# Explain Canada



## warlord (Sep 23, 2005)

So I'm a junior in highschool and just started looking at colleges. So far Canada is looking real nice as far as universities go so is there anything I need to know about Canada before I go up there to visit colleges?


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## orangefruitbat (Sep 23, 2005)

Being Canadian, here are a few things:

*Canada is very similar to the US (baring French-speaking Quebec), so we tend to define oureslves in how we're different than America, rather than in our similarities. There are differences, but they're not so big that you can't feel comfortable. In general, Canadians are slightly more liberal than Americans, but this tends to be overstaked (unless you're into canabis culture or are hoping to marry someone of the same sex). Culture in Vacouver (BC) isn't too different than Seattle. Albertans aren't too different than mid Western Americans, and us folk in Toronto aren't too differerent than those in say Chicago or Boston. East-Coasters are similar to those in the East coast of the US.

*things will be slightly cheaper here, as the American dollar gets a premium. Hower this exchnage rate is falling. 5 years ago, $1 CDN would be worth .65 US. Now its $1 to .85 or so. So don't expect a consistent rate over the next 3 or 4 years. Cost of living is roughly comparable. Overall, Canadians are less wealthy than Americans, and tend to drive smaller cars and live in smaller hourses. But it's not a huge difference.

*Winters are generally colder, but if you're from Minesota, then you know how to dress sensibly. Vancouver tends to be merely wet without a lot of snow, but if you live in Ottawa or Edmunton, be prepared for long winters.

*Canada has some excellent universities. None of our universities are as well-funded as say Harvard, but this really only affects top-level graduate research (or those pursuing sporting scholarships). Our best-funded research university (the University of Toronto), which is an excellent graduate university, is  ironically not one I'd recommend for undergraduates as it can be big and impersonal. I would find a university that has a good program for you, that is of a comfortable size. (And possibly not too, too far from home, cause it's nice to visit).

*Most big cities have excellent role-playing stores and communities.

*Get comfortable with the metric system.

*Our beer is better.

*If you like hockey, things will be good. Lots of Canadians don't like hockey, and that's ok too.

*TV is about the same, but we get the CBC, which means the new Dr. Who. (not sure when the new season starts though).



			
				warlord said:
			
		

> So I'm a junior in highschool and just started looking at colleges. So far Canada is looking real nice as far as universities go so is there anything I need to know about Canada before I go up there to visit colleges?


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## devilbat (Sep 23, 2005)

> Overall, Canadians are less wealthy than Americans, and tend to drive smaller cars and live in smaller hourses.




????????

 

Overall, house sizes and car sizes are the same as our American friends.  We don't have as many Millionaires as the U.S. does, nor do we have Hollywood or Miami Beach, but to say the *average* house size and car models are smaller, is just not accurate.  Canadian population is also much, much less then the Americans.

Our larger Canadian Universities are well regarded, thoughout the world.  You will find that the American dollar will take you a little further in Canada.  

Our standard ond style of living is the same in Canada as in the U.S.  We watch the same programs, eat the same foods, listen to the same music, and drive the same cars.  I have lived in the U.S. a good portion of my life, and the differences I have seen are more regional then anything else.  I have always thought it funny when travelling through the States, and talking to people who believe that Canada is the arctic, and only hunters, hockey players and eskimos live there.

You will also find that the average American is far more patriotic then the average Canadian.


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## Blue_Kryptonite (Sep 23, 2005)

My observation as a native of New York with Canadian relatives in a couple provinces: Socially, the USA is RPGnet. Canada is ENWorld. Most of the same discourse, but one is cleaner, friendlier, and more polite than the other.


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## Del (Sep 23, 2005)

Don't forget the "eh", eh.

It's basically a self-conscious statement appendage.


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## Dextra (Sep 23, 2005)

*Canadia!*

One big difference in post-secondary education between the US and Canada is the number of alcohol-related deaths and injuries.  Even though the drinking age in the US is higher, a culture of excess has built up around campuses, and many students' health and education suffer because of it.  In Canada, the drinking age is lower (19, 18 in Quebec), and there seems to be less of a forbidden-fruit syndrome.  Our American friends come up and drink themselves silly for a few weeks whilst they adjust to the new paradigm, but almost all then join in with their more responsible less alcoholic Canuck peers.  

If you are going to consider education in Quebec, do yourself a favour and try and pick up a rudimentary French course along the way.  Sure, McGill and Concordia offer a brilliant course calendar, but you may be hard-pressed to find a part-time job (or meet anyone outside of campus) in Montreal if you don't understand French.

I disagree with the statement that Canadians are less patriotic than our US counterparts.  It's just we're not so in-your-face flag-waving about it.  We're more polite.  To proclaim our superiority too loudly might make other countries' citizens feel inadequate, and that wouldn't be very nice now, would it?

As a general rule, people tend to get along better here.  To paraphrase one of Pierre Trudeau's sons, this can largely be explained by the fact that no matter where you live in Canada (well, except Toronto, and they don't really count as Canadians anyhow, right?) winter is coming (aside: been reading Game Of Thrones, and this saying of the Starks now strikes truer than ever before!).  It gives us a bit of a staunch determined feel, a mild smugness of our toughness, pioneering spirit, and "we're all in this together" to survive the infamous Canadian Winter ov Doom, and we tend to be more tolerant of differences.  Well, except for those damned close-minded rightwing Albertans.  (PS tongue=in cheek.  I heart my oilmoney-soaked redneck friends!)

Honestly, though, in general the majority of our differences are subtle, most charming.

For more information, I heartily encourage you to read
Canadian World Domination


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## billd91 (Sep 23, 2005)

Canadians are oddly fond of curling. I'm from an area of the US where curling is unusually popular and even I find the level of popularity the sport has in Canada is weird.


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## diaglo (Sep 23, 2005)

billd91 said:
			
		

> Canadians are oddly fond of curling. I'm from an area of the US where curling is unusually popular and even I find the level of popularity the sport has in Canada is weird.



i curl my toes too when i explode

IYKWIMAITYD
'
diaglo "fond of curling at least once a day" Ooi


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## was (Sep 23, 2005)

Very, very cold.


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## MaxKaladin (Sep 23, 2005)

devilbat said:
			
		

> I have always thought it funny when travelling through the States, and talking to people who believe that Canada is the arctic, and only hunters, hockey players and eskimos live there.



Pffft!  That's not true.  We know about the lumberjacks.


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## Rel (Sep 23, 2005)

Personally Canada scares me.  Ever look at a map?  It's just this enormous, icy mass resting quietly atop the U.S. for 'lo these many years.  Quietly waiting for their moment to strike.
And they're already subtly invading us with their Celine Dions, Mike Myers and Peter Jenningses (I find that I don't mind Shania Twain so much though).  Sneaky bastards.  I don't trust them.




(Actually I love almost all the Canadians I've ever met but I'm mildly bitter that I didn't get any poutine at GenCon. )


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## Rodrigo Istalindir (Sep 23, 2005)

Rel said:
			
		

> Personally Canada scares me.  Ever look at a map?  It's just this enormous, icy mass resting quietly atop the U.S. for 'lo these many years.  Quietly waiting for their moment to strike.
> And they're already subtly invading us with their Celine Dions, Mike Myers and Peter Jenningses (I find that I don't mind Shania Twain so much though).  Sneaky bastards.  I don't trust them.




Yeah, well, one down, two to go.  And our fondness for SUVs is just a cunningly disguised plan to increase global warming and ward off that threat from the Great White North.


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## wingsandsword (Sep 23, 2005)

Del said:
			
		

> Don't forget the "eh", eh.
> 
> It's basically a self-conscious statement appendage.



I always figured that the Canadian "eh" was them pronouncing the period at the end of a sentance, sort of a verbalized "end of statement" cue.


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## Gnome (Sep 23, 2005)

So are Canadian geese referred to as just "geese" up there?  How about the other kind of geese, for that matter?


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## drothgery (Sep 23, 2005)

devilbat said:
			
		

> ????????
> 
> 
> 
> Overall, house sizes and car sizes are the same as our American friends.  We don't have as many Millionaires as the U.S. does, nor do we have Hollywood or Miami Beach, but to say the *average* house size and car models are smaller, is just not accurate.  Canadian population is also much, much less then the Americans.




You can look up the per capita real GDP numbers; there's a pretty significant gap between the US and Canada (and most other first-world countries, in fact). It's not a huge gap, but it's definitely there.


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## fusangite (Sep 23, 2005)

With respect to universities in Canada, only one has a reputation of any worth outside the country: the University of Toronto. In keeping with our slightly more socialistic social contract, you will find that university is cheaper for mediocre students than it is in the US and pricier for good students than in the US. 

Like the US, Canada is not monolithic and has many regional variations with respect to climate, culture and everything else you might imagine. While, in the past, Canada has been pretty politically similar to the US, we have diverged a little more in recent years not so much in areas of policy but in terms of how we talk about ourselves. The Bush administration is more disliked in Canada than Nixon's was and this rubs off a bit in an unprecedented level of general US-bashing even in relatively conservative areas of the country. If you're a highly political Republican, therefore, you might find yourself having to be a little quiet about it in social situations in a way that has never been true here before.

You'll find Canadians are, in many respects, more into US popular culture than Americans are. Racial politics are a little different here than in the US -- most of Canada's black population are recent (since the 1960s) immigrants from the Carribean and are concentrated in Quebec and Ontario. And, outside of Quebec, there are few Hispanic people. West and north of Ontario, the main racial minority are aboriginal people, although they are outnumbered by Chinese and South Asian (Indian subcontinent) people in the cities of BC and Alberta. Issues that might be understood as racial in the US are often understood by Canadians as being about ethnicity or culture; our national multicultural policy is about twenty years older and very different from that of the US.

If I had to pick one state to compare Canada to, I'd say we're like California, minus the hispanic people -- liberal, regionally diffuse, highly urban and much enamoured of US cultural exports.

EDIT:

When coming up to visit colleges, avoid the area from Edmonton to Quebec City during the winter (except maybe the area along Lakes Erie and Ontario) during the winter if you can. The area from Calgary to Victoria and the three Maritime provinces aren't too bad in the winter. 

And, Greyhound buses in Canada, while bad, are nowhere near as bad as those in the US. Don't take the train unless you are in Quebec or Ontario (that's where all the rail subsidies go) or are independently wealthy.


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## devilbat (Sep 23, 2005)

> Personally Canada scares me. Ever look at a map? It's just this enormous, icy mass resting quietly atop the U.S. for 'lo these many years. Quietly waiting for their moment to strike.
> And they're already subtly invading us with their Celine Dions, Mike Myers and Peter Jenningses (I find that I don't mind Shania Twain so much though). Sneaky bastards. I don't trust them.




Crap, they're on to us!  Quick, everybody put on the foil and call Pam Anderson, Carrie Ann Moss, Brenden Fraser, Keanu Reeves, Hayden Christensen, Matthew Perry and all members of Rush, and tell them to get the hell out of there.


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## fusangite (Sep 23, 2005)

drothgery said:
			
		

> You can look up the per capita real GDP numbers; there's a pretty significant gap between the US and Canada (and most other first-world countries, in fact). It's not a huge gap, but it's definitely there.



Well, you'll find that fewer Canadians are very rich and fewer are very poor. However, the gap between rich and poor here has widened considerably in the past 12 years. However, the only way you're going to notice the smaller per capita GDP is if you hang out with millionaires and find there are fewer of them here. (Except in BC which has more per capita than almost any US state.)


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## Alhazred (Sep 23, 2005)

What programme do you have in mind?  I went to U Waterloo for my BA (medieval studies) and Wilfrid Laurier - which is literally right down the street - for my MA.  Waterloo is highly respected for its math, computer science and engieneering programmes, and its coop programme.  Laurier is big on business.


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## Rel (Sep 23, 2005)

devilbat said:
			
		

> Crap, they're on to us!  Quick, everybody put on the foil and call Pam Anderson, Carrie Ann Moss, Brenden Fraser, Keanu Reeves, Hayden Christensen, Matthew Perry and all members of Rush, and tell them to get the hell out of there.




I am prepared to offer you ONE MILLION AMERICAN DOLLARS if you'll leave Carrie Ann Moss and take Carrot Top and Sally Struthers.  And before you scream "NO!", I urge you to consider that if we were to ship them there in the same container, it is unlikely that more than one would survive the trip...


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## devilbat (Sep 23, 2005)

> I am prepared to offer you ONE MILLION AMERICAN DOLLARS if you'll leave Carrie Ann Moss and take Carrot Top and Sally Struthers.




How about we trade Tom Green for Carrot Top straight up?


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## devilbat (Sep 23, 2005)

> So are Canadian geese referred to as just "geese" up there? How about the other kind of geese, for that matter?




Oh and to answer your question, yes,  Canadians refer to Canadian geese as geese.  But I don't know what they call them in Toronto.


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## Rel (Sep 23, 2005)

devilbat said:
			
		

> How about we trade Tom Green for Carrot Top straight up?




Man!  You Canadians drive a hard bargain!

Let me sleep on it.  There's always a chance that something heavy will fall on Carrot Top tonight and make the decision for me.


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## DarkSoldier (Sep 24, 2005)

Canada is like an unarmed America with health care.


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## fusangite (Sep 24, 2005)

DarkSoldier said:
			
		

> Canada is like an unarmed America with health care.



Actually we have more guns per capita than the US. It's just that there are a lot fewer urban gun owners and a much smaller portion of our guns are handguns.


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## Toras (Sep 24, 2005)

fusangite said:
			
		

> With respect to universities in Canada, only one has a reputation of any worth outside the country: the University of Toronto. In keeping with our slightly more socialistic social contract, you will find that university is cheaper for mediocre students than it is in the US and pricier for good students than in the US.
> 
> 
> When coming up to visit colleges, avoid the area from Edmonton to Quebec City during the winter (except maybe the area along Lakes Erie and Ontario) during the winter if you can. The area from Calgary to Victoria and the three Maritime provinces aren't too bad in the winter.




I would not agree that only Toronto is respected, as there is a major university in the capital city of each province and many of them are quite respected.  

As for avoiding Edmonton in the winter, what kind of Canadian are you?  -30 C is the perfect weather in the winter.  And if you are looking to work to help pay for College, their are a large number of well paying jobs in oil.


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## fusangite (Sep 24, 2005)

Toras said:
			
		

> I would not agree that only Toronto is respected, as there is a major university in the capital city of each province and many of them are quite respected.



_In Canada_. Outside of Canada, McGill and U of T used to be know but McGill has really lost a lot of its international standing in the past 30 years. Nobody outside of Canada attaches any significance to these other places.







> As for avoiding Edmonton in the winter, what kind of Canadian are you?  -30 C is the perfect weather in the winter.  And if you are looking to work to help pay for College, their are a large number of well paying jobs in oil.



It's true -- Alberta is the best place for undergraduates to find jobs. No contest.


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## devilbat (Sep 24, 2005)

> It's true -- Alberta is the best place for undergraduates to find jobs. No contest.




It's true, the rest of Canada bows down to superiority of those that hail in the centre of the world, otherwise known as Toronto.  Just ask someone from there.


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## mojo1701 (Sep 24, 2005)

There's a lot of foreign students here at the University of Windsor.


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## Impeesa (Sep 25, 2005)

wingsandsword said:
			
		

> I always figured that the Canadian "eh" was them pronouncing the period at the end of a sentance, sort of a verbalized "end of statement" cue.




Eh? It's the same as the American "huh" or "hey", sort of a 'what do you think?' tacked on to the end of the sentence.

--Impeesa--


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## ssampier (Sep 25, 2005)

Impeesa said:
			
		

> Eh? It's the same as the American "huh" or "hey", sort of a 'what do you think?' tacked on to the end of the sentence.
> 
> --Impeesa--




Hey! We use that the beginning of a sentence, not at the end. It's probably closer to those annoying people that say, "You know?" or "You know what I'm sayin'?" after every sentence. 

*who's never been to Canada but dreams of finding _The One Road_. As Trey Parker and Matt Stone say, "Blame Canada."


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## Tarrasque Wrangler (Sep 25, 2005)

> Oh and to answer your question, yes, Canadians refer to Canadian geese as geese. But I don't know what they call them in Toronto.




Ah, but what do you folks call Canadian bacon?


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## Goblyn (Sep 25, 2005)

fusangite said:
			
		

> _In Canada_It's true -- Alberta is the best place for undergraduates to find jobs. No contest.




I agree.



			
				mojo1701 said:
			
		

> There's a lot of foreign students here at the University of Windsor.




As well as at many major institutions in BC, IMX, such as UBC, BCIT, UCFV, and Douglas College. Not that that is exhaustive, though.



			
				Impeesa said:
			
		

> Eh? It's the same as the American "huh" or "hey", sort of a 'what do you think?' tacked on to the end of the sentence.
> 
> --Impeesa--




All, really. You can find that many people use it in different ways, but they all revolve around these similar meanings.


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## Impeesa (Sep 25, 2005)

ssampier said:
			
		

> Hey! We use that the beginning of a sentence, not at the end. It's probably closer to those annoying people that say, "You know?" or "You know what I'm sayin'?" after every sentence.




Finish this sentence: "Nice weather, ___?" 

--Impeesa--


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## devilbat (Sep 26, 2005)

> Ah, but what do you folks call Canadian bacon





We call it back Bacon.


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## ssampier (Sep 26, 2005)

Impeesa said:
			
		

> Finish this sentence: "Nice weather, ___?"
> 
> --Impeesa--




today, isn't it?

today, Sir?

lately, Ma'm?

Sorry it'd sound strange saying "hey" there. eh really does sound better, but if I said that instead, people would think I lost my mind or something (and starting wearing hats with earflaps*).

*stereotype I know....


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## ssampier (Sep 26, 2005)

devilbat said:
			
		

> We call it back Bacon.




What are _you_ doing in Canada, man?

 

I love that show.


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## jester47 (Sep 26, 2005)

I really think most Americans (as opposed to Canadians, cause technicly we're all AMERICANS) think of Canada as a supply of unused states.  Kind of like Puerto Rico.  If we were to ever add Puerto Rico as a state, it would really mess up the flag, and so to straighten it out, we would need a few more states, approx 4.  So we would probably "cut a deal"* and take BC, Alberta, the Northwest Territories, and The Yukon.  That way Alaska would not be so lonely and no one would really complain all that much.  Mexico is where we invade if it proves impossible to move the border 30 miles north.  

*The appearance of said deal depends on who is in the white house at the time.


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## devilbat (Sep 26, 2005)

> So we would probably "cut a deal"* and take BC, Alberta, the Northwest Territories, and The Yukon.




That would be an inventive way to get more oil.  I'd ask if you could take us Manitobans, because I like the color of the U.S. dollar.


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## Shemeska (Sep 27, 2005)

jester47 said:
			
		

> I really think most Americans (as opposed to Canadians, cause technicly we're all AMERICANS) think of Canada as a supply of unused states.  Kind of like Puerto Rico.  If we were to ever add Puerto Rico as a state, it would really mess up the flag, and so to straighten it out, we would need a few more states, approx 4.  So we would probably "cut a deal"* and take BC, Alberta, the Northwest Territories, and The Yukon.  That way Alaska would not be so lonely and no one would really complain all that much.  Mexico is where we invade if it proves impossible to move the border 30 miles north.
> 
> *The appearance of said deal depends on who is in the white house at the time.




Not as far fetched really considering that Alberta keeps moving towards secession anyway. Pays far more out than in in terms of taxes since they have the oil and cattle industry there, and that little thing about not being able to elect their own representatives but having them appointed by the prime minister*.

* I say this as an american who gets an earful on this from a friend from Canada


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## Wild Gazebo (Sep 27, 2005)

> With respect to universities in Canada, only one has a reputation of any worth outside the country: the University of Toronto.




That's a nice little rumour you've got going there.  I'd just like to add that that the following universities made The Times Higher Education Supplement list of top universities:  McGill, UofT, UBC, Waterloo, McMaster, UofA, University de Montreal (as of 2004).  McGill receiving the second highest mark for International Faculty Acclaim.

Personally I have a soft spot for NASCAD and Concordia...but I studied a lot of silly artsty thingies.


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## Azul (Sep 27, 2005)

Dextra said:
			
		

> If you are going to consider education in Quebec, do yourself a favour and try and pick up a rudimentary French course along the way.  Sure, McGill and Concordia offer a brilliant course calendar, but you may be hard-pressed to find a part-time job (or meet anyone outside of campus) in Montreal if you don't understand French.




Well, as a former Montrealer, Con U and McGill student, I can't completely agree with you.  Finding a part-time job will be harder... much harder if you are talking about a retail job (but outside the east end of Montreal, it's hard to find retail work unless you speak BOTH French and English).

It is perfectly feasable to function as a unilingual Anglophone (i.e. English-speaker) in Montreal but you end up being limited to western parts of the city... pretty much from St. Laurent Boulevard westwards.  All of downtown is bilingual (actually, it's more Anglo than Franco) and places like Westmount, NDG and the Snowdon area are pretty much English-speaking areas.

My wife (a Torontonian by birth and upbringing) lived and functioned just fine as an unilingual English-speaker during her 4 years as a Concordia student.  It can definitely be done.

Do I recommend living in Montreal without learning some French and getting to enjoy the other half of the city?  Of course not.  You'd be missing out of lots of great experiences.  But you can certainly function in Montreal without French.  Just don't move into a unilingual neighbourhood.  If you live anywhere near McGill or Concordia, the vast majority of the locals speak English just fine.

For an American student looking for something different, Montreal might be a very interesting choice.  It is probably the least American feeling city in Canada that an English speaker can function in on a day-to-day basis.  Quebec City is even more unique in some ways but day-to-day living there pretty much requires fluency in French (although tourists can get by with English just fine).  Even Anglo-Montrealers are pretty different from other Canadians since they share many of the social habits and attitudes of their French-speaking compatriots (I mean lifestyle here, not politics).


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## Bihor (Sep 27, 2005)

Shemeska said:
			
		

> Not as far fetched really considering that Alberta keeps moving towards secession anyway.




I would't be suprised that they do it before Quebec.


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## Azul (Sep 27, 2005)

Culturally speaking, Canadians are very much North Americans.  Odds are that your first impression will be similar to if you were visiting a part of the US unless we are talking about Quebec or Newfoundland (both those places are a little too different from the US to match up to any region of the States).  Most regions of Canada bear a fair bit of similarity to the adjoining regions of the US.

Since the similarities are stronger than the differences adjusting shouldn't be too hard, but after a longer stay, I'm sure you'll pick up on the subtler differences between Canada and the States.  A lot of it has to do with differences in our histories and national characters.  As a people we tend to be less confrontational, less accepting of social imbalances and more cynical and phlegmatic than Americans.  We aren't very idealistic and we are very mistrustful of ideologues.

We prize civility and public order yet we are very progressive and favour strong civil rights.  Our historical relationship with power and authority is very different from the American experience and that is reflected in many ways.  We tend towards cynicism rather than partisanship when it comes to almost any debate - political, religious, social issues, whatever.

Compromise is seen as a typically Canadian way of resolving disputes and a "stick to your guns" attitude will often be viewed as unreasonable or obstinate here.  We tend to be more patient and tolerant of bureaucracy than Americans.

As a result, the stereotypical Canadian tends to be polite, pragmatic, and open-minded.  We have our own pioneer history but it's pretty different (compare mounties and Wild West sheriffs and you'll get the picture).  I guess in some ways, we retained more of our European heritage (esp. British and French) although both those nations seem to consider us just as dreadfully colonial as the rest of North America.  

We're a nation of law-abiding (for the most part) grumblers who like to think our nation is genuinely benevolent (even if our leaders can be shmucks).  Canada's the kind of place that breeds reformers instead of rebels.  We can be kind of smug-sounding sometimes but that's really just our awkward way of being patriotic and proud of our nation.

Hockey is the national religion.  Rooting for the wrong team is tantamount to a declaration of holy war.  You have been warned.    All other beliefs are tolerated but are expected to be a personal matter.  We are a much more secular country with a pretty tolerant attitude towards personal faith (i.e. believe whatever you want) and a very intolerant attitude towards public faith (i.e. but don't talk to me about it).  Expressing your beliefs publicly outside your religious institution is a pretty surefire way to get funny looks in much of the country.

On a side note, don't be surprised if at least a few Canadians try to get your insights into the American mindset, especially on issues where our nations differ greatly.  Canadians tend to be endlessly fascinated if not obsessed with the differences between our nations, often forgetting just how alike we really are.

Do be forwarned that the "ugly American" stereotype does exist here.  We tend to view Americans as our brash, churchy, kind of obnoxious yet entertaining cousins.  You are foreign yet familiar and I suppose we are the same to you.

As for gaming, just about any university will have a games club and most urban centers will have several FLGS.  Gaming is alive and well here.

As for schools, it really depends what you are looking for.  Do you want a small, community-like school in a semi-rural area (i.e. a college town setting) or an larger, more impersonal university in a more lively urban setting (i.e. Toronto, Montreal or Vancouver).  Perhaps a mid-sized school in a smaller city (e.g. Ottawa, Halifax, Calgary, Winnipeg)?  Is there a particular field you want to study in?


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## devilbat (Sep 27, 2005)

Great post Azul.  Well said.


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## Desdichado (Sep 27, 2005)

Dextra said:
			
		

> I disagree with the statement that Canadians are less patriotic than our US counterparts.  It's just we're not so in-your-face flag-waving about it.  We're more polite.  To proclaim our superiority too loudly might make other countries' citizens feel inadequate, and that wouldn't be very nice now, would it?



My dad always taught me it's not polite to ask someone where they're from.  If they're from Texas, they'll let you know, and otherwise you don't want to embarrass them.


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## Joël of the FoS (Sep 28, 2005)

Wild Gazebo said:
			
		

> That's a nice little rumour you've got going there.  I'd just like to add that that the following universities made The Times Higher Education Supplement list of top universities:  McGill, UofT, UBC, Waterloo, McMaster, UofA, University de Montreal (as of 2004).  McGill receiving the second highest mark for International Faculty Acclaim.




Yes, I was going to correct this "rumor" too. McGill is indeed near the top in Canada.



			
				Azul said:
			
		

> Do I recommend living in Montreal without learning some French and getting to enjoy the other half of the city?  Of course not.  You'd be missing out of lots of great experiences.  But you can certainly function in Montreal without French.  Just don't move into a unilingual neighbourhood.  If you live anywhere near McGill or Concordia, the vast majority of the locals speak English just fine.
> 
> For an American student looking for something different, Montreal might be a very interesting choice.  It is probably the least American feeling city in Canada that an English speaker can function in on a day-to-day basis.




Well said. Montréal is a big town with a cool village feel. I mean many things happens here (shows, etc.), but you do not feel like living in a cold, big american city (Toronto included).

To complete, I'd suggest you register to an English school (McGill or Concordia, depending on the course subjects you'd like to take), and then try to immerse in French as much as you can / as feel comfortable with. You'll end up with a cool experience.

And indeed, don't know why, but the proportion of gamers is higher in Canada then elsewhere. Just look at the proportion of Canucks in D&D forums.

Let us know of your decision!

Joël


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## Gnome (Sep 28, 2005)

I get the impression from this thread that Toronto isn't well-liked by Canadians not living there.  Why is that, or am I misreading this thread?


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## Davek (Sep 28, 2005)

Within the rest of Canada there is a widely held suspicion that those who live in Toronto believe that Toronto is the Business/Cultural/Religious/Ethnic Center of Canada, therefore it is the only place of importance in Canada.

While at a purely rational point of view, most will agree that this is not a valid belief, there are many aspects of Toronto, ie. some of the media outlets, particularily op-ed writers that seem to particularily hold this belief.

Demographically it is the largest urban area in Canada, and therefore it does carry some weight in political circles, so I think that the rest of Canada feels resentful of this at times.


----------



## Desdichado (Sep 28, 2005)

I think Toronto is great!  Then again, I live in Detroit.  I think Winnemucka, Nevada is great, and compared to Detroit... it is.


----------



## Khayman (Sep 28, 2005)

Canadians from coast to coast might not agree on much else, but a healthy loathing of Toronto is part of the national psyche.  It probably goes unnoticed in TO, however.


----------



## Joël of the FoS (Sep 28, 2005)

Gnome said:
			
		

> I get the impression from this thread that Toronto isn't well-liked by Canadians not living there.  Why is that, or am I misreading this thread?




Unfortunately, people from the City are often looking down to the rest of the country, not by really thinking they are the best, but by thinking the rest of the country is so backward 

Many white collar persons having to deal with Toronto will tell you they feel that way, i.e. the Toronto business club is closed to the rest of the country. There are not many architects or publicists, for example, from another canadian metropolitan area getting contracts in Toronto. They aren't considered as equal in business proposal.

This said, it's a cool city to visit  It used to be borring (say, compared to Montréal or Vancouver), but last time I was there, it was fun and energic. If they now could change their attitude, people would like the city more.

Joël


----------



## Banshee16 (Sep 28, 2005)

orangefruitbat said:
			
		

> Being Canadian, here are a few things:
> 
> *Canada is very similar to the US (baring French-speaking Quebec), so we tend to define oureslves in how we're different than America, rather than in our similarities. There are differences, but they're not so big that you can't feel comfortable. In general, Canadians are slightly more liberal than Americans, but this tends to be overstaked (unless you're into canabis culture or are hoping to marry someone of the same sex). Culture in Vacouver (BC) isn't too different than Seattle. Albertans aren't too different than mid Western Americans, and us folk in Toronto aren't too differerent than those in say Chicago or Boston. East-Coasters are similar to those in the East coast of the US.
> 
> ...




Well, there are other cities in Canada than Toronto, as well as other excellent universities than the U of T (as we call it).  McGill has excellent medical research programs, as well as psychology.  The University of Alberta has a fantastic program if you're into paleontology.  The University of Ottawa has a very good law school, is very well funded for research, and is tied to the Ottawa Hospital-General Campus, which has one of the best funded and most successful heart research facilities in the country (and is known Internationally).  The University in Halifax has a very good marine biology program.  So, really, what university you'd want to go to depends on what you want to take.

As others have stated, we're not all lumberjacks, hockey players etc.  And despite what some Americans believe, it's not snowy weather here 24-7.  A friend of mine visited Alberta in June a few years ago, and ran into a family from Texas or some other sounthern state who showed up with snowsuits and skis, expecting to ski and wondering why there was no snow.

I haven't lived in the U.S. but I've visited often enough, and my brother works there every day, driving back and forth between Detroit and Windsor.  The richest in the U.S. are definitely richer than in Canada, but the poor in Canada aren't nearly as bad off.  We don't have the same issues with poverty related crime to the same degree, though they are there.  At the same time, the racial issues also aren't there to the same degree.  In some parts of the country, there are discriminatory attitudes towards natives, but that's improving.  But African-descended Canadians?  Or Asian?  For many of us, it really doesn't matter.  There are tonnes of inter-"racial" marriages and such.

Generally people are pretty friendly.  I find we're not as "in your face" about politics or religion etc.  But we get tonnes of American cultural imports, so we're probably closer culturally to Americans than any other country in the world.  But, as others have said, we also pride ourselves on our differences.  Most of us don't want to be the next state, though we do *like* the States.  But we want to be neighbours...we don't want to move into your house.

I find that in recent years, there's a far greater separation between the church and politics in Canada than there is in the U.S,, which appears to be moving in the opposite direction.  Our politics are generally left-leaning in comparison to the U.S.  Even our conservatives would be more like democrats in the U.S., from what I understand.  But there are far more than two parties....four of them have legitimate power at the moment, with a few others such as the "Green" party, being on the sidelines, without official status, but showing in the elections.  Typically, Canadians seem to be less polarized about their politics in the U.S. so if you're into getting all fired up about it in discussions, you may want to tone it down a bit, as it'll just annoy others around you.

Generally, we're pretty safe.  Your chances of getting shot or murdered are far less than in the U.S.  I think my city had 8 murders last year, and another year within the last 5, we had I think 4 or 5.  For a city of a million people, that's not too high.  I don't generally feel any fear about walking alone at night.....I'm honestly more afraid because there have been cougar sightings near my city than I am of another person when I'm alone.  And of course, the bears.  In certain parts of the country, again, you need to be fairly cautious when on the outskirts of the cities.  I've got friends who have friends that were killed by bears while jogging on paths outside the city, etc.  Not that they're coming into the city or anything....just the standard problem....communities move further out into the wilderness, and the chances of dangerous encounters with wildlife increase.  It's still more likely that you'd get hit by a car or something though.

As to our winters, they're notorious apparently, but really not that bad.  My city (Ottawa) had a low of about -40 celcius last winter.  But the summers get hot enough.  I think we hit about 33 celcius during June and July this year.  Maybe not as high as Florida or something, but hot enough for me.  But I personally grew up in those conditions every winter, so you just get used to it and dress for the weather.  A key in any of the areas that get colder temperatures is to learn to enjoy the cold weather for what it is.  A chance to get out and enjoy the crisp outdoors without the sweat and bugs and dirt and west nile and whatnot that we have to deal with all summer.  Many of our cities in Ontario, Alberta, BC, and Quebec are close to great ski hills, biking and hiking facilities, cross country ski hills, etc.

If you plan on going to Quebec, definitely start taking French courses.  Due to political issues, some people in that province can be really ignorant if you don't speak the language.  Not that they all are....but one or two bad experiences can ruin anybody's day.  At the same time, it's a fantastic culture over there.

For sports, Americans hear about Canadians and hockey all the time, but matter of fact, more Canadians play soccer than hockey.  We are very proud of hockey though.

Technologically speaking, we're up there with the best.  We've got the best telecommunications network in the world, a very high rate of Internet connectedness among our citizenry, a high ratio of computers per househould, strong literacy rate, advanced medical facilities (that are unfortunately under a lot of stress at the moment), and strong aerospace industries.  The Canadian economy is currently on fire, led both by the energy industry, as well as what *was* a low valued dollar assisting our exports.  That may slow down due to the increasing value of our dollar leading to increasing pricing for those exports.

Overall, though there are currently several issues that Canadians are frustrated with our neighbours attitudes about (lumber tariffs, cattle, war, politics), we generally like the U.S., and are closer to them than any other country.  There likely won't be much culture shock, you'll likely be received fairly well, as we're generally a fairly quiet and even-tempered people, and in fact, there's always the chance that you may decide you don't want to go back 

Banshee


----------



## Banshee16 (Sep 28, 2005)

Azul said:
			
		

> Well, as a former Montrealer, Con U and McGill student, I can't completely agree with you.  Finding a part-time job will be harder... much harder if you are talking about a retail job (but outside the east end of Montreal, it's hard to find retail work unless you speak BOTH French and English).
> 
> It is perfectly feasable to function as a unilingual Anglophone (i.e. English-speaker) in Montreal but you end up being limited to western parts of the city... pretty much from St. Laurent Boulevard westwards.  All of downtown is bilingual (actually, it's more Anglo than Franco) and places like Westmount, NDG and the Snowdon area are pretty much English-speaking areas.
> 
> ...




I tend to agree.  As a former Montrealer, I had many friends that spoke no French at all.  But they stayed west of St. Laurent most of the time.  But the West Island etc. is full of Anglophones.  My old town didn't have any Francophones.....or at least, the percentage was something like 4% when I lived there.  At the same time, you can run into problems with some Francophones refusing to offer assistance if you don't speak the language.  Generally, I saw more of this when support for separation was high than I see now.

Montreal is a fantastic city though, full of culture, and very different.  Aside from the political issues, probably one of my favourite cities in Canada.

Banshee


----------



## devilbat (Sep 29, 2005)

> I get the impression from this thread that Toronto isn't well-liked by Canadians not living there. Why is that, or am I misreading this thread?




We've seen a couple of examples of why some Canadians have "not so nice" feelings towards Torontonians, in this thread.  We non Toronto residing Canadians find some of their attitudes to be arrogant, and we tire of the people who seem to look down their nose at the rest of the country.

As far as the city goes, I love to visit.


----------



## Joël of the FoS (Sep 29, 2005)

Banshee16 said:
			
		

> At the same time, you can run into problems with some Francophones refusing to offer assistance if you don't speak the language.  Generally, I saw more of this when support for separation was high than I see now.




You will find idiots everywhere 

If you are from out of the province and just arrived, just make sure it is clearly understood by the other person. These few people a little intolerant won't be with a person from out of the country, unless they are really moron (which is thankfully rare, as for when a Quebecker goes western Canada - generally welcomed well, except by a few idiots).

Some french quebeckers are blaming anglo-quebecker for not speaking French (with perhaps some understandable bitterness), but I very rarely heard of this idiotic behavior when the poor guy was known to be from out of Québec.

Just learn a few quick French words. If people see you trying, you will get their sympathy quickly.

Joël


----------



## Banshee16 (Sep 29, 2005)

Joël of the FoS said:
			
		

> You will find idiots everywhere
> 
> If you are from out of the province and just arrived, just make sure it is clearly understood by the other person. These few people a little intolerant won't be with a person from out of the country, unless they are really moron (which is thankfully rare, as for when a Quebecker goes western Canada - generally welcomed well, except by a few idiots).
> 
> ...




Just to be clear, I'm not saying everyone is like that in Quebec   Plenty of Quebecers I've known would appreciate the *effort* to speak their language.  I was lucky enough to learn both languages, but many people aren't.  And just to be fair, there are plenty of English Canadians and English Quebecers who refuse to bother trying.

But overall, most people are pretty moderate about the whole thing.  I can pick out individual examples of rudeness..but then I remember all the times where I didn't see any rudeness, and it's not fair to tar 7 million people because of a few bad apples.

Montreal's definitely a very cool city to live in during the university experience, if you like culture.

Ah, it's been a few years.  Unfortunately, my favourite greasy spoon, Chez Basile in St. Anne de Bellevue closed down after I left for Ontario.  Sniff......they had the *best* poutine 

Banshee


----------



## Banshee16 (Sep 29, 2005)

Gnome said:
			
		

> I get the impression from this thread that Toronto isn't well-liked by Canadians not living there.  Why is that, or am I misreading this thread?




We don't hate Toronto.  I think a lot of Canadians who don't live in Toronto just get frustrated because there's a perceived attitude that Torontonians see Toronto as the only place of importance in Canada....whether that perspective is correct or not.

Maybe there's an element of jealousy involved as well, since it is the largest, most economically powerful city in Canada.

Canadians tend to be pretty modest.  People that flaunt what they have or become too visibly successful are sometimes looked down on.  The city of Toronto gets looked at in that light.

Personally, I don't dislike it, but I like Montreal, Halifax, and Calgary better.  

Banshee


----------



## Joël of the FoS (Sep 29, 2005)

Banshee16 said:
			
		

> Just to be clear, I'm not saying everyone is like that in Quebec




Don't worry, I didn't understand your post this way. Still I wanted to correct an often heard misconception 



> And just to be fair, there are plenty of English Canadians and English Quebecers who refuse to bother trying.




That canadians from other provinces do not speak French doesn't worry us - that's understandable as most French are concentrated in Québec (and a few other smaller areas). They are not exposed to French / have no need learning it.

However, that English Quebecker refuse bother trying even a little is beyond me. I can't explain it without thinking either of bigotry, perceived superiorism of their language, or the silly argument "well, English is the majority in Canada, so I won't learn French" (_Hello_, good neighbour! Wake up!  ). These anglo-canadian-from-Québec are in fact responsible for the most for some's ill oriented bad feeling toward anglo-canadians in general.



> Ah, it's been a few years.  Unfortunately, my favourite greasy spoon, Chez Basile in St. Anne de Bellevue closed down after I left for Ontario.  Sniff......they had the *best* poutine




*lol* 

Joël


----------



## Rodrigo Istalindir (Sep 29, 2005)

Banshee16 said:
			
		

> We don't hate Toronto.  I think a lot of Canadians who don't live in Toronto just get frustrated because there's a perceived attitude that Torontonians see Toronto as the only place of importance in Canada....whether that perspective is correct or not.




That's pretty much how most people on the east coast of the US feel about New York, and I'm sure how the west coasters feel about LA.  And the midwesterners about Chicago, and the southerners about Atlanta.


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## Rel (Sep 29, 2005)

Rodrigo Istalindir said:
			
		

> That's pretty much how most people on the east coast of the US feel about New York, and I'm sure how the west coasters feel about LA.  And the midwesterners about Chicago, and the southerners about Atlanta.




As a southerner I'd say I feel much more that way about New York than Atlanta.

YMMV


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## Khayman (Sep 29, 2005)

Banshee16 said:
			
		

> Ah, it's been a few years.  Unfortunately, my favourite greasy spoon, Chez Basile in St. Anne de Bellevue closed down after I left for Ontario.  Sniff......they had the *best* poutine     Banshee




The best poutine comes from a "Chez _____".  A friend of mine and her husband take trips every weekend, driving to a random point on the Quebec map and ordering poutine from the local greasy spoon.  It's always named Chez George, Chez Frank, Chez Jacques, etc.

Best I had was in Notred-Dame-du-Bon-Conseil.  I figured that the Lady of Good Advice couldn't steer me wrong.


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## Khayman (Sep 29, 2005)

Joël of the FoS said:
			
		

> That canadians from other provinces do not speak French doesn't worry us - that's understandable as most French are concentrated in Québec (and a few other smaller areas). They are not exposed to French / have no need learning it.




I'm from Manitoba, so we have a sizeable Francophone population.  I'm so accustomed to seeing French signage that I was bothered by the lack of it while I was living in Vancouver.


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## Shemeska (Sep 29, 2005)

Rodrigo Istalindir said:
			
		

> and the southerners about Atlanta.




No, like Rel said, and as another North Carolina resident I feel likewise, we probably reserve our feelings like that towards New York and the 'Yankees' from up there rather than feeling any spite at all towards Atlanta*.

It's a combination of generic, often-times fashionable, lingering feelings regarding the north (not from the Civil War, but from the Reconstruction period). And now firmly tongue in cheek here: Plus feelings across the south towards spoiled, latte sipping, WTO protesting, SUV driving, trust fund baby 'libruls' perceived as living in communist hives in NY City or something.

I say this all from my perceptions living in NC for 21 years, originally from NJ.

*excepting the time I agreed to pick up a friend in Atlanta, thinking 'it's in Georgia, only one state seperating us, it can't be that long a drive'...


----------



## Rel (Sep 29, 2005)

Shemeska said:
			
		

> I say this all from my perceptions living in NC for 21 years, originally from NJ.




DAMN YANKEE!


----------



## devilbat (Sep 29, 2005)

> It's always named Chez George, Chez Frank, Chez Jacques, etc.




Makes sense, because the translation is George's place, Frank's place and Jack's place.  How many ___ Place does every city have?  Quite a few, I'll bet.



> I'm from Manitoba, so we have a sizeable Francophone population.




If I remember correctly, we have the second largest french population outside of Quebec.  Our "Festival Du Voyageur" IS the  largest french festival outside of Le Carnaval du Québec.
I'm one of those rare french speaking anglophones.


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## Desdichado (Sep 29, 2005)

devilbat said:
			
		

> Our "Festival Du Voyageur" IS the  largest french festival outside of Le Carnaval du Québec.



Say what?  I'm there!

Oh, Voy*ag*eur!  Sorry, I missed the -ag- on the first read-through...


----------



## devilbat (Sep 30, 2005)

> Say what? I'm there!
> 
> Oh, Voyageur! Sorry, I missed the -ag- on the first read-through...




Hey JD, if hairy, bearded guys pretending to be turn of the century fur traders, are what your into, I'm not going to judge.


----------



## Khayman (Sep 30, 2005)

devilbat said:
			
		

> Hey JD, if hairy, bearded guys pretending to be turn of the century fur traders, are what your into, I'm not going to judge.




Hmm. Sounds like KeyCon.


----------



## Banshee16 (Sep 30, 2005)

devilbat said:
			
		

> Makes sense, because the translation is George's place, Frank's place and Jack's place.  How many ___ Place does every city have?  Quite a few, I'll bet.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




What about Ontario? We've got a pretty sizeable Francophone population....especially east of Toronto.

I know Manitoba, New Brunswick, and Ontario have the key French populations outside of Quebec...just not sure who has most.

Banshee


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## Rodrigo Istalindir (Sep 30, 2005)

Rel said:
			
		

> As a southerner I'd say I feel much more that way about New York than Atlanta.




I grew up in Florida and we *hated* Atlanata's attitude that it was the cultural and intellectual center of the South.  And I was in south Florida -- my friends in the Panhandle were rabid.  "Atlanta -- Southern efficiency, Northern charm'


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## Sequoia2 (Oct 1, 2005)

just one thing to remember...when up there, just refer to the country of Canady as America Junior when talking to locals


----------



## Joël of the FoS (Oct 1, 2005)

Sequoia2 said:
			
		

> just one thing to remember...when up there, just refer to the country of Canady as America Junior when talking to locals




*lol* sure !


----------



## Khayman (Oct 1, 2005)

Sequoia2 said:
			
		

> just one thing to remember...when up there, just refer to the country of Canady as America Junior when talking to locals




Careful.  We'll sic that guy from the Keiths ads on ya.


----------



## Three_Haligonians (Oct 2, 2005)

What kind of programme are you looking for?  If it's just a generic undergrad you want, you may want to choose your university by the city like some people have been suggesting.  Montreal is a great city, easily the cultural capital of Canada.  I went to the Nova Scotia College of Art and Design (and although the acronym is pronounced NASCAD, Wild Gazebo, it is in fact spelled NSCAD.  The university actually had a sign misprinted this way for a couple years, though   )  There are a number of universities here in Halifax, if you're interested in an east coast small city.  

If you're looking for something completely different, though, I would suggest Newfoundland.  I spent a semester at Sir Wilfred Grenfell College in Corner Brook, NF, and it was the best three months of my university experience.  Newfoundland is an island (clearly) and because of that the people who live there have a culture quite distinct from mainland Canada.  I think the only university there is Memorial University of Newfoundland (of which SWG was an off-shoot), but there are plenty of other schools as well.  Newfoundlanders are known for their politeness and warmth, so if you're looking for a place to make many friends, it is the place to go.  The winters are absolutely horrible, but you gotta take the bad with the good.

Also, you probably already know this, but remember that your tuition is listed under International Students, and is significantly more expensive than it is for Canadian students.

Oh, and despite what Fusangite says, U of T is not the only school known outside of Canada.  NSCAD itself has quite a reputation, as do many other schools across the country I'm sure.

Yes, b'y, we'll see you north of the border,

R from Three Haligonians


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## Borlon (Oct 3, 2005)

Toronto is one of the great cities of the world.  At least downtown, around the U of T.  I don't know about the other parts.

As for the rest of the country's attitude towards Toronto; well, Albertans lump Ontario, Quebec and the maritimes together as "the East" and lament their majority in Parliament.  ("The West wants in!")  Folks in northern Ontario think that southern Ontario runs the show.  People in southern Ontario agree that Toronto has way too much influence.  Residents of Toronto blame Bay Street (the Canadian equivalent to Wall Street).  I don't know what the financial movers and shakers on Bay Street think.

I wouldn't make decisions about University on the weather.  First, winters are warmer than they  used to be.  Second, it is easy to get winter boots and a coat.  And we do have internal heating and everything.

One thing- Canadians know far more about the US than Americans know about Canada.  I think that is because the US is 10 times the size of Canada (population wise- more by economy) and so there is a strong incentive to be informed; however since Canada is 1/10th the size of the US (from the US point of view- economically and demographically, not geographically) there is little incentive to be informed.  The disparity in knowledge is not, I don't think, 100:1, but it is pretty big.


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## KRT (Oct 13, 2005)

Three_Haligonians said:
			
		

> Newfoundlanders are known for their politeness and warmth, so if you're looking for a place to make many friends, it is the place to go.  The winters are absolutely horrible, but you gotta take the bad with the good.




I spent 4 years at Memorial. I agree the winters are nasty, and the people although friendly, are no more so than I have found anywhere else in Canada, Toronto included. One feature to note though is that the number of single women outnumber the men approximately 3 to 1 (no exaggeration). However this is not neccesarily a factor to base your University choice on.



			
				Three_Haligonians said:
			
		

> Oh, and despite what Fusangite says, U of T is not the only school known outside of Canada.




He didn't quite say that. I think the words "worth anything" were in there. I would agree that UofT has a good all round reputation, but to be fair Waterloo has won the MacClean's award many times in the past few years. Most Universities however achieve renown through specific programs (i.e Neuroscience  and Genetics studies garner Memorial a lot of International attention).


----------



## Wild Gazebo (Oct 14, 2005)

> I went to the Nova Scotia College of Art and Design (and although the acronym is pronounced NASCAD, Wild Gazebo, it is in fact spelled NSCAD.




I assure you it was quite on purpose.  I'm a big fan of Garry Neil Kennedy...and if I've learned anything from his work...it's that you can never trust signs.  Did one of my undergrads there.

And it's great to see other artsy-fartsies haunting the boards.


----------



## Three_Haligonians (Oct 14, 2005)

Wild Gazebo said:
			
		

> I assure you it was quite on purpose.  I'm a big fan of Garry Neil Kennedy...and if I've learned anything from his work...it's that you can never trust signs.  Did one of my undergrads there.
> 
> And it's great to see other artsy-fartsies haunting the boards.





My mistake!    

I'm not such a fan of Mr. Kennedy, but it is nice to see another NSCAD grad on the boards!  I'm not sure if I count as artsy-farsty, I took Film.  I did go through Foundation, though!  Do colour wheels count as artistic?    

R from Three Haligonians


----------



## fusangite (Oct 15, 2005)

Borlon said:
			
		

> Toronto is one of the great cities of the world.  At least downtown, around the U of T.  I don't know about the other parts.
> 
> As for the rest of the country's attitude towards Toronto; well, Albertans lump Ontario, Quebec and the maritimes together as "the East" and lament their majority in Parliament.  ("The West wants in!")  Folks in northern Ontario think that southern Ontario runs the show.  People in southern Ontario agree that Toronto has way too much influence.  Residents of Toronto blame Bay Street (the Canadian equivalent to Wall Street).  I don't know what the financial movers and shakers on Bay Street think.



Actually, I think, as of late, the Torontonian attitude has become more like that of Alberta. I find that people in this city tend to see us as a source of the nation's wealth (and Liberal MPs) and that the rest of the country is politely plundering us and then providing inferior services (e.g. less unemployment insurance) in return. I don't really buy this but that's more and more often what people seem to say.


----------



## Darth Shoju (Oct 15, 2005)

Khayman said:
			
		

> Hmm. Sounds like KeyCon.




ROFL!



			
				Shemeska said:
			
		

> No, like Rel said, and as another North Carolina resident I feel likewise, we probably reserve our feelings like that towards New York and the 'Yankees' from up there rather than feeling any spite at all towards Atlanta*.




LOL. I work in a call centre that deals primarily with American customers. One time I was speaking to a gentleman from somewhere in the South. He picked up on a trace of an accent in my voice and asked where I was from. I responded that I was in Canada, worried that he was going to get angry that I was taking a job away from an American (not that I assume all Americans get their nickers in a twist over that). His response was: "Ah ok. For a minute there I was worried you were a Yankee."


----------



## Darth Shoju (Oct 15, 2005)

Davek said:
			
		

> Within the rest of Canada there is a widely held suspicion that those who live in Toronto believe that Toronto is the Business/Cultural/Religious/Ethnic Center of Canada, therefore it is the only place of importance in Canada.
> 
> While at a purely rational point of view, most will agree that this is not a valid belief, there are many aspects of Toronto, ie. some of the media outlets, particularily op-ed writers that seem to particularily hold this belief.
> 
> Demographically it is the largest urban area in Canada, and therefore it does carry some weight in political circles, so I think that the rest of Canada feels resentful of this at times.




I once heard Valerie Pringle refer to Toronto as "the Paris of Canada." The level of derision I feel for this statement is difficult to express.



			
				Banshee16 said:
			
		

> Ah, it's been a few years.  Unfortunately, my favourite greasy spoon, Chez Basile in St. Anne de Bellevue closed down after I left for Ontario.  Sniff......they had the *best* poutine
> 
> Banshee




Ah. Poutine. Here's another tip to the original poster: if you intend to indulge in this bit of Canadian cuisine on a regular basis, bring a spare heart along with you. You'll be needing it.



			
				Joël of the FoS said:
			
		

> However, that English Quebecker refuse bother trying even a little is beyond me. I can't explain it without thinking either of bigotry, perceived superiorism of their language, or the silly argument "well, English is the majority in Canada, so I won't learn French" Joël




LOL. Or maybe it is because you don't exactly learn French by watching Habs games on French CBC (I should know    ). While I agree that someone living in Montreal would be wise to pick up some French, it isn't exactly easy. I was forced to learn it until grade 9 and I couldn't hold a conversation with a fluent Francophone. In fact, I'm pretty sure if I tried the convo would look something like this:

Me: "Pardonez moi, sil-vous plait, q'ues ce...." (and my poor spelling there is indicative of my even-worse pronunciation)
Francophone: (rolling his eyes) "Look, what do you want?"

 



			
				Borlon said:
			
		

> I wouldn't make decisions about University on the weather.  First, winters are warmer than they  used to be.





They are?!?! 

*shivers at the idea of another -40 season in WINTERpeg*


----------



## Three_Haligonians (Oct 15, 2005)

Darth Shoju said:
			
		

> Me: "Pardonez moi, sil-vous plait, q'ues ce...." (and my poor spelling there is indicative of my even-worse pronunciation)
> Francophone: (rolling his eyes) "Look, what do you want?"




   

This is what I remember:

"Je m'appelle Henri Matin.  Il est le dix-huit septembre.  J'aime le musique pop.  J'aime Roch Vosine."

Do you think this will help me converse with francophones?  Damn public education!

R from Three Haligonians


----------



## Darth Shoju (Oct 15, 2005)

Three_Haligonians said:
			
		

> ...J'aime Roch Vosine."




LOL



(BTW, nice sig there R..."Barrett's Privateers" right?)


----------



## Dirigible (Oct 16, 2005)

> My observation as a native of New York with Canadian relatives in a couple provinces: Socially, the USA is RPGnet. Canada is ENWorld. Most of the same discourse, but one is cleaner, friendlier, and more polite than the other.




So which country is Nutkinland?


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## Three_Haligonians (Oct 16, 2005)

Darth Shoju said:
			
		

> LOL
> 
> 
> 
> (BTW, nice sig there R..."Barrett's Privateers" right?)




Quite so!  The unofficial anthem of the east coast.  Our avatar seems a little ... patriotic?  There are three of us here, and uh, we're from Halifax.  In case you didn't get that...  

R from Three Haligonians


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## fusangite (Oct 16, 2005)

Dirigible said:
			
		

> So which country is Nutkinland?



Nutkinland I would define more as a region; it's California/British Columbia. Stylish, dysfunctional, extremist screw-ups and lunatics with no ideological commonality with one another.


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## Storminator (Oct 16, 2005)

Banshee16 said:
			
		

> As to our winters, they're notorious apparently, but really not that bad.  My city (Ottawa) had a low of about -40 celcius last winter...




Only a Canadian would use "...really not that bad..." and "...about -40 celcius..." in consecutive sentences.  

PS


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## Joël of the FoS (Oct 20, 2005)

Darth Shoju said:
			
		

> LOL. Or maybe it is because you don't exactly learn French by watching Habs games on French CBC (I should know    ). While I agree that someone living in Montreal would be wise to pick up some French, it isn't exactly easy. I was forced to learn it until grade 9 and I couldn't hold a conversation with a fluent Francophone. In fact, I'm pretty sure if I tried the convo would look something like this:
> 
> Me: "Pardonez moi, sil-vous plait, q'ues ce...." (and my poor spelling there is indicative of my even-worse pronunciation)
> Francophone: (rolling his eyes) "Look, what do you want?"




*lol* perhaps, but he would surely be friendly  And of course you need to practice any langage before being able to use it more or less fluently - school isn't enough. It's as funny as to hear some quebecker (or French for this matter) trying to speak English  OMG... 

Joël


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## Joël of the FoS (Oct 20, 2005)

Storminator said:
			
		

> Only a Canadian would use "...really not that bad..." and "...about -40 celcius..." in consecutive sentences.
> 
> PS




-40? Not that bad! My pool is still opened!


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## Davek (Oct 20, 2005)

Until you live on the prairies (Manitoba, Saskatchewan, Alberta) you do not truly appreciate that the actual temp has only a small bearing on comfort level. It is the wind that matters. Even at -10 C, with a 60 kph wind, it is cold...real cold.


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## devilbat (Oct 20, 2005)

> It is the wind that matters. Even at -10 C, with a 60 kph wind, it is cold...real cold.




Agreed.  -25 with no wind, no problem, I'm playing hockey outside.  -10 with 60 KPH wind, I stay inside


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