# Bad Hair Cut Etiquette?



## Queen_Dopplepopolis (Feb 20, 2005)

So, I got a haircut that I did not like today from a stylist that is not my normal stylist (he apparently doesn't work at my salon anymore, so I found another salon to try - BAD IDEA).

In my shocked state, I just sort of smiled and paid the bill (that was much higher than my normal bill and my normal salon)... running to my car, I cried huge girly tears of sadness and grief over my lost locks... I just wanted the same hair cut, but 2 inches shorter... and I got a new style, 4 inches shorter.  

I realize most of you are guys and probably unable to answer this question - but, what is the polite way to demand some money back for a job poorly done in this situation?


----------



## Crothian (Feb 20, 2005)

I imagine I would just back and ask to talk to the manager and complain to him/her.  Be calm and rational and just explain yourself as best you can.  A reciept that shows you went there would help since it is not your reglar place.  

When I get a bad haircut I just have them even it out and go shorter.  It is never more then ten bucks and hair grows back so not a big concern for me.


----------



## MrFilthyIke (Feb 20, 2005)

Well, working in the airline industry, we find that if you scream, cry, bitch, and threaten to sue you get your way, whether you're right or wrong.   

On a more SERIOUS note, go back in, ask to speak to either a)manager or b)owner (if its a "mom n pop" salon).  Just state your displeasure.  But honey will probably get you further than vinegar, but if honey fails you, PICKLE them.


----------



## Wereserpent (Feb 20, 2005)

Ummm, I dont know what I would do.  A bad haircut would not last too long for me as my hair grows back obscenely fast.


----------



## Teflon Billy (Feb 20, 2005)

Is it a bad haircut (Meaning poorly executed) or is it just shorter than you asked for?


----------



## Queen_Dopplepopolis (Feb 20, 2005)

Teflon Billy said:
			
		

> Is it a bad haircut (Meaning poorly executed) or is it just shorter than you asked for?



 My highlights are really what ended up **bad** - very unevenly distributed and much darker than I asked for.

The hair was just extremely, unexpectedly short... I just wanted the same hair cut, but shorter a.k.a. a trim.  And I got whole new hair style.


----------



## Goodsport (Feb 20, 2005)

I had a similar experience last December:

Where I used to live until last August, I had gone to the same barber shop/salon/whatever it's called that I'd gone to for years.  Both ladies who cut my hair there (and the previous barbers there before them) knew me for _so_ long that for the last few years I didn't even need to tell them how to cut my here upon each visit - they already knew.  I suppose the only downside to that was that I had lost the art of explaining how I liked my hair to be cut (as it had been a long time since I needed to use that art).

Once my family and I moved, though, I had to find a new barber shop/salon/whatever, and found a lady who was able to cut my hair pretty close to how I liked it.  However, in my third visit there, that lady had the day off, and the other lady there misunderstood my request of "I want a trim" as "I want to join the Army". 

Strangely, though I was pale with shock, I nevertheless politely paid for the haircut and left (what else could I do?). 

While I usually get my hair cut every 5-6 weeks, I hadn't been to a barber shop since that mid-December trip.  It's about time for me to go get my hair cut again this coming week, though it looks like I'll have to both find yet another barber shop place _and_ re-learn the art of explaining how I want my hair cut, made more difficult by how different my hair length around my head is now compared to how it was at this stage in the past. 


-G


----------



## fusangite (Feb 20, 2005)

I think the probability of you getting the money back is just about nil. The people at the salon, once you complain, will already know you're never coming back. So they have no incentive to refund your money. (I recently had a commercial dispute in a restaurant that went like this.) So don't waste your time on fighting them.

Count your blessings. I have a great barber here (of course not as good as the one back home, TB) but the week before last he coughed on me and gave me a nasty virus. After the past two weeks, I think I'd take a really really bad haircut over whatever it was that attacked my lungs, tonsils, intestines and everything in between.

But then, I'm a guy.


----------



## Stone Angel (Feb 20, 2005)

You could complain I suppose but unless your hair has been grossly mismanaged, I think you just might have to suck it up and chalk this one in the loss column. They may redo your high light-low lights though. Try asking the other salon if they no where your stylist went to. Sorry to hear about that.

One time in college my roomates buzzed most of the top of my hair off. SUCK!! Imagine my suprise when I half drunkenly stumbled in the shower for work the next morning and went to wash my hair. I really freaked out. The worst part, the clippers they used were borrowed from a neighbor, they were not home or wouldn't get out of bed to answer the door. I had to go and wait tables like that. Luckily I was sent home extremely early and then I had to shell out 7 bucks for a haircut to "even it up". 

Don't worry I got them back.


The Seraph of Earth and Stone


----------



## Teflon Billy (Feb 20, 2005)

Fusangite has the right of it.

If someone comes back to complain, we know that that client is lost and almost nver refund their money. We'll offer to fix it as best we can, but too short? Tough.

It soudns mean, but honestly, 9/10 times we are operating on virtually _no_ directions fromthe client. The single most common instruction from clients is "just a little bit off".

Sounds simple right? Except that they have no idea what they mean by "A little bit" so you either wind up doing the cut a second time because after looking at it they think they need a "little bit" more off, or you go too short because they only meant a "little bit", not the amount _you_ cut off...that's too much 

Or you luck out and hit the magic 1/16th of an inch window that's perfect.

Don't even get me started on "Short, but not too short" and the uselessness of _that_ as instruction.

Anyway, my advice is just to chalk it up to experience and move on. 

Stone Angel is right on one count htough, you might get more streaks out of them if there is a particularly ass-kissing Manager present, but they will be done by someone who literally no longer gives a crap about you or your hair. They are working for free. Expect half-assed effort.


----------



## Amal Shukup (Feb 20, 2005)

Teflon Billy said:
			
		

> Fusangite has the right of it.
> 
> If someone comes back to complain, we know that that client is lost and almost nver refund their money. We'll offer to fix it as best we can, but too short? Tough.




Not a lot you can do about 'too short'...

I was just teaching a class on Customer Service to a bunch of small biz types last week, and the _"Customer is lost anyway so why sweat it?"_ argument came up as a justification for NOT trying to fix the situation. Obviously every business has to set policies that are right for them (as determined by their bottom line), but I'm gonna throw out a couple of thoughts:

1.  A screwed up transaction has the potential of hurting future business. People who have a REALLY bad experience tend to spread their displeasure around (sadly, much more than when they have a positive experience). This is Not Good - particularly in a smaller, or well connected, community. Making it up to them somehow (repair trim and a fix of the highlights, say) might prevent that negative word of mouth even if the customer IS a write off.

2.  I've seen good Customer Service actually save the relationship*. This is particularly important if the customer is any sort of regular (a number of 'good' transactions followed by the screw up). Marketing Math says that NEW customer tansactions cost 5 times as much to obtain as REPEAT customer transactions. So even if you lose the value of, say, 3 sales (transactions) but keep the customer, then that is a 'win' so far as the 'bottom line' is concerned.

Part of the secret to this is that you don't 'fight' the customer (it's not that they're always right - just that being 'right' costs you money). If you get to the point where they're screaming about lawsuits, you've waited too long....

* Example: Normally excellent restaurant pooches a meal (slow, cold, messed up order). Manager immediately apologized, 'Comp'ed the meal AND gave credit for 50% off the diners' NEXT meal (which they made sure was perfect). Customers saved. No negative word of mouth. Probably got positive word of mouth actually...



			
				Teflon Billy said:
			
		

> Sounds simple right? Except that they have no idea what they mean by "A little bit" so you either wind up doing the cut a second time because after looking at it they think they need a "little bit" more off, or you go too short because they only meant a "little bit", not the amount _you_ cut off...that's too much




Too true.

I now cut my own hair (Bzzzzzz). For a while, I actually brought along polaroids (front oblique and back) of me with a 'good' haircut so there'd be no confusion about what _"really short sides and back, tapered to about 'this' long on top"_ meant. 

In response to the original poster: It never hurts to ask. I also suggest honey over vinegar. If they treat you like cr-p, though... Pickle em (MrFilthyIke - I'm loving that evolution of '...vinegar' to transitive verb!).

A'Mal


----------



## Turanil (Feb 20, 2005)

I have absolutely no advice to give. 

I just wanted to say that I am extremely statisfied of my local hair-stylist. He knows what I want (always the same thing, a simple hair-cut), does it very well, for a decent price (18 euros). Plus the guy is sympathetic, works alone in his small shop, and you don't need to call in advance, just go there and see if you have to wait or not. Well, in a life where so many things go wrong and I am dissatisfied so often, I am glad that _at least_ it works fine with the hair-stylist!!


----------



## talinthas (Feb 20, 2005)

times like this i appreciate being a guy.  i grow my hair out until it's too long, then shave it all off.  i get my hair cut around three times a year as a result =)
very convenient.


----------



## Queen_Dopplepopolis (Feb 20, 2005)

Now that it is the day after, my shock is wearing off.  Will be re-visiting the salon this afternoon to have my highlights touched up - the hair is a lost cause (oh my beautiful length!  You will be missed!)

And, TB, thanks for the advice... but, I really thought I explained to the woman, "I want the same hair cut buy 2 inches shorter."  Alas, I think her english was not-so-good and maybe she just didn't understand (here I thought she just wasn't very talkative).

I've learned my lesson... and will be reminded of it in the mirror every day for 6-8 months.


----------



## Greylock (Feb 20, 2005)

o_0


[Sorry, my bad. Staring is not polite.]


----------



## Rel (Feb 20, 2005)

I don't know if you'll read this before you go back to the salon and it may not have an impact anyway.  But I'd go for a sort of "iron fist in a velvet glove" approach.  I'd probably call them and say something like:

"Hi, I was in yesterday for a haircut and I'm REALLY not happy with the results.  I thought I explained pretty clearly what I wanted and what I told the stylist is NOT what I got.  Now it's not like you chopped off my earlobe or anything.  It'll grow back.  But I wanted to give you the opportunity to do something to compensate me for the shoddy job the stylist did.  If you refund my money or offer to fix the highlights then you still probably won't have me as a future customer.  But I won't be telling anybody who will listen about how terrible your salon is like I am thinking I'll do right now.  What do you say?"


----------



## ph34r (Feb 20, 2005)

Rel said:
			
		

> ...iron fist...




I like this idea!


----------



## MrFilthyIke (Feb 20, 2005)

Bane the Barber.

Well, even overlords need a hobby I guess.


----------



## ph34r (Feb 20, 2005)

MrFilthyIke said:
			
		

> Bane the Barber.
> 
> Well, even overlords need a hobby I guess.




Where do you think Fzoul gets his color done?


----------



## jeff37923 (Feb 20, 2005)

Queen_Dopplepopolis said:
			
		

> I've learned my lesson... and will be reminded of it in the mirror every day for 6-8 months.





It doesn't have to be that bad. The next time you wish your hair done, drive over to Knoxville, TN and go to Venus Salon. Ask for Shannon the Hair Goddess, explain what you would like done - you'll look so good afterward, that you and your hair will find religion.


----------



## Angcuru (Feb 21, 2005)

jeff37923 said:
			
		

> Shannon the Hair Goddess, explain what you would like done - you'll look so good afterward, that you and your hair will find religion.



This is just screaming to be statted out.


----------



## ph34r (Feb 21, 2005)

Angcuru said:
			
		

> This is just screaming to be statted out.




Eh, I'm feeling lazy right now...someone else can do it..


----------



## Altamont Ravenard (Feb 21, 2005)

Strange coincidence, a woman at work went to get her hair done, but it wasn't the same stylist/hairdresser, and the hairdresser didn't do what she wanted. She went back home, cried a lot, hated her new hair. The next day, she didn't feel all that bad, we told her that it looked good (and it did. It wasn't what she asked for, it was different from her usual style, but it was well executed), and, although she won't be getting her hair cut by that particular hairdresser, after a couple of days, she got used to it.

AR


----------



## IronWolf (Feb 21, 2005)

I checked with my wife this evening just out of curiosity to see what her thoughts were.  She said if it happened to her she wouldn't really expect her money back but she would expect them to fix the highlights and at least make the shorter hairstyle look good.  This of course on the house.


----------



## jeff37923 (Feb 21, 2005)

Angcuru said:
			
		

> This is just screaming to be statted out.




I'll see if Shannon is cool with it and do so if she is.
Shannon is real and calls herself a Hair Goddess instead of a hairdresser, so I'd have to get permission. Although she'd probably be up for it. We'll see.


----------



## Teflon Billy (Feb 21, 2005)

Rel said:
			
		

> "Hi, I was in yesterday for a haircut and I'm REALLY not happy with the results.  I thought I explained pretty clearly what I wanted and what I told the stylist is NOT what I got.  Now it's not like you chopped off my earlobe or anything.  It'll grow back.  But I wanted to give you the opportunity to do something to compensate me for the shoddy job the stylist did.  If you refund my money or offer to fix the highlights then you still probably won't have me as a future customer.  But I won't be telling anybody who will listen about how terrible your salon is like I am thinking I'll do right now.  What do you say?"




My response would be as follows...

[bq]"Ha! Cute. Everyone thinks they are so hardcore. 

Okay, here's how it is Dona Corleone: your hair is not terrible enough by along shot to pull of what you are describing.. 

I'll grant that it might not be what you were expecting, But if you are going to do enough legwork to actually impact my salon's business in any way, you are going to be putting in some serious hours trying to convince people that you are wering a disaster-- and given that your haircut is simply too short, and not completely screwed up technically--you will look like a melodramatic crybaby to your intended audience. 

What I am saying is that getting enough people to understand that your "slightly too short" hairdo is, in fact, a crushing blow to your self-worth is going to take _time_

Time that would normally be spent interacting in other ways: Discussing subjects of mutual interest, work, family or any number of things. What I'm saying is that you will become "the chick who can't shut up about her hair" rather than "Queen Dopplepopolis"

Plus, you would need to convince more than 50 of my clients to leave the roster to make a dent even close to the natural fluctuation that this industry experiences regularly. Do you know 50 of my clients?  Your absolute best-case-scenario is you slow the growth of my business _infinitesimally_...so infinitesimally that I will likely not realize what's happened and just chalk it up to a slow month.

More likley is that you will affect my business in no way whatsoever.

So what's my answer? My answer is...


_get the  out of my shop_


_"don't come back_


Next time you think to threaten a person to get what you want, try and bring a threat that doesn't make you look like an idiot
(Snoweel Expletive)"[/bq]

I don't resond well to threats though. Maybe your guy does


----------



## Xath (Feb 21, 2005)

The sad thing about living in a metropolitan area like DC is that Tefflon Billy is right.  Alot of people don't give a crap about you, because there are so many people ready to give them business that you don't effect them, and you can't.  I still think you should go for it, but try the honey approach before the vinegar.  

(And if you wanted to, and you really hate the hair cut, you now have the perfect opportunity to cut your hair short like it used to be.    )


----------



## francisca (Feb 21, 2005)

Xath said:
			
		

> The sad thing about living in *modern society* is that Tefflon Billy is right.



Fixed it for you.  It's not just DC or the coasts, unfortunatley.

QD, here are few links to help you cope: 

http://www.molyworld.net/laughterloaf/arch/bhd.htm

http://www.kidzworld.com/site/p600.htm


----------



## Rel (Feb 21, 2005)

Teflon Billy said:
			
		

> I don't resond well to threats though.




Fair enough.  And were I put in the position that QD describes it isn't like I would be yelling from the rooftops about how bad my haircut was or trying to call CNN about it.  I would be doing just what I said:  Giving them an opportunity to fix *their* error.

But I do disagree with your approach though.  I'm the owner of a small business myself and my feeling is that if, for whatever reason, I can't make the customer happy then I'll at least do the best I can not to antagonize them.  I think there is a substantial difference between having somebody out there spreading the word that "they didn't make me a satisfied customer" and "they screwed up my haircut and then when I called them on it they acted like complete sonsabitches!"

YMMV


----------



## fusangite (Feb 21, 2005)

Rel,

Extortion is only effective if you've abducted somebody's loved one or are otherwise holding catastrophic power over them. Sure, if you, by yourself, had the power to shut down the salon, then you might be able to extort something from them. 

But mere simple harm... nope. I don't know how often people have tried to extort things from you but the experience typically produces in me, and others who have dealt with it, a sense of boundless rage. Unless you have real catastrophic power over people, using extortion against them will entrench their position and make them want to kill you. And if you do have that power over them, it will make them cave and want to kill you even more.


----------



## nakia (Feb 21, 2005)

To be fair, I don't think Rel was advocating extortion, just wanting Queen D to be up front with her proposed course of action if the hair place blew her off.

How about an approach more in the middle, something like: "There may have been some miscommunication the other day when I got my haricut.  I thought I was pretty clear on what I wanted, but it's too short and I don't like the highlights at all.  Maybe we can redo the highlights?"

This doesn't put them in a corner or overly lay blame.  The use of "we" makes it seem like Queen D and the hair place are working together toward a solution.  You are not asking for what they cannot give (your two inches of hair back), nor are you being overly antagonistic or threatening.  You are giving them an out -- redoing the highlights.  If they say no, you can just say "well, that's too bad, as I was looking for a permanent hair salon.  I'll just have to get it taken care of somewhere else."  They may not care, but you've done all you can.


----------



## Amal Shukup (Feb 21, 2005)

Teflon Billy said:
			
		

> My response would be as follows... <much amusing verbage omitted>
> 
> 
> 
> _get the  out of my shop_<<<




Woah Dude!

I confess that I don't instinctively respond 'well' (matter of perspective) to threats... I understand the response. And you're not 'wrong': Threats should NOT be made in the course of a business negotiation - it lacks class.

But, dude, you just DON'T respond thusly to customers (viscerally satisfying as it might be). If they're intractable, threatening or abusive you get rid of them, but you do it POLITELY (_"...until it's time to NOT be polite..."_ And that ain't yet by a long shot). 

I KNOW a lot of business owners (particularly in large urban markets) THINK that the odd angry customer doesn't threaten their business. They're WRONG (really stupidly wrong, too IMNSHO). 

As observed by others here: Normal business fluctuations occur in an environment with or without negative stimuli. But what is perhaps less obvious is the fact that these fluctuations can easily be magnified or trended downwards by unhappy customers spreading the word. To maintain profitability in the face of these enhanced fluctuations, businesses must spend money (marketing) or cut costs (laying off staff who tell customers to _"get the - out of my shop"_ would be top of my list...).

I'm NOT suggesting that an unhappy customer or two is going to RUIN a business or anything, but their economic impact can EASILY exceed the cost of fixing the situation. If a business loses $100 in profits because they're unwilling to spend $25 to fix the situation (at least well enough to offset the future loss), that's just a BAD business decision.

Yes, there are lots of fish in the sea, but they TALK to each other... All this said, however:  

When complaining and asking for some sort of compensatory action, don't threaten (or get into somebody's face). It sends the wrong message and engages on an emotional level that is not beneficial to ANYBODY...

If you walk away unsatisfied, channel your annoyance into something effective...

A'Mal


----------



## Rel (Feb 21, 2005)

fusangite said:
			
		

> Rel,
> 
> Extortion is only effective if you've abducted somebody's loved one or are otherwise holding catastrophic power over them. Sure, if you, by yourself, had the power to shut down the salon, then you might be able to extort something from them.




Whoah, whoah whoah!

I know that TB started tossing around the word "threat" and I suppose that what I proposed meets the definition of that word on a certain level.  But "extortion"?  We obviously have two very different ideas about what that term means.

If I walk into the salon and say, "I've never been here before in my life but unless you give me a free haircut then I'm going to tell everybody who will listen that you screwed me over." then that's extortion (it's also stupid because I don't let people near my head with sharp objects when I've just threatened to try and ruin their business).

If somebody messed up at their job and I ask the company to make it right then there is nothing wrong with that at all in my opinion.  If I further say, "If you fail to acknowledge your mistake, return my money or try to fix the problem then I'm not going to be a happy customer.  Unhappy customers are not people you want spreading the word about your business." then I see that as being a simple fact.

And I thought I made this clear before but I'll say it again just in case:  IT'S JUST A FRIGGIN' HAIRCUT.  I'm not talking about trying to put Geraldo Rivera on the case and writing a four part miniseries about my trauma.  I'm suggesting that you ASK them to fix the problem that THEY created with the understanding that if they have a callous disregard for such things then I'm going to feel compelled to share that with family and friends when they say, "I'm looking for a new hair stylist.  Got any recommendations?"

I just went back and read what I wrote in my earlier post and it sounds to me fairly resonable for somebody who is an unhappy customer.  Maybe I needed to add a smiley at the end to help get across the idea that you aren't pointing a gun at the stylist's head when you're saying it.

 <-  Smiley added to show Rel's appreciation for Gun Safety


----------



## Michael Morris (Feb 21, 2005)

When I drove a truck I dealt with many different barbaers and salonists. I was one of those "trim it back but not too far" guys.  Well, a lady in Youngstown Ohio changed that. When she got done, and I liked the results, she explained to me what she did.

Now my instructions to a haircutter I don't know is, "Use a #4 guard and burr it."


----------



## Mercule (Feb 21, 2005)

Michael Morris said:
			
		

> Now my instructions to a haircutter I don't know is, "Use a #4 guard and burr it."




As my hairline receded, I kept getting it cut shorter and shorter (my hairline pretty much followed Bruce Willis', who has a similarly shaped face, so I followed his length).  When the stylist said, "I think I could just use clippers and get that effect, do you mind?" I let her.  Then I asked what she did.  

Next time I was at Target, I saw a clippers that was $22.  A haircut cost me $11.  Short trip, mathematically, considering my hair (what there is of it) grows faster than average.  That was eight or nine years ago.  I think it's finally time to replace my clippers (or start shaving my head).


----------



## Teflon Billy (Feb 21, 2005)

Rel said:
			
		

> I'm suggesting that you ASK them to fix the problem that THEY created with the understanding that if they have a callous disregard for such things then I'm going to feel compelled to share that with family and friends when they say, "I'm looking for a new hair stylist.  Got any recommendations?"




I just went a re-read it as well, and I'll summarize what you put if that's ok (and feel free to correct me if I am wrong. Here's the quote I am referring to...



			
				Rel said:
			
		

> If you refund my money or offer to fix the highlights then you still probably won't have me as a future customer. But I won't be telling anybody who will listen about how terrible your salon is like I am thinking I'll do right now. What do you say?"




So what you are basically saying is that you want me to invest my time, or refund your money...or you will be "giving a bad review" to my Salon. That's the threat I am talking about.

What I am saying is the threat doesn't worry me.

I know you aren't coming back, what you are promising to me is that unless you get your way you are going to bad-mouth the salon.

I'm saying--in this instance--that your threat (the bad-mouthing) means nothing. 

It won't affect my business. It _might_ if your hair was right and truly screwed, but if it is just marginally shorter (two inches more than you were hoping) and the highlights aren't light enough (rather than being fried and/or falling out) then you aren't going to look all that persuasive when you bitch to people

Your aren't offering to recommend us to other customers if I "Make this right", you are just--I think--claiming that you _won't _bad mouth the salon if a discussion comes up.

I say go to it.

People who are crying in their car over haircuts that are marginally too short are the kind of drama queens that make Hairdressing a hellish job at times. 

Unless we are desperate for clientele (which may be the case) the salon can do without them.


----------



## Teflon Billy (Feb 21, 2005)

Mercule said:
			
		

> As my hairline receded, I kept getting it cut shorter and shorter (my hairline pretty much followed Bruce Willis', who has a similarly shaped face, so I followed his length).  When the stylist said, "I think I could just use clippers and get that effect, do you mind?" I let her.  Then I asked what she did.
> 
> Next time I was at Target, I saw a clippers that was $22.  A haircut cost me $11.  Short trip, mathematically, considering my hair (what there is of it) grows faster than average.  That was eight or nine years ago.  I think it's finally time to replace my clippers (or start shaving my head).




Is that what you are suggesting a Woman who just bid farewell to her "Beautiful Length" over a 2 inch overshoot should do?


----------



## Rel (Feb 21, 2005)

Teflon Billy said:
			
		

> I know you aren't coming back, what you are promising to me is that unless you get your way you are going to bad-mouth the salon.
> 
> I'm saying--in this instance--that your threat (the bad-mouthing) means nothing.
> 
> It won't affect my business.




I'm not in the haircutting business but I'm operating on an assumption here that there's been a screw up.  If you say that "two inches too short" is no big deal to you then I've got no reason to disbelieve you.  But I've been around women who've just had their hair cut and my anecdotal experience is that most would consider two inches longer or shorter than they wanted to be "bad".  So again, my starting point was to take QD at her word and go from the position that a mistake had been made.

Now given that the salon has her money they've got all the power.  They can try and make her whole either by fixing whatever they can about her haircut or they can refund her money.  Or they can decide not to try and fix it at all.

If there is no economic incentive to fix things then I get your point.  If business is so good that you're turning away customers already then there is no need to try and fix something for someone who probably won't come back anyway (I'll note that if you're in this position you should probably raise your prices a bit).  I still maintain that you're better off to just send them away than to say something nasty and guarantee that they'll go away mad.

If I can get my own business to that point then I'll be thrilled.  And rich!

EDIT - I just realized something else that I might not have made clear when I first posted in this thread and it might be what rubbed some people the wrong way.  I wouldn't resort to the "you don't want me as an unhappy customer" routine right out of the gate.  I'd start with, "I hate to be a pain but this is not the haircut I asked for." and go from there.  If you ask them to fix their mistake and they say yes then you thank them and move forward.  If not then you move forward on that front.  Sorry I didn't make that more clear up front.


----------



## Teflon Billy (Feb 21, 2005)

Rel said:
			
		

> If there is no economic incentive to fix things then I get your point.  If business is so good that you're turning away customers already then there is no need to try and fix something for someone who probably won't come back anyway (I'll note that if you're in this position you should probably raise your prices a bit).




I've been trying to convince my boss of this exact thing



			
				Rel said:
			
		

> I still maintain that you're better off to just send them away than to say something nasty and guarantee that they'll go away mad.




Point taken there I was taking issue with your prepared statement for The Queen that involved threatening the salon with unleashing the might of her poor opinion.

My point was she could _very easily_ get laughed out of the place particularly if they arte successful enough to be charging a much higher price than her previous place (which was stated).

Hairdressers are  fussy, tempermental lot on the whole (Either No-Hopers or Artistes generally speaking) and threatening them with anything is a long shot.

You suggested the "iron hand in the velvet glove" as a solution. I'd give you less than 20% chance of "Iron" anything working based solely on the info we have.



			
				rel said:
			
		

> If I can get my own business to that point then I'll be thrilled.  And rich!




We do allright


----------



## Rel (Feb 21, 2005)

Teflon Billy said:
			
		

> You suggested the "iron hand in the velvet glove" as a solution. I'd give you less than 20% chance of "Iron" anything working based solely on the info we have.




TB, I'd take it as a personal favor if you go read the edit I just made to the post before yours.  I think I kinda botched my delivery to start with because I didn't mean my "iron fist" idea to be delivered as a monologue but more of a "weapon of last resort."

My bad.


----------



## Queen_Dopplepopolis (Feb 21, 2005)

Well - the final result.... because I know you all want to know...

I went into the salon this afternoon - much to my glee, the woman that did my hair was not working today.  I explained the situation - actually completely omitting the part about the shortness (I've done my crying, it's gone.  It'll grow back)...

I simply put on my sweetest midwestern smile (it works wonders) and said, "I had my hair done on Saturday and I'm really unhappy with my highlights - they turned out darker than I would have liked.  If you have the time, I would really appreciate a touch up."

A guy that was working jumped on the case (he was actually "fixing" another lady's hair, too) - he jumped between the both of us for about 45 minutes, and despite the fact that my hair is much, much shorter than I would like - my color looks fabulous.

So, though I won't be returning to the Salon of Doom any time in the near future (I'll find a stylist at my old salon or call my old stylist and see who he says is best) I have no reason to say anything bad about the establishment.

  I'm a quasi-happy camper (with shorter hair than expected).


----------



## ph34r (Feb 22, 2005)

So I guess I should send word to the battalion of Zhentarim soldiers headed your way that they aren't needed anymore...ah fooey.  :\ 

Congrats on the hair though.


----------



## Goodsport (Feb 22, 2005)

Queen_Dopplepopolis said:
			
		

> Well - the final result.... because I know you all want to know...
> 
> I went into the salon this afternoon - much to my glee, the woman that did my hair was not working today.  I explained the situation - actually completely omitting the part about the shortness (I've done my crying, it's gone.  It'll grow back)...
> 
> ...




I'm glad to read that all went well.

As it turns out, I too went to the barber shop today for the first time since mid-December.  This time I more succinctly explained to the barber what I wanted ("just a trim on top but cut a bit more on the sides and back"), and now my hair is back on track and I'm back to my usual 5-6 week haircut cycle. 


-G


----------



## Amal Shukup (Feb 22, 2005)

Queen_Dopplepopolis said:
			
		

> So, though I won't be returning to the Salon of Doom any time in the near future (I'll find a stylist at my old salon or call my old stylist and see who he says is best) I have no reason to say anything bad about the establishment.
> 
> I'm a quasi-happy camper (with shorter hair than expected).




Good Customer Service in action. Better would have been to do the job right the first time and earn a new regular customer, but a credible job of damage control - even if all they accomplished was to keep you from dissuading one or two individual customers, that was 22.5 'man minutes' well spent. Not to mention, it was the right thing to do.

Hair grows! It'll be back to where you want it in no time.

A'Mal


----------



## Rel (Feb 22, 2005)

Queen Dopplepopolis, I'm glad they were accomodating and glad that you're happier with the results.  I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that The Universe thinks you look lovely regardless of the haircut. 

I got a chance to put my money where my mouth is today with regards to customer service.  I got a call from a customer indicating that a DVD that I made for them (I'm a professional videographer) wasn't working.  They wanted a VHS copy and I was making one within ten minutes of their call.

After talking with them some more we were able to determine that the problem was on their end (with the laptop they were trying to play the DVD on) and not a problem with the DVD itself.  Regardless they needed the tape ASAP and their office is an hour and a half away from me.  They offered to send a courier to pick up the tape.

I had some paperwork that I could have worked on but nothing too pressing.  I offered to meet their courier half way to help them out.  Particularly in light of the fact that the problem was not my fault and I was fixing it within three hours of them calling, they were thrilled.  I'm pretty sure that they will be a customer for life and will hopefully spread the work about how helpful I was with their problem.  If that translates into even one additional video then I'll make a minimum of a couple hundred dollars.  Plus I get to bill them for the extra copy I made today.

I love it when doing good by my customers also translates into cash.


----------



## Cyberzombie (Feb 22, 2005)

Darn!  I was hoping to hear you had gone in and busted a cap in everyone.  

  Glad you got it fixed as much as is possible.


----------



## fusangite (Feb 23, 2005)

Queen_Dopplepopolis said:
			
		

> Well - the final result.... because I know you all want to know...



I'm glad things went so well. Obviously, my advice was incorrectly predicated on you being as charming as I am (not particularly) when, evidently, you are much more so.


----------



## Stone Angel (Feb 23, 2005)

Good finally, I was losing sleep over this lol

Glad to hear you are satisfied.


The Seraph of Earth and Stone


----------



## Amal Shukup (Feb 23, 2005)

Rel said:
			
		

> ...I'm pretty sure that they will be a customer for life and will hopefully spread the work about how helpful I was with their problem.  If that translates into even one additional video then I'll make a minimum of a couple hundred dollars..




Yup. Awesome stuff. May your professionalism and focus on delivering a quality customer experience be rewarded a thousand times over. Or at least once. It's useful to employ a few discrete strategies to help happy customers spread the word. The top two (of dozens):

One: Remind 'em occasionally that you exist: "thanks for the business" notes, holiday cards, the occasional notice of special offers ("for favored customers") etc.. Don't overdo this - it's BAD to annoy folk. No spamming! A business like yours could do this perhaps twice a year. Maybe quarterly if the relationship is solid...

Two: In any transaction (meeting, sending product, a thank you/holiday card etc.) include two (not lots - TWO) copies of your biz card.  This gives them the 'tools' to help them spread the word...



			
				Rel said:
			
		

> I love it when doing good by my customers also translates into cash.




It's funny how often that happens!

A'Mal
(Who normally gets to bill $100.00/hour for this sorta thing  )


----------



## KidCthulhu (Feb 23, 2005)

I've got to chime in on the Iron Hand thing.  I've worked a lot of retail in my life, and I can tell you that unless you're _exceptionally_ charming or suave, the Iron Hand is never as subtle as you think it is.  We've seen you coming a mile away.  

Just tell the retailer the problem and make the issue clear.  Don't harp, don't repeat yourself twenty times.  We know you're upset, and believe me, the minute you started talking, we knew  we'd have to fix the problem.  And we will.  Don't get clever and try the subtle threat thing.  Anyone in retail knows the danger of an angry customer.  You don't have to explain it.

I had a customer come in one day to the pet store where I work my second job.  She had an empty bag of dog food. She'd noticed the bag was past its sell by date after she'd gotten it home.  No problem there.  But she'd fed the ENTIRE bag to her dogs, no problem with the quality.  Then she came in and wanted a new bag of food, because the previous one had been past sell by.

And we gave it to her.  That's how thin the margins are, and how much difference the happy customer makes.


----------



## Rel (Feb 23, 2005)

KidCthulhu said:
			
		

> I've got to chime in on the Iron Hand thing.  I've worked a lot of retail in my life, and I can tell you that unless you're _exceptionally_ charming or suave, the Iron Hand is never as subtle as you think it is.  We've seen you coming a mile away.




You're probably right about this, KC.  I think I've just duped myself into thinking it will work well for others because I'm charming and suave enough to make it work myself.


----------



## Xath (Feb 24, 2005)

*The Iron Hand is no friend of mine*

Ah, retail.  Once I had a lady call and ask about a Yu-Gi-Oh tourney.  (I worked retail for WotC)  I told her pre-reg started at 5 and it was first come first serve; we could only accept 40 participants per game.  The tournament would start at 6.  So she gets there at 6:20 and demands that her son be let in because I had promised that he would be allowed to play, and that she had driven down from PA for this.  My manager (who had been listening to our phone conversation) explained that late entries weren't allowed, and that we had turned people away because we had been full booked since 5:20.  She was not a happy camper.  She made threats, and threw quite the fit until we had to ask her to leave the store.  She called my boss' boss' boss' boss to complain, which meant that everyone down the chain got in trouble, but nothing came out of it.  There was nothing we could do.  

The Iron Hand doesn't work.  It just makes the retail employees less happy to help you.


----------



## Darth K'Trava (Feb 25, 2005)

> Bane the Barber






			
				ph34r said:
			
		

> Where do you think Fzoul gets his color done?




You wanna know why Fzoul is soooo cheezed off?? He asks for RED and they give him BLONDE. Talk about a screwup!


----------



## Darth K'Trava (Feb 25, 2005)

Xath said:
			
		

> Ah, retail.  Once I had a lady call and ask about a Yu-Gi-Oh tourney.  (I worked retail for WotC)  I told her pre-reg started at 5 and it was first come first serve; we could only accept 40 participants per game.  The tournament would start at 6.  So she gets there at 6:20 and demands that her son be let in because I had promised that he would be allowed to play, and that she had driven down from PA for this.  My manager (who had been listening to our phone conversation) explained that late entries weren't allowed, and that we had turned people away because we had been full booked since 5:20.  She was not a happy camper.  She made threats, and threw quite the fit until we had to ask her to leave the store.  She called my boss' boss' boss' boss to complain, which meant that everyone down the chain got in trouble, but nothing came out of it.  There was nothing we could do.
> 
> The Iron Hand doesn't work.  It just makes the retail employees less happy to help you.





You've not known true rage until you work the fast food industry. People want their food hot, NOW, NOW *NOW*!! And they get picky over the least little thing. There was one guy who had two sandwiches left out. No biggie. Except for the fact he kept carping on "oh... how *I* was inconvenienced..... oh, how I was inconvenienced......" to the tune of flogging that poor, poor dead horse over and over again.... it just made me roll my eyes (not in his sight of course...). Or the gangsta member who came in and rudely demanded we remake his whole order. Down to the prepackaged orange juice.... and asked, RUDELy, abt a napkin and fork. I growled that they were over in the cubby in the corner. Then he asked, just as rudely, abt a straw. Same growled response. Basically, you come in acting like a jackass, don't expect niceness. Especially when you act like a jackass when I haven't had a good day......


----------



## RyanL (Feb 25, 2005)

I had a similar experience once.  I went to the barber shop that I've gone to my entire life.  There was a new person working there, a woman, which is odd for a traditional barber shop.  She was kind of shifty-looking, but I was in a hurry.  I sat down in her chair.  I asked her to leave me about 2 inches on top and taper the sides and back.  Apparently she misunderstood; I don't know what she thought I said, but I ended up with about 1 centimeter of hair.  I was so shocked that I just paid and left.

The next time I went back, she was not there.  I strongly suspect that the owner, who has known me my whole life and therefore knows I would never get my hair cut that short, knew she messed up and fired her shortly thereafter.

Ah, memories.


----------



## Xath (Feb 25, 2005)

> You've not known true rage until you work the fast food industry.




Heh, I was also a Friendly's waitress.  I know all about the rude picky eaters.


----------



## Psychic Warrior (Feb 25, 2005)

I had a wacky customer (note 'wacky' is an ENWorld safe word, the real word is not safe for young tneder minds) just the other day.  I work in an optical lab with a retail store front.  There is am eye Doctor's office right next door to us but he runs his own business and sets his on hours.  A lady came in and I saw everyone else was busy so i left the lab to go help her.  Turns out she was upset that the eye doc wouldn't give her an immediate exam as he was with a patient and had 3 more in the office ahead of her (it was about 5:15pm and the doc usually closes at 5pm).  She keet saying it was an emergency because she had diabetes and needed to have her eyes checked.  Now it is true that persons with diabetes can suffer terrible problems with their eyes but the best place to discover these problems would have been the hospital not 5 minutes away (the place I work and the doc's office are in a mall).  What was wierd was when i offered directions to the hospital or even the name & phone# pf an eye doctor across the street who was opened until 7pm she just said "I'm from out of town.  I guess it's OK with you that I can't see" and walked out.  I was scratching my head about that one.


----------



## SpringPlum (Feb 25, 2005)

One of my friends used to manage a Chick-fil-a.  And my favorites of his stories are about the people who would get truly furious at the drive-thru guys because they didn't sell hamburgers.

Another retail tale:

I used to work at a maternity clothing store with a pretty steep return policies.  "No refunds and exchanges only with a receipt and the tags still on."  So this lady comes in wanting panty hose.  I show her where they are.  She complains about the price and says that the sizing chart on the back is confusing.  But gives in and purchases them because she 'must' have them for a party.  I make the exchange policy very clear and add that we cannot even exchange hose once the package has been opened.  She says that it's a stupid policy but she buys two packages and storms out.  
  An hour later she calls and says that they didn't fit and she wants her money back.  *Now, boys and girls, what does 'no refunds' mean to you?* Plus, she has opened one of the packages and we will NOT take those back.  First she wants us to refund hr credit card over the phone.  No way! So after she yells and screams, we agree to do a post void for one pair if her husband brings them in.
  Two hours later, she calls again and says that her husband will be in tomorrow and we should do the post void then.  Those who work in retail know that post voids have to be done before close of business or the credit card will go through when the register is closed.  I try to calmly explain this to her when she launches into a serious of explicatives totally unsuitable for ENWorld and threatens to come in tomorrow and 'cause problems'.

Now, keep in mind that this fine human being was a few months away from spawning another fine human being.  The girl who worked the next day called mall security on her when she came in screaming and yelling.


----------



## ph34r (Feb 25, 2005)

Darth K'Trava said:
			
		

> You wanna know why Fzoul is soooo cheezed off?? He asks for RED and they give him BLONDE. Talk about a screwup!




Well if it's blonde he can gel it up and run around like Goku.


----------



## Darth K'Trava (Feb 25, 2005)

ph34r said:
			
		

> Well if it's blonde he can gel it up and run around like Goku.




     

I guess that's why he's so  -off looking all the time!! Someone's already made that suggestion and it didn't sit too well with him....   

Now if we fixed Torm (the deity, not the poster) up with that hairstyle......... (falls over laughing at the thought) it would mess up the "order of things" in his life....


----------



## Darth K'Trava (Feb 25, 2005)

SpringPlum said:
			
		

> One of my friends used to manage a Chick-fil-a.  And my favorites of his stories are about the people who would get truly furious at the drive-thru guys because they didn't sell hamburgers.




We get people who ask for pancakes, burgers, hot dogs, pizza, tacos, chicken nuggets..... and we're a CHICKEN place (a variant of KFC). I told one guy that Taco Bell was next door and he goes out the parking lot the OTHER direction....  I guess people think we serve anything..... which, thankfully, we don't. Doing that took a big hit on Hardee's when they tried that (to failure) and the company went downhill and started closing restaurants after that "little" fiasco....


----------



## WanderingMonster (Feb 25, 2005)

One thing I've learned in my 11 year sentence to retail is that we all serve each other.  Americans, by and large, work in some sort of service providing industry.  In a small town like mine, this hits home hard.  If I don't provide good service to the lady who has a problem with the product she purchased at my store, I get to see her again when the roles are reversed at the grocery store, the daycare, the salon, the school,  or *shudder* if I'm pulled over by the police (talk about inviting disaster there!)  It's a smaller world than you think.

Be excellent to each other and PARTY ON DUDES!


----------



## orchid blossom (Feb 25, 2005)

On the subject of getting a problem taken care of at a retail place....

Always ask to speak to a manager.  When I was a retail slave I had many, many people asking me to make allownaces in policies for them.  I learned very quickly the phrase "let me get a manager for you."  Not because I didn't want to help them, but because I had no authority to do so.  Peons can't make those decisions.

So please, ask for a supervisor or a manager, you'll save yourself and the retail slave alot of grief.


----------



## Cyberzombie (Feb 25, 2005)

Xath said:
			
		

> Heh, I was also a Friendly's waitress.  I know all about the rude picky eaters.



 Hmm.  Doesn't sound like your job was all that...

Friendly!

~rim shot~

Thanks, I'll be hear all week.  Try the veal.  And be sure to tip your waitress!


----------



## LightPhoenix (Feb 27, 2005)

Well, I now know I'm asking my regular hairdresser _exactly_ what she does now.


----------

