k isn't much cash to start with at all.  All that alpha-ware would have cost you at least 70k out of your 90k and that just presumes that the cyber whip cost exactly the purchase price of the mono-whip without any additional costs.

Just to see what you had left after buying everything, but before buying you a lifestyle I came up with 4,785 not enough to even buy a month of middle class.  This isn't a criticism or anything, but you made out like a bandit so stop while your ahead.


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## reapersaurus (Mar 30, 2003)

a) Where exactly are the Edges & Flaws detailed? I borrowed some books, but can't find it. (and what does Aptitude do?)
b) I guess it's pretty straight-out that there's only 90,000 to spend? I shouldn't re-arrange the reources a different way?
I haven't reviewed the resources part yet.
(edit) I just checked - yeah, Attributes first, then Adept, leaving 90K. Sounds right. I guess I'm short on $ now because of the alphaware (before, the tip-of-the-finger monofilament wire was breezed over as an Essence non-issue, fortunately for me - I see how it impacts other areas quite a bit.)
c) I totally guessed with the Ventriloquism being a Knowledge skill.
It just seemed to fit better there, as it didn't seem very active, with the big cost (as I remember) of active skills.
d) The holographic projector is on page .... I haven't found it yet.
I'm pretty sure it was an expansion-type, equipment guide. 
It detailed a retrieval line for the projector, a speaker system for sound and vision projection, and up to 7 stored "shows" that it could play back.
I thought it might come in handy on some runs, and could be fun.
e) I thought monofilament whip only cost .10 Essence for the fingertip compartment?
f) Why would I maybe have wanted Stealth to be SO high?
Is it overkill, or can the extra-high scores be used effectively?
g) What book is Nervestrike from, and what does it do?
h) Ruthenium Polymer is 10,000 per square meter. I don't know how much material it would take to cover a smallish man. +5,000 for an image projector.

TIA.


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## reapersaurus (Mar 30, 2003)

Oh yeah! 
I just remembered/found where I previously had put the Infrared, and an external transducer in a Security Helmet (pg 284), getting (I think) some extra protection, and cheaper cost, no Essence reduction, too.

Does that sound like a good idea?
Would that work? I could get all the stuff I'd want (thermo, mag, infrared, etc (pg 281 & 282)) relatively cheap (compared to cyberware?)

Also, to clarify:
A Smartgun can be used with the Smartgoogles feature of a Security Helmet, providing -1 to shots with that weapon.
The Smartlink raises that to -2, but with a hefty Essence cost, and pricetag.
Maybe instead of that, would Boosted Reflexes be good?
I can't find where it states what Level 1 Boosted Reflexes does, exactly....


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## Douane (Mar 30, 2003)

Reaper,

here are the reasons for the changes I made: (Hope they make sense!)

0. Ruthenium Polymer:
I don't think that I ever included them, due to their prohibitive cost. (50,000 Nuyen for the lowest posssible level, out of the 90,000 you have.) Instead I have added the camouflage suit. While limited in scope ( different suits for different terrains/no office interior version available), is has nearly the same effect (+4 to be seen) and is much more affordable (1,200 NuYen)

1. I don't know about 'more effective', but I have to agree with Shalimar's opinion, that it would be very fitting considering your pressure points skill (which, as a knowledge skill, doesn't give any boni to active skillls). In regard to 2 extra stealth dice and +2 Quickness boost, well 9 dice are already very good - especially if combined with your natural apitude (see below) - and the boost works like, for the lack of a better idea, a ninja mantra: You'll  have to activate it and it will stay active for 5 rounds at the best, so no use in surprise situations. 

2. The only option would be to invest 4 points in the edges 'exceptional attr' and 'extra attr point', this would allow you to get your Quickness to 7. Given your concept, however, the aptitude which reduces every stealth target number by 1, seems to be far more suitable (and makes it much easier to rack up those needed extra successes) [well, at least to me ].

3. Sorry, should have listed the essence costs. That's all you can get for your money. I opted to go for quality over quantity and therefore took the alpha grade of cybereware, which reduces the essence loss of the implants by 20%. Your momentary essence is 5,36, so you can still add something else later on.
Regarding the choice (Please beware, I might get slightly rantish!):
- Cybereyes: Speaks for itself, a whole slew of useful sight-based options, which you now don't have to buy as adept powers or to rely on equipment-based versions [BEWARE OLDTIMER RANT!  ... and unfortunately much too common already, given the concentration on 'effective' cyberware. Come on people, where are the stylish choices in cyberware? ]
- Smartlink II: Definetely essentila, if you use firearms a lot, since it gives a -2 target number with a linked weapon

Given my impression of the PC, I would have personally recommended some other cyberware options (I took the PC to be a kind of 'traditional-mythical' ninja, more like 'Remo Williams' than anything else. This is why I took the liberty of increasing his strength and unarmed combat skill.):
- Bone Lacing Plastic: +1 Body, higher unarmed combat damage (8M) and harder to break bones. Essence 0.5 (0.4 Alpha)
- Balance Augmenter: -2 target number on all checks involving balance. Essence 0.4 (Alpha 0.32)

4. Oops, the gas grenades got somehow lost. However, the standard gas grenade is only available with a filling of Stun gas.

Concerning the holo-projector I can honestly say, I've never heard of such a piece of equipment in SR. To my knowledge holograms are only used in very limited quality and quantity for entertainment purposes (and then only in stationary equipment).


Hope this helps!

Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 30, 2003)

*Where exactly are the Edges & Flaws detailed? I borrowed some books, but can't find it. (and what does Aptitude do?)*

Edges and flaws are detailed in the canon companion


*b) I guess it's pretty straight-out that there's only 90,000 to spend? I shouldn't re-arrange the reources a different way?
I haven't reviewed the resources part yet.
(edit) I just checked - yeah, Attributes first, then Adept, leaving 90K. Sounds right. I guess I'm short on $ now because of the alphaware (before, the tip-of-the-finger monofilament wire was breezed over as an Essence non-issue, fortunately for me - I see how it impacts other areas quite a bit.)*

Yes very staright out, the purpouse of the priority system is so that no one can have everything they want at character creation, its a balance thing.  


*c) I totally guessed with the Ventriloquism being a Knowledge skill.
It just seemed to fit better there, as it didn't seem very active, with the big cost (as I remember) of active skills.*

Active skills are limited, you could buy it as an active skill, but then you lose out on something else.  The game you were playing in before seems very very very highpowered, this game isn't that high powered.  Shadow run is set up that characters just out of creation are mid-level characters(if you can actually aply a level description like d20)  the game you guys played just from looking at the quality of your cyber was easily an epic level game.

*d) The holographic projector is on page .... I haven't found it yet.
I'm pretty sure it was an expansion-type, equipment guide. 
It detailed a retrieval line for the projector, a speaker system for sound and vision projection, and up to 7 stored "shows" that it could play back.
I thought it might come in handy on some runs, and could be fun.*

You couldn't afford it the way it is, and you don't really need it.  I think your thinking way too high tech.  Each piece of equipment has an availibility rating.  at character creation we are only allowed to buy up to availibility 8 that monowhip is availibility 24 so your lucky Folkert let you have it.  You payed 9k for it instead of 3k becaues he made you pay what you would have to pay for it on the street.

*e) I thought monofilament whip only cost .10 Essence for the fingertip compartment?*

You got a way better deal then I thought.  Cyber weapons cost a lot of essence, even when alpha'd  they cost .24 for retractibles.  That you got a 2 meter whip grafted to your body at no essence cost is a gift.  A very big gift, that you should not under-estimate.  blades that are only a few inches long cost .24  what should 2 meters cost?  figure that out and know that you got away with that much.

*f) Why would I maybe have wanted Stealth to be SO high?
Is it overkill, or can the extra-high scores be used effectively?*

Your fine as is, with the stealth score like that your great, better then world-class, you are the definition of the skill.  With a camo suit which Folkert added to your sheet your golden, it would take a monumentally bad roll on all 9 dice for you to get seen.

*g) What book is Nervestrike from, and what does it do?*

nerve strike is in Magic in the Shadows.  Basically, when you employ it with unarmed combat you reduce their quickness, if you do it well enough which is quite possible for you with the way your skills are, you leave them paralyzed.  I suggested it because you had knowledge skill pressure points.  See my comments are Ventriloquism for reasons why having it so high with no way to express it is pointless unless as a character thing bearing in mind it wouldn't ever really be usable except in conversation.

*h) Ruthenium Polymer is 10,000 per square meter. I don't know how much material it would take to cover a smallish man. +5,000 for an image projector.*

See Folkert's answer


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## Douane (Mar 30, 2003)

*a) Where exactly are the Edges & Flaws detailed? I borrowed some books, but can't find it. (and what does Aptitude do?)*

In the „SR Compendium, revised for 3rd edition". Aptitude lowers the target number for stealth-related tasks by one.


*e) I thought monofilament whip only cost .10 Essence for the fingertip compartment?*

That's the way I have always handled it. 


*f) Why would I maybe have wanted Stealth to be SO high?
Is it overkill, or can the extra-high scores be used effectively?*

In my opinion, 11 is somewhat overkill. Quoting from the 3rd Rulesbook "Active Skill 8+: Only two words can describe your use of the skill of the class: World Class". Even with that skill of 9 you are way more skilled than most people can ever hope to be. (And as firm believer in dice and luck I will add, if you can‘t do with 9 dice those 2 extra won‘t help. )


*g) What book is Nervestrike from, and what does it do?*

It is from „Magic in the Shadows". Paraphrased effect: standard unarmed combat attack agianst target number 4 (+Impact armor of opponent), every 2 successes will reduce opponent‘s quickness by 1. On quickness 0 he‘s paralyzed.


*h) Ruthenium Polymer is 10,000 per square meter. I don't know how much material it would take to cover a smallish man. +5,000 for an image projector.*

IIRC , just the body surface of man with your stated weight and height would be something over 2 square meters, so a suit would have to have more, ie. 3 square meters. You also need at least
4 scanners, so it sums up to 50,000 at least. I sincerely doubt it is worth that.


Folkert


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## reapersaurus (Mar 30, 2003)

It's all very helpful - thanks!
And fun, too - I really do like learning rules. (to a point)

0) Where are you getting the 50,000 cost for Rujtenium Polymer?
The only figure I've seen is 10,000 per square meter. I'd guess a human could be plenty covered in 2 square meters, and then one image scanner puts it at 25,000. Wait a minute.
Street Index of 2! 
That's what that does - gotcha.
OK - is it possible that we get money in game and he can smuggle out one of those suits that he used to use as an assassin for the Shiawase corporation? (Or if we're completely inexperienced, than he would have used it in practice)

1) Yes, Nervestrike sounds cool, and I really enjoy both of your suggestions.
I don't think I'll go that direction, though, since that implies a hand-to-hand combatant, and if I decked out Inue in that way, I'd likely add Killing Hands, etc.
I want him more of a dextrous, stealthy killer-from-the-shadows guy. You don't see him till it's too late, and then yoiu're sliced in half by the monofilament whip. 

2) I didn't know the Adept boosts weren't that useable?
Sounds like a tough call between the boost and Improved Physical Attribute.
Too expensive, though - what do you guys think?

3) Very interesting suggestions with the cyberware, all.
I like it when cyberware gives something that other more mundane things can't get you. (or does it significantly better).
I hadn't thought of the Balance thing - that does match what I remember of the vat-grown ninja from Johnny Mnemonic.
It's just so expensive!
It's definately something I'm considering.
The Bone Lacing again pusjes Inue into a hand-to-hand melle combatant, and if he gets that close, he'd be using the whip.

Smartlink only gets 1 more than a non-cyber smartgun, right?
I'm thinking of just using a Smartgun, linked with a special helmet that goes with his stealth costume:
the helmet would be based on a Security Helmet, but not provide any armor benefits.
It would be cloth-like with wires and a Vision System, with the features (Thermo, etc) that Shalimar nicely suggested. It's a great ide to cyber that stuff... I just think it's better to not have it cyberware if you can get almost the same effect with gear. 
Does that sound right to you guys?

And Shalimar - I'm sure you're spot on, about how I'm lucky with the whip costs.
And about Pressure Points - it really was just a flavor thing, since I couldn't find any other Knowledge skills that interested me.
Forget about the Ventriloquism, since I can't find the Holgraphic Projector.


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## Douane (Mar 30, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> *Oh yeah!
> I just remembered/found where I previously had put the Infrared, and an external transducer in a Security Helmet (pg 284), getting (I think) some extra protection, and cheaper cost, no Essence reduction, too.
> 
> Does that sound like a good idea?
> ...





It would indeed be cheaper to add the visual options to an helmet, IIRC however it won't add to your armor, as helmets are designed to be used with heavy armor. 
[EDIT: I am wrong here, helmets seem to add to any kind of armor.]

Right on with the smartgun.

Boosted reflexes won't do you any good, since you have already improved them via adept abilities. (They don't add.)


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 30, 2003)

Your right, I did the body surface area calc on him,  1.98 meters, so you would have to buy 2 meters if you attached it to form fitting body armor, but if you attached it to that, then you wear no other armor, none.  If you had it put on a secure long coat so  you could hide your gear as well you would need to buy another meter as only form fitting body armor actually comes close to matching your surface area.

You have to buy a minimum of 4 scanners, part of the rules for that equipment.  So for you to get it with form fitting body armor would cost 40k.  On a secure long coat(Which leaves hands and head and feat bare) 50k.  To add it to a helmet and gloves and boots to complete the outfit would cost 10k for the material, and 60k for the scanners.  Total of 120k to buy enough to be able to conceal your self and anygear that you carry with you.  Damn expensive.  But its hightech stuff, and that isn't cheap, not at all.


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## Douane (Mar 30, 2003)

_Originally posted by reapersaurus _


0) Where are you getting the 50,000 cost for Rujtenium Polymer?
The only figure I've seen is 10,000 per square meter. I'd guess a human could be plenty covered in 2 square meters, and then one image scanner puts it at 25,000. 

Reaper, your body surface alone is 2 square meters, so the suit would better be larger, otherwise it will be a really tight fit . The rules I read indicated that you would need at least 4 scanners to have any kind of effect.



1) Yes, Nervestrike sounds cool, and I really enjoy both of your suggestions.
I don't think I'll go that direction, though, since that implies a hand-to-hand combatant, and if I decked out Inue in that way, I'd likely add Killing Hands, etc.
I want him more of a dextrous, stealthy killer-from-the-shadows guy. 

Okay, understood. 


2) I didn't know the Adept boosts weren't that useable?
Sounds like a tough call between the boost and Improved Physical Attribute.
Too expensive, though - what do you guys think?

Aargh, I'm very sorry. I just reread the list I sent you on adept powers: It falsely states "improved phys attr" cost at 0.25, in fact it is 0.5.
So you could add +2 your quickness for that one point. Is it worth it? I don't know. 


3) Very interesting suggestions with the cyberware, all.
I like it when cyberware gives something that other more mundane things can't get you. (or does it significantly better).
I hadn't thought of the Balance thing - that does match what I remember of the vat-grown ninja from Johnny Mnemonic.
It's just so expensive!
It's definately something I'm considering.
The Bone Lacing again pusjes Inue into a hand-to-hand melle combatant, and if he gets that close, he'd be using the whip.

OK, got it, no 'Remo'. Damn! 


Smartlink only gets 1 more than a non-cyber smartgun, right?
I'm thinking of just using a Smartgun, linked with a special helmet that goes with his stealth costume:
the helmet would be based on a Security Helmet, but not provide any armor benefits.
It would be cloth-like with wires and a Vision System, with the features (Thermo, etc) that Shalimar nicely suggested. It's a great ide to cyber that stuff... I just think it's better to not have it cyberware if you can get almost the same effect with gear. 
Does that sound right to you guys?

No problem!


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## Douane (Mar 30, 2003)

@ Shalimar:

I've since gone over your character, background and stuff. There is one thing still unclear in my mind:

Why shadowrunning? (Especially since Angel could get legal and less dangerous employment.)


Thanks,

Folkert


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## Shalimar (Mar 30, 2003)

She wouldn't really do well pychologically speaking as a corp wage-slave, and she really just sees this as a temporary until she goes back to the Tir.  She really is a thrill seeker at heart, she puts up with bodygaurding and the parties and formal events out of a sense of duty to her family.  If she had grown up without them instilling that in her, or without their vast resources, she would most certainly be a runner already, the frame up got her out on her own.


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## Douane (Mar 31, 2003)

Thanks!

I had already come to the opinion that "sprawling" would be a major factor in Angel's motivation. Good to see that I wasn't too far off.


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Apr 1, 2003)

I have been thinking really hard on this, and, if its okay with you Folkert, I'd rather remove Angel's Cyber-ware, all 180k of it, its not really necessary for her, and I think she would rather not polute her body with it.  She can replace those things external units as Reap said.  This way her magic wont need to be limited by a Geas.

Heres the break down of expenditures to use the cash:
4 spell points 100k (3 for the focus) 1 point to learn Clean Air
Force 3 Improved invis. Sustaining focus 45k
Mono-whip 9k
2 pairs of mirrored Shades with Thermo, Smartlink 2 16k
(Is it possible to add image Vision Mag 3 to these shades?)

18,615 left  (subtract whatever for the vision mag 3 for the two glasses)

I want to change her whips 3 to whips/mono-whips 2/4(Eventually when I am able to buy a weapon focus, It'll be a mono-whip, so I want to be good with it)


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## Tory Adore (Apr 2, 2003)

Douane, I sent a background to you via e:mail per your request for Bowie. Please feel free to change anything or add anything you need.

Thank you again to Shalimar for doing Bowie's stats. I think I'm ready to go now.  

Tory


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## Shalimar (Apr 3, 2003)

I'm all ready to go as well, just tell me if those changes are acceptable.  Oh, and how is our 6th player coming?  Is that the friend of your that sorta fell of the map?


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## reapersaurus (Apr 4, 2003)

Shalimar - what's a mono-whip?

That's funny, that you're dropping the Geasa.
I read about it, and am VERY interested in taking one.  

I have seen some examples that people have used, and it DOES seem like pretty much a benefit for no drawback.

Here's an example(s):
* - Geas (Involuntary, to offset 1 Magic lost due to cyberware): cord necklace w/ wooden ziggurat (flat) medallion stained with the blood of a fallen enemy  

Rationales
When Joaquin was a boy, Q helped him find the medallion that he now wears. It was an emotional placebo meant to help catalyze the growth of the man Loco became. When Loco lost his magic point getting his Smartlink installed, the medallion became necessary for his protective powers of Mystic Armor and Pain Resistance. 

His Geasa
His Voluntary Incantation Geas
Etienne has taken the voluntary geas Incantation to reduce the cost of his Magical Powers.  This allows him to purchase the power at 75% of the cost.  If he does not use Incantation, he can not cast spells or conjure Spirits.  His incantation consists of a bass, ritualistic chant. 
His Involuntary Talisman Geas
Etienne has taken the Talisman involuntary geas to offset the Magic point lost due to the reduction in his Essence for taking cyberware. 
Etienne's talisman is an arm brace that rests high on his right arm *snip* etc

Duoane - is there a way I can take a Geasa, make it a cost, but not a crippling one?
Phys-ads need all the magic they can get, in my mind - they aren't exactly overpowering, and it doesn't seem like there's a ton of rules which apply to them (most of the magic rules I read that benefit Awakened PC's don't apply to adepts).

And I'm trying to post the info on Inue when I get the chance (background, etc).
I'd really like him to be trying to get in touch with the Invisible Ones (Path of the Adept : Invisible Way)
I'll mention more about them later - I think it would be neat if there was a small # of ex-corp ninja assassins that left the corp over the years - they are the few that ascended past the brainwashing and systematic insistence on "the Good of the Corporation" - and struck out on their own in the big, scary, unclean, unorganized, sleep-where-you-drop World.


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## Shalimar (Apr 4, 2003)

its a whip that infects those who are hit by it with mononucleosis  hehe, its a mono filament whip.  Its the only melee weapon you need not have strength to use effectively.  Since I was planning on buying a weapon Foci (eventually) I needed one with a skill that wasn't strength linked, and since I can't astrally project I wanted one with good reach(2 meters being damn good).

The reason I didn't want the Geas is that Angel being who she is wouldn't have got it installed in the first place.  I know I figured that out a tad late, but, shes a rather new character, I needed time to get to know her.

Folkert actually changed the rule on Geasa.  If you break your Geasa you are out the point of magic that you were saving, + 1 additional.  So if you had magic 6 W/ the Geas, then if you break it you have magic 4 until its unbroken.  Also as far as I know, Geasa to ofset magic loss for adepts are involutary, ie the GM sets 1 if he wishes, you get to say yes I'll go with it, or no I wont and your magic is now reduced.


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## Howling Coyote (Apr 4, 2003)

Adepts can take a geasa voluntarily to reduce adept power costs. The 25 percent reduction can be useful especially when applied to expensive powers, like improved reflexes.


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## Xael (Apr 4, 2003)

Just wanted to point out that I'm ready to go too. And I've got to say that this has been the most pleasant character creation on these boards that I've taken part of. Most of the other games (that I've been part of) go like this:
Day 1: Recruitment starts.
Day 2: Game full. Half of characters ready. (This is usually when I notice the recruitment thread)
Day 3: Game starts.


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## reapersaurus (Apr 5, 2003)

Howling Coyote - yeah, I'm interested in the voluntary Geas, and the 25% reduction in Improved Reflexes, as well.
Depending on how punishing the Geas is - Duoane, be fair, but be nice.  
(Would extra adept powers be unbalancing? I don't know how they're perceived by experienced players, but phys-ads sure seem to me to be a tad underpowered - how are they considered in your groups?)

Shalimar - I'm confused - are you saying that you're using the same thing that I based Inue on? (the mono-filament whip)
In my thoughts, it was required to have the cyberware to use the mono-filament whip - I didn't think you could use one without having it "installed".

And the whole point of me making Inue was to have a unique weapon that matches the inspiration for the character.


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## Douane (Apr 5, 2003)

@ all:

I'm back. 

Sorry for going AWOL,  but due to some health issues I havn't spent much time at the computer for the last days.

I'll be working through the backlog so we can get back on track.


Folkert


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## Douane (Apr 5, 2003)

@ Xael and Howling Coyote:

I'll be posting my last questions today, so I can consider your PC's finished.


@ Xael:

Could you recheck your money? It seems to me that you spent too much, mainly due to the price of computer memory.


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Apr 5, 2003)

Reap, the default mode of a mono-filament whip is as a whip.  It comes in a  handle where it is cotained until you let it out.  It isn't cyber-ware at all.  I feel 100% confident in saying that having it in cyberware is entirely unique.  This is the first time in the shadowrun universe I have ever heard of one being altered into anything but a handle that holds the filament.  I should say that since I had switched her over from a street Sam (page 3) she was always going to use one.  As a street Sam she had the strength to use other melee weapons.

Thats why I had whips 3.  I wouldn't use a reglar whip, they do somewhere around strength light damage, no where near enough.  I just switched the whips 3 for the specialty of whips/mono-whips 2/4, what I had intended to do from the beginning.  I mean, she would only use the weapon in the last extreme defense of her life, she needs a weapon therefore that can kill easily when she is forced to use it, and for someone as physically weak as her, its a mono-whip, because of the 2 meter reach, and also because the damage is not reliant on strength.  When eventually she bonds a weapo focus, a mono-whip is what it is going to be.  The only way to harm a spirit(For her) is an unarmed attack, or one with a melee weapon, or a spell.  The damage from a melee or unarmed attack does Charisma (M) damage, the damage from a weapon focus is the weapon's base damage code. The 10(S) damage at a 2 meter reach beats out 3(M) with no reach.  The only other weapons that are independent of strength do their damage as stun damage, making it useless as a weapon focus.

Your right though, I should have flat out said that I was planning on using a mono-filament whip back on page 3, but at the time it was unavailible at character creation because it was availibility 24 and the max at creation is 8.  Once Folkert allowed the purchase with the paying of the street index, it became availible, otherwise I would have bought it before.  I am sorry if that upets you.  But it was my intention even before I knew you were planning on playing Johny Mneumonic.  i do think there are enough of them in the world, and enough differences between your internal one and my regular one for them both to co-exist.

In response to your "are adepts under-powered?" question, they are what they are.  They are specialists, they can be better in one or two areas then a street Sam, but a street sam will be better over all.  Its a trade off.  The average adept doesn't set off metal detectors, street Sams do.  Street Sams need major cash for their cyberware, and they also need to maintain their ware with regular visits to sHadow clinic.  Sams need to pay not only for the Ware but also for surgery and hospital stays.  Adepts jst spend the karma and get the power point immediately no monetary cost at all.  There is just so much cyber a body can take, 5.999 or so, if you hit 6 used, you are dead, no ifs, no ands, no buts(Cyberzombies don't count, not really).  An adept can keep spending karma as long as he is living, so eventually he can be better all around then a sam, at no monetary cost, and with no real detection of his gifts through mundane means when he decides to retire.  He doesn't need permits for all of his powers like sammies need for their illegal ware.


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## Xael (Apr 5, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *Could you recheck your money? It seems to me that you spent too much, mainly due to the price of computer memory.*




Argh! It seems that I missed the part memory *COST* * x.  Which means that the prices are 20 times what I thought...  

Change Heads-up display memory to 10 MP.
Change Personal Wrist Computer memory to 10 MP.
Change Personal Table-Top Computer memory to 50 MP.

Heh, never bought memory or computers in SR before.


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## Douane (Apr 7, 2003)

Shalimar said:
			
		

> *I have been thinking really hard on this, and, if its okay with you Folkert, I'd rather remove Angel's Cyber-ware, all 180k of it, its not really necessary for her, and I think she would rather not polute her body with it.  She can replace those things external units as Reap said.  This way her magic wont need to be limited by a Geas.
> 
> Heres the break down of expenditures to use the cash:
> 4 spell points 100k (3 for the focus) 1 point to learn Clean Air
> ...





Sorry, Shalimar, for the delay!

Thought I had already answered this, but I must be getting old. 


If you want to, please go ahead with the "no cyberware policy".  Seems to be more suitable for a Tir elf anyway. 

Concerning the changes, I'll admit that I don't exactly like the use of sustaining foci, but if you really want it, take it. 
Considering the size of image mag scopes I don't think it possible to add that to shades. BTW, the shades won't fool any professional, they will recognize them for what they are.


Folkert


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## Douane (Apr 7, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> *Depending on how punishing the Geas is - Duoane, be fair, but be nice.
> (Would extra adept powers be unbalancing? I don't know how they're perceived by experienced players, but phys-ads sure seem to me to be a tad underpowered - how are they considered in your groups?)*
> 
> First, I never knew Phys Ads could take geasa. Well, you learn something new every day.  [Nope, I'll refrain from ranting how 1st Ed Adepts had to make without this kind of stuff. ]
> ...


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## Shalimar (Apr 8, 2003)

With the sustaining focus, giving up the cyber reduces her capability by a lot.  Just her pistols skill has been weakend greatly by the removal of the smart link and the vision mag, I would say to less  then 1/4 of what it would be with it.  As such she is forced to rely a lot more on her magic, a lot more, so +2 tn for sustaining the spell would pretty much cripple that ability.  

Could be worse,  I could have learned the spell at force 1 and bought a lot of force 1 sustaining foci for it, at least this way I am forced to sustain any uses of it beyond the first.  Though I do think buying it at force 1 with a ton of foci and doing that while very effective, and legal, it is also rather umm...... very poor form.  

Understood about the vision mag thing, and that others would know what they were, but the general public wouldn't.  Besides, its a rule somewhere, bodygaurds have to have those little ear things, and black shades.

Ok then.  For the other 18k then I'll pick up 2 force 4 expendable combat Foci, 1 force 2 expendable combat focus, and finally1 force 2 expendable elemental manipulation focus. The combat foci will help with the area of affect of her stunball's.


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## Douane (Apr 8, 2003)

@ Shalimar:

Bad news, unfortunately!  


I apologize for not addressing this sooner, but it seems to have so far slipped beneath by radar and I only recognized it when rereading my last post.

In my campaign it won't be possible for a mono whip to be made into a weapon focus.

My reasoning for this

1. The use of orichalcum in the construction is somewhat opposed to the monofilament line of the whip.

2. I don't give boni regarding astral combat neither for dikote, the infamous "laser-axe" of the 1st Edition or for the mono whip. Their technological construction and way of doing damage is counteracted in the astral plane. (In the spirit that will and magic ability count in the astral, but not technology.)


In hindsight, I realize that this will put a serious crimp in your concept, but I hope that we'll be able to overcome it and that this won't make you reconsider your involvement in the game.


Sorry,

Folkert


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## Shalimar (Apr 11, 2003)

I have responded in an email, though this does kill her as far as my concept of her as a sorceror adept.  I really do like the character though, her background, and her history.  I'll alter her stat and ability wise.

I'm thinking physical adept one following the path of the warrior(One of the Tir Na Nog paths of the Wheel), a Tir Paladin.  It retains the magical bent I want for her from her background, I mean pretty much all of the Tir nobles are awakened beings of some sort.  That rather makes me wonder though.  Overall only 1% of the population is awakened, So how can it be that the entirety of Tir Na Nog nobility be awakened, is it perhaps less common then 1% in certain races and much much more common in other Races?


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## Shalimar (Apr 15, 2003)

Well, this is the final incarnation of Angel.  Questions, comments, thoughts, ideas?  To answer a question, yes, I did use the build-points 123 system with permission from Folkert

*Attributes:*
Body:		5
Quickness:	5
Strength:	5
Charisma:	3
Intelligence:	4
Willpower:	3

Essence:	6
Magic:		6
Reaction:	8
Initiative:	3d6 +8

Combat pool:	6
Karma pool:	1

*Skills:*
SMG/Heckler & Kock		4/6
Pistols/ Predator		4/6
Edged Weapons/Katana		4/6
Unarmed Combat		5
Athletics			5
Stealth				5
Negotiation			3
Etiquette			3
Demolition			3

*Languages:*
English				5
Sperethiel			5

*Knowledge:*
Elven Society			4
Magic				4
Meta-human Politics		3
Security Procedures		3

*Adept Powers:*		6pts
Improved Reflexes 2		3
Traceless Walk			.5
Improved Senses:		1
Thermo, Flare Comp, Scent, Hearing Damp
Killing Hands Serious		1.5 (Talisman Geas)

*Edges and Flaws:* 
Impulsive			+2
Friends in High Places (Terry)	-2
Good looking and knows it	-1
Sensitive system (Magical)	+2
Dark Secret			+2
Incompetence Launch Weapons	+2


*Gear:
Misc.*
Level 2 Contact
Middle Life-style

*Weapons*
Dikoted Katana
Dikoted Katana (blacked out)
Shock-glove
Predator 3 (with Silencer)
Predator 3 (with Silencer)
Heckler & Koch hk227 (Smart 2, suppressor)
Survival knife
2 flash packs	

*Ammo (extra clips):*
1 clip 15 regular rounds
1 clip 15 Ex-Explosive ammo
1 clip 28 Ex-Explosive ammo
1 clip 28 regular rounds

*Clothing and armor:*
-Medium Grade Security Armor	6/5 (Includes Street Index)
-Security Helmet		1/2
Smartlink 2, Electronic vision mag, HUD w/ 100 megapulses of memory, Rating 4 signal locator, Helmet Transceiver 
-Form fitting body armor	4/2
-Secure clothing		3/0
-Secure Jacket			5/3
-Leather Pants			0/2
-Tres Chic clothing
-Fine clothing x3

*Equipment:*
Smart Goggles (Smart Link 2)
Micro-transceiver 6
Sub-vocal microphone
Pager
Wrist-phone with flip-up screen
Wire cutters
3 Plasteel restraints	 
5 Tranquilizer patches rating 6

Cash:						1923 at start


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## Howling Coyote (Apr 15, 2003)

Build-points? Should I try to remake Swart with points too? 

Shalimar shouldn't incompetence be taken on a skill that you actually poses.


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## Shalimar (Apr 15, 2003)

Well I was all set to use another flaw, but was told to switch the other flaw because of what Folkert was planning, so I was kind of at a loss there.  Launch weapons is a skill someone in her postion would actually have, had I more skill points, and I am planning on buying once I get the karma(along with assault rifles as I plan on using it only with underbarrel grenade launchers)

I do see your point though, hmm Allergy uncommon, mild Gold would work, subject to approval of course.


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## Douane (Apr 16, 2003)

@ all:

My apologies, but this won't start today.

As I'm still staying (and working) with my father, without access to my email-account or the SR materials, I will have to delay another day. (If all goes well, I should be back at my own place tomorrow and will post the opening then.


Thanks for the patience!

Folkert

[EDIT]P.S.:
*Howling Coyote*, if you want to, redo the PC. But I'd appreciate it if you keep the concept.

*Shalimar*, Allergy (gold) would be fine, of course.


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## Douane (Apr 17, 2003)

Hi all!

I've returned and will post the opening later this day. [Have to sleep.]


The new Rogue's Gallery thread can be found over here. 

Please post your own PC's so that you can make revise them in case it is necessary.



The IC thread "Chapter 1: Another day at the bar" is also up. 

Please keep the still open creation questions to this thread, so we can finish them quickly.


Folkert


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## Douane (Apr 19, 2003)

Finally,

the first post of the IC thread is up!


Thanks for your patience!

Folkert


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## Shalimar (Apr 20, 2003)

One last character creation question, then I am done, totally done, until next time  it is implied in the ability of adepts to buy improved senses that we can buy pretty much anything that sense-wear cyber can do and it can be had for a flat .25 points, will you allow us to use that with Vision Mag?


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## Douane (Apr 21, 2003)

I sincerely don't know! 

After reading the description several times, I think that it doesn't fall under the "Technological" limitation; so it would be possible.

However, once again, I'm not entirely comfortable  with giving the full lvl 3 benefit on a flat 0.25 cost. So my *suggestion* would be: one lvl of magnification per 0.25


What do all of you think about this? (Because I never encountered anything like this before.)


[In retrospective - after trying to find something on this on the dumpshock.forums - it seems like I have openend a whole can of worrms with my rule allowing Smartlink and Image Mag to work together.]


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Apr 21, 2003)

I am up for whatever it is you want to do, a flat no, a yes, or a stepped version.  Its not like I have a free power-point so it'll take a while to get the karma together for a power point to buy it up to 3.


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## Shalimar (Apr 22, 2003)

Question about the in character thread, will you tell us when we are suppoused to start posting?  I don't want to write up a post and have me doing something that gets in the way, so any guidelines you might have would be good.


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## Douane (Apr 22, 2003)

AAAARGH!!!


Sorry!

I really should have stated clearly: "Go ahead and post away!" 

This shows best what a newbie I'm at this, doesn't it?


I didn't post anything further about the 'Tavern' itself, just in case anyone wanted to do anything special before going to the meeting. (Surely a remnant from my P&P days.)

I will post a description of the interior later this day. (3 AM here and I have a seminar at 11 AM.)


Folkert


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## Shalimar (Apr 22, 2003)

I really didn't have anything planned for before the meet, so having us set a day ahead sort of threw me off.  Do you want me to just start with going to the meet?


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## Douane (Apr 22, 2003)

Like I said, a remnant of my past SR experience. (I could always count on extensive actions [sometimes very weird ones] that had nothing to do with the run itself. Oh, the joys of "extreme" roleplaying.)

Considering this, please start with that.


Folkert


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## Tory Adore (Apr 29, 2003)

Bummer. Did we stall?


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## Shalimar (Apr 30, 2003)

No, the game has started.  Look in the in character forum.


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## Tory Adore (Apr 30, 2003)

Found it! Thanks Shali 

So are people being brought in one by one or is that all that are playing? Last e:mail I got was on 04/10/03. I apologize if I seem a bit out of it, but life got busy this week.


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## Douane (May 1, 2003)

[Finally, the boards function again! ]


Hi Tory!

My apologies for not contacting you any further. Since I hadn't heard from you in the meantime, I had assumed that you were too busy with RL. (Which I very well understand, being in the same position right now.)


As for for entering the game, just walk into *O'Flaherty's Tavern * right here.  


Could you please post "Bowie" in the Rogues' Gallery?   "[SR] "Tsunami" Characters


Thanks and 'Welcome to the game!',

Folkert


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## Howling Coyote (May 2, 2003)

Well the delay hasn't bothered me, since I was practically without a computer for two week's after my computer died (hard drive, CPU, motherboard, etc. and I'm still wondering what caused it  )

That's why I decided Swart to be late from the meet, so I would not slow down the game too much.  

But it seem it wasn't necessary, since my new computers running now. Oh well, now he's just an exception for the rule that the players come to the meet precisely or well before the meeting.


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## Douane (May 2, 2003)

Hi all!

My apologies for the rather slow-moving IC thread. Unfortunately, this and the last week were the beginning of my term, so my time was rather limited. Should get better now and I will try to push the thread a bit. 

Will work on Xerd's astral perception now and then it's time to meet "Mr. Johnson". 


Folkert


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## Douane (May 9, 2003)

Hi all!

I'm sorry for another break in the flow, but there'll a big family get-together on Sunday and at the moment I'm somewhat swamped with the preparations.

I'tried to get a post up, but it didn't really klick for me, and so I'll rework it over the weekend and put it up on Tuesday when I'll be back at my own place.


Thanks for the patience!

Folkert


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## Howling Coyote (May 28, 2003)

I'm somewhat ashamed of myself since I haven't posted in this game much since it started. 

I'm slightly confused what's Swarts status right now (I said he would be late). Is he still on his way to the bar?


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## Douane (May 28, 2003)

Absolutely no need for that, HC!  

Due to the outages there wasn't any progress in the past two weeks at all, since I was unable to post anything, even when the boards were temporarily up. (Drats! When I returned from our family get-together 2 weeks ago, I was in really high spirit to get the story and then the boards went down.)

Also we are still at the very beginning, so no trouble to jump back right in.


Concerning Swart's status:

Since the "Johnson" was also late in managing to shoo the PC's into the backroom, I had assumed that Swart, while arriving a little bit late, also seated himself at one of the tables and was then invited along with the others by the waitress.
If he should be late on principle, he can walk right into that mess on the other side of the door.


Folkert


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## Howling Coyote (May 28, 2003)

No, he wasn't late on purpose. I just decided that he would be late couple weeks ago, when I had computer problems (actually I still have them). I just asked, since I still want to be in the game, but was unsure of the situation. Oh well, now I have to start posting to the IC thread.


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## Douane (Jun 1, 2003)

@ all:

1. New Post will go up tomorrow! 
The library wants its books back, so I'd better copy out everything I need for my politics paper.


2. (And more important!)
I realize that I have been too lax in posting my upddates. To combat this problem, I had thought on implementing some kind of posting schedule for myself, like *monday - wednesday - friday*.
This would give everyone 2 days to post, not that there's a problem with your frequency.


3. Any kind of critiscism already? Speak out, so I can try to improve!


Your thoughts?


Thanks,

Folkert


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## Xael (Jun 5, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *3. Any kind of critiscism already? Speak out, so I can try to improve!*




Only the lax in updates, but that's fine by me, because I'm a lazy bastard myself.


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## Douane (Jun 5, 2003)

Xael said:
			
		

> *
> 
> Only the lax in updates, [...]*




 That's why I'll try to schedule myself.

Originally I had planned today's update for yesterday, but I decided to wait for another day because of the outage.


BTW, just to clear this up for myself: You didn't post because your initiative wasn't up, right?


Folkert


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## Howling Coyote (Jun 6, 2003)

Xael said:
			
		

> *
> 
> Only the lax in updates, but that's fine by me, because I'm a lazy bastard myself. *




You took the words out of my mouth


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## Xael (Jun 6, 2003)

Douane said:
			
		

> *You didn't post because your initiative wasn't up, right?*




Well, yes. The "stranger" is dead anyway if he's agressive.

...at least I hope so, well I'm not in the front line...


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## Douane (Jun 22, 2003)

Sorry for making myself scarce once again, folks, but unfortunately my partner for a paper due in a week went rogue on me and disappeared. So I'm stuck with doing it all alone and this cuts really down on my available time.

Still, I will try to keep up with a at least 2 posts a week. Hope this works out!


Folkert


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