# Throwing a character across a room?



## harpy (Mar 6, 2010)

So the other night we had a situation where a 22 strength character wanted to throw a PC across a room to avoid some difficult terrain.  The 22 strength character was large so it could easily lift 300+ lbs just as a light load.

What we were trying to figure out was what the rules have to say on any of this and we couldn't come up with much.

The improvised weapon section talks about taking a full round action to throw a two-handed weapon, so we did that for the throwing character, but everything else was pretty much made up.

The throw wasn't an attack, just targeting a square, so the character rolled their throw to see if they could hit that square.  That roll was easily made, even with 10' range increments being factored in.

The PC that was getting thrown was being thrown into water, so in the end the DM ruled that no damage would be taken.  So all in all it worked well in a ham fisted way, but we're just trying to unpack the rules a bit more now to see if anything was missed.

So, how heavy can something be and have it still be throwable?

How far can something be thrown if accuracy isn't required?

Are there any other rules impacting throwing a willing character?

What kind of damage is done if a thrown character hits something hard, use falling damage based on distance?


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## gamerprinter (Mar 6, 2010)

*Halfing tossing is an Orc sport...*

I'd be more interested throwing a DM across the room, sometimes...

And you're right there isn't rules for throwing characters, let alone any objects other than weapons, by the Core Rules.

In reviewing that rule, it offers a -4 penalty "to hit". Even though the thrown character is not being used in an attack, you are "attacking" a specific location in where the character is being thrown and those rules are the closest that apply. But a 2-handed weapon is much lighter than a character. As a DM, I'd probably increase the penalty to -8 or -12, based on the characters weight and size. The landing should/could cause damage to the character - break an ankle, etc. Perhaps have the landing character make a Dexterity check with its own modifier (-4?) since he has less control of the landing, since he isn't the one jumping.

You're trying to pull a "Aragorn tosses Gimli at Helm's Deep" maneuver. While somewhat heroic, its also somewhat silly - but I could see the corner case.

I still want to throw my DM across the room, even out the window, sometimes...

GP


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## StreamOfTheSky (Mar 6, 2010)

*Shrug*  PF has those handy simplified combat maneuver calculations, why not use those?  I'd call it functionally similar to a bull rush.  The rules for bull rush are the same in PF aside from how you calculate the rolls right?  So, make a check versus "x."  You move your ally 5 ft + 5 ft per 5 points you exceed x.  If you want to make it a little more difficult and represent the fact you're tossing someone, maybe the ally takes falling damage as if he fell 10 ft upon landing.  If your check result is 5/10 (you pick, I'd go with 5) or more points higher than what you needed to make the desired distance, no damage is taken.  Or you could let the ally tumble to avoid damage.

Figuring out "x," the ally's bull rush check, is trickier.  Strictest interpretation is he can take 1 and all other modifiers add to get the combat defense.  If instead you wanted to make it a DC with different mechanics...you could start with a base DC of 10, then give size bonuses or penalties.  Probably the best method would be something that factored in the weight of what you were tossing.  Hmm...take the ally's weight (including gear) or a rough estimate thereof, and do a DC of 10 +2 per 10 lbs?  Then an ally with gear weighing about 80 pounds would be DC 26.  A 26 would toss him 5 ft, a 46 would toss him up to 25 ft, and if you reduce the distance by 5 ft, he can land unharmed.  Is that too difficult to reasonably do in pathfinder?  Could lower the DC, but...how far CAN something weighing as much as a small person really be thrown realistically?


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## Maidhc O Casain (Mar 6, 2010)

Character being thrown makes an Acrobatics (Jump) check, character doing the throwing makes an Athletics check to Aid Another.


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## StreamOfTheSky (Mar 7, 2010)

Mowgli said:


> Character being thrown makes an Acrobatics (Jump) check, character doing the throwing makes an Athletics check to Aid Another.




That works, too.  Well, if the thrown charcter is using his action to do it, I guess it does.  If the thrower is spending his action, I think it should be the reverse if anything (Athletics check with an Acrobatics check to aid).


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## Maidhc O Casain (Mar 7, 2010)

StreamOfTheSky said:


> That works, too.  Well, if the thrown character is using his action to do it, I guess it does.  If the thrower is spending his action, I think it should be the reverse if anything (Athletics check with an Acrobatics check to aid).




Or this.


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## Liquidsabre (Mar 7, 2010)

Bullrush with CMB check against an opponent that is not resisting (against base CMD 10). So a roll of 25 exceeds by 15 and so the target is tossed 15ft.

As with being bullrushed into a wall, a character tossed will take damage based on distance thrown so they receive an Acrobatics check to reduce the distance by 10ft. for falling damage. Any distance below 10-ft can be ignored.

Off the cuff GMing at the game table, that's what I'd do. Suprisingly easy to capture more or less within the ruleset.


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## Mark Chance (Mar 7, 2010)

harpy said:


> So, how heavy can something be and have it still be throwable?
> 
> How far can something be thrown if accuracy isn't required?
> 
> ...




Glommed from _Mutants & Masterminds_:

Characters can throw any object they can lift, up to a heavy load. You cannot throw your maximum load, only drop it adjacent to you. Picking up an object is a move action, while throwing it is a standard action, so it's possible to pick up and throw an object in one round.

The distance you can throw an object is based on its weight and your Strength. You can throw your heavy load 5 feet, which is also the base range for throwing. For every 5 points of Strength you have over the minimum required to lift an object as a heavy load, double the base range.

Improvised thrown objects have a range increment of 10 feet.

So, a Large PC with a 22 Strength wants to throw a 200-pound ally. IIRC, it takes a 15 Strength for 200 pounds to be a heavy load. The Large PC has an equivalent 27 Strength for carrying capacity (IIRC). That puts the Large PC 10 points over the minimum required to lift the ally as a heavy load. The Large PC can throw his ally 20 feet.


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## Ogrork the Mighty (Apr 5, 2010)

I like those rules but the multiplier quickly breaks down. Doubling after doubling after doubling, etc., quickly produces ridiculous results.

Applying the D&D multiplying rules helps a bit.


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## Shazman (Apr 6, 2010)

There was a feat in Races of Stone called Hurl Ally (I think) that allowed Goliaths (or other things with Powerful Build) to do this.  You might want to look at that feat to see how the mechanics worked.


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## Thanael (Apr 6, 2010)

Feat - Fling Ally

Feat - Fling Enemy

But you need to have the rock hurling ability to qualify for them...


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## Drowbane (Apr 20, 2010)

Mark Chance said:


> Glommed from _Mutants & Masterminds_:
> 
> Characters can throw any object they can lift, up to a heavy load. You cannot throw your maximum load, only drop it adjacent to you. Picking up an object is a move action, while throwing it is a standard action, so it's possible to pick up and throw an object in one round.
> 
> ...




Yoink!


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## ruemere (Apr 20, 2010)

Consider load type and ease of throwing the object vs strength of performing character. Basing on this, choose range increment (none - item can be merely dropped, 1 feet range increment or bigger - for example: grenade-size weapons have 20' increment).
Remember that most ranged attacks for thrown weapons are limited to 5 range increments (projectile weapons: 10 increments).

Hitting target square is a range attack as per splash weapons (AC 5). Modify DC as per number of increments needed (-2 per increment beyond first).

If the thrown object resists, precede throw with CMB vs CMD test (fail - throw failed, success - throw successful, range is halved, success by 10 or more - range as per non-resisting object).


Regards,
Ruemere


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## cordaen (May 8, 2010)

*Flying Dwarf*

Here's how I resolved a similar difficult issue.

Playing  3.5:  Half-Orc fighter with a STR 21 wanted to throw her dwarf party  member who was wearing a horned viking-style helmet across a 10-ft.  pit.  On the other side of the pit was a drow archer.  

She held  her action until the dwarf's initiative.  Since her DEX was higher than  the Dwarf's, she we first.  



Move-Equivalent:  Pick up  the Dwarf (dwarf weighed 145 lbs., well below her lift-over-head  capacity)
Standard Action: Throw the Dwarf at the Drow:
Ranged  attack, -4 penalty on attack roll as per the Improvised Throwing  Weapons rule.
Strength Check vs. DC of 10 for 5 ft., +1 foot  for each point over 10 rolled.  (she rolled her D20 = 16, STR mod = 5,  Total roll was 21... for an effective max range of 16 ft.)
 
On  the Dwarfs action:  


I treated his movement of being thrown  as a Charge (considering he DID move before attacking, he was moving at  least 10 feet, and was traveling in a straight line without  obstructions).
Once he was within melee range of the Drow, he  was allowed a single melee attack with the horns of his helmet
 -8  penalty on his attack roll because he was using a weapon he wasn't  proficient with (the horned helmet), but he gained a +2 bonus on the  attack roll to compensate for momentum.
Had the Drow archer been  using a melee weapon, the Drow opponent would have been granted an AOO  toward the Dwarf... who was suffering a -2 to his AC for the Charge
 
All  rolls were made in the open, and the attack succeeded.  Damage was  calculated as such:


The Dwarf rolled 1d6 (each horn was  treated as a 1d3 piercing weapon), and The Half-Orc's STR mod was  applied to the damage roll.
In order to compensate for the  momentum of a flying dwarf, I modified the rules of Bull Rush.


Opposed  STR rolls between the Half-Orc thrower and the Drow defender.
+2  bonus on the STR check for Bull Rush.
Drow received a +2  stability bonus... he wasn't exceptionally stable, but he was far more  stable than an air-born dwarf.
 
Rolls were made, and the  flying dwarf skewered the drow & pushed him back 6 feet (as per the maximum-allowed throwing distance)

Ending results:


Both combatants  landed prone.
Dwarf took damage as though falling 16 feet  (his total distance of movement).
Since a non-throwing  weapon being thrown has a 50% chance of breaking, a roll was made, and  both horns broke off the helmet.
All in all, the players agreed  it was a fair outcome utilizing what rules were established.  As for my  opinion as a DM... I'll let the players try whatever hair-brained  scheme they want, but they're gonna earn it.  There will be risk, and  like always, dice rolls will be made in the open with a  "hands-where-i-can-see-them" approach.  This of course puts the players  at their own mercy, and makes them think twice about doing stuff like  this... then again, if they roll it and succeed, then they earned it!


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