# Song of Ice and Fire - Official Book 5 Pub Date!



## Dausuul (Mar 3, 2011)

And no, I'm not reading some guff on Amazon. This comes straight from the horse's mouth. Quoting from George R. R. Martin's website:

"The end is in sight, at long long last, and we're close enough so that my editors and publishers at Bantam Spectra have set an actual publication date. ... Barring tsunamis, general strikes, world wars, or asteroid strikes, you will have the novel in your hands on July 12."


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## Steel_Wind (Mar 3, 2011)

*GRRM Confirms A Dance with Dragons to be released July 12, 2011*

Yes, this is probably more appropriate for the Media Lounge and can be moved there in due course.

However, given the nature and interest in the news by many (if not most) gamers, it doesn't hurt to spread the word here.

*Short strokes: *George R.R. Martin and his publishers confirmed today that the long delayed fifth novel in the_ A Song of Ice and Fire_ series, titled _A Dance with Dragons_, will be published simultaneously in  the USA, Canada and the UK on Tuesday, July 12, 2011.

The news is confirmed by GRRM here: Update - A Song of Ice and Fire - George R. R. Martin's Official Website

Yes. This is for real.

For those wondering, based upon GRRM's blogging, he is down to polishing the last chapter in the book, set on the Wall. 

Nevertheless, both he and the publisher are satisfied that the novel will be on shelves on that day and date and have each confirmed it.

Given that GRRM has left that chapter set on the Wall until the very last, if past practice is an indication of future performance, somebody important is about to die on the Wall in ADwD.

(Yo Stannis! Yeah - you up on that Wall. How's that whole _prophecy thing_ working out for you?)


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## Starman (Mar 3, 2011)

YES! Best news I've heard in awhile.


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## smoelf (Mar 3, 2011)

Great news indeed. A long wait is finally almost over.


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## rogueattorney (Mar 3, 2011)

When I saw the news this morning, I called my mom, who is also reading the series, and told her the news.

Yes, that's probably the geekiest thing I've ever done.


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## wolff96 (Mar 3, 2011)

Dausuul said:


> "The end is in sight, at long long last, and we're close enough so that my editors and publishers at Bantam Spectra have set an actual publication date. ... Barring tsunamis, general strikes, world wars, or asteroid strikes, you will have the novel in your hands on July 12."




FINALLY.  I'm pretty sure at this point, we're in serious danger of author-existance-failure before the series finishes, though.


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## saskganesh (Mar 3, 2011)

I'm shocked.

anyhow, I'll wait for the paperback.


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## Morrus (Mar 3, 2011)

Meh.  It's been too long for me - I can't remember what happened in the last book and I don't want to read them again.  I won't be bothering with this.


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## Patryn of Elvenshae (Mar 3, 2011)

I disbelieve the illusion.

EDIT:

[looks at dice roll] Yay! A Dance with Dragons is totally coming out!


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## samursus (Mar 3, 2011)

S'about time!!!


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## Crothian (Mar 3, 2011)

Isn't he a Mets fan?  If the Mets have a bad start to the season will that interfere with this?  What about the NFL issues?  We know he's a Giants fan and this could cause him delays.  Thank goodness there are no real elections between now and then or this could be delayed for years more.


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## Fast Learner (Mar 3, 2011)

Woot! I'm super-excited and eagerly look forward to it!

Time to start reading them through again from the start, as I do before each new one comes out. Westeros here I come!


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## ssampier (Mar 3, 2011)

Crothian said:


> Isn't he a Mets fan?  If the Mets have a bad start to the season will that interfere with this?  What about the NFL issues?  We know he's a Giants fan and this could cause him delays.  Thank goodness there are no real elections between now and then or this could be delayed for years more.




George R.R. Martin has never set a day before, so I'm pretty confident book 5 should be released at or around July 2011. Now for book 6, we have an U.S. Presidential election in 2012. We may see book 6 in 2020 or so


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## the Jester (Mar 3, 2011)

Well, this is cool and all, but I have to admit that my enthusiasm has cooled. I no longer feel any urgency about getting it- heck, I'm going to have to reread the series to remember what's going on.

Sadly, Martin has put himself in the category of "wait until the series is finished before I bother" for me.


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## Dausuul (Mar 3, 2011)

ssampier said:


> George R.R. Martin has never set a day before, so I'm pretty confident book 5 should be released at or around July 2011. Now for book 6, we have an U.S. Presidential election in 2012. We may see book 6 in 2020 or so




Keep in mind that he has a TV show to keep up with, now. Assuming "Game of Thrones" runs 1 book per season and doesn't get canceled, he has a deadline of 2016 to release the sixth book (and 2017 to release the seventh). And in practical terms, it's probably more like 2015/2016, given the amount of planning that goes into a TV show.


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## Blastin (Mar 3, 2011)

I really have mixed feelings on this. Part of me REALLY wants to get it and read it day one, while a little voice is saying "why bother...it'll be 5-10 years before you get the next part anyway..."
  What to do....what to do....


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## Herremann the Wise (Mar 3, 2011)

Between this news and the forthcoming HBO series release, I think us lovers of fantasy are getting a real treat. Fantastic news!!!

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise


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## Umbran (Mar 3, 2011)

Morrus said:


> Meh.  It's been too long for me - I can't remember what happened in the last book and I don't want to read them again.  I won't be bothering with this.




I read the first book, and set it down and decided to wait until the series was done before I read any more, so I knew I'd avoid what you're experiencing (and the possible Robert Jordan effect of the author dying before he was done with the series).

I will believe it when I see it on the shelves.  I will worry about it when the last in the series hits the shelves.


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## Fast Learner (Mar 3, 2011)

Despite disturbing the poor, dead horse, I'll go on record again to say that I really don't care if it's ever finished, I've enjoyed each book so much that the pleasure of simply reading them has far, far outweighed any concern over final resolution. They're so drastically better than any of the hundreds of fantasy books I've read that the sheer reading pleasure is more than enough.

I appreciate that not everyone feels the same and that resolution is a big deal for a lot of folks, but it sure never stopped me from loving and sharing Firefly long before Serenity, for instance.


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## Pour (Mar 4, 2011)

Awesome news, but I'm right there with Jester. It's been far too long, and though I'll definitely purchase this hardcover, my passion for the series has cooled quite a bit. Given the usual complexity of his plots, and the fact he's had, what, 6 years to compound that, I'm going to have to reread the series to have any grasp of the E through Z plots (I think I have a firm enough grasp on A, B, C and D plots...).


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## Olgar Shiverstone (Mar 4, 2011)

I'll believe it when it is on the bookshelves.  The dead guy will still probably finish his series before GRRM's next book.


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## Zaukrie (Mar 4, 2011)

Crothian said:


> Isn't he a Mets fan?  If the Mets have a bad start to the season will that interfere with this?  What about the NFL issues?  We know he's a Giants fan and this could cause him delays.  Thank goodness there are no real elections between now and then or this could be delayed for years more.




Awesome post!

I'll believe it when I see it. I may not read another book until he finishes or dies....seriously, I don't have time to re-read the whole series each time a book comes out, which you have to do given the time delay.


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## Mercurius (Mar 4, 2011)

A Wait of Vice and Ire is almost over? I'll believe it when I see it.

I stopped reading after the first book, both because I liked but didn't love it, but also because I didn't want to deal with waiting a couple decades for the series to end. I think I'll hold off for another decade or so, at least until the last book is imminent which, at his current pace, should be sometime in the 2020-2024 range.


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## mach1.9pants (Mar 4, 2011)

There is another one due after this, right? The final one?


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## Olgar Shiverstone (Mar 4, 2011)

2 or 3 more, IIRC.  Hence my skepticism.


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## Herremann the Wise (Mar 4, 2011)

Hello Everyone,

I'm curious why people won't read a series until they have all been released. From my own point of view, if I liked a series, I would read it regardless of whether it was finished because:

a) I'd enjoy reading the next "chapter" of the story anyway

b) I'd hate reading something somewhere that spoiled what was happening in a book I had not read yet.

This differs for some of you out there, I'm kind of curious why?

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise


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## Starman (Mar 4, 2011)

Fast Learner said:


> Despite disturbing the poor, dead horse, I'll go on record again to say that I really don't care if it's ever finished, I've enjoyed each book so much that the pleasure of simply reading them has far, far outweighed any concern over final resolution. They're so drastically better than any of the hundreds of fantasy books I've read that the sheer reading pleasure is more than enough.
> 
> I appreciate that not everyone feels the same and that resolution is a big deal for a lot of folks, but it sure never stopped me from loving and sharing Firefly long before Serenity, for instance.




I, for one, refuse to read _The Canterbury Tales_ until Chaucer finishes the damn thing. I need to know how it ends. Do the pilgrims make it or not??!


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## MerricB (Mar 4, 2011)

Herremann the Wise said:


> This differs for some of you out there, I'm kind of curious why?




I'm not very happy reading something that will never be finished, especially something epic. GRRM really has to move heaven and earth to convince me that he'll finish A Song of Ice and Fire: it has taken him *eleven years* to finish writing this book. As he's now 62, he can't afford any more delays. (Jordan was 58 when he died, and we're very fortunate that he made copious notes and was willing to have someone else finish it; we're unbelievably fortunate that that someone was Brandon Sanderson). 

There's also the basic problem that I'm not convinced that the story knows where it's going. The Wheel of Time (mostly) has a massive forward momentum, and the brilliant use of prophecy and foreshadowing allows you to understand where it's going. 

Cheers!


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## the Jester (Mar 4, 2011)

Herremann the Wise said:


> Hello Everyone,
> 
> I'm curious why people won't read a series until they have all been released.




I'm happy to, if it's being written and released at a reasonable pace.

For instance, just today I got the final volume in Steven Erikson's _Malazan Book of the Fallen_, which I've been getting as they come out- because they come out every year or so at the most. 

It's a series where stuff is happening, and where the author is actually writing them instead of, basically, making excuses for how long it is taking.

I read _A Feast for Crows_ when it came out and realized that I couldn't remember everything that had been going on. And then release date after release date came and went while Martin kept saying, "No, that wasn't a release date, _this_ is a release date"- and he's doing it again.

Frankly, I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for this if I were you.

Now, I'm not one of those guys that thinks a given author "owes" me a story, or that he is under any obligation to finish a series. But I hate to read a cool series that never ends, and I'm also not one of those guys that thinks I somehow owe it to authors like Martin and Jordan and Gerrold to keep reading/buying them if they aren't writing what I want to read.


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## Felon (Mar 4, 2011)

Fast Learner said:


> Despite disturbing the poor, dead horse, I'll go on record again to say that I really don't care if it's ever finished, I've enjoyed each book so much that the pleasure of simply reading them has far, far outweighed any concern over final resolution.



Well, it'll be finished one way or the other. It's such a cash cow and Martin has gotten sufficiently avaricious that there's little doubt that he's sold the rights to publish more books in the case of his demise. Easy money for him, insurance for the publisher. 

I recommended these books to my mother, who has grown somewhat fond of sci-fi and fantasy epics late in her life. She didn't believe me when I told her there hasn't been another book in the last five years or so. Hope this makes her happy.


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## jonesy (Mar 4, 2011)

It's been 9 and a half years since Storm of Swords. Feast didn't really continue much from that. At this rate he'll need 20 years to finish the series.


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## Rhun (Mar 4, 2011)

Sweet! I can't wait to read the next one.


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## AdmundfortGeographer (Mar 4, 2011)

I don't believe anything he says about finishing the book. GRRM has offered too much proof he's full of it on that matter.

To my mind, it's not true until it's on the shelves.

Thankfully I stopped reading the series after the third book, vowing not to touch the rest of any of them until they were all out because he was too much of a flake releasing them unreliably. That's his prerogative.

Because he's taken so friggin long getting them out I'd completely forgotten nearly everything that happened in the first three book by the time book four was released. If I'm going to have to reread each book in the series all over again just so I'm not in the dark with the new one, I'm just going to wait until they are all out so I can read them together.

And I might not either, I'm getting bored with it now.


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## dangerous jack (Mar 4, 2011)

I won't be rushing to buy this one, which saddens me.  But I had a tough time with the last one because I no longer remembered who the characters were, or what they were doing.  It is still extremely skilled and engaging writing, but has fallen off from being brilliant storytelling.

That said, as soon as the final book is out, I will be rushing to read them all.


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## Stumblewyk (Mar 4, 2011)

_Excellent..._


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## HandofMystra (Mar 4, 2011)

Well, I am both excited and will also have to reread the whole damn thing. Maybe not the whole thing, I reread AGoT a couple of years ago so it seems rather fresh and the HBO will help. 

[sblock=spoiler][MENTION=13085]Steel[/MENTION]-Wind Did Stannis take the Black? It seems reasonable, the last that I remember though was that he was fleeing his castle and that red woman ...[/sblock]


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## Spatula (Mar 4, 2011)

the Jester said:


> I read _A Feast for Crows_ when it came out and realized that I couldn't remember everything that had been going on. And then release date after release date came and went while Martin kept saying, "No, that wasn't a release date, _this_ is a release date"- and he's doing it again.



Not to mention that (IIRC), Martin writes in the hardcover Feast for Crows, when explaining why half the characters wouldn't be appearing in it, that the next book was pretty much already written and mostly just needed editing.

That was 5 and a half years ago. And it took him 5 years to write FFC.

I'm really excited by this news - I thought GRRM had basically given up on ever putting another book out - but his lack of output has taken away any trust I had in him finishing the series. Which is fine. Books 1-3 stand perfectly fine on their own, and are a great read.


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## Puggins (Mar 4, 2011)

HandofMystra said:


> Well, I am both excited and will also have to reread the whole damn thing. Maybe not the whole thing, I reread AGoT a couple of years ago so it seems rather fresh and the HBO will help.
> 
> [sblock=spoiler][MENTION=13085]Steel[/MENTION]-Wind Did Stannis take the Black? It seems reasonable, the last that I remember though was that he was fleeing his castle and that red woman ...[/sblock]




You're a bit behind regarding what's happening on the Wall, Hand.  If you want a bit of catch-up regarding Stannis, read on...

[sblock=spoiler]Stannis took Davros' advice and marched his army north to help defend the wall.  Davros is the only person of influence to take the appeals for help from the Nightwatch seriously, and his advice saved the wall from being taken by Mance Rayder.

Stannis fell upon Mance's army as Mance was assaulting the Gate at castle black (the red priestess, Melisandra, accompanied him).  Mance was routed and captured, Stannis subsequently took up residence at castle black as the king.  He offered to free Jon Snow of his vows to the Nightwatch and to make Snow the rightful lord of Winterfell.  Thus far, Jon has refused.  

Jon has packed up Maester Aemon (who was a Targaryen before taking the black) and Mance Rayder's son and sent them south with Samwell Tarly in an effort to deny Melisandra a sacrifice of royal blood.  Aemon died along the way, Sam made it to the Citadel, where we last saw him (unknowingly) in the company of the Faceless Man who Arya saved in A Game of Thrones.[/sblock]

That's pretty much where we're at.  Can't wait for it, personally.


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## Azgulor (Mar 4, 2011)

Fast Learner said:


> Despite disturbing the poor, dead horse, I'll go on record again to say that I really don't care if it's ever finished, I've enjoyed each book so much that the pleasure of simply reading them has far, far outweighed any concern over final resolution. They're so drastically better than any of the hundreds of fantasy books I've read that the sheer reading pleasure is more than enough.
> 
> I appreciate that not everyone feels the same and that resolution is a big deal for a lot of folks, but it sure never stopped me from loving and sharing Firefly long before Serenity, for instance.




I worry less about series completion so long as the book can stand alone.  Too often with this style of series, however, we increasingly see characters left in cliffhanger-style situations.  For me, this is the primary reason to wait for a series to be released in full before diving into it.

That said, I've loved every book so far.

I do think he really damaged the brand & his reputation with the ridiculous delays.  From the looks of the TV series, I think it'll reinvigorate the fans and draw new ones in, which is great.  However, if he thought he was under pressure to finish before, I can definitely see this shaping up as a "Be careful what you wish for" scenario.


Sidenote: It still amazes me, however, that I can cherish these books so much yet cringe at 90% of what he says in interviews & blogs.  The "so distraught at the election I can't write" crap almost made me sell off the books that had been released.  Man up & write already or at least stop making excuses!


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## mac1504 (Mar 4, 2011)

I am cautiously optimistic of this news; I will be happy to have a good summer book to read. As far as catching up, I personally just slip in the audio books into my commute. I did that before reading a FFC.

Also, they released a new trailer for the HBO series yesterday as well:

The best 'Game of Thrones' trailer yet -- EXCLUSIVE | Inside TV | EW.com


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## DEFCON 1 (Mar 4, 2011)

I will definitely pick this book up right around it's release date, and if history is any indication... in the months leading up to it I'll do exactly what I did leading up to A Feast For Crows... which is go back and reread the earlier books.

I am very thankful in that the period of time after reading one of these books where I desperately wish that the next book would "just get here already"... only lasts for a couple weeks or so.  After that... I'm able to put away my needs and desires for the next book and just move on to whatever tv/film/book I'm excited for next.  I haven't been concerned with what happens after AFfC for years now, and thus it doesn't matter to me how long he takes to put out the next one.  And once Dragons is released... by the beginning of August I won't be worrying about when The Winds of Winter might get written.


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## howandwhy99 (Mar 4, 2011)

Herremann the Wise said:


> Hello Everyone,
> 
> I'm curious why people won't read a series until they have all been released. From my own point of view, if I liked a series, I would read it regardless of whether it was finished because:
> 
> ...




Watch the Star Wars Trilogy and stop after Empire, why go on right?

Or read books backwards first. Or randomly roll what pages to read next. 

Because continuity and resolution generally hold a payoff desired by audiences.


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## Umbran (Mar 4, 2011)

Fast Learner said:


> I appreciate that not everyone feels the same and that resolution is a big deal for a lot of folks, but it sure never stopped me from loving and sharing Firefly long before Serenity, for instance.




It isn't about resolution, it is about pacing.  

I don't mind reading the last book and having plot threads ultimately left hanging.  I mind having to wait so long between books that I forget the details, and have to go back and re-read several 500+ page tomes to be able to fully enjoy and understand the newest offering.  The books are good, but not so good that I feel they merit so much revisiting so soon.

There are other authors who reliably put new books out on a regular basis, and these I don't mind reading as they come out.  But this guy hasn't earned that kind of trust.


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## Umbran (Mar 4, 2011)

There was a thread in General and a thread here in Media on the same topic - I've brought them both to Media and merged them.


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## jbear (Mar 4, 2011)

I've had a bit of a giggle at some of the semi-irate responses in the thread thus far I must admit. I talk about Mr Martin every now again with my wife and I'll also admit we've not always said nice things. But I think mainly out of a sense of frustration at having waited so long for something to continue a story I thus far have absolutely relished.

But I guess it's best to flip negative things on their head. Waiting for the next book so long was the direct cause for me stumbling across the 'Geralt de Rivia Saga', written by a marvellous polish writer, Andrej Sapkowski, which I have been thoroughly enjoying in what has seemed like a wait that was never going to end.

Also, with a four month heads up I have enough time to reread the series from the beginning because the details have faded into a haze of nostalgia far to light on details, but this time with the satisfaction of knowing at the end of it I will be able to have the next one in my hands smelling of new with the stories of what the hell happened to John Snow and Tyrion inside.

Will the entire series ever fully written? I have my doubts. But I still want to read the next book.


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## NewJeffCT (Mar 4, 2011)

when the last book, *A Feast For Crows *was released - way the heck back in 2005 - it had been about five years since book three, *A Storm of Swords*, had been released in 2000.

When I picked up AFFC right after its release, I started reading it immediately and was overwhelmed because I had forgotten so much that had happened from the last book.  I got frustrated because I could not remember so many of the characters, so I just stopped reading after less than 20 pages and said I would wait until the next book came out and read them both together.... little did I know the wait would be six friggin' years!!   I vaguely remember names like Lannister and Stark, but could not tell you one Stark child from another and which ones are alive and which ones are dead.

When AFFC came out, didn't he say that he had written AFFC and ADWD together so they could be released in back to back years?  Or, something like that?


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## Crothian (Mar 4, 2011)

NewJeffCT said:


> When AFFC came out, didn't he say that he had written AFFC and ADWD together so they could be released in back to back years?  Or, something like that?




Yes, he did.  he had written so much it had to be broken into two books.  Given how long it took for that to happen I think it was BS.  

The delays don't bother me as much as hearing and reading some things he wrote on his blog.  His excuses over the years and reactions to fans really left me cold.  He became an author I don't want to give money to.


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## mach1.9pants (Mar 5, 2011)

Just like the wheel of time, I won't be buying or reading anymore until they are all out in mass market paperback and I can start from scratch. Still I really look forward to that day, if it happens!


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## Aldern Foxglove (Mar 5, 2011)

Ah my bad missed this thread entirely. 

But honestly I cannot believe the responses here. To me A Song of Ice and Fire blows everything else in the fantasy genre out of the water. I've enjoyed the books so much that even if they remained unfinished I could never contemplate regretting reading them.

I feel very sorry for folks who are not going to continue with the series because they might have to wait a while, or even never see it finished.


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## Banshee16 (Mar 5, 2011)

Dausuul said:


> Keep in mind that he has a TV show to keep up with, now. Assuming "Game of Thrones" runs 1 book per season and doesn't get canceled, he has a deadline of 2016 to release the sixth book (and 2017 to release the seventh). And in practical terms, it's probably more like 2015/2016, given the amount of planning that goes into a TV show.




It'll be an expensive, niche TV show.  And, given we haven't seen an episode yet, we have no idea if it'll be good enough to last all those seasons.  So this is a hypothetical pressure on him.  If the show lasts 2 seasons and then gets canceled, there's not much pressure on him.

I hope this is not the case.  I hope that he feels sufficient pressure that he gets the next book out in a year or two, and that this big wait was due to problems in writing book 5, and not an indicator that he's truly slowing down.

I guess we'll see..

How many more books are there supposed to be?  2?  Or 3?  I can't remember if it's a 6 book series that has been extended to 7 books, or a 7 book series that extended to 8 books.

Banshee


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## Banshee16 (Mar 5, 2011)

Herremann the Wise said:


> Hello Everyone,
> 
> I'm curious why people won't read a series until they have all been released. From my own point of view, if I liked a series, I would read it regardless of whether it was finished because:
> 
> ...




It is kind of a silly viewpoint.  Regardless of delays, the books are excellent, and far superior than most of what we have available in terms of fantasy.

And really, none of us is guaranteed any time on this earth.  I'd rather not postpone something I'd really like because the series isn't complete or whatever.....because we might not *be* here 10 years down the road when that final book comes out.

Banshee


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## Jared Rascher (Mar 5, 2011)

Starman said:


> I, for one, refuse to read _The Canterbury Tales_ until Chaucer finishes the damn thing. I need to know how it ends. Do the pilgrims make it or not??!





Isn't there a relative that Kevin J. Anderson can find to finish this up?


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## Starman (Mar 5, 2011)

Banshee16 said:


> How many more books are there supposed to be?  2?  Or 3?  I can't remember if it's a 6 book series that has been extended to 7 books, or a 7 book series that extended to 8 books.
> 
> Banshee




It started out as a trilogy. Then it changed to six. He's been saying seven for awhile now, though.



KnightErrantJR said:


> Isn't there a relative that Kevin J. Anderson can find to finish this up?




Don't give him ideas!


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## Crothian (Mar 6, 2011)

Aldern Foxglove said:


> But honestly I cannot believe the responses here. To me A Song of Ice and Fire blows everything else in the fantasy genre out of the water..




Not everyone feels that way obviously.  I don't think he is head and shoulders above everyone else that writes fantasy.  His books I've read were good, but honestly I enjoy other writers more.


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## CAFRedblade (Mar 16, 2011)

Taiwan News catches up with one of their wacky CGI videos.

George R.R. Martin (and his dancing ghost) get the zany Taiwanese news treatment

I love these things.


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## El Mahdi (Mar 16, 2011)

My favorite part was the game of musical chairs using the Iron Throne.


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## Fast Learner (Mar 16, 2011)

So many great things in that video! Dancing Tyrion! A game of musical thrones! The "who dies next?" poster!


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## Steel_Wind (Apr 27, 2011)

GRRM is in New York City today. He was there for last night's Time 100 Most Influential People of 2011 gala. Today he met with his publisher in NYC.

The subject of that meeting has now been leaked on GRRM's Not A Blog which indicates that "Twas Beauty...." and then a large picture of King Kong lying dead at the base of the World Trade Centre is shown on George's blog.







As most know how have been following George's efforts on _A Dance with Dragons_, GRRM has referred often in the past years to ADwD as "King Kong" on his blog.

So Kong is dead and *A Dance with Dragons* is FINISHED, as promised!! 

The Book (and audiobook) will be in stores in North America and the U.K. on July 12, 2011.


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