# Ring of Fast Healing



## wysiwyg (Aug 15, 2010)

How much would you decide is the cost of a ring of fast healing (has a continuous cure light wounds spell)? 
Is there something in the official rules to determine the cost?

Since the Forge Ring requires a 7th level caster, how many would this ring cure every round (1d8+5), assuming one does not wish to roll every round?


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## Werebat (Aug 15, 2010)

The obvious is to check ring of regeneration for a reference.


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## Anguish (Aug 15, 2010)

wysiwyg said:


> How much would you decide is the cost of a ring of fast healing (has a continuous cure light wounds spell)?
> Is there something in the official rules to determine the cost?
> 
> Since the Forge Ring requires a 7th level caster, how many would this ring cure every round (1d8+5), assuming one does not wish to roll every round?




There's no real solid formula for this, regardless of what you're doing.  Fast Healing is generally one, two, maybe three hit points per round, not a continuous 1d8+5 (average 9.5 hp per casting).  Fast Healing 9.5 would be ludicrously expensive.  Fast Healing 1 is complicated enough.

If I were making such an item I might do something where it only works up to 1/2 normal hit points.  A _ring of desperation healing_ that grants Fast Healing 1 while its wearer is at or below one half of their normal hit point total and requires 24 hours to attune to its wearer might be reasonable to price somewhere around the 30,000gp mark.  That's _totally_ ball-parking it.  If it's priced much higher it wouldn't be purchased.  (Who'd ever pay 100,000gp for a FH1 ring?)  If it's priced lower it'd probably be a no-brainer item.

Try this for a formula.  Price is 20,000gp + Fast Healing Granted squared * 10,000gp.

FH1 would be 20,000gp + 1^2 * 10,000 = 30,000gp
FH2 would be 20,000gp + 2^2 * 10,000 = 60,000gp
FH3 would be 20,000gp + 3^2 * 10,000gp = 110,000gp

Seems reasonable to me.


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## wysiwyg (Aug 15, 2010)

I want to know if any of the formulas given in DMG can apply here? It's all good and nice to guestimate what it should be worth, but is there nothing in the rules about creating an item that has a once off spell functioning continuously?


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## frankthedm (Aug 15, 2010)

wysiwyg said:


> I want to know if any of the formulas given in DMG can apply here? It's all good and nice to guestimate what it should be worth, but is there nothing in the rules about creating an item that has a once off spell functioning continuously?



The formulas generally don't account for an item this _powerful_. Epic item rules have a similar item that can be made once you have epic feats and 35 ranks in arcana and spellcraft.

*Forge Epic Ring [Item Creation][Epic]*
Prerequisites
Forge Ring, Knowledge (arcana) 35 ranks, Spellcraft 35 ranks.

*Benefit*
You can forge magic rings that exceed the normal limits for such items. 

*Rapid Healing*
This ring grants a living wearer fast healing 3. It must be worn for 24 hours before its powers activate, and if removed it will not function again until it has been worn for 24 hours by the same individual.
Caster Level: 20th; Prerequisites: Forge Ring, *Forge Epic Ring*, regenerate; Market Price: *300,000* gp


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## jefgorbach (Aug 15, 2010)

I disagree with Anguish because I'm getting a far more reasonable $3,519 cost using the standard Item Creation rules.  

Note since RAW doesnt say the person forging the ring needs to be the same person casting the enchantment(s), you'd be far better off have a first level cleric cast the Cure Light Wounds spell; especially since it caps a 1d8+5 per round. This saves $12,000 ... enough to purchase three of the rings!

Secondly, you dont mention if you have the Forge Ring feat or need to hire someone to do the actual forging. I presumed the latter, using the DMG suggestion NPC Spellcaster's should charge player's 10gp per spell level × their caster level to cast spells (additional to any component and xp expenses) since its not listed in the SRD(?). Hiring someone to use a feat isnt specified, but is similiar enough that using the same formula should be reasonable. Thus hiring a 7th level NPC to use Forge Ring would be $70gp.



7th level NPC to forge ring  (7th level NPC * 10g per level)                            70
Cure Light Wound cast by 1st level cleric as constant effect (1 x 1 x 2000)  2,000
Cure Light Wounds has no material components                                             -
Cure Light Wounds has no Xp components                                                    -
thus base gold cost                                                                        =  2,070
xp creation cost = 5(base/25) =                                                              414
cost of basic supplies cost = base/2 =                                                   1,035
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
final cost =                                                                                       3,519gp

Result is a ring which heals 1d8+1 hit points per round while worn by an injured creature. 
Presume 5hp if you dont feel like rolling each round.  

At $3,500, its slightly more expensive than a Ring of Feather Falling ($2,200) which also continously generates a first level spel effect and thus seems reasonably within the pricing ballpark.


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## Maidhc O Casain (Aug 15, 2010)

That seems a little . . . off . . . to me. I'm not an expert on item creation, or really on anything else D&D/Pathfinder related, but as a GM I've gotta say there's no WAY I'd allow a character to pick this item up for a measly 3000 GP.

(See the 300,000 GP price tag on the ring in frankthedm's post, or the 90,000 GP tag on the Ring of Regeneration - which does allow regeneration of limbs, but only 1 HP/Round).

Also, as this it the Pathfinder forum, I feel compelled to mention that there is no XP cost for item creation in Pathfinder.


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## frankthedm (Aug 16, 2010)

jefgorbach said:


> At $3,500, its slightly more expensive than a Ring of Feather Falling ($2,200) which also continously generates a first level spel effect and thus seems reasonably within the pricing ballpark.



Pricing a magic item is not *G.U.R.P.S.* character creation. In no way are unlimited feather fall and unlimited cure light wounds in the same ballpark.



			
				Pathfinder said:
			
		

> Not all items adhere to these formulas. First and foremost, these few formulas aren't enough to truly gauge the exact differences between items. The price of a magic item may be modified based on its actual worth. The formulas only provide a starting point. The pricing of scrolls assumes that, whenever possible, a wizard or cleric created it. Potions and wands follow the formulas exactly. Staves follow the formulas closely, and other items require at least some judgment calls.






			
				3.5 said:
			
		

> Not all items adhere to these formulas directly. The reasons for this are several. First and foremost, these few formulas aren’t enough to truly gauge the exact differences between items. The price of a magic item may be modified based on its actual worth. The formulas only provide a starting point. The pricing of scrolls assumes that, whenever possible, a wizard or cleric created it. Potions and wands follow the formulas exactly. Staffs follow the formulas closely, and other items require at least some judgment calls.


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## Kaisoku (Aug 16, 2010)

The continuous entry for making a magical item has a cost modifier based on the duration of the spell. It does *not* have a modifier for instantaneous.

I think that's because once an instantaneous effect goes off, it's done. There's no "ongoing effect" so it can't be made "continuous".

If you made a ring that allowed you to cast cure light wounds as a standard action, unlimited, then it would cost in that ballpark. Some people are still against this idea. I gave this to my players so they wouldn't have to nickel and dime cure wands every time they go into town, or check charges remaining, etc.

As for a ring of fast healing I, which is closer to what you are looking for (healing as long as you are alive), I'd go with what the ring of regeneration's price is: 90k.

It heals 1 point of damage (and one non-lethal, as that's how curative magic works) per round, forever. It also stops bleed damage and can re-attach/re-grow limbs.

If you made the fast healing work on only damage that's been dealt since wearing the ring (thus preventing swapping the ring from person to person to heal up after combat, etc), but not stop bleed or reattach limbs, then I'd cut the cost down a bit (around 60-75k maybe?).
You could have it heal any damage, but require 24 hours to attune, for a similarly abuse discouraging effect, while remaining different from the ring of regeneration (and less bookkeeping).

But yeah... a constant, "no action required" curative is quite strong. If it's just the "who cares" healing you are wanting, go with an unlimited-but-standard-action device that cures for the el cheapo pricing.


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## jefgorbach (Aug 16, 2010)

Mowgil - true, however Wysiwyg wasnt asking about a Ring of Regeneration. He inquired whether there is anything in RAW regarding item creation, and if so, what a ring enchanted with the 1st level Cure Light Wounds spell would cost. This is what I showed, presuming he’d want/prefer a continuous effect since using a Command Word for a 1st level effect only saves a few hundred gold.

As noted, a Ring of Regeneration costs significantly more ... because it reflects the cost of imbuing it with the much more effective and thus more expensive 7th level Regeneration spell. Will a ring of CLW reattach a severed arm? no. Will it regrow a damaged eye/ear? Again, no.  It will however stabilize an injured comrade and eventually ready him to fight again - just as if the cleric was standing nearby to cast the exact same 1st level spell. 

However RAW is subject to GM override, so it really comes down to the campaign's composition/style. Given the question is being raised implies (to me) the ring is designed to reduce the cleric's need to constantly cast CLW and repeated extended rests so he can renew this particular spell - in which case I would (and have) allow it to increase everyone's fun/enjoyment. 

Of course if you really dislike the ring THAT much, his cleric could still make his life easier by using the Scribe Scroll feat to make 83 CLW scrolls per day at $12gp each per RAW (1st level spell x 1st level cleric x 12gp base = $12gp; allowed $1,000gp value per day spent writing). A single day or two of writing should keep the group healthy enough between writing days to make decent headway on their chosen endeavors. (Additionally, he could sell the leftovers at $25 per RAW for a little bonus income)

Don’t like scrolls? Find a 3rd level cleric with Brew Potion and generate CLW potions for $25 a pop, but expect the group to be taking extended camping trips between adventures since he can only brew one a day. (Again, sell leftovers at $50 each)


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## Azmyth (Aug 16, 2010)

First of all, a rings with a 1st level spell 'in it' doesn't work the way the OP wants! If you want a wand of CLW, easy enough. But a ring that hits you with a CLW every round?! Any GM that would allow this item needs to have his head checked! And the suggested creation cost of a little over 3k?! Don't steer away from the Ring of Regeneration, let it bring you back to reality on this subject!

You aren't able to find rules to create the ring because its broken.


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## wysiwyg (Aug 16, 2010)

The problem with CLW is that it is probably the most common need that every PC has. Constantly. Unlike feather fall, which is needed once in every blue moon.

Here's my gut feeling about this -

Let's say we're going to base it on the ring of regeneration due to lack of any other precedent. The RoR costs 90,000 and cure 1HP/round plus other benefits too that are not as common or needed as our good ol' CLW. 

Does 45,000gp sound like to little/much to pay for a ring that will only cure 1HP/round?

Now imagine you could couple the effects of this ring with a periapt of wound closure thus doubling the healing rate (plus other benefits of the PoWC). The cost would now rise to 60,000gp giving 2HP/round of curing.

So we're down to a 60k ring that acts like a PoWC plus cures 2HP every round. The cost of this ring is probably only affordable to a +/- 10th level PC. Is it going to be a game balance train-smasher for a PC of this level to heal 2HP per round? 

Alternatively, what about stepping the power of the ring down and reducing it's cost. How about something like this -
For half the price one could get the same effects. The only difference is that the healing can only start taking effect once the wearer is not doing any strenuous activity (like combat). So in fact one is basically only gaining the ability to wean off the party healer's CLW.

Feedback?


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## Jhaelen (Aug 16, 2010)

wysiwyg said:


> Feedback?



There's no way I'd ever allow that kind of item. I assume you're the player, here? Ask your DM!


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## wysiwyg (Aug 16, 2010)

Jhaelen said:


> There's no way I'd ever allow that kind of item. I assume you're the player, here? Ask your DM!




Nope. Well, my PC is currently at 2nd level so my prospects of affording this item are several levels away. I was just curious to know how to handle this when (if) the need came up.


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## Anguish (Aug 16, 2010)

wysiwyg said:


> Nope. Well, my PC is currently at 2nd level so my prospects of affording this item are several levels away. I was just curious to know how to handle this when (if) the need came up.




The point that's been made is that the RAW formula doesn't apply to this item because it's got a value that exceeds the formula results.  That's where the RAW clause kicks in saying that the formula doesn't always work and is just a guideline.  Which is where you're invited to refer to my post regarding what is reasonable, on the sensible basis that RAW tells you to be reasonable, not a slave to the formula.


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## renau1g (Aug 16, 2010)

Just buy a few wand of Cure Light Wounds and you're good. They're pretty cheap (750gp) and you can heal up to full between battles pretty easily with them. But yeah that ring is increda-broken for anything less than an Epic level item.


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## DaveMage (Aug 16, 2010)

A ring of CLW is like having fast healing 6.

I want one for my characters.


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## Loren Pechtel (Aug 16, 2010)

jefgorbach said:


> 7th level NPC to forge ring  (7th level NPC * 10g per level)                            70
> Cure Light Wound cast by 1st level cleric as constant effect (1 x 1 x 2000)  2,000
> Cure Light Wounds has no material components                                             -
> Cure Light Wounds has no Xp components                                                    -
> ...




This won't work.  You can't make an instantaneous spell continious.  It makes no sense.


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## wysiwyg (Aug 16, 2010)

Loren Pechtel said:


> This won't work.  You can't make an instantaneous spell continious.  It makes no sense.




I got news for you buddy: there already are items that do just that in RAW.


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## wysiwyg (Aug 16, 2010)

Anguish said:


> The point that's been made is that the RAW formula doesn't apply to this item because it's got a value that exceeds the formula results.  That's where the RAW clause kicks in saying that the formula doesn't always work and is just a guideline.  Which is where you're invited to refer to my post regarding what is reasonable, on the sensible basis that RAW tells you to be reasonable, not a slave to the formula.




I agree with you. In fact, if you look at my calculation, even though it took a different route than yours, we both came to more or less the same ball park figure of 60k for a ring that cures 2HP/round.


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## IronWolf (Aug 16, 2010)

wysiwyg said:


> ... there already are items that do just that in RAW.




Not doubting you, but can you post an example or two?  Too lazy to go look myself....   


Also, why is what FranktheDM posted being ignored?

http://www.enworld.org/forum/5282811-post5.html

That item seems to be near exactly what you want and has the rules already in place for creating it along with price.  Why not use it?


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## wysiwyg (Aug 16, 2010)

IronWolf said:


> Not doubting you, but can you post an example or two?  Too lazy to go look myself....
> 
> 
> Also, why is what FranktheDM posted being ignored?
> ...




The ring of feather fall mentioned earlier comes to mind.

That earlier post by FranktheDM: isn't just his idea? Where is the source for this epic ring forging (in PF) and the fast healing ring?


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## IronWolf (Aug 16, 2010)

wysiwyg said:


> The ring of feather fall mentioned earlier comes to mind.




The duration of feather fall is "_until landing or 1 round/level"_, not instantaneous like a cure light wound spell.



			
				wysiwyg said:
			
		

> That earlier post by FranktheDM: isn't just his idea? Where is the source for this epic ring forging (in PF) and the fast healing ring?




No, he took that from the d20 SRD and the epic magic item section.  Pathfinder doesn't have epic rules yet, but falling back to the d20 rules in this case seems reasonable to me until Paizo does an Epic book for Pathfinder.


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## renau1g (Aug 16, 2010)

wysiwyg said:


> I agree with you. In fact, if you look at my calculation, even though it took a different route than yours, we both came to more or less the same ball park figure of 60k for a ring that cures 2HP/round.




Ok, so fast healing 2 is approx. 60k. Fast healing 8-9 should be 4-4.5 times that is about 240-270k or so gold right? (4.5 avg d8 roll + 5 = 8.5)


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## pawsplay (Aug 16, 2010)

The ring of feather falling is a use item, and it just happens the action required for feather fall is free. 

It is absolutely correct you cannot make a continuous instantaneous item by the guidelines given. You can make a use item; what "use" means is up to the GM, but in this case, it's probably something involving a standard action.


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## coyote6 (Aug 16, 2010)

Except a lot of prices increase as the square of the value, rather than linearly -- e.g, a +2 sword is 2*2=4 as expensive as a +1 sword. If fast healing should follow a similar progression, that would make a _ring of fast healing 8_ 16 times as expensive as a _ring of fast healing 2_.

Personally, I'm not sure a formula will give an accurate value for something like always-on, never-ending (except with death) healing. It is kind of a game-changing item; you suddenly aren't dependent on spellcasters or substitutes for out-of-combat healing. You will be at max hp for most every fight. It's _really_ useful. 

IMHO, the limb-regenerating part of the PF _ring of regeneration_ is the least useful of its abilities, given how infrequent maiming is in 3e/PF. I suspect the 90k price tag is just because that's what the _ring of regeneration_ cost in 3.5e.

OTOH, once you have priced Fast Healing 1 at 90k, is fast healing 2 really worth twice as much? It's not much more useful for in combat healing, and until you have hundreds of hp, the difference between the five minutes of healing and ten minutes isn't that signifcant, IMO. And the same logic holds as you go up; sure, eventually, fast healing 10 is awesome in a fight -- but by the time you are powerful enough for that to be sane or feasible, the bad guys are probably doing 10 hp when they sneeze as a free action. So it still is essentially "you get all your hp back after the fight".

So, yeah: picking a price is hard.


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## jefgorbach (Aug 17, 2010)

lol sounds like it'd be more cost effective to hire an "army" of clerical acolytes to follow along behind the main party for the express purpose of casting CLW/etc as needed since the SRD confirms a Trained Hireling such as a cleric is roughly 3sp per day plus 10gp per CLW cast.


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## Crothian (Aug 17, 2010)

jefgorbach said:


> lol sounds like it'd be more cost effective to hire an "army" of clerical acolytes to follow along behind the main party for the express purpose of casting CLW/etc as needed since the SRD confirms a Trained Hireling such as a cleric is roughly 3sp per day plus 10gp per CLW cast.




And odds are since they are using their healing magics to heal you that they won't be able to heal themselves so they'll die.  Then you won't have to pay them!


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## jefgorbach (Aug 17, 2010)

Loren Pechtel said:


> This won't work.  You can't make an instantaneous spell continious.  It makes no sense.




It does if/when you realize "Constant effect" is simply an easier/shorter way of saying the effect is an instantaneous single-round standard action Use triggered by the user being injured with an automatic reset.  

ie each round, the ring heals 1d8+1 during the wear's standard action (provided he's injured) then ends the effect for THAT round and resets.


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## renau1g (Aug 17, 2010)

Crothian said:


> And odds are since they are using their healing magics to heal you that they won't be able to heal themselves so they'll die.  Then you won't have to pay them!




Or just cast a few lightning bolts as they're lined up... either way


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## jefgorbach (Aug 17, 2010)

Course if the ring's too expensive, hire a cleric with Craft Wondrous Item to fashion a CLW trap using the SRD's Burning Hands example since nothing in RAW says the spell involved has to be offensive. The result is an object causing the first undead to touch it each round to suffer 1d8+1 (Will save for half damage). Obviously a rope would be relatively light weight and handy/useful choice since it not only continues providing its normal climbing/tying function, but could be used offensively by tossing at approaching undead, tying across corridors, or tossed to living companions needing healing. 


CLW Trap
CR 2; magic device; proximity trigger (alarm); automatic reset; spell effect (CLW, 1st-level cleric, 1d8+1 healing, DC 11 Will save half damage); Search DC 26; Disable Device DC 26. Cost: 500 gp, 40 XP.


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## jefgorbach (Aug 17, 2010)

Crothian said:


> And odds are since they are using their healing magics to heal you that they won't be able to heal themselves so they'll die.  Then you won't have to pay them!




lol true, but presumably they be remaining far enough behind to avoid the main combat encounters until the party's eliminated those threats and numerically overwhelm minor random encounters.


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## Jhaelen (Aug 17, 2010)

jefgorbach said:


> Course if the ring's too expensive, hire a cleric with Craft Wondrous Item to fashion a CLW trap using the SRD's Burning Hands example since nothing in RAW says the spell involved has to be offensive. The result is an object causing the first undead to touch it each round to suffer 1d8+1 (Will save for half damage). Obviously a rope would be relatively light weight and handy/useful choice since it not only continues providing its normal climbing/tying function, but could be used offensively by tossing at approaching undead, tying across corridors, or tossed to living companions needing healing.
> 
> 
> CLW Trap
> CR 2; magic device; proximity trigger (alarm); automatic reset; spell effect (CLW, 1st-level cleric, 1d8+1 healing, DC 11 Will save half damage); Search DC 26; Disable Device DC 26. Cost: 500 gp, 40 XP.



That's utter nonsense (, imho). 

I think, we've had that discussion before. Traps don't work like that. And even if they did: What alarm trigger would you use?

It might work as a magical location, though. But these follow different rules.


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## gamerprinter (Aug 17, 2010)

Our old DM was a lot like these nonsensical ideas, he twisted the RAW, created broken spells based on misinterpretted comparisons to other spells that had no comparison, etc. We didn't kick him out of the gaming group, we simply banned him from the GM's chair. Now he's just an unruly and uncooperative player, still a problem, but easier to take as he is no longer running the game. Luckily nobody ever sides with his arguments so the skewed effect to the game is not there anymore.

GP


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## wysiwyg (Aug 17, 2010)

IronWolf said:


> The duration of feather fall is "_until landing or 1 round/level"_, not instantaneous like a cure light wound spell.
> 
> 
> 
> No, he took that from the d20 SRD and the epic magic item section.  Pathfinder doesn't have epic rules yet, but falling back to the d20 rules in this case seems reasonable to me until Paizo does an Epic book for Pathfinder.




Ahha! So it is real. Thanks. Seems fricking expensive though. Here's my solution if you have 300k to spare:
Put them in the bank earning say 0.5% interest per month (or 1500gp) and buy 2 wands of cure light wounds every month instead (that's 100 charges). If you're strapped for cash, well you know what to do.


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## Crothian (Aug 17, 2010)

jefgorbach said:


> lol true, but presumably they be remaining far enough behind to avoid the main combat encounters until the party's eliminated those threats and numerically overwhelm minor random encounters.




If the DM's allows that to happen the DM is too kind.  D&D is a dangerous world no matter where you are.


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## Werebat (Aug 17, 2010)

Honestly?  A ring of fast heal 2 isn't game breaking and isn't worth 300K.

What player will BUY one of those for 300K?  None.  There are more powerful rings available for less money.

The original Ring of Regeneration was also overpriced in 3.5.  No one ever bought it and it one ever got found it often got sold.

The vast majority of the time, Fast Heal 2 equates to maybe 20 extra hit points (given a 10 round fight).  Not worth 300K.  Not even close.

   - Ron   ^*^


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## renau1g (Aug 17, 2010)

Crothian said:


> If the DM's allows that to happen the DM is too kind.  D&D is a dangerous world no matter where you are.




Yup, that's when a purple worm should show up and start chomping down on cleric like they're sushi. That much "food" in one area would certainly draw some sort of predatory monster.


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## jefgorbach (Aug 17, 2010)

Jhaelen said:


> That's utter nonsense (, imho).
> 
> I think, we've had that discussion before. Traps don't work like that. And even if they did: What alarm trigger would you use?
> 
> It might work as a magical location, though. But these follow different rules.




Although I tossed it into the thread as another legal alternative to accomplish his desire, agree that particular item would be broken because its providing considerably MORE usefulness than the $3k ring for a sixth of the cost! 

IRC we did and you essentially house-ruled objects cant be enchanted. 

RAW's magical traps DO work that way using the Alarm spell's default ability to trigger the effect "each time a creature of Tiny or larger size enters" a 20ft radius of the object. 

The ONLY substitution I made to RAW's example CR2 magical trap was substituting CLW for Burning Hands which is legal since nothing in RAW limits what spell can be so triggered.  WOTC termed such traps "boon traps" in Dungeonscape (Chapter 6, p134): "Traditionally, magic traps are designed to harm or hamper intruders, but it is possible to build magic traps that provide a benefit. These *boon traps* have little use in most dungeons unless they are paired with a guardian monster. With a little planning, the trap can bolster or heal the creature, keeping the dungeon owner's guardian alive longer during a fight. Boon traps are constructed as any other magic trap with a visual trigger, but using a spell that enhances a creature rather than harms it. "

Kobold Quarterly also has a brief article: "Boon Traps for Pathfinder RPG" 
Boon Traps for Pathfinder RPG « Kobold Quarterly Magazine: Monsters and Magic for D&D Gamers 

House-rule they dont exist if you wish but magically trapped objects, including boon traps, are legally RAW.


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## Jhaelen (Aug 17, 2010)

Edit:
Well, after rereading your post in this thread I retract my comment that this is nonsense.

I thought you had been recommending to create something like a 'trapped ring of fast healing'. And that's what I was refuting in the other thread because it's nonsense. All traps are location-based. You cannot carry them around (at least you can't while they're set and ready to trigger).

A trap enchanted with a 'cure light wounds' spell may after all be useful to protect an area against undead...

Still the concept is rather useless for pcs, unless they happen to encounter enemies on their own turf.


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## Nadaka (Aug 17, 2010)

Similar to boon traps there are rules for use activated architecture in the 3e supplement "Stronghold Builders Guide". This gp cost for such architecture was generally half the recommended craft wondrous item cost.


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## Loren Pechtel (Aug 17, 2010)

jefgorbach said:


> It does if/when you realize "Constant effect" is simply an easier/shorter way of saying the effect is an instantaneous single-round standard action Use triggered by the user being injured with an automatic reset.
> 
> ie each round, the ring heals 1d8+1 during the wear's standard action (provided he's injured) then ends the effect for THAT round and resets.




But that's not continuous and can't be priced by the continuous formula.

A "continuous" CLW effect is basically a use-activated caster level 1, spell level 1 uncharged item that can do 10 rounds/minute * 60 minutes/hour * 24 hours/day = 14,400 times/day = that's 5,760,000gp.

The ring of fast healing is considerably cheaper.


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## wysiwyg (Aug 18, 2010)

Just glancing over the epics since Epic Ring Forging is the only way to make this smaller version of the item.
Well, there is already an epic feat called Fast Healing that gives 3HP/round. So I guess if someone had the 300k at epic levels it would just make perfect sense to buy the ring. Right. Whoever came up with that price should use a different finger to suck figures from. 300k will give you a +10 weapon and +10 armor. 
or better: +7 weapon, +10 armor and a ring of regeneration and a periapt of wound closure that combined heal for 2HP/round.
Seriously.


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## Maldor (Aug 18, 2010)

lesser vigor 1st level spell grant fast healing 1 for a few rounds 1st level caster use actavated always on 2000gp 

I have made and used this item in many game it has derailed none its a great addtion to the game it means that your players are more likly to 

fight multiple monsters between rest

servive combat without deceasing the challange (really whats 4 or 5 hp a combat)

saves the healer from burning all his spell on a thankless job

The ring of regeneration is over priced no one uses it even if you give it to your players most will sale it because even at 45,000gp its still over priced. most i would pay for fast heal 1 6000gp.

PS don't use cure light wounds in a continuous item give it a command word or charges per day.


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## jefgorbach (Aug 18, 2010)

Loren Pechtel said:


> But that's not continuous and can't be priced by the continuous formula.
> 
> A "continuous" CLW effect is basically a use-activated caster level 1, spell level 1 uncharged item that can do 10 rounds/minute * 60 minutes/hour * 24 hours/day = 14,400 times/day = that's 5,760,000gp.
> 
> The ring of fast healing is considerably cheaper.




No idea where you got THAT continuous formula. 

True, I technically made the ring use-activated(injured) which uses the SAME formula as continuous per RAW so the pricing remains unchanged regardless of which description you prefer.

You are correct in pointing out an uncharged item is created as if it had 100 charges when calculating the spells material and XP costs - however CLW has neither, thus zeroing those additional costs. Further, CLW is instaneous effect so there isnt an additional cost for generating a multi-round effect, which I should have shown. 


7th level NPC to forge ring (7th level NPC * 10g per level) 70
Cure Light Wound cast by 1st level cleric as constant effect (1 x 1 x 2000) 2,000
thus base gold cost = 2,070
CLW is an instanteous effect (base * 0) = 0
CLW has no material components (100 charges x 0) = 0
CLW has no Xp components (100 charges x 0) = 0
NPC xp creation cost = 5(base/25) = 414
basic supplies cost = base/2 = 1,035
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
final cost = 3,519gp


If Use-Activated(injured)/Continuous bothers you, change it to a Command word activation and reduce the cost accordingly: 

7th level NPC to forge ring (7th level NPC * 10g per level) 70
Cure Light Wound cast by 1st level cleric with Commdand Word (1 x 1 x 1800) 1,800
thus base gold cost = 1,870
Cure Light Wounds is an instanteous effect (base*0) = 0
Cure Light Wounds has no material components (100 charges x 0)=0
Cure Light Wounds has no Xp components (100 charges x 0) =0
xp creation cost = 5(base/25) = 374
cost of basic supplies cost = base/2 = 935
-----------------------------------------------
final cost: $3,179gp


However that seems a step in the wrong direction since you feel it was already too inexpensive, so lets leave it use-activated(injured) but limit it to say 5 uses per day instead: 

7th level NPC to forge ring (7th level NPC * 10g per level) 70
Cure Light Wound cast by 1st level cleric as constant effect (1 x 1 x 2000) 2,000
thus base gold cost = 2,070
Limited to 5x daily (base/(5/5 uses)) = 2,070
Cure Light Wounds has no material components (100 charges x 0) =0
Cure Light Wounds has no Xp components (100 charges x 0) =0
xp creation cost = 5(base/25) = 414
cost of basic supplies cost = base/2 = 1,035
-------------------------------------------------
final cost = 5,589gp

thus: 
5x daily   5,589
10x daily  7,659
15x daily  9,729
24x daily 13,455


It really boils down to how much does the GM wants to charge the party for pressing onward rather than taking an extended rest after #daily encounters.


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## wysiwyg (Aug 18, 2010)

Maldor said:


> lesser vigor 1st level spell grant fast healing 1 for a few rounds 1st level caster use actavated always on 2000gp
> 
> I have made and used this item in many game it has derailed none its a great addtion to the game it means that your players are more likly to
> 
> ...




That was my intention entirely. I am just frustrated with the notion that when adventuring in a dungeon crawl, the PCs can open 2 or 3 rooms, and in about 15 rounds of combat (90 seconds), they are exhausted and have to rest again for an entire day. 

This ring was my idea to overcome this without disturbing the DC of each adventure. That's why I even came up with the idea that the ring will only function out of combat when the PC wearing it is in a non-stressful mode.

In 4E they came up with the notion of resting between encounters to regain lost HP. My DM is not in favor of implementing this rule, so hence Enworld posting to the rescue.

I wonder if he'll allow the ring to implement the Lesser Vigor spell continuously as we're in PF and Complete Divine spells might not be allowed.


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## Azmyth (Aug 18, 2010)

jefgorbach said said:
			
		

> House-rule they dont exist if you wish but magically trapped objects, including boon traps, are legally RAW.




Both of your supporting examples, *WoTC's Dungeonscap*e and *Kobold Quarterly *are not in any way, shape or form Pathfinder RAW. 
For that matter, neither is anything from the 3.0 or 3.5 rule sets.

I had already given up on this thread and the lack of logic displayed in several of the arguments posted here. 
When WoTC products are quoted as being PF RAW, I gotta call BS for the stinky pile that it is.


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## Jhaelen (Aug 18, 2010)

wysiwyg said:


> In 4E they came up with the notion of resting between encounters to regain lost HP. My DM is not in favor of implementing this rule, so hence Enworld posting to the rescue.



...then your DM probably won't be happy if you try to sneak the concept he dislikes into his game like this.


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## Azmyth (Aug 19, 2010)

Some guy with the initials JJ said:
			
		

> JJ› I'd  say an auto CLW ring would be,  effectively, a quickened CLW every round, and according to the FORMULA  that would = 90,000 gp minimum.
> Same  cost as a ring of regeneration, as it turns out, and arguably not  as  good as a ring of regeneration since a CLW won't reattach severed  limbs  or regrow body parts.




I'd start there. He knows what he's talking 'bout.


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## Anguish (Aug 20, 2010)

wysiwyg said:


> That was my intention entirely. I am just frustrated with the notion that when adventuring in a dungeon crawl, the PCs can open 2 or 3 rooms, and in about 15 rounds of combat (90 seconds), they are exhausted and have to rest again for an entire day.
> 
> This ring was my idea to overcome this without disturbing the DC of each adventure. That's why I even came up with the idea that the ring will only function out of combat when the PC wearing it is in a non-stressful mode.
> 
> ...




If that's the case, just look at a _wand of lesser vigor_.  750gp buys you 50 charges that heal 11 hit points each.  550 hit points for 750gp.  There's another price comparison for you.  It's an activation device and it doles out batches of 11, so it's more restrictive than a ring.

The 2,000gp price that was given above is way, way off track.  An unlimited healing device that isn't activation based should be priced much higher.

Oh the other hand, you could just pick up the above mentioned wand.  They're cheap as dirt, work great at out-of-combat healing, and can be activated by several classes as well as anyone with UMD.  Especially after 2nd level (where you're at now), the price becomes trivial.

I'd like to note something else.  The legendary 5-minute adventuring day is about more than healing.  Once your party barbarian is out of rage and your wizard is out of spells, it's time to rest.  Even if the rogue has infinite sneak attack and the ranger has a golf bag full of arrows, you've got a couple bored players.  Sure, the barbarian can still take attacks, but the wizard is pretty dead bored.


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## jefgorbach (Aug 20, 2010)

oops. Been working off a desktop direct link and forgot this is under the Pathfinder subsection instead of the Legacy discussions and consequently withdraw the citations. 

Since I obviously was looking in the incorrect RAW, I take it PF handles non-damaging spells/traps inherently different than those directly inflicting damage?


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## Crothian (Nov 18, 2012)

reported


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