# Heroes Season 1(#12)---1/22/07-'GODSEND' Mid-Season Cliffhanger Continued



## Truth Seeker (Jan 22, 2007)

*GODSEND*


*Cast and Crew*:*Sendhil Ramamurthy, Milo Ventimiglia, Adrian Pasdar, Hayden Panettiere, Ali Larter, Noah Gray-Cabey, Santiago Cabrera, Tawny Cypress, Masi Oka, Greg Grunberg, Jack Coleman, Christopher Eccleston, Zachary Quinto, Jimmy Jean-Louis, Thomas Dekker, Clea DuVall, Cristine Rose.*



Matt reveals himself to his wife. HRG confers with Mohinder. Now that she knows the truth, Claire tries to make sense of her life. Hiro seeks the sword that he is destined to own. Niki must face the consequences of her decision to turn herself in to the police. Simone and Nathan are worried about Peter, who has been in a coma for two weeks. A new hero is introduced who meets Peter and offers him a different view of the recent changes in the human evolutionary process. Micah visits his mother.​


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## Man in the Funny Hat (Jan 23, 2007)

I have had SO little interest in watching anything else on TV since Heroes started.  I've taken to playing a lot of City of Heroes to fill in waiting for the season to resume.


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## DonTadow (Jan 23, 2007)

Awesome episode. I cracked up laughing when i realized that both peter and invisible guy couldn't be seen I cracked up. 

Seems like a lot has happened in the last few weeks. I wonder could Nathan be a hero now?  

Glasses guy looks even more like a villian like he did in the beginning of the show. . 

BTW I went to the website and it just says heroes.


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## The Grumpy Celt (Jan 23, 2007)

Great Scott! Dr. Who has gone evil! And invisible! 

Masi Oka, who plays Hiro Nakamura, manages to be amusing just walking across the room, without degenerating the character into a pitiable fool That is a rare gift. 

So Claire Bear is resisting Evil Dad. Good for her. It makes it likely that Evil Dad will have her Nerdy Friend killed next time, rather than simply trying to wipe his memory.

Evil Dad still has Sylar locked in a cage. That does not make me like Evil Dad, as he apparently wants to keep everyone in cages or on chains.

Matt Parkman, the mind reading cop, should tell his wife the reasons he’s suddenly so scary good in the sack is he started to read her mind to know what she wanted. (the only way to ever know what a woman wants, in or out of the sack, is to read their minds)


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## Flexor the Mighty! (Jan 23, 2007)

So how did Sylar not escape last episode?


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## Umbran (Jan 23, 2007)

The Grumpy Celt said:
			
		

> Great Scott! Dr. Who has gone evil! And invisible!




He steals from wallets - the man is a pickpocket, possibly without even that much skill, and he's probably scared.  



> Evil Dad still has Sylar locked in a cage. That does not make me like Evil Dad, as he apparently wants to keep everyone in cages or on chains.




Watch again, and listen - he says very specifically that he thinks Sylar deserves to be removed from the planet.  Keeping Sylar locked up and alive is not his idea - he has bosses he must answer to, and they ordered him kept alive.



> (the only way to ever know what a woman wants, in or out of the sack, is to read their minds)




Please, let's not get into the sexist stereotyping, hm?  If we aren't going to condone it about small segments of gamers, we aren't going to condone it for half the human race, either.


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## The Grumpy Celt (Jan 23, 2007)

Flexor the Mighty! said:
			
		

> So how did Sylar not escape last episode?




There were two doors. He broke a window set into the same wall as the inner door, but did not open the outter door.


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## LightPhoenix (Jan 23, 2007)

The scene between Isaac, Nathan, and Hiro was hilarious.  

I also liked Simone finally realizing that Isaac wasn't making stuff up, and that there really are people with powers.

There was an awkward cut during HRG and Mohinder's scene right after HRG asked if Mohinder was on the list.  It sounded like there was something more that was going to be said there, but was cut.  I would have liked to hear it.

Also, not enough Matt/Mrs. Matt/Audrey.

I would have liked the Nikki/DL/Micah C-story cut, and more added to the others.

It's readily obvious this is the start of all the heroes coming together.


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## Steel_Wind (Jan 23, 2007)

Flexor the Mighty! said:
			
		

> So how did Sylar not escape last episode?




Sylar is playing possum. We (the viewer) already know that given what he did at the end of Episode 10.


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## LightPhoenix (Jan 23, 2007)

Wow, I guess people didn't really know about the comics running during the down-time.  That's a shame, there's a bunch of backstory on a character next week.  They should have hyped it more.

http://www.nbc.com/Heroes/novels/novel_011.shtml

HRG and the Haitian got him shortly after Eden was killed.  He's been drugged since, per tonight's episode.


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## Ed_Laprade (Jan 23, 2007)

I loved Hiro even more than usual in this one. "You flying man, ZOOM!" "Keep it down." "zoom." with the hand gesture lowered!!! 

But I find it incredible that a whole suad of cops and a bunch of FBI agents couldn't find a big steel door with a lockcode pad. Of course, if Mr. Memory Wiper went with them, Matt could have gotten the info from Claire's Dad. If he's just wiping everyone's memory whenever, that's too much of a deus ex machina.


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## Ed_Laprade (Jan 23, 2007)

LightPhoenix said:
			
		

> Wow, I guess people didn't really know about the comics running during the down-time.  That's a shame, there's a bunch of backstory on a character next week.  They should have hyped it more.
> 
> http://www.nbc.com/Heroes/novels/novel_011.shtml
> 
> HRG and the Haitian got him shortly after Eden was killed.  He's been drugged since, per tonight's episode.



If it ain't in the book/movie/whatever, it don't exist.


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## BrooklynKnight (Jan 23, 2007)

Ed_Laprade said:
			
		

> If it ain't in the book/movie/whatever, it don't exist.





Except that the comic IS an official part of the story line.


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## Alzrius (Jan 23, 2007)

Ed_Laprade said:
			
		

> If it ain't in the book/movie/whatever, it don't exist.




Well, since these are the official comics that NBC states have additional content, then it seems like they do indeed exist.


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## yangnome (Jan 23, 2007)

Anyone catch the code for the primatech site?  I thought I had it, but it didn't work


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## yangnome (Jan 23, 2007)

ok, code flashed on teh screen wasnt the same one.


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## Dire Bare (Jan 23, 2007)

*Lots of stuff on NBC.com*

Not only do they have the very good (and short) graphic novels on NBC.com, but you can now watch all 11 episodes from Season One in their entirety!!!  So, if you missed any, nows the time to catch up cause you never know when they'll yank'em!

I also found the "Wireless" sneak preview on NBC.com that aired during "Deal or No Deal" tonight (I had missed it on the TV).  The sneak preview plus the "Wireless" four-part graphic novel previews a new "Hero" that seems like will be lots of fun!

Of course, there are lots of cast and crew interviews as well, so head on over to NBC.com and just wallow in the Heroes-ness of it all!

I will warn you however, the Heroes site on NBC.com is TERRIBLY organized and it can be hard to find what you want . . . and I also have trouble getting the various videos to play, although I did get everything I wanted eventually and the problems could be with my computer (or me)!

Check it out!


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## Dire Bare (Jan 23, 2007)

yangnome said:
			
		

> ok, code flashed on teh screen wasnt the same one.




Wha?

A code flashed on the screen?  Ah, I've got terrible reception so I missed it.


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## Dire Bare (Jan 23, 2007)

Steel_Wind said:
			
		

> Sylar is playing possum. We (the viewer) already know that given what he did at the end of Episode 10.






			
				LightPhoenix said:
			
		

> HRG and the Haitian got him shortly after Eden was killed.  He's been drugged since, per tonight's episode.




HRG and the Haitian did get Sylar before he could escape . . . but that doesn't mean he isn't playing possum!!  I mean, he wouldn't be much of a supervillian if he didn't escape at some point even more powerful then when he was captured!  I'm in a giddy suspense for some near-future episode where Sylar escapes after taking out . . . the Haitian!!! (well, maybe!)


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## Dire Bare (Jan 23, 2007)

LightPhoenix said:
			
		

> I would have liked the Nikki/DL/Micah C-story cut, and more added to the others.




Not me, I'm loving all the characters and their plot lines so far.  Nikki is fast losing it and Jessica seems to have a plan!  Nikki/Jessica, Sylar, and the new character "Wireless" (seen in the sneak preview) are all building suspense for BAD STUFF to happen.  This is going to be just like last year where each week of my life for the next while is just going through the motions at work and at home until the next Heroes episode!  (kidding, mostly . . . so sad . . .)


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## Hand of Evil (Jan 23, 2007)

Question: Was Who just invisible or also no audio?  Got the impression he could not be heard either from when Peter started to call out no one was looking.


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## dravot (Jan 23, 2007)

Hand of Evil said:
			
		

> Question: Was Who just invisible or also no audio?  Got the impression he could not be heard either from when Peter started to call out no one was looking.




Didn't Peter's phone call cut out on him in mid-sentence?


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## dogoftheunderworld (Jan 23, 2007)

Dire Bare said:
			
		

> Not me, I'm loving all the characters and their plot lines so far.  Nikki is fast losing it and Jessica seems to have a plan!




At the end of the scene at the prison visit, when they woudln't let Jessica hug her son.... I'm pretty sure that was Jessica (Not Nikki) who was getting mad and broke the police batton in half!  Ahe looked surprised when that happened.  I think she has super srength all the time, and the Jessica "half" just didn't know it... or know how to use it.


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## Taelorn76 (Jan 23, 2007)

dogoftheunderworld said:
			
		

> At the end of the scene at the prison visit, when they woudln't let Jessica hug her son.... I'm pretty sure that was Jessica (Not Nikki) who was getting mad and broke the police batton in half!  Ahe looked surprised when that happened.  I think she has super srength all the time, and the Jessica "half" just didn't know it... or know how to use it.




I think you have that reversed. Jessica is the violent one and Nikki is the good one.


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## Umbran (Jan 23, 2007)

Alzrius said:
			
		

> Well, since these are the official comics that NBC states have additional content, then it seems like they do indeed exist.




"Official" does not mean "necessary to understnad what is going on".  One is supposed to be able to get everything off what's presented on your TV screen.  The comics are gravy.  Maybe interesting gravy, but still gravy.


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## Torx (Jan 23, 2007)

I was quite pleased with the episode.  Specifically, it further corrected one of the drawbacks many people have complained about: tying the storylines together.  Besides mere random connections and one or two heroes on screen at the same time, this time we had Nathan, Isaac, and Hiro all working together and starting to believe in one another.  That's a big step in the right direction as far as I'm concerned.

Overall, I was happy, and it made it all worth the wait.


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## LightPhoenix (Jan 23, 2007)

Umbran said:
			
		

> "Official" does not mean "necessary to understnad what is going on".  One is supposed to be able to get everything off what's presented on your TV screen.  The comics are gravy.  Maybe interesting gravy, but still gravy.




That's why I blame NBC for not promoting them more, and not anybody for not reading because, really, how was anybody supposed to know?  _Most_ of the time it seems like it's just filler - I thought the scene was too, first time I read it.  I assumed they would have handled that in last night's episode, and they didn't.

There are a couple other little things that I'm wondering if they may come up now.



			
				dogoftheunderworld said:
			
		

> At the end of the scene at the prison visit, when they woudln't let Niki hug her son.... I'm pretty sure that was Niki (Not Jessica) who was getting mad and broke the police batton in half! Ahe looked surprised when that happened. I think she has super srength all the time, and the Niki "half" just didn't know it... or know how to use it.




I was thinking about Niki/Jessica, and I don't think her only power is super-strength.  I think she may have heightened reflexes as well, sort of like *shudder* Gambit.  The way she grabbed the baton effortlessly, without even really thinking about it, seemed to suggest it.  There is precedent for heroes seeming to have more than one power - Peter absorbing/dreaming, and the Haitian mind erasing/power blocking.


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## GlassEye (Jan 23, 2007)

Interesting that in the comic 'Wireless, part 1' the positioning of the broken glass around Sylar makes him look like he has angel wings...


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## Ed_Laprade (Jan 23, 2007)

Umbran said:
			
		

> "Official" does not mean "necessary to understnad what is going on".  One is supposed to be able to get everything off what's presented on your TV screen.  The comics are gravy.  Maybe interesting gravy, but still gravy.



Right. If I had to go somewhere else to find out what was happening on the screen I'd stop watching, no matter how much I like the show. Some people don't have internet access (gasp!) and others just can't be bothered. 

Oh yeah, and I want to see the kid run over. By a steam roller! I would be happier if the whole Nikki/Jessica/DL/kid storyline went away.


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## RichCsigs (Jan 24, 2007)

Ummm... so am I the only one who went to the web site on Evil Glasses Man's business card?  

Spoilers:


Spoiler



On the web site there's an 1-800 number.  If you call the number (1-800-PRIMA16) and pick option 3 (all other options tell you that all operators are busy and you should try back later), it'll go into a spiel about job opportunities.  It'll then give you a code to punch in on the job section of the web site.  When you punch in the code, there's an application to fill out, including a short quiz.  Nothing major (yet) but pretty fun.



All around I loved this episode.  And I think it's obvious now that Linderman is going to be more than just the local mob boss.


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## Dire Bare (Jan 24, 2007)

Umbran said:
			
		

> "Official" does not mean "necessary to understnad what is going on".  One is supposed to be able to get everything off what's presented on your TV screen.  The comics are gravy.  Maybe interesting gravy, but still gravy.




I'm a big fan of these graphic novels on NBC.com.  I love'em!  But I am 100% sure that they are NOT necessary to enjoy and understand the show. 

However, they do expand upon and explain a lot about what's going on, and they ARE an official part of the storyline.  Think of them as the deleted scenes that will be re-edited back into the show on the Director's Cut DVD (not that it will happen, as they are comics of course and not video . . . although they probably will be on the eventual DVD).  Necessary?  No.  Are you missing out if you don't read them?  Yes!  (IMHO, of course)

If you aren't interested in reading them, or simply don't care for them . . . that's fine.  But too simply dismiss them as "that unimportant extra crap" on the web, well jeesh!  I'm not trying to pick on Umbran or anybody else in particular, just surprised in general about some folks reaction to things (this happens to me a lot).


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## The Grumpy Celt (Jan 24, 2007)

RichCsigs said:
			
		

> And I think it's obvious now that Linderman is going to be more than just the local mob boss.




I get the feeling Linderman is going to be a Lex Luthor/Dr. Doom type of figure; rich, smart, powerful, screws with things from a distance. Sylar is more of a Joker or Carnage type; mad, violent, leaves a bloody trail of bodies behind him.


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## DonTadow (Jan 24, 2007)

That was the first thing I did after the show, and I got in troublefor it because i was suppose to clean the kitchen after the show.  







			
				RichCsigs said:
			
		

> Ummm... so am I the only one who went to the web site on Evil Glasses Man's business card?
> 
> Spoilers:
> 
> ...


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## DonTadow (Jan 24, 2007)

I wish I had a Dwight at my job, this would be so much fun.


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## Hand of Evil (Jan 24, 2007)

The Grumpy Celt said:
			
		

> I get the feeling Linderman is going to be a Lex Luthor/Dr. Doom type of figure; rich, smart, powerful, screws with things from a distance. Sylar is more of a Joker or Carnage type; mad, violent, leaves a bloody trail of bodies behind him.



I am thinking he MAY be a good guy, powerful but a good Lex Luthor.


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## Aaron L (Jan 24, 2007)

I was so excited about watching this all weekend long, and then I fell asleep at 7 Monday night 

Isn't it rerun on Sc-Fi Channel?  When is that?  This is the one thing that will get me to watch that channel again.


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## Umbran (Jan 24, 2007)

Thought - HRG's man explained that he hadn't found any genetic markers in Sylar other than the ones that explained his TK....

So, how many of us think that the whole "get powers from other heroes" thing is just Sylar being completely cracked?  

Yes, he developed TK after killing someone with TK.  But given that we haven't really seen anything that cannot at least be no-prized by TK, maybe that was merely coincidence that the two had similar powers, and that event got Sylar over his hurdle to using them?  We have two other heroes with psychological blocks, after all...


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## DonTadow (Jan 24, 2007)

Umbran said:
			
		

> Thought - HRG's man explained that he hadn't found any genetic markers in Sylar other than the ones that explained his TK....
> 
> So, how many of us think that the whole "get powers from other heroes" thing is just Sylar being completely cracked?
> 
> Yes, he developed TK after killing someone with TK.  But given that we haven't really seen anything that cannot at least be no-prized by TK, maybe that was merely coincidence that the two had similar powers, and that event got Sylar over his hurdle to using them?  We have two other heroes with psychological blocks, after all...




After this episode, I"m starting to think that too. He hasn't demonstrated anything but telekenetic powers. What if he's just a whack job who thinks he can takes others powers.


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## Hand of Evil (Jan 24, 2007)

Aaron L said:
			
		

> I was so excited about watching this all weekend long, and then I fell asleep at 7 Monday night
> 
> Isn't it rerun on Sc-Fi Channel?  When is that?  This is the one thing that will get me to watch that channel again.



Sci-fi reruns it Friday in their 7:00 PM to 8:00 PM Slot, at least that is where they were running, which I think they still are doing.


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## LightPhoenix (Jan 24, 2007)

My new loony theory, which is so rediculous that I'm sure it's wrong, is about Jessica.

Jessica, like Peter, absorbs powers.  Except, whereas Peter does it in real-time, Jessica only does it when they die.  She also gets some of their personality.


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## Umbran (Jan 24, 2007)

LightPhoenix said:
			
		

> My new loony theory, which is so rediculous that I'm sure it's wrong, is about Jessica.
> 
> Jessica, like Peter, absorbs powers.  Except, whereas Peter does it in real-time, Jessica only does it when they die.  She also gets some of their personality.




Okay, I'll call that one loony, alright.   What brings you to this idea, considering that, as far as we know, Jessica has only killed normals?

My thought - the whole Nikki/Jessica division is a "normal" psychological problem.  Nikki could not deal with the death of her sister, and so created an alternate personality to help her cope.  It just so happens that, being the tough one, Jessica is the one who figured out how to use the super-strength.  But, like Isaac and drugs,that's a psychological block she may be able to break.  If somehow Nikki can deal with her trauma, she'll get rid of Jessica, and have her powers to herself.


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## dravot (Jan 24, 2007)

Umbran said:
			
		

> Okay, I'll call that one loony, alright.   What brings you to this idea, considering that, as far as we know, Jessica has only killed normals?
> 
> My thought - the whole Nikki/Jessica division is a "normal" psychological problem.  Nikki could not deal with the death of her sister, and so created an alternate personality to help her cope.  It just so happens that, being the tough one, Jessica is the one who figured out how to use the super-strength.  But, like Isaac and drugs,that's a psychological block she may be able to break.  If somehow Nikki can deal with her trauma, she'll get rid of Jessica, and have her powers to herself.




I predict that Nikki will gain about 80-90% control over the situation, and Jessica will come out at some point in the storyline.  Vaguely Dark Phoenix.


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## Pseudonym (Jan 25, 2007)

We gained some insight into the symbol on Hiro's sword, but still nothing about the connection to the Hatian's pendant on Jessica's tattoo.

If the super strength and reflexes area being blocked by Nikki/Jessica's personality issues, it still doesn't explain why one has that tattoo and the other doesn't.


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## LightPhoenix (Jan 25, 2007)

Umbran said:
			
		

> Okay, I'll call that one loony, alright.   What brings you to this idea, considering that, as far as we know, Jessica has only killed normals?




Yeah, it's dumb.

First, I meant Nikki, which means I'm also dumb.  So this is doubly dumb.

It's not so much that Nikki would need to kill someone, as much as be nearby when the person died.  Presumably she was nearby when Jessica died, hence powers.  If Nathan died near her, she would pick up flight and a bit of his personality, Rogue style.

What brought me to this?  Absolutely nothing.  Random thoughts.


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## DonTadow (Jan 25, 2007)

LightPhoenix said:
			
		

> Yeah, it's dumb.
> 
> First, I meant Nikki, which means I'm also dumb.  So this is doubly dumb.
> 
> ...



hey every theory is plausible until proven false. Though it is one of the more farout theories I've seen


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## The Grumpy Celt (Jan 25, 2007)

Umbran said:
			
		

> But, like Isaac and drugs,that's a psychological block she may be able to break.  If somehow Nikki can deal with her trauma...




I agree, but I find this entire story line weak because of weak acting on the part of Ari. She is pretty, but not much of an actress.

I also think Petrelli, on some level, retains all the powers he experiences. Hence, why is goes boom in New York even when Radioactive Man is no where in sight. And he may have gotten his visions from Isaac.


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## RichCsigs (Jan 25, 2007)

I like that idea for Nikki/Jessica.  Kind of like a Rogue (the comic character) thing with the absorbing of powers and memories and them being permanent if she stays in contact too long.  A fun idea, but probably not it.

Update on the Primatech Paper web site thing (Spoiler)


Spoiler



Got an e-mail today from them telling me that they are "...always interested in unique individuals with special abilities to help us provide the best service to our many clients" and that a "...representative will be contacting {me} in a few weeks".  Actually, it's kinda creepy feeling...


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## Hand of Evil (Jan 25, 2007)

I will state my wild theory on Jessica/Nikki: 
...Nikki is the one with super strenght and toughness, she just represses it. 
...Jessica is an ether character, she was able to leave her body and float about.  She died while away from her body or was thrown from it at the time of death.  Somewhere down the line she will learn how to take control of other people, possibly taking over someone to be a villian.


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## DonTadow (Jan 25, 2007)

RichCsigs said:
			
		

> I like that idea for Nikki/Jessica.  Kind of like a Rogue (the comic character) thing with the absorbing of powers and memories and them being permanent if she stays in contact too long.  A fun idea, but probably not it.
> 
> Update on the Primatech Paper web site thing (Spoiler)
> 
> ...



I think its so cool. Creepy, but in a cool way. I've gotten 3 random texts from them telling me they are looking forward to my talents and "we will get them alll" .


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## Taelorn76 (Jan 25, 2007)

The Grumpy Celt said:
			
		

> I agree, but I find this entire story line weak because of weak acting on the part of Ari. She is pretty, but not much of an actress.




I admit her acting is not that great in general, but that scene in jail with her lawyer where she switches back and forth from Nikki to Jessica, she pulled that off big time. I think she sold it very well that there is someone else inside her.



			
				The Grumpy Celt said:
			
		

> I also think Petrelli, on some level, retains all the powers he experiences. Hence, why is goes boom in New York even when Radioactive Man is no where in sight. And he may have gotten his visions from Isaac.




I don't think he retains others powers, I think Ted is somewhere near him in NYC and he can't handle it. As for his visions he was having them before he met Issac. The opening scene of the series has him dreaming of flying off a roof.


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## Flexor the Mighty! (Jan 25, 2007)

The Grumpy Celt said:
			
		

> I agree, but I find this entire story line weak because of weak acting on the part of Ari. She is pretty, but not much of an actress.




I agree.  I think the show would be a lot better without her or her family.


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## Shadeydm (Jan 25, 2007)

I just hope that Linderman doesn't turn out to be the man in charge of the "Organization Without Initials" that would really disappoint me.


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## Taelorn76 (Jan 25, 2007)

Shadeydm said:
			
		

> I just hope that Linderman doesn't turn out to be the man in charge of the "Organization Without Initials" that would really disappoint me.




What's the "Organization Without Initials"? Is that who Claire's dad works for?


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## Hand of Evil (Jan 25, 2007)

Taelorn76 said:
			
		

> What's the "Organization Without Initials"? Is that who Claire's dad works for?



Yep, the OWI.


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## LightPhoenix (Jan 25, 2007)

Speaking of Lindey and the OWI, one line that really stood out to me this episode was from Simone, and she says that Linderman buys all of Isaac's paintings.  That threw up the red-flags for me, and I'm assuming at this point Lindey knows about Isaac's power, though I have no clue how.  Also, it's convenient he holds the sword too, if it does indeed focus powers and isn't just Hiro making that up.


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## Arnwyn (Jan 25, 2007)

That was a pretty decent episode - going after that sword is going to be pretty cool.

But holy crap, does that Niki/Jessica side-story ever suck. Toss her from the show!


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## Fast Learner (Jan 26, 2007)

The symbol on the sword matches Jessica's tattoo and the HG's amulet. Either the sword is a real focus of some kind or it's an elaborate Linderman trap, I'd think.


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## The Grumpy Celt (Jan 26, 2007)

I think the Mind reading Cop was given the same tattoo during his abduction.


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## LightPhoenix (Jan 26, 2007)

Arnwyn said:
			
		

> But holy crap, does that Niki/Jessica side-story ever suck. Toss her from the show!




I actually think Ali Larter does a pretty good job.  In fact, I like all of the actors involved in the story.  The biggest problem with that story (IMO, of course) is that they're barely tied into the overall arc right now, so that story takes up time in an already dense show that could be better used to flesh out some of the people that _are_ involved.  It's more evident now, since the heroes are starting to come together, and her/DL/Micah are on the periphery.

The good news is that I've actually heard this acknowledged by the writers (sorry, no link off the top of my head), so hopefully by the end of the season they should be more in the fold.  After all, they do have to make it to NYC.

This was actually a problem I had with Matt's storyline in the beginning of the show, but that was ameliorated in a number of ways.  For one, Clea DuVall and Greg Grunberg rock.  More importantly though, they were our link to Sylar, and it was in their storyline he was first revealed.  Also, Matt was given a pretty big reason early on to be invested - not just Sylar, but the kidnapping as well.  

The reason this doesn't work for the Sanders family is for two reasons.  They are our primary link to Linderman (IMO, with Simone), but since he's being kept so shadowy, that really doesn't help them at all.  Also, while they _are_ invested in him, he's not a direct threat - in fact, he's been extremely benficial so far to everyone aside from Nikki and DL.  The reason they get his ire?  They tried to rob him, and killed a bunch of his goons.  It's not undeserved in the least, in direct contrast to Matt, and so it's harder to sympathize.

Spoilery speculation based on above: 



Spoiler



The next person to die has to be Simone, to preserve Nikki and DL as the primary link to Linderman, so they can be brought into the fold.



Anyway, when I say they need to cut Nikki's scenes, it's not because they're bad, it's because they're disrupting the flow.  I liken them to the storyline in season one of BSG with Helo on Caprica... it _eventually_ pays off, but until they do they tend to cut up the show in a distracting way.



			
				The Grumpy Celt said:
			
		

> I think the Mind reading Cop was given the same tattoo during his abduction.




He got the two pin-pricks on his neck, not the half-helix.  So did Ted Sprague, which is how he and Matt connected.  It's touched on in the latest comic, which I know you don't read, but the critical stuff will be in the episode next week (I hope!).


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## Taelorn76 (Jan 26, 2007)

Hand of Evil said:
			
		

> Yep, the OWI.



Never have heard it called that before.

I think Mr. Bennett has mention Linderman before, I am most likely mixing things up, But I thought the was a scene when he was on the phone speaking to Linderman?


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## Hand of Evil (Jan 26, 2007)

Taelorn76 said:
			
		

> Never have heard it called that before.
> 
> I think Mr. Bennett has mention Linderman before, I am most likely mixing things up, But I thought the was a scene when he was on the phone speaking to Linderman?



He has plus no one questioned, at least yet, on how he got into Nathan's room, while he was sleeping with Jessica, and while Linderman was filming!


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## Ulrik (Jan 26, 2007)

LightPhoenix said:
			
		

> The reason this doesn't work for the Sanders family is for two reasons.  They are our primary link to Linderman (IMO, with Simone)




Have you forgotten about Nathan? Not only does he work for Linderman (in some sense), but he and his dad have had ties to him for years. (Although Peter is in the same family, he tries to keep himself away from those connections.)

The Nikki storyline shows us Linderman's nasty side, which wouldn't be apparent otherwise (they just call him a gangster occasionally, nothing is shown), but Nathan is the one who actually has influence with Linderman. Remember that he got the painting back, not Simone. And what's really left of the Nikki-Linderman connection now that Linderman's got his money back and Nikki's in jail?


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## Flexor the Mighty! (Jan 26, 2007)

Ulrik said:
			
		

> Have you forgotten about Nathan? Not only does he work for Linderman (in some sense), but he and his dad have had ties to him for years. (Although Peter is in the same family, he tries to keep himself away from those connections.)




Good point.  Nathan has already sold his soul to Linderman for 4M.


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## Umbran (Jan 26, 2007)

LightPhoenix said:
			
		

> Also, it's convenient he holds the sword too, if it does indeed focus powers and isn't just Hiro making that up.




I am sure Hiro wasn't making up the folkelore about the sword.

However, we are seeing several cases where what the hero _believes_ to be true has an effect on his powers.  For a long time, Issac didn't think he could paint the future without drugs, so he couldn't.

So,there is a third option - Hiro isn't makign it up, but the sword really isn't special, physically.  Just so long as Hrio _believes_ it will help him focus, it will do so.

Anyone ever read the _Wild Cards_ series?  Think "The Great and Powerful Turtle".


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## Kaodi (Jan 26, 2007)

The sword could be a trap, but on the other hand, who is to say that the ancient Japanese swordsman didn't have actual powers? Perhaps at several times throughout history, people have gained powers. Think of the heroic ages of each civilization. 

What I really wonder is, in future seasons, what's going to happene when they start bringing the whole world into the fold. Right now, it's focused on a plot in North America. Only Hiro is from another continent, it seems. However, the map shows people all over the world. Lots of room for expansion, hehehe...


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## Umbran (Jan 26, 2007)

Kaodi said:
			
		

> The sword could be a trap, but on the other hand, who is to say that the ancient Japanese swordsman didn't have actual powers?




To be a trap, Linderman would have to have access to temporal information - he'd have to know that Hiro woudl end up thinking he needed it...



> Perhaps at several times throughout history, people have gained powers. Think of the heroic ages of each civilization.




HRG has said that he's ben tracking powered-people for over 14 years.  So these things are perhaps not all that new...



> Only Hiro is from another continent, it seems.




What, Mohinder and his father, and the boy who teaches in dreams don't count?  And there's a hero from the Middle East coming, if I am not mistaken.  The main plotline is set in North America because that's what the viewers are familiar with.


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## Hand of Evil (Jan 26, 2007)

Kaodi said:
			
		

> The sword could be a trap, but on the other hand, who is to say that the ancient Japanese swordsman didn't have actual powers? Perhaps at several times throughout history, people have gained powers. Think of the heroic ages of each civilization.
> 
> What I really wonder is, in future seasons, what's going to happene when they start bringing the whole world into the fold. Right now, it's focused on a plot in North America. Only Hiro is from another continent, it seems. However, the map shows people all over the world. Lots of room for expansion, hehehe...



To loop - We know Hiro gets the sword as we saw him with it.  It is possible, Hiro jumps back in time to leave the sword for himself, it is even possible that Hiro is his own forefather and has set all the heros in play from the future, appearing in the past, which we may be seeing.


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## Felon (Jan 26, 2007)

Umbran said:
			
		

> What, Mohinder and his father, and the boy who teaches in dreams don't count?




Don't forget the Haitian.


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## LightPhoenix (Jan 26, 2007)

Ulrik said:
			
		

> Have you forgotten about Nathan? Not only does he work for Linderman (in some sense), but he and his dad have had ties to him for years. (Although Peter is in the same family, he tries to keep himself away from those connections.)




I have not.  However, Simone has had just as much contact as Nathan, if not more - she gets the photo of the painting, she calls about the sword, and it's fairly obvious she's Isaac's art dealer and since Lindy buys all of his paintings, she's deep in.  She's obviously familiar with him.

Ugh, didn't mean to hit send yet.  Doh!    

With regards to Nathan and his father, the first thing is Nathan's father can't be a primary link to Lindy, because we've (seemingly) never seen him, even in the flashback.

Nathan did get the painting, yes.  The car crash may or may not have been Lindy's goons.  The sex scandal Nathan handily diffused, as if it were nothing.  That's not at strong as Nikki's story as far an antipathy goes, and not as seemingly honest as Simone's work with him.  In fact, there's good reason for Linderman to lie to Nathan, and has already, and I don't think Nathan's account of him can be trusted.


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## Arnwyn (Jan 26, 2007)

LightPhoenix said:
			
		

> I actually think Ali Larter does a pretty good job.  In fact, I like all of the actors involved in the story.  The biggest problem with that story (IMO, of course) is that they're barely tied into the overall arc right now, so that story takes up time in an already dense show that could be better used to flesh out some of the people that _are_ involved.  It's more evident now, since the heroes are starting to come together, and her/DL/Micah are on the periphery.
> 
> /snip/



That's a great analysis, *LightPhoenix*.

However, you are more generous than I am. I find the Niki character, and her entire storyline, to be just plain boring and uninteresting. It may commit a host of other sins (like disrupting the flow, as you mentioned), but I don't even make it that far before condemning that portion of _Heroes_.


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## The Grumpy Celt (Jan 26, 2007)

Hand of Evil said:
			
		

> ...it is even possible that Hiro is his own forefather...




I get the notion of Hiro singing "I'm my own grandpa." 

Hiro does go through some experiences that turn him into the character we see in the subway, talking to Patrelli. This includes, but is not limited to, fighting a hungry t-Rex, armed with a a sword. I mean Hiro has the sword, not the T-Rex.

I don't find the Nikki story arc dull, i just find Ari's performance generally lack luster.


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## Kobold Avenger (Jan 27, 2007)

Of other heroes that aren't from North America, there's Hana Gitelman while introduced in one of the online comics, she will appear in the show as previewed on http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=9458


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## Richards (Jan 27, 2007)

A coworker the other day came up with the interesting concept that it would be cool if it turns out that Kensai (was that his name?) in feudal Japan - the "original wielder" of the sword - ends up being none other than Hiro himself, having adventures way back then with his sword.

Johnathan


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## The Grumpy Celt (Jan 27, 2007)

Richards said:
			
		

> ... Kensai (was that his name?) in feudal Japan - the "original wielder" of the sword - ends up being none other than Hiro himself...




Perhaps the sword becomes a kind of infinity loop. I mean, maybe Hiro gets the sword now, and it supposedly old. Then, while in the past of Japan he loses it and it pass down though history that way. Passes down through history until it again/for the first time, end up in his hands.

The show creators have said they know where the show is going over the next five years or so - similar to the assertion by the writers of LOST.


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## LightPhoenix (Jan 27, 2007)

Arnwyn said:
			
		

> That's a great analysis, *LightPhoenix*.




Thanks!  I promise, I won't make another intelligent post for the rest of the season.    



			
				The Grumpy Celt said:
			
		

> The show creators have said they know where the show is going over the next five years or so - similar to the assertion by the writers of LOST.




I'll believe that in five years.  Lost, and specificaly Lindelof/Cuse/Abrams, made me too cynical.  Well, that and Shonda Rhimes from Grey's Anatomy.


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## Fast Learner (Jan 27, 2007)

Umbran said:
			
		

> To be a trap, Linderman would have to have access to temporal information - he'd have to know that Hiro woudl end up thinking he needed it...



If Linderman saw the painting of him fighting the T-Rex, he could have set it up.


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## Dire Bare (Jan 27, 2007)

The Grumpy Celt said:
			
		

> Hiro does go through some experiences that turn him into the character we see in the subway, talking to Patrelli. This includes, but is not limited to, fighting a hungry t-Rex, armed with a a sword. I mean Hiro has the sword, not the T-Rex.




Hiro has already encountered the T-Rex . . . in the museum!  Matched the painting perfectly!  I wasn't the only one who caught this, was I?


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## Mustrum_Ridcully (Jan 27, 2007)

Dire Bare said:
			
		

> Hiro has already encountered the T-Rex . . . in the museum!  Matched the painting perfectly!  I wasn't the only one who caught this, was I?



No, you were not.


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## Umbran (Jan 27, 2007)

The Grumpy Celt said:
			
		

> The show creators have said they know where the show is going over the next five years or so - similar to the assertion by the writers of LOST.




Hopefully it is more similar to the assertion of JMS - Not only did he know where B5 was going over five years, the show actually went somewhere each individual year.n  Something I am told Lost cannot claim.


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## The Grumpy Celt (Jan 27, 2007)

Dire Bare said:
			
		

> Hiro has already encountered the T-Rex . . . in the museum!  Matched the painting perfectly!  I wasn't the only one who caught this, was I?




I did not think it matched up that well. Maybe I am wrong. But that would be a kind of understated way to handle the confrontation.

GREAT SCOTT!

What if Linderman is actually a T-Rex!?!


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## DonTadow (Jan 27, 2007)

Umbran said:
			
		

> Hopefully it is more similar to the assertion of JMS - Not only did he know where B5 was going over five years, the show actually went somewhere each individual year.n  Something I am told Lost cannot claim.



HOpefully heroes producers and writers will stick to their plans and not divert because of media or studio pressure.

That was/is thep roblem with LOst. I think they began to getlost themselves trying to cater to a lot of demands.


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## Fast Learner (Jan 27, 2007)

Hiro did not have a sword, though, when he sees the (same) T-Rex, so the future vision doesn't match what we've seen so far.


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## Mustrum_Ridcully (Jan 27, 2007)

Fast Learner said:
			
		

> Hiro did not have a sword, though, when he sees the (same) T-Rex, so the future vision doesn't match what we've seen so far.



When he saw the dinosaurs the first time, he did not have sword. 
But the second time, he was wielding the (false) sword in front of the dinosaur, just like in the picture. I don't think the picture is detailed enough to show us whether Hiro is holding the real sword or the fake one, so it seems it is was just a clever ruse of the authors. Though it could be a "double ruse", and make us all believe that that's what the picture was all about.


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## LightPhoenix (Jan 27, 2007)

I may be talking out my butt on this one, but I don't think that it was the scene painted either.  IIRC (which I may not) the picture of Hiro battling the T-Rex had substantially different lighting than the museum shot - I think the background was orange in the former and blue in the latter.  Since they're been pretty exact about Isaac's paintings, as far as setting the shots up goes, I'm not entirely convinced.

That said, I find it likely it may be the same.


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## Fast Learner (Jan 27, 2007)

In the museum the sword is in its sheath and the background is indeed mostly blue. In the painting the sword is unsheathed and the background is indeed orange.

Otherwise, though, it is incredibly similar, and it works for me. The reason it didn't seem right before was because I remembered the unsheathed sword in the painting and that the one he grabs doesn't even have a blade. But yeah, I suppose it's good enough.


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## The Grumpy Celt (Jan 28, 2007)

Fast Learner said:
			
		

> But yeah, I suppose it's good enough.




You're probably right. It seems out of character for the show to actually have Hiro battle, or even encounter, a living T-Rex. Almost silly, actually.

So....

Who is the next to die?


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## Mustrum_Ridcully (Jan 28, 2007)

The Grumpy Celt said:
			
		

> You're probably right. It seems out of character for the show to actually have Hiro battle, or even encounter, a living T-Rex. Almost silly, actually.



I wanted to write the same thing, first, but then I thought: "Come on, we are talking about a show with superheroes using questionable genetic science as its excuse for superpowers..."


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## The Grumpy Celt (Jan 28, 2007)

Mustrum_Ridcully said:
			
		

> I wanted to write the same thing, first, but then I thought: "Come on, we are talking about a show with superheroes using questionable genetic science as its excuse for superpowers..."




Phoey on you. I was talking about thematically, in terms of mood and feel of the show. It is silly to suggest squinting your eyes changes the time stream, but the program has not gone into "fighting with dinos" silliness yet.


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## Taelorn76 (Jan 29, 2007)

Well, 

If Hiro fights a living T-Rex, then the show has jumped the megalodon.


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## DonTadow (Jan 29, 2007)

A dinosaur storyline could be done well if the right amount of tme and realism was put into it. I didnt think a superhero show could come off looking like anything but greatest american hero.


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## Umbran (Jan 29, 2007)

LightPhoenix said:
			
		

> IIRC (which I may not) the picture of Hiro battling the T-Rex had substantially different lighting than the museum shot - I think the background was orange in the former and blue in the latter.  Since they're been pretty exact about Isaac's paintings, as far as setting the shots up goes, I'm not entirely convinced.




Plus, you know, the world of dinosaurs was filled with orange-lit, mostly featureless backgrounds...


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