# Hethas' Gambit: Game of Death discussion [rnd 5]



## seasong (Jul 3, 2003)

*Links*

Original Discussion Thread
Continuation 1
This is Continuation 2...

Link to the GAME
and the RULES
and the MAP

*Point Totals*

*Round 01*

clockworkjoe (3 pts)
(Marius, PC)
+2: Bad Odds 4:1 (Master, Blaster, Unth & Antony)
(Special)
+1: Sif, for surviving an astounding amount of damage in 1 round

DM with a vengence (-1 pts)
(Hagbard, PC)
-1: Diddling
(Emeldra, Companion)
-0: Diddling (1/3rd point, rounded down for now)
(Thoramus, Companion)
+0: Companion Kill-thiefs Companion (Xiao Hu, Cholestus did most of the kill)

Duder (-1 pts)
(Whole team, PC + 2 companions)
-1: Diddling (2/3rds unaccounted for)

JDragon (-1 pts)
(Izad, PC)
-1: Diddling

Number47 (4 pts)
(Xiao Fung, PC)
+1: PC Kills Companion (Polar Bear 4)
+1: PC Kills Companion (Mr Cuffles, turned to stone)
+1: PC Kills Companion (Mr Fluffles)
(Special)
+1: Wee Jas, for extraordinary efficiency of action & teamwork

reapersaurus (1 pts)
(Special)
+1: Nike, for a decisive, _agressive_ early attack for 192 dmg

Sollir (-1 pts)
(Rillos, PC)
-1: Diddling

*Round 02*

clockworkjoe (3 pts)

cool hand luke (1 pts)
(Special)
+1: Nike & Sif, for Mortem doing a body check on a charging elephant

DM with a vengence (-1 pts)

Duder (-2 pts)
(Duder, PC)
-1: Diddling
(Omigawd, Companion)
-0: Diddling (1/3rd so far)
(Mang, Companion)
-0: Diddling (1/3rd so far)

JDragon (-2 pts)
(Izad, PC)
-1: Diddling

Jeremy (-1 pts)
(Tairnandon, PC)
-1: Diddling
(Usasmir, Companion)
-0: Diddling (1/3rd point so far)

Number47 (8 pts)
(Xiao Fung, PC)
+1: PC Kills Companion (Emeldra)
+1: PC Kills Companion (Thoramus)
+1: PC Kills Companion (Mr Gruffles)
+1: PC Kills Companion (Polar Bear 1)
+1: Bad odds 2:1 (Cholestus + Mrs Stampy)
(Xiao Lung, Companion)
+0: Companion Kills Companion (Polar Bear 5, 8)

reapersaurus (4 pts)
(Blaster, PC)
+3: PC Kills PC (Marius)
+2: Bad odds 3:1 (Mortem, Unth & Antony)

Sollir (-1 pts)


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## seasong (Jul 3, 2003)

Regarding diddling: Actually, I think that giving diddling points only if no one in the party is laying smack is closer to my original intent. I will go with that.

So, for example, reapersaurus will not suffer a diddling penalty for Master not participating directly.

Now, let's revisit natural d20 rolls...

I did say that, and like I said, I'm reasonably indifferent to it myself - while I was writing up results, it seemed that it was more exciting without them. But if y'all prefer to see them, I'm willing to switch back.

This was the vote as of last round:

Show Rolls (reapersaurus)
Don't (Saepiroth, Jeremy, cool hand luke)
Abstain (Number47, seasong)

As of the moment, it's changed to:

Show Rolls (reapersaurus, duder)
Don't (Saepiroth, Jeremy, cool hand luke, JDragon, Number47)
Abstain (seasong)

If I get a majority (5 with the current abstains) wanting me to show rolls, I'm  with that.


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## Jeremy (Jul 3, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> *... it seemed that it was more exciting without them.*




That's the feel I got too.  I like the strong RP feel of this GoD.  This type of game can VERY easily turn into a so and so moves 10' rolls 18, does 14 damage to him and her to the point it looks like a math problem.

Don't slow me up with numbers.  Tell me if something is a particularly telling blow, but keep it in game speak for me.


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## JDragon (Jul 3, 2003)

Thanks for the link Seasong, and don't show the roles. 

JDragon


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## Number47 (Jul 3, 2003)

Don't show rolls.


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## reapersaurus (Jul 3, 2003)

Jeremy said:
			
		

> *I like the strong RP feel of this GoD.*



You're joking, right?  

Unless I've been missing some, the bears and elephants have been doing almost all the roleplaying.  

All I've seen are rolls and effects (edit: actually, just my rolls).
That's just the way it's been so far, and I feel that the reason for that (partially) is that people ARE running scared, due to the lack of knowledge about the other opponents.

Notice we haven't had people guessing about what the effects have been caused by, where in other GoD's there was much discussion. (as a side note, there's been very little back-and-forth about the _gameplay_. I think that if there was, it would make things even more fun)
This might be attributed to; 
a) when we don't know much, it's very difficult, if not impossible, to guess many things.
b) There comes a phenomenon where a combatant may feel "If I'm quiet, and dodge attention, than I won't be attacked."

Personally, I like when the combat is above-board, and there is more knowledge about the effects - I think it gives a greater appreciation for the work involved (leading to more fun), and most importantly it allows for more strategy.

Actually, could someone help me out with a question?
How does keeping everything hidden promote MORE strategic actions, instead of making it less strategic, since you know almost nothing about why your attacks failed, or your strategy didn't work?

P.S. I just thought I'd start out this new thread with some food to chew on, discussion-wise...  
This post is meant light-heartedly, though it doesn't read as such - please don't attack me, or feel defensive... I'm just talking about a Game I like.

edit: I read jeremy's words again, and I think I see what he's getting at : a RP 'feel' (not referring to the roleplaying aspects, just in the fact where you are abstracted somewhat from the dice rolls).
That's interesting. The last thing I want from a GoD is something that I can get from a normal game session. A GoD to me is something unique, where the whole point of the exercise is to compete with an intense 'numbers' approach. It's interesting how we all approach these Games differently.


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## Number47 (Jul 4, 2003)

New maps are up. I think everyone will like the new format. The cast page is being dropped, someone else can track that if they choose.


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## Rathan (Jul 4, 2003)

Thought I'd drop in and say good luck to all for the next game of death! and a long time no see to #47..... nice to see you again man.. we all miss ya here at Fight Club!


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## Saepiroth (Jul 4, 2003)

Ah... to answer Reaper's problem with finding the game thread...

There's this magical little resource built-in to vBulletin called the "User Control Panel". If you enable "use Email Notification" it will always contain a link to every active thread you are involved it.

It's worked by magic server gnomes! 



I would actually like a "cohorts diddling costs points" thing... though, of course, I would, now wouldn't I? It would certainly reduce the cohort supply in another game...

...

I'm going to be out of town until tuesday. I'll go do my move for round three now, but please don't set the round 4 deadline before wednesday at the earliest.


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## reapersaurus (Jul 4, 2003)

I'm aware of the subscription ability, Saep, thanks.

You know what I just found out last week - you guys'll be SOOO stoked - there's that ability in the newest IE browser that even lets you Favorite a web site you want to be able to go back to!
I've heard it works thru some virtual-reality process that clones pixies for their dust.

Can you believe it?   

Let me rephrase the point, Seap, just for you  :
The Fight Club is not as busy as General Discussion. This could be perceived as a benefit.

Of course, the downside is that now you might have to go in a Forum you normally don't go to (I'd agree with that...).

so does anybody have any feedback or opinions about the Game? How things are looking?
I think the ones to watch out for are the ones that haven't been heard from yet.... all those dudes hanging back and playing possom...


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## Number47 (Jul 4, 2003)

I'll bet Izad is a little ticked at the bear suddenly appearing over him.


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## Saepiroth (Jul 4, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> *Of course, the downside is that now you might have to go in a Forum you normally don't go to (I'd agree with that...). *



 The people in here are weird, that guy in the corner keeps _looking_ at me!


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## reapersaurus (Jul 4, 2003)

Number47 said:
			
		

> *I'll bet Izad is a little ticked at the bear suddenly appearing over him. *



LOL Yeah - "I was just taking this nice swim in the lake here, minding my own business, when
 << WHAM! >> a bear attacks me like I'm a salmon, trying to spawn!"

Oh, 47: Master moved, then dropped the elephant (Raster is a good name, BTW). So it would have started in (16,69)-(19,70).

I liked the sheep from Hell making its debut.


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## JDragon (Jul 4, 2003)

Yeah the bear showing up was a bit of a surprise.  

We'll see what happens, but as I told Seasong in my response to the detailed email... 

"Looks like the lake isn't so safe anymore. "

So I guess I'm off to find another hiding spot.  

JDragon


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## reapersaurus (Jul 4, 2003)

JDragon said:
			
		

> *So I guess I'm off to find another hiding spot.  *



[poking fun] Izad, the Legendary Hiding Gladiator.
I'm sure the Gods will have songs commissioned to eternalize his heroics.  [/fun]


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## seasong (Jul 5, 2003)

By the way, I just wanted to compliment everyone who has taken hard hits in the last two rounds. I know that some careful planning was completely torn apart for several of you, and there have been a lot of deaths and lost resources... And y'all have been perfectly sportsmanly about it.

This is a game of _death_, you understood that, and you are playing accordingly. Thank you.

_On another note_, I'm going to have some corrections to make: Master's elephant Raster got an AoO on Mortem when he moved, which I forgot about; and Blaster managed some Arrow Deflection against Antony's arrows that I forgot about.

Neither one affected the overall results, but they will alter hit point totals by a few points here and there, and I'll try to get that up sometime Monday (I'm gone for the weekend).

_One more thing,_ I'm still waffling on Cohort Diddling. On the one hand, cohorts are a heft advantage, and I don't think some point penalties is too harsh. On the other hand, what if the cohort's build is to enhance the primary character's ability to attack?

So maybe I'll restate that to CONTRIBUTING to an attack, rather than direct attack.

What do y'all think?


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## Sollir Furryfoot (Jul 5, 2003)

On cohorts and diddling:
I still don't see how that's much different for casting spells to enhance yourself, and you consider that diddling-I mean, should that benefit be only to people who have casters as cohorts?  If so then I concede my point, but just my feelings on the matter.


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## reapersaurus (Jul 5, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> *So maybe I'll restate that to CONTRIBUTING to an attack, rather than direct attack.
> 
> What do y'all think? *



I think a couple things:
1) Most competitors that don't have a cohort will probably want diddling, and most that have cohorts probably won't want diddling for cohorts.

2) You'd have to define parameters for what exactly "contributing" is.

Is it buffing?
How bout healing?
What about casting a critical part of the PC's offensive strategy?
What about, for example, Master's creation of the elephant? In retrospect, I don't see how that was diddling even before...

And this is gonna be a long weekend without GoD action, after a fast-n-furious couple weeks.


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## Saepiroth (Jul 6, 2003)

I admit I am decidedly on the "pro-diddle" side of the equation, but I don't think it should be TOO severe. Cohorts really just aren't as meaty as a PC would be, and don't have the same ability.

I would think Healing, any sort of "aid another" combat action ("Aid Another", Provide Cover, a readied action to protect the PC (even if it doesn't trigger) or whatever), or attacking through a surrogate should be an exemption from diddling for cohorts. So, in this last round, Reaper wouldn't have been penalized on the cohort (because of the elephant) but Duder would have been, since his crew just hung out inside a force bubble. I actually do think attacking through a surrogate should be an exemption for PCs too, since our friends in the northwest corner have been utterly sodomized by the Xiao group.

I also think that Cohort diddling should be less pricy than PC diddling... say, .5 points per round instead of 1p/round.


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## seasong (Jul 6, 2003)

I could base cohort diddling around the same ratio as I did cohort kills. That would put it at 1/3rd point per round a cohort diddles.

That way:

Cost of cohort death = 1/3 cost of PC death
Cost of cohort diddle = 1/3 cost of PC diddle

Does that sound like a good compromise? If so, I need to go through and recalculate everyone's points, but I'm cool with that


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## Saepiroth (Jul 6, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> *Does that sound like a good compromise? *



 It's .


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## Number47 (Jul 7, 2003)

Whatever works. I know I'm sure not diddling!


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## reapersaurus (Jul 7, 2003)

that sounds like a good, and logical, compromise.

It does give a cost to those with cohorts that don't actively advance the aggression factor (tm), while the cost doesn't overshadow their accomplishments later (or earlier) on.

seasong:
if we were to suffer an attack by an invisible opponent that failed (let's say a Dominate spell), would you inform us?
Same situation - would you tell the other Gladiators?


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## seasong (Jul 7, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> seasong:
> if we were to suffer an attack by an invisible opponent that failed (let's say a Dominate spell), would you inform us?
> Same situation - would you tell the other Gladiators?



At the very least, I would tell you that you made a Will save, what the roll was, and that you succeeded. I would not tell the other gladiators unless there was something visible going on.

This is still under vote, however, for natural d20 rolls.


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## cool hand luke (Jul 7, 2003)

wow intersting round 2.  definitely didn't go as I had planned, but oh well.


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## seasong (Jul 7, 2003)

Hokey-dokey, here's the corrections as I have them, all related to Blaster's assault on Marius .

1) Marius DID get an AoO on Blaster. Reapersaurus reminded me* that Blaster was not using an improved grab (Marius is not small enough). He missed, but I should have caught that. Too many of y'all are Large!

2) Blaster managed to deflect the first arrow Antony shot at him, at Init 23 (AoO). This arrow did NOT do 10 dmg to Blaster.

3) Blaster's elephant (Raster) got an AoO against Mortem when he moved to the other side of Blaster. Raster attempted to gore Mortem, but missed.

Since no one else came screaming with corrections , I'm going to start working up the gods' commentary and final points. I'm using the 1/3rd point for cohort diddling.

* Incidentally, this was well beyond the ordinary call of honesty - Marius still would have taken enough damage to die, but Blaster might have taken more damage than he already did this round.


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## seasong (Jul 7, 2003)

Posted the Gods' commentary.

Editted points into the first post of this thread, both for round 1 and 2. There were a few corrections: I didn't notice a diddling character last time through, and I miscounted the kill on Xiao Hu.

I also think I'm going to tweak the points slightly, so that I don't have to deal in 1/3s and 1/2s, and so that you never get "0" points for a kill.

How does this sound?

Kills

Straight up kill:
PC kills PC: 30 points
PC kills Companion: 10 points
Companion kills PC: 20 points
Companion kills Companion: 6 points

Kill-THIEF:
PC kills PC: 10 points
PC kills Companion: 3 points
Companion kills PC: 6 points
Companion kills Companion: 2 points

Coup de Grace:
PC kills PC: 20 points
PC kills Companion: 6 points
Companion kills PC: 12 points
Companion kills Companion: 3 points

Kill-THIEF + Coup de Grace:
PC kills PC: 6 points
PC kills Companion: 2 points
Companion kills PC: 4 points
Companion kills Companion: 1 points

SUICIDE:
PC: -30 points
Companion: -10 points

Kill-THIEF + SUICIDE:
PC: -60 points
Companion: -20 points

Other Stuff

Bad Odds:
2:1 odds: +10 points per round
3:1 odds: +15 points per round
4:1 odds: +20 points per round
5:1 odds: +30 points per round

Performance:
Gets you 10 points, +1 pt per 1 you exceed DC 20 by on a Perform check. 

Diddling:
PC: -10 points per round
Companion: -3 points per round

Championship:
Last PC Standing: +100 points
Win Champion Fight: +100 points
Lose Champion Fight: -50 points


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## Pielorinho (Jul 7, 2003)

> As the round ends, Hethas glances at the gods. _It is time,_ she decides, _to stir the pot a bit._ A moment of concentration, and the wind slowly begins to increase in ferocity - the increase is slow enough for gladiators to recognize the danger, but swift enough to be interesting.




Cholestus, here's lookin' at you! 

Daniel


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## reapersaurus (Jul 7, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> *How does this sound?*



It sounds GREAT.
Seriously, I think that really helps the overall equity of point awards and penalties.
Good job, again.

edit: oops, except for Master shouldn't have gotten a Diddling this round, I think - he attacked with the elephant, so why would that be diddling?


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## seasong (Jul 7, 2003)

That reminds me, I might as well make sure everyone understands the effects the wind might have. Basically, at 20 mph or less, there is no game effect. At higher wind speeds, missile weapons become increasingly difficult to use (impossible at 51+ mph), creatures begin to be knocked down or blown away (Fort save based), and _dust of disappearance_ is ripped away.

Wind can also penalize or entirely prevent Listen checks, kick up waves, hit you with damaging sand, and even reduce visibility if there is debris.

Strong winds can be used to very good effect in adventures, making otherwise boring fights very exciting, as the PCs scramble to stay in place or find a shield against the wind to allow a few shots with an arrow.

_A note on timing: the game is going slower (in rounds) and faster (in agression) than I had originally thought, so 5-10 rounds between changes is likely too slow. As long as it doesn't bother anyone, I'll be changing the timing from 1d6+4 to 1d4+2 (3-6 rounds). Regardless, this wind will not be at full strength until round 5, per my original plans._


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## seasong (Jul 7, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> edit: oops, except for Master shouldn't have gotten a Diddling this round, I think - he attacked with the elephant, so why would that be diddling?



Because I can't read my own writing .

Corrected.


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## reapersaurus (Jul 7, 2003)

Could you also add in Blaster's survival points for surviving 3 people's attacks?


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## Number47 (Jul 8, 2003)

You should add a points page to the site. I like the proposed changes. Everything looking just fine. Didn't I kill more than that by now? Do I get extra points for being attacked by DMwaV army and Cholestus for two rounds?

Can we get a new initiative list?


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## Number47 (Jul 8, 2003)

I'm just itching to know...would Marius have survived if he didn't get hit by that lightning bolt?


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## seasong (Jul 8, 2003)

Marius: Maybe . Characters will be revealed, if y'all don't vote it down, at the end of the game.

Bad odds survivors: Points added in. I'll convert the points to the new system if y'all like it.

Initiative: As before, individual players know if their initiative is altered, but otherwise it is a non-visible action which is revealed at the beginning of the round, after I get everyone's actions.

Other points: If y'all notice any other points you should have gotten, please bring them to my attention. Hethas misses beats sometimes .


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## seasong (Jul 9, 2003)

Just a reminder to send me your move by tonight.

Some of you already sent your move, then sent me questions, then didn't confirm to stick with the old move - if you don't send me a new move, I will stay with the old.


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## JDragon (Jul 9, 2003)

Edit - never mind - sent via Email.

JDragon


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## seasong (Jul 9, 2003)

Got it. Check my l33t reply .


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## Saepiroth (Jul 9, 2003)

It's hard to keep track of events when lightning abducts your cable modem for five days and traps it in a well in the basement, occasionally spraying it with a hose.


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## seasong (Jul 10, 2003)

For diddling, here's my general reasoning:

The diddling rule was to encourage fast, decisive action; to discourage hiding, long periods of buffing, and running away. At the same time, I didn't want it to be TOO severe - a slight disadvantage in the points aspect of the game, but not something that equals a guaranteed loss.

Just looking it over from a game theory standpoint, a good strategy allows up to 3-5 rounds of diddling, and is still capable of coming out on top, points-wise. Remember, there is a sea of _50+ potential kill points_ running around the arena, and only about 14 of those points have been taken.

With that said, I have been rethinking the definition of diddling. I like the idea of Aid Another. Suggestions for a clear definition would be welcome .

Anyway, there's my reasoning. Feel free to argue the point with me, my eyes are open to reason .


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## Number47 (Jul 10, 2003)

I don't know if you've started processing turns or not. I just wanted to say that I'm having a very busy week at work, so I can't even start maps until the weekend, and then it will probably take a couple days. Sorry, everyone.


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## duder (Jul 10, 2003)

its all good


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## Number47 (Jul 12, 2003)

Any news?


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## reapersaurus (Jul 13, 2003)




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## Sollir Furryfoot (Jul 14, 2003)

*whistles* I'm gonna be gone this whole wednesday and won't be able to post til late thursday (going to the airport and flying to Phoenix), just a quick heads up-I doubt it'l effect my email tho, if its needed by then.


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## cool hand luke (Jul 14, 2003)

so reaper,

which of my guys did mr. kitty kill this round?


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## reapersaurus (Jul 15, 2003)

I'm not sayin' nothin'.
The quieter you are, the more likelihood you'll escape notice, and people won't attack you.
That's good strategy. 

You are really trying to sucker people into believing you're weaker than you are, aren't you?  

Gee, 3 vs 1 odds.
Blaster has survived 10 attacks so far, 9 last round alone.

While my aggression may border on suicidal, it IS easier to instill fear when your main weapon isn't pushing up daisies.  

I'm just wondering who my next target(s) is(are) going to be....*

*presuming my guys survived Round 3, of course.


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## cool hand luke (Jul 15, 2003)

wreaking a few thousand HP damage each round isn't exactly keeping quite.


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## seasong (Jul 15, 2003)

Hoping to have stuff up tonight or early tomorrow morning. Sorry for how quiet I've been the last few - had a very, very busy weekend.

I may post some teasers this afternoon.

...

Looks like I never posted Init, either. Dammit. Here you go:

36 - Xiao Fung (Number47)
35 - Xiao Lung (Number47)
33 - Master (reapersaurus)
30 - Duder (duder)
29 - Osirdar (Jeremy)
28 - Hagbard the Chartreuse (DM with a vengence)
27 - Antony Grandell (Cool hand luke)
23 - Blaster (reapersaurus)
22 - Izad (Jdragon)
22 - Cholestus the Shredder (Saepiroth)
21 - Tairnandon (Jeremy)
21 - Usasmir (Jeremy)
20 - Rillos (Sollir Furryfoot)
19 - Mang (duder)
17 - Unth Dirn (Cool hand luke)
10 - Mortem Redgrave (Cool hand luke)
7 - Omigawd (duder)
3 - Mr Buffles (DM with a vengence)
3 - Mr Duffles (DM with a vengence)
3 - Mr Huffles (DM with a vengence)
3 - Summoned Polar Bear 2 (DM with a vengence)
3 - Summoned Polar Bear 3 (DM with a vengence)
3 - Summoned Polar Bear 6 (DM with a vengence)
3 - Mr Stampy (DM with a vengence)
3 - Mrs Stampy (DM with a vengence)


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## cool hand luke (Jul 15, 2003)

yikes, this bodes ill for me.

stupid cat.  

I hate cats

all men SHOULD hate cats.


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## Saepiroth (Jul 15, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> *36 - Xiao Fung (Number47)
> 35 - Xiao Lung (Number47)
> *




...crap.


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## reapersaurus (Jul 15, 2003)

cool hand luke said:
			
		

> *I hate cats*



What's to hate about those little balls of hatred?  

And just for that, Blaster is "Mr. Fluffy" to you from now on.


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## seasong (Jul 16, 2003)

Running behind. Boss in the office*.

Have a ton of free time tonight, however . Oh, and this round was not as violent as last round, but it looks like a good setup for next round.

Also: I've noticed that the targets are getting harder than in the first two rounds...

("is that a boss in your office, or are you just normally a fluffy ball of hatred?")


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## Sollir Furryfoot (Jul 17, 2003)

Hey Seasong, would you mind emailing my character to my address again please?  As I said I'm in Arizona, but I forgot to email my own character to myself lol... (Whisper_the_tiefling@yahoo .com)


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## seasong (Jul 17, 2003)

Two of you have asked for a copy of your characters. I will be able to send those to you when I get home - the copy I have at work has too many DM's notes 

Also, I'm still working on the round from last night. This round has taken a lot longer due mostly to tiredness on my part, although it is at least less confusing .

I'm going out of town this weekend, so I think we'll set the deadline at Sunday night. Sound good?

.
.
.

A note on points: It was pointed out to me by a friend that summoned creatures and animal companions are generally less dangerous than cohorts; it was also pointed out that animated objects, grasping hands, and similar things act just like a companion, and require hit point damage to end, and so should probably be treated similarly to summoned creatures and animal companions for points.

You'd think, by now, that I wouldn't be surprised anymore when there are points issues I haven't considered .

Anyway, here is the complete points rules, which I will not change any further without an act of congress 

*Kills*

A lesser companion includes, basically, anything that can attack and be attacked, and has a duration of at least one full round. This includes animated skeletons, animated objects, summoned creatures, animal companions, Bigby's hands, and so on.

*Straight up kill:*
PC kills PC: 30 points
PC kills Cohort: 10 points
PC kills Any Lesser Companion: 5 points
Companion kills PC: 20 points
Companion kills Cohort: 6 points
Companion kills Any Lesser Companion: 3 points

*Kill-THIEF:*
PC kills PC: 10 points
PC kills Cohort: 3 points
PC kills Any Lesser Companion: 1 point
Companion kills PC: 6 points
Companion kills Cohort: 2 points
Companion kills Any Lesser Companion: 1 point

*Coup de Grace:*
PC kills PC: 20 points
PC kills Cohort: 6 points
PC kills Any Lesser Companion: 3 points
Companion kills PC: 12 points
Companion kills Cohort: 3 points
Companion kills Any Lesser Companion: 1 point

*Kill-THIEF + Coup de Grace:*
PC kills PC: 6 points
PC kills Cohort: 2 points
PC kills Any Lesser Companion: 1 point
Companion kills PC: 4 points
Companion kills Cohort: 1 points
Companion kills Any Lesser Companion: 0 points

*SUICIDE:*
PC: -30 points
Cohort: -10 points
Any Lesser Companion: -5 points

*Kill-THIEF + SUICIDE:*
PC: -60 points
Cohort: -20 points
Any Lesser Companion: -10 points

*Other Stuff*

*Bad Odds:*
2:1 odds: +10 points per round
3:1 odds: +15 points per round
4:1 odds: +20 points per round
5:1 odds or more: +30 points per round
All companions count full for this!

*Performance:*
Gets you 10 points, +1 pt per 1 you exceed DC 20 by on a Perform check. 

*Diddling:*
PC: -10 points per round
Cohort: -3 points per round
Any Lesser Companion: -1 point per round

*Championship:*
Last PC Standing: +100 points
Win Champion Fight: +100 points
Lose Champion Fight: -50 points


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## cool hand luke (Jul 17, 2003)

will you have everything posted by tomorrow morning?  (I'm leaving at noon tomorrow) so If you don't post by then, I won't be able to make the sunday deadline.


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## seasong (Jul 17, 2003)

cool hand luke said:
			
		

> will you have everything posted by tomorrow morning?  (I'm leaving at noon tomorrow) so If you don't post by then, I won't be able to make the sunday deadline.



Actually, I have some clarifications I need from you, so I'll send you a note on where you're at right now - it should be sufficient information for you to decide the next round as well.

As for tomorrow morning, I'm hoping to have it up today .


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## seasong (Jul 17, 2003)

Was chatting with Jeremy on Yahoo IM (hanging around for cool hand luke ), and he mentioned that y'all might like a few teasers while you wait.

- It looks like 2, possibly 3, characters have died (all cohorts).
- The Xiao family finally deigns to notice Cholestus. He notices them back.
- A few more animals die.
- Izad thinks he's Jesus. Why would a bear try to eat Jesus?
- Master + Blaster switch gears. Fast.

-seasong


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## Jeremy (Jul 17, 2003)

Did you Xiao's hit Izad with the purple stuff too?  Haven't we got enough crazies running around?


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## cool hand luke (Jul 17, 2003)

sorry, can't IM at work, 

but I did send you an email


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## seasong (Jul 17, 2003)

Got the e-mail, sent a response.

Oh, in case anyone's fretting...  Cool hand luke is the only clarification needed; I've got everyone else pretty much done, although there will be some rippling from cool hand luke.

Uhm... I also still have some rolls for Rillos, Mrs Stampy, and Cholestus, but that's all pretty minor. Like I said, this round wasn't nearly as bloody as last round 

-seasong


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## reapersaurus (Jul 17, 2003)

yeah! - there was something to read this morning in the GoD thread!

Nice to see...

That Master and Blaster - they can go from 60 to 0 in less than 6 seconds!


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## Saepiroth (Jul 17, 2003)

> Kill-THIEF + Coup de Grace:
> Companion kills Any Lesser Companion: 1/2 point



 Since you said that you changed the points table to eliminate partial points, maybe this ought to just be zero?

And the "Lesser Companions" just use the "Companions" part of the table, right?


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## seasong (Jul 17, 2003)

Hm. Yeah, might as well drop that to zero. If you have a cohort using a _coup de grace_ to steal a kill from someone else, Hethas has no use for you .


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## seasong (Jul 17, 2003)

A note on a ruling:

> How do you handle disintegration and gear? 

Unless there's a good argument why not, equipment is not touched by it - it targets the character, not the doorframe he is touching, the ground he is standing on, or the miscellaneous other items in contact with his flesh. 

This is also a part of my larger philosophy, which says, "if I have to roll for items, too, and keep track of what's lost and what's kept, it's going to take me a month to run a round."


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## seasong (Jul 17, 2003)

Annnnnnd... one more thing:

In the choosing of starting locations, there was a subtle strategy involved. I debated discussing this, because it says quite a bit about strategy, and I'd prefer to NOT taint y'all's plans with my DM's View of things. However, it's come up in a couple of emails, and I'd rather share it with everyone than with just the few people who brought it up.

When designing the arena, I decided on a number of variables that would matter the most, primarily:

Distance from other points in the arena
Line of sight from other points in the arena (and concealment)
Barriers to movement
Natural visual sinks (just from an art theory perspective)

For distance, the four corners offered the longest overall distance from other points in the arena, making them ideal for archers and spell casters. This was a simple enough issue - I rounded the arena slightly so that I wouldn't end up with people crowding the few squares of the corners themselves (while amusing to think about, I wanted some breathing space for everyone).

At the same time, the real melee types would tend to pick locations closer to the middle, where they would be most likely able to close quickly with whoever they chose to target.

For line of sight, the hills and the lake break things up for targetting purposes. That makes the top of the upper left hill (I call it Fort Hill) the MOST ideal for anyone who wants flexibility between hiding and laying long-range smack.

The middle-sized hill (I call it Cautious Hill) does not provide as great an advantage to long range attackers, but it provides the only real barrier to line of sight _from_ Fort Hill. That makes it look like a good place to hide for a round or two.

For barriers, I divided the arena into two with the river. It's not a perfect barrier, just a mild one, but it creates two major visual spaces in the arena - the northeastern area looks terribly vulnerable and open, and the southwestern area looks more broken up and protective. Again, this enhanced Cautious Hill's appeal to that group, and helped push everyone away from the northeastern corner.

I also made the lake as a bigger barrier to movement, and gave it only a few squares along the edges. I wanted that area to look like a trap, to push most people away from the southeastern corner.

For natural visual sinks, I laid it out to draw the eye inexorably along the left side of the arena. I didn't really intend for there to be any fighting in the east half of the arena - the whole purpose of that area was to provide the visual oomph to push the eye to the west.

My ultimate goal was to have three groups: one in the center, between Fort Hill and Cautious Hill, one physically _on_ Fort Hill, and one in the southwestern corner, preferably clustered a bit close to Cautious Hill.

The central group would primarily be those folks who were looking to lay smack and weren't too picky about who. I expected Cholestus and Master+Blaster to be here, and possibly one or two others, and I was rather wrong .

The Fort Hill group would be the strongest contenders, the ones who were ready for a fight right out of the gate, but who wanted some tactical options for line of sight, distance, and who they could target.

The Cautious Hill group would be the cautious ones who wanted some time to prep, little knowing that Hethas planned to have them all crowded together right off the bat (Rillos and Izad stumped me by taking a chance on the even more crowded looking southeastern corner).

The larger strategy, of course, would be to see this, figure out where people are likely to end up, and go for a spot that suited your needs based on where everyone else was going to be. If I had a build that was made for Fort Hill, for example, I'd take Cautious Hill. Fewer options, but I'd be closest to all the people who'd built around having extra prep time.

If I had a Cautious build, I'd stuff myself into a corner, preferably the northeastern corner. Or I'd do what Rillos and Izad did.

And if I was a Central gimme-a-fight type, I'd pick Fort Hill, where the biggest, meanest, juiciest targets were. Of course, that wouldn't result in a quick win, but I'd probably go out in a blaze of glory .


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## cool hand luke (Jul 17, 2003)

clarification email sent.


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## seasong (Jul 17, 2003)

Okay, I finished. I'll write up the visible version as soon as I get home, and then I'm going to bed .

More teasers 
- Cholestus is so high, he can almost touch the sky.
- Someone finally cast blade barrier.
- Xiao Fung and Hagbard the Chartreuse prepare to go head to head (and both earn some points).
- Mr Stampy's grass don't taste so good now.


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## reapersaurus (Jul 17, 2003)

That's a great line of explanation there, seasong.
I REALLY appreciate your extra discussion, and thoughts about aspects of your GoD. (planning, etc)

I think it adds insight and understanding, just like your Exposition posts in the Iron DM competition (you got unlucky on the scheduling, and on a brief glance, the decision didn't seem completely accurate OR correct in my eyes)

As for "Cautious Hill", the only things I remember thinking before giving my starting coords were: I wanted a place where I could be central, and be able to attack a lot of potential targets. And also, that it would be smart to start in a corner, to attack spellcasters and hidey-people, but I didn't want to risk starting in an empty corner - it would take too long to get started.

While Cautious Hill is a very dangerous location currently, it does kinda seem strange to me on the surface that duder's trio and Jeremy's trio would have chosen that location to start, IF they aren't attacking.
Rationale: if they wanted to buff, or be protected, or stay unrevealed, I'd think that a central location wouldn't be the best strategy. 

edit: ahhhh, but is Cholestus _'experienced'_? 
And actually, shouldn't Mr. Stampy be as high as the sky, after all that grass? (the Mid-day Toker)


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## Number47 (Jul 17, 2003)

Grass as high as an elephant's eye?


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## seasong (Jul 17, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> I think it adds insight and understanding, just like your Exposition posts in the Iron DM competition (you got unlucky on the scheduling, and on a brief glance, the decision didn't seem completely accurate OR correct in my eyes)



Well, I got unlucky on scheduling, but that didn't hamper me as much as my boss/job did the next morning . A few hours of editting, and I might have had a chance. As it was, my entry was too sloppy. Good, but very sloppy.



> As for "Cautious Hill", the only things I remember thinking before giving my starting coords were: I wanted a place where I could be central, and be able to attack a lot of potential targets. And also, that it would be smart to start in a corner, to attack spellcasters and hidey-people, but I didn't want to risk starting in an empty corner - it would take too long to get started.



Heh. Well, that makes a lot of sense now - you were working for a happy medium between the spot I thought you'd want, and the area that looked ripe 

I'd been wondering why you ended up in the wrong spot


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## Sollir Furryfoot (Jul 18, 2003)

Reaper, is that a Jimmy Hendrix reference?  I know you like to make a bunch of those, so I'm just curious


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## seasong (Jul 18, 2003)

I'm going over the entry one last time, just to make sure there's nothing _really_ stupid . Should be up in about five minutes.

_Edit: Speaking of stupid, no one saw that. _


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## seasong (Jul 18, 2003)

And I'm off to bed.

Custom e-mails in the morn.


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## reapersaurus (Jul 18, 2003)

Fun round.

I liked Cholestus's futile cry for whereabouts.

Mr. Stampy's sense of loss was palpable.

Hagberd : a Save-or-Die specialist?
Number47 - are the dice hatin' you, now?  that green bolt looked painful, but DAMN! That was some serious init they had (have).

seasong - when you get the chance, I'm guessing you're going to update the point totals in the first post with the new point-scale?
And you went to bed at 8:17? (you are 2 hours ahead of Pacific time, right?)


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## Number47 (Jul 18, 2003)

The dice have been hating me all along. I really did not take into consideration the possiblity that Hagbard would survive my assault. It is simply inconceivable!

The funny thing is, I chose my opening position because I wanted to ensure that I was near quite a few combatants, preferably all bunched up together. That was accomplished admirably by DMwaV. I didn't like Cholestus starting just _five feet_ from me, though! Even that would have been nothing if I had only gotten better initiative. I do believe that Xiao Fung's +16 to initiative is the top amount possible in this game of death, but I suppose I might be wrong.

Maps are done. Just getting started to work on the pages themselves. Remember that the Round two action pages are going bye-bye now!


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## reapersaurus (Jul 18, 2003)

Number47 said:
			
		

> *It is simply inconceivable!*



I do not think this word means what you think it means. (1)







> That was accomplished admirably by DMwaV.



You can say that again.







> I do believe that Xiao Fung's +16 to initiative is the top amount possible in this game of death, but I suppose I might be wrong.



Ya, that's pretty darn high.
So did you take Way of the Scorpion, too?
It's the only way I can think of getting that high of init.
Well, actually Master could have had +17 if I'd bothered with _Foreaction_ and kept a magic item...
and the funny thing is, I really didn't build him for Init - it was just a fringe benefit, really. I was surprised when he was acting first to begin with.
He's a fast little gnome (in following with my references, "He's a nimble little minx, ain't he?") (2).
Well, if you called him a gnome now, he'd ooze on your shoe as much as look at ya'.  

In following seasong's very creative use of footnotes in his posts while slumming at NL, I'll continue the tradition:
(1) this is from Princess Bride
(2) Ghostbusters here, Ray. The obligatory response if that happened would be, "He slimed me."

And yes, Sollir - that was Jimmy Hendrix earlier - but I also threw in a Steve Miller reference with the Toke-ing. 

edit: how did Mang cast a Wall of Force on init 19, after the other 2 cast spells? Would he have Delayed for a later init (7 or later), it's just that you listed it that way?


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## Number47 (Jul 18, 2003)

If you look at init 19, it says Mang delay to init 6. The second init 19 is a typo, I think.

Maps are up.


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## Sollir Furryfoot (Jul 18, 2003)

Fun round, it seems Rillos isn't that threatening compared to alot of these contendors we have here.  Maybe I should've gotten myself a cohort 

My compliments to Master and Blaster for being a very entertaining tag team, and #47's Xiao team for being tactically perfect as usual.


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## seasong (Jul 18, 2003)

Init 6/19: Yeah, typo. I'll fix it when I get a chance at work.

Point totals: I'm doing the round stuff first, then worrying about points, since the points can be done later. Once I've got everyone's custom e-mails out, I'll worry about points.

Or, more realistically, I'll be worrying about corrections for round three .

Sleep: Yes, a bit after 8pm. I've had a very long week with little sleep, and a game Friday nights that usually goes to midnight, and I'm going out of town over the weekend... so if I didn't sleep Thursday night, I wasn't gonna sleep period .


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## Saepiroth (Jul 18, 2003)

Number47 said:
			
		

> * I didn't like Cholestus starting just five feet from me, though! Even that would have been nothing if I had only gotten better initiative. *



 Yup. With all my eggs in one basket, so to speak, a blast from one of those Prismatics would have left me pretty much sodomized. 

Also, in a bit of incedental humor, I only picked "Fort Hill" because of it's altitude advantage, and not for any tactical reason... though I did expect I'd be standing on someone's head. I actually planned to start 15 feet in the air but, because I'm a moron, I screwed up when I sent Seasong my prep round and ended up leering at Xiao Fung from ground level.


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## cool hand luke (Jul 18, 2003)

I noticed one small error, sent you an email seasong.


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## seasong (Jul 18, 2003)

That will be fixed in your personalized results; everyone else will see it the same way it is written. But thanks for your honesty!


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## clockworkjoe (Jul 18, 2003)

you can dismiss an anti magic shell? I didn't know that. Where is that in the rules? I thought it was one of those things you had to just wait out.


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## clockworkjoe (Jul 18, 2003)

you can dismiss an anti magic shell? I didn't know that. Where is that in the rules? I thought it was one of those things you had to just wait out.


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## clockworkjoe (Jul 18, 2003)

you can dismiss an anti magic shell? I didn't know that. Where is that in the rules? I thought it was one of those things you had to just wait out.


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## seasong (Jul 18, 2003)

Antimagic Shell Duration: 10 minutes/level (D)

That (D) on the end is referenced in the spell duration section of the PHB, and essentially means, "dismissable at will".

Most _spell casters_ are unaware that some of their spells are dismissable, so it's no surprise you weren't aware of this . For me, it makes a huge difference in some spells that I would otherwise be unwilling to use, like _wall of force_ (which is also dismissable).


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## Number47 (Jul 18, 2003)

I wish I could dismiss that dang Hagbard a little easier.


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## Jeremy (Jul 18, 2003)

Yup.  The sorcerer in my party makes extensive use of wall of force to divide the battle field as he sees fit knowing he can bring them down at a moments notice.  Unfortunately the cleric lacks that ability with Blade Barriers so often there is much waiting involved.


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## Number47 (Jul 18, 2003)

No damage listed for the arrow striking Unth Dirn?


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## seasong (Jul 18, 2003)

Damage corrections: the fireballs thrown by Xiao Lung before his untimely death did 18/9 dmg (not 26/13) for the first one, and 24 dmg (not 16) for the second one.

Damage clarification: the arrow from the east did 16 damage to Unth Dirn.


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## seasong (Jul 18, 2003)

If you sent me an e-mail in the past day or two (PRIOR to the round 3 results), please send again to my "seasong at texas dot net" address. Round 3 questions have very likely drowned them out.

The following two people, in particular, sent me something that I can't find now: reapersaurus and Sollir.


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## Jeremy (Jul 18, 2003)

I see you on yahoo but you don't seem to be getting my messages.


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## seasong (Jul 18, 2003)

I think I was on Yahoo by accident when I rebooted earlier today. Wasn't watching.

At any rate, I have to go to my Friday night game now, so I can't take the time to answer 'em .

If you'll be around Saturday morning, drop a message here and I'll try to be on around the same time.


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## DM with a vengence (Jul 19, 2003)

Number47 said:
			
		

> *I wish I could dismiss that dang Hagbard a little easier. *




Your taking a lot of killing too.

And you've hurt me more than I've hurt you.


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## Number47 (Jul 20, 2003)

You know, I was thinking that maybe DMwaV shouldn't bother with his turn. It's just asking for disappointment. He'll never live to get it, after all.


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## reapersaurus (Jul 20, 2003)

^^^  
I was thinking that the North should just sit down at one big table and have a splendid tea party - why fight, when you can have scones and crumpets?

Those come with a Robe of Useful Items, right?
It couldn't be but a standard action to set it up - just dress the animals as your favorite diety, and have a raging tea-kegger.

Is there a deadline tonight for Round 4 actions?


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## Saepiroth (Jul 21, 2003)

Alas, 47's little present shall occupy me well into the next round. I just hope this kickin' kegger that's going on downstairs is still in full swing when I get back into action.


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## Number47 (Jul 21, 2003)

As a flyer, you are going to have a tough time getting back here.


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## Sollir Furryfoot (Jul 21, 2003)

I *think*, I'm past the deadline for my action, although i'm hoping that doesn't count since I emailed you the action a few days prior-though you couldn't access it (I was gone afterwards til now)

Will be sending that action soon, anyways

Edit-Action sent, btw, just curious, what type of action is it to turn on or off a Cube oF Force?


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## Number47 (Jul 21, 2003)

According to the book, it is a standard action to press any of the Cube of Force's faces, including the deactivate. Yeah, I know what you're thinking and I thought the same thing, too. I do think he could have done it all, but it involves a couple things we aren't necessarily going to be told. I'm just hoping the entire charge cost gets paid each time in order to overcome all the downsides.


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## Jeremy (Jul 21, 2003)

From the SRD:

"The character presses one face of the cube to activate or deactivate the field"

"USING ITEMS
To use a magic item, it must be activated. Some items, once donned, function constantly. In most cases, using an item requires an activate magic item action that does not provoke attacks of opportunity. By contrast, spell completion items are treated like spells in combat and do provoke attacks of opportunity.
Activating a magic item is a standard action unless the item indicates otherwise. "

"Use Activated
This type of item simply has to be used in order to activate it. Use activation is generally straightforward and self-explanatory."

"Activating a use-activated magic item is either a standard action or not even an action and does not provoke attacks of opportunity, unless the use involves committing an action that provokes an attack of opportunity in itself."

Looks like a standard action, though it wouldn't be the first time I was wrong.  He could be using extra partial actions on it.


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## seasong (Jul 21, 2003)

Computer Note: Damn. And damn. I swapped out hard drives over the weekend, to take advantage of a 60 GB sale. After I got all of my files onto the new hard drive, the old one sort of died.

Anyway, I have an operating system and all of the raw data on the new hard drive, but I don't have any software to open the data up with yet. So... nothing's lost, but nothing gotten done, and I don't have Internet access at home right this second.

Which makes round 4 a bit hard to do.

Anyway, I'm going to install some stuff tonight and tomorrow night, and crunch what I can at work, but short version is that this round may take a bit longer.

A few comments on other stuff:

1) Cube of Force. I plan to explain this one soon*, but I have to get my computer up and running first, so I can cut-n-paste the details. In the meantime, please hold off on rampant speculation . It's reasonably simple, and I may have been wrong, but overall I'm not too worried about it in terms of balance - y'all remember my test munchkins? Not a one of them had a problem smacking Master despite the cube of force.

* I'll only be explaining the rules I'm applying, not the specific list of Master's actions or any such thing. And I would prefer that y'all not bring reapersaurus into this - it is ENTIRELY my decision, my rulings, etc., that is involved here. Neither his character build nor his tactics are under scrutiny, kay?

2) Some of you were rushed for getting your turn in, and now I can't even process the turn because of my computer. Erg. Anyway, if you want to add anything or modify your move slightly, and you can get it in by sometime tonight (I should at least be functional by tomorrow), I'll accept moves up til then.


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## Saepiroth (Jul 21, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> *And I would prefer that y'all not bring reapersaurus into this - it is ENTIRELY my decision, my rulings, etc., that is involved here. Neither his character build nor his tactics are under scrutiny, kay? *



 Actually, as far as I see Reaper has been nothing but  in this game. 

Let's not rules lawyer it, guys. It's a lot more fun when we talk about what's happening rather than all the minuitia of HOW it's happening. Besides, I'm pretty certain that Seasong can balance the game just right.


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## seasong (Jul 21, 2003)

Actually, as far as balance goes, the _hardest_ part about running this game has been keeping my mouth shut about strategies that people are using, or could use. There is some pretty clever stuff that y'all are doing (or that I've thought of), that I wish could be shared.

Oh well. Hurry up and kill each other, so I can talk about everyone's cool characters .

_(heard from the arena below, "Well, I'm *trying*, but the others aren't cooperating with me!")_


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## Number47 (Jul 21, 2003)

Don't forget that, before you process this turn you have to answer the question of whether the Hand gets an AoO from last turn.


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## reapersaurus (Jul 22, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> *Actually, as far as balance goes, the hardest part about running this game has been keeping my mouth shut about strategies that people are using, or could use. There is some pretty clever stuff that y'all are doing (or that I've thought of), that I wish could be shared.
> 
> Oh well. Hurry up and kill each other, so I can talk about everyone's cool characters *



You could make a kind of "DM's Journal" that lists your thoughts and ideas as you go thru the actions, sharing your impressions of our characters and our actions, and what we may have been able to do better, etc.
It'd be a lot easier to write them down as they happen, than try to remember what you thought once it's all done.

This kind of account I would be VERY interested in reading about after the Game is in the books.


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## seasong (Jul 22, 2003)

Number47: It does not get an AoO.

reapersaurus: Not a bad idea.


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## Saepiroth (Jul 22, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> *This kind of account I would be VERY interested in reading about after the Game is in the books. *



 So would I. I'd really like to see his impression of some of the tricks people came up with.


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## Number47 (Jul 23, 2003)

Any teasers yet?


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## seasong (Jul 23, 2003)

Woo hoo! New hard drive! New power supply! Newly cleaned processor fan! And about half an hour of carefully cleaning and re-seating the circuit boards!

Okay, so I can give ONE teaser based on the preliminary run through the round...

The fight between Hagbard and Xiao Fung? Ugly.

It's almost 10pm now (I just finished the circuit boards and installing the new power supply), so I'll be doing the real game crunching tomorrow (and, if history is any indication, the day after that ). Is tomorrow only Wednesday? Hot diggety.

I'm still working on points - that's slow going, because I'm re-doing rounds 1 and 2 as well, so I'm focusing on RUNNING the game first, and SCORING the game second.


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## DM with a vengence (Jul 23, 2003)

Good ugly, bad ugly, ugly ugly, fugly ugly, or just fugly?

Concerned minds want to know.


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## seasong (Jul 23, 2003)

Ugly.


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## Number47 (Jul 23, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> *Ugly. *




I'll interpret that to mean that seasong doesn't actually know how ugly yet. We all know it's ugly. It's been ugly between us. But don't worry, I'm trying to put the ugliness to rest.


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## reapersaurus (Jul 23, 2003)

OTOH, Master/Blaster's actions were a beautifully harmonious sight to behold, no?  
Because if they don't look good, _I_ don't look good.


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## Number47 (Jul 23, 2003)

While I believe that all my moves have been very sound tactically, the beauty of _The Plan_ has been utterly destroyed.

By the way, the thread still says that it's round 2?

Geez, I hope that DMwaV doesn't get his turn. No offense, you seem like a nice guy, but I really need you dead.


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## Jeremy (Jul 24, 2003)

Any teasers today?


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## reapersaurus (Jul 24, 2003)

Number47 said:
			
		

> *Geez, I hope that DMwaV doesn't get his turn. No offense, you seem like a nice guy, but I really need you dead. *



An interesting comparison would be:

Which team has lost the most resources in this fracas?

How many % of team resources have been expended in the fatal fight?


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## Number47 (Jul 24, 2003)

I guess that might also depend on how you define it. If you lose half the creatures you summoned, does that only count as half a spell expended? Does a defensive spell with duration count as an expenditure at all? When you say team resources, I suppose that means that losing Xiao Hu before his first action is a total loss of those resources. A real shame, he was going to be an expert at dispelling.


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## reapersaurus (Jul 24, 2003)

how did xiao fu die, again?
which one was your cohort?
Hasn't DMWaV lost 2 cohorts PLUS a ton of animals?


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## Jeremy (Jul 24, 2003)

One to flamestrike and one to disintegrate.  Dangerous area your crew is moving into.


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## Number47 (Jul 24, 2003)

Xiao Hu died in the first round from a combined assault by Cholestus and a spell from Thoramus, Hagbard's cohort.

Xiao Lung died just this past round, disintegrated by Hagbard.

I have killed both of Hagbard's cohorts, and most of the animals.


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## Saepiroth (Jul 24, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> *how did xiao fu die, again? *



 I smashed the living crap out of him and DMWaV got off a Flame Strike on all four of us, finishing him off with a killthief.


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## Number47 (Jul 24, 2003)

By the way, there is no Xiao Fu.

Xiao Fung = bad-ass who's still alive
Xiao Lung = recently disintegrated
Xiao Hu = dead before acting
Fu Lung = flying rodent

I picked a couple words from actual chinese to make these names. Lung is dragon, Hu is tiger, Fu is bat.


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## reapersaurus (Jul 25, 2003)

Blaster Fu is gonna fu you up the Lung.  

Watch out behind you, whoever survives your sortie.


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## Jeremy (Jul 25, 2003)

Any word on what happened this round?  Any small teasers?  Any guess at when we'll be able to read the full account?


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## seasong (Jul 25, 2003)

Probably Sat morning. I'm a bit swamped right this second, and I've got a game this evening.

As for teasers... hm. Naw... I'll just focus on getting it out tomorrow morning . This round is more of a middle round, anyway - some twinkness, but the real fun starts when the _dust of invisibility_ goes away NEXT round.

-seasong


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## cool hand luke (Jul 25, 2003)

ah there will be hell to pay when that chicken@#$ dust goes away!


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## Jeremy (Jul 27, 2003)

Update?   Pretty please?


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## reapersaurus (Jul 27, 2003)

I gotta admit - at least 3 times today, I brought up the site, with an expectant hope that I'd soon be wallowing in Gladitorial Games' hyper-active combat round action.

Lo, I was repeatedly disappointed.  

Hey! Why don't we make up what happened?
We could just state what our characters did, without need for mundane things like ROLLS (without rules would be fun, too).  

Like:
Master Polymorphs into a ginat block of lead shaped into a 10-ton weight, smashing thru the Wall of Force (there's gotta be SOMEthing that'd break thru one of those...) squishing duder's trio.

Blaster does a Move-By Charge Grapple, grabbing a few animals and dragging them haplessly along and into Hagbard in a loving Hug O' Death.


----------



## Saepiroth (Jul 27, 2003)

Cholestus drops out of the sky screaming "JIHAD!" and smashes two bottles of acid on Blaster's forehead, dissolving his face.


----------



## Jeremy (Jul 27, 2003)

Osirdar, being mostly in the spirit realm, lifts a glass to the Xiao's that have joined him.


----------



## Number47 (Jul 28, 2003)

Xiao Fung blasts Hagbard with a spell, shouting, "I hit you!"

Hagbard responds, "No you didn't!"

"Yes I did!"

"Did not!"

"Did too!"


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## DM with a vengence (Jul 28, 2003)

"Did not!"

"Did too!"

"Did not!"

"Did too!"

"Did not!"

"Did too!"

"Did too!"

"Did not!"

"Okay, so we're in agreement that you did not hit Hagbard with a spell."  



As for who's lost the most, I'd say that I've lost the most, considering that I've lost 
A) My cohorts and all their spells
B) My animals and all their attack
C) All the actions and spells I put in to my Cohorts and Animals

Of course by this point, I think that one of us is going to be dead this round or round after, so it's pretty intense.


----------



## Number47 (Jul 29, 2003)

Well, I've lost two cohorts and everything I invested in them. Your animals only count as character features, magic items or spells, depending. Overall, I think you have probably lost a little more, mostly depending on how much resources you have expended (unrecoverable) in magic items and spells so far.


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## Jeremy (Jul 29, 2003)

Usasmir uses his incredible speed to track down Hethas and the other deities and unfreeze time so the carnage can continue....


----------



## Number47 (Jul 29, 2003)

You know, seasong said he would update Saturday. Silly me, I didn't realize he never said _which_ Saturday.


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## reapersaurus (Jul 29, 2003)

47 - you play bards, with use magic device skill, right?

Too bad you couldn't cast 9th level spells in this Game, to get a _Time Un-Stop_ cast.

Jeremy - I'm thinking of Superman flying around the planet to get it moving again.
Is Usasmir THAT fast?


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## Jeremy (Jul 29, 2003)

Damn.  Nope.


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## Number47 (Jul 29, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> *47 - you play bards, with use magic device skill, right?*




I am the well-known defender of the bard as a munchkin, yes. In this game, unfortunately not.


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## Number47 (Jul 30, 2003)

Well, I certainly hope nothing bad has happened to seasong. Has anyone communicated with him?


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## reapersaurus (Jul 30, 2003)

no, i haven't communicated with him.
but i wouldn't send an email to his work address, since i figure i'm sure he knows about the Game (and I presume our interest in an update).

Which makes me wonder : 
I can completely understand not getting time to do a significant update, but I've never understood not letting us know what's happened.
It just takes (literally) one minute, and it lets us all know that nothing catastrophic has happened to him (or, by extension, to the Game we are thoroughly enjoying).


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## J. Anson (Jul 30, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> *no, i haven't communicated with him.
> 
> but I've never understood not letting us know what's happened.*




I've communicated with him today, so he's probably alive.

And maybe it runs in the family, I'm pretty bad at updating people on what's going on with me, too...


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## seasong (Jul 30, 2003)

Alive. Just tightly leashed at work, and too tired when I get home .

The round is actually finished, I just have to write up the visible portion for an update. If I don't have that tonight, I may just run through and delete invisible stuff and post the driest round evar.

Probably won't post anything more today.

Thanks for the prodding.


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## cool hand luke (Jul 31, 2003)

prod.....


prod prod....



prod prod prod.....


Does my cattle prod need new batteries?


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## Jeremy (Jul 31, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> *The round is actually finished, I just have to write up the visible portion for an update. If I don't have that tonight, I may just run through and delete invisible stuff and post the driest round evar.*




Dry bones, half a round, gimme something...


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## reapersaurus (Aug 1, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> *Thanks for the prodding. *



Thanks for the update.


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## seasong (Aug 1, 2003)

I've been given a long lunch this afternoon in recognition of my hard work, so sometime this afternoon I will try to put up at least part of the round .

I may have to post it here, as the blog page sometimes takes a while to load.

-seasong


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## seasong (Aug 1, 2003)

Just realized that I never answered the How Ugly question .

It took a lot of killing, but one of the two up north is dead.


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## seasong (Aug 1, 2003)

My long lunch just went in the crapper. Dammit.

I'm running a game this evening, I'll see if I'm up to going without sleep late tonight. I'm dying to post this stuff so the beatings can commence!

-seasong


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## reapersaurus (Aug 2, 2003)

How many games do you run IRL, seasong?

It seems like your work as insane as it has been, and your game on Friday nights, and don't you have at least one game all one weekend day? - that it's been very hard to find any time for the GoD recently.  

I'd hope that it wasn't a choice between your sleepless night and an update for our Game.


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## seasong (Aug 2, 2003)

I _play_ in a game on Monday nights. That takes up 3-4 hours of my week as stress relief - if I wasn't doing that, I'd be doing video games instead .

The past week hasn't been due to gaming, however - it's been due to sleep and general tiredness. I haven't BEEN gaming, I even skipped the Monday game that I play in so I could sleep last week.

Anyway, speaking of which, I can't stay up tonight, either. I just don't have the energy right now. So here's a starter. Each time I delay, I'll try to include another, since _individually_ they don't take up much time at all .

36 - Xiao Fung (Number47)

Xiao Fung casts a spell, and Hagbard is suddenly revealed at (15,11)! Xiao Fung then waves his wand and drops an _ice storm_ for 24 dmg (this also hits Polar Bear 2). The bear dies, but Hagbard yet lives!

His face purpling, Xiao Fung casts again, and lightning arcs into Hagbard for 57 dmg. Hagbard, his face blackening under the coruscating energy, falls.

From the other side of the wall, Mrs Stampy bellows with rage, and prepares to attack.


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## Jeremy (Aug 2, 2003)

Quick and dirty.  Pounded in a thunderous crash, then fried to a crisp when still standing, bloodied and bruised.

Now we wonder if 'falls' is 'dead', or 'knocked down' and we still wonder which one of the two spell hurlers bit the dust.  

Though it doesn't look good for Hagbard's shot at living through it.


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## DM with a vengence (Aug 2, 2003)

I have a bad feeling about this.


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## Jeremy (Aug 2, 2003)

MORE!!


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## cool hand luke (Aug 3, 2003)

please?


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## seasong (Aug 4, 2003)

Note: My home computer is having more problems. I'll be doing a few more of these this afternoon, when I anticipate having some more time.

29 - Osirdar (Jeremy)

Position unknown.

However, Duder seems to have some idea, because the dwarf starts looking around wildly, his face paling somewhat.

28 - Hagbard the Chartreuse (DM with a Vengence)

Hagbard has a new strategy. He lays prone. Hopefully Mrs Stampy will avenge him.

23 - Master (reapersaurus)

Master casts a spell, and the ioun stone orbitting Blaster's head glows momentarily. He and Mr Wonder (his bat) then act in concert. The bat pulls and activates a _feather token (fan)_ to counter the wind (down to 15 mph), while Master drops the force cube and flies into the air (8,69, +10 ft).

Master drinks a potion, and Mr Wonder draws from a back at Master's side, tossing a small, tan ball towards the ground. The wind grabs it and carries it about 20 ft south to (8,73), where it grows into a tan-furred lion and the wind ceases to matter to it. (8,72)-(8,73).

Master reactivates his force cube*, and the wind ceases to matter at all to any of them.

* I promised an explanation. I'm typing that up now.


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## seasong (Aug 4, 2003)

Cube of Force:

Okay, a few things about this item. It has 36 charges, and it has variable settings which cost different amounts of charges _per minute_.

Reading the text, it is not clear whether or not switching from a higher level type to a lower level type should cost charges, and if so, there is no indication of how many charges it should cost. Nor is there anything explicit about switching back.

For that matter, with a 1 minute duration, and an explicit methodology for deactivating/reactivating, it's not clear whether or not even _that_ should cost charges.

Neither is there any text which indicates what kind of action it should take to activate the cube of force, other than the _initial_ activation of the field - otherwise, it's just putting your thumb on one side of the cube.

If I had read more deeply, I would have come up with THIS ruling: "Deactivating/reactivating costs 0 charges until the minute duration is up; changing levels costs the difference in charges, unless the difference is negative; it takes a free action to deactivate, and a standard action to reactivate."

What I ruled instead, and somewhat erroneously, is as follows: "Reactivating costs 1 charge (the minimum difference between the different levels) until the minute duration is up; changing levels costs the difference in charges, unless the difference is negative; it takes a standard action to activate initially, and a free action to deactivate/reactivate, but the cube can only be reactivated once per turn, and ONLY during the owner's turn."

The free action part didn't bother me too much, because I've been limiting folks to 3 free actions except in special "that would be cool to say" instances. And overall, I think both versions are reasonably well balanced to each other.

As it stands, Master can turn it on and off every round without cutting into his normal actions, BUT he can't do it _forever_ - at the maximum setting (6 charges per 10 rnds), he has a maximum of 20 rounds that he can pull it off, minus whatever spells are cast at the cube.

Note: There are at least three ways around the cube. One of them is accessible to _every character in the arena_; another is accessible to roughly 50% of the characters in the arena; and the last one is accessible to only a few characters in the arena. And only the last one is very difficult at all. From a pure balance perspective, the cube is a minor annoyance at best.


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## Number47 (Aug 4, 2003)

I'm cool with it. I am very appreciative to know the rulings, however. It will become even more important when the cube belongs to me.

EDIT: I think you skipped something. At the very least, an effect that is on Xiao Lung's turn.

EDIT 2: On Xiao Fung's turn, he also disappears into the smoke, correct?

EDIT 3: I think the lion is in the blade barrier, according to your coordinates.


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## seasong (Aug 4, 2003)

Number47 said:
			
		

> I'm cool with it. I am very appreciative to know the rulings, however. It will become even more important when the cube belongs to me.



No prob .



> EDIT: I think you skipped something. At the very least, an effect that is on Xiao Lung's turn.



Er, Xiao Fung, you mean?



> EDIT 2: On Xiao Fung's turn, he also disappears into the smoke, correct?



Correct. I have that there, and must have editted it out "because he wasn't visible" or some stupid thing.

Xiao Fung is not visible by the end of his turn, although _where ever_ he might be in the cloud of smoke, he will probably be revealed by the end of the turn due to the wind.



> EDIT 3: I think the lion is in the blade barrier, according to your coordinates.



This will become a factor on the lion's turn.

As a side note: the tan ball failed its Fort save against the wind; it actually rolled worse than 20 ft knockback, but the _bag of tricks_ has a distance limit of 20 ft before the ball activates, so it turned into a lion at that point automatically.


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## Number47 (Aug 4, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> *
> Er, Xiao Fung, you mean?*




No, Xiao Lung. The Hand.


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## Saepiroth (Aug 4, 2003)

Number47 said:
			
		

> *
> 
> No, Xiao Lung. The Hand. *



 You NAMED your grasping hand? The same name as your dead cohort?


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## Number47 (Aug 4, 2003)

Better to name my hand than something else.


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## seasong (Aug 4, 2003)

*Hand:* Oops?

I don't have my books in front of me, but could someone near one check something in two sections of the PHB for me? If not, I'll have to check this evening.

1) In the Death & Dying section (in Combat), look for anything about spells ending upon death, particularly spells with a duration ending in "(D)".

2) In the magic overview, under Durations, look for the same.

I think I accidentally let a house rule enter the GoD this round, that ended certain spell durations when the characted died. If I did, I will correct it back - this is not a major change (Cholestus may get shoved a bit, and Mrs Stampy will have lost her attack), but I need to fix it if I did.

Good eye, Number47.


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## Saepiroth (Aug 4, 2003)

Combat death; no mention of spells at all in the entire section, except as an example (lightning bolt parbroiling someone).

Durations ( Specifically D); No explicit mentions of death in the entire section, not even in Concentration. Also, it's described as an active choice to Dismiss a spell, so a (D) spell shouldn't end on death.

...

Whoa, that's a bit of a shocker for me. I never noticed that spells DIDN'T end on death. That's just as embarassing as my mixup on item creation a few weeks ago.


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## seasong (Aug 4, 2003)

Saepiroth said:
			
		

> Dismissable (D); No explicit mentions of death in the entire section, not even in Concentration. Also, it's described as an active choice to Dismiss a spell, so a (D) spell shouldn't end on death.



That's the one I needed to know for sure. I apparently have this as a house rule I didn't know about. Okay, so it's fixed. I'll put up Xiao Lung's "turn" next .

(And now, from _beyond the grave_, Lung does his best to continue protecting the remainder member(s) of the Xiao family)



> Whoa, that's a bit of a shocker for me. I never noticed that spells DIDN'T end on death. That's just as embarassing as my mixup on item creation a few weeks ago.



You're embarrassed? I'm sitting on it .


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## Number47 (Aug 4, 2003)

Well, good to find out on such a minor quibble. After all, the hand is unlikely to do more than annoy, especially since it cannot receive any new instructions. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if it didn't suvive the AoO, anyway.


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## seasong (Aug 4, 2003)

Correction to prior post: During Init 35, a _bigby's grasping hand_ rocketed skyward at Cholestus and attempted to shove him higher. Cholestus whacked it with his vicious, nasty chain, but did not manage to destroy it, and it shoved him a good 10 ft upward.

And now, back to the slave mines with me.


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## reapersaurus (Aug 4, 2003)

oh, man - I should have spent some thought recognizing which direction the wind was blowing!  

Oh, well -
what _I'm_ waiting with baited breath to see is the bottom half of Init 23's actions....


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## Number47 (Aug 4, 2003)

Me, too! I will be very cross if it isn't bloody!

Of course, Monday is seasong's other D&D game, so I don't think we'll see it until at least tomorrow.


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## reapersaurus (Aug 5, 2003)

Number47 said:
			
		

> *Me, too! I will be very cross if it isn't bloody! *



'Course, you DID take down one of Blaster's targets up North....


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## Number47 (Aug 5, 2003)

Well, if he was just unconscious, you might still kill-thief him. That is, depending on whatever your action was supposed to be.


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## Saepiroth (Aug 5, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> *'Course, you DID take down one of Blaster's targets up North....    *



 Wait, are we about to party?


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## reapersaurus (Aug 5, 2003)

Saepiroth said:
			
		

> * Wait, are we about to party? *



could be, pardnah...  could be.


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## Saepiroth (Aug 5, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> *could be, pardnah...  could be. *



 I only hope I last long enough to make a heroic last stand and melt your face off.


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## reapersaurus (Aug 5, 2003)

ah, the old acid-bottles-in-the-face Holy War maneuver...

as long as you spent a feat on it, I guess it's OK.
What 3rd party book is that from, anyway?


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## Jeremy (Aug 5, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> *23 - Master (reapersaurus)
> 
> Master casts a spell, and the ioun stone orbitting Blaster's head glows momentarily. He and Mr Wonder (his bat) then act in concert. The bat pulls and activates a feather token (fan) to counter the wind (down to 15 mph), while Master drops the force cube and flies into the air (8,69, +10 ft).
> 
> ...




more....


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## Saepiroth (Aug 6, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> *ah, the old acid-bottles-in-the-face Holy War maneuver...
> 
> as long as you spent a feat on it, I guess it's OK.
> What 3rd party book is that from, anyway?    *



 I plead the fifth, until I run out of them. 


Actually, "Acid" is almost exactly the wrong word... :ninja:


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## seasong (Aug 6, 2003)

My home computer is still down, so no more tonight (I'm posting this from la cafe ). But I'll have 2-3 Inits up tomorrow at work.

More if my boss is away .


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## reapersaurus (Aug 6, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> *More if my boss is away . *



While the boss is away, the Game of Death can play...


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## seasong (Aug 6, 2003)

Sorry for the delay. Here's some Inits .

Init 23 - Blaster (reapersaurus)

Blaster roars and charges south to (9,80). The ioun stone orbitting his head disappears somewhere as the wind catches it, but he doesn't seem to care at the moment.

His eyes are on Mortem.

As with Marius, Mortem's magic seems to go away for a moment, but this time, the effect is far deadlier. Blaster leaps and pounces, and drags claws and teeth through Mortem's body. Although almost as large as the roman gladiator of old, his body is not quite as sturdy, and Blaster happily rips limbs from his body before finishing with a killing blow that snaps Mortem's neck and very nearly decapitates him.

At 203 points of damage, there was no real question of survival.

Init 22 - Izad (JDragon)

In rapid succession, Izad sucks down two potions and jogs south to (17,87). As he drinks the second potion, his outline wavers and distorts, making him difficult to see precisely.

Init 22 - Cholestus the Shredder (Saepiroth)

Drops almost straight down to the ground at (25,21), where he gets a close shave with the _prismatic wall_. The Bigby hand following him ceases to exist.

_Note: noticed an error in this as I was typing this, durnit. Original result: Cholestus finished his movement by flying over the wall at Xiao Fung, but the problem is, he can't SEE Xiao Fung, and isn't sure where he is. So Cholestus stays where he is on the far side of the wall for now._

Init 21 - Tairnandon (Jeremy)

Position unknown.


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## Number47 (Aug 6, 2003)

You didn't say, but I assume that Cholestus made his save versus the wind? As a flyer, he has to save as a small creature. Of course, it is a pretty easy Fort save, anyway.

Is there any smoke created/destroyed so far?

What is the rule with AMF and an in-place blade barrier? I don't quite remember the wording, and don't have my 3.0 books anymore.


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## seasong (Aug 6, 2003)

Number47 said:
			
		

> *You didn't say, but I assume that Cholestus made his save versus the wind? As a flyer, he has to save as a small creature. Of course, it is a pretty easy Fort save, anyway.*



*He is not suffering from the wind.

Yet .




			Is there any smoke created/destroyed so far?
		
Click to expand...


Yes. Not enough to worry about, though. Did I send you that e-mail with it's Init movement rate due to wind?




			What is the rule with AMF and an in-place blade barrier? I don't quite remember the wording, and don't have my 3.0 books anymore.
		
Click to expand...


In 3.5, blade barrier is not affected, as it is technically a force effect. I can't wait to run THAT in a game .

In 3.0, however, spell resistance can allow you to ignore it. That means the blades themselves (and the damage they do) is magical, and like conjured creatures, wink out while within the scope of the anti-magic field.

So yes, Blaster and Mortem are reasonably safe as long as Blaster is AMFed.*


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## Number47 (Aug 6, 2003)

and Mortem? I think Mortem is reasonably safe from all things now.

Actually, I don't think all force effects ignore AMF. I think only wall of force and prismatic wall are specifically mentioned.


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## reapersaurus (Aug 6, 2003)

cool hand luke:
http://www.wavsource.com/movie_stars/murphy/ahh_ha.wav


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## Saepiroth (Aug 7, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> *cool hand luke:
> http://www.wavsource.com/movie_stars/murphy/ahh_ha.wav *



 Don't be cruel, you're better at this than most people.


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## cool hand luke (Aug 7, 2003)

wow reaper, impressive, you are better than I can even fathom.  I sat up half the night wondering how someone can move 115 feat, and get enough attacks off to do 200+ points of damage, all aparently while in an anti-magic field, I can't wait to see his build up, I'm DYING to pull something that moves that far, that fast, and still get's a massive attack on some of my players......

however, I did peg my Time of death quite nicely, round 4.


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## seasong (Aug 7, 2003)

No schoolyard antics, y'all.

Smack talking is fine, but winners are under more duress to be graceful than losers. And a file you have to download to be gloated at is a bit much .

Note: 115 ft in a _double move_ is very easy to achieve. The tiger's pounce ability is an established rule. There were no crazy rules here, just a minimum non-magical Move 60, a double move, and a tiger's charge attack.

Cool hand luke, you've still got characters so you are still in the fight. And if you must console yourself, remember that you are pretty much the entire reason Blaster tucked tail and ran back to Master before coming down to try and kill you again .

-seasong


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## Pielorinho (Aug 7, 2003)

As a bystander, I'm curious which version of "pounce" is being used.

This is still tons of fun to watch!
Daniel


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## cool hand luke (Aug 7, 2003)

sorry, didn't mean to offend, Like I said at the beginning, i'm horrid with rules.  Things like tiger's pounce are far beyond my knowledge level, just didn't know it was possible.


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## Jeremy (Aug 7, 2003)

The "if a tiger charges in the first round of combat" clause seems to be out the window.  

Of course, if it's 3.5 (which nothing else is) then he's got the much more tasty "Pounce (Ex): If a tiger charges a foe, it can make a full attack, including two rake attacks." version.


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## Saepiroth (Aug 7, 2003)

Well, great, now I have to be out of town for a few days. Don't set the round 5 limit too soon, please.


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## seasong (Aug 7, 2003)

cool hand luke said:
			
		

> sorry, didn't mean to offend, Like I said at the beginning, i'm horrid with rules.  Things like tiger's pounce are far beyond my knowledge level, just didn't know it was possible.



I'm not offended at all - that's why I spelled out an easy way that it would be possible.


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## reapersaurus (Aug 7, 2003)

whoa - sorry, anybody who didn't like the Eddie Murphy old man from Coming to America sound clip - that voice is always funny to me, and I thought the old man saying "Ah ha" like it's some big revelation that he was misdirecting anyone with his little joke, would be funny and appropriate here. Sorry for an obscure reference.

Now, another applicable reference here would be his follow-up line: http://www.wavsource.com/movie_stars/murphy/what_do_you_know.wav


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## Sollir Furryfoot (Aug 7, 2003)

Yep, I must agree that is *very* impressive.  Especially in an antimagic field.

Hrmmm...I'm curious to see how many other combatants can do the same, or is reaper the only one?

I guess we may never know 

[color=333333]Or will we?[/color]


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## reapersaurus (Aug 8, 2003)

Sollir Furryfoot said:
			
		

> *I guess we may never know *



I was wondering where you were hiding...  

I was surprised to not feel the influence of your spells in the Game so far, Sollir.


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## Number47 (Aug 8, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> *Init 22 - Izad (JDragon)
> 
> In rapid succession, Izad sucks down two potions and jogs south to (17,87). As he drinks the second potion, his outline wavers and distorts, making him difficult to see precisely.*




Shouldn't that be _jogs west_?


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## Sollir Furryfoot (Aug 8, 2003)

No spells here

And I'll i've done was do like 7 damage while everyone else has been so impressive.  I'm just ashamed that I forgot to buy two more broken items from the DMG that haven't been used so far.  I mean, I put them in my original writeup and then forgot all about them, ah well  

Edit-I missed that other GoD where it was going to be this huge battlefield with monsters and treasure and stuff.  My character concept for that was also an invisible person who would telekinesis cursed items into place so that they looked like valuable treasure or similar...


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## Number47 (Aug 8, 2003)

You want to talk about embarassing? One of my cohorts had a bow. I forgot to buy any arrows, however! Seasong informed that I would have to scavenge them if I needed some. Well, doesn't matter now, because he's dead, dead, dead.


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## Sollir Furryfoot (Aug 8, 2003)

Nah, I got something more embarassing.  I think it was round 2 when I shot at one of CHL's cohorts.  I had a single, main target in mind, and then 3 backup targets-and by the time my turn had come around-I was unable to shoot at any of them!  (*wonders if that gives any hint to who his targets were-oh well*)

Tut, tut, my character is just a tad bit too slow for my liking (even being around 20 init on the list)


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## duder (Aug 8, 2003)

im a dorf


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## seasong (Aug 8, 2003)

Number47: Yes. Ignore my trademarked direction sense. The coordinates are correct.

Init 21 - Usasmir (Jeremy)

Position unknown.

Init 20 - Rillos (Sollir Furryfoot)

Position unknown.

An arrow thunks into Unth from somewhere northeast... although with wind sheer, it may have been arced from somewhere to the east. It does 11 dmg.

A _wall of force_ springs up along the southern edge of these squares: (41,80)-(46,80). The wall is 30 ft high and 30 ft wide, and the bottom edge of the wall is at +85 ft high (the top edge is +115 ft high).

20 - Mrs Stampy (DM with a vengence)

Stays where she is, unable to force herself towards the area where Xiao Lung died.

Note: DM with a vengence, I would suggest attacking less well protected individuals with the elephant .


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## Sollir Furryfoot (Aug 8, 2003)

*pokes* seasong, those walls are invisible, although I wouldn't be surprised if everyone standing can see invis stuff


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## seasong (Aug 8, 2003)

Not with raindrops.

In fact, between wind and gradual rain, there won't be much left that *is* invisible.


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## Sollir Furryfoot (Aug 8, 2003)

Bleh, now you tell me   Figured I just had to worry about the wind *sighs*


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## Number47 (Aug 8, 2003)

Seasong, I am going on vacation for almost a week, leaving tomorrow afternoon. I will try to post some maps for what has been resolved up until now. I will send you my next turn before I leave.


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## Number47 (Aug 9, 2003)

Seasong, minor issue cropped up when I was making the maps. There is no way that Blaster could have charged directly at Mortem because Master's cube of force was directly in between. I think it is only a minor issue, though, because I suspect that Blaster could have easily jumped the cube and I don't believe there is any restiction of not being able to perform a jump while charging.

EDIT: of course, it could have cost him even more movement and left him short.

Maps are done. Just going to put them online now, but with no text. Too tired. I will mail off a turn in the morning.

EDIT: maps are posted. The later links are all broken because they are for future use. The linked maps only go up to, I think, 11.


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## reapersaurus (Aug 9, 2003)

Master is 10' in the air, specifically to get out of the way of Blaster.


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## Number47 (Aug 9, 2003)

Ah yes. Correct you are. That's what I get for only having 2-dimensional maps.


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## reapersaurus (Aug 9, 2003)

I think they're great maps.

Hope your vacation doesn't get in the way of your continued strategic play in Round 5.


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## Jeremy (Aug 12, 2003)

Update?


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## seasong (Aug 12, 2003)

Coming .

Boss over shoulder all day yesterday, but I've got a few minutes this morning.


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## seasong (Aug 12, 2003)

17 - Unth Dirn (Cool hand luke)

Roaring, Unth moves NW to (3,73), then sprints completely around the _blade barrier_ and SE to (23,84).

10 - Mortem Redgrave (Cool hand luke)

Mortem's left arm lays in the cool grass, considering the intellectual challenge of achieving its goals without a direct connection to the brain. A few feet over, its mirror twin considers the same thing. The brain awaits their response, as the lack of heart's blood is making it a bit difficult to think for itself.


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## reapersaurus (Aug 13, 2003)

When you get the chance, seasong, could you give us an update about your condition and schedule, and an ETA as to when you can finish up the last few inits and when we might be looking at a Round 5 deadline?

BTW I thought the Mortem post was humerous.
I appreciate the extra bit if effort, like with the animal's thoughts, that make the Game better.

However, I'm gettin' worried about whether this Game will finish...
How you doin'?


----------



## seasong (Aug 13, 2003)

I'm trying to have everything done by tonight - I've been doing the individual e-mails as I went, but holding them until everything was done.

I still won't get it out until tomorrow morning (so y'all give me a few pokes tomorrow morning - I do appreciate the thumps ), because my home computer system is still hosed.

My home computer should be fixed this weekend. I will probably push out the round 5 deadline until after that, since I would like to be able to do everything I need to at home, instead of having to do everything electronically (at home, I can have my books open, my map printouts spread out, etc. - much easier).

I'm sorry this round has sucked so bad .

-seasong


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## reapersaurus (Aug 13, 2003)

wow!
Quick response - that bodes well.

I've restrained myself from prodding or poking (though it's been very hard) - I figure you know about the Game ongoing, and the players intense interest in it continuing (I guess you could say "getting our fix").

It makes sense to do it in as comfortable of environment as possible, and that's unfortunate that your home computing location hasn't been available.

Her's to hoping that it's just a temporary condition, and I, for one, have no problem that one round's been pretty slow - as long as you're in it for the long haul, and things can get fixed up and easier for ya, I'm cool wit' it. 

edit: 
P.S. have you gotten my emails?
about next round, but especially about the lion's actions this round?


----------



## seasong (Aug 13, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> P.S. have you gotten my emails?
> about next round, but especially about the lion's actions this round?



Uhm, haven't seen anything about the lion. Did you get a bounce message or anything?

-seasong


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## reapersaurus (Aug 13, 2003)

No bounce messages on any emails yet.

I'll re-post it here:

"I'm wanting the lion to run (double-move) towards Izad."

That's IF it survives the Blades, of course.


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## seasong (Aug 14, 2003)

Will be later today (probably over lunch). Got pounced by boss for morning project. Feel like Mortem, now .

Reapersaurus - could you resend the e-mail I'm missing? I'll watch for it very carefully, and if I don't get it, I'll check with my provider and see what's up with that.


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## Jeremy (Aug 14, 2003)

*poking as instructed anyways*


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## Number47 (Aug 14, 2003)

Well, I'm back now. Seasong, I know that you are busy with Round 4 still, but if you take a look at the action I sent for Round 5 I will be around mostly to answer any questions.

Thanks again for running this game. Oh, and *prod*.


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## seasong (Aug 14, 2003)

8 - Duder (duder)

Delay to Init 7

7 - Omigawd (duder)

Omigawd casts something and touches Duder's shoulder. Duder looks relieved, but all three of the dwarven team are watching the air around them warily.

(note: "warily" = defensive casting)

7 - Duder (duder)

Warily (and somewhat shakily), Duder casts a spell and lifts into the air to the top of the little force dome (+10 ft). He watches all around himself, and looks ready for anything to pop out of anywhere.

The events of the round appear to have shaken him a bit.

6 - Mang (duder)

Mang, also glancing warily around, takes the time to wring his hands as he cowers in his patch of the dome.

3 - Mr Buffles (DM with a vengence)

DOUBLE MOVE: 80 ft to (11,27)-(15,28)

Mr Buffles seems intent on making a stand with Mrs. Stampy, to avenge the deaths of his friends.

3 - Mr Duffles (DM with a vengence)

FULL ROUND: Runs 160 ft to (37,52)-(38,55)

Throwing caution to the winds, Mr Duffles hauls ass for Mrs. Stampy. Vengeance awaits no bear, even an oversized one.

3 - Mr Huffles (DM with a vengence)

Mr Huffles manages to crack the skull of Polar Bear #6 and gives a howl of triumph. It can barely be heard over the wind at this point, but it sounds pretty pleased.

3 - Summoned Polar Bear 2 (DM with a vengence)

"I am not a number, I am a free man!"

"You are number six. I am number two."

_Incoherent yell_

"I am not a number, and you... YOU. ARE. DEAD."

_Who will be the new number two? Stay tuned next week!_

3 - Mr Stampy (DM with a vengence)

Sniff. Sniff. As Mr. Stampy charges at those he believes ruined the grass, he passes a _fiiine_ patch. His vengeance shall wait.

The lumbering elephant comes to a near instant halt and practically plows his face (tusks and all) into the turf.

Mmmmmmmmm MMM! That's some fine grass.


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## seasong (Aug 14, 2003)

(hee hee hee, just got my lunch and have the rest of the hour to myself)

Individual e-mails should be out this afternoon or evening, but feel free to send me your usual pre-emptive questions .

Also, I managed to cobble together a compuer fix late last night. I should be up and running this evening*. On the plus side, I entirely missed out on the virus/worm scare .

* I want to make sure I'm up and running before I start that, so... no deadline yet. It will be at least three days after I'm sure of the computer, which will be sometime this weekend, so the deadline won't be before Wednesday.

-seasong


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## seasong (Aug 15, 2003)

Did anyone get my e-mails last night? I copied myself but I don't see them, and I usually get a flood of questions, but I haven't seen _anything_, which has me a bit worried.

If y'all got my e-mails, and just held back the questions, that's cool, but if you didn't get an e-mail, or you sent me something last night, let me know here and e-mail my "temanp at hotmail dot com" account.

-seasong


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## Jeremy (Aug 15, 2003)

Didn't receive anything last night.


----------



## cool hand luke (Aug 15, 2003)

nada


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## reapersaurus (Aug 15, 2003)

didn't receive anything either.
I wonder how the 'NY' black-out might have impacted internet routers?


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## seasong (Aug 15, 2003)

Well.... crap.

I won't be home until midnight tonight (as in, I won't even SEE home until midnight). Y'all pester me tomorrow morning, and I'll cut-n-paste over to hotmail and resend.

-seasong


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## duder (Aug 15, 2003)

note: new email
omigawd@sbcglobal.net


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## Saepiroth (Aug 16, 2003)

And now I'm out of town again.


----------



## Jeremy (Aug 16, 2003)

*prod*  *prod*


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## Jeremy (Aug 17, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> *Y'all pester me tomorrow morning, and I'll cut-n-paste over to hotmail and resend.*




Copy, paste, send...


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## reapersaurus (Aug 18, 2003)

man, seasong - what kind of insane schedule do you keep on the weekend?


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## seasong (Aug 18, 2003)

I'm sending it all out now, from my 'temanp at hotmail dot com' account.

Yes, my computer bombed again this weekend. No, I'm not using it any more - I've got everything on CD (which I brought to work with me this morning), and a new computer at home which is, as of late Sunday night, up and running.

This has been a nightmare, and I apologize.

Anyway, like I said, I'm sending it all out _right this second_, so if you don't get your e-mail in the next... let's say half hour.. let me know here and I'll resend. I don't anticipate any such problem, but I've been known to fail to anticipate such problems .

I also have a side note, but my boss is walking over, so...


----------



## seasong (Aug 18, 2003)

Okay, side note:

Last Thursday, a friend at work directed me to this site. I wish I'd known about it before .

Anyway, I'm considering moving off Tripod because of the troubles it has given me, and moving to RPOL. This would provide the following major advantages:

1. Have the rules and round-by-round action all on the same site. The maps would still remain on mine and Number47's websites. We would still talk smack here or there, whichever y'all seem to prefer .
2. Have character sheets online, but still visible only to the player and to me. Character sheets can be editted on the fly, and multiple versions kept.
3. Players could make their own rolls (with "GM-eyes only" check box checked) for their planned actions. The dice roller is very nice, very flexible.
4. A private message on the RPOL system acts as a thread for the GM and player only. No e-mails required, and it archives just like the threads do. Action e-mails and private e-mails back would be replaced with PM-threads.

The major downside would be that I can't figure out how to access dice rolls that happened in the distant past. Currently, I have a record of every roll ever - I'd like to keep that record, and I'm not sure RPOL can do it (although I could probably cut and paste, but that looks like a high maintenance activity, so I'm disinclined to like it).

-seasong


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## Number47 (Aug 18, 2003)

No email for me, yet.


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## seasong (Aug 18, 2003)

Resending it to you _right now_. Let me know if you get it.

-seasong


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## seasong (Aug 18, 2003)

Also, the Bigby Hand isn't in the e-mail, but it didn't have any actual impact on gameplay - it rolled 1 better than last time, shoved Cholestus one more foot than last time, and then he flew down and destroyed it on the Wall.

Also, I assumed that the bat is hiding in your clothes at the moment. Let me know if otherwise.

-seasong


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## cool hand luke (Aug 18, 2003)

nothing yet.


----------



## Jeremy (Aug 18, 2003)

As far as I can tell I have received nothing at either address.


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## seasong (Aug 18, 2003)

Jeremy: I sent it to your comcast address. I can't remember if that was the right one. Anyway, I just resent it.

Cool hand luke: I just got bounce messages from you, reap, duder and DMwav. I'm trying all of you four again.

I also got a bounce message from Number47 after my second send, so I'm resending that one again. Number47, if you get three identical messages from me sometime today, sorry.

-seasong


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## seasong (Aug 18, 2003)

Gotta go to a team lunch, but I'll check back to see if anyone else needs resends this afternoon. Also, y'all let me know if you DO get it - at this point, better safe than sorry, eh?

Anyone have a chance to check out RPOL? Wanna give me an opinion?

-seasong


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## Jeremy (Aug 18, 2003)

I got it that time.

RPOL looked alright.  I know the big Arena matches for the Epic games are held there.  I don't know how it works and didn't have the time to check out the FAQs right there, but if it'll make the game run smoother for you I'll figure it out.

Otherwise, the current setup doesn't bother me at all.


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## Jeremy (Aug 18, 2003)

w00t!

Happy happy..    Gonna scare the bejeesus out of some more people this next round.


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## Number47 (Aug 18, 2003)

Got it, twice. I'll give you a reply by e-mail later. Do you still have my Round 5 action?


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## JDragon (Aug 18, 2003)

No email here.

JDragon


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## seasong (Aug 18, 2003)

I now have bounce messages from most of you, so I'm resending, unless I've already resent. If I've resent at least once, I'll wait until you say you don't have it, then resend a 3rd time.

-seasong


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## seasong (Aug 18, 2003)

Number47 said:
			
		

> Do you still have my Round 5 action?



Yup.


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## JDragon (Aug 18, 2003)

Got it. 

JDragon


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## seasong (Aug 18, 2003)

*A quick note on... WIND*

This is the first major environment shift; the next one is 1d4+2 rounds away (3-6 rounds). The wind will _probably_ drop back down to the 40 mph range a round before the next major shift, and will _probably_ die away when the next shift happens. But don't count on it.

80 mph winds...

The wind will be 80 mph (_hurricane force!_) at the top of the next round. The clouds have finally fulfilled their promise as well, and have begun dropping veritable buckets of driving rain throughout the arena. 

Medium-size or smaller: Fort DC 20 or blown away.
Large: Fort DC 20 or knocked down.
Huge: Fort DC 20 or checked.
Gargantuan or Colossal: No effect.

(flying creatures are one size smaller)

Blow away: knocked prone, roll 1d4x10 ft (2d6x10 if flying), take 1d4 subdual per 10 ft rolled along the ground (or a flat 2d6 subdual if flying).

Knocked down: knocked prone. Flying creatures are blown back 1d6x10 ft instead.

Checked: Unable to move North. Flying creatures are blown back 1d6x5 ft instead.

All flames are extinguished. Ranged attacks are impossible (even with siege weapons). Listen checks are impossible. This is strong enough to fell some trees.

Buckets of rain...

Visibility is cut to 50 ft (elves and other sharp-sighted & low-light critters 100 ft; darkvision is still cut to 50 ft). Sound-based blindsight is cut to half normal. Everything is spookily dark, although there is still enough light to see by. People who are glowing for whatever reason are visible (as a dim glow) despite distance.

The ground is becoming muddy and somewhat slick, although this is only an issue for people fighting on hillsides (DC 10 Balance check each round of actual combat not to slip and fall - result of Prone). Spell casting and up to double moves do NOT require balance checks, but Running does.

Universal effects...

_Dust of disappearance_ is stripped away by anyone hit by the wind and rain.

Walls such as the _prismatic wall_ and _walls of force_ provide some cover - for 5 ft south of the walls, there is no wind or rain; for every 5 ft south thereafter, the wind and rain creeps in 5 ft from all sides (left, right, top and bottom).

Thus:

```
[color=skyblue]--------
xxxxxxxx
 xxxxxx
  xxxx
   xx[/color]
```
Where the 'x' areas are calm and everything else is windy and rainy.

The hills provide no protection against the wind whatsoever.

-seasong

_edit: fixed formatting._


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## Jeremy (Aug 19, 2003)

Responded with a bunch of questions.


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## reapersaurus (Aug 19, 2003)

I got one email.

I'm of the same exact opinion about RPOL as Jeremy - if it makes it easier for you, or more likely for us to finish the Game, than let's try it.

I like the sound of it - I don't know how it is in practice, though, and it's always dangerous to mess with something IF it's working. If the current setup is not working, than let's definately try.


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## seasong (Aug 19, 2003)

Note: I forgot to tell the tale of the poor lion, brought into this cruel world only to appear amidst the flashing blades of dwarven vengeance. Yes, I speak of the Tan Lion, who's woeful fate we now discuss.

The damage roll on the blade barrier against the lion was 58 slashing damage. Alas, poor Lion, had only 32 to give, and the rest, as they say, was taken out of his hide.

At knee height, the blades were, and falling softly into the grass beneath the barrier, the stumps of his legs came to rest, spattered with the bits of the corpse left by the vicious circle.

Sorry dude. That wind's a &*%$$.

-seasong


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## seasong (Aug 19, 2003)

I'm going to be out of pocket this weekend, so the deadline will be Sunday night. However, if I get the high Init actions before the weekend, I will begin crunching them early. My next week is also likely to be a bit spotty, so...

My current plan is to post Inits as I finish them. I'll try to be as fast and efficient as I can, but at worst, I'll just be slow.

The complete round 3 should go up on Tripod sometime this week.

Regarding RPOL: I'm very interested in that site, and would like to discuss it, but I'm not going to make any sudden moves . If I run another Hethas' Gambit, it will _definitely_ be on RPOL, since a lot of the advantages are reduction of overhead for me, and elimination of e-mail difficulties.

-seasong


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## Number47 (Aug 19, 2003)

Unless there is a problem with it, use the turn I sent you last week for Round 5. Thanks.


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## Jeremy (Aug 19, 2003)

Seasong with his first character in Valhalla!  Good luck.  

Anyways, sent answers, no new questions.  Working on plan of action.


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## duder (Aug 20, 2003)

Oooh. Lion bits..


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## seasong (Aug 20, 2003)

Lion bits, Mortem bits... will Master and Blaster's littering never end!?

Jeremy: Thanks . Character name will be Rpomani... I'll be the one getting his butt handed to him by all of the seasoned veterans. Character build is a mounted archer, which is essentially my favorite build ever .

-seasong


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## Jeremy (Aug 20, 2003)

I was thinking of doing me a Kishi Charger with a Scythe mounted on a pale white horse.  

That power crit, deadly charge, power attack combination just seems wonderful for 1 on 1 arena matches.  Or maybe a psionic character with deep impact and a psionic bow of coup de grace.  How long until that would get nerfed?


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## seasong (Aug 20, 2003)

If you do, let me know what you think of how the site works. Oh, and let me know your character name, so I can kick his tailside curbside .

-seasong


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## cool hand luke (Aug 20, 2003)

*new game*

gentlemen,

I am considering running a TOTAL character creation contest, where both the background, and personality of the contestant counts as much as the munchy number crunching aspect.  It will be based on the greek pantheon, and will be a 1 on 1 tourney, instead of mass combat, see the attached document for the details I've got so far.

I'm posting it here first, since you guys are the experts on things like this, I'm looking for several things

1.  interest in a format like this
2.  comments on the (scant) details so far
3.  suggestions, etc.

being not so great with the rules (ask seasong)  I'm also looking for someone to be my top secret advisor on the legalities of various questions.

and yes, I did borrow heavily from seasongs rules.


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## Jeremy (Aug 20, 2003)

I know they are optional for ya, but any chance we'll be seeing the rest of the round 4 maps?


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## Number47 (Aug 20, 2003)

Soon. Maybe today if there isn't much work to do.


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## Jeremy (Aug 20, 2003)

Wonderful!  Thanks again for all the hard work.


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## Number47 (Aug 20, 2003)

Cool Hand Luke: Looked at your tourney document. Looks cool. I'll probably join, as soon as I think up a character concept. One question/comment. You are allowing OGL spells and items from seasong's game? Does that mean that those are the only possible additional spells and items, or that other OGL things may be approved? Only spells and items, or also OGL feats, PrC, etc?


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## cool hand luke (Aug 20, 2003)

yeah, saw that, it's a goof, I'm only allowing core EVERYTHING, no other feats, spells, etc, etc.  for 2 reasons. 

1.  I'm not a good enough rules lawyer to look at a feat/spell and tell if it's broken.

2.  I'm really interested in the balance of straight out of the box 3.5  sorry for that confusion.  THink of a character concept, I've still got a lot of work to do before I formally announce and start this bad boy.


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## duder (Aug 20, 2003)

Define "core"


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## cool hand luke (Aug 20, 2003)

3.5 phb and DMG

good point though....


----------



## reapersaurus (Aug 21, 2003)

cool hand luke - 
are you sure that a level 15 game is what you want, if you're not rock solid on the rules?

The higher the levels are, the harder it is to adjudicate, you know....   

Plus, the high-level games have kind of been covered, with clockwork's and seasong's....  is there a lower level that you might be interested in?

just a thought...


----------



## Number47 (Aug 22, 2003)

It is made a little easier, I think, by having only two combatants against each other at a time. Just remember about that when you design your character!


----------



## Jeremy (Aug 22, 2003)

Number47 said:
			
		

> *Soon. Maybe today if there isn't much work to do. *




But when will 'soon' be 'now'?  

Seasong:  Any chance we'll see the inventive write up text you come up with any time soon up on the blog?


----------



## seasong (Aug 22, 2003)

Jeremy said:
			
		

> Seasong:  Any chance we'll see the inventive write up text you come up with any time soon up on the blog?



Yes, just not this weekend. I'm a-goin' campin'  

-seasong


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## Number47 (Aug 22, 2003)

The rest of the maps are up. Just pretend the smoke isn't there.

Seasong, confirm that there is zero smoke at top of Round 5?


----------



## Jeremy (Aug 22, 2003)

*cheers*

Yay 47!  My favorite number!  

Now, the question is, who is Blaster going to leave for me to kill THIS round?


----------



## seasong (Aug 22, 2003)

*Re: new game*

Ugh. Can't sleep.

Number47: Confirmed, there is no smoke at the top of round 5.

Jeremy: One of the joys of so many players is that you dwell in a target-rich environment.



			
				cool hand luke said:
			
		

> I am considering running a TOTAL character creation contest, where both the background, and personality of the contestant counts as much as the munchy number crunching aspect.



Looks cool! I will echo the earlier comment, though, that a lower level contest might be more interesting for this crowd, and easier for you to teeth on. Another consideration, however, is that lower level characters are easier to check over, and from personal experience, even 8 players is a LOT of checking .



> I'm also looking for someone to be my top secret advisor on the legalities of various questions.



Since this will be 1 v 1, and focused on the non-crunchy aspect as well, have you considered open submissions? Or, perhaps, a small judging committee, similar to the CeramicDM setup?



> and yes, I did borrow heavily from seasongs rules.





That's what they're there for! The idea was that others could borrow and build on some of the anal-retentive work I did, so that future such games would be slightly easier to start.

Of course, an anal-retentive's work is never _truly_ finished .

-seasong


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## Number47 (Aug 22, 2003)

Gah! Don't convince him to change the setup! I just finished making the first draft of my character!


----------



## seasong (Aug 22, 2003)

Number47 said:
			
		

> Gah! Don't convince him to change the setup! I just finished making the first draft of my character!



 I'm just letting him know what kind of work high level characters are. And the rest of the things I mentioned won't affect the character builds very much.

Besides, serves you right for being so quick .

-seasong


----------



## Sollir Furryfoot (Aug 22, 2003)

Cool hand luke's GoD certainly looks interesting.  I'm not a big fan of 3.5e, but I may try it out if I have the chance.


----------



## cool hand luke (Aug 22, 2003)

ok, you guys convinced me, I'm going to run that thing.  Good point about the levels, I might knock that down a bit, 15 has been done a lot.  I want them to have most of the really cool class features, so i'm considering either 10 or 12.  

I really want to keep as much of the characters details private, so as to prevent metagaming, however, I don't necessarily feel qualified to judge the write-up portions by myself.  I think I will handle it like ceramic DM, with a panel of 2 others, but do it off screen.  I really don't want to divulge any character information in the process.  I will post a link here when I announce it.  Thanks guys!


----------



## cool hand luke (Aug 22, 2003)

what is standard starting gold for 10th and 12th levels?


----------



## Greppa of Tartwater (Aug 22, 2003)

*Re: New Game*

Luke, I apologize if I missed it earlier, but are you allowing Psionics in your GoD?


----------



## cool hand luke (Aug 22, 2003)

nope, no psionics, sorry


----------



## cool hand luke (Aug 22, 2003)

here's the thread for my game

http://enworld.cyberstreet.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=61339


----------



## Greppa of Tartwater (Aug 22, 2003)

*RE: Psionics*

Thanks.


----------



## Number47 (Aug 26, 2003)

Any update?


----------



## reapersaurus (Aug 26, 2003)

a WEEK since last update? 

i guess seasong wanred us it'd be a spotty/slow week...


----------



## JDragon (Aug 26, 2003)

Are the last few maps from round 4 working for everyone?  I can only get up to about map 15 to work?


----------



## Number47 (Aug 26, 2003)

There are only 15 maps. Ignore the others. Those are not the maps you're looking for.


----------



## Jeremy (Aug 26, 2003)

You can only read those extra maps if you are a subscriber.  To sign up send your money to me.


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## JDragon (Aug 26, 2003)

Not the maps I'm looking for.  

Ok, thanks


----------



## Jeremy (Aug 26, 2003)

Number47 said:
			
		

> *Any update? *




Seasong is busy working on a possible first victory over the ever opinionated Oskar up in Valhalla.    And cool hand it appears is about to join him.

Plug him full of holes!

((And give us our update!  ))


----------



## seasong (Aug 26, 2003)

Quick Note: A number of people didn't send me actions. That's going to make this a cowardly round!

Init 36 - Xiao Fung

Now visible at (24,20), Xiao Fung takes a 5 ft step north to (24,19), points his _ice storm_ wand into his mouth, and _takes it like a man_. He does not appear hurt by this, although his breath practically sparkles with frost.

Then, leaning into the wind, he turns and grins at Cholestus and Mrs Stampy, who both stand on the other side of the _prismatic wall_.

_Note: Number47, my ruling on your plan is that it would work under the conditions you specified, so that is the option I went with. Also, although you specified no action for Fu Lung, he's been doing the same thing *every durned round*, so he'll just continue doing that ._

-seasong


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## Number47 (Aug 26, 2003)

Do you mind if I post a little spoiler on one of the hidden uses of a familiar?


----------



## seasong (Aug 26, 2003)

If you don't mind giving it up, I don't mind you saying it .

-seasong


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## Number47 (Aug 26, 2003)

Well, it's just that it is often overlooked that a familiar can use his master's skill ranks.


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## Jeremy (Aug 26, 2003)

Yay!  Update!

More!


----------



## seasong (Aug 27, 2003)

Okay, the new boards feel weird. Once I get used to it, I'll be used to it, I suppose, but for right now nothing is where my mouse expects to go to click.

Anyway, I should have a few inits up over the lunch break.


----------



## Jeremy (Aug 27, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> Okay, the new boards feel weird. Once I get used to it, I'll be used to it, I suppose, but for right now nothing is where my mouse expects to go to click.
> 
> Anyway, I should have a few inits up over the lunch break.




Again!  Yay!  More!


----------



## seasong (Aug 27, 2003)

Another update, with more than just a teaser of 1 init, should be up sometime around lunch .

Also, the board seems to have eaten my earlier post saying the same thing.

-seasong


----------



## Jeremy (Aug 27, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> Another update, with more than just a teaser of 1 init, should be up sometime around lunch .
> 
> Also, the board seems to have eaten my earlier post saying the same thing.
> 
> -seasong




Ok, I got your back in Valhalla and kept your monkey from getting spanked by that vorpal blade, now I want some mayhem!    Post!


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## reapersaurus (Aug 27, 2003)

umm..  this default view on the new boards SUCKS.
Some icons are impossible to see, etc.

Anyway, seasong - could you list who didn't send you actions, so that those people can know if the email didn't go thru?


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## seasong (Aug 27, 2003)

Augh! I hate the new board. Can't get it to update for crap.

Okay, I tried to post, and I don't know if it went through, because I can't see it even when I hit refresh. I'll come back in an hour and see if I can see it then, because I can see the two attempts I made a while back...

Maybe you guys can see it?

Augh! Augh! Augh!

Anyway, if I can't see it in an hour, I'll repost.

-seasong


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## Jeremy (Aug 27, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> Augh! I hate the new board. Can't get it to update for crap.
> 
> Okay, I tried to post, and I don't know if it went through, because I can't see it even when I hit refresh. I'll come back in an hour and see if I can see it then, because I can see the two attempts I made a while back...
> 
> ...




Nope.  No post.


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## seasong (Aug 27, 2003)

Okay, here we go again. I still won't be able to see it, I think, so if y'all get this twice, sorry.

Init 36 - Xiao Fung

Now visible at (24,20), Xiao Fung takes a 5 ft step north to (24,19), points his ice storm wand into his mouth, and takes it like a man. He does not appear hurt by this, although his breath practically sparkles with frost.

Then, leaning into the wind, he turns and grins at Cholestus and Mrs Stampy, who both stand on the other side of the prismatic wall.

Note: Number47, my ruling on your plan is that it would work under the conditions you specified, so that is the option I went with. Also, although you specified no action for Fu Lung, he's been doing the same thing every durned round, so he'll just continue doing that .

Init 29 - Osirdar

Waits...

Init 23 - Master

Quickly chanting, Master disappears! His force cube is still visible, although it appears to have reduced in power somewhat. The force cube steps 10 ft south, and a distinct *cracking* sound can be heard, like a pistol or a cracking whip, and Marius' old shield, lying just beneath the circle of razors scootches (seemingly of its own accord) across the grass 5 ft towards the cube. Another crack, and it scurries through the force cube's walls (as if they weren't there).

Simultaneously, a rope snakes out of the cube and into the grass. Once it hits the grass, however, it becomes functionally invisible - no one in the game has the Spot check required to see what it's doing .

...and the big question: Who's Blaster's next target? Tune in tomorrow, when seasong finishes rolling the gigajabillion dice required!


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## seasong (Aug 27, 2003)

Hey! I can see my messages!

WOOOOOOT!

(apparently, hitting [ctrl]+[F5] refreshes in a way that works )

-seasong


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## Jeremy (Aug 28, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> ...and the big question: Who's Blaster's next target? Tune in tomorrow, when seasong finishes rolling the gigajabillion dice required!




Coolness!  But after you get done with his math intensive turn and the poor sap who gets ground up by him's attempts to salvage the situation (please don't be me!) we want more turns a day!  I watched the whole match with Oskar so I know you have occasional free time to squeeze out more of the less dice intensive turns.  

  Don't mind me, I'm just really enjoying the game and want more carnage.


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## seasong (Aug 28, 2003)

Heh. Most of the turns with Oskar were cut-n-paste of old turns with new coords/rolls .

But yeah, after Blaster it should go faster. I'm trying to do the turns a slightly different way - doing an entire Init at once, including the visible post, before moving on to the next. It reduces my ability to keep the whole round in my head, but (BUT!) it seems to be moving faster. I didn't get as much done yesterday as I wanted, but I also didn't spend NEARLY as much time not doing it .

Anyway, expect some carnage this Init, although I still have to make sure that someone is dead or not dead.

-seasong


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## Jeremy (Aug 28, 2003)

*applauds*  Rpomani goes to 1 and 1.  Post!  Who'd Blaster rip in half?


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## seasong (Aug 28, 2003)

Whew! Should be faster after this. I may have some time to myself this evening, which would be nice, and I'll try to crank through the remaining Inits. And hey - look at the time! We're to Blaster in only 4 days since Sunday!

Init 23 - Blaster

_A quick note: this was a bit complicated, because I had to make some adjudications for things the rules don't really cover. Yikes. In essence, my ruling was:

1. I rolled a Touch AC hit for Blaster to successfully leap onto Izad. If he failed, he would get one attack before hitting water, lose the other paw and bite, but still get the 2 rakes if he qualified later in the round. If he succeeded, he would get the first round of natural attacks and THEN hit water. As it happened, Izad's blur mattered - it prevented the touch attack! So Blaster got 5 total attacks, 4 of which were in the water (no game effect due to an effect of Izad's that kept them close to the surface).

2. Blaster wasn't even *trying* to swim, just rip into Izad, but an effect on Izad essentially continued to drag Izad to the surface. The end result was Blaster was underneath the surface of the water, clinging to a prone-but-floating Izad. Blaster is holding his breath.

3. It is not explicitly stated where I could find it, but I am going to state it now: concealment modifiers do NOT affect grappling, other than the initial touch attack._

Blaster rips across the turf towards the mini-lake, growling ferociously... although it's hard to growl properly when you're grinning. Teeth bared in what appears to be joy, Blaster hits the turf at (17,83) and leaps the remaining 15 ft (DC 20) to smack into where he thinks Izad is... but the blurring of Izad's outline puts him off just enough.

At the last second Blaster swipes a paw as he falls, ripping Izad for 23 dmg and dragging the poor bastard into the water with Blaster.

Something is keeping Izad on the surface of the water despite the weight of a large, wet tiger, and Blaster is wrapped around him like some kitty afghan, and manages a binding grip with his paws (on the second try). He then proceeds to rip the poor man up as much as possible with his two remaining attacks (dmg 23 and 21).

Total damage to Izad: 67! He lives!

_Note: Underwater fighting will require some deep thought for next round. I don't think it will impact much, but it may._

-seasong


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## JDragon (Aug 28, 2003)

Well that was fun.  

Seasong sent you an email to get some information on my current situation.


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## seasong (Aug 28, 2003)

JDragon said:
			
		

> Well that was fun.
> 
> Seasong sent you an email to get some information on my current situation.



Replied .

Yeah, it sucks to be Blaster's meat of choice... but look on the bright side! You're the first person he's had trouble hitting!

-seasong


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## Jeremy (Aug 28, 2003)

I'm really hating this non-refreshing problem the boards have right now.

In case any of you haven't read, you have to hit ctrl + f5 to see new stuff on the boards until they fix it.

Anyways, Seasong, I'm trying to contact you.


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## seasong (Aug 28, 2003)

Quick correction: Izad and Blaster are both sinking. There is no effect holding Izad above water.

They are just beneath the surface of the waves that are forming, and so are considered to be holding their breath, but are still at +0 ft for positional purposes.

Oh yeah, and... wet tiger. Ew.

-seasong


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## seasong (Aug 28, 2003)

Jeremy: Got it, responded, I'm about to head home, so it might be an hour or two before I see any more response from you. But basically, "yes".

-seasong


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## Jeremy (Aug 28, 2003)

So I noticed.  Kewl.    Just you wait.  Just you wait...  I'll have my day!


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## seasong (Aug 29, 2003)

Cholestus, Usasmir and Rillos are done. Am currently revising Izad's and Tairnandon's moves (Blaster screwed up some plans, obviously). They sent me the e-mails last night, I just have to make the rolls and see if anybody dies .

Those all should be up by lunch. Mrs Stampy may sneak in there, too, since her move is pretty simple. Unth will have to wait, though, unless I get a block of time at work - I haven't even looked at his move yet .

_Edit: Looked at Unth's move. He's going to have to revise because of Blaster, too _

Uhm, answer to earlier question: Actually, I was wrong. Only two people didn't send in a move, that was Saepiroth and duder. My impression was due to the fact that the e-mails were split over two accounts (hotmail and texas.net), and that some of the moves (like Sollir's) were very, very short .

-seasong


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## Jeremy (Aug 29, 2003)

Izad's reprisal should be interesting.  Hope you got some tricks up your sleeve, cause being grappled by a weretiger while sinking to the bottom of a lake in an antimagic field is a pretty lethal situation.  With or without Reaper at the helm.


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## seasong (Aug 29, 2003)

Thank you Jeremy, you just put "(Don't Fear) the Reaper" in my head.


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## cool hand luke (Aug 29, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> Thank you Jeremy, you just put "(Don't Fear) the Reaper" in my head.





I already sent you the revised move.


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## seasong (Aug 29, 2003)

Got it. Easy peasy.


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## seasong (Aug 29, 2003)

Long meeting looms up
Lunch, pushed back, cries for vengeance
Post at lunch, but late


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## JDragon (Aug 29, 2003)

Jeremy said:
			
		

> Izad's reprisal should be interesting.  Hope you got some tricks up your sleeve, cause being grappled by a weretiger while sinking to the bottom of a lake in an antimagic field is a pretty lethal situation.  With or without Reaper at the helm.





We shall see, Iv'e sent the best thing I could come up with to Seasong. 

But this a pretty tuff sittuation, going from minding your own business to pinned by a weretiger in a single round throws your step off a little.


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## reapersaurus (Aug 29, 2003)

<-- teeth showing


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## reapersaurus (Aug 29, 2003)

Quite the wild rules-quandries this round.
I always think it's fascinating when a situation comes up that literally has to be guessed at - 1000+ pages of rules doesn't cover it.

I sure hadn't expected Blur to figure so prominently. 
With Blaster's Blind-fight, I wasn't thinking a 20% miss chance would come up twice - yowtch.

But it does at least look pretty grim for Izad, pinned underwater like that....


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## Jeremy (Aug 29, 2003)

Yup.  Makes us all want a wall of force dome.  

Too bad he seems to be able to pounce every round.  It's really making him deadly.

But it also makes him the turn to watch (as long as you're not the target).  And with enough nickel and diming, he's still only got so many hitpoints to chew through.

Too bad Anthony's dead.  Need some archers to plunk into the big bad tiger.  Where'd Rillos run off to?


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## Jeremy (Aug 29, 2003)

'Pinned' underwater?  As in, no actions but break the pin?  OOOoo  That's even nastier.  Better clear the area.  Whoever's closest to the wet kitty next round may end up lunch.


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## Jeremy (Aug 29, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> Long meeting looms up
> Lunch, pushed back, cries for vengeance
> Post at lunch, but late



 **looks around**  **checks watch**

**paces impatiently, waiting and hoping**


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## reapersaurus (Aug 29, 2003)

Jeremy said:
			
		

> Too bad Anthony's dead.  Need some archers to plunk into the big bad tiger.  Where'd Rillos run off to?



Dude, didn't YOU kill Antony? 
Kinda hard to gnash your teeth about a situation you caused....  

Could you tell me a bit about this Valhalla you guys're mentioning?
I went to the Valhalla thread at RPOL, but couldn't make heads or tails of it. The info as to how to start, and the exact character guidelines, etc eluded me.


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## Jeremy (Aug 29, 2003)

SHHHHH!!  People had almost forgotten that!  

Valhalla is a 15 ECL advancing 1 on 1 area match forum.  You build a character PM'ing back and forth with the DM's, submit a challenge in the Galleries, then duke it out in an arena chosen from several pregens at random starting positions.  XP is gained based on difficulty of the challenge and whether you won or lost as well as money to refurbish or purchase new gear.  Current champ, recently enervated to death, but still champ, is a orc weretiger frenzied berserker with an absorbing shield and a berserking scythe.


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## seasong (Aug 29, 2003)

Nothing for Mrs Stampy. Long meeting basically broke lunch for me 

22 - Izad (Jdragon)

Izad, finding himself beneath lashing waves with a rapturous tiger, decides that this, THIS, is not the life for him.

He fights valiantly to free himself, a fierce look of concentration on his face as he pits human strength against striped brawn, and the tiger bares its teeth and holds him tight.

He tries trickery, relaxing momentarily, then bucking and diving for freedom... and almost makes it, but the tiger drags him, inexorably, back into its deadly grasp.

Despair seeps in with the chill of the waters, and as a desparate, last ditch effort, he reaches down... and grabs the tiger by the tail. Blaster doesn't like that! No sir! He yowls and howls and growls (or would, if he wasn't holding his breath), but Izad manages to kick free for a precious half second.

And in that half second, Izad kicks himself another five feet, narrowly avoiding an opportunistic slash from Blaster, and finds himself just far enough for magic to work.

Grimacing at what he is about to endure... he cracks a black bead on his forehead, and a blast of force (not quite large enough to catch Blaster, even if magic worked around the big beast) deals 23 points of damage to Izad, and encapsulates him in a perfect sphere, 10 ft on a side.

Alas, when the bead of force encapsulates, it does not _create air_. Izad finds himself in a 10 ft force sphere filled with water.  The sphere slowly begins to sink beneath the waves (hits the floor of the water this round).

22 - Cholestus the Shredder

The Shredder looks through the _prismatic wall_, his ugly face deep in concentration. Xiao Fung is taunting him. TAUNTING him. He glances over at Mrs. Stampy. She obviously feels it too, this yearning to rip the old wizard from stem to stern with a rusty hook.

But... BUT! His feral instincts say different. They say... he wouldn't be taunting if he didn't have a reason. Cholestus takes the better part of valor, and stays where he is.

He does take a partial action to flip the old wizard off, however.

21 - Tairnandon

_Note: Tairnandon moved somewhere - I'm letting the player change the position without impact - and his position is unknown._

Cholestus looks suddenly discomfitted and is lifted bodily by an invisible, telekinetic force!

And what will happen to the daughty warrior now that something has him?

Why, toss him through the _prismatic wall_ everyone has been admiring for the past several rounds of course! Cholestus flies through the field, screaming like a little... well, a very ugly little girl... and disappears from existence.

He then winks back into existence at (25,77), burned, shocked, eaten by acid, and partially poisoned... but very much alive.

Red (Ref, fail) 20 dmg (fire)
Orange (Ref, fail) 40 dmg (acid)
Yellow (Ref, fail) 80 dmg (electrical)
Green (Fort, succ) 20 dmg (poison)
Blue (Fort, succ) no effect
Indigo (Will, succ) no effect
Violet (Will, fail) teleported to a random position in the arena
- New Pos (25,77)
- Total dmg 160 dmg (He Lives!)

Xiao Fung's face, if you could see it through the rain, is probably priceless.

21 - Usasmir

Position unknown. But Hethas is pleased.

20 - Rillos

Position unknown.


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## reapersaurus (Aug 29, 2003)

Wow.
That is beyond belief, that Izad (a medium-sized human spellcaster?) could roll 2 successful 20% miss chances to avoid Blaster's full attack, then somehow get 2 unsuccessful grapple checks and then with his last grapple check (-10 for 3rd attempt), he did ... something (what is grabbing by the tail?) that got him out.
THEN, Blaster managed to miss ANOTHER sure-hit attack to grapple him again?
Then he gets a second 5' move out of the AMF and gets his hasted (I'm presuming) partial action back to use a Bead of Force 'gainst himself.

I'm really interested in seeing the rolls this round. 

I guess Blaster's +ALOT grapple bonuses are for naught this Game...


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## cool hand luke (Aug 29, 2003)

maybe it is karma cathcing up with you for bringing something so vile into this arena.  No, I'm not bitter.


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## Jeremy (Aug 29, 2003)

Luck o' the dice my friend.  

I just find it great that he'd rather attack himself and imprison himself then go another round with ya.    You should take that as a compliment, the big monster's on the prowl and people are throwing THEMSELVES in prison rather than face him.    Rather drown then get torn limb from limb I guess.

New target time!


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## seasong (Aug 29, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> Wow.
> That is beyond belief,



No, no it isn't .



> that Izad (a medium-sized human spellcaster?)



It's true. A human spellcaster would have to be insanely lucky to achieve what Izad just achieved. I think we both know what the hidden assumptions here are, especially since I've never seen a medium-sized human spellcaster at 15th level who could get off 3 attacks in a round and still have room for a _haste_ action.



> could roll 2 successful 20% miss chances to avoid Blaster's full attack,



He only rolled one of them - the initial leap. Here is the full round outline:

Touch AC to leap onto him: hit, 20% miss, missed.
First attack: hit, improved grab, grappled!
Rakes: auto damage.
2nd attack: bind, failed (Izad beat you by 2). (no miss chance)
3rd attack: bind, succeeded. (no miss chance)

End of your attacks (per my ruling, the missed leap negated extra natural attacks, although not the rakes since you qualified for them later).



> then somehow get 2 unsuccessful grapple checks and then with his last grapple check (-10 for 3rd attempt), he did ... something (what is grabbing by the tail?) that got him out.



Tail grabbing was text fluff. There is no -10 for 3rd attempt on grapples - you get a check for each attack you use up, and all checks are at your grapple check, which is BAB + STR + Size. This applies to Blaster as well, so they were on the same footing relative to each other the whole time.

He rolled better on 1 out of 3 attempts. Statistically, that means that on average he's about 6 points below you for his escape bonus (and note that he could substitute Escape Artist for Grapple Check for this one particular aspect of grappling).



> THEN, Blaster managed to miss ANOTHER sure-hit attack to grapple him again?



I'm not sure why you insist it was a sure-hit attack. It was an AoO, where you roll 1d20+attack versus his AC. You seem to be assuming that his AC was medium-to-low.



> Then he gets a second 5' move out of the AMF and gets his hasted (I'm presuming) partial action back to use a Bead of Force 'gainst himself.



Yes. There was nothing shady here .



> I guess Blaster's +ALOT grapple bonuses are for naught this Game...



Yes. Because out of three people he's nailed with them, ONE had the balls to get away . You know better than that. Your +ALOT grapple bonuses are why the crappy first round rolls you got still resulted in a sure fire kill; and why Mortem was so dead, dead, dead.

So, uh, no. They are not for naught. They are, in fact, a primary reason you are such a killing machine.

-seasong


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## seasong (Aug 29, 2003)

Additional note: If Izad dies from drowning in his force bubble, that will count as a suicide from a points perspective.

Blaster will not be docked any points for changing targets, since his current target is basically unavailable. He won't be docked if he has a way to get Izad, either, of course .


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## Jeremy (Aug 29, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> They are not for naught. They are, in fact, a primary reason you are such a killing machine.




Heh.


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## seasong (Aug 29, 2003)

Jeremy: Yeah, you laugh now. Wait'll he gets a hold of you . As you said, Blaster really is the turn to watch right now .


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## reapersaurus (Aug 29, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> Touch AC to leap onto him: hit, 20% miss, missed.



Per Blind-Fight, he gets another roll at the miss %.







> Tail grabbing was text fluff. There is no -10 for 3rd attempt on grapples - you get a check for each attack you use up, and all checks are at your grapple check, which is BAB + STR + Size.



Not according to my book.
"If you get multiple attacks in a round, you can attempt to start a grapple multiple times (at successively lower base attack bonuses)."

That's what makes grapples so deadly to get pinned by...







> Yes. There was nothing shady here .



I know there's nothing shady.
I trust you - that doesn't mean you (or I, or anyone) is perfect - we need many people's eyes peeled to get rules this BIG right.







> Your +ALOT grapple bonuses are why the crappy first round rolls you got still resulted in a sure fire kill; and why Mortem was so dead, dead, dead.



Actually, Blaster killed MArius and Mortem with attacks:
He's whiffed on both opposed grapples so far.
Marius escaped the first round, AND Izad escaped, as well.

That's not exactly dominance in grapples when Blaster has a +4 size bonus, PLUS high-STR (I'm sure that's not a give-away to anyone), + a feat that applies here, seasong... and he still missed on the grapple, AND the AoO in an AMF.
Izad must have an incredibly-pumped up Escape Artist check, or be insanely non-magically strong, or something. 

Oh yeah - where was the move-equivalent action to stand up from prone?  
(I have no clue how you wanted to run a Tripped character underwater...)


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## seasong (Aug 29, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> Per Blind-Fight, he gets another roll at the miss %.



I missed this. Thanks. I will re-roll and get back to you .

Correction: Blaster did not miss. I need to roll up his extra claw and bite damage. At a quick glance, though, I don't think he can do enough to kill unless he gets a crit, so I'll roll this up later. Remind me if I don't!



> Not according to my book.
> "If you get multiple attacks in a round, you can attempt to start a grapple multiple times (at successively lower base attack bonuses)."



Yes, and that is the ONLY grapple check that the reduced bonuses are mentioned for - starting the grapple. Once the grapple is started, all other grapple checks (pinning, escaping, doing damage, etc.) don't do that by a strict reading of the rules.

And there's a good reason for it - you aren't trying to hit a set value (like AC), you are trying to hit an opposed check. If they went down on your attacks, it would give the defender (in every case) a huge advantage. For example, if your pin attempts went down by -5 every attack you used, you would have _failed to pin him_ in the first place.



> Actually, Blaster killed MArius and Mortem with attacks:
> He's whiffed on both opposed grapples so far.
> Marius escaped the first round, AND Izad escaped, as well.



The whole point of grappling isn't to do damage. It's to make escaping expensive and difficult - if damage was the point, grappling would do MORE damage, not less. Marius got out, sure... and then what? Oh yeah, after escaping, he only had enough actions left to get 10 ft away.

And we're talking about a half-ogre STR monster here, trying to escape you.

How would the Marius thing have gone down without the grappling? Oh yeah, he would have gotten further, downed the potion, and disappeared high into the sky.

Mortem: Actually, this is true. The grappling wasn't necessary against Mortem, because he died in the first round.

Izad: After escaping, his only option? Smacking himself with a bead of force? Jesus. That's not escape - it's suicide.



> That's not exactly dominance in grapples when Blaster has a +4 size bonus, PLUS high-STR (I'm sure that's not a give-away to anyone), + a feat that applies here, seasong... and he still missed on the grapple, AND the AoO in an AMF.



Okay, quick fact: you gave up +4 BAB to be a weretiger. This is something anyone can check, so I'm not giving away anything. The size bonus exactly counters that.

Your STR and feats give you an OMG bonus to grappling. Your sheer number of attacks gives you an almost unbeatable capacity to grapple someone. And once they are grappled, that's IT - they have to escape or die trying. And for the escape, they get their NUMBER OF ATTACKS. Sheer odds are that they will escape _if they use a full round_ AND _if they have a good BAB + STR_.

So far, both escapes used a full round, and had a good BAB (3 attacks in a round should tell you that); and one of them is a confirmed STR monster. And even with that... Izad, like Marius, only got 10 ft away from you. Marius tried to save himself with a spell. Izad did 23 points of damage to himself and caught himself in a bead of force trying to find a way out.

And you can still stand there and say that you're not dominating? Ha! In my day, we felt dominant if we edged the other guy out by a single hit point! 



> Izad must have an incredibly-pumped up Escape Artist check, or be insanely non-magically strong, or something.



Actually, I can get an Escape Artist of +27 without trying very hard, and without magic.



> Oh yeah - where was the move-equivalent action to stand up from prone?
> (I have no clue how you wanted to run a Tripped character underwater...)



I am treating it like perfect flying: there is no prone, there is just direction of travel.


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## seasong (Aug 29, 2003)

Actually, per my comments on what grappling achieves, check out my fight with Oskar at Valhalla. The whole purpose of grappling at the end was to prevent him from getting away while I did horrible, horrible things to him. And I was a crappy grappler - I was just lucky he was worse.

So far, you've picked some of the toughest people to consecutively grapple. Try it on one of the little girls in the arena and see how you fare .


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## Number47 (Aug 29, 2003)

I think you should be happy that seasong has decided your grappling is not a smackdown. Personally, it is so completely overpowering that I expected it to be nerfed.

Seasong, I do not think that walls of force sink. Is Rillos wall of force in the air sinking? It should maintain the level it was invoked at, if there was any air caught in it (how far under the water was he?), he should have pretty much zero chance of drowning if he can swim well enough to tread water. Of course, whatever magic thing was making him float will re-activate, right?

EDIT: Is there an arena-style game on RPOL that uses 3.5 (I gave my 3.0 book away already), but is less than epic level (because I only use the 3 core)?


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## reapersaurus (Aug 30, 2003)

finally ... the boards are up!
---------------------------------------
what would you have seasong DO, #47?
Ban my character?
It's a combination of about 7-10 things that contribute to Master/Blaster being effective at killing - I didn't just pay X levels for a "ass-kicking" template, or something.

Is it the monk you object to?
Is it the half-ogre?
Is it the Weretiger?
Is it the AMF?
Is it the cohort?
Is it the Cube of Force?
Is it the feats all had access to, as well?
----------------------------------------

seasong - I found out what was 'off'.

Blaster pinned Izad, right?
Then Izad beat Blaster's opposed grapple check....  ONCE.
And escaped.

So Izad should be still grappled with Blaster after his 3rd escape attempt (and wouldn't have gotten out of the AMF, so no extra partial action for the Bead of Force).
That's the scary part about getting pinned.


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## Number47 (Aug 30, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> finally ... the boards are up!
> ---------------------------------------
> what would you have seasong DO, #47?
> Ban my character?
> ...




As you well know, seasong stated that something is a smackdown and due to be nerfed if (a) it is nearly impossible to resist/avoid and (b) it is nearly guaranteed to kill before you can do anything about it. The fact that you are arguing how irresistible your bonuses are actually prove my point. In your AMF, you can probably only miss most characters on a 1 (after all, your strength must be at least 40), inititate a grapple automatically. Once the grapple is initiated, it simply means the opponent is dead the next round (if it takes even that long). That is lot more overpowering than dropping big rocks, and seasong certainly said he was going to nerf _that_!


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## seasong (Aug 30, 2003)

1) I'm not nerfing Blaster. He was built, fairly carefully, under the spirit of the rules AND the letter of the rules, that I set forth. And it's not a smackdown by my feelings on the matter. There are ways to survive the attack, and a good set of rolls allows things to go either way. This is no more a smackdown than have a spell with a save DC 30 is - it's damned tough to beat, but it can be beaten.

2) Walls of force do not sink, you are correct. Izad is hanging beneath the waves. My bad .

3) I went over this little fight with a fine toothed comb this morning. Here are the changes:

Izad will take more damage from Blaster's two extra natural attacks. Blaster did not miss the initial leap, due to blindfight. It still won't kill Izad, but every point counts, yes?

Izad escaped the pin, but NOT the grapple. I see reapersaurus is also pointing this out .

The upshot of that is this: Izad can still free himself, but he won't have actions left over to break the bead. He would be aware of this, so JDragon, if you want to send me a different set of actions for your post-Pin-escape activity, please do!

-seasong


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## Jeremy (Aug 30, 2003)

He's got a point.  I much prefer everyone running from the tiger and the tiger occasionally one-shot'ing his opponents and occasionally the target running away like a scared little girl and drowning himself in a prison of force than:

'Reaper's turn.  Weretiger pounce.  X is dead.'
'Reaper's turn.  Weretiger pounce.  Y is dead.'
'Reaper's turn.  Weretiger pounce.  Z is dead.'

  There's no variation and chance for fun things to happen in the above.  Yes he kicks butt and in the antimagic field is the most powerful melee combatant, but given enough rolls someone might escape long enough maybe not to fight back but at least show himself a coward and lose points.

Even if you don't kill someone you are still winning the game which is a race of points.  

I agree, be happy you didn't get nerfed as a smackdown.  None of your one components would be out, but instead the sum of them all, and that would blow.  I should know, smackdowns are carefully engineered combinations that work in certain circumstances to bring annihilation.

As Blaster is doing occasionally 200 points of damage in a single round (sometimes at range), that qualifies as a smackdown by the rules of the Sultans of Smack thread.    Which is cool, you should definately post him over there when we're done, but it also means you are subject to nerfing as per the rules of the game you read when you joined.    So even though the round didn't end in a kill for you, it may yet still if he doesn't have a disintegrate or teleport and you DID get points, and he did not.

Besides even if a ruling didn't go your way (and it looks like seasong is doing everything he can to make rulings fair) I personally feel he is very generous allowing a (Su) ability 'Alternate Form' in an AMF especially when it's from a Magical Disease in an area where all magic is supressed.  And even more generous allowing you full attack actions at the end of every charge instead of single attacks as the pounce ability only gives a full attack action at the end of the first round of combat, which we are well past.  The magical abilities that I know that one-up that giving it at the end of every charge, are just that, magical, and would have been suppressed.  Though it wouldn't be the first time I over looked something.

Also, according to the init breakdown above, your rakes auto hit instead of attacking at your claw attack bonus (which may or not be considered auto-hit by you anyways ) as per normal weretigers.

And apparently seasong is correcting his ruling oversights anyways.    So all is good.  Be happy.  So no need for the:



			
				reapersaurus said:
			
		

> I guess Blaster's +ALOT grapple bonuses are for naught this Game...




or the 



			
				reapersaurus said:
			
		

> what would you have seasong DO, #47?
> Ban my character?




comments.  It's all good.  Step back, realize you are still doing what you came to do (kill well, quickly, and more often than anyone else) with relative impunity.  This stuff is supposed to be fun right?  

PS- You know me, none of this stuff is supposed to be offensive or critical.  Just poking and pointing out things.  Just wanted to say that as I know tone and meaning sometimes gets lost on these boards to the coldness of typeset.


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## Number47 (Aug 30, 2003)

Well said.

I do not propose to nerf Blaster. I am warning that if reaper tries to hard to convince seasong that his grapples are inescapable, seasong just might agree with him. Then the nerf stick would come down. In other words, you do NOT want overwhelming success in this game at anything you want to keep on doing.


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## Jeremy (Aug 30, 2003)

Let's get this round over with so we can get on with the killing.    I know Cholestus has a new best friend he's anxious to meet.


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## Pielorinho (Aug 30, 2003)

Jeremy said:
			
		

> And even more generous allowing you full attack actions at the end of every charge instead of single attacks as the pounce ability only gives a full attack action at the end of the first round of combat, which we are well past. The magical abilities that I know that one-up that giving it at the end of every charge, are just that, magical, and would have been suppressed. Though it wouldn't be the first time I over looked something.




Actually, that's what I'm wondering.  It looks like blaster is using 3.5 pounce rules, but I was thinking this is run by 3.0 rules.  Am I missing something?

The character is a lot less scary if it can no longer pounce in this combat -- which, by my reading of 3.0 pounce rules, it can't.

Of course, I'm a casual observer, and anyone involved should feel free to tell the peanut gallery to shut up .

Daniel


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## Number47 (Aug 30, 2003)

I'm still wondering how he gets so many attacks. I suspect a bad rules call in there somewhere, but I'm not worried about it. I can handle it when it gets down to me and him.


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## Jeremy (Aug 30, 2003)

K.  Do you mind if I wait over here in the corner while it's down to you too?


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## seasong (Aug 30, 2003)

Number of attacks: natural attacks -1, plus BAB extra attacks.

Pounce: Actually, this is a good point. I need to check some of my old e-mails. He may not have been able to pounce Izad - I think I'd told him it only works when he's taken a "break round" to restart the ability.

I'm pretty sure that's why he ran back to Master in round 3, for example, and in the heat of round 5's excitement, we forgot. I'll go and check, but it might take me some time - I've got something like 200 e-mails between me and reapersaurus discussing what I will and won't allow . (and he's not the only one, you munchkins).

If that was my ruling, I'll need to come up with a quick fix solution so we can keep the game rolling, and remember better in future (fix will probably be to allow it, but to also allow Izad's escape + extra move + bead of force, since that was fricking cool even if it wasn't technically legal).


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## Number47 (Aug 30, 2003)

Before the post gets too old, congrats to Cholestus for making the _important_ saves. Your life just flashed before your eyes, there.


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## Number47 (Aug 30, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> Number of attacks: natural attacks -1, plus BAB extra attacks.




Creatures using natural attacks never get extra attacks for BAB. Look at dragons for an example. He can use one or the other, natural or BAB progression and penalties for offhand attacks, not both combined.


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## seasong (Aug 30, 2003)

Check the salamander for a counterexample. There is no hard and fast rule here that I am aware of.

However, I do agree with you (reading through Lycanthrope). This was a bad ruling. I will consider whether or not to nerf this moving forward - If I DO, it would reduce his attacks by -2 one way or the other. It would not be retroactive - I'm not starting the whole game over .


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## JDragon (Aug 30, 2003)

Seasong,

I have sent an email with my response regarding the diffrent move.

Let me know if this covers it or not.


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## reapersaurus (Aug 31, 2003)

I'm not sure if anything I can say will change anyone's opinion/approach to this Game, but:


			
				Number47 said:
			
		

> Creatures using natural attacks never get extra attacks for BAB.



No, they don't get ITERATIVE attacks with natural weapons.
What this means is that when a creature gets 4 attacks (lets say), his iterative attacks are not 4 more attacks each.
That makes sense, and is balanced, since natural attacks are factored into CR. 

BTW: excluding Rakes (a special ability), Blaster only gets one more attack than a monk with 10 BAB. 

Also, Blaster is not impossible to resist, as evidenced by him missing multiple AoO's, and his only 2 grapple-foes escaping.

Jeremy: I presume the Rakes "auto-hitting" was flavor text, as well.

About Pounce: I'm pretty sure that the designers of 3E stated and intended that Pounce could be used in the first round of any combat. Meaning, the first round of combat with any target, not that one round of combat between combatants A & B invalidates Pouncer C from using it.
I haven't found the reference that I read years ago, but the 3.5 Pounce sure supports that view (3.5 Pounce is much stronger, BTW - on any charge...).

The only stretch as I thought was allowing me to have Blaster Pounce Mortem in Round 4, after disengaging (hypothetically re-setting the combat, I'd guess). I didn't realize it might be a stretch that round until later.

But that's all post-mortem analysis.  HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA (you can thank my wife for the horrendous, but perfect play-on-words)

About Blaster's supposed un-stoppableness:
I guess many people missed how close to death Blaster was after only 2 rounds of attacks. I was fortunate to have him survive, using such an aggressive strategy. If he didn't have Tumble, he would have died. If I was a viewer of the battle, I know I'd want to watch aggressive, combat-effective play in a GoD - I'm surprised at many of the comments, since we ARE playing in a Game of DEATH, here...

And what also has been overlooked is how darn easy it is to dodge Blaster's attacks: I hesitate to state the obvious, since it will reduce my character's effectiveness, but let's just say I sure was happy Izad ran right over and invited Blaster's attacks. 

I presume he thought he was a squeaky-toy for a couple rounds, and wanted to play. 

Jeremy - I'm having a great time with this GoD. This stuff is not only supposed to be fun, it IS fun.


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## Jeremy (Aug 31, 2003)

Great!  

Yup.  3.5 Pounce is incredible.  

Oh, Blaster's not unstoppable, just fearsome.  Which makes him the turn to watch.  Which is good!  Spending 4 months watching people circle each other is no fun.

Watching someone recklessly charge into combat is fun!

It's like Han Solo charging all those Storm Troopers, of course, when they all turned around, he knew it was time to run.  But really, every target is just hit points until he starts fighting back.  

Yup.  I certainly didn't count on the AMF coming back.  

Anyways, on with the show.  We going to see the rest of the inits soon seasong?


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## Saepiroth (Aug 31, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> Only two people didn't send in a move, that was Saepiroth and duder.



Sorry, I was out of town until just recently, and I guess I got a bit distracted about the change of pace since you weren't posting things to the weblog. 


edit; HOLY JESUS GOD I SURVIVED


WOAH


_WOAH_.


edit2; watch me slip on the wet grass next round and break my neck, or something.


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## Jeremy (Aug 31, 2003)

Lol


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## Saepiroth (Aug 31, 2003)

A question; is the Draconic Might potion's effects an unnamed bonus?


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## Jeremy (Aug 31, 2003)

Normally, but it was changed to a enhancement bonus for this game.  It's on the website, or at least, I think it is.


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## seasong (Aug 31, 2003)

I'm going to be in Houston or Galveston tonight and chunk of tomorrow. This is kind of a last minute thing, but I'm bringing my laptop with me, and if I have time, I'll work some inits while I'm there. Otherwise, it will probably be another 5+ inits on Tuesday.

JDragon, I'm going with the spirit of what you sent me. The combat between you and Blaster is just complicated . That will be updated with the other inits, when I have good access again.

-seasong


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## reapersaurus (Aug 31, 2003)

here: http://seasong.home.texas.net/god/items.html
(testing Quick Reply)

edit: It seems strange to me that noone has commented on Jeremy's silent-assassin group. Characters are DYING from some invisible, unknown force, yet noone's even said one thing about it?
AFAIK, no one knows where they are, or what they can do.... 
It's like an Agatha Christie novel - people are dying, and noone knows the killer, or how they're doing it. 
I think the unknown, silent killer is much scarier than one that's out in the open.

Face it - we're all just characters in _The Ten Little Gladiators_ novel.


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## Number47 (Sep 1, 2003)

I have a few vague suspicions about them, but I don't believe they can harm me. I like how they even got inside duder's force bubble.


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## Jeremy (Sep 1, 2003)

So did Hethas.  I want to make the insides of that bubble red with blood!  Rawr!


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## Sollir Furryfoot (Sep 1, 2003)

Ignore me


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## reapersaurus (Sep 1, 2003)

How the heck would they get inside the Force Bubble if they're incoporeal?

Hey, Jeremy - all this discussion about RPOL's Arena is funny, how we were abusing these spells long ago. RPOL must not have been taking notes, eh? Allowing those spells in is a really bad idea (well, I guess it's not bad if you know about them, and they don't  ). Did they stop the dancer cheese, or is that viable?

And the name  "Jairami" is awfully familiar to me - I swear, he was in the Paladins of the Board Unite adventure long ago - was that you, Jeremy?


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## Jeremy (Sep 1, 2003)

Nope.  Jairami is a corruption of Jeremy I formulated while playing DragonRealms so long ago as a Moon Mage.  Though amazingly enough I've seen the same name in a couple of places.


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## Number47 (Sep 1, 2003)

If he/they are incorporeal, they can simply go through the ground and come up in the middle of the force bubble. That's why you have to fly and use a force sphere!


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## reapersaurus (Sep 1, 2003)

ahh.. good point, #47.

Jeremy - then did you use Jairami as a character in SMACK, or any other PbP I was in?


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## Jeremy (Sep 1, 2003)

I believe the only time I've used that name in any instance on this board was a when I originally signed up for it way back when.  About a year later after 2 board switches I got on early enough to take 'Jeremy' as my user name instead of the corruption and have been this ever since.


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## seasong (Sep 2, 2003)

Just a quick note that I didn't have any time for anything while in Houston, and I don't have any time this morning . I'm sending JDragon and reapersaurus a write up of their round of play together, and after they send me back a reply that they don't see anything wrong with it, I will post that over lunch.

Depending on how lunch goes, I may get more inits out then . And we're STILL going faster than the last round .

-seasong


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## JDragon (Sep 2, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> Just a quick note that I didn't have any time for anything while in Houston, and I don't have any time this morning . I'm sending JDragon and reapersaurus a write up of their round of play together, and after they send me back a reply that they don't see anything wrong with it, I will post that over lunch.
> 
> Depending on how lunch goes, I may get more inits out then . And we're STILL going faster than the last round .
> 
> -seasong




You get that email sent?  If so can you resend, I don't appear to have gotten it.


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## seasong (Sep 2, 2003)

Okay, evening it is then. Sorry.

JDragon, I resent it, but still didn't get a response back. If I still haven't heard from you this evening, I'll just post it here - I was hoping to avoid further editting on the board, but I'd rather it gets done .

-seasong


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## JDragon (Sep 2, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> Okay, evening it is then. Sorry.
> 
> JDragon, I resent it, but still didn't get a response back. If I still haven't heard from you this evening, I'll just post it here - I was hoping to avoid further editting on the board, but I'd rather it gets done .
> 
> -seasong




Ok, I'll keep an eye out for it but nothing so far.

IF you need to just post that will be fine.


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## reapersaurus (Sep 2, 2003)

I haven't received an email either.   

I agree that it's a good idea to run it by us before posting, to minimize updates/modifications/confusions.


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## seasong (Sep 3, 2003)

E-mail resent. I'd rather hash it out in e-mail. In the meantime, I'm working on the remaining Inits. Blaster and Izad are unlikely to influence other fights, so I'm going to keep everything else rolling.


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## JDragon (Sep 3, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> E-mail resent. I'd rather hash it out in e-mail. In the meantime, I'm working on the remaining Inits. Blaster and Izad are unlikely to influence other fights, so I'm going to keep everything else rolling.




Got the Email, and responded.


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## seasong (Sep 3, 2003)

Got it, still waiting on reapersaurus.

Still cranking on the other inits .


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## seasong (Sep 3, 2003)

Lunch! And the last of the Inits!

I'm going to go through and double check everything, and finish up with reapersaurus and JDragon, and then polish the bear's positions (and double check Xiao Fung's hit points), so I should be done by tonight.

Individualized e-mails tomorrow, assuming Blaster and Izad get their thang worked out.

----------------
20 - Mrs Stampy

*Tusked Vengeance:* Once upon a time, there was a spell cast upon the favored son of Xiao Fung, and this spell did keep all manner of beasts and kin at bay while Xiao Fung blasted hither and yon amidst the beasts and their friends. Even when Hagbard, friend to animal and elephant kin everywhere, smote the favored son into dust, the spell remained, anchored to the remaining motes of his corpse. Those motes of dust, however, were carried by a vengeful storm into a wall placed (ironically) by Xiao Fung himself, where they were smashed into nothingness, and the terrible spell with them.

Mrs. Stampy grimly shook herself and began rumbling through the grass, one dire purpose alone in her mind: kill the murderer and bury him in the mud beneath her feet!

She moves 85 ft to (16,17)-(23,20), goring Xiao Fung as she arrives (30 dmg), and bellows a terrible song of elephantine war!

_(Note: I don't think I have the complete list of hits/heals for Xiao Fung at work, so I may be off, but I'm pretty sure he survived. I will double check this when I get home)_

17 - Unth Dirn

Seeing the fight that _he_ wanted to be in going on at the water's edge, Unth runs pell-mell to (17,84) where he puts his reach weapon to good use, smacking the big kitty across the back! (36 dmg)

Of course... now Blaster has his choice of sweetmeats.

8-6 Duder, Omigawd and Mang

All three go to all out defense, stepping swiftly about and obviously hoping to avoid whatever it is that invades their sanctum. All seem to have readied themselves to hit anything they spot, and appear to be listening intently as well...

But they hear nothing but the rain and wind, beating against the walls of force surrounding them.

3 - Mr Buffles and Mr Duffles

These two meet up where Cholestus used to be, and grunt affirmation to each other. They give Xiao Fung a look that is unmistakeable - meat to be wasted.

_(For some reason, I have these guys in the wrong spot. I know they have plenty of movement to get to where Cholestus was, but I don't know exact distance. I will fix this section when I get home, but it's not important since they aren't attacking anyone yet.)_

3 - Mr Huffles

Continues eating the brains of Polar Bear #6. Mighty, mighty pleased about it, too.

3 - Mr Stampy

Contentedly munching on the grass, Mr Stampy examines his life from a whole new perspective. Having reached some form of accord with himself, he begins a trumpeted rendition of "White Rabbit", adding to the already cacophanous winds!


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## seasong (Sep 3, 2003)

Ack, knew I forgot something.

Jeremy: Since your readied action never went off, you remain at your old Init next turn.


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## cool hand luke (Sep 3, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> Contentedly munching on the grass, Mr Stampy examines his life from a whole new perspective. Having reached some form of accord with himself, he begins a trumpeted rendition of "White Rabbit", adding to the already cacophanous winds!





some pills make you taller.......

and some pills make you small

but the ones that mother gives you.....

I'd love to hear the elephant version of that.


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## seasong (Sep 3, 2003)

Just think of the beat/melody, not the lyrics. Although any characters are welcome to sing along with the elephant. As packyderm musicians go, he's quite good .


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## Number47 (Sep 3, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> Ack, knew I forgot something.
> 
> Jeremy: Since your readied action never went off, you remain at your old Init next turn.




You mean Number47, right?


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## seasong (Sep 3, 2003)

Actually, I meant both of you. Jeremy's was just the most recently in mind.


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## Jeremy (Sep 3, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> Actually, I meant both of you. Jeremy's was just the most recently in mind.



I thought I didn't have a readied action in my revised turn? Tair? Or Osirdar?

If Osirdar:  Blast.  Worth a shot!    That's the price you pay I guess.


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## reapersaurus (Sep 3, 2003)

Jeremy said:
			
		

> If Osirdar:  Blast.  Worth a shot!    That's the price you pay I guess.



I have a sneaking suspicion as to what he was readying for....   

seasong and JDragon - I replied with my thoughts - it should be good to go, even though the round ended up turning out a bit worse for my team than I'd hoped, what with Unth sticking it to Blaster's backside again with his pigsticker.. UNTH GET OFF MY BACK YOU OVER_REACHING 
BLASTER-ON-A-STICK BBQ-FIEND, YOU!  

But I'd hoped Blaster would lead to memorable encounters, and I think this round's was...


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## cool hand luke (Sep 4, 2003)

reapersaurus said:
			
		

> I have a sneaking suspicion as to what he was readying for....
> 
> seasong and JDragon - I replied with my thoughts - it should be good to go, even though the round ended up turning out a bit worse for my team than I'd hoped, what with Unth sticking it to Blaster's backside again with his pigsticker.. UNTH GET OFF MY BACK YOU OVER_REACHING
> BLASTER-ON-A-STICK BBQ-FIEND, YOU!
> ...





I'm sure unth is a deadman after that little swat.  probably not the best tactical decision, but oh well.  had to at least hit the guy


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## reapersaurus (Sep 4, 2003)

little swat?!
Boy, he sure can do damage, even in an AMF!
congrats on his build.


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## Jeremy (Sep 4, 2003)

Alright!  What's the deadline and when can we see the maps?


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## seasong (Sep 4, 2003)

Just a quick note that I didn't get ANYTHING done last night. However, I did manage to bring my stuff to work with me, so I'll be double checking stuff this morning.

I already double checked to make sure Cholestus lived. Tough little bugger, ain't he? Although we're going to have to rename him to "Cholestus the Shredded" .

Also, it looks like reapersaurus and JDragon are in agreement, so I'll edit that post sometime later this morning. The essence of it is, Blaster didn't get the pin (ruling/slight nerf: has to take a round "away" from fighting to be able to pounce again), but Izad _still_ wasn't able to get out of the AMF, although he was able to esconce himself in the bead of force and set himself up for a slow drowning death.

Also, reapersaurus, I mispoke on the rakes thing, so no worries there.

-seasong


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## cool hand luke (Sep 4, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> The essence of it is, Blaster didn't get the pin (ruling/slight nerf: has to take a round "away" from fighting to be able to pounce again), but Izad _still_ wasn't able to get out of the AMF, although he was able to esconce himself in the bead of force and set himself up for a slow drowning death.
> 
> Also, reapersaurus, I mispoke on the rakes thing, so no worries there.
> 
> -seasong





how did he use the bead of force inside the AMF?


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## seasong (Sep 4, 2003)

He has a 5 ft reach. He was inside the AMF, at the edge of the field.


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## seasong (Sep 5, 2003)

Sorry y'all. Got delayed by real life.

Xiao Fung: confirmed that he isn't dead .

Blaster vs Izad:

Blaster runs and leaps upon Izad! Although Izad was blurred, Blaster relies on senses other than sight along, and managed to drag a claw into his chest, dragging Izad with him as he sank into the storm-whipped waters.

As they sink, Blaster pulls Izad in close and rakes with his hind legs... blood mixes with freshwater, and both disappear beneath the waters. Desparate, and unable to break free by any other method, Izad grabs Blaster by the tail and kicks free...

Alas, not far enough. The magical drain upon Izad is present still. _One last try_, he thinks, and reaches an arm out as far as it will go, a small black bead held in his hands.

With an amazing display of manual strength, he cracks the bead. A wave of force completely fails to harm anything within the antimagic field, but the sphere of force expands into place without difficulty. Izad does not resist, and is pulled by the bead of force into the "safety" of an impenetrable prison.

Will he drown? Time will tell.


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## seasong (Sep 5, 2003)

I'm not going to have much time at work today, but I will try to get your individual e-mails out as soon as possible. Poke me if you haven't heard anything by Saturday morning.


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## Saepiroth (Sep 6, 2003)

cool hand luke said:
			
		

> how did he use the bead of force inside the AMF?



 It's such an inspired tactic, it'd be too anticlimactic if it just fizzled out.


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## Jeremy (Sep 6, 2003)

*pre-Saturday-morning-poke to not forget to poke seasong saturday morning when I am poking myself to rembember to poke on the appointed time of poking*


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## reapersaurus (Sep 6, 2003)

*poke poke*
I'm interested i seeing my rolls this round, then hopefully onto Round 6 soon?


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## Number47 (Sep 8, 2003)

Well, seasong, I have been following your fights over at RPOL. Not looking so hot. Just fighting too much nerfed-up munchkin goodness?

I just started my firt match in the arena The Proving Grounds. Seems to have started out very nicely. You should make a 3.5 character and come by. Unfortunately, it really is the only arena I can fight in. 3.5 with no books required outside core.

Oh, and by the way, where the heck are the turns? What are the opening conditions of Turn 6?


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## Jeremy (Sep 8, 2003)

As far as I can tell, I have not yet received my individual email either.

And I have to recommend the Proving Grounds as well, it's run by Tyr (our own DM with a Vengeance) and has much more balanced and well thought out rules than Valhalla.  If I weren't so busy fixing all the nerfs Luo brought about I'd probably have a char over there.


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## Number47 (Sep 8, 2003)

You mean I'm busy stomping on DM with a Vengeance yet again? This is becoming a habit!


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## cool hand luke (Sep 8, 2003)

where is the proving grounds?  is it rpol also, I tried to get one up on valhala, but I just can't munch enough to get anything effective, with all the outside sources that are allowable, but I don't have.  (freaking idiotic FR!!!)


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## Jeremy (Sep 8, 2003)

LOL

Are the maps up?  What's the new deadline going to be?  Update?


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## reapersaurus (Sep 9, 2003)

OK, I'm gonna say something to rile up seasong:

How do you have enough time to get your ass kicked over on RPOL, while we're languishing away, the entire Game perched on your every word?

PLEASE find the time to stay with this Game - it's the best, HANDS-DOWN Game of Death/Arena/Tournament Game of its kind on the internet, and spending time on any other is kind of a waste (IMO) while there's efforts to be expended on this one to make it better.


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## Saepiroth (Sep 9, 2003)

Oh, give him time. As long as he doesn't drop it, it's fine. Let him play slow, you're not going to die if you don't win before december.


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## Number47 (Sep 10, 2003)

You know, I haven't seen seasong post anywhere since friday. He must be having health/personal/computer problems. Give him a little slack on the RPOL. It doesn't take that much time to run a character there, you can post your turn in a couple minutes at work. Compare it to running a game like this one, with secret info and stuff, and the amount of work must be boggling.

Speaking of RPOL, I just won my first match! The proving grounds is so much better than Valhalla, in my opinion. The match actually lasted 5 rounds! It would have lasted longer, but my opponent conceded when he got shoved through the prismatic wall.


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## cool hand luke (Sep 10, 2003)

Number47 said:
			
		

> You know, I haven't seen seasong post anywhere since friday. He must be having health/personal/computer problems. Give him a little slack on the RPOL. It doesn't take that much time to run a character there, you can post your turn in a couple minutes at work. Compare it to running a game like this one, with secret info and stuff, and the amount of work must be boggling.
> 
> Speaking of RPOL, I just won my first match! The proving grounds is so much better than Valhalla, in my opinion. The match actually lasted 5 rounds! It would have lasted longer, but my opponent conceded when he got shoved through the prismatic wall.




i'm about ready to submit my character over there too.  looks good.


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## seasong (Sep 10, 2003)

Crud, I am neglecting to post again.

I apologize for not letting y'all know - I have not had the time to do anything the past few days, and work has been rough again. It is one of the disadvantages of working with an end customer for a manufacturer, that some weeks are just hideous, and other weeks there's nothing to do.

Anyway, as soon as I can get the sit down time to type up individual e-mails, I will. In the meantime, since the public posts don't have everything, if there's something you *need* to know, send me an e-mail Q. I should have 30 mins around 4pm this afternoon (CST), and I'll try to dash off some responses on the secret stuff .

On an off-topic, looks like there's no Instant Reply anymore. Damn. That was a real time saver, especially with having to re-log-in every five minutes.

-seasong


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## seasong (Sep 10, 2003)

Re: RPOL quick answer: I don't. That's why I haven't been fighting over there while ignoring over here.

With that said, Rpomani's moves are mostly cut-n-paste. He doesn't have a lot of tricks, and I have a pre-formatted post for every one of them. It's one of the two reasons I'm getting pasted with him .

If anyone wants to post their characters at RPOL in this thread, I'd love to put some names to names. It looks like H.G. folks are kicking some arse, and I'd love to know for sure.

-seasong


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## Jeremy (Sep 10, 2003)

Luo the Nerfed, Raz the Screwed, and Verilex the Damn-I-Need-+10-More-to-Init.  

At least I think those are their names.  Luo may need to be renamed again after the Maze match.  There is little to nothing he can do on that map.  Needless to say, I had no say in what map or who was fighting in the match.    I liked it better while Odin was away.  At least DMwaV discusses things with you before making changes.  If I can get some free time, I'll be over in the Proving Grounds too.

Oh, and I concur, I have no time lately but am able to maintain 3 people's matches for the same reason Seasong is, you just copy and paste, click dice roller and roll a few, and hit post.  It takes only a couple seconds and it's something entertaining and easy to do between projects at work.


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## seasong (Sep 10, 2003)

Jeremy: How did I know you were Luo?

He _needed_ nerfing - has anyone other than Rpomani even given him pause? 

-seasong


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## cool hand luke (Sep 10, 2003)

seasong said:
			
		

> Jeremy: How did I know you were Luo?
> 
> He _needed_ nerfing - has anyone other than Rpomani even given him pause?
> 
> -seasong





I'm about to start in the proving grounds if anyone wants an easy victory.


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## seasong (Sep 10, 2003)

I dearly want to play in the Proving Grounds, but I just don't have the time to build the character right now.

But I will. Oh, yes indeed, I will .


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## Jeremy (Sep 10, 2003)

If you say so.  Milo, Oskar, Kili, Atherias, and Rpomani all nearly beat him.  All but Oskar required pretty extensive tactics between posts and a lot of thought.  And Iuchi handed him his ass on a platter.  Beat him in everything he's good at.  Init, attack rolls, damage, ride skill, range.  And no offense to Iuchi or DMwaV who are the main reason I'm still over there, but Iuchi didn't get nerfed, Iuchi is now employing bits of Luo's build.

So it couldn't have been that bad.  Ugh.  Touchy subject for me right now.  The editing of my character sheet for me without my knowledge or permission because I was doing well within the established rules of the game angered me.

Well that and the fact excelling within the established rules is not the objective, strong legal builds and effective tactics with the goal of victory in battle is not the objective; the objective is to rock the boat as little as possible, fit the mold, and take what scraps you are allowed.

Lose and everything is hunky dorie.  Win and you are unbalanced, in need of nerfing, the rules that you generated your character around that were approved will be altered so that others can profit by them and you will be forbidden them, and after everyone is done figuring out precisely what the best parts of your build are either by asking repeatedly or posting over here, they will then deride you character while adopting his strengths into their own.

Yeah.  That's got my goat.  Don't do too well.  It's not fair to use the approved rules in a creative manner to win.

Ah never mind.  This isn't even a good rant that is blowing off steam.  It's just a bunch of wasted time and a side track to further delay this game.  It's not like it'll ever change.  Whoever excels at anything will always be pulled back down.


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## seasong (Sep 11, 2003)

Jeremy said:
			
		

> If you say so.  Milo, Oskar, Kili, Atherias, and Rpomani all nearly beat him.



Actually, I spoke without having checked those boards for several days. Apologies for that - at the point that I'd read up to, you'd made a first round mess of everyone you'd fought, except Rpomani, who managed to hold you off for precious seconds before you kicked his butt .



> So it couldn't have been that bad.  Ugh.  Touchy subject for me right now.  The editing of my character sheet for me without my knowledge or permission because I was doing well within the established rules of the game angered me.



Wasn't aware of this, either. Rpomani hasn't been nerfed, and I think he should be, so I thought strong builds were encouraged (the fact that I can't _play_ him to save my life should not be taken to mean that the build is not broken).

On the other hand... stand proud . Skimming the past few days, it looks like folks from Hethas' Gambit (and you in particular) have managed to approximately _double_ the number of fight-specific house rules, and that's not counting the older house rules which were modified because of you .

Damn kids .


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## seasong (Sep 11, 2003)

Also, hoping to have time this afternoon. I may not get everyone's emails out, but I should get some of them, and tomorrow morning the office will be empty, so I should have some time to finish then.


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## reapersaurus (Sep 11, 2003)

Jeremy, if it means anything, I read your post with rapt attention, and am glad you got across your frustration.
As I mentioned in our email, it certainly cements my decision not to bother with Valhalla.


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## seasong (Sep 12, 2003)

Quick note: got out Number47, reapersaurus, Saepiroth, JDragon, Jeremy. Y'all let me know if you did or didn't get it.

I'll try to get the rest out at lunch.

-seasong


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## seasong (Sep 12, 2003)

Just noticed we're at 400+ posts. The new thread.


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## reiella (Sep 14, 2003)

And I'll go ahead and issue the last word.


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