# Torrent as a PC - Did you do it and how?



## Marcon (May 21, 2008)

I'm meddling with the idea of converting Torrent into a PC.  I'm not a big fan of having to play "lead-them-by-the-nose NPC".  I understand I don't have to spill it out everytime the heroes are wondering what to do but then again, Torrent knows a lot of things, has a lot of contacts and, quite frankly, is the most experienced and "higher-ranked" member of the Resistance among the group so I don't think I could realistically play her as being kinda laid-back and "Let's see how YOU guys can pull it off!"

BUT I know there are problems converting her into a PC.  Suddenly, one hero becomes really crucial to the adventure.  I need to pass along a lot of information to that player, without having him feel like I'm using him to drive the plot forward.

For instance, when it comes to getting out of Gate Pass, I don't want the player to pick up the scrap of paper I gave him and say : "Oh, looks like I know a Resistance-friendly councilman who can help us".  So I was thinking about giving him a LOT of information.  In fact, the player would be so flooded with Gate Pass tidbits that he wouldn't be able to separate the red herrings from the actual useful stuff and would thus have much more control over his leader role.

Any thoughts?

-Marcon


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## Volaran (May 22, 2008)

I believe, at least according to his story hour, that Amethal replaced Torrent with a turtle-person who was a follower of the same god.  Torrent has shown up in this PC's backstory in the story hour as a fairly prominent religious personage in Gate Pass, but I don't believe she has shown up at all "on stage" with the PCs.  So, Amethal might be the person you wish to speak with.

Our own DM (Rugult) did not specify her position in the Resistance until adventure 3, and I suspect he may have deviated from the adventure-as-written for similar reasons to your own.

The _party_ was under the impression that she was a high ranking resistance member until it actually came up in Seaquen, when she explained that she was more associated with the Lyceum and simply doing a favour for the Resistance.

This began to desperately worry the party, as it meant our only "official" resistance member was Krug; our half-orc barbarian with a good heart, but well below average mental abilities.  Ever since, we've all been at least claiming official position within the Resistance.


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## amethal (May 22, 2008)

It was very easy to get rid of Torrent.

I gave the player a briefing about what to say in the scene in the pub, and helped him out when he said anything that wasn't accurate. It wasn't anywhere near as comprehensive a briefing as Torrent would have given, but my group don't like long exposition anyway.

"Head to the depository, get a case off a gnome? OK. let's go."
"Don't you want to know the rest of the plan?"
"We'll worry about that later!"

I can't remember what I did about seeing the councillor - I think I may have said to the player that Torrent suggested he visit the councillor if he got stuck for an escape plan.

In other words, I ran it completely differently to the way you are proposing   

Maybe you could give the player a list of resistance contacts, and let him choose which ones would be most useful?

However, with hindsight, even if you leave out Torrent DO NOT leave out her wand of cure light wounds (assuming someone can use it).


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## Selganor (May 22, 2008)

AS I understood it, Torrent's purpose in the adventures was just to be the person who sets the party on the right track to capture the intelligence from Ragesia and transport it to Seaquen.
Once there, she also "introduces" the party to her mentor, which allows the party to draw some conclusions regarding the "masterplan" of adventure 3.
After adventure 3 she is as well connected (and probably of equal level) as the rest of the party.

In my campaign we got NO cleric or other divine caster (if you don't count the two elven rangers who got their first spells at level 8-9 due to multiclassing in other classes, too), so the party is really dependent on her healing.

Usually it's too much hassle for me to play her during any combats (I'm busy enough with the rest of the combat), so I usually "forget" her or find other things for her to do (within reason).

In one session we had a guest player who was there only for one session (just entering the fire forest), so I handed her Torrent to play for this one session.

The Torrent in our campaign has "evolved" to a healing machine (I am just putting together her stats for level 9 and 10 - as we are in the midst of adventure 5)


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## Zinovia (May 24, 2008)

I'm thinking of doing a conversion over to 4E and running WotBS as our next major campaign.  My feeling from reading some of the modules is that there are too many NPC's tagging along with the party, making more work for me in fights.  I'd rather eliminate at least some of them, including Torrent, and Three Weeping Ravens.  

Torrent does have a lot of contacts and is important to tie into the third adventure, but I would rather replace her with a player character who has the same information and contacts.  Not only does that eliminate an NPC that I would rather not have to keep track of while running the rest of the game, but it ties the players more closely to the Resistance and what is happening in Gate Pass (and later on in Seaquen as well).  

I'm not sure if the idea of overwhelming that player with detailed information would work well or not.  Perhaps a page of info summarizing what they know, and some prompting by me if there is something they should know but I didn't write down for them.  In picking one player to have more inside knowledge, there is the risk of creating a Mary Sue character who overshadows the rest of the party.  Either I'll have to work to keep that in check, or else come up with some sort of tie-ins for other party members to make them also feel important.  They may well have contacts in other parts of the world.  

In any case, i like the story line from what I've read so far, and think that my group will enjoy it.  They tend to be pretty heavily into RP stuff.  The scary part will be in GM'ing for the first time in many years.  My husband has been holding the DM's chair for the past 6 years that our 3rd edition game has been running.


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## RangerWickett (May 24, 2008)

A quick clarification. The point was never that the party keep all the NPCs who crop up throughout the campaign. I tried to have one NPC ally in each adventure, to play to the adventure's theme, to provide for easy exposition, and to showcase some of the breadth of the setting. 

In the first two adventures the heroes have Torrent as an ally, and later Tiljann (plus maybe two or three other NPC refugees they need to protect). I tried to design Torrent primarily as a support character to keep the rest of the party from toppling over in the wildly fragile state that is "1st level D&D." And Tiljann was meant more as a friendly face who can help the heroes figure out what's going on, and less as a member of the party.

The refugees - Crystin, Haddin, maybe that guy who's on fire in adventure 2 whose name I forget - weren't supposed to be combat characters. They're there to give the heroes someone to think about beyond themselves, to try to subtly encourage them to be good guys.

And then, once the heroes get to Seaquen, I fully expected the heroes to dump most of the NPCs. They might run into them from time to time in Seaquen, for roleplaying opportunities, but I didn't expect most people would bring Torrent along with them on further adventures.

As for replacing Torrent, I think it would be doable, especially with 4e hit point rules. I wouldn't give all her hooks to just one PC, though. I'd suggest one person know Lee in adventure 3, and another might be affiliated with the Lyceum academy. And most if not all the party should know of or have some connection to the Gate Pass resistance.

I hope it works out for you.


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## amethal (May 24, 2008)

RangerWickett said:
			
		

> The refugees - Crystin, Haddin, maybe that guy who's on fire in adventure 2 whose name I forget - weren't supposed to be combat characters. They're there to give the heroes someone to think about beyond themselves, to try to subtly encourage them to be good guys.



Man, did that so not work with my group! 

My lowest ebb was when they wiped out Clan Millorn within a minute of meeting them. Expect a very bitter account of that incident, if my story hour ever makes it that far.


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## RangerWickett (May 25, 2008)

amethal said:
			
		

> Man, did that so not work with my group!
> 
> My lowest ebb was when they wiped out Clan Millorn within a minute of meeting them. Expect a very bitter account of that incident, if my story hour ever makes it that far.




They killed the gnomes?! The bastards!


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## Rugult (May 26, 2008)

RangerWickett said:
			
		

> They killed the gnomes?! The bastards!




= 0

WHAT!?

Those Gnomes were probably the greatest part of Adventure 6.  I had the players controlling them at some points, and even had them around for the final encounter.

That Paladin alone killed more then the actual PCs.

I am shocked...  I hope you intend to bring the Gnome Mafia down on them later in the adventure path!


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## Volaran (May 26, 2008)

Ah yes, that was a fine encounter, Rugult.  That gnomish paladin was _stupidly_ effective, although much of that was down to luck.  It was a nice change from playing Rowan.

I'm sorry to hear about Clan Milorn in your campaign, Amethal.  Those were some of my favourite roleplaying moments.  We keep looking for excuses to call upon them as future allies.


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## amethal (May 27, 2008)

RangerWickett said:
			
		

> They killed the gnomes?! The bastards!



Yeah, I wanted tiamat to appear out of the sky and squish their characters because they'd killed "my" gnomes. I haven't felt that way playing D&D since I was 12. 

Of course, if I had been 12, that's probably what would have happened next


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