# Heroes Season 1(#11)---12/04/06-'FALLOUT' Mid-Season Cliffhanger



## Truth Seeker (Dec 4, 2006)

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*"FALLOUT"*​




*Star*:  *Hayden Panettiere (Claire Bennet),  Adrian Pasdar (Nathan Petrelli),  Tawny Cypress (Simone Deveraux),  Noah Gray-Cabey (Micah Sanders),  Santiago Cabrera (Isaac Mendez),  Sendhil Ramamurthy (Mohinder Suresh),  Milo Ventimiglia (Peter Petrelli),  Masi Oka (Hiro Nakamura),  Leonard Roberts (D.L. Hawkins),  Greg Grunberg (Matt Parkman),  Jack Coleman (Mr. Bennet / HRG),  Ali Larter (Niki Sanders) * 

Recurring Role: * James Kyson Lee (Ando Masahashi)* 

Guest Star:  *Clea DuVall (F.B.I. Agent Audrey Hanson),  Ashley Crow (Sandra Bennet),  Jimmy Jean-Louis (Haitian),  Jack Coleman (Horn-Rimmed Glasses/Mr. Bennet),  Thomas Dekker (Zach),  Zachary Quinto (Sylar/Gabriel Gray),  Nora Zehetner (Eden McCain)  * 

The recent tragedy weighs down on the heroes and changes their relationships with one another while they continue to learn shocking details about the upcoming nuclear-level disaster in Issac's painting. Peter's in trouble. HRG finds another hero to pull into his web. A new lead is pursued in the hunt for Sylar by Agent Audrey Hanson and Matt. After Niki learns of Jessica's recent actions she must make a difficult decision to keep her family safe. Mohinder takes new steps toward his recently chosen path. A familial bond is revealed. We will learn much more about Sprague, a hero with radative abilities. Isaac latest work of art details major implications for the future actions of a certain hero. Someone dies.​
Just watch it...nuff said.

And yes, there are two shots of the same actress, who is playing *2 * different characters.

And please forgive the crazy setup...it just came out that way.


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## Shalimar (Dec 4, 2006)

Make my Heros thread Truth Seeker's.  Major effort, and it looks great.


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## mmu1 (Dec 4, 2006)

Well, I think all that effort means this deserves a bump... Can't wait to catch this one. Though I am dreading the wait for new episodes to start airing again. Hopefully _Rome_ can help tide me over...


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## Flexor the Mighty! (Dec 4, 2006)

How long is the break gonna be?


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## Taelorn76 (Dec 4, 2006)

Most likely until Feb sweeps


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## dravot (Dec 5, 2006)

Taelorn76 said:
			
		

> Most likely until Feb sweeps




Wikipedia shows that the next episode is January 22nd.


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## Shalimar (Dec 5, 2006)

dravot said:
			
		

> Wikipedia shows that the next episode is January 22nd.




Depressing considering how good this episode is so far.


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## Flexor the Mighty! (Dec 5, 2006)

This show just has too many characters.   It's good, and I enjoy it regardless, but the cast is too large.


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## Taelorn76 (Dec 5, 2006)

Well now we know that Sylar has others powers as well. I wonder what they are?


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## DonTadow (Dec 5, 2006)

Nice episode. I love how Peter's the guy whose suppose to blow up new york. Has he ever had a dream that didnt come true?  We know hiro can change things, and the painter can change things but can peter change his own visions. 

And the hatian spoke...too much to comprehend right now.


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## Tokiwong (Dec 5, 2006)

Hiro really needs to get that sword, even I think it is totally cliche 

This show is excellent.


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## Truth Seeker (Dec 5, 2006)

No way... 



			
				Taelorn76 said:
			
		

> Well now we know that Sylar has others powers as well. I wonder what they are?


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## Crothian (Dec 5, 2006)

Not bad, but the reveals and cliffhangers were not all that good.  The cast is too big.  I also don't like to see people die for soing something stupid.  The Hatian though we learned a lot about surpisingly.  I liked that Niki turned herself in.  Syler just isn't that good of a character.  He is not that interesting and I tire of bad guys that are near invincible.  

Still, can't wait till the 22nd of January.


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## Flexor the Mighty! (Dec 5, 2006)

Crothian said:
			
		

> Not bad, but the reveals and cliffhangers were not all that good.  The cast is too big.  I also don't like to see people die for soing something stupid.  The Hatian though we learned a lot about surpisingly.  I liked that Niki turned herself in.  Syler just isn't that good of a character.  He is not that interesting and I tire of bad guys that are near invincible.
> 
> Still, can't wait till the 22nd of January.




I agree about the cast.  There are just too many characters and I just dislike Nikki and her plot.

I guess Syler was able to TK since the Haitian wasn't there to stop him?  I wonder what the secret he was talking about was?


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## DonTadow (Dec 5, 2006)

i disagree about the cast being too large. Doesnt seem any larger than lost and al lthe charachters seem to have meat on them. 

Can't really say there's an underdeveloped charachter on the show.


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## Tokiwong (Dec 5, 2006)

DonTadow said:
			
		

> i disagree about the cast being too large. Doesnt seem any larger than lost and al lthe charachters seem to have meat on them.
> 
> Can't really say there's an underdeveloped charachter on the show.



 I too enjoy the whole cast, Hiro is obviously a fan fave, but I really likethe Nikki plot and Claire's story is well done.


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## Kaodi (Dec 5, 2006)

Makes me wonder if at some deeper level, Peter's ability is to connect, not just copy. He connects to his brother during the car crash, and apparently now he connects to his future self. Apparently though, copying nuclear guys powers... not such a bright idea, or rather, a very, VERY, bright idea!

Anyway, crazy government types.

Also, I think the Haitian is becoming an even more interesting character... but why do we have to wait until the 22nd of January, damnit? WHY?!


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## The Grumpy Celt (Dec 5, 2006)

Well, so much for the “this room turns off your powers” bit. Or perhaps Daddy Bennett has a power – the ability to shut of the powers of others, if he’s concentrating on it. That would explain Sylar’s inability to harm him but Petrelli’s ability to fly away.

Good to see Niki asserting herself and making a sacrifice.

Maybe Michael stands too close to Radiation Man and can’t quite get a handle on it. And why is he sick now?

It was funny, last week Hiro worried about going back too far and being eaten by a T-Rex. It appears he is at least going to encounter one. And the throw away joke about stepping on a bug was made me laugh out loud. Hiro is the funniest character in the show.

Well, Haitian Guy can talk. It comes down, then, to whom we distrust more… Haitian Guy or Daddy Bennett. That said, it would have been simpler to kill the Goth Kid rather than wipe his memories and the failure to do so reveals Daddy Bennett’s group to be logistically sloppy and incapable of making tough moral decisions.

Sylar, owing to choices made during casting, scripting writing and directing, got a lot less interesting once we saw his face and he started talking.

To whom does Daddy Bennett answer? Personally, I think it is the Cylons. Or the Hanso Foundation.


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## Just_Hal (Dec 5, 2006)

DonTadow said:
			
		

> i disagree about the cast being too large. Doesnt seem any larger than lost and al lthe charachters seem to have meat on them.
> 
> Can't really say there's an underdeveloped charachter on the show.





Agreed, Lost has too many and you don't see soem for weeks but I never feel that way about Heroes.

So is Peter ill (like fever etc?) what up with pale coughing Peter?


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## Taelorn76 (Dec 5, 2006)

Truth Seeker said:
			
		

> No way...




Should I take that as sarcasm?

Because I was being serious. I wonder what other powers he has taken.


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## BrooklynKnight (Dec 5, 2006)

I loved it when Hiro said "Great SCOTT" when he called himself in Japan in last weeks episode. 

Really good episode....much to ponder!


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## dravot (Dec 5, 2006)

The Grumpy Celt said:
			
		

> To whom does Daddy Bennett answer? Personally, I think it is the Cylons. Or the Hanso Foundation.




The Cylons run the Hanso Foundation.  Anyone can see that.


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## Fast Learner (Dec 5, 2006)

The Grumpy Celt said:
			
		

> That said, it would have been simpler to kill the Goth Kid rather than wipe his memories and the failure to do so reveals Daddy Bennett’s group to be logistically sloppy and incapable of making tough moral decisions.



Au contraire, it reveals that they're more moral than they might otherwise be thought to be. It makes them relative good guys.

I also have no problem following the characters or enjoying their stories. What exactly is the problem with "too many characters"? Are they confusing? Do you feel folks aren't getting enough screen time or focus? I don't get it.


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## Taelorn76 (Dec 5, 2006)

The Grumpy Celt said:
			
		

> That said, it would have been simpler to kill the Goth Kid rather than wipe his memories and the failure to do so reveals Daddy Bennett’s group to be logistically sloppy and incapable of making tough moral decisions.




Don't forget Mr. Bennett already had HG planted in his home when Clair called him all freaked out. He was going to wipe her mind before he knew she had found out the others minds had been wiped.


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## Taelorn76 (Dec 5, 2006)

DonTadow said:
			
		

> Nice episode. I love how Peter's the guy whose suppose to blow up new york. Has he ever had a dream that didnt come true?  We know hiro can change things, and the painter can change things but can peter change his own visions.




I think the only way Peter can Change this particular destiny is to learn how to turn on/off his power. You saw when Matt walked in the room he immediately got Matt's headache. 

BTW the whole feedback think when Matt tried to read Peter mind was a nice touch


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## BRP2 (Dec 5, 2006)

> Sylar, owing to choices made during casting, scripting writing and directing, got a lot less interesting once we saw his face and he started talking.




I disagree ;o I adore Sylar more now that he has been unmasked, especially before he got his powers, and it seems that he has naturally become insane(well, more insane) because of all the DNA he is taking in. Personally, I think he could have broken out of there anytime he wanted, but he was waiting until Eden was alone because he wanted that power(possibly needed some of his own questions answered first). He seems to be a lot smarter than people tend to think. And he will probably become very underrated. I really like what he stands for and his batshit craziness. How do you correctly cast a psyco anyway? The whole point is that he is an average nobody, but he has gained power to act on his deepest desires.

I'm happy DL, Matt, and Issac didn't die, they are all potentially good characters but they are not getting as much development as they should.


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## Sir Brennen (Dec 5, 2006)

BRP2 said:
			
		

> Personally, I think he could have broken out of there anytime he wanted, but he was waiting until Eden was alone because he wanted that power(possibly needed some of his own questions answered first).



Nope. Haitian Guy is the power surpressor, I think that's clear. And while he was off not-mind-wiping Claire, Sylar simply used his TK power in self-defense, as a reflex, not neccessarily knowing he could at the moment. Eden offing herself to prevent him from getting her power was a nice touch.


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## Knightfall (Dec 5, 2006)

It was a great episode, although I think started out a bit slow. Losing Eden sucks. I really like that character.

Now all I need is the next graphic novel. Hurry up NBC!


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## Wycen (Dec 5, 2006)

Nikki, the kid and the dad part was drifting too far from the rest, but now I suppose if she's arrested and the MIB gets her, she'll finally be part of the rest of the crew.

I was kinda thinking the artist would die, or Ando, they seemed to be "useless" to the story at this point.  Ando is just a sidekick and the artist already revealed the threat and "save the cheerleader, save the world" schtick.


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## Truth Seeker (Dec 5, 2006)

DAMN!!!! Frellin' damn...-set Calendar remainder for January 22-

Comments later in the day.

Damn!!!!


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## Hand of Evil (Dec 5, 2006)

I think Sylar figured out how they were surpressing his power in the holding cell and 'fixed' it - its his power.  

Hiro: I have to find that sword!


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## Kaodi (Dec 5, 2006)

Who is to say though that Ando doesn't have a power, or that he is really a Japanese government agent?

I mean, look at memory girl. There would be absolutely no way to tell someone had a power like that unless you could read minds, or some variation there of. Also, not everyones powers manifest at the same time. 

I mean, Ando and Mr. Bennet are the only two major characters that haven't been revealed to have powers yet, aren't they? Bennet has an angle, but it we'll have to wait and see if Ando is more than he appears as well.


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## Taelorn76 (Dec 5, 2006)

Hand of Evil said:
			
		

> I think Sylar figured out how they were surpressing his power in the holding cell and 'fixed' it - its his power.
> 
> Hiro: I have to find that sword!




I agree with Sir Brennen, the HG was blocking Sylars powers while he was there. So know we know the HG possibly has two powers. Power blocking and mind wiping.


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## mmu1 (Dec 5, 2006)

I don't think HG was the one blocking Sylar, for several reasons:

1. I don't think there's any proof that HG can actually nullify powers - I think he can only do telepathy and memory modification. If he was a power blocker, Nathan should not have been able to escape.

2. Mr. Bennett would _never_ set up a prison that'd rely on the HG to keep Sylar - the man who wants to kill his daughter - contained, then take HG with him and leave Sylar unattended. No way.

3. It's completely impractical as a method of holding someone 24/7. 

I think the "power blocker" is a technological solution, and that's the reason why that cell looks so bunker-like. Eden simply turned it off before coming in, in order to make sure _her_ power was working when she was going to tell Sylar to kill himself.

On another note... It looks like it's pretty clear now that Sylar does not, in fact, eat brains - he simply examines them to see what makes them tick, then modifies his own DNA using his basic power.


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## Grymar (Dec 5, 2006)

mmu1 said:
			
		

> I think the "power blocker" is a technological solution, and that's the reason why that cell looks so bunker-like. Eden simply turned it off before coming in, in order to make sure _her_ power was working when she was going to tell Sylar to kill himself.




THAT makes sense.  Well thought out.  

LOVED the episode.  I actually had to pause the show for a minute when I saw Hiro and the T-rex so I could giggle like a little girl.

And Peter is the bomb?  Literally?  And he needs to watch out...the lovey dovey eyes Clair was giving him is a big problem...jail bait!

Although here is a really perverted thought about her...with her healing powers is she forever a virgin?


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## Flexor the Mighty! (Dec 5, 2006)

Fast Learner said:
			
		

> I also have no problem following the characters or enjoying their stories. What exactly is the problem with "too many characters"? Are they confusing? Do you feel folks aren't getting enough screen time or focus? I don't get it.




That is my feeling, there isn't enough time to spend on the characters.


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## Flexor the Mighty! (Dec 5, 2006)

mmu1 said:
			
		

> I don't think HG was the one blocking Sylar, for several reasons:
> 
> 1. I don't think there's any proof that HG can actually nullify powers - I think he can only do telepathy and memory modification. If he was a power blocker, Nathan should not have been able to escape.




I think he can suppress due to his stopping the Cop's telepathy in a few different scenes.


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## Krafus (Dec 5, 2006)

Wonderful ep! In fact, I think it was my favorite so far. January 22nd seems so far away...

Anyway, about Sylar's prison, I think Eden turned off whatever mechanism was preventing powers from being used in there so that she could mind-order him to kill himself. Unfortunately, Sylar had recovered and was expecting her attack, instead of being wounded and caught off-guard (and without the Haitian guy as back-up). Oh, and does anyone else think that Sylar recovered suspiciously quickly? IIRC, Bennett mentioned that Sylar had lost a lot of blood, but when Eden came he seemed fully recovered.

Some people might find this curious, but one of my two favorite parts of this ep was Claire visiting Peter in his cell. I'd have been disappointed if she hadn't wanted to at least make sure her rescuer was all right. Too bad Bennett cut their conversation short.

My other favorite part was Hiro (and Ando) meeting up with Isaac, both aware that the other has special powers, and staying together for at least the lenght of the ep. And that "I need to find that sword" was just plain cool.  

OTOH, I'm getting tired of the Niki/Jessica storyline. She (and DL and their kid) feel too disconnected from the rest of the heroes and story, and N/J is my least favorite character. If there's one hero I wouldn't mind seeing eliminated, it's her.


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## Umbran (Dec 5, 2006)

mmu1 said:
			
		

> 1. I don't think there's any proof that HG can actually nullify powers - I think he can only do telepathy and memory modification. If he was a power blocker, Nathan should not have been able to escape.




Agreed - also note that Matt's telepathy does not "shut off" in the presence of the Hatian.  He gets static that he can, with a lot of effort, work through.



> I think the "power blocker" is a technological solution, and that's the reason why that cell looks so bunker-like. Eden simply turned it off before coming in, in order to make sure _her_ power was working when she was going to tell Sylar to kill himself.




Agreed.  We should not have expected that her power should work but Sylar's not.

We have seen a couple cases now where powers are not absolute - Sylar could resist Eden, and Matt could burrow through the Haitian's static...



> On another note... It looks like it's pretty clear now that Sylar does not, in fact, eat brains...




Maybe not in a literal sense, but it is still metaphorical cannibalism - killing another and taking their power into yourself.  I hope, that they never actually show Sylar acquiring a power, so that the question of mechanism is left a bit open...

And now, the question that I wonder why nobody else has asked - Why was Peter ill?


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## dravot (Dec 5, 2006)

Umbran said:
			
		

> And now, the question that I wonder why nobody else has asked - Why was Peter ill?




Great question.  I have a few possibilities, and one observation:

1) Peter has internal bleeding that didn't corrected itself before his Claire-bear powers wore off.  However, he met with Claire a 2nd time, so who knows.

2) It seems that he got sick when Evil-Dad entered the cell.  Perhaps the sickness is from something from Evil-Dad?  An interesting notion with very little to back it up.

3) It's radiation sickness, picked up from Radioactive-Ted.  Is Radioactive-Ted in the next cell over?  Did Sylar get Radioactive-Ted, and pass Ted on to Peter?

4) He's temporarily overwhelmed by absorbing all of Sylar's powers.

The observation: this gives Nathan the chance to bring Peter back to New York without Peter's permission.


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## DonTadow (Dec 5, 2006)

Just_Hal said:
			
		

> Agreed, Lost has too many and you don't see soem for weeks but I never feel that way about Heroes.
> 
> So is Peter ill (like fever etc?) what up with pale coughing Peter?



That's what I love. Whosever said sylar has lost his mystery is still caught on lost's timeline of revealing something every 30 episodes. 

We still don't know what sylar's exact power is, we know that he has an ability to "fix thing". We also don't know the other people sylar killed, I believe there are six other people, meaning he has seven powers. Right now I only know of the fix thing and the telepathy thing. 

Thanks for bringing up the fact that eden killed herself. I missed that part. I was under the impression that sylar did it on purpose.


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## DonTadow (Dec 5, 2006)

dravot said:
			
		

> Great question.  I have a few possibilities, and one observation:
> 
> 1) Peter has internal bleeding that didn't corrected itself before his Claire-bear powers wore off.  However, he met with Claire a 2nd time, so who knows.
> 
> ...



What is number 4 Alex. 
1. He's seen clair two times, that should be enough to correct himself. 
2. He was six sick before that. When he woke up from the dream? he had a cough. 
3. Possible. We assume that radioactive ted was broken out by the brotherhood, but it could have been that sylar tracked him down and took his powers off screen. 
4. This is my choice. Peter absorbed 7 powers at least at one time. The last few episodes have been silently showing the heroes limitations. Peters could very well be he is only suppose to absorb one at a time. 
5. In the vision, oddly enough, Peter didn't appear to have any one elses power, only ted's. Yet all the other heroes were near him. 
6. Why stay in the middle of the street and blow up. Why not fly away, or make yourself impervious like clair, or teleport away. 

Anyone got a feeling that their going to be fighting dinosaurs next season.


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## Krafus (Dec 5, 2006)

dravot said:
			
		

> Great question.  I have a few possibilities, and one observation:
> 
> 1) Peter has internal bleeding that didn't corrected itself before his Claire-bear powers wore off.  However, he met with Claire a 2nd time, so who knows.
> 
> ...




Number 3 is the one that makes the most sense to me (although I think they would have shown Ted if he was in a nearby cell). If it was 1 (internal bleeding), then I'd have to wonder why Peter didn't heal it when he mimicked her power after his fall, or right then and there when she visited him in his cell. Or maybe he has to consciously decide to mimic other people's power - he didn't do it in his cell because he was unaware he was seriously sick.


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## Umbran (Dec 5, 2006)

DonTadow said:
			
		

> What is number 4 Alex.
> 5. In the vision, oddly enough, Peter didn't appear to have any one elses power, only ted's. Yet all the other heroes were near him.




Didn't appear to have?  How many of the other characters appear to have their own power when it isn't operational?  You can't tell just by looking at them, you know.



> 6. Why stay in the middle of the street and blow up. Why not fly away, or make yourself impervious like clair, or teleport away.




First off, Claire is not "impervious".  In fact, she gets injured on a regular basis. She just heals up quickly. 

As to why not do other things - it is vary difficult to choose a proper course of action when you don't know what's going on.  A moment of indecision is quite normal for human beings.  Peter gets powers when he's near others, but that doesn't mean he knows how to use or control them.  That scene looked very much like him getting Radioactive Ted's power (though Ted wasn't on screen), and him not knowing how to turn the darned thing off...

Now, the real question is - where is the dream thing coming from?  Is it innate to Peter, or is he picking it up from someone else?

I am going to guess that Peter is misinterpreting - he isn't the one responsible for the Big Boom.  Why?  Because of the empty cars.  Aside from the heroes and a couple non-powered attendants, the streets were packed with abandoned cars - people had already been evacuated, meaning there was a threat there before Peter...



> nyone got a feeling that their going to be fighting dinosaurs next season.




Woohoo!  Hot Samurai on Dinosaur action, here we come!


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## mmu1 (Dec 5, 2006)

Umbran said:
			
		

> Maybe not in a literal sense, but it is still metaphorical cannibalism - killing another and taking their power into yourself.  I hope, that they never actually show Sylar acquiring a power, so that the question of mechanism is left a bit open...




Well, yeah - but it's not like anyone was questioning that. 

Though I had said before that I believed Sylar would simply use his powers to absorb those of others, and the head-cutting was just a sideshow... and I'm just happy to see my pet theory gaining credibility. 

Not that there aren't holes in it, still... If Sylar can modify his own DNA, and that's how he absorbs those powers (I'm basing this on what Bennet had said to Sylar), then why would he need to examine the brains? You'd think any cell would do... Unless he modifies his genes to get the biological means to use the power, and examines the brain to gain insight into what it is and how it works. On the other hand, genetics pretty clearly work just a _little_ differently in the "Heroes" world than in our own, and I probably should stick to my established policy of not overthinking it...


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## mmu1 (Dec 5, 2006)

Umbran said:
			
		

> As to why not do other things - it is vary difficult to choose a proper course of action when you don't know what's going on.  A moment of indecision is quite normal for human beings.  Peter gets powers when he's near others, but that doesn't mean he knows how to use or control them.  That scene looked very much like him getting Radioactive Ted's power (though Ted wasn't on screen), and him not knowing how to turn the darned thing off...




That whole scene was like a dream - and as such, like many dreams, symbolic and out of his conscious control.

You've got Claire in her cheerleader uniform, Mohinder in a cab, Matt - who's been suspended from the force - running around Manhattan in an LA cop's uniform... None of it is necessarily an accurate and literal representation of reality (past or present) any more than his dream of talking to his dying patient and then flying out the window was. It's just a confused, dream-like message.

The fact the city was empty doesn't mean it was evacuated, either - it can very well just be a way of (either on the part of the director, or Peter's subconscious mind) eliminating the background clutter and saying "These are the people who are going to be important."

Or the producers didn't feel like dealing with huge amounts of extras when they didn't need to.


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## Taelorn76 (Dec 5, 2006)

mmu1 said:
			
		

> Well, yeah - but it's not like anyone was questioning that.
> 
> Though I had said before that I believed Sylar would simply use his powers to absorb those of others, and the head-cutting was just a sideshow... and I'm just happy to see my pet theory gaining credibility.
> 
> Not that there aren't holes in it, still... If Sylar can modify his own DNA, and that's how he absorbs those powers (I'm basing this on what Bennet had said to Sylar), then why would he need to examine the brains? You'd think any cell would do... Unless he modifies his genes to get the biological means to use the power, and examines the brain to gain insight into what it is and how it works. On the other hand, genetics pretty clearly work just a _little_ differently in the "Heroes" world than in our own, and I probably should stick to my established policy of not overthinking it...




If you remember what Dr. Suresh said last week about the brain being the part of the body that controled every thing. I think you are on to some thing that Sylar examines their brains to one see what is different in them to give them their power(s), and two learn from their brains how to control said powers.


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## Umbran (Dec 5, 2006)

mmu1 said:
			
		

> That whole scene was like a dream - and as such, like many dreams, symbolic and out of his conscious control.
> 
> You've got Claire in her cheerleader uniform, Mohinder in a cab, Matt - who's been suspended from the force - running around Manhattan in an LA cop's uniform...




Why would he put Matt in an LA cop's uniform, when he met Matt in Texas, with an FBI agent?  In terms of subconscious imagry that one doesn't seem reasonable.  And while Peter has met Ando, right now I can only recall him seeing _future_ Hiro.  Why would Peter's subconscious cast these people in ways he's never seen them before?  And, I don't recall Peter ever seeing Issac's painting of the Exploding Man.  Why dream of that same image?

Peter is getting information from somewhere.  While some of it may not be literal, there's no reason to take some bits of the information over other bits.


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## The Grumpy Celt (Dec 5, 2006)

The dream is not based on what Peter knowsn, but images that fall into his brain from the future. 

As for the episode, I felt it was a weak cliff hanger.

And Bennett is not as smart as he thinks. Who do you trust less, him or Haitian Guy?

Also, I did not write I thought Sylar lost his mystery - what ever that means - but that I found him less interesting once he was held in that cell, under bright lights.


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## Hand of Evil (Dec 5, 2006)

So, Peter's vision, I wonder if it was not a manifestaion of some of Sylar's power?


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## Taelorn76 (Dec 5, 2006)

Hand of Evil said:
			
		

> So, Peter's vision, I wonder if it was not a manifestaion of some of Sylar's power?





Peter was having visions before he encountered Sylar


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## Taelorn76 (Dec 5, 2006)

mmu1 said:
			
		

> That whole scene was like a dream - and as such, like many dreams, symbolic and out of his conscious control.
> 
> You've got Claire in her cheerleader uniform, Mohinder in a cab, Matt - who's been suspended from the force - running around Manhattan in an LA cop's uniform... None of it is necessarily an accurate and literal representation of reality (past or present) any more than his dream of talking to his dying patient and then flying out the window was. It's just a confused, dream-like message.
> 
> ...





IIRC Nathan was the only who didn't turn away from Peter when he was about to blow. I think that speaks volumes about Nathan's character. He is not as self absorbed and does actually care about his brother.

Also if Nathan _is_ invounerable while in flight then he could be the one to save the city by flying Peter away, or better yet standing close enough to Peter so he could fly himself away, and detinate in atmosphere.


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## Hand of Evil (Dec 5, 2006)

Taelorn76 said:
			
		

> Peter was having visions before he encountered Sylar



How could I forget about that.


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## Steel_Wind (Dec 5, 2006)

DonTadow said:
			
		

> We still don't know what sylar's exact power is, we know that he has an ability to "fix thing".




An interersting aside: is Sylar's ability to fix things? Because the "ability to fix things" seems *also* to be the power of Micah - (Nikki/Jessica's son). His manifests with electronics instead of watches...but is it any different?

Is Micah a Sylar Mk II in the making?


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## Taelorn76 (Dec 5, 2006)

Steel_Wind said:
			
		

> An interersting aside: is Sylar's ability to fix things? Because the "ability to fix things" seems *also* to be the power of Micah - (Nikki/Jessica's son). His manifests with electronics instead of watches...but is it any different?
> 
> Is Micah a Sylar Mk II in the making?




And with all the domestic violence going on between Nikki/Jessica and DL the odds are would be leaning that way (at least in real life).


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## Fast Learner (Dec 5, 2006)

Steel_Wind said:
			
		

> An interersting aside: is Sylar's ability to fix things?



No, that's not his power at all. His power is to understand how things work, and as a result, know when things are broken. When we see him in his timepiece-repair days, he can tell that Papa Suresh's watch isn't working right instantly, but he still has to mechanically take it apart and fix it.

Micah hasn't displayed an ability to tell when something's broken, just to fix something that is.


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## Flexor the Mighty! (Dec 5, 2006)

So how does he fix his brain then?


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## Hand of Evil (Dec 5, 2006)

Flexor the Mighty! said:
			
		

> So how does he fix his brain then?



That we don't know, yet.  It is possible he is able to tell what what part of the brain is being used by his victims and adjust his to perform the same task.


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## el-remmen (Dec 5, 2006)

I don't get the complaints regarding too large a cast.  

It is one of the things I love about this show.  

Plenty of threads and people and I never lose interest. 

I mean, I don't love all the characters equally, but that is true of any show.


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## Ed_Laprade (Dec 5, 2006)

So why was Peter ill? He shouldn't have been, since Claire was in his cell long enough that he should have absorbed her powers. An d he obviously doesn't have to concentrate on someone's power to use it. IIRC pretty much every time he's used a power he had no idea he was getting it from someone else. Also note that the last time he absorbed Claire's power he still had it several minutes after she ran off to get help. 

Nikki's kid. Bad writing, or direction, here. He gets slammed into a pile of rocks and looks like he's in great pain. But as soon as mommy shows up he _springs_ into her arms, all better! And he remains all better until a distraction is needed so Nikki can go turn herself in. 

Removing Zack's memory of any interaction with Claire since the sixth grade? This goes beyond bad to insane. Unless their high school is unlike any other I've ever heard of the gossip grapevine is all over the two of them being together for the past couple of weeks. That means that like *half the school* is going to be aware of his lost memory pretty soon. And to confirm it, all someone has to do is ask him the one question he can't answer. "So why did you campain so hard for Claire to win the Homecoming Queen contest?" Since his reasons were obviously inextrictably intertwined with what had been going on between the two of them, there's no way he can possibly answer that. And if HG had wiped Claire's memory she would have gotten the same deal from her friends. 

I would much rather almost any other character had been offed than Eden. To me, she was the 'nicest' of the bunch. Also the least angsty of the bunch, mostly.


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## Arnwyn (Dec 5, 2006)

A pretty good episode, IMO. A few things I was a little confused on (as per Ed Laprade's post above - removing Zack's memory so far back was kind of silly), though I generally enjoyed the episode.

But Niki's storyline continues to suck. Hard.


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## LightPhoenix (Dec 5, 2006)

I love Audrey... "I had to go through five different lawyers... but I'm here anyway."  I would love to see more of her and less of Mrs. Matt.  Audrey and Matt have great chemistry too.

So... Peter is the bomb, literally and figuratively?

Also, regarding Sylar/Eden... for one, we don't know the room blocks powers, because Eden never tried to use hers before Sylar got fed up with it.  Also, it's very important to have an intact brain, it seems - Eden blowing her brains out to prevent Sylar from getting the power seemed to freak him out.

Also, sad to see that Nora was the one with contract issues.  I liked her more and more as the show went on.  Kinda wish it was Showkiller that was offed.

Claire and Peter are very cute together.

I will never forgive Mr. Bennett for mindwiping Zach.  Boo HRG, boo!

If Peter's dreams always come true (not necessarily true) then we have at least a list of people to survive until the bomb goes off - Nikki, DL, Micah, Matt, Claire, Nathan, Hiro, Ando, and Isaac are all safe.  One interesting observation, IMO - there's only one person without powers in that group - Ando.  Does this mean he really does have a power, or that perhaps he really is a hero, even without powers?  Also, no Audrey.  Sadness.

My newest pet theory is that the Haitian can suppress powers, but if you're strong enough, you can push through.  This is recalling that HRG said Matt was farther along than they thought.


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## hafrogman (Dec 5, 2006)

LightPhoenix said:
			
		

> If Peter's dreams always come true (not necessarily true) then we have at least a list of people to survive until the bomb goes off - Nikki, DL, Micah, Matt, Claire, Nathan, Hiro, Ando, and Isaac are all safe.  One interesting observation, IMO - there's only one person without powers in that group - Ando.  Does this mean he really does have a power, or that perhaps he really is a hero, even without powers?  Also, no Audrey.  Sadness.




Simone and Mohinder were there as well, both officially unpowered.


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## Taelorn76 (Dec 5, 2006)

Arnwyn said:
			
		

> A pretty good episode, IMO. A few things I was a little confused on (as per Ed Laprade's post above - removing Zack's memory so far back was kind of silly), though I generally enjoyed the episode.
> 
> But Niki's storyline continues to suck. Hard.




I don't think his memory was wiped clean all the way back to 6th grade, that would be a little to drastic that I think even Zack would notice that he can't remember the last 6+ years of his life.

I think what he is getting at it that Claire just stopped talking to him in the 6th grade. She got in with new group of friends (the popular kids) and started ignoring and acting better than her old friends ( Zack and the misfits)


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## warlord (Dec 5, 2006)

For one thing since when did HG talk? and why hasn't Claire realized her Dad is EVIL. And for all those who are mad at HG for brianwashing Zach that was simply a set up for Claire and Peter's Buffy-Angel style romance.


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## Steve Jung (Dec 6, 2006)

Arnwyn said:
			
		

> A pretty good episode, IMO. A few things I was a little confused on (as per Ed Laprade's post above - removing Zack's memory so far back was kind of silly), though I generally enjoyed the episode.



I think Claire said something about being friends with Zack for only the past couple weeks.


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## BRP2 (Dec 6, 2006)

Zack is gay, as in a homosexual, I'm not insulting him, I don't think he would have become a problem between Peter and Claire.

Sylar seems smart enough to wait until Eden is alone. I think a lot of people are underestimating him, and he might be super intelligent now that he has Charley's brainpower.

If his powers don't work in the cell, then why was he able to read how Mr. Brennet works? ;p

Anyway, I respect Eden a lot. She went out bravely, killing herself so Sylar couldn't get what he wanted.

Finally, something tells me that Peter is getting a visit from the Indian boy, but that is just a guess with no basis really.


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## dravot (Dec 6, 2006)

BRP2 said:
			
		

> Mr. Brennet




Bennet


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## Taelorn76 (Dec 6, 2006)

BRP2 said:
			
		

> Sylar seems smart enough to wait until Eden is alone. I think a lot of people are underestimating him, and he might be super intelligent now that he has Charley's brainpower.




Actually that hits on something that I have a question about. When Hiro went back in time and tried to save Charlie she told him she had a brain tumor and as going to die from it. Did Sylar get to her or did she die from the tumor. Possibly Hiro could go back and change events in the past but if she was supposed to die the destiny, fate whatever you wanna call it found another way for her to die.

So do we know if Sylar gets her again?


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## dravot (Dec 6, 2006)

Taelorn76 said:
			
		

> Actually that hits on something that I have a question about. When Hiro went back in time and tried to save Charlie she told him she had a brain tumor and as going to die from it. Did Sylar get to her or did she die from the tumor. Possibly Hiro could go back and change events in the past but if she was supposed to die the destiny, fate whatever you wanna call it found another way for her to die.
> 
> So do we know if Sylar gets her again?




Sylar got her anyway.  They were very clever about this.  We learned the news when Mohinder was on the phone with the FBI, mentioning the guy in LA dying 9 days ago, and Charlie dying 2 days ago. 

Very casually slipped into the storyline.


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## Phoenix8008 (Dec 6, 2006)

HOLY %#@$ !!!

Just read the newest online graphic novel at NBC.COM and _Sylar didn't get away!_ Mr. Bennet and the HG showed up just in time to pump him full of tranq darts and put him down. That should prove to be interesting when he awakens.

I hadn't caught it that Eden possible turned off the power nuetralizer when she went in the cell. As for Peter's illness, I'm not sure. I lean towards absorbing too many powers (too much power??).

Now what about the first dream where his visiting brother turned into Sylar? WHat was that about? And where are these dreams coming from. Could be the Indian boy Mohinder found I guess. Although he's nowhere close, maybe dreams don't have a short proximity. The kid did say that people find him when they have questions they need answered. Although he always showed up visually in Mo's dreams.

As for the vision at the end...WOW. So is Peter dead now (again)? I didn't even catch that Eden offing herself would count as the "one Hero dying" that was in all the commercials for this episode. At the end, I thought it was Peter who was going to stay dead. I guess he probably would choose self sacrifice over being the Nuke in New York though.


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## Knightfall (Dec 6, 2006)

Phoenix8008 said:
			
		

> HOLY %#@$ !!!
> 
> Just read the newest online graphic novel at NBC.COM and _Sylar didn't get away!_ Mr. Bennet and the HG showed up just in time to pump him full of tranq darts and put him down. That should prove to be interesting when he awakens.



Yeah, I just read that myself. I find it interesting that something so important happened off-screen. Eden's sacrifice means even more now.

She died a 'true' Hero! 

KF72


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## Seonaid (Dec 6, 2006)

Knightfall1972 said:
			
		

> I find it interesting that something so important happened off-screen.



Grrr . . . That's what I'm sayin'!


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## John Crichton (Dec 6, 2006)

Knightfall1972 said:
			
		

> Yeah, I just read that myself. I find it interesting that something so important happened off-screen. Eden's sacrifice means even more now.



If it really is that important I'm sure they will show either the result or it happening at the start of the next half of the season.


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## Taelorn76 (Dec 6, 2006)

Knightfall1972 said:
			
		

> Yeah, I just read that myself. I find it interesting that something so important happened off-screen. Eden's sacrifice means even more now.
> 
> She died a 'true' Hero!
> 
> KF72




That does seem to be a pretty significant not to have aired. Has there ever been a scene in the graphic novel that has then made it air?


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## DonTadow (Dec 6, 2006)

Arnwyn said:
			
		

> A pretty good episode, IMO. A few things I was a little confused on (as per Ed Laprade's post above - removing Zack's memory so far back was kind of silly), though I generally enjoyed the episode.
> 
> But Niki's storyline continues to suck. Hard.



I don't think he erased his memory that far back. 

Claire began befriending Zack a few weeks ago to video tape her exploits. Up until then, it was inferred that she would just pass over him as if he didn't exist. The same way popular kids do nerds in HS. This is also infired in the episode a couple weeks ago when she was with the popular cheerleaders. I don't think thats a stretch of memory at all. 

Now everyone who saw them together, all the nerds who voted for her, the homecoming, all that stuff, now that's going to be hard to erase, but not inexplainable. Teenagers are wierd.


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## Henry (Dec 6, 2006)

Taelorn76 said:
			
		

> That does seem to be a pretty significant not to have aired. Has there ever been a scene in the graphic novel that has then made it air?




Actually, several of the graphic novel incidents haven't really make sense in context of the show_ (Claire pulling Quarterback-rapist out of the burning car and him being conscious enough to ask "what are you?", Nathan doing the whole "flying into burning building publically to rescue a baby", and even this week's note of Mr. Bennet going to visit the dead cheerleader's father. He's no cop; won't the cops be suspicious when they go do their job, to notify next of kin, and he doesn't freaking remember his daughter? And most importantly, why wasn't Audrey SHOOTING AN INNOCENT even mentioned by Matt or others? It's almost like... duh!duh!duh! .... it didn't even happen!)_. For this reason, the events in the graphic novel MAY not hold continuity with the TV show. It COULD, and we could see Sylar still imprisoned in Jan 22, but it's also possible the show opens with him on the run like he had just escaped from Bennet's clutches.


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## DonTadow (Dec 6, 2006)

Phoenix8008 said:
			
		

> I hadn't caught it that Eden possible turned off the power nuetralizer when she went in the cell. As for Peter's illness, I'm not sure. I lean towards absorbing too many powers (too much power??).



Something you said struck me. They have been playing up that the powers are mutations of the brain. Maybe peter isn't just absorbing the power, but the mutation as well. If sylar's killed a half dozen people, that's a half dozen mutations to his brain made all at once that you are not used to.  

The only question is, why wasn't sylar sick. Is it because he's used to it?


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## dravot (Dec 6, 2006)

DonTadow said:
			
		

> Something you said struck me. They have been playing up that the powers are mutations of the brain. Maybe peter isn't just absorbing the power, but the mutation as well. If sylar's killed a half dozen people, that's a half dozen mutations to his brain made all at once that you are not used to.
> 
> The only question is, why wasn't sylar sick. Is it because he's used to it?




Maybe it's because he's assimilated those powers one at a time.

Peter assimilated Claire's power, Matt's power and all of Sylar's powers, all in less than 1 day.


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## Arnwyn (Dec 6, 2006)

Steve Jung said:
			
		

> I think Claire said something about being friends with Zack for only the past couple weeks.



Yeah, I think you're right. That sounds a lot better.


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## Sir Brennen (Dec 6, 2006)

dravot said:
			
		

> Peter assimilated Claire's power, Matt's power and all of Sylar's powers, all in less than 1 day.



Not to mention the nice "mind-reading feedback" that happened when Matt tried to read Pete's mind.

"You know that I know that you know that I know that..."


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## LightPhoenix (Dec 6, 2006)

hafrogman said:
			
		

> Simone and Mohinder were there as well, both officially unpowered.




Doh!  How could I forget!  Isaac was grabbing Simone (probably they're getting back together), so I shouldn't have missed her.  Moho was kinda by himself, so I can kinda see that.

The survivor list expands!


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## Ed_Laprade (Dec 6, 2006)

Darn, I had a great rant all lined up about Claire's dad. Then I finally figured out his real motivation regarding Claire Bear. When he says that he's trying to protect her, what he *means* is that he's trying to protect his image of her as his Little Girl. Never mind that it's a hopeless cause, his brain's shut off where she's concerned. Otherwise he'd have to ask himself what her next logical step would be once she lost her memory of what she's been doing about her power for the past couple of weeks. Let's see: she's been set back emotionally and knowledgably (sp?) to where she started having Zack videotaping her trying to kill herself, etc. So what's she likely to do now? How's about Start All Over Again? 

But, thanks to the talkative HG, that won't happen now.


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## The Grumpy Celt (Dec 6, 2006)

Another factor to consider is the nature of Peter's ability to mimic other powers. Is it a RAM thing, where it is gone, or does he have some kind of superpower cache file in his brain, that can allow him to tap into other powers, even if the person is not around.

So maybe he gets close to Radiation Man, and later accidently accesses those powers via his cache file...


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## atom crash (Dec 6, 2006)

I'm not convinced that Peter is the monster that destroys New York. I think he was seeing a vision of the future, but his brain put him into the picture in order to help him make sense of what was happening. 

Much like he had a dream that connected him to when Simone's father died (though he wasn't really there when it happened) and when Nathan first experienced his power of flight (again, he wasn't really there for that either), his vision connects him to the time and place when the explosion happens, but perhaps he's just seeing through the eyes of someone else. Maybe it's Ted Sprague. Or maybe it's Sylar, who will absorb Ted's power in the future. 

Here's just a couple things to ponder: Peter's interaction with future Hiro would have been different if Hiro knew that Peter was the cause of the explosion. Also, Peter was standing in the middle of all those heroes in his vision when he exploded, yet he didn't seem to be using any of their powers at the time. If he knew he was about to explode, he could have always tried using someone else's power to minimize the damage done (fly away like Nathan, sink into the ground like DL, teleport away like Hiro).

Or, an alternate theory that just occurred to me: perhaps the nuclear reaction is what happens when Peter gets near too many superpowers at one time.


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## BRP2 (Dec 6, 2006)

> (Claire pulling Quarterback-rapist out of the burning car and him being conscious enough to ask "what are you?", Nathan doing the whole "flying into burning building publically to rescue a baby", and even this week's note of Mr. Bennet going to visit the dead cheerleader's father. He's no cop; won't the cops be suspicious when they go do their job, to notify next of kin, and he doesn't freaking remember his daughter? And most importantly, why wasn't Audrey SHOOTING AN INNOCENT even mentioned by Matt or others? It's almost like... duh!duh!duh! .... it didn't even happen!).




Nothing in the show says the quarterback didn't know about her power, he even called her a monster didn't he? Nathan didn't "publically" fly in the building, no one saw him. I don't understand the last two.

A friend of mine mentioned a theory of his. At the end, it's possible that Nathan grabs Peter and flies high in the sky, preventing Peter from blowing up New York, but sacrificing himself. Since the person who originally has the nuclear powers doesn't get harmed by his own work, Peter should be just fine and maybe could fly down even, but there would be a lot of sadness at the cost of Nathan's life.


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## Taelorn76 (Dec 6, 2006)

BRP2 said:
			
		

> Nothing in the show says the quarterback didn't know about her power, he even called her a monster didn't he? Nathan didn't "publically" fly in the building, no one saw him. I don't understand the last two.




The person you quoted was talking about the online graphic novel. That is where all that stuff has happened.



			
				BRP2 said:
			
		

> A friend of mine mentioned a theory of his. At the end, it's possible that Nathan grabs Peter and flies high in the sky, preventing Peter from blowing up New York, but sacrificing himself. Since the person who originally has the nuclear powers doesn't get harmed by his own work, Peter should be just fine and maybe could fly down even, but there would be a lot of sadness at the cost of Nathan's life.




I mention that a several posts back in this thread, but to take that a bit further also Peter could mimic Nathan's flight and fly himself away.


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## BRP2 (Dec 7, 2006)

Taelorn76 said:
			
		

> The person you quoted was talking about the online graphic novel. That is where all that stuff has happened.
> 
> 
> 
> I mention that a several posts back in this thread, but to take that a bit further also Peter could mimic Nathan's flight and fly himself away.





Hmm, yeah, I know, so was I. (and I too mentioned Peter could fly himself down, but I didn't see you post theory earlier)


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## Fast Learner (Dec 7, 2006)

Henry said:
			
		

> Actually, several of the graphic novel incidents haven't really make sense in context of the show
> 
> --snip--
> 
> this week's note of Mr. Bennet going to visit the dead cheerleader's father. He's no cop; won't the cops be suspicious when they go do their job, to notify next of kin, and he doesn't freaking remember his daughter?



That wasn't the cheerleader's dad, that was Eden's dad. The cops don't know she's dead, nor will they ever find out.


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## Taelorn76 (Dec 7, 2006)

BRP2 said:
			
		

> Hmm, yeah, I know, so was I. (and I too mentioned Peter could fly himself down, but I didn't see you post theory earlier)




Sorry, I must have misread the 1st part of your post, sounded like you were saying it didn't happen in the show. And totally missed the last part about Pete flying himself down.


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## Flexor the Mighty! (Dec 7, 2006)

Arnwyn said:
			
		

> But Niki's storyline continues to suck. Hard.




I agree.  I don't really care about her storyline or any of the characters in it.


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## LightPhoenix (Dec 10, 2006)

Something really got me after thinking over Claire's story.  Okay, so they mind-wiped Zach completely.  What about all the other people who must have realized that they were friends?  Was the whole school mind-wiped?  Someone would have to realize something was up with Zach.


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## Fast Learner (Dec 10, 2006)

I take it you've not read this thread.


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## Rodrigo Istalindir (Dec 10, 2006)

LightPhoenix said:
			
		

> Something really got me after thinking over Claire's story.  Okay, so they mind-wiped Zach completely.  What about all the other people who must have realized that they were friends?  Was the whole school mind-wiped?  Someone would have to realize something was up with Zach.




I don't think that's such a big deal.  As previously mentioned, they had only 'reconnected' as friends a couple weeks ago, and with Claire now homecoming queen and probably head cheerleader   I think a change in her relationship with Zack would not be seen as out of the ordinary.


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## LightPhoenix (Dec 11, 2006)

Fast Learner said:
			
		

> I take it you've not read this thread.




Perused.  Between not having internet access at home for a bit (boo Time Warner, boo) and having to interview for grad school, my brain has become a little muddy.


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## ken-ichi (Dec 11, 2006)

I don't know if the cell they are holding Sylar in has any sort of power nullifying ability. To me that seems a bit to comic booky to fit the tone of this show.
What if the cell was hardened enough that Mr. Bennet believed that despite Sylar's abilities that he would not be able to escape. What if all that really happened was that Bennet was wrong in calculating Sylar's TK ability. Eden, when she was about to kill Sylar by making him shoot himself caused him to struggle to his limit and break the glass window before she could hand the gun over to him.

I still see no evidence to Mr. Bennet having any sort of powers. All the times that Bennet was being mind read by Matt, the Hatian was very near by and foiling his power.


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## DonTadow (Dec 11, 2006)

LightPhoenix said:
			
		

> Something really got me after thinking over Claire's story.  Okay, so they mind-wiped Zach completely.  What about all the other people who must have realized that they were friends?  Was the whole school mind-wiped?  Someone would have to realize something was up with Zach.



I see where you're getting at, and though its minor its important. The big thing is what about his friends who voted for her. They would think it strange that this guy doesnt remember the girl he begged them to vote for.


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## Fast Learner (Dec 11, 2006)

I also wonder if Eden's power doesn't work when transmitted electronically, as through a speaker system in the cell, but that she just hadn't thought of that.


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## Knightfall (Dec 22, 2006)

Just a note to fans of Heroes, there is a 12th graphic novel up at NBC.com.

http://www.nbc.com/Heroes/novels/novel_012.shtml


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## Truth Seeker (Jan 22, 2007)

Time for a refresher...


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