# And here they are... Official Human 'Subraces'



## Tarril Wolfeye (Dec 31, 2004)

Well, it seems WotC finally caved in.

We present Exhibit A: Human Subraces (from Races of Destiny)

Human (of course)
Mongrelfolk
Sea kin
Sharakim
Skulk
Underfolk

and with a variant from the chapter on feats:
Half-Elves
Half-Orcs
Half-Ogres
Aasimar
Tiefling
Mechanatrix
Shyft
Genasi
Half-Celestial Human
Half-Fiend Human
Half-Dragon Human
etc.

Even without the variant that's 6 (six!) Human subraces.


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## Mercule (Dec 31, 2004)

Care to elaborate on any of them?  Maybe one or two sentences?


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## Zappo (Dec 31, 2004)

Shyft and Mechanatrix? I assume these are chaotic and lawful planetouched respectively. I dislike the names already...


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## Ankh-Morpork Guard (Dec 31, 2004)

Zappo said:
			
		

> Shyft and Mechanatrix? I assume these are chaotic and lawful planetouched respectively. I dislike the names already...



 Actually, I believe the Lawful and Chaotic planetouched were in MMII with different names...Shyft and Mecanatrix were in the Fiend Folio(I think...) and I truly don't remember what was different about them.

...of course, I could be all wrong here.


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## Lonely Tylenol (Dec 31, 2004)

The mongrelfolk have been around since at least 2nd edition.  Of course, they were called mongrelmen back in the day, so I can understand the confusion.


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## Masquerade (Dec 31, 2004)

Zappo said:
			
		

> Shyft and Mechanatrix? I assume these are chaotic and lawful planetouched respectively. I dislike the names already...




I believe they are planetouched related to the astral plane and mechanus, respectively.


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## Olorin (Dec 31, 2004)

Ankh-Morpork Guard said:
			
		

> Actually, I believe the Lawful and Chaotic planetouched were in MMII with different names...Shyft and Mecanatrix were in the Fiend Folio(I think...) and I truly don't remember what was different about them.
> 
> ...of course, I could be all wrong here.




You are not wrong. 

Chaond and Zenythri are the chaotic and lawful planetouched respectively, from MMII.


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## Gez (Dec 31, 2004)

Chaonds are kinda slaad-touched, descendant of people who were infected by blue slaadi but somehow resisted the disease just enough to remain partly what they were (and thus become sorta half-slaad).
Zenythri trace their ancestry to the Mercanes.
Mechanatrix are related to the living clockworks of Mechanus, the Modrons.
The Shyfts, for their parts, are the distant offspring of a "race native of the Ethereal" (haven't found out which) with humans.

And yes, the names kinda suck.


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## hellbender (Dec 31, 2004)

Dr. Awkward said:
			
		

> The mongrelfolk have been around since at least 2nd edition. Of course, they were called mongrelmen back in the day, so I can understand the confusion.



MMIII 1E


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## Tarril Wolfeye (Dec 31, 2004)

First, all of these are now type Humanoid (Human):
Mongrelfolk
Sea kin
Sharakim
Skulk
Underfolk

Mongrelfolk are like in FF, but also get low-light vision, immunity to magical sleep, +1 save vs. Ench./Ill./Poison, +1 Appraise, Climb, Jump, Listen, Move Silently, Search, Spot, +4 Hide, Sleigh of Hand, and 'Diffuse Blood': +2 save vs. spell that are race-specific on human/halfling/dwarf/elf/gnome/goblin/orc

Sea kin are still air-breather who need water to survive (kinda like dolphins)

Sharakim are found at WotC's site

Skulk is found in FF

Underfolk are 'Underdark Humans'


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## Darkness (Dec 31, 2004)

BoVD has Vashar. They're like normal humans, except that their bonus feat must be a vile one.


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## Tarril Wolfeye (Dec 31, 2004)

Darkness said:
			
		

> BoVD has Vashar. They're like normal humans, except that their bonus feat must be a vile one.



Oh, yes I forgot those. But as they are like caricatures to me, I don't use them.


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## Darkness (Dec 31, 2004)

True. Just figured I'd mention them.


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## Arbiter of Wyrms (Jan 1, 2005)

Darkness said:
			
		

> BoVD has Vashar. They're like normal humans, except that their bonus feat must be a vile one.



 Beat me to it, Darkness.  I actually kind of like the Vashar.  I was just rereading the BoVD last night, acutally, and I have to say, the best thing about that book is that if I read it too long, I actually start to get a little creeped out.  The backstory for the Vashar is neato finito.


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## DMScott (Jan 1, 2005)

hellbender said:
			
		

> MMIII 1E




Mongrelmen were originally introduced in a module, I1 if memory serves. One of the abandoned/forgotten/forbidden city modules. Was there an MMIII in 1E? I only remember the MM, FF, and MMII, and I thought they were in the latter.


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## Krieg (Jan 1, 2005)

DMScott said:
			
		

> Mongrelmen were originally introduced in a module, I1 if memory serves. One of the abandoned/forgotten/forbidden city modules. Was there an MMIII in 1E? I only remember the MM, FF, and MMII, and I thought they were in the latter.





Correct on all accounts.


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## FireLance (Jan 1, 2005)

Don't forget the Neanderthals from Frostburn. It would be quite cool if they were the first Humanoid (human) subrace.


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## Tarril Wolfeye (Jan 1, 2005)

FireLance said:
			
		

> Don't forget the Neanderthals from Frostburn. It would be quite cool if they were the first Humanoid (human) subrace.



Hey, they're Human too. I always thought they only had 'Human Blood'.
But the Price for first human subrace goes to ...(drumroll)... Vasharan from BoVD.
Sorry, Mr. Neanderthal, you're just too late.


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## Garnfellow (Jan 1, 2005)

FireLance said:
			
		

> Don't forget the Neanderthals from Frostburn. It would be quite cool if they were the first Humanoid (human) subrace.




What are the game stats for neanderthals?


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## Tarril Wolfeye (Jan 1, 2005)

Garnfellow said:
			
		

> What are the game stats for neanderthals?



+2 Str, +2 Con, -2 Dex, -2 Int
+1 attack with 'primitive' weapon: bolas, club, dart, greatclub, boad, harpoon, iuak, javelin, longspear, quarterstaff, ritiik, shortbow, shortspear, sling, spear, sugliin, throwing axe, tigerskull club
+2 Listen, Spot, Survival
Climate Tolerant: no Fortitude necessary between -20°F and 140°F
Illiteracy, except when Wizard (but may buy Literacy)
Fav class Bbn
+0 LA


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## SpiralBound (Jan 1, 2005)

I can't quite tell if the original poster and a few of the others who replied are for or against human subraces?  I suppose that if we're going to have hundreds of subraces of everything else, then I guess we may as well have them for humans too...

Personally, I'm not a huge fan of the style of subrace that basically follows the methodology of taking race "A" and applying generic descriptors "1"  through "infinity".  Take for instance the 1001 colours of Elves that exist. :\  grey elves, blue elves, black elves (not the underdark ones), smoke elves, green elves, red elves, _fushia, turquoise, and saffron elves_!   Or the exact same process just with terrain, environment or material templates, which is really only slightly better than colour coding them. forest elves, desert elves, mountain elves, aquatic elves, sky elves, dusk elves, shadow elves, fire elves, water elves, _mud, plaster and brick elves!_ 

My point isn't that subtypes shouldn't exist, it's just that they should exist for a good setting related reason.  More and more, it seems that some of the subraces that get created are made to justify a "kewl" race name or to "complete the set" so to speak. _("Oh! Oh! We haven't made highway Elves yet!  A highway is part of the landscape, right?")_

The original Dark Elves made sense in the setting that they first appeared in due to the history of that specific setting that they were a part of, similarly so for Sylvan and High Elves.  Now however, it seems that almost EVERY setting has these and many many more types of Elves, Gnomes, Dwarves, etc.  _Sometimes_ the setting makes a very good case for justifying them.  Sadly though, in most cases they don't and it's obvious that they were added to appease the expectations of the average gamer.

I'd much rather have subraces that make sense for the setting that they're a part of, that have a more cultural and historical basis for their physical and mental distinctions, rather then just an excuse to give say, a breath weapon to an Orc cause you think it's "Kewl".

I know that there are some good settings out there that don't do this, but I'm talking about the majority that don't.  As for a race book _(human or otherwise)_ that simply splatters it's pages with a bunch of disconnected subraces that don't technically belong in any intrinsic way to a specific setting... Well, like I said in the begining of this rant, once you decide to have as many random flavours of subraces as you can, then yet another subrace book is a good thing... :\  The only valuable application I can see for such a book is to allow a GM to use one or two races from it that fit the concept and style of his setting, or more likely as an inspiration in making his own.  However, once you consider just how many such race books there actually are out there in print right now, and temper that consideration with what the average gamer's response is to the seemingly neverending tide of yet another "crunch-filled" book of rules expansions without any real setting-specific flavour attached, and it becomes obvious that what is most likely to happen is that all of these subraces will be accepted as "canon" for all settings without any consideration for their suitability or degree of sensibility.

Again, I know that there are many gamers out there that DON'T blindly act that way.  In fact, many of the people who I see post here in these forums I would consider to be gamers who put a great deal more thought into their gaming decisions than I'm implying here.  Still, a recent stat I read _(here in this forum actually)_ stated that there are approx. 4 million gamers these days and I know that they don't all post here!    I hate to be so negative, but I'm seeing more and more books getting published these days "just because".
[sarcasm]
It's almost as though the marketing departments are  the only ones calling the shots when it comes to deciding what will get written next...   
[/sarcasm]


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## Remathilis (Jan 2, 2005)

Don't the Elans and Kalasthar count?


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## The Shaman (Jan 2, 2005)

SpiralBound said:
			
		

> snippage!



Couldn't have said it better.

On the original subject, _Wilderlands of High Fantasy_ has a number of human subraces.


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## hellbender (Jan 2, 2005)

DMScott said:
			
		

> Mongrelmen were originally introduced in a module, I1 if memory serves. One of the abandoned/forgotten/forbidden city modules. Was there an MMIII in 1E? I only remember the MM, FF, and MMII, and I thought they were in the latter.



  I thought I was slick and added an extra I, yes, they are in the MM2, 1E, and yes, they are from one of those forgotten something or other. Maybe the Tharizdun Temple?


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## Doug McCrae (Jan 2, 2005)

SpiralBound said:
			
		

> As for a race book _(human or otherwise)_ that simply splatters it's pages with a bunch of disconnected subraces that don't technically belong in any intrinsic way to a specific setting...



That's exactly what a race book _should_ be doing precisely because it isn't tied to a particular setting. GMs and players can then decide which races, if any, they want in their universe.


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## Doug McCrae (Jan 2, 2005)

SpiralBound said:
			
		

> _("Oh! Oh! We haven't made highway Elves yet!  A highway is part of the landscape, right?")_



How about swamp elves, taiga elves, caldera elves, pond elves, canyon elves, black smoker elves and hairy elves?


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## LightPhoenix (Jan 2, 2005)

Doug McCrae said:
			
		

> How about swamp elves, taiga elves, caldera elves, pond elves, canyon elves, black smoker elves and hairy elves?



I'm all about Keebler Elves and Christmas Elves...


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## PhoenixDarkDirk (Jan 2, 2005)

In Dragon #319, the Dark Sun 3e issue, there is a race called humans quite different from the Player's Handbook version.  I think the name athasian would be suitable if both were used in one campaign.


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## Lonely Tylenol (Jan 2, 2005)

The funny thing is that "highway elves" are about the only elven subrace I've heard of that sound at all interesting.

I imagine them playing guitar, slinging pistols, and cruising around in big convertables that are immaculately maintained in a like-new state.  Racial bonus to "Stunt Driving" and "Craft: bourbon" and a special racial ability that allows them to stand and fight on the hood of a moving car without having to check to see if they fall off.  Racial weapons include bolas that look like fuzzy dice.


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## Tarril Wolfeye (Jan 2, 2005)

Remathilis said:
			
		

> Don't the Elans and Kalasthar count?



As both are not type Humanoid (human) they're technically not human subraces.



			
				The Shaman said:
			
		

> On the original subject, _Wilderlands of High Fantasy_ has a number of human subraces.



Where's that book from? Could you describe the subraces?



			
				PhoenixDarkDirk said:
			
		

> In Dragon #319, the Dark Sun 3e issue, there is a race called humans quite different from the Player's Handbook version.  I think the name athasian would be suitable if both were used in one campaign.



Yes, but should we use normal humans and athasian humans in the same campaign?
At least, there's no Balance issue: Athasian Humans have +1LA.


All official Human subraces at a glance:

Human (PHB)
Vashar (BoVD)
Athasian Human (Dragon #319)
Neanderthal (Frostburn)
Illumian (RoD)
Mongrelfolk (RoD)
Sea kin (RoD)
Sharakim (RoD)
Skulk (RoD)
Underfolk (RoD)

Did I miss any? (And yes, I didn't include Wilderlands of High Fantasy)


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## Voadam (Jan 2, 2005)

It is wierd how Half-elves and half-orcs don't have subtype human in addition to their other half race's subtype (at least as listed in the MM).


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## Tarril Wolfeye (Jan 2, 2005)

Voadam said:
			
		

> It is wierd how Half-elves and half-orcs don't have subtype human in addition to their other half race's subtype (at least as listed in the MM).



Well, using the variant in RoD you get just that, but also any other race with human ancestry becomes type Humanoid (Human). For a partial list, see my first post in this thread.


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## Gez (Jan 2, 2005)

Tarril Wolfeye said:
			
		

> As both are not type Humanoid (human) they're technically not human subraces.




Elans are aberrations, yes. But Kalashtars are humanoids. They may have the subtype, as long as they won't be statblocked like monsters, no one will know...

BTW, I've already seen humans without the human subtype... For example, the first NPC statted in _Shadows of the Last War_ has a statblock like this one (very mild spoiler, as the glorious heroes are not supposed to attack her anyway).


Spoiler



Female human aristocrat 2/sorcerer 2; CR 3; Medium humanoid; HD 2d8+2d4; hp 17; and so on.



See? No human subtype!

So, humans are not humans?


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## Kobold Avenger (Jan 3, 2005)

Under the variant considerations for planetouched there's also the Cansin and Axani which appeared in Dragon #297, which are also Chaotic and Lawful planetouched.  I happen to like them a lot better than the Zenythri and Chaonds that appeared in MMII.  Also in that same article they described Dust, Ice, Magma, Ooze, Smoke and Steam Genasi.

Spirit Folk could be considered a subrace, but they are Humanoid (spirit) creatures...


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## Tarril Wolfeye (Jan 3, 2005)

Kobold Avenger said:
			
		

> Under the variant considerations for planetouched there's also the Cansin and Axani which appeared in Dragon #297, which are also Chaotic and Lawful planetouched.  I happen to like them a lot better than the Zenythri and Chaonds that appeared in MMII.



I liked Cansin and Axani better, too. I even had a player play a Cansin once (ancestry: eladrin)



			
				Gez said:
			
		

> Elans are aberrations, yes. But Kalashtars are humanoids. They may have the subtype, as long as they won't be statblocked like monsters, no one will know...
> 
> BTW, I've already seen humans without the human subtype...
> So, humans are not humans?



From the description of Kalashtar: "Today, new Kalashtar are born, not possessed; neither spirit nor human, they are a new race that breeds true."
See, they're a new race, not humans. And if you are called human in your statblock, you don't need to state the subtype as it is clear from context.

But you were almost right: Your comment reminded me of Inspired/Empty Vessels, and - Surprise! - they are subtype human.

Adding to my list, the human subraces are:
Human (PHB)
Vashar (BoVD)
Athasian Human (Dragon #319)
Inspired/Empty Vessel (Eberron CS)
Neanderthal (Frostburn)
Illumian (RoD)
Mongrelfolk (RoD)
Sea kin (RoD)
Sharakim (RoD)
Skulk (RoD)
Underfolk (RoD)


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## Aesmael (Jan 3, 2005)

Dr. Awkward said:
			
		

> The funny thing is that "highway elves" are about the only elven subrace I've heard of that sound at all interesting.
> 
> I imagine them playing guitar, slinging pistols, and cruising around in big convertables that are immaculately maintained in a like-new state.  Racial bonus to "Stunt Driving" and "Craft: bourbon" and a special racial ability that allows them to stand and fight on the hood of a moving car without having to check to see if they fall off.  Racial weapons include bolas that look like fuzzy dice.



In all seriousness, *YOINK*


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## Psion (Jan 3, 2005)

Tarril Wolfeye said:
			
		

> As both are not type Humanoid (human) they're technically not human subraces.




But they do share an origin not entirely like illumians. They were once humans.

I think a campaign that makes some horrible revalation about why they are different would be fun.


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