# Critical hits on undead?



## rilus (Oct 31, 2004)

Anyone have any good systems for criticals on undead, constructs, etc?

I always allow criticals AND sneak attacks on undead, contructs, etc.

I was just wondering if anyone has any alternate of dealing with them.


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## DreamChaser (Oct 31, 2004)

I allow critical confirmation rolls to me made but I still make them immune to precision damage (sneak attack and critical).  If the weapon does something that isn't precision based (like Flaming Burst or vorpal), the undead or construct would take the increased damage or loose the body part (not deadly for them necessarily).  If not, then it is just normal damage.

DC


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## Shadeus (Nov 1, 2004)

DreamChaser said:
			
		

> I allow critical confirmation rolls to me made but I still make them immune to precision damage (sneak attack and critical).  If the weapon does something that isn't precision based (like Flaming Burst or vorpal), the undead or construct would take the increased damage or loose the body part (not deadly for them necessarily).  If not, then it is just normal damage.
> 
> DC




Actually, that's straight from the DMG.  Take a look at the mace of smiting and its effect on golems (who are also immune to criticals).  

What we've done in some campaigns I've played is allow it as a weapon ability.  You can critical undead, but suffer a -4 penalty on the confirmation roll.  It never came up as a item creation question, so I'm not sure what the modifier should be...maybe +2.


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## Nareau (Nov 1, 2004)

I was just thinking about this today.  I like the idea of critical hits on undead, as it seems to fit with much of the body of lore surrounding them.  Vampires must be staked through the heart or beheaded to be slain, both of which sound like critical hits to me.  Zombies have to be shot in the head.  Skeletons have to be completely smashed apart.  Although if I were to allow critical hits against undead, I think it'd only be for corporeal undead.

Spider


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## zalgar07 (Nov 1, 2004)

*Host of options.*

Could be done as a weapon property, feat (or series of feats), prestige class, combat maneuver (a la _Book of Iron Might_) or a house rule. I'd lean toward a combat maneuver or feat chain myself.


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## Anthelios (Nov 1, 2004)

Hmm.. Heres a couple of feats. Though they havn't been tested yet. Feedback would be nice.

*Heavy Strike* [General]

You deal additional damage to objects, constructs and corporeal undead.

Prerequisites: Str 15, Craft ( any ) 4 ranks

Benefit: If you successfully critical hit a corporeal creature or object that is immune to critical hits, your attack gains a +2 bonus damage.

*Demolishing Strike* [General]

You deal additional critical and sneak attack damage against objects, constructs and corporeal undead.

Prerequisites: Power Attack, Heavy Strike, Base attack bonus +3

Benefit: Whenever you score a critical hit, or sneak attack against a corporeal creature or object that is immune to critical hits, you may add half your critical damage or sneak attack damage to the attack.

*Improved Demolishing Strike* [General]

You are trained to deal normal critical and sneak attack damage against objects, constructs and corporeal undead.

Prerequisites: Demolishing Strike

Benefit: You deal your weapons regulare critical and sneak attack damage to undead, even if they are immune to critical hits.

Special: This replaces the half damage gained from Demolishing Strike, and does not stack.


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## Raylis (Nov 1, 2004)

*Crit's on Undead, Constructs, Etc.*

The system that my gaming group uses is any weapon that does extra damage on a crit (namely the burst weapons) does affect undead, the extra energy damage is delt but not the exta physical damage (I.E. A flaming burst scimitar would deal 1d6+str+1d6 fire+2d10 fire). 

Any ranger or other class that takes a favored enemy that would normally be immune to crits isn't immune to crits or favored enemy damage from the Ranger.

As a DM I made the Disruption Ability work like the Mace of Smiting and allowed players to take Critical Strike (From Masters of the Wild) while ignoring the favored enemy prereq.

Hope this Helps

"Keep Neck Injuries Down-Donate Blood!"


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## Ghostwind (Nov 1, 2004)

If you take a look at _Torn Asunder: Critical Hits_ (Bastion Press), you'll see that your very question is addressed.


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## JDowling (Nov 2, 2004)

Spider said:
			
		

> I was just thinking about this today.  I like the idea of critical hits on undead, as it seems to fit with much of the body of lore surrounding them . . . Although if I were to allow critical hits against undead, I think it'd only be for corporeal undead.
> 
> Spider




something similar to this (I may have read this here acctually a while ago) is that if you want undead to be tougher / more scary / more horror movie give them insane damage resistance and use called shots to hit specific areas where they are weak.  Either that or it could be like Skeleton: DR 50/Crushing etc if they aren't weak in one spot but to one type of damage.  Zombie could be like 50/Head Shot .

it's been a while so I don't recall if called shots are in 3.5 rules, but I'm fairly sure they are buried in there somewhere.


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## Darmanicus (Nov 2, 2004)

Check out the Book of Exalted Deeds, it has suggestions re this. IIRC it suggests that the character should be exalted in nature ie. exalted prestige class, 3 exalted feats or maybe a certain lv attained as paladin or cleric.

I personally think that a holy or bane weapon should be able to do this also.


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## Spyritwind (Nov 5, 2004)

A critical strike may be seen as hitting in a critical location only therefore discounting certain creatures, or a critical hit could mean your best swing of the day generating more force.  I think the former is considered more than the later.

Another option is to go ahead and roll the multiple damage dice and keep the highest roll.  Example:  Gonad the Librarian hit a skeleton with a long sword and scores a critticle hit.  Gonad rolls 1d8 twice and keeps the highest roll.  It's far from double damage in some cases, but it still reflects the ability to get in a better strike.  



Sneak attack is a different ability IMO.  I really interpret this as the ability to hit your opponent in a critical location and has nothing to do with getting in a particularly powerful strike.  Even so even a +1 per 1d6 would still be more damage while greatly reducing the ability.


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## Maester Luwin (Nov 8, 2004)

I like your ideas Spyritwind! I actually made the undead alittle more deadly in my game & made them only hit with crit's (& your roll both damage dice & take the highest will be useful) as they are assumed to shrug off normal damage/ wounds that wear the average PC down. Thanks Maester Luwin


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