# [HARP] Back to the Dungeon [Full]



## Citizen Mane (Mar 21, 2005)

Anyone interested in giving HARP a test drive?  I've had the books for a while (have even read the main book), but haven't played.  I'd like to, so...

I'm thinking a quick, one-off back-to-the-dungeon type of thing (probably using an old 1e dungeon to test it out).  Four players, one character each, main book only, I'll roll stats using Invisible Castle, and we'll just run from there.  I'm thinking that we'll pick it up right at the start of the action (just at the dungeon door).  It's not to say that there won't be RPing, but that I want to start in with action.

*Stat Rolling*:
Because of the high baseline that I set when I rolled Vargo's scores, I've been rerolling everyone's stats twice and dropping the lower of the two rerolls.  Players can then use the original stats or the higher of the rerolls.  Just FYI.

Teflon Billy's been quoted as saying that HARP's more D&D than D&D (or something like that).  I want to find out if he's right. 

First four to post are in.

Nick


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## Guest 11456 (Mar 21, 2005)

pardon my ignorance but... What is HARP?


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 21, 2005)

High Adventure Role-Playing, a stripped down variant of Rolemaster (which isn't quite the best way to describe it, as it was built from the ground up, not the top down, but it does have some similarities to RM), from Iron Crown Enterprises.

Nick


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## Vargo (Mar 22, 2005)

Booga.  I'm in.


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 22, 2005)

Good deal.  If you'd like to get a head start on character generation, here're the stats I rolled at Invisible Castle: 97, 47, 74, 99, 56, 78, 52, 87.  You can arrange those any way you like.  

Nick


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## Mark Causey (Mar 22, 2005)

There's no place like HARP, there's no place like HARP.

I'll give it a shot


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 22, 2005)

Nice.  Welcome aboard.  Your stats: 85, 46, 85, 67, 86, 49, 60, 52.  

*Note*: Vargo's stats set a high baseline, and I want everyone to be fairly evenly-matched, so I did reroll yours twice.  This is the second reroll.  I'll do this for everyone who joins if they like.  If anyone's super-hardcore and wants to take their original roll, I'll link to that, too.

adamantineangel's original roll

Nick


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## Mark Causey (Mar 22, 2005)

I should have something by tonight or tomorrow. Any guidelines or suggestions?


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## JimAde (Mar 22, 2005)

Hey, Kajamba, can I get in if I just download the free Lite rules?  I can't see investing in another game system that I'll never play tabletop, but I'd love to be in a game you run.


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 22, 2005)

*adamantineangel*: Nothing past what I've said above (core book only), and I'll be running a dungeon from an old 1e mod, so...that might help you get at a feel for the game I'm looking to run.

*JimAde*: Should be able to, AFAIK they're enough to play with.    You can try out these stats: 68, 72, 99, 40, 98, 71, 55, 98 (original roll).  Speaking of high baselines...

Nick


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## Guest 11456 (Mar 22, 2005)

I'll go ahead and grab the last slot, KL.

Tails


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## JimAde (Mar 22, 2005)

Sweet, thanks!

AdamantineAngel and Vargo: If it's OK with you I'll go with the big, dumb fighter type (though with those stats I don't even have to be dumb).  Since I haven't played HARP before I don't want to mess with the magic system.

I have played some Rolemaster (many many moons ago) and things look vaguely familiar.  But I want my E Puncture Critical table! 

EDIT: This post was in response to Kajamba Lion, not TailSpinner, just to clarify!


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## Vargo (Mar 22, 2005)

I guess I'll head for a wizardly sort, then...  Aiming on blasting power and some utility spells.


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 23, 2005)

*JimAde, Vargo*: That all sounds fine.

*Tailspinner*: Cool beans. Glad to have you with us.  Your original stats are 88, 47, 55, 72, 90, 43, 63, 93.  And the re-roll: 88, 54, 62, 50, 62, 98, 53, 80.

*Everyone*: As far as character background, assume, again, that we're playing in a fairly standard D&D fantasy world (Greyhawkish) when you make your characters.  Create a background that fits that milieu, and we'll run with it.

Nick


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## Mark Causey (Mar 23, 2005)

I'll be playing a cleric/holy warrior kinda concept. Never played Greyhawk, what's a god of battle (good)?

I take it back, I'll be a warrior for the god of magic. Gives me plenty enough reason to want to go into a dungeon and actually leave with something of my own 

Okay, so I'm a Dwarven Holy Warrior, devoted to wrenching Magic, Gems and Baubles from the wretched infidels that stole them or unconscionably reaped from Mother Earth.

Now, onto the stats and skills.


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## JimAde (Mar 23, 2005)

I'm working on my character.  Dwarf Fighter with entirely too much Endurance (+104).  I should have it done today.  Kajamba, do you want it posted here, or will you start a Rogue's Gallery thread?  Or I could e-mail it to you.


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## Mark Causey (Mar 23, 2005)

Two Dwarfs ... are we from the same clan, JimAde?


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## linnorm (Mar 23, 2005)

Dibs on the first alt spot!


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## Vargo (Mar 23, 2005)

Something you guys may or may not find useful - I threw together a VERY quick + dirty spreadsheet for making a HARP character.  You can download it at http://www.oz.net/~inthane/harp.xls

On the "stats" page, don't edit anything that has a yellow background.  On the skills page, list your class's favored skill categories in cells O3-O9, and don't edit the following columns:

Ranks
Total Ranks
Rank Bonus
Total Bonus

Total DP spent on skills shows up in cell P1.  Enter the DP you wish to spend on the skill, and it will calculate your skill ranks, bonuses, etc.

For Stat bonus, enter the formula as either '=stat+stat' or '=stat*2' - where stat is st, co, ag, qu, sd, re, in, or pr.  So for a skill that uses in and re, you would enter '=in+re' in the stat column.

Works in Excel XP and Excel 2003, don't know about other versions.


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 23, 2005)

*Vargo*: Ooh.  That's cool.  Thanks!

*adamantineangel*: For ease of use, we can use the Player's Handbook gods, but I wouldn't worry about not being familiar with Greyhawk.

*JimAde*: You can post it in here.  When we have all four characters, I'll open a RG thread.

*linnorm*: If you actually want in, that's cool, too.  Have some stats: 94, 94, 91, 90, 78, 70, 70, 63.  Original stats are here, although I can't imagine you'll take them...

Okay, we're full.  

Nick


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## JimAde (Mar 23, 2005)

adamantineangel said:
			
		

> Two Dwarfs ... are we from the same clan, JimAde?



 Sure, why not?  I was planning on a backstory that included sending regular reports back to my clan elders on the doings of the outlanders.  Nothing really under-handed, but I figure if dwarves are mostly insular homebodies they might value reliable reports from the outside world.  

But let's not be too obnoxious to the benighted non-dwarves.  They can't help it. 

Also, I am basing all my dwarvish names and terms on Finnish (which is what I use for the dwarves in my home D&D campaign).  If you want to do so as well we'll have a nice unified sound.

Vargo: I downloaded a pretty full-featured HARP spreadsheet from HARP HQ.  It's been a big help for me:
http://www.harphq.com/charsheets.htm

I am using Johnathan Dale's sheet.


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## JimAde (Mar 23, 2005)

Question from a HAPR newbie: I am making a fighter, which supposedly has 4 important stats: Str, Con, Agility and Quickness.  I have 3 really high stats to use, so my question is: Which of Agility and Quickness should I "sacrifice" with a lower stat?  My fighting style will be the typical dwarven "stand and bash with axe" approach.  From the description of the stats, i was going to have agility lower, but it looks like agility is used in the combat skill calculations, right?


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## Vargo (Mar 23, 2005)

Heh.  I should have figured he would code something like that - somehow I missed it when I was looking earlier.

Trivia: Jonathan and I were friends when I was much younger, we lost touch when he moved out to the east coast for college.  Used to play Rolemaster together...


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 23, 2005)

*JimAde*: I like the idea of Finnish names for dwarves.  That's a neat touch.  As for the Quickness/Agility question...from a skill standpoint, I'd have to say run with Agility and sacrifice Quickness.  Not because of the weapon skills, so much as Armor using Ag.  I'm assuming that part and parcel of the stand and bash approach is that you generally take a beating, too.  I'm assuming that you'll want a high Armor skill so you don't get your ass kicked too badly.  That's what I would run with.  Anyone else?

Nick


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 23, 2005)

*Vargo*: Small world.


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## Mark Causey (Mar 23, 2005)

Are we using Training Packages?


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## Mark Causey (Mar 23, 2005)

The spreadsheet is calculating DPs wrong. A stat at 85 should give 7 DP, but I see it is giving 8. I haven't checked any other fringe numbers.


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 23, 2005)

*adamantineangel*: Training packages, yes.  Did you want to use one from the main book or put one together?  Let me know.  Which spreadsheet?  I'm using Jonathan Dale's, and it's working properly for me.


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## Vargo (Mar 23, 2005)

Which sheet, Jonathan's or mine?


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## Mark Causey (Mar 23, 2005)

Hmm, posts are accruing without me noticing .. anywho, Vargo's sheet gave me the error.

JimAde: wonderful. help me with a name, though  Think of me as the comedic cleric who made too much trouble for the church back home and was sent on a quest.

Nick: I'd like a TP, but none in the book work for me. I'll post in a bit the skills I'd like to focus on.


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## JimAde (Mar 23, 2005)

*Tutkia*

_EDIT: I'm yanking the conversation parts of this post and using it for just my character._

[sblock]
*Tutkijavieras* (One who finds out about foreigners) "Tutkia" - Dwarf Fighter (1)				
Hits: +104
PP: -5
Init: +11 (+6 with battle axe)
DB: +45
BMR: 7				

RR Bonuses:	Stamina +25  Will +3  Magic +22	


```
Stat	Bon.	Race	Total
Strength	98	+10	+2	+12
Constitution	99	+10	+5	+15
Agility		98	+10	+0	+10
Quickness	72	+5	+0	+5
Self-Discipline	71	+5	+4	+9
Reasoning	40	-4	+0	-4
Insight		55	+1	+0	+1
Presence	68	+4	+0	+4
```

*Weapon Skills*
Battle Axe         +67/+57 Large Slash (+10 on Slash Critical table)

Light Crossbow  +52/+42 Small Puncture (-10 on Puncture Crit table)
	Load in three rounds due to Speed Loader talent

MA Strike (6)    +57/+47 Small Crush (-1 on Crush Crit)

Aseeton (5)      +51
	MA Style (St)


*Armor:* Chain Mail (DB +40, Maneuver Penalty: -10, Casting Penalty: +6)				
*Talents/Abilities*
Dark Vision (Greater)
Dense Musculature
Stone Sense
Shield Training
Lightning Reflexes
Speed Loader (Crossbow)
Skill Specialization (Battle Axe)

*Key Skills*
Climbing (4) +42/+32
Appraisal (1) +2
Crafts: Glassblowing (6) +36/+26
Healing (4) +17
Lore: Local Region (1) -3
Perception (3) +25
Power Point Development (0) -5
Runes (1) +2
Armor Skills (6) +52
Endurance (6) 104
Jumping (5) +47/+37
Swimming (0) -28/-38
Locks & Traps (4) +31/+21
Stalking & Hiding (0) -6/-16

*Resistance*
Magic (4) +22, Stamina (0) +25, Will (0) +3	

*Languages*
Dwarven (S6/W6): +27/+27
Common (S4/W5): +17/+17
Signaling(Dwarf whistle) (2): +7

*Possessions*
Chainmail
Battleaxe
Light Crossbow
Quiver and 20 Bolts
Cloak and Hat
Backpack, Tent and Bedroll
Lock Picks
3 outfits
50 sheets paper, pens and ink (for reports home)
50' Rope
Fire bow and Tinderbox
2 Water Skins (when I drink water, I drink water and when I drink whiskey, I drink whiskey)
Whistle
Lantern and 3 oil flasks
Hammer & Pitons
2 weeks trail rations
whiskey

35 Silver Pieces in various denominations

*Disciple of Aseeton Training Package*
MA Strikes 3
Aseeton Style 3
Chi Focus 3
Heal 2
Armor 2
[/sblock]


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 23, 2005)

JimAde said:
			
		

> Also, I put ranks into a Strength-based Martial Art style I've named Aseeton (which means unarmed in Dwarvish) but the rules for doing this aren't actually in the Lite download. Can I buy ranks in a style like this without buy ranks in the "generic" MA strike first?




Nope.  You need to have as many or more ranks in MA Strike as you have in the Style.  As far as +57 being acceptable for a front line fighter's skill, it should be.  You seem to have done what you could within the strictures of what your character had available.  That works for me.

Nick


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## JimAde (Mar 23, 2005)

adamantineangel said:
			
		

> Hmm, posts are accruing without me noticing .. anywho, Vargo's sheet gave me the error.
> 
> JimAde: wonderful. help me with a name, though  Think of me as the comedic cleric who made too much trouble for the church back home and was sent on a quest.
> 
> Nick: I'd like a TP, but none in the book work for me. I'll post in a bit the skills I'd like to focus on.




Well my character's name is a "use name."  I'm going with the idea that Dwarves have a secret name that they don't tell to outsiders, and have a descriptive name/title that they normally use.  So my character's name Tutkijavieras comes from the words for "foreigner" and "investigator."  Before anybody asks, I don't actually speak Finnish and I'm sure I'm mangling this badly!   I just like to get a consistent feel to my names and if I make them up out of whole cloth they all sound the same.

So for your character, maybe your superiors have assigned you a descriptive name as a mild penance!

For priest I find "pappi" and "kirkkoherra".  Kirkkoherra sounds cooler.  Given my limited knowledge of German I assume it means "church man".  For joker I find "ilveilijä".

So we can mash them together to get Ilveilijäkirkkoherra, or Ilveili for short.  There are other options if you don't like that.  For example, there's "reimukas" meaning jolly and "huuliveikko" meaning funny guy.  So you could be Huuliveikkirkkoherra, or Huuli for short.


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## JimAde (Mar 23, 2005)

Ok Nick, I have fixed my MA ranks to have 3 MA Strikes and 3 in the style.  I don't even know how the MA rules work but I wanted some kind of backup in case I'm disarmed.  I also formatted the character a little better.  I'll get the bio written today or tomorrow.

*adamantineangel:* I saw that there is a whistle on the equipment list.  This gave me the idea that the Dwarves might have a "whistle code" for use in tunnels when they get separated, etc.  If we each spend one rank in Signaling(Dwarf whistle) it might be fun.  What do you think?


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## Mark Causey (Mar 23, 2005)

Call me Huuliveikkirkkoherra, or Reimukas for short 

*chime*

Reimukas: "You hear that? There's a phalanx of Dwarven Initiates o'er the breech. Are you ready to stand down?"

Goblin: "Th-that piercing sound? S-so, Initiates or not, they'll fall before our forces!"

Reimukas: "Hmm, maybe so. But Initiates don't travel anywhere without their Mentor Masters. I wonder where they are?"

Goblin: "S-see? Goblin-army, goblin-friends! This petch is full of punk!"

*chime*
Reimukas laughes hartily. "Oh, I forgot!" *chime* "Now they're on their way. Good. Let us begin!"

Okay, enough of that for now  Uhm, do the skills I get from my Deep Warrens count against my max skill ranks? The TP I would like to be in would focus on some Priestly Skills, Gem Appraising, and Mine (Treasure!) Mapping. So:

Appraisal
Attunement
Craft (Cartographer)
Healing
Runes
Spell Casting


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 23, 2005)

*JimAde*: How do you picture Tutkia fighting when he uses the MA style?  Is it just brawling?  What sort of forms does it emphasize?  What advantages does Astoneen give him?  If you can answer these, we can whip something up.  

Nick


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 23, 2005)

*adamantineangel*: Adolescent ranks (what you get from the Deep Warrens culture) are free.  As for the training package, we could say that makes you an Initiate of the Underhalls/[Insert God name here].  Your training package can have no more than 20 skill ranks in it, minimum of 2 per skill and max of 5.  When you're done dividing those up, figure out how much taking all those skills would cost [skills from your favored categories cost 2/rank and skills from others cost 4/rank] and then find out 25% of that.  Does that make sense?

As for Spellcasting, all spells are purchased individually, you'd have to pick a specific spell (or spells) to purchase.

Nick


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## JimAde (Mar 23, 2005)

Kajamba Lion said:
			
		

> *JimAde*: How do you picture Tutkia fighting when he uses the MA style?  Is it just brawling?  What sort of forms does it emphasize?  What advantages does Astoneen give him?  If you can answer these, we can whip something up.
> 
> Nick



 Astoneen focuses on powerful strikes and parries.  The philosphy of "one strike" conflict-ending blows is emphasized.  It capitalizes on the Dwarven ability to withstand a foe's initial blows to get inside his guard for devastating strikes to the vitals.  It also teaches powerful, stable stances and at higher levels teaches unbalancing and throws (that is, it's a "complete" martial art but my character doesn't have ranks in sweeps yet  ).  Rumors persist of great Astoneen masters who can project their immense strength outside their bodies to affect foes at a distance!

How's that?


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## Mark Causey (Mar 23, 2005)

Kajamba Lion said:
			
		

> *adamantineangel*: Adolescent ranks (what you get from the Deep Warrens culture) are free.




Right, but if I have 3 free Adolescent ranks, and my rank max is 6, can I purchase only 3 more? Or do these tack on to my skill purchases? To return to my example, can I purchase 3 more or 6 more?



			
				Kajamba Lion said:
			
		

> As for the training package, we could say that makes you an Initiate of the Underhalls/[Insert God name here].  Your training package can have no more than 20 skill ranks in it, minimum of 2 per skill and max of 5.  When you're done dividing those up, figure out how much taking all those skills would cost [skills from your favored categories cost 2/rank and skills from others cost 4/rank] and then find out 25% of that.  Does that make sense?




Makes perfect sense, just didn't know if you wanted to rule on the skills or have me do so. JimAde, help me come up with the god's name!



			
				Kajamba Lion said:
			
		

> As for Spellcasting, all spells are purchased individually, you'd have to pick a specific spell (or spells) to purchase.




Oh, I thought it was an all purpose spell casting skill. Didn't read far enough. I'll replace it with Signaling to go with JimAde's idea. Signaling, faux-signaling, encoded signaling, it's how the Dwarves have warred with topsiders, other clans, and below-dwellers for eons!

Initiate of the Underhalls Training Package

```
Skill                   Ranks
Appraisal                 2
Attunement                2
Craft (Cartographer)      1
Healing                   1
Signaling                 2

16 * .75 = 12 point TP
```


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## linnorm (Mar 23, 2005)

Kajamba Lion said:
			
		

> *linnorm*: If you actually want in, that's cool, too.  Have some stats: 94, 94, 91, 90, 78, 70, 70, 63.  Original stats are here, although I can't imagine you'll take them...
> 
> Okay, we're full.
> 
> Nick




Sweet!  Count me in then.  I'll try to get my character together tonight.


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## JimAde (Mar 23, 2005)

If we're using the generic Greyhawk gods, the Dwarven god is Moradin.  But if we want to have our own Dwarven pantheon with a nice Finnish feel you'll have to describe the god's portfolio.  Then we can kick names around.  Here are a few name-elements that we might find useful:

```
gem	jalokivi
gem-cutter	jalokiviseppä
lord	herra, ruhtinas, loordi
king	pohatta, kuningas, kurko (informal)
queen	kuningatar
lady	nainen, rouva, täti, leidi, aatelisnainen
cavern	ontelo
cave	kolo, onkalo, luola
glitter	kipinä, loistaa, kimaltaa, välke, hohtaa, välkkyä
shining	kiiltävä, säihkyvä, välkkyvä, kiillotettu, hohtava
jewel	koru, jalokivikoru, jalokivi, korut
```


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## Mark Causey (Mar 23, 2005)

I was gonna go with Cave Jewel King, but that led to possible connotations to a white supremicist group (K.K.K. were the initials).

How about Välkejalokivikungatar, Queen of Glittering Gems, and her Warriors are the Valkyre. I guess I just became a female Dwarf!

Nick, do your dwarven females have beards? I don't mind either way


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## JimAde (Mar 23, 2005)

Just because she's a goddess doesn't mean she can't have male warriors working for her. 

I love the name, though.  I think I've just yoinked it for a goddess in my homebrew, thanks!


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## Guest 11456 (Mar 23, 2005)

I think i will bow out. You have the original 4 that you wanted. Good luck with the game.

Tailspinner


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## linnorm (Mar 24, 2005)

I didn't get as far as I hoped with my char, but I'll post my concept at least.  Hopefully I'll be able to finish him up and post him tomorrow.

Gunnar Ullersson
Rural Human Ranger 1

Gunnar grew up in the forest at the foot of the mountains of a dwarven clan.  This afforded him the opportunity to learn a little of the dwarven language and culture during trading trips to the mountain halls of the dwarves.  Gunnar's main focus has been the woodcraft of his forefathers, something he learned well and has earned the right to venture into the wider world for a time.


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 24, 2005)

*Tailspinner*: I'm happy to run with five, so please don't bow out unless you really want to.  I'd like to have you aboard.

*linnorm*: That'll work.  

*JimAde*: You can certainly make up a name for the dwarf god; that works for me.  Or...Moradin can always be the human name for the main dwarven god (or some sort of odd composite god that humans think dwarves worship).  Just throwing out ideas here.  I'll have something on the fighting style tomorrow...

*adamantineangel*: The answer is no for the female dwarf beards, although humans and elves widely believe that they do have them.  As for the adolescent skill ranks, they don't count.  They're a separate entity as far as I can see.  Finally, the package looks fine to me.

Nick


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## Vargo (Mar 24, 2005)

Guys,

I'm going to have to back out.   Things just got crazy for me.

Too bad, because my Elf/Dwarf wizard was getting fun.


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 24, 2005)

*Vargo*: That's too bad, man.  But I understand and hope things get a little less crazy for you.


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## JimAde (Mar 24, 2005)

Välkejalokivikungatar it is then!  She'll be my primary deity, too, though my character isn't a priest or anything.  Just a head-basher. 

So we've got two dwarves and a human with close ties to the dwarves.  I sense a theme.  

Sorry to see Vargo leave, but I understand how that goes.  If Tailspinner stays we're all set.  Nick, I see you changed the thread title to pull in another player.  Cool.

*admantineangel*: Since our backgrounds are already tied together, should we just assume our characters know each other and are traveling together?  Maybe whatever it is that you did to annoy your superiors we did together.  Maybe you're the "get into trouble" type and I'm the boring friend who invariably gets dragged along.


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## Guest 11456 (Mar 24, 2005)

Kajamba Lion said:
			
		

> *Tailspinner*: I'm happy to run with five, so please don't bow out unless you really want to.  I'd like to have you aboard.






			
				Vargo said:
			
		

> Guys,
> 
> I'm going to have to back out.   Things just got crazy for me.
> 
> Too bad, because my Elf/Dwarf wizard was getting fun.




OK. I guess we need a wizard? I'll wade into that stuff now? Can I have Vargo's rolls? (97, 47, 74, 99, 56, 78, 52, 87)


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## Mark Causey (Mar 24, 2005)

JimAde said:
			
		

> Välkejalokivikungatar it is then!  She'll be my primary deity, too, though my character isn't a priest or anything.  Just a head-basher.
> 
> So we've got two dwarves and a human with close ties to the dwarves.  I sense a theme.
> 
> ...




We could even go as far as brother and sister, and you're always getting us out of the trouble I get us in. Or, if not siblings, then inseperable childhood friends.

God, this is a lot more complicated than I'd originally thought (the crunch of character creation, that is).


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 24, 2005)

*Tailspinner*: Good deal.  If you want Vargo's rolls, feel free to take them.

*JimAde*: For the fighting style, I'm co-opting the following from HARP's Martial Law supplement.  You might want to change some of your skills (we can always put together a training package if you like so you can gain the Chi Focus skill and Stone Fist technique).  For the throws, it'd probably require a Hard or Very Hard Maneuver Roll with the Chi Focus skill with an appropriate technique (something like the Stone Fist).  Would this work?



			
				Martial Law said:
			
		

> Astoneen (Elemental Style: Earth) – This is a sturdy defensive style. A character using this style gains a +20 to DB when parrying, and to all attempts to resist being knocked down or moved. Additionally, when using this style, the character may use the skill Chi Focus (Medium Maneuver Roll) to initiate the Stone Fist. When using the Stone Fist, all attacks are resolved on the Impact Critical Table. Use of the Stone Fist follows the normal rules for using Chi Skills. It takes one full round to initiate the Stone Fist technique.
> (Combat – SD/Co – Combat)



Let me know what you think.

Nick


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 24, 2005)

*adamantineangel*: I agree about character creation.  It is a lot harder than it needs to be, I think, but the more I read the system, the more impressed I am with its simplicity.  The actual system feels very straightforward IMO.


Nick


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## JimAde (Mar 24, 2005)

That sounds way cool, but I have two problems:

1) I don't know where I would scrounge up the skill points
2) Since I don't actually have the rule books I would feel bad about having character features that rely on them.

I didn't realize the MA rules were so complicated.  Maybe I should just dump the 6 ranks in brawling and call it good.


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 24, 2005)

*JimAde*: Whichever you prefer works for me, but that is the entirety of the rule from Martial Law.  A training package could help with the skill points, as it'd reduce the cost of the skills by 75%.  Let me know what you want to do.

Nick


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## Mark Causey (Mar 24, 2005)

What does specializing in a skill do for you?

I was gonna purchase Appraisal, but it says you can specialize ...

Also, the Racial Bonuses ... those get added to the Stat Bonus, not the Stat, right?


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## Citizen Mane (Mar 24, 2005)

*adamantineangel*: Two answers: (1) Skill Specialization is a talent, costs 10 DP, and gives you a +10 bonus to that skill.  It can be bought up to three times/skill. (2) Pick an item (say, gems) that you're familiar with.  You're more accurate when you try to appraise that than other things.  I think this is what you're talking about.  And, yes, racial stat bonuses apply to stat bonuses, not stats.

Nick


----------



## Mark Causey (Mar 24, 2005)

Kajamba Lion said:
			
		

> *adamantineangel*: Two answers: (1) Skill Specialization is a talent, costs 10 DP, and gives you a +10 bonus to that skill.  It can be bought up to three times/skill. (2) Pick an item (say, gems) that you're familiar with.  You're more accurate when you try to appraise that than other things.  I think this is what you're talking about.  And, yes, racial stat bonuses apply to stat bonuses, not stats.
> 
> Nick




Cool, and the Stat Bonuses question?


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 24, 2005)

*adamantineangel*: Last sentence of the quote.    I think you were quoting me while I was editing.


----------



## Mark Causey (Mar 24, 2005)

heh.


----------



## JimAde (Mar 24, 2005)

My HARP Lite rules say this for Skill Specialization:



			
				HARP Lite said:
			
		

> The character is capable of great focus in learning.
> This is reflected in him gaining a one time +10 bonus to a
> single skill. This Talent may be taken no more than three
> times, for a different skill each time.




If I can take it up to three times per skill, I'm going to dump Speed Loader and drop another +10 on Battle Axe. 

As far as the MA, I'll try to take another look at it.  I have to run off to some training now so I won't be able to look at it until at least tonight, or more likely tomorrow.  Since nobody else has their character done yet I guess I have a little time.

*adamantineangel*: Siblings would be cool if it's OK with Kajamba.  I think you should be a little older to explain why I always let you talk me into things when I should know better.


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 24, 2005)

*JimAde*: That's the first definition that I gave.  Under the Appraisal skill, it says that he can take it as a general skill or specialize in a specific class of objects (which changes the accuracy to 5-10% from 15-25%).  Don't worry about the character too much.  We're not under deadline. 

As for siblings, that's cool with me.

Nick


----------



## JimAde (Mar 24, 2005)

Kajamba Lion said:
			
		

> *JimAde*: That's the first definition that I gave.  Under the Appraisal skill, it says that he can take it as a general skill or specialize in a specific class of objects (which changes the accuracy to 5-10% from 15-25%).  Don't worry about the character too much.  We're not under deadline.
> 
> As for siblings, that's cool with me.
> 
> Nick



 Right, but my point is that you said 







			
				Kajamba Lion said:
			
		

> (1) Skill Specialization is a talent, costs 10 DP, and gives you a +10 bonus to that skill. It can be bought up to three times/skill.




But the rule seems to say "up to three times, but only once/skill.  So it seems like you're saying it can stack on the same skill up to three times.  Is that right?


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 24, 2005)

*JimAde*: You're right.  I misread that.  Sorry about that.

Nick


----------



## JimAde (Mar 24, 2005)

Kajamba Lion said:
			
		

> *JimAde*: You're right.  I misread that.  Sorry about that.
> 
> Nick



 Cool.  Makes sense that it wouldn't stack.

Now I really am off to training!   Catch you tomorrow.


----------



## Mark Causey (Mar 24, 2005)

Are the 20 spells that Clerics get 20 spells with one skill rank, or just a list to choose from when putting DP in for those spells?

Or is the cost the Mana cost? Man, I'm so~ close to being done.


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 24, 2005)

*adamantineangel*: The 20 spells are just a list to choose from.  You do need to spend DPs on skill ranks to be able to cast spells (to cast a spell you need skill ranks equal to the amount of PPs to cast it — you only need to buy 1 rank in Counterspell to be able to cast it, but you'll need more ranks to be able to scale it at all).


----------



## Mark Causey (Mar 24, 2005)

Okay, so treat each spell as a skill, and I get to create a list of 20 to choose from. I must have at least 1 rank per the base PP to be able to cast it at its base form. To be able to ramp a spell at all, I must still have enough ranks to equal that new cost.


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 24, 2005)

*adamantineangel*: You got it.


----------



## Mark Causey (Mar 24, 2005)

```
[B]Huuliveikkirkkoherra[/B] "Reimukas" - Dwarf Cleric (1)				
Hits: 
PP: 
Init: +10
DB: 
BMR: 7'				

RR Bonuses: Stamina +26  Will +18  Magic +18	

		Stat	Bon.	Race	Total
Strength        51 (49) +1      +2      +3
Constitution    52 (52) +1      +5      +6
Agility         67 (67) +4      +0      +4
Quickness       60 (60) +2      +0      +2
Self-Discipline 46 (46) +0      +4      +4
Reasoning       86 (86) +8      +0      +8
Insight         86 (85) +8      +0      +8
Presence        86 (85) +8      +0      +8
-----------------------------------------------
4 DP

[B]Weapon Skills[/B]
Short Blades +10
Light Crossbow +9

[B]Armor:[/B] 
			
[B]Talents/Abilities[/B]
Dark Vision (Greater)
Dense Musculature
Stone Sense
Training Package
-----------------------
30 DP

[B]Key Skills[/B]
Skills                     Rank
Climbing                   +8  (no ranks)
Weapon: Shortblade         +16 (+2 Combat Category)
Weapon: Crossbows          +12  (+1 Combat Category)
Appraisal                  +27 (+2 TP)
Craft: Cartography         +15 (no ranks)
Healing                    +16 (no ranks)
Mundane Lore: Local        +17 (no ranks)
Perception                 +18 (+1 General Category)
Signaling                  +26 (+2 TP)
Attunement                 +16 (no ranks)
Power Point Development    +52 (+4 Mystic Arts Category, +2 ranks)
Runes                      +37 (+4 Mystic Arts Category)
Armor                      +14 (+1 Physical Category)
Endurance                  +90 (+2 Physical Category, +4 ranks)
Locks and Traps            +24 (+2 Subterfuge Category)
Stalking and Hiding        +13 (+1 Subterfuge Category

----------------------------
24 DP

[B]Spells 16/20[/B]
Arcane Bolt           2/-
Bless                 4/4
Counterspell          1/-
Divine Hammer         5/-
Elemental Bolt        4/-
Elemental Weapon      3/3
Harm                  3/3
Light                 6/-
Minor Healing         3/3
Major Healing         4/-
Nature's Strength     3/3
Restoration           3/-
Shock                 4/-
Sleep                 4/-
Summon Animal         5/-
Tree Skin             4/-
-----------------------------
0 DP

[B]Resistance[/B]
Magic +26, Stamina +18, Will +18	

[B]Possessions[/B]

Total: 58 DP = Starting DP 29 x 2
```


----------



## linnorm (Mar 24, 2005)

Here's my finished (I think) character, sblocked for space.  I used the Dale Excel sheet from harphq to do the math.  Also, I took the Bounty Hunter TP.

[sblock]

```
Gunner Ullersson
Rural Human
Ranger 1

Ht:    72			Wt:   176
Eyes: Brown			Age:  20
Hair:  Long, Auburn Braid	Sex:   Male

		Stat	Bon.	Race	Spec.	Total
Strength	94	+9	+2		+11
Constitution	90	+8	+0		+8
Agility		94	+9	+2		+11
Quickness	78	+6	+2		+8
Self-Discipline	70	+4	+0		+4
Reasoning	70	+4	+0		+4
Insight		91	+9	+2		+11
Presence	63	+3	+0		+3
		DP:	104

Initiative Modifier:		+19
Resistance Roll: Stamina	+36
Resistance Roll: Will		+28
Resistance Roll: Magic		+7
Concussion Hits:		72

Hits recovered / 8 hr rest:	9
Power Points:			55

PP recovered / 2 hr rest:	14

Encumbrance:		Light
Enc/Armor Penalty:	-10	This penalty applies to all Qu & Ag maneuvers (including Attacks).
Load		Wt	Mod	Max Pace
None		41	0	Dash
Light		71	-10	Fast Sprint
Medium		101	-20	Sprint
Heavy		131	-30	Run
Base Move Rate:		11	ft/rnd
Walk (Light)		11
Run (Medium)		22
Fast Run (Hard)		33
Sprint (Very Hard)	44
Dash (Extr. Hard)	55

Defensive Bonus
Total DB:		+36	 Qu DB:	+16
Soft Leather
ManPen:	0	Casting.Pen: 2	DB:	+20
	Other:			DB:	+0
	Talents			DB:	+0
	No Shield		DB:	+0

Weapon: Hand Axe
Fumble:	01-02	OB:	+32/+22
Size:	Small	Type:	Slash

Weapon: Short Bow
Fumble:	01-03	OB:	+47/+37
Size:	Small	Type:	Puncture

Treasure
Platinum:
Gold: 7
Silver: 4
Copper: 6
Gems:
Jewelry:

Fate Points: 3

Talents
Profession Adaptability
Bonus Skill Ranks
Skill Specialization
Tap Personal Mana
Focus Style (Gestural)
Focus Style (Verbal)
Shapechanger

Equipment		Cost (sp)			Wt
Arrows (40)		0.8			6
Backpack		0.2			2.5
Bedroll (Heavy)		0.7			9.5
Boots			1			3.5
Cloak			0.9			2.5
Flint & Steel		0.2			0.5
Hand Axe		5			3
Hat			0.6			1
Pants			0.3			1.5
Quiver (x2)		0.2			1
Shirt			0.3			1
Short Bow		6			2
Soft Leather		10			15
Tinderbox		0.1			0.25
Waterskin		0.1			1.25
	Total Cost (sp):	26.4	Total Weight:	50.5

						- Bonus Mods -
Skill				Ranks	Rank	Stat	Other	Total
Animal Handling: Horse		1	+5	+14		+19
Arcane Lore: Faerie Lore	1	+5	+8		+13
Armor Skills			4	+20	+22		+42
Attunement			1	+5	+22		+27
Beastmastery: Canine		1	+5	+14		+19
Crafts: Bowyer			3	+15	+15		+30/+20
Endurance			6	+30	+12	+30	+72
Foraging/Survival: Forest	6	+30	+15	+10	+55
Healing				1	+5	+15		+20
Herbcraft			1	+5	+15		+20
Language: Common (S)		4	+20	+15		+35
Language: Common (W)		3	+15	+15		+30
Language: Dwarven (S)		3	+15	+15		+30
Language: Northman (S)		6	+30	+15		+45
Language: Northman (W)		5	+25	+15		+40
Lore: Local Region		2	+10	+8		+18
Navigation			1	+5	+15		+20
Perception			4	+20	+15		+35
Power Point Development		2	+10	+15	+30	+55
Resistance: Stamina		2	+10	+16	+10	+36
Resistance: Will		2	+10	+8	+10	+28
Riding: Horse			2	+10	+15		+25/+15
Rope Mastery			3	+15	+15		+30/+20
Runes				1	+5	+15		+20
Sniping				3	+15	+15		+30/+20
Stalking & Hiding		5	+25	+15		+40/+30
Swimming			3	+15	+22		+37/+27
Tracking			6	+30	+15		+45
Weapon: Hand Axe		2	+10	+22		+32/+22
Weapon: Short Bow		5	+25	+22		+47/+37

Spells (Favored)
Universal
Minor Healing (3)		4	+20	+8		+28
Study Target (2)		4	+20	+8		+28
Ranger
Find Shelter (3)		3	+15	+15		+30
```
[/sblock]


----------



## driver8 (Mar 24, 2005)

Disregard, actually sorry..nothin to see here


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 25, 2005)

*adamantineangel*: Did you use the Dale spreadsheet for your character?  I only ask because you've got a ton of DPs in spells — you realize that it costs 2 DP/rank in a favored category and 4 DP/rank in a non-favored category?  By the time you get to Light, you've already spent 44 DP by my calculations.

*linnorm*: At a glance, he looks solid, but I'll go over him more carefully tomorrow morning.

Nick


----------



## Mark Causey (Mar 25, 2005)

*sigh* I'm so used to point for point skill systems that I went about that entirely wrong. Durnit! I'll revise @_@


Check my spell revision. I switched one point from stats into it. I think I have 3 spells I can cast.


----------



## Mark Causey (Mar 25, 2005)

Man, spellcasting almost doesn't seem worth it ... 42 points for 4 spells. Still, I'm about ready to rock. Gotta equip mah Valkyre and I'll be ready to go. Actually, come to think about it, seeing as Counterspell is the only 1PP spell, having it at base rank does nothing for me. Any suggestion on a better spell selection, all?


----------



## JimAde (Mar 25, 2005)

So, Nick, I'm re-visiting the martial arts thing again.  Is Stone Fist a skill I have to buy?  It's not in the Lite rules or the spreadsheet (no surprise).  If it is a skill, is it in one of my favored categories?  I'm trying to put together the Training Package.  I figure it will include MA Strikes, the actual style skill and Chi Focus.  Plus the Stone Fist skill if it exists.


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 25, 2005)

*JimAde*: Nope, Stone Fist is a special ability of the martial art.  To use it, you have to have ranks in Chi Focus and make a Medium Maneuver roll.

*adamantineangel*: As far as I can tell, things look a bit better.  As a side note, you might want to adjust your skills a bit more — your Endurance bonus translates directly to your Hits (even someone with a total roll of 11-20 during combat is going to do around 4-9 Hits of damage depending on the crit table), and your Power Point Development translates directly into your Power Points (it might mean being able to cast fewer spells more often, but staying alive longer).  Just some thoughts.  As for spellcasting not being worth it, it's becoming apparent to me that training packages are essential for spellcasters at some point (the idea of a priesthood or a mage guild training their casters in certain spells but not others does come to mind).  Without superhigh ability scores, it does expensive quickly.

Nick


----------



## JimAde (Mar 25, 2005)

Ok, so here's the TP I came up with (complete with smarmy flavor text).  Just smack me if it's too munchikin-ey:

*Student of Aseeton*

The Dwarven Aseeton masters teach their students to strike with the power of the very Earth.  To weather the blows of their enemies, they learn to move dextrously in heavy armor.  And given the vagaries of both real combat and hard training, they also study ways to re-align the body with the earth's energy.  Aseeton masters rarely teach their art to outsiders and any non-dwarves who show proficiency in it will be regarded with an extra measure of respect.

MA Strikes          3
Style (Aseeton)   3
Chi Focus           3
Healing              2
Armor                2

If you want me to yank out the healing and/or armor I will.


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 25, 2005)

*JimAde*: That looks fine to me.  By my count, the package costs 32 DPs before the 25% off kicks in, which'd make it cost 24 DPs — does that match what you've got? (Everything except Chi Focus is a preferred category.)

*adamantineangel*: I was just thinking that you might be a bit better off buying spells/Power Point Development ranks with a TP than the other stuff, particularly if that stuff's already in your favored categories.  If you'd like to work something out, let me know.

Nick


----------



## JimAde (Mar 25, 2005)

The spreadsheet makes it 25.  I think it's just a rounding thing.  Cool.  I'll correct my character sheet and call it done.  It also sounds like adamantineangel and I have a nebulous background as siblings who've been sent out among the great unwashed masses to keep us out of trouble. 

By the way, I bought additional ranks in the MA stuff outside the TP also.  That's ok, right?  The total ranks is still 6 or less in each skill.


----------



## Mark Causey (Mar 25, 2005)

I also just noticed that my TP has skills with less than rank 2. So, let me update it and add some spells to it. How does this work?

Initiate of the Underhalls/Välkejalokivikungatar's Valkyries Training Package

```
Skills                  Ranks
Appraisal                 2
Signaling                 2
Spells                  Ranks
Bless                     4
Elemental Weapon          3
Harm                      3
Minor Healing             3
Nature's Strength         3

40 * .75 = 30 point TP
```

If kosher, that would leave me with ... 24 points to buy other skills with. Does that seem right? I'm all googley-eyed now. --->@_@


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 25, 2005)

*adamantineangel*: That's good and should work well for you (10 DPs is a lot to save).  It's a wildly different system from d20, but once you get into it (as I've had the luck to be doing while y'all are creating characters), you can really do some nice stuff.  I'm loving the TP stuff.

Nick


----------



## Mark Causey (Mar 25, 2005)

Alright, I'll adjust my character sheet then. I've actually got skill points to spend instead of just the defaults!

Okay, I'm done. Check 'er out.


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 25, 2005)

*linnorm*: Your ranger looks good.

*JimAde*: Sorry for not getting back to you sooner on this (I missed your post when page 3 popped up).  That's fine — you can buy a skill as part of a TP and then buy more of it at the regular price.

*adamantineangel*: That's better.  You do need to redo your bonuses for the skills — each of the first 10 ranks you have in a skill gives you a +5 bonus to that skill, so (for example), your Power Point Development skill, which has 6 ranks in it (2 from the TP, 4 from your class) should have a total bonus of +52 (+10 for being a dwarf, +30 for skill ranks, +12 for SD/In), meaning you have 52 PP.  Likewise, your Endurance should be at +90 (+50 dwarf, +30 for skill ranks, +10 Stats), giving you 90 Hits.  Every skill should have a bonus that's the total of the bonus from ranks, the two ability score bonuses (or one bonus twice), and any other bonuses from race/talents/profession.  I think you'll see a marked change in how your character looks on paper.  

Nick


----------



## Mark Causey (Mar 25, 2005)

That's why skill ranks cost so much DP.

I assume I did okay on the purchasing of the correct minimum ranks to get the spells, though, right?


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 25, 2005)

*adamantineangel*: The spells are fine, you just need to carry out your bonuses for them and the rest of your skills (don't forget to do the same for your resistances).  Also, don't forget the -25 penalty for being unskilled.


----------



## Mark Causey (Mar 25, 2005)

-25 unskilled penalty on the Resistances?


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 25, 2005)

*adamantineangel*: Yep.  It's harsh, but they're worth the 1 rank each (at least).


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 26, 2005)

Here's a little map of the world, just so y'all have an idea of what's where (in case you decide to go back to town).  The keep (Carlamon's Tower) on the coast is the dungeon, and the forest surrounding it is a touch marshy.  Sufford-on-Windirune (think "windy" as in "twisty") is a small town — village, actually — in the northern part of the North Kingdom, subsisting on agriculture and the goods made by local craftsmen, which are sent off to the seat of the kingdom (off to the south) and sold.  Two men vie for leadership in the village: Canon Hegibert, who presides over the Church of St. Cuthbert, and Drogo, an ancient ranger-priest of the Old Faith.

Elves live in the forests, dwarves in the mountains.  Hobbits (halflings) and humans in and around Sufford-on-Windirune.  Rumors persist of a gryx encampment somewhere north of the Windyrune, and there've been reports of bandits (goblins, kobolds) in the Kingswood, potentially based in the tower.  Other than that, the area's as peaceful and idyllic as anyone could hope (or, if you'd rather, as peaceful and idyllic as any rustic village is in an FRPG).

Anyhow, thought this would be nice for y'all to know.  I thought that JimAde and adamantineangel's dwarves could be from someplace in/under the mountains on the map, and linnorm's ranger's family could live in the woods near the foothills (which'd give them plenty of contact with the dwarf clans).  Anyhow, if'n there're any questions or comments, let me know.  I was just goofin' around with Photoshop and thought I'd put what was in my head down onto paper.

Nick


----------



## JimAde (Mar 28, 2005)

Cool.  Since you haven't specified, I'd suggest the Dwarven homeland be called Alamaailmakoti, which simply means underground home.  Their main city could be called 
Välkeonkalokaupunki: City of the Glittering Cavern.


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 28, 2005)

*JimAde*: Cool.  That works for me and keeps the whole Finnish thing going on for naming conventions.

Nick


----------



## Guest 11456 (Mar 28, 2005)

[sblock]
Name: Gallen Spillage
Race: Elf
Culture: Sylvan
Profession: Mage 1

Hits: +31
PP: +82
Init: +20
DB: +16
BMR: 10

RR Bonuses:
Stamina +12
Will +10
Magic +54

St: 56 (+2)
Co: 52 (+1)
Ag: 78 (+7)
In: 97 (+12)
SD: 47 (+0)
Qu: 74 (+8)
Re: 99 (+11)
Pr: 87 (+12)

Weapon Skills:
Weapon: (melee) +19
Weapon: (missile) +14

Armor:
No armor

Talents/Enhancements:
Enhanced Senses
Quiet Stride
Night Vision
Sense Magic
Tap Personal Mana
Focus Style (Gestural)
Focus Style (Verbal)

Key Skills:
Dancing (2) 29
Climbing (2) 19
Herbcraft (1) 28
Lore: Local Region (1) 27
Perception (1) 27
Resistance: Magic (2) 54
Resistance: Stamina (2) 17
Resistance: Will (2) 15
Public Speaking (2) 34
Attunement (6) 54
Power Point Development (6) 82
Runes (2) 33
Riding: _______________ (1) 12
Tracking (2) 22
Armor Skills (1) 14
Endurance (2) 31
Swimming (1) 14
Stalking & Hiding (3) 47
Arcane Bolt (2) (6) 41
Counterspell (1) (6) 41
Light (6) (6) 41
Elemental Ball: Fire (6) (6) 41
Elemental Bolt: Fire (4) (6) 41
Fire Wall (4) (6) 41
Mage Armor (4) (4) 31							

Resistance:
Magic (2) 54
Stamina (2) 17
Will (2) 15

Langauges:						
Racial (S6/W5): 53/48
Common (S4/W3): 43/38
[/sblock]


----------



## Rhialto (Mar 28, 2005)

Is there room for one more?   

Postscript--Guess not.  Well, enjoy yourselves...


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 28, 2005)

*Rhialto*: If you want in, I am recruiting (the title's correct).  Let me know.

*Tailspinner*: I don't have time to check the math now, but it looks solid to me at first glance.

*Everyone*: This is a wicked week for me.  I'm not going to be able to get things kicked off until Saturday at the earliest, and there'll be a couple days when I don't even get on here.  Just wanted to let y'all know.  

Nick


----------



## Guest 11456 (Mar 28, 2005)

I used the auto character maker mentioned earlier. So hopefully it is all correct.


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 28, 2005)

*Tailspinner*: I'm sure it is then.  Dale's spreadsheet is solid.


----------



## Rhialto (Mar 28, 2005)

Nah, I guess I'll skip.  A bit too complicated for my tastes.


----------



## linnorm (Mar 29, 2005)

Kajamba Lion said:
			
		

> *Everyone*: This is a wicked week for me.  I'm not going to be able to get things kicked off until Saturday at the earliest, and there'll be a couple days when I don't even get on here.  Just wanted to let y'all know.
> 
> Nick




Just holler when you're ready.


----------



## JimAde (Mar 29, 2005)

linnorm said:
			
		

> Just holler when you're ready.



 Yep.  I think we're all about ready.  Should be fun!


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 29, 2005)

*Rhialto*: Fair enough.  

*Everyone*: I'm going to try and post the first post tonight, believe it or not (as I've found some free time), but I may not get to it.  In the meantime, please post completed characters in this RG thread (no need to spoiler them, as I'm going to need to be able to reference them quickly).

thanks,
Nick


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 29, 2005)

Game On!

Just a little something to get us going...

Nick


----------



## der_kluge (Mar 30, 2005)

You still looking for one more?  I'm guessing not since it seems you've already started..


----------



## Mark Causey (Mar 30, 2005)

Please join us, die_kluge, so we can better Game Day this system!


----------



## der_kluge (Mar 30, 2005)

adamantineangel said:
			
		

> Please join us, die_kluge, so we can better Game Day this system!




Well, I'd like to, but I suspect Kajamba Lion is the final authority on such matters. 

I can have a Harper ready rather quickly.


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 31, 2005)

*die_kluge*: Throw a character together; I'd be happy to take a fifth.   Here're your two sets to pick from — (1) Roll 1: 45, 90, 64, 70, 83, 69, 71, 47, and (2) Roll 2: 90, 85, 50, 91, 78, 83, 62, 86.

Nick


----------



## der_kluge (Mar 31, 2005)

Kajamba Lion said:
			
		

> *die_kluge*: Throw a character together; I'd be happy to take a fifth.   Here're your two sets to pick from — (1) Roll 1: 45, 90, 64, 70, 83, 69, 71, 47, and (2) Roll 2: 90, 85, 50, 91, 78, 83, 62, 86.
> 
> Nick




Great. I'll have something for you in the morning.


----------



## der_kluge (Mar 31, 2005)

I was going to make a harper, but the character concept I started developing worked better as a thief.  So, here he is:
http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?p=2132645#post2132645

BTW, that second roll is way better than the first. Because HARP's character creation is so heavily influenced by the stats, I think a point buy is the way to go. It ensures that everyone starts out with the same DPs that way.


----------



## Citizen Mane (Mar 31, 2005)

*die_kluge*: Cool.    After this experience, I agree with you completely on the point-buy issue.  But I wanted to roll stats this once and see what happened.  If I could have left well-enough alone, it'd probably have worked fine, but then I saw one roll go high and I tried to comp for the rest with multiple rolls.  Oh well.    Next time...

Nick


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## der_kluge (Apr 1, 2005)

I find HARP to be really flexible, but there are numerous little bitty things that I think should be corrected.  Hopefully one of these days they'll release a 2nd edition, and they'll fix all the little things. I think there are some ways to simplify combat, and they could get rid of those criticals tables altogether really easily. The skill check table is also kind of unnecessary. They should just assign movement based on race, not based on height. So, in that respect it kind of penalizes females (something I consider an RPG taboo) since females are generally shorter, and thus have a slightly lower BMR. It would also simplify looking up that BMR chart.  

Just little bitty things like that that would make the system just that much more easy. But I still really like the flexibility, and the magic system, and the fact that I can completely and totally create the kind of character I want.


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## Citizen Mane (Apr 1, 2005)

die_kluge said:
			
		

> The skill check table is also kind of unnecessary.



Everything else, I'll agree with, although I'm curious about this one.  It's not that I don't agree so much as I'm curious as to how you'd replace it — I have a couple ideas (like using an opposed roll/open-ended roll combo and basing results off the number rolled on the die, without referencing a table), but I'd like to hear yours.

Nick


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## der_kluge (Apr 1, 2005)

Kajamba Lion said:
			
		

> Everything else, I'll agree with, although I'm curious about this one.  It's not that I don't agree so much as I'm curious as to how you'd replace it — I have a couple ideas (like using an opposed roll/open-ended roll combo and basing results off the number rolled on the die, without referencing a table), but I'd like to hear yours.
> 
> Nick




Yea, that's it. As I understand it, when you roll an RR, you have to look up the target on the table. So, if the monster rolls a 92, the target is a 100, based on what the table says. And so to beat it, you have to roll a 101.  I think simply rolling a 93 would make more sense, and would at least eliminate that particular column of that table. I haven't really thought about the other kinds of rolls too much, but I'm sure they could be eliminated in a similar way.

It's like they did it to simplify the process, and ended up just making it more time consuming.


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## Mark Causey (Apr 12, 2005)

My workplaced has decided (correctly so) that bulletin boards reduce productivity from their workers. I've steathfully logged in to a remote machine (my home) and posted this message.

I can only look at these boards on the weekends, and on those days I haven't the time to continue any sort of PbP.

See you (rarely) on the boards,

Mark C.


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## JimAde (Apr 12, 2005)

adamantineangel: Bummer.  Tutkia's just not going to be the same without his sister. 

Oh, well.  Can't say I blame your employer (it's their network after all) but we'll miss you in the game.  Take care.


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## Citizen Mane (Apr 12, 2005)

*adamantineangel*: I'm sorry to hear that.  If things ever change, we're here.  And I'll see you around the boards.

Nick


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## JimAde (May 4, 2005)

Well, Kajamba Lion has posted saying that he's taking a break from RPGs for a while.  I just want to say that the game was fun while it lasted and thanks to Nick for running it.  I guess that's it for this game, unless someone else is able and willing to pick it up?

Nick, if you're still reading this I have a question: Is this, in fact, the Temple of Elemental Evil?  The moat-house and giant frogs looked awfully familiar. 

Anyway, here's Nick's post:
http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?p=2220294#post2220294


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## Citizen Mane (May 4, 2005)

Thanks for the kind words.  

Yeah, this was going to be ToEE with a few changes in the monster palette.

best,
Nick


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