# EN World Women's Forum?



## Queen_Dopplepopolis (Dec 22, 2005)

I've seen women's forums be very popular at other message boards and, with EN World's population of women, I think that it would be a fun way for the ladies that hang out around these parts to get to know one another.

What would we have to do to put something like this together?  Is it even possible?  Am I the only person that would be interested?


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## Thornir Alekeg (Dec 22, 2005)

Ooh, yes, then all the boys can try and sneak into it!

I would then ask for a reciprocating "Men's only" forum, but I know it would take up too much of the Moderators' time.  Wait, the rules could be different there since Eric's Grandma shouldn't be in that forum anyway, right?


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## Queen_Dopplepopolis (Dec 22, 2005)

Ugh.  Boys.


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## Ambrus (Dec 22, 2005)

I'd be curious just to see who'd post in it. There are some ENworlders who seem to like keeping their gender ambiguous or secret. Hmm... Would we then have to set up the Ambiguously gendered forum to make them happy? :\


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## Queen_Dopplepopolis (Dec 22, 2005)

Ambrus said:
			
		

> I'd be curious just to see who'd post in it. There are some ENworlders who seem to like keeping their gender ambiguous or secret. Hmm... Would we then have to set up the Ambiguously gendered forum to make them happy? :\



 I'm not advocating any sort of obligation to set up any sort of forum, not attempting to discriminate against anyone.  Just thought it would be nice for the ladies of EN World to have a place where we could chat, that's all.


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## JimAde (Dec 22, 2005)

Ambrus said:
			
		

> I'd be curious just to see who'd post in it. There are some ENworlders who seem to like keeping their gender ambiguous or secret. Hmm... Would we then have to set up the Ambiguously gendered forum to make them happy? :\




We could call it the Vaarsuvius forum. 

Queen D, I think this is a fine idea.  Not that my opinion means anything, but I thought I'd offer it anyway.  If you can't get an actual forum created, you could always just start a hivemind-like thread in the off-topic forum.


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## DaveMage (Dec 22, 2005)

Wasn't randomling's house filling this niche for a while?


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## Queen_Dopplepopolis (Dec 22, 2005)

DaveMage said:
			
		

> Wasn't randomling's house filling this niche for a while?



 It has a Girl Talk forum, but I think that the EN women would be more likely to visit and EN Women's Forum.  But - I could be wrong.


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## RangerWickett (Dec 22, 2005)

I foresee an EN Singles forum, an EN Cool Crowd forum, and an EN Too Cool to Join a Forum forum.


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## Umbran (Dec 22, 2005)

Typically, any time you split a forum off of General, the traffic through it decreases dramatically.  So, if you want the thing to survive, you have to have enough traffic on the sub-topic to start with.

Perhaps you might want to start with a variant of the Hivemind - go with a few ladies-only threads in Off-Topic, and see if there's enough activity and support for them to merit a whole new forum?


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## diaglo (Dec 22, 2005)

RangerWickett said:
			
		

> I foresee an EN Singles forum, an EN Cool Crowd forum, and an EN Too Cool to Join a Forum forum.



ENWurld OD&D forum... the only true forum.


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## DaveMage (Dec 22, 2005)

diaglo said:
			
		

> ENWurld OD&D forum... the only true forum.




With you as moderator.    

(Why do I hear The Imperial March in my head...?)


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## Hand of Evil (Dec 22, 2005)

This could be done with a personal/private forum and invite only (password protect)...


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## Mark CMG (Dec 22, 2005)

I need to scrub my brain.  I'm plagued by the the image of RangerWickett screaming, "I'm wearing _boots of escaping_," and running from one end of the EN World Women's Forum to the other wearing nothing but a mask fashioned from Queen D's posts . . .

    :\


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## JimAde (Dec 22, 2005)

Mark CMG said:
			
		

> I need to scrub my brain.  I'm plagued by the the image of RangerWickett screaming, "I'm wearing _boots of escaping_," and running from one end of the EN World Women's Forum to the other wearing nothing but a mask fashioned from Queen D's posts . . .
> 
> :\



 I'd prescribe a quart of egg nog and three consecutive viewings of "It's a Wonderful Life."


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## Angel Tarragon (Dec 22, 2005)

Queen_Dopplepopolis said:
			
		

> Ugh.  Boys.



Makes me glad I'm a man.


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## Angel Tarragon (Dec 22, 2005)

Mark CMG said:
			
		

> I need to scrub my brain.  I'm plagued by the the image of RangerWickett screaming, "I'm wearing _boots of escaping_," and running from one end of the EN World Women's Forum to the other wearing nothing but a mask fashioned from Queen D's posts . . .
> 
> :\



OMG!!! ROFLMAO!!!!

Thank you Mark, you have made my day!


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## Teflon Billy (Dec 22, 2005)

Queen_Dopplepopolis said:
			
		

> I'm not advocating any sort of obligation to set up any sort of forum, not attempting to discriminate against anyone.




That's funny, I thought you were describing a "women _only_ forum"? 



> Just thought it would be nice for the ladies of EN World to have a place where we could chat, that's all.




What's wrong with the Off-Topic forum?


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## Queen_Dopplepopolis (Dec 23, 2005)

Teflon Billy said:
			
		

> That's funny, I thought you were describing a "women _only_ forum"?




I'm sorry I was not terribly clear.  What I was attempting to get across was the idea that I do not want to see actually having a selective forum turn into an argument about discrimination.  So - I didn't want to see this idea turn into "If they get one, we get one!" sort of bickering.

If people feel that is the logical conclusion to having a women's forum, then by all means, it's a terrible idea.


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## Queen_Dopplepopolis (Dec 23, 2005)

Teflon Billy said:
			
		

> What's wrong with the Off-Topic forum?




There's nothing *wrong* with the Off-Topic Forum - I'm certainly not complaining about anything.  I love the OT forum.  It's one of my favorite things ever.  I'm really just asking how people would feel about a Women's Forum and, judging by initial reaction, it's not a good idea and that's totally cool.


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## The Traveler (Dec 23, 2005)

Thornir Alekeg said:
			
		

> I would then ask for a reciprocating "Men's only" forum



Done.


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## reveal (Dec 23, 2005)

I have no problem with having a female alt.


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## Darrin Drader (Dec 23, 2005)

It has been my experience on other boards that private forums lead to cliqueishness. The only way I could see this working at ENWorld would be to make it an open forum where the guys could read and join in.... but probably wouldn't want to due to the subject matter.


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## diaglo (Dec 23, 2005)

reveal said:
			
		

> I have no problem with having a female alt.




has she got back?

diaglo "i'd hit that" Ooi


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## The Traveler (Dec 23, 2005)

Whisperfoot said:
			
		

> but probably wouldn't want to due to the subject matter.



What would you name it? "Menstruation Station"?


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## Queen_Dopplepopolis (Dec 23, 2005)

Whisperfoot said:
			
		

> It has been my experience on other boards that private forums lead to cliqueishness. The only way I could see this working at ENWorld would be to make it an open forum where the guys could read and join in.... but probably wouldn't want to due to the subject matter.



 This is a really good point, Whisperfoot.


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## Queen_Dopplepopolis (Dec 23, 2005)

The Traveler said:
			
		

> What would you name it? "Menstruation Station"?



 [totally serious] Yes. [/totally serious]


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## fusangite (Dec 23, 2005)

As long as someone is prepared to do a certain amount of verification work for admission to the forum, I can see this as being a useful thing. My only concern would be the amount of work entailed in doing verification, given the sheer number of men who turn intermittently into teenaged girls when on the 'net.

QD, I'm sure that your chances of getting something like this put together would be enhanced if you developed some minimum verification protocols and found a female moderator and/or admin for it.

I personally would have zero problem being excluded from the forum and think that it probably enable some discussions that don't currently take place. More importantly, if moderated properly, it would likely increase the number of active female ENWorld posters, an objective I'm sure we would all support.


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## mythusmage (Dec 23, 2005)

A place where a woman can give a guy major and minor lip.


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## The Traveler (Dec 23, 2005)

Queen_Dopplepopolis said:
			
		

> [totally serious] Yes. [/totally serious]



Because, y'know, that'd be about the only thing about women that guys don't wanna read about.


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## DaveMage (Dec 23, 2005)

The Traveler said:
			
		

> Because, y'know, that'd be about the only thing about women that guys don't wanna read about.




And makeup...


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## Darrin Drader (Dec 23, 2005)

DaveMage said:
			
		

> And makeup...




And relationships....


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## Eternalknight (Dec 23, 2005)

Yep, one problem would be the fact that it is easy to fake one's gender on the internet.


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## Mark CMG (Dec 23, 2005)

DaveMage said:
			
		

> And makeup...






			
				Whisperfoot said:
			
		

> And relationships....






			
				Reg said:
			
		

> Right, what else have they ever done for us?






> Well, the aqueducts.






			
				Reg said:
			
		

> Right, right, they’ve given us aqueducts. What else have they ever done for us?






> Sanitation.






			
				Reg said:
			
		

> I grant you sanitation-






> And the roads






			
				Reg said:
			
		

> All right, the roads go without saying; Women build roads. But what else?






> Well, irrigation, medicine, education, fresh water.






			
				Reg said:
			
		

> All right, all right, besides sanitation, medicine, education, public order, irrigation,roads, fresh water, what have the Women ever done for us?”






			
				Loretta said:
			
		

> Hmmmm.....  Babies?




Okay.  I'm lost . . .


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## Mark CMG (Dec 23, 2005)

Eternalknight said:
			
		

> Yep, one problem would be the fact that it is easy to fake one's gender on the internet.





And you know this . . . _how?_


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## Darrin Drader (Dec 23, 2005)

Mark CMG said:
			
		

> And you know this . . . _how?_




I have an answer for you, but it would involve moving the discussion off of ENWorld.


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## Eternalknight (Dec 23, 2005)

Mark CMG said:
			
		

> And you know this . . . _how?_




Surely I'm not the only one on the internet who's pretended to be female just to...

umm..

look, over there!  

*dashes out of sight*


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## Mark CMG (Dec 23, 2005)

Whisperfoot said:
			
		

> I have an answer for you, but it would involve moving the discussion off of ENWorld.







			
				Eternalknight said:
			
		

> Surely I'm not the only one on the internet who's pretended to be female just to...
> 
> umm..
> 
> ...





_Tammy . . ?_


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## Eternalknight (Dec 23, 2005)

Mark CMG said:
			
		

> _Tammy . . ?_




LOL.  

I really don't think I should ask...


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## fett527 (Dec 23, 2005)

But, how would Teflon Billy tell them how to fix their relationships? :\


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## Darrin Drader (Dec 23, 2005)

Mark CMG said:
			
		

> _Tammy . . ?_




Tammy, Sarah7286, Cat129.... I also might have the chat logs hidden somewhere for 'backup purposes'.... Backup, yeah, that's the ticket.


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## Mark CMG (Dec 23, 2005)

_I wasn't going to tell Tammy about Sarah7286 but I guess that point is now moot . . ._


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## Darrin Drader (Dec 23, 2005)

Mark CMG said:
			
		

> _I wasn't going to tell Tammy about Sarah7286 but I guess that point is now moot . . ._




Oh sarah7286 is right pissed at you.


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## DaveMage (Dec 23, 2005)

Captain, the thread is spinning out of control!


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## Truth Seeker (Dec 23, 2005)

Now I can see why the need for A Women Only Forum...just look at the last 6 to 8 posts, above me. Expect for the next to last behind me.  

MEN!!!


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## Thornir Alekeg (Dec 23, 2005)

Truth Seeker said:
			
		

> Now I can see why the need for A Women Only Forum...just look at the last 6 to 8 posts, abouve me. Expect for the next to last behind me.
> 
> MEN!!!




Yep, we men are soooo annoying.   

Seriously though, that is the issue with the idea of a women's only forum, IMO.  A few of the guys "crashing" the forum can cause resentment, but restricting males from the forum goes against the spirit of these boards in the first place.  

I know there have been a couple of "women only" threads posted in the off-topic forum in the past.  How did they go?  

If people were actually respectful of that, then just do that again when you feel the need for estrogen exhortation.  

If people were not respectful of it, then why would you expect anything different from a separate forum?


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## DaveStebbins (Dec 23, 2005)

fett527 said:
			
		

> But, how would Teflon Billy tell them how to fix their relationships? :\



Right. And if women had their own forum, we'd miss all the naked pillow fights!

 

-Dave


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## Truth Seeker (Dec 23, 2005)

-Shake head in a speechless pause-



			
				DaveStebbins said:
			
		

> Right. And if women had their own forum, we'd miss all the naked pillow fights!
> 
> 
> 
> -Dave


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## DaveMage (Dec 23, 2005)

DaveStebbins said:
			
		

> Right. And if women had their own forum, we'd miss all the naked pillow fights!
> 
> 
> 
> -Dave




As long as they take pictures, everything is cool....


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## Teflon Billy (Dec 23, 2005)

Can I have a forum where *Kahuna Burger* and *Darth K'trava* aren't allowed?

Because I find their "feminine perspectives" counter productive to masculine discussion.


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## Morrus (Dec 23, 2005)

The big problem with that is that it would involve an area of EN World where I can't go... and I'm so very not comfortable with that idea!  In addition, at present at least, all the mods are male, and I'm not comfortable with them all not having access to a forum.


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## DaveStebbins (Dec 23, 2005)

Truth Seeker said:
			
		

> -Shake head in a speechless pause-



A sense of humor is a wonderful thing...

-Dave


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## reveal (Dec 24, 2005)

Morrus said:
			
		

> The big problem with that is that it would involve an area of EN World where I can't go... and I'm so very not comfortable with that idea!  In addition, at present at least, all the mods are male, and I'm not comfortable with them all not having access to a forum.




Maybe you could promote some female users to mod.


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## Mark CMG (Dec 24, 2005)

Morrus said:
			
		

> The big problem with that is that it would involve an area of EN World where I can't go... and I'm so very not comfortable with that idea!  In addition, at present at least, all the mods are male, and I'm not comfortable with them all not having access to a forum.





Are there no women Moderators and Admins?  I remember Ashtal was one but how about currently?


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## Eternalknight (Dec 24, 2005)

I'll be a mod for it


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## fusangite (Dec 25, 2005)

I figured the admin/mod thing would be the main obstacle.


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## diaglo (Dec 25, 2005)

i'd like to nominate Buttercup.


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## Mark CMG (Dec 25, 2005)

diaglo said:
			
		

> i'd like to nominate Buttercup.





She and Queen D would both make good moderators, IMO, but their most difficult task would not preserving order within the forum but keeping the males out.  I'm not sure there is any ironclad way to definitely identify the gender of someone online if they are determined to confuse the issue.  The biggest shame of it all is that, given that everyone has limited time, each post in a segregated forum means one less post is likely to be made in the general forum, and the general community will have a lower ratio of posts by female gamers.  It's a perspective I would be disappointed in losing access to regularly reading.


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## fusangite (Dec 26, 2005)

Mark CMG said:
			
		

> She and Queen D would both make good moderators, IMO, but their most difficult task would not preserving order within the forum but keeping the males out.  I'm not sure there is any ironclad way to definitely identify the gender of someone online if they are determined to confuse the issue.  The biggest shame of it all is that, given that everyone has limited time, each post in a segregated forum means one less post is likely to be made in the general forum,



Do you have anything to back that up? If I thought this was going to be a zero-sum thing, I would be much much less likely to support this. I'm supporting this, largely, because I think the forum might get some female lurkers or infrequent posters to post more frequently and that this will habituate them to making ENWorld posts, increasing the likelihood that they will posts to other forums. 

I personally doubt that this will lead to a net reduction in posts to other forums. It's not like we decide, at the beginning of the day/week how much time we are going to waste on internet forums. What happens, at least with me, is that we get into a posting mood and see if there are any interesting conversations to post in. The more such conversations there are, the more posting we do.







> and the general community will have a lower ratio of posts by female gamers.



I'd be prepared to wager actual money that the opposite will happen.


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## Mark CMG (Dec 26, 2005)

fusangite said:
			
		

> Do you have anything to back that up?




Nothing except my opinion based on my own observations and the logic I've put forth above and below.



			
				fusangite said:
			
		

> I personally doubt that this will lead to a net reduction in posts to other forums. It's not like we decide, at the beginning of the day/week how much time we are going to waste on internet forums. What happens, at least with me, is that we get into a posting mood and see if there are any interesting conversations to post in. The more such conversations there are, the more posting we do.




Only to a point, IMO.  Time devoted to one thing necessarily takes time from some other pursuit.  Creation of a new forum doesn't increase someone's available time.  It will be even more of a strain for those who volunteer or are chosen to moderate.  IMO, there's simply no way around it, though you are also entitled to your opinion, of course, and whatever wagers people are willing to make with you.  It simply stands to reason, as far as I can see, but I appreciate your optimism.  Perhaps the women who would post in an EN World Women's Forum have a great deal of time in other areas of their day that they will devote to posting both in an EN World Women's Forum and in other EN World Forums simply because they are spending more time here.  That would both surprise and delight me.


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## LightPhoenix (Dec 26, 2005)

Honestly, I don't really think ENWorld is the place to have a forum like that.  I've seen this sort of thing (both female-only and male-only) in my internet travels, and it's always tended to end badly.  Especially when you have a large, generally non-segregated community like the kind that exists here.  

Now, if you were to start your own website, dedicated to women and RPGs, with forums and all, that might work better, I think.  That way you start fresh, from the ground up, without all the baggage of ENWorld.  Plus, you could probably have a little more control over gender verification.


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## Staffan (Dec 26, 2005)

Mark CMG said:
			
		

> I'm not sure there is any ironclad way to definitely identify the gender of someone online if they are determined to confuse the issue.



Require posting of naked pics taken of the poster together with a computer with ENWorld on it.

Preferably in a public forum, so we all can see that they're not trying to sneak in.


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## Teflon Billy (Dec 26, 2005)

Staffan said:
			
		

> Require posting of naked pics taken of the poster together with a computer with ENWorld on it.
> 
> Preferably in a public forum, so we all can see that they're not trying to sneak in.




I find your ideas intriguing, and would like to subscribe to your newsletter


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## DungeonmasterCal (Dec 26, 2005)

There's always www.d20chyx.com.  It's a women's gamer forum, though they don't keep guys out...only from certain threads.


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## Darth K'Trava (Dec 27, 2005)

DaveStebbins said:
			
		

> Right. And if women had their own forum, we'd miss all the naked pillow fights!
> 
> 
> 
> -Dave





Like you don't have pr0n for that......


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## Darth K'Trava (Dec 27, 2005)

Staffan said:
			
		

> Require posting of naked pics taken of the poster together with a computer with ENWorld on it.
> 
> Preferably in a public forum, so we all can see that they're not trying to sneak in.




Time for rabid fanboys to pull out their copy of photoshop and start editing....


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## BOZ (Dec 27, 2005)

Randomlingshouse still has a womens' forum doesn't it?


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## kirinke (Dec 27, 2005)

Darth K'Trava said:
			
		

> Time for rabid fanboys to pull out their copy of photoshop and start editing....




Some people have waaay to much time on their hands. 
Let's not go there....
Please.
For the love of humanity!
Let's not go there!


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## Crothian (Dec 27, 2005)

BOZ said:
			
		

> Randomlingshouse still has a womens' forum doesn't it?




Yes, nicest place I've ever been


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