# Black Company or Song of Ice and Fire, what should I read next?



## fett527 (Jun 16, 2005)

So, I have never read any books in these two series.  I understand Black Company is the older of the two series and people have expressed waiting too long for the next Song of Ice and Fire book so I am leaning towards Black Company, but I thought I would ask.  Which series should I read next?  I'll take feedback through the end of the weekend.  Thanks for your input!

 I very much enjoy David Gemmel and I have enjoyed The Wheel of Time books.  I used to read Forgotten Realms novels voraciously but have not picked one up in some time.  The last few books I have read:  _The Revenge of the Sith_, _The Rule of Four _ (not scifi or fantasy), _ New Spring_,


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## drothgery (Jun 16, 2005)

Black Company.

It's finished (at least for now).
Cook keeps the fantasy in his Grim-n-gritty fantasy.
Cook also keeps the good guys and the bad guys in his Grim-n-gritty fantasy.


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## Zaukrie (Jun 16, 2005)

While I really, really like SoFaI, read at least the first three black company books first. It won't take long to do, they are done, and then you can go to the much longer books that may never be done.


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## Whizbang Dustyboots (Jun 16, 2005)

"A Song of Ice and Fire" is vastly better written. While Cook has some good plots and characterizations, a lot of his naming conventions sound like D grade homebrew worlds. You wouldn't think it'd get annoying, but I found it to be incredibly intrusive eventually. (And no, I'm not talking about the military nicknames. Those work just fine for me.)


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## Crothian (Jun 16, 2005)

Thieves World!!


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## Steel_Wind (Jun 16, 2005)

Both!

If you have not read either  - you are a lucky person and I envy you.

You have thousands of pages of MANDATORY & Excellent reading ahead of you.

Whilst I am a huge fan of both of these series (they are in fact, the only Fantasy fiction I have bothered to keep up with, having concluded almost everything else in the genre is pap), Martin is clearly the better - and more consistent -  writer.


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## Endur (Jun 16, 2005)

Both.  

My personal recommendation is to buy Game of Thrones and The Black Company (book 1 of each series), read each, then decide which series you want to follow through first.  

For what's it worth, I have every novel that Glen Cook has written (30 or so books), but did not buy every novel GRR Martin has written.  My best estimate (and most people probably agree) is that Martin's novels are the more "classic" adventures.


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## mattcolville (Jun 16, 2005)

Martin is a better writer.

Cook creates characters you care about and is writing fantasy unlike anything you've ever read.


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## Fast Learner (Jun 16, 2005)

All three of Martin's SoIaF books completely grabbed me and kept me engrossed. 

I read the first of Cook's Black Company and was, shoot me now, completely unimpressed. I didn't read any further in the series, and saw nothing _at all_ in the first book to make me want to. And after so many good reviews here. Dunno.


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## ForceUser (Jun 16, 2005)

Black Company. It's short and gritty.


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## Olive (Jun 16, 2005)

SoFaI.

I enjoyed the BC books, bu they're so pulpy that it took some of my enjoyment away. It's a cool setting and all, but they're not that well writen. If you enjoyed the books you list as having been your recent reading, that may not bother you much.   

SoIaF is really well writen. The only thing that I would say against it is that it's not finished yet.


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## Felon (Jun 16, 2005)

Haven't read the Black Company. Maybe that's next on my reading list. 

Tried reading Martin's first book, found it to be very long, boring, and unengrossing. *Very* long. But I don't like books about royalty, never understood why nobility automatically makes someone interesting, and I think that sets me apart from a lot of fantasy fans.


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## Hand of Evil (Jun 16, 2005)

Black Company.

I found Song of Fire and Ice to be long winded and it never caught my interest.


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## mmadsen (Jun 16, 2005)

fett527 said:
			
		

> I very much enjoy David Gemmel...



I have found Gemmel to be a pale imitation of Robert E. Howard (to whom he's often compared).  If you haven't read Howard's original Conan stories, start there.


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## Rackhir (Jun 16, 2005)

Felon said:
			
		

> Haven't read the Black Company. Maybe that's next on my reading list.
> 
> Tried reading Martin's first book, found it to be very long, boring, and unengrossing. *Very* long. But I don't like books about royalty, never understood why nobility automatically makes someone interesting, and I think that sets me apart from a lot of fantasy fans.




Nothing makes nobility automatically interesting. However, they usually have 

a) Power - They can do stuff/make things happen
b) Position - They are usually important in the society/class structure
c) Enemies - Someone usually wants to kill/replace/exile/turn them into pumpkins, etc...

All of these are important for interesting conflict. Few people write novels about pheasents, because all they do is farm, grow old and die. Nobody is usually trying to kill them. They have no power over anything except which row to hoe that day and it really doesn't make a lot of difference if they live or die.

Its the same reason people tend to write novels about lawyers, politicians, spies and reporters rather than 7-11 Store clerks.

That said

I'd go with The Black Company. Glen Cook's stuff is almost always an entertaining read and the Black Company books are one of my all time favorites and most of my friends as well. Also Cook has a lot more stuff out there. Once you've finished the BC novels, there's his Garret Series. The Dragon Never Sleeps (SF), The Swordbearer, if you can find them there's the Dread Empire series and a number of other single novels.

SoFaI is well worth reading as well, but it is kind of a nasty series. There's a lot of really unpleasant characters doing really unpleasant things to each other. Realistic stuff mind you, but still some very unpleasant stuff in there.


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## Rodrigo Istalindir (Jun 16, 2005)

Black Company, hands down.


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## Pants (Jun 16, 2005)

Read both, though read The Black Company books first. They're a relatively short and quick read through and the first three books are quite good. They even end on a somewhat conclusive note should you not feel any need to continue on. 

After you've read The Black Company, pick up Martin's books. 

AFter you've devoured Martin, pick up Steven Erikson's 'Malazan' books. They are very definitely styled after Glen Cook's The Black Company.

After you've gone through the five books that he's released, pick up R. Scott Bakker's 'Prince of Nothing' series. 

Those books should keep you busy for a long, long time.


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## cignus_pfaccari (Jun 17, 2005)

Black Company.  While I've heard Mr. Cook has two more Black Company books in his head, the series is at a very decent stopping place.  Also, most or all of them are in print.

Also check out the Garrett Files books (hard-boiled detective in a fantasy city...it's one of the inspirations for Eberron), though most of those are out of print.

I'd also like to plug Thomas Harlan; his Oath of Empire series was pretty good, even if he does overuse the word 'gelid' entirely too much.

Brad


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## fett527 (Jun 17, 2005)

Just a note, I did plan on reading both series.  I just wnated to know the opinion of which I should read first.  Thanks for everyone's input so far!


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## fett527 (Jun 17, 2005)

Rackhir said:
			
		

> ...All of these are important for interesting conflict. Few people write novels about pheasents...




Yeah, I don't think birds make good subjects for fantasy novels.  

(Even though that would be spelled pheasants  )


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## Vonlok The Bold (Jun 17, 2005)

If you want something light, read Black Company.  It is gritty, but goes into very little depth and details.  Magic is VERY free flowing in Black Company.  The idea of it being about a group involved in a war is cool.  It is like an old WW2 film from the 40's turned into a fantasy series.

If you want something with well developed characters, a rich world, lots of details, relatively litte but powerful magic, then read SoIaF.  It has very complex characters, plots, and world so fully developed it seems like a historical fiction rather than a fantasy novel.


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## Desdichado (Jun 17, 2005)

mattcolville said:
			
		

> Martin is a better writer.
> 
> Cook creates characters you care about and is writing fantasy unlike anything you've ever read.



Yeah, but Martin isn't done yet and who knows when he will be.

I'd go for Cook.  You should be able to bang through all ten of the Black Company books fairly quickly, though.  Then you can go and read Martin.


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## Harmon (Jun 17, 2005)

Cook- good writer.  Black Company is a fine read, I look forward to completing the series sooner or later.  

Martin- I have read Fire and Ice once, cover to cover, and I am listening to the first book from audio.com so that I can get ready for Feast for Crows.  I am catching so much I missed, or don't recall reading.  

The depth of Martin's writing to Cooks is ocean and creek in difference.


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## LiKral (Jun 17, 2005)

I was absolutely gripped by ASOIAF. I couldn't put it down. I read the first few 'Black Company' because I had heard on sites like this how cool it was and how much like ASOIAF. Well. I wasn't impressed. It was enjoyable but not thrilling. Not very grim or 'gritty'. Woodenish characters. Just ordinary fantasy, much like a novelisation of a good D&D campaign.
First read ASOIAF. Then read 'Black Company' to fill in the endless waiting for the rest of the series.

As for the series being about nobility, I find this refreshing. There are so many stories (probably modeled on Star Wars) of nobody farm boys/kitchen assistants/orphans, who become the most powerful mage in the land/greatest swordsman in history/king, with no real training, resources or contacts. In the real world, most people don't come from nowhere like that, especially in the past. Some people may like it, I guess it is wish-fulfilment, but it really breaks my suspension of disbelief.


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## danbuter (Jun 17, 2005)

Holy tough choice. Both series are extremely good. I'll go with Black Company, because you'll probably be able to read the first trilogy before the next book is printed.


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## Nifft (Jun 18, 2005)

Much as I love SoIaF, it ain't done.

Save yourself some frustration... read the series that's done first.

 -- N


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## fett527 (Jun 18, 2005)

Well SoIaF is winning in the poll by 12 votes so far.  I let it run through tomorrow so Black Company will have to come from behind in a day and a half.


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## Rackhir (Jun 18, 2005)

fett527 said:
			
		

> Well SoIaF is winning in the poll by 12 votes so far.  I let it run through tomorrow so Black Company will have to come from behind in a day and a half.




Oh, didn't really notice there was a poll. The comments seem to be running heavily in favor of the Black Company.


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## Whizbang Dustyboots (Jun 19, 2005)

Rackhir said:
			
		

> Oh, didn't really notice there was a poll. The comments seem to be running heavily in favor of the Black Company.



8 out of 28 is "heavily in favor?" Are you a political pollster?


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## drothgery (Jun 19, 2005)

Whizbang Dustyboots said:
			
		

> 8 out of 28 is "heavily in favor?" Are you a political pollster?




Unless I'm miscounting, the posts that recommended reading one or the other first (or reading one and not reading the other) are 11 to 5 in favor of Black Company.


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## The_lurkeR (Jun 19, 2005)

SoIaF are the best novels I've ever read, period.
Since you plan on reading both series, I don't think it matters which you read first.


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## Herremann the Wise (Jun 19, 2005)

I voted for George R.R.Martin - absolutely fantastic series and the next book is due out November.

However, one series that you might never have picked up but should is Jack Vance's Lyonesse series - my favourite fantasy series quickly followed by ASoIaF. I feel obliged to mention it. 

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise


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## barsoomcore (Jun 19, 2005)

If you like Robert Jordan, you'll probably enjoy Martin better than Cook.

Contrary to what many people are saying here, I think Martin is very substandard as a writer -- his prose is clunky and dull. I couldn't even get through the first book. But I nearly threw the first _Wheel of Time_ book out the window I thought it was so awful, so obviously we disagree on what makes good writing.

I like Cook because he doesn't write like he's writing a fantasy; he writes like he's writing journal entries by tired, weary soldiers who can't afford to take much seriously except their sense of brotherhood. And I'm sucker for that.


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## John Q. Mayhem (Jun 20, 2005)

I can't make a comparison, because I haven't read aSoIaF, but I like Black Company a lot.

But...Herremann's right. Read Vance's Lyonnesse series if it is at all possible. _Very_ good.


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## Rackhir (Jun 20, 2005)

fett527 said:
			
		

> Yeah, I don't think birds make good subjects for fantasy novels.
> 
> (Even though that would be spelled pheasants  )




Well there was "Watership Down", but I couldn't find any on Amazon.com. However, there were a lot of books on breeding and hunting them.


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## fett527 (Jun 20, 2005)

Well, Song of Ice and Fire wins the poll!  I'll read through Martin's books and then belt out the Black Company after I'm done.  Thank you VERY much to all who gave feedback.


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## JoeGKushner (Jun 20, 2005)

I say Black Company because Cook doesn't let the current state of the union distress him so much that he finds himself unable to write for many moons and that his series is actually copmlete.


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## Dakkareth (Jun 21, 2005)

The Black Company books I've read so far were all great fun. ASoIaF had great parts, but that was it.

Bakker and even more so Erikson make Martin look for a hole to crawl into IMO.


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## barsoomcore (Jun 22, 2005)

Dakkareth said:
			
		

> Bakker and even more so Erikson make Martin look for a hole to crawl into IMO.



Word. I just re-read _Midnight Tides_ and was even more blown away than I was the first time. Man, can that guy write. Woof.


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