# Metalheads!  Confess & Brag



## Dannyalcatraz

OK...

I love hard rock and metal, but its not all I like, so my music collection is somewhat...vast & odd.  Still, the majority of my collection is hard rock & metal, so I call myself a metalhead.

However- I have noted that almost every metalhead of my acquaintence has something in their collection that is, how shall I put it...less than metal.  Some guilty pleasure of some sort.

Example- the guy who turned me on to Motorhead was also a big fan of Winger.  In retrospect, I can kinda respect that, since Kip Winger is actually a fantastic musician.  He was a studio musician for years before forming his band, and he's still a hired gun in high demand today.  Say what you want, the man has mad bass skilzzzz.  (Ok, he's not Flea, Geddy, Hamm or Claypool, but still...)

Also, I noticed that because metal is somewhat of an underground genre, even today, most Metalheads have some pretty obscure stuff in their collections as well.

So, this is the place to confess your guilty musical pleasures and brag about your obscure finds, your (King) diamonds in the rough...but there is one rule:
*
You can only brag if you first confess!*


*Confession*: I must confess I also have a complete collection of Europe and Nitro.  Slaughter is on my shelf.  Bang Tango...Bulletboys.  Vain!  Vinnie Vincent Invasion!  Did I mention EUROPE?

*Brag*: Despite the above, I also have a collection of hard rock ranging from Alcatrazz to Black Sabbath, Deep Purple, Godflesh, Helmet, Iron Maiden, Judas Priest, Led Zeppelin, Living Colour, Malmsteen, Motorhead, Primus, Queensryche, Rainbow, Satriani, Vandenburg, Whitesnake & Zebra.  I also have a complete collection of Budgie & Kyuss, as well as albums by shredders like Jennifer Batten, Chris Impelliteri, Helios Creed & Ronnie Montrose...  Most of Bruce Dickenson's solo work.  Dio's work with Elf.  Trust. Slayer.  Soulfly.  Rage Against the Machine.  Alter Bridge.  Ozzy.  Van Halen.  Audioslave.  Soundgarden. Red Hot Chili Peppers. Pearl Jam.  Alice in Chains.  Green River.

and so, so many more quality bands...


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## FickleGM

I secretly sing along with ......................................................... Bon Jovi songs   

I know, I know *must scrub the unclean off of me*


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## diaglo

i went to elementary, middle, high school and college with the drummer from Iron Christ. we formed a band when we were kids too. called Mangled Baby Ducks during our Punk phase. i played the kazoo and sang.   

he also played D&D in the campaign i refereed.

he is iirc now with El Gotten.


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## GlassJaw

I'm definitely into heavy music but I wouldn't consider myself a "metalhead".  I'm not really into many of the 80's metal bands.  I listen to some of them once in a while (like Maiden) but that's not my standard listening.

I'm into a lot of the newer metal bands.  One of my favorite bands right now is Avenged Sevenfold.  Heavy but man, those guys are great songwriters and it's some of the best guitarwork I've heard in a while.  

Some other bands I've been listening to lately: The Haunted, Soilwork (both from Sweden), Callenish Circle, Taproot, Demon Hunter.


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## Warrior Poet

*Confession:* Cinderella, _Night Songs_.  I love "Shake Me."  Also the Scorpions album _Savage Amusement_.  I can explain this one.  Really.  When I was about 14 I saw the video for "Rhythm of Love."  If you remember this video, with the woman who unzips her bodysuit, you know what I'm talking about.  I didn't buy the album -- my hormones did.  OK, commense mockery.

*Bragging:*  AC/DC, Accept, Aerosmith, Alice in Chains, Anthrax, Apocalyptica (heavy wood), Armored Saint, Black Sabbath, The Cult, Danzig, (early) Def Leppard, Dio, Faith No More, Guns N' Roses, Jimi Hendrix, Iggy Pop (not strictly metal), Infectious Grooves, Iron Maiden, John Paul Jones (solo), Judas Priest, KISS, Led Zepplin, Living Colour, Megadeth, Metallica, Meshuggah, Mötley Crüe, Motörhead, Ozzy, Pantera, Queensryche, Quiet Riot (Sarzo's bass work is great), Rush, Satriani, Billy Sheehan, Spinal Tap (of course!), Tesla, Thin Lizzy, Twisted Sister, Steve Vai, Van Halen, Y&T.

Some of these have been lost over the years to moves, or disintegrating cassettes/vinyl (remember those?), or loans, etc.  But the core stuff is still there.  And still played loudly, often.



			
				DannyAlcatraz said:
			
		

> Bang Tango



Wow.  OK, I'm impressed.  Or stunned, whichever.  Both.

Ta da!

Warrior Poet


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## Dingleberry

I certainly don't qualify as a metalhead, but I do have one GNR-related brag: the wall of my 10-month old son's jungle-themed nursery has "WELCOME TO THE JUNGLE - WE'VE GOT FUN AND GAMES" spelled out in cheery colorful letters.


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## DungeonmasterCal

I'm a much larger fan of heavy rock and metal than I am any other genre, but I will confess to owning releases from Merle Haggard, Lyle Lovett, and Dwight Yoakum among my album/cd collection.  Dig around, and you'll also find Prince, Morris Day & the Time, and an Air Supply lp (a gift from a high school friend...I swear I didn't pay for it).

I own about 90% of the Iron Maiden discography, including a picture disc LP with their version of "Cross Eyed Mary" on it.  I own Judas Priest's very first LP, "Rocka Rolla" (an album even they're not proud of).  Motorhead's "No Remorse" collection in the leather album cover.  Lots of WASP.  Lots of KISS.  Lots of Manowar. Lots of Saxon and Judas Priest.  AC/DC.  Nazareth. Aerosmith.  Even a Bon Jovi LP or two.  Some less well known and less than stellar 80's heavy rock releases include Rock Goddess, Icon, Heavy Pettin, Mama's Boys, Black 'n' Blue, Coroner (which thankfully gave us Les Claypool), and Dr. Mastermind.  

This is just a sampling.  I have nearly 700 lp's, but only a fraction of that in cd's.  After 1991, I lost interest in music to a large degree.  It's only been in the last couple years I've begun to listen to very much music again.


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## Darth Shoju

Well, not sure if I can be classified as a metal head, as my top three favourite bands are the Beatles, Metallica and the Rolling Stones. But here are the metal/hardcore/heavy rock bands I listen to:

(not in any particular order): Metallica, Megadeth, Iron Maiden, Black Sabbath, System of a Down, Tool, Godsmack, Sepulchura/Soulfly, Danzig, the Misfits, Opeth (a friend just turned me on to them lately), Ozzy, Malmsteen, A Perfect Circle, AC/DC, Alice in Chains, Soundgarden, Audioslave (Chris Cornell in general really), Rage Against the Machine, Nirvana, Pearl Jam, Stone Temple Pilots (yes I was into grunge), G 'n R, Korn, NIN, Deftones, Ramstein, Pantera, Linkin Park.

I also listen to a LOT of non-metal, but I don't consider most of those bands a *guilty* pleasure: Oldies like the Beatles, the Rolling Stones, the Beach Boys, BTO, the Guess Who, Jimi Hendrix, CCR; Punk like The Sex Pistols, the Dead Kennedys the Ramones, Bad Religion, Gob, the Clash, Pennywise, and other bands like Blue Rodeo, The Tragically Hip, They Might Be Giants, Weezer, Bob Marley, Neil Young, Gordon Lightfoot, BB King, etc.  Those that I *would* consider a guilty pleasure: 

Journey, Kansas, Black Eyed Peas, Abba, Bon Jovi, Weird Al Yankovick Creed and bands that do covers of video game music (hell, video game music itself...).


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## glass

I don't know if I qualify as a metalhead exactly, but rock in it's various forms is definitely my favourite, although I like lots of other stuff too. My favourite band of all time is The Smashing Pumpkins.

Non-rock in my collection includes Dido, Norah Jones, Eminem, Blur, Sleeper and a near complete collection of A-ha CDs.

Rock/metal includes the usual stuff: Maiden, Metallica, GnR, Therapy?, Sepultura, Faith No More, Nirvana, Pearl Jam, Alice In Chains, Soundgarden, Sugar...

Nothing particularly obscure now, AFAIK, but I used to have 'Teeth Like Sheep' by The Blue Smarties. Unfortunately, the tape gopt chewed up and I haven't been able to replace it.


glass.


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## Angel Tarragon

Does Quiet Riot count?


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## Eternalknight

I own all albums by:  KISS, Manowar, Bon Jovi, Def Leppard.

Several albums by:  Guns n Roses, Poison, Metallica, Aerosmith, Saxon, Iron Maiden, Rob Zombie, AC/DC.


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## Eternalknight

Forgot a couple:  The Darkness and Jet.


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## Desdichado

I have to confess that...

...actually I'm not really a metalhead at all.  Most of the music that your stereotypical D&D player listens to?  I'm not really that familiar with it, nor, when I do hear it, do I have any interest in it.  I do like a lot of really older hard stuff, like _Land of Rape and Honey_ era Ministry, or Suicidal Tendencies, or whatnot.  But the "metal" I like most is cheesy 80s hair bands like Def Leppard, Van Halen, Quiet Riot, Ratt, etc.

Rather, in the later 80s I abandoned a burgeoning career as a metalhead and became a New Wave fan.  It all started with the more pop acts like A-ha and Duran Duran (I have close to complete collections of both) but when Depeche Mode came to my attention, I was completely converted.

I did wander into harder stuff; much of my favorite music is industrial, or at least borderline industrial futurepop and whatnot.  One music critic called some of my recent favorite bands as "Depeche Mode with teeth."  But nobody's gonna be calling that metal anytime soon.

Can I brag that I had a CD copy of Visage's original eponymous album long before the re-release in the early 90s?  That was certainly the hardest thing to get ahold of that I owned.


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## LightPhoenix

Confession... okay, so I actually like Maroon 5.  Shoot me in the face.

I'm more a prog rock kiddie than a metalhead.  Queensryche is definitely up there... Yes, Dream Theater, King Crimson, Liquid Tension Experiment, and Spock's Beard all find numerous songs in rotation.  I adore Smashing Pumpkins and Foo Fighters is one of my favorite bands.  I've got some A Perfect Circle, Audioslave, Godsmack, Zeppelin, Pearl Jam, Goo Goo Dolls, Skynyrd, Clash, Modest Mouse, Queens of the Stone Age, The Killers, and White Stripes on my playlist right now.  On the lighter side I have some Ben Folds, some Simon and Garfunkel, some Toad the Wet Sprocket, some Wierd Al, as well as a couple of Irish rock bands, The Drovers and Quagmyre.  Oh, and some Mahler.  And the Kill Bill Vol. 1 soundtrack.  And Maroon 5.


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## MrFilthyIke

I'm mostly a metalhead...but with other music.  I consider myself a metalhead though.


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## Chainsaw Mage

My confession:

I have all of Michael Bolton's CDs.


My boast:

I have all of Quiet Riot's CDs.


(Or do I have those mixed up?   )


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## Chainsaw Mage

Joshua Dyal said:
			
		

> I have to confess that...
> 
> ...actually I'm not really a metalhead at all.  Most of the music that your stereotypical D&D player listens to?  I'm not really that familiar with it, nor, when I do hear it, do I have any interest in it.  I do like a lot of really older hard stuff, like _Land of Rape and Honey_ era Ministry, or Suicidal Tendencies, or whatnot.  But the "metal" I like most is cheesy 80s hair bands like Def Leppard, Van Halen, Quiet Riot, Ratt, etc.




Hey, show some respect, son! Def Leppard and Van Halen are good friggin' bands.

Quiet Riot, Ratt . . . one hit wonders.


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## Dannyalcatraz

> Chainsaw Mage
> 
> My confession:
> 
> I have all of Michael Bolton's CDs.




_ALL_ of his CDs?

Even his early work in hard rock as the lead singer of Blackjack...with guitarist Bruce Kulick of KISS fame?


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## Warrior Poet

Chainsaw Mage said:
			
		

> I have all of Michael Bolton's CDs



[Office Space] "Why should I have to change my name?  He's the one that sucks!" [/Office Space]

And I thought Bang Tango was this thread's winner.  Well, maybe it still is.
 



			
				Chainsaw Mage said:
			
		

> One hit wonders



Hey, Riot had TWO hits.  Sure, "Cum On Feel The Noize" was a remake, but it was a hit, and Metal Health was original (and what a bass line!).



			
				Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> with guitarist Bruce Kulick of KISS fame?



Great guitarist.  What's Bruce been up to lately?

Rokken with Dokken,

Warrior Poet


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## Desdichado

Warrior Poet said:
			
		

> Hey, Riot had TWO hits.  Sure, "Cum On Feel The Noize" was a remake, but it was a hit, and Metal Health was original (and what a bass line!).



And let's not forget "The Wild and the Young" which had one of my favorite music videos: in post-apocalyptic Nazi future America, "the man" is trying to keep us from rockin'.


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## Warrior Poet

Joshua Dyal said:
			
		

> And let's not forget "The Wild and the Young"



_The Wild and the Young
They all have their dreams!
The Wild and the Young
They've got to be free!
The sun never sets, their souls on the run
The Wild and the Young!_

 Who could forget such lyrical genius?  



			
				Joshua Dyal said:
			
		

> which had one of my favorite music videos: in post-apocalyptic Nazi future America, "the man" is trying to keep us from rockin'.



Isn't that just like The Man?

Mama Weer All Crazee Now,

Warrior Poet

P.S.  Any progress on Chapter 3?


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## Desdichado

Warrior Poet said:
			
		

> P.S.  Any progress on Chapter 3?



Three written, and four mostly so.  The difficult part may be cleaning it up, formating it and posting it, especially with the holiday (and my in-laws) right around the corner.


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## Dannyalcatraz

The man is still slaying notes with his sick, repulsive, electric twanger!

Bruce Kulick 

BTW, in the interest of FULL disclosure, Hard Rock/Metal accounts for about 1/4 of my 3500+ CD collection (just edging out new wave for 1st place) which covers all genres.

So, were you to peruse my collection, you'd also find nestled between Anthrax and ZZTop:

Paula Abdul
Duran Duran
Devo
Jane Child
Moby
Mozart
Gypsy Kings
Miles Davis
Neil Young
Michael Hedges
Kaki King
Bill Laswell
Mariah Carey
Maroon 5
Yeah Yeah Yeahs
Siouxsie & the Banshees

and the like, as well as hard rock luminaries as

Loudness
EZO
Dweezil Zappa
Satan Jokers

and oddballs like

Praxis
Buckethead
Material
Course of Empire

So...its not all metal, and its not all good, but it is definitely all MINE!!!


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## Warrior Poet

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> BTW, in the interest of FULL disclosure, Hard Rock/Metal accounts for about 1/4 of my 3500+ CD collection (just edging out new wave for 1st place) which covers all genres.



I don't have that many, but like you, I've got a lot of other stuff, including classical, jazz, blues, some reggae, some world, etc.   

Warrior Poet


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## Chainsaw Mage

Okay, here's a question for you metalheads:

Ever hear of a band called "Piledriver"?







I remember looking at this album as a kid thinking, "Whoa, that's frickin' cool, man!" Never listened to them, though.

Can anyone tell me about this brutally cheesy-looking band?

I mean, with song titles such as "Sodomize the Dead", "Sex with Satan" and "Alien Rape", surely they have *some* artistic merit.


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## Vindicator

Chainsaw Mage said:
			
		

> Okay, here's a question for you metalheads:
> 
> Ever hear of a band called "Piledriver"?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I remember looking at this album as a kid thinking, "Whoa, that's frickin' cool, man!" Never listened to them, though.
> 
> Can anyone tell me about this brutally cheesy-looking band?
> 
> I mean, with song titles such as "Sodomize the Dead", "Sex with Satan" and "Alien Rape", surely they have *some* artistic merit.





...scream, scream, puke, scream...
a few more screams, then a fart...
...and then some more screaming
Sodomize the dead!

*Piledriver, "Sodomize the Dead" (1985)*


[Sob, sniff]  More beauty than a Petrarchan sonnet . . .


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## Dingleberry

Anyone have "Cycle Sluts From Hell"?  I mean, anyone _else_?


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## Ferret

I have ACDC, Atreyu, Metallica, Iron Maiden, Black Sabbath, Mega death, Rage against the Machine, Slayer, and Slipknot and some songs from Apocalyptica, and Korn on my playlist.  Also Avenged Sevenfold, Drowning pool, Damage plan, etc

On the "Shame" List, Switchfoot, Razor light, Michelle Branch, James Blunt, Jamiroquai, and Maroon Five. But I like them all so I don't care.

Lots of stuff I like that isn't on the playlist, like Eminems earlier stuff, Black eyed peas, Outkast,  Atomic kitten,  and alot of pop bands I don't know the names of.


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## Warrior Poet

Dingleberry said:
			
		

> Anyone have "Cycle Sluts From Hell"?  I mean, anyone _else_?



Aw, c'mon!  That's a definite keeper!  I mean, they're called Cycle Sluts From Hell!  What's not to love?   

Warrior Poet


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## Dannyalcatraz

As I recall, the Cycle Sluts from Hell had a hit single "I wish you were a beer"...actually pretty damn funny.

Somehow, despite my love of that song, I never picked it up.

Ditto Piledriver.  But moreso, with less love for their tunes.


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## Dingleberry

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> As I recall, the Cycle Sluts from Hell had a hit single "I wish you were a beer"...actually pretty damn funny.



Bingo - and the video was on Beavis & Butthead once, which is probably the ONLY reason anybody ever heard of them.


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## Angel Tarragon

I love INXS. I have all of their albums!


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## freebfrost

*Confession:*  Yeah, I own every _Duran Duran_ album... and the _Power Station_ and _Arcadia_ knock-offs too.    

*Braggadocio:* _Maiden, Priest, Metallica, Queensrÿche, Megadeth, Scorpions, Van Halen, AC/DC, Ozzy, Sabbath, Raven, Deep Purple, Blue Öyster Cult, Quiet Riot, Leppard, Mötley Crüe, Saxon, Rainbow, Motörhead, Venom, Fastway, Ratt, Bon Jovi, W.A.S.P., Dio, Dokken, Europe, White Lion, Twisted Sister, Tiamat _ (the band not the diety), _KISS, Yngwie J. Malmsteen_ (since its always important to distinguish Yngwie *J.* from all the other guitarists named Yngwie Malmsteen out there...), _Tesla, Manowar, Talas, Skid Row, Cinderella, Bang Tango, Guns N Roses, Y & T, Type O Negative, Helloween, Metal Church_.  

I'm sure I'm missing some, but you get the idea.


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## Dannyalcatraz

I share with you the shame of Duran Duran/Arcadia/Power Station...UNREPENTANTLY!


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## megamania

hee ...along with my metal I have rap and hip hop and country.


'course I wouldn't call myself a metalhead either.  I just enjoy music.


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## Goblyn

I am and always have been a metalhead.  Metallica, Megadeth, Sabbath, System of a Down, and all sorts of little known death metal bands. Anyone hear of Dominion Mine? Heaven Shall Burn? Borknagar? Internal Bleeding? Bloodbath?

As a confession ... my favorite musical piece is Pachabel's canon ... and I like the Rankin family.


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## Captain Tagon

The only metal I listen to is modern Scandanavian black metal and power metal. "Heavy metal", ala Metallica and the like, doesn't even register as metal to me. Just another form of mainstream "rock".


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## DungeonmasterCal

I neglected to mention them in my first post, but I really, really love a band no one seems to have heard of; Solitude Aeturnus.  I think they've disbanded, but I really, really like their stuff.  Most of heavy and slow, with wailing vocals... a metal dirge, if you will.

And now, a confession.  I love bluegrass music.  I love it so bad.


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## John Q. Mayhem

Captain Tagon said:
			
		

> The only metal I listen to is modern Scandanavian black metal and power metal.




Cool. What're some bands you like?


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## Dannyalcatraz

Never really warmed up to the Norse Death Metal scene...though I DO have a Bathory CD...

Anyone else here into Hawkwind or Budgie?


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## DungeonmasterCal

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> Never really warmed up to the Norse Death Metal scene...though I DO have a Bathory CD...
> 
> Anyone else here into Hawkwind or Budgie?




I remember both Hawkwind and Budgie, but by their stuff was (and still is) hard to come by in the part of the country I live in.  I inherited a really badly scratched copy of Hawkwind's "Hall of the Mountain Grill" when I was in high school, but it couldn't even be played.


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## Nyaricus

*Confession*: I like all of the following bands: Alexisonfire, Billy Talent, Coheed and Cambria, My Chemical Romance and the Used.

*Brag*: here comes the fun part: A Perfect Circle, Amon Amarth, Apocalyptica, As I Lay Dying, Behemoth, Blind Guardian, Bloodsimple, Burn the Priest, Bury Your Dead, Children of Bodom, Coal Chamber, Cradle of Filth, Death, Demon Hunter, DevilDriver, Disturbed, Dope, DragonLord, dreadnaut (local band), Dry Kill Logic, Evanescence, Flaw, God Forbid, Gorgoroth, Impaled Nazarene, In Flames, JAW (local band but simply awesome), Kamelot, Killswitch Engage, Kittie, Korn, Lacuna Coil, Lamb of God, Linkin Park, Loco (split-up local band), Manowar, Marilyn Manson, Mastodon, Motograter, Mudvayne, Mushroomhead, Nargoroth, Nightwise, Nile, Opeth, Otep, Rammstein, Rhapody ("of Fire") Rob Zombie, Shadows Fall, Skinlab, Slipknot, Sonata Arctica, Spineshank, Static-X, StillVillage (another local band), StoneSour, Symphony X, The Berzerker, The Crown, Thine Eyes Bleed, Tool, Tribes of Cain, Unearth, Walls of Jericho, plus a bunch more I'm likely forgetting here.

I like death, groove, symphonic, power, black, melodeath, metalcore, nu, gothic, thrash, doom and industrial metal. I like pretty much all types of metal. Metal is awesome. Did I mention I like metal? 

cheers,
--N


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## Thunderfoot

Chainsaw Mage said:
			
		

> Hey, show some respect, son! Def Leppard and Van Halen are good friggin' bands.
> 
> Quiet Riot, Ratt . . . one hit wonders.



Sorry 
QR - Cum on Feel the Noize, Metal Health, Mama were All Crazy Now, Wild & the Young
Ratt - Round n Round, You're In Love, Lay it Down, Back for More

All of these charted (to some degree)

As for me - yes I'm a metalhead

Brag - Metallica (Before Jason Newstead RUINED the group and they became Alternica), Iron Maiden, Motorhead, Judas Priest, Van Halen, Rush, Queensryche, Dream Theater, Sex Pistols, Anthrax, KISS (Before 'I was Made for Loving You'), Ozzy, Dio, Sabbath, Rainbow, Deep Purple, Yngwie Malmsteen (w/ & w/o Rising Force), Talos, Aerosmith, Pretty Maids

Confess - Obviously Ratt, Quiet Riot, Winger, Bang Tango (I loved those guys), Trixter, Danger Danger, Electric Boys, Shark Island, Vixen (totaly Hawt!), Heart, Night Ranger (actually these guys were awesome before they got famous), Great White, Dokken, Stryper (did concert security for these guys in Germany), Beethoven, Motzart, Modern English, Depesche Mode, Alabama, Duran Duran, Grandmaster Flash, Run DMC, the Beastie Boys, Journey (sorry honey), Hootie and the Blowfish, Dave Mathews and Charo (Koochie Koochie)

Blasphemy - I actually can't stand Led Zepplin or Pink Floyd anymore - They are in such HEAVY rotation in this area that I actually change stations when they come on)


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## Nyaricus

Thunderfoot said:
			
		

> Blasphemy - I actually can't stand Led Zepplin or Pink Floyd anymore - They are in such HEAVY rotation in this area that I actually change stations when they come on)



That's okay, neither of those are actually metal anyways - Led Zep is simply rock, or hard rock maybe, and PF is more avant-garde progressive rock (with themes of psychedelic back before that). In any case, I've only ever heard The Wall by PF (and most of the times I've heard it it was the cover version by Korn) and while I own the first 4 Led Zepplin albums, I only like a handful of the songs - Stairway to Heaven, Ramble On, Good Times Bad Times, Immigrant Song and Heartbreaker. YMMV and all that 

cheers,
--N


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## kenobi65

I'm not really a metalhead, though my music collection has a fair amount of hard rock and metal in it (Led Zep, some AC/DC, some Scorpions, some Def Leppard, some Judas Priest).  That said, my favorite bands include ELO and Yes, which is probably enough to make the hardcore metalheads here cringe. 

My only metal "brag" is that my hearing loss is directly attributable to a heavy metal moment.  Motorhead concert, December 1985, Madison Wisconsin.  They played at "Turner Hall", which was fundamentally a gymnasium.  My friend Mark and I stood about 25 feet away from the amps.  I couldn't hear a thing for 2 days afterward, and, after that, I went from having very good hearing to being unable to hear a conversation in a noisy room.


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## Arkham

I have nothing to confess. I like all styles of music, and am quite happy with my Nina Simone, Nat King Cole, Prodigy, Johnny Cash, Ramones, Starship, etc...

I don't have much to brag about either. Just some Skyforger, Bal-Sagoth, Rudra, Therion, Nightwish, Mael Mordra, Vesperian Sorrow, Emperor, and Mangarm. My only real brag is flying 2,000 miles for the sole purpose of seeing Bal-Sagoth in their only US appearance to date at Heathen Crusade II. All the other amazing bands were just frosting on the cake.


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## Torm

Thunderfoot said:
			
		

> Ratt - Round n Round, You're In Love, Lay it Down, Back for More



How about I Want A Woman, and Way Cool Jr.?

I'm SOOOO Metal. I like _all_ that stuff by Winger and Warrant.


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## Thunderfoot

Torm said:
			
		

> How about I Want A Woman, and Way Cool Jr.?
> 
> I'm SOOOO Metal. I like _all_ that stuff by Winger and Warrant.



They didn't chart - which would have been more ammo for the "one hit wonder" tag.


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## Thunderfoot

Nyaricus said:
			
		

> That's okay, neither of those are actually metal anyways - Led Zep is simply rock, or hard rock maybe, and PF is more avant-garde progressive rock (with themes of psychedelic back before that). In any case, I've only ever heard The Wall by PF (and most of the times I've heard it it was the cover version by Korn) and while I own the first 4 Led Zepplin albums, I only like a handful of the songs - Stairway to Heaven, Ramble On, Good Times Bad Times, Immigrant Song and Heartbreaker. YMMV and all that
> 
> cheers,
> --N



Well, I would agree if you compare them to metal nowadays, but in retrospect, they were as heavy as they came in the late 60s early 70s.  They are literally held up as the godfathers of metal around the world and I can see it, I'm just burnt out on it.

I've listened to all sort of stuff through my life, Classical, Bubblegum pop (50s-70s), Latin, Afro-Cuban, Hard Rock, Heavy Metal, Thrash, Speed, Hardcore, Progressive (My absolute favorite genre), Punk (both original and new Emo style), Country (both Western and New), Traditional Folk (Irish, German, Scottish, English), Showtunes (No comments on my sexuality), Jazz (Fusion, Traditional and Experimental), New Wave, Disco (please don't kill me), Rap (back when it was break music), R&B (when it stood for Rhythm & Blues (I loves me some BB King)), Reggae (traditional), Barbershop Quartets and some other stuff that I really can't explain and would probably make your head explode.

I don't like Ska(new style), House, House Reggae, Modern R&B (how can it be Rhythm and Blues when it isn't blue and has no rhythm?) and Gansta anything (go home .50 before you get shot AGAIN)


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## xrpsuzi

*Confessions....*

I use to like Christian rock and thought it was jamming..... I was raised Southern Baptist and it was the "acceptable" rock & roll.


While we were dating, I use to make fun of Joe's metal collection, but then he introduced me to Maiden (Power Slave), and I was hooked. I'm still in metal re-education; last year on the drive to Gen Con, we listened to Judas Priest and King Diamond. 


-Suzi


----------



## Angel Tarragon

Does Quiet Riot count?


----------



## Tauric

I'm only a part-time metalhead, but my CD collection includes:  Megadeth, Metallica, Life of Agony, Sepultura, Pantera, Anthrax, System of a Down, Tool (& A Perfect Circle, can't get enough of Maynard), NIN, Led Zep, Rush, Hawkwind, Clawfinger, Rammstein, and Rage Against the Machine, with singles by Filter, Judas Priest, and Iron Maiden on my iTunes.

I feel no shame at the country/western, Motown, British Invasion, punk, ska, ska-punk, big-band, blues, bluegrass CDs that comprise the rest of my collection.

However, the one CD that I would rather my gaming group not know of (thankfully they don't know my screenname) is the Les Miserables cast recording. Oh, and Rod Stewart's Greated Hits boxed set.  Or Jewel.  I should stop now.


----------



## xrpsuzi

Tauric said:
			
		

> However, the one CD that I would rather my gaming group not know of (thankfully they don't know my screenname) is the Les Miserables cast recording. Oh, and Rod Stewart's Greated Hits boxed set.  Or Jewel.  I should stop now.




It's OK, we all bought Pieces of You. It was the 90s.

-Suzi


----------



## D.Shaffer

Hmm, I'm a Metalhead in so far as that Metal is my favorite genre, but my collection is fairly diverse.  (I've got everything from showtunes, to death metal, to the Animaniacs soundtrack)

Confessions: ...I like Flight of Seagulls and have their album.

Does the upcoming Metalocalypse/Dethklok album count as bragging or a confession?
"AWAKEN! AWAKEN! AWAKEN! AWAKEN!"


----------



## xrpsuzi

D.Shaffer said:
			
		

> Does the upcoming Metalocalypse/Dethklok album count as bragging or a confession?
> "AWAKEN! AWAKEN! AWAKEN! AWAKEN!"




Totally Brag. Brutal.

-Suzi


----------



## Chainsaw Mage

Thunderfoot said:
			
		

> Sorry
> QR - Cum on Feel the Noize, Metal Health, Mama were All Crazy Now, Wild & the Young




Of course, two of those four songs were covers.  Yep, one-hit wonder is a pretty good description of good ole QR.


----------



## Chainsaw Mage

suzi yee said:
			
		

> I use to like Christian rock and thought it was jamming.....




There were actually some pretty talented Christian metal bands.  Stryper, despite the goofy and brutal power ballads, had some great tunes.  And both Shout and Guardian were as good as any "secular" metal band.  

If you can track down a copy of Guardian's "Miracle Mile" and Shout's "In Your Face", you won't regret it.  

And I say this as a person who almost never listens to any religious-type music.


----------



## Chainsaw Mage

Gabriel said:
			
		

> I secretly sing along with ......................................................... Bon Jovi songs
> 
> I know, I know *must scrub the unclean off of me*




[Shrug] Why? Bon Jovi had some great songs.  "Raise Your Hands" is one of the all-time great concert songs.

Now if you sang along with Milli Vanilli, I'd say get out the brush . . . 

(I don't know if I got the spelling wrong, and don't care.   )


----------



## Huw

Confession: Sugababes.

Brag: All of Metallica's early stuff, including Garage Days.

Bonus brag: I disliked Smashing Pumpkins before anyone had heard the word "Grunge". _Bullet with Butterfly Wings_ is awesome though, I do admit.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Thunderfoot, Led Zep is one of my favorite bands...but I hardly ever listen to their CDs.

Why?

Not only are they (and PF) staples of the classic rock stations around here, one of my best buds is essentially stuck in the 1970s.  Odds of my hearing a Led Zep song in his presence approach 100%.

Continuing Confessions & Brags:

C: Still buying Enya.

B: I did start that Gojira thread...& bought the new album.  Shortly thereafter, picked up Jesu, and just picked up the new Mastodon (my first of theirs).  I'm intrigued by DragonForce...

Speaking of DragonForce, their guitarists Vai/Malmsteen fusion reminds me: I've said it before- I'm not liking a lot of the new vocalists out there.  Too many trying to outdo Max Cavalera, not enough trying to actually sing anymore.  While that type of vox has a place, its not so hot over virtuoso (ie Malmsteen/MacAlpine/Chastain, etc.) type guitar.

And sometimes, its clearly not a case of "bad" vocals by choice- Early Man NAILS the early Black Sabbath sound including the tone of Mike Conte's Ozzy-esque vocals- its truly great stoner rock.  However, where Oz occasionally wanders around a note without hitting it, the guy for Early Man doesn't seem to be able to hit the mark but 50% of the time.


----------



## Thunderfoot

I feel your pain Danny...

More Confessions: I like the Sugarcubes, I mean Bjork ROCKS!  Ok, maybe not rocks...but she is hot....well sort of.... okay, maybe I should re-think this post.   

Christian metal was definately a love of mine during the 'grunge' blot of the early 90s (it was the only real new metal out there /and frankly that's kind of sad/).  A couple of other groups that were pretty good were:
POP/Hard Rock Metal: Angelica and Holy Soldier - both had awesome musicianship and pretty tight vocals and lyrics.
Speed: Tourniquet - yep, speed and Christian lyrics and their drummer is STILL one of the fastest in the world.
Hardcore: White Throne (started growling WAY before a lot of other more popular bands)

Funniest thing I've noticed - Mastadon is a hot new metal band, in the 80's and 90's there was a Chirstian Metal/Progressive group named Mastadon. (Had the Elephante brothers, hence the name), they are NOTHING alike....


----------



## Fishbone

Confessions:
I'm into rap almost as much as metal and I'm a huge Wu-Tang Clan fan. If it is Wu-Tang clan related, I got it. I'm the whitest guy on the face of the earth and its strange for people to see Only Built 4 Cuban Linx sandwhiched lovingly between Speak English or Die and Swallowed in Black.
Brag: I'm responsible for a bunch of Kataklysm fans after putting Ambassador of Pain on my little brother's mix CD. Its always good to convert people to death metal fandom.
Edit: Further confessions: I'm a big time time lover of banjo music. Shhhhhhhhhh.....


----------



## xrpsuzi

Fishbone said:
			
		

> Edit: Further confessions: I'm a big time time lover of banjo music. Shhhhhhhhhh.....




*makes room in the bluegrass closet for fishbone*

Banjos, mandolins, fiddles, all are welcome.

-Suzi


----------



## jhallum

I'm into both metal and Prog rock.  My wife and I have an extensive collection that includes the following bands:

Dream Theater (the band that brought us together), Angra(the best band that Brazil has to offer), Queensryche,  Iron Maiden, Therion, Rage, Nightwish, Morgana LeFay(best thrash metal ever!), Evergrey, Spock's Beard, Pain of Salvation, Vanden Plas.

Safe to say, but IMO, the best metal in the world isn't being released here, but rather in Europe, where the metal scene never died in the nineties.  

I have my Heaven and Hell tickets, looking forward to finally getting a chance to see them live!


----------



## Kyuss Knight

I have such a varied musical taste (at least in my opinion)

"Metal" bands that I listen to regularly (in no particular order):
Metallica (first 4 albums), Megadeth, Down, Electric Wizard, Black Sabbath (Ozzy or Dio), Saint Vitus, Wolves in the Throne Room, King Diamond, Motorhead, Sleep, Pentagram, Between the Buried and Me, Blue Cheer, Ocean, Cathedral, Isis, Mastadon, Vio-Lence, Anthrax (w/ Joey singing), Sunn O))), Yob, Earth, High on Fire, Death, Napalm Death, Venom, Obituary, Appleseed Cast, Melvins, Kyuss and a crap-ton that I can't think of.

Some of the "non-metal":
Jets to Brazil, Weezer, Nirvana, The Clash, The Ramones, Marvin Gaye, Public Enemy, Talib Kweli,  Johnny Cash (probably what I listen to the most), The White Stripes, Gnarls Barkly, Bad Brains, Outkast and hundreds if not thousands more.


----------



## D.Shaffer

suzi yee said:
			
		

> *makes room in the bluegrass closet for fishbone*
> Banjos, mandolins, fiddles, all are welcome.



Mmm. Bluegrass.
Can we exclude steel guitar?   That's probably the only instrument in the world that'll make me automatically reject anyone.  I can usually find something worth while from any artist.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Confessions:

I own at least a couple of CDs (each) of Native American music, Bagpipes, Pan flute, and a host of stuff by a guy named Rabih Abu Khalil- Lebanese Traditional/Western Jazz Fusion stuff.

Brags: Just picked up the latest by Corrosion of Conformity.  If you like "stoner rock" or "southern rock" you need to know this band.  At times, part Lynard Skynard, at times Black Sabbath, this band has been around a while, and they still rock...but nobody ever talks about them.

Aside on cover tunes: I say count 'em towards your "hit" list.  If you can make a semi-obscure song rock, you deserve credit.  Almost any band you can name has some killer covers to their credit, even if it takes them a decade to actually commit them to a recorded media format.  Metallica, for instance, was doing Budgie's Breadfan for YEARS before they actually released it.  A lot of early rock bands wouldn't be anywhere without blues or folk covers.  Led Zep covered Robert Johnson.  Hendrix made hits of "All along the Watchtower" and "Hey Joe."  Yes, I know that few of the songs actually rose high in the charts, but if its still in rotation after a decade or so, I'd call that a hit.  After all, very few directors (to switch genres for a second) are as critically acclaimed as Scorsese...but while he didn't win an Oscar until this year, the films he lost to have not aged as well as his...


----------



## Mark Hope

Shame: Depeche Mode.  Love them to bits.  Once cited them as a major influence during an interview, much to the horror of my fellow bandmates ...

Fame: Creepmime.  My band from back in the day.  No, I know you've never heard of us, but we had a brief spell in the spotlight back in the early 90s.  Played with Death and Cynic amongst others.  Fun times.


----------



## Nyaricus

Mark Hope said:
			
		

> Shame: Depeche Mode.  Love them to bits.  Once cited them as a major influence during an interview, much to the horror of my fellow bandmates ...
> 
> Fame: Creepmime.  My band from back in the day.  No, I know you've never heard of us, but we had a brief spell in the spotlight back in the early 90s.  Played with Death and Cynic amongst others.  Fun times.



Awesome! I just looked you up at the Metal Archives - death metal, eh? What other DM bands do you listen to?

cheers, 
--N


----------



## Mark Hope

Nyaricus said:
			
		

> Awesome! I just looked you up at the Metal Archives - death metal, eh? What other DM bands do you listen to?
> 
> cheers,
> --N



Well, we were more in the vein of doom than death, although I've always thought that those categories weren't very useful in the long run.  I've always been fond of Cynic and Death, and enjoyed good old Paradise Lost and Carcass and Opeth really impress the hell outta me.  I love the whole sweeping atmospheric thing.  I have a lot of time for thrash (Bay Area stuff like old Exodus and Testament) so I was always trying to get more of that groove into our music.  I think that the vocals of many death and doom bands can be self-defeating at the end of the day - we suffered from that problem a bit to be honest.  I remember trying to explain that to the interviewer in the same interview that I was rambling on about Depeche Mode in, actually.  He looked at me like I was insane - the other guys in the band were like "yeah, ok Mark, you can shut up now!", lmao...

I have to add Bjork, Jamiroquai, old Motley Crue and Goa Trance music to my Shame list as well, in all honesty.  At the first Dynamo festival in Holland there was a guy with a homemade t-shirt that said "Motley Crue is disco, and disco is sh*t!"  Funny stuff.  I probably shouldn't mention Stryper at all either...


----------



## rjs

Wow Mark, we have similar tastes. 

Just to chime in-->

Brags (?): Vader, Opeth, My Dying Bride, Slayer, Death, Amorphis, Sepultura, Sammael, Mortuary Drape, King Diamond, Dio, Maiden, Black Sabbath (Dio era), Arch Enemy, Katatonia, Kyuss, Priestess, Soulfly, Bruce Dickenson, Bolt Thrower, Strapping Young Lad, Ministry, Soilwork, Diablo, Demirous, Paradise Lost, Windir, Obituary, Cynic, Merciful Fate, Corrosion of Conformity (new album is very sexy), Monster Magnet, and on and on.

Shame: Static-X, Hed PE, Queensryche, Danzig

Over the last few years, my tastes have gotten substantially darker and heavier... surprise!


----------



## Mark Hope

Heh, I really like Static-X and Queensryche as well (they're not so awesome post-Empire but still not bad).  Maiden are kings of metal (and Bruce's solo stuff is killer) and I've got a lot of time for Slayer too.  Early Metallica (Justice and earlier) are great but god knows what has happened to them in recent years.  I loved Jason Newstead's take on the whole therapy thing: "Really f***ing lame and weak".  Preach it, brother bass-man!  

Any Skyclad fans here?  I haven't bothered with them since Walkyier left, but they are one of my all-time faves...


----------



## rjs

True about Queensryche, but if you compare Empire to Rage for Order, man, they're worlds apart. I saw Static-X a few years (well several I suppose) at Ozzfest. They were one of the best bands on the second stage, better even than Rob Zombie, who cut his set short. 

As for Skyclad, I couldn't get in to them. Their first disc was pretty good (1992-ish, yes?), but I never followed them after. Metallica... they blow. Their public image has even sullied their good work imho: ...And Justice backwards. I'm clinging to the faint hope that Rick Rubin can kick their arses into shape and make something heavy for their new disc.

Anyone pick up the new Type O Negative? I'm planning to, but not for a week or so. Opinions?

Also, for Vader fans (I know you're out there), the band just entered the studio to re-record their old material for their 25 year anniversary disc. Personally, this is awesome since I've had the hardest time finding any of their older discs. I go back as far as Litany, but then I hit a wall.

Last, Diablo, the Finnish doom band, released Mimic 47 last year . Anyone have any links to picking up imports from a reputable site? Here's the link to their video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYa9814SHtk


----------



## The Thayan Menace

*Query*

What is this "metal" that you speak of?    

-Samir


----------



## Nyaricus

The Thayan Menace said:
			
		

> What is this "metal" that you speak of?
> 
> -Samir



*THWACK*

BAD SAMIR! BAD, BAD SAMIR!


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

_Empire_ took some time to grow on me, but I think its just as good an album as _Mindcrime_ in its own way.  _Mindcrime_ is Queensryche's _The Wall_, but _Empire_ is their _Dark Side of the Moon_- its the album of theirs that most people will have.

As for Static-X, I like the spin they've taken on Prong's work, keeping techno-influenced metal alive.

King Diamond?  I bought a couple of albums- _Them_ and _Abigail_, listened to them for about a year, then got tired of the storylines and sold them at Apple Records in San Antonio, along with the first 2 Danzig albums (same reasons)...but I did just buy the Best of KD last month.

Kyuss was simply awesome, especially _Welcome to Sky Valley_, and I've been a big fan of QOTSA since Kyuss broke up.  (Slo-Burn also kicked a$$, but 1 EP in 10 years does not bode well...)

Jamiroquai Rocks!   No, really!  I love that band.


----------



## Nyaricus

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> As for Static-X, I like the spin they've taken on Prong's work, keeping techno-influenced metal alive.



I'm a big fan of Static-X; they have a sweet industrial metal sound to them, and I'm slowly growing some rivethead parts  Wumpscut and CombiChrist are both wicked Industrial bands.

For anyone who likes Static-X, have you heard of Crossbreed? I have their album _Synthetic Division_, and it's as amazing fusion of indutrial sounds (with keys and a dj) and a full metal band (vox, beats, bass and strings).

Also, Spineshank is another good Static-Xish band. Some great potential in their sound; too bad their old vocalist left...

cheers,
--N


----------



## Thurbane

Along with industrial and punk, metal is some of my favorite music. I'd say at least 80% of my large(ish) CD collection is metal.

Bands like Slayer, Anthrax, Manowar, Kreator, Sepultura, Blind Guardian, Metal Church, Dio, Black Sabbath, Testament, Candlemass, Sleep, Grand Magus, Orange Goblin, Biohazard, Fear Factory, Exodus, Overkill, Coroner...

..and the greatest of them all...

DETHKLOK


----------



## D.Shaffer

Thurbane said:
			
		

> DËTHKLØK



Fixed it for you.  
"We will make everything metal. Blacker than the blackest black times infinity. "


----------



## BLACKDIRGE

This may be shocking to some of you, but yes, I am, in fact, into heavy metal.   

I like the extreme end of metal, death, grindcore, and thrash mostly. I have a real fondness for the discordant, down-tuned Swedish stuff, especially Entombed and Flesh Crawl. Some of my favorite bands are as follows: 

Morbid Angel (my favorite)
Bolt Thrower
Entombed
Six Feet Under
Devildriver
Cannibal Corpse
Slayer
Monstrosity
Gorguts

BD


----------



## Nyaricus

DevilDriver rocks my socks! Man, I get to see them in May, and I can't wait for it! On the plus, they are coming with the metalcore outfit Unearth (another fav) and black metal band Dimmu Borgir. Woohoo!

cheers,
--N


----------



## Thurbane

D.Shaffer said:
			
		

> Fixed it for you.



Thanks, that's brutal!


----------



## dmchucky

*My guilty and non-guilty pleasures*

Brag...

AC/DC, Alice in Chains, Anthrax, Armored Saint, As I Lay Dying, Black Sabbath, Bruce Dickenson, Dio, Disturbed?, Dokken, Dream Theater?, Fight, Godsmack, GNR, H.I.M.?, Helloween, Iron Maiden, Judas Priest, Killswitch Engage, King's X?, Kiss?, Kix?, Linkin Park?, Megadeth, Metallica, Mullmuzzler?, Ozzy, Pantera, Prong, Queensryche?, Quiet Riot, Ratt, Riot?, Scorps, Skid Row, Spinal Tap (yes, for real), Stryper, System of a Down, Testament, Trivium, WASP, Warrant?, White Lion?, Whitesnake?, Yngwie Malmsteen, among others

Note those listed above with question marks are bands that may not be considered metal by some.

Confess... (there are some groups I like that I will never confess to; like ABBA for instance [oops])

Aerosmith, Alan Parsons, Al Stewart, America, April Wine, Asia, Autograph, Beatles, Big Country, Billy Joel, Blue Oyster Cult, Bon Jovi, Boston, The Cars, Cheap Trick, Cinderella, Coheed & Cambria, Creed, The Cure, Damn Yankees, David Bowie, David Gilmour, Deep Purple, Def Leppard, DM (Violator only), Dido, Duran Duran, Eagles, ELO, Elton John, Enya, Europe, Evanescence, Firehouse, The Fixx, Fleetwood Mac, Foo Fighters, Foreigner, Genesis, Gin Blossoms, Great White, Heart, House of Lords, John Waite, Journey, Kansas, Keane, Led Zep, Liquid Tension Experiment, Lita Ford, Loverboy (wince), Meatloaf, Mr. Mister (wince more), Night Ranger, Orion the Hunter, Pat Benatar, Phil Collins, Pink Floyd, Queen, Rainbow, REO Speedwagon, Rick Springfield (oops), Rush, Saga, Sammy Hagar, Sarah McLachlan, Stevie Nicks, Styx, Survivor, Talk Talk, Tears for Fears, Tesla, The Tubes, Van Halen, Vertical Horizon, Vinnie Vincent Invasion, Vixen, and Yes.


----------



## Nyaricus

dmchucky said:
			
		

> Brag...
> 
> AC/DC, Alice in Chains, Anthrax, Armored Saint, As I Lay Dying, Black Sabbath, Bruce Dickenson, Dio, Disturbed?, Dokken, Dream Theater?, Fight, Godsmack, GNR, H.I.M.?, Helloween, Iron Maiden, Judas Priest, Killswitch Engage, King's X?, Kiss?, Kix?, Linkin Park?, Megadeth, Metallica, Mullmuzzler?, Ozzy, Pantera, Prong, Queensryche?, Quiet Riot, Ratt, Riot?, Scorps, Skid Row, Spinal Tap (yes, for real), Stryper, System of a Down, Testament, Trivium, WASP, Warrant?, White Lion?, Whitesnake?, Yngwie Malmsteen, among others
> 
> Note those listed above with question marks are bands that may not be considered metal by some.



I'll bite 

Disturbed - definitly metal; they are traditional heavy metal with nu metal elements.
Kiss - they are glam rock with some heavy metal influences. Not actually metal, though.
Linkin Park - Despite being the poster children for Nu Metal, they are way more rock than metal. I'd peg them as Rap Rock (yes, an almost superflous distiction, but hey!).

The rest I've either not heard enough by them or never heard of em.

cheers,
--N


----------



## Selenim

I'm into death metal for the most part.    I also like a lot industrial music bands.  Here's a partial list of the metal bands I listen to on a regular basis : 

Asphyx, Atheist, Bloodbath, Cannibal Corpse, Carcass, Cryptopsy, Cynic, Death/Control Denied, Dying Fetus, Gorgasm, Grave, Iron Maiden, Martyr, Megadeth, Morbid Angel, Mortician, Necrophagist, Nile, Obituary, Pestilence, Phlebotomized, Primus, Samael, Sepultura, Suffocation, Suicidal Tendencies, Unleashed, Visceral bleeding, Vomitory, White Zombie

As far as cheesy music goes I do have the occasional craving for goth rock and ebm.   I also have a few disco albums as well....

Les Claypool was in Coroner ? It's been a while since I listened to this band I'll have to check this out


----------



## JukeboxHead

dmchucky said:
			
		

> Brag...
> 
> AC/DC, Alice in Chains, Anthrax, Armored Saint, As I Lay Dying, Black Sabbath, Bruce Dickenson, Dio, Disturbed?, Dokken, Dream Theater?, Fight, Godsmack, GNR, H.I.M.?, Helloween, Iron Maiden, Judas Priest, Killswitch Engage, King's X?, Kiss?, Kix?, Linkin Park?, Megadeth, Metallica, Mullmuzzler?, Ozzy, Pantera, Prong, Queensryche?, Quiet Riot, Ratt, Riot?, Scorps, Skid Row, Spinal Tap (yes, for real), Stryper, System of a Down, Testament, Trivium, WASP, Warrant?, White Lion?, Whitesnake?, Yngwie Malmsteen, among others
> 
> Note those listed above with question marks are bands that may not be considered metal by some.




H.I.M. is a death metal/goth metal band. Definitely.


----------



## MrFilthyIke

Mark Hope said:
			
		

> Played with Death and Cynic amongst others.  Fun times.




Love both bands.  Good stuff.


----------



## Fishbone

Nyaricus said:
			
		

> DevilDriver rocks my socks! Man, I get to see them in May, and I can't wait for it! On the plus, they are coming with the metalcore outfit Unearth (another fav) and black metal band Dimmu Borgir. Woohoo!
> 
> cheers,
> --N



Is that the show in Milwaukee at the Rave? Because while I like DevilDriver and Dimmu Borgir and tolerate Unearth I was really only going for Kataklysm.


----------



## Fishbone

dmchucky said:
			
		

> Brag...
> Anthrax, Armored Saint,Black Sabbath, Bruce Dickenson, Dio, Dokken, Dream Theater?, GNR, Helloween, Iron Maiden, Judas Priest, King's X, Kiss, Megadeth, Metallica, Mullmuzzler, Ozzy, Pantera, Prong, Queensryche,Skid Row, Spinal Tap (yes, for real),Testament, WASP, Yngwie Malmsteen, among others



I weeded out the crap in the brags that I didn't like. Good list!
For the record why the hell are you "confessing" to bands like Van Halen, Deep Purple, Led Zepplin, the Beatles, Rainbow, Blue Oyster Cult and Aerosmith?


----------



## replicant2

A list of (mostly) heavy metal bands I've seen in concert:

Iron Maiden (x6), KISS (x 8), Megadeth (x3), Anthrax (x2), Slayer (x2), Sick of it All, Sepultura (x2), Ozzy Osbourne (x5), Black Sabbath (x2), Dio (x3), Motorhead, Cinderella, Twisted Sister, Motley Crue, Queensryche (x4), Judas Priest (x2), Scorpions, Whitesnake, Alice Cooper, Rush (x7), Metallica (x2), Pantera (x3), Danzig, Poison, Ratt (x2), Yngvie Malmstein, Doro Pesch, Napalm Death, Ace Frehley, Type O Negative, Dokken, Fear Factor, Rob Zombie, Marilyn Manson, Firehouse (yuck), and countless other bands on the Ozzfest tour whose name escapes me.

Yes, I have some permanent hearing damage.


----------



## BOZ

i guess you must by now!


----------



## Nyaricus

Fishbone said:
			
		

> I weeded out the crap in the brags that I didn't like. Good list!



Hey man, "one man's trash..." and all that. Don't be hatin'.


----------



## Nyaricus

Fishbone said:
			
		

> Is that the show in Milwaukee at the Rave? Because while I like DevilDriver and Dimmu Borgir and tolerate Unearth I was really only going for Kataklysm.



No idea, but that's the line-up I'll be seeing when they come to Winnipeg - so, yes, likely it is.

Pretty solid line-up, I gotta say. What's Kataklysm like, anyways? I've never even heard of them before this show.


----------



## Fishbone

Kataklysm is great. Good vocals, they mix it up with the standard deep stuff and a more Dani Filth like thing. It grates at first but you'll learn to like it. And the drummer is one of the best hyperblasters in the business, he'll go 200+ BPM for HOURS.
The earlier stuff has lower, faster pitched vocals and is a bit hard to hear.
They're a quality Canadian DM band, nothing more, nothing less.


----------



## Kurashu

Ok. I'll bite.

Confessions...? I really don't have any. I used to like rap and Linkin Park. I tend to not say that...often or at all, but I did. Linkin Park actually isn't THAT bad. There's worse bands. I've been made fun of for liking Jonezetta. Iunno. Appearently synth-pop-rock-whatever doesn't fit in with my "metal" demeanor. I really like Anberlin too. They Might Be Giants. The Aquabats! and Fivie Iron Frenzy. Incubus. Journey. I'd say I'm not really ashamed of anything I listen to, but a Stratovarius song just came on. That and The Devil Wears Prada and It Dies Today (ugh). I got those two on accident thinking they'd be good.

As for my metal stuff...Iunno. The only "pure" metal I have is Kamelot, Blind Guardian, DAATH, Demilich, some of Extol's older stuff, Goatwhore, Acid Bath, Mastodon (although, it may be debatable if they are tr00 metal), some Death, a few Deicide and Cannibal Corpse songs my friend sent me. Some Slayer and Megadeth. Gojira though. I love me some Gojira. And Suffocation. (Although, I only have their latest album). My Dying Bride is amazing too.

If you count grindcore as metal...even those it's the extreme end of hardcore, ...I'm Dead (can I say that?) and Last Days Of Humanity, and Napalm Death. The Day Everything Became Nothing.

I'm real deep in the metalcore area. The Red Chord, Suicide Silence, Through The Eyes of the Dead, From A Second Story Window, Psyopus, Fear Before The March of Flames, Bring Me The Horizon, August Burns Red, Heaven Shall Burn, The Haunted, The Human Abstract, As Blood Runs Black, Zao (I love me some Zao), The Chariot, Luti-Kriss/Norma Jean, Dead To Fall, Ed Gein, Dillinger Escape Plan, Converge, A Life Once Lost, All That Remains, All Shall Perish, Elysia, HORSE the band, War Of Ages, Twelve Gauge Valentine, The Acacia Strain, Knights of the Abyss, Into The Moat, Between the Buried and Me, Glass Casket, Bury Your Dead, Training For Utopia has grown on me some, The Number 12 Looks Like You, Inked In Blood, The Black Dahlia Murder, A Day To Remember, Ion Dissonance

The list goes on and on and on. I think I got most of them though...

As for other stuff? Muse, Chevelle, Cursive, mewithoutYou, The Beatles, Comeback Kid, Figure Four, Beloved, Queens of the Stone Age, 30 Seconds To Mars, Glassjaw, The Clash, (hed) p.e., Pink Floyd, Rush, AC/DC, States of Melba is alright from what I've heard (it's a side project from Zao that is mellow rock)

I like mostly rock stuff, as you can tell.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Kurashu- admitting liking any band, the wearing of whose t-shirt would get you razzed by someone at a Motorhead or any analogous show, no matter how good their musicianship, and even if they count actual professional Metal Musicians within their fan base*, counts as a "Confession."

They Might Be Giants clearly counts.

*I've seen & read interviews with Zakk Wilde, for instance, where he expresses his admiration for a variety of non-metal bands, and even says that he listens to them on his Tour bus.


----------



## Nyaricus

Kurashu said:
			
		

> Figure Four



Awesome Winnipeg metalcore/hardcore band \m/

cheers,
--N


----------



## Theron

Confession:  I really, really, like Rhapsody (of Fire).  Sue me.  It's fun to watch my seven year old rock out to "Emerald Sword."  Also, right out of high school, my buddies and I had a really bad (I'm talking Wyld Stallions bad) band called Wrathchyld.

Brags:  The first band I ever saw in concert was the Irons with Paul DiAnno fronting them.  They were opening for Judas Priest on the "British Steel" tour.  I saw Ozzy with Randy Rhodes on guitar a month before Randy died.  Met the Iron's some years later and have sat front row at a Priest show.  Back in the day (early 80s) I don't think I missed a metal show that rolled through San Antonio.

I fell away from metal when it became more about hairspray and power ballads than rock, spent a decade or so wearing plaid, then, a few years ago, discovered Power Metal bands like Blind Guardian, Hammerfall, and, yes, Rhapsody, which led me back to my old listening habits.  I've never gotten into death/dark/black metal, though not for lack of trying.  As a result, a lot of the newer stuff leaves me cold.  On the other hand, there's nothing more pathetic to my mind than 50-60 year old metal guys.  With the exception of Lemmy.  Because Lemmy's older than dirt and cooler than Antarctica.  But I digress.


----------



## Nyaricus

Theron said:
			
		

> Confession:  I really, really, like Rhapsody (of Fire).  Sue me.  It's fun to watch my seven year old rock out to "Emerald Sword."  Also, right out of high school, my buddies and I had a really bad (I'm talking Wyld Stallions bad) band called Wrathchyld.



Hey! Rhapsody of Fire may be a cheesefest, but it is real metal! C'mon, give us a *real* confession! Otherwise, out of the thread for you 

cheers,
--N


----------



## Theron

Nyaricus said:
			
		

> Hey! Rhapsody of Fire may be a cheesefest, but it is real metal! C'mon, give us a *real* confession! Otherwise, out of the thread for you
> 
> cheers,
> --N




Fine, fine.  Between my wife and myself, we own every second of music ever released by The Cure and a fair bit of unreleased/bootleg stuff.  Something like twenty eight hour's worth.

Better? 

(And as an addendum to my earlier post, if you've never seen comedian Brian Posehn's video "Metal By Numbers," you shouldn't call yourself a metalhead.  Go look it up on YouTube, it's a thing of deep and abiding beauty.)


----------



## Kurashu

Theron said:
			
		

> (And as an addendum to my earlier post, if you've never seen comedian Brian Posehn's video "Metal By Numbers," you shouldn't call yourself a metalhead.  Go look it up on YouTube, it's a thing of deep and abiding beauty.)




It's a decent song. However, I wouldn't say it makes or breaks a metalhead.

Although, when I first introduced it to my friends, we laughed for twenty minutes.


----------



## Theron

Kurashu said:
			
		

> It's a decent song. However, I wouldn't say it makes or breaks a metalhead.
> 
> Although, when I first introduced it to my friends, we laughed for twenty minutes.




To me, a well-done parody or satire is a thing of abiding beauty.

The line, "Somewhere in Norway," and the picture-in-picture Dragonforce parody just about killed me.


----------



## Ferret

Hmm, I've been out of the forum for a while... But my tastes have matured maybe.

I listen to mainly Megadeth, Iron Maiden, Metallica, Sikth*, The Jonbenet*, Killswitch Engage*, Monster Magnet*.

The asterix denotes bands that I've recently listened to.

I still get the impression that I have a small listening range, but I've found it hard to find music I like. C'est la vie.


----------



## papastebu

Most definitely not a metalhead. I do like Iron Maiden, Seventh Son...
Def Leppard, if that counts at all, Several songs by Twisted Sister, Van Halen--I used to have a huge crush on Vallerie Bertinelli when I was a kid, but I was only jealous of Eddie's guitar work. Led Zeppelin. Hendrix. I know those two don't actually qualify, but they were forerunners, for sure. Black Sabbath for the music, but not so much for the vocals.
My confession is that I listen to a little a LOT of everything. Blues Traveler, especially Travelers and Thieves--what was that thread about music and D&D?--Barenaked Ladies, a band out of Nashville called The Floating Men--one of my favorites(I just remembered their logo, LOL: a childlike drawing of three guys facedown in a swimming pool!).  But I also listen to Limp Bizkit, EmineM, Metallica, Nazareth--Hair of the Dog was so cool--Blue Oyster Cult, Frank Zappa, Steve Miller, Stevie Ray Vaughan, the Fabulous Thunderbirds, Steve Vai, Tony McAlpine, Buddy Guy, B.B. King, Albert King, Robert Johnson, Eric Clapton, Aerosmith, The Stones, The Beatles, James Taylor--_there's_ a freaking confession, for you--Black Flag, The Meat Puppets, F.U.C.T. and so many more that I can't think of all of them. Truthfully, if I give something a good listen, and it seems to be cohesive and strong for whatever kind of music it is.
Now, for the real confession: My dad was a country/western singer and guitar player for a little more than 32 years--the entirety of my childhood and adolescence included in there--and that is what I grew up listening to. My first dose of Rock music was eother the Eagles or Lynnard Skynnard, I'm not sure which, but I still like Hank Williams, Sr. _and_ Jr., Merle Haggard, an Marty Robbins.


----------



## Nyaricus

Theron said:
			
		

> Fine, fine.  Between my wife and myself, we own every second of music ever released by The Cure and a fair bit of unreleased/bootleg stuff.  Something like twenty eight hour's worth.
> 
> Better?
> 
> (And as an addendum to my earlier post, if you've never seen comedian Brian Posehn's video "Metal By Numbers," you shouldn't call yourself a metalhead.  Go look it up on YouTube, it's a thing of deep and abiding beauty.)



Better 

And I own the same Lamb of God hoodie as the one Brian Posehn is wearing the video  +10 cool points!

cheers (metal by numbers/ONE TWO THREE!),
--N


----------



## Nyaricus

Ferret said:
			
		

> Killswitch Engage*
> 
> The asterix denotes bands that I've recently listened to.
> 
> I still get the impression that I have a small listening range, but I've found it hard to find music I like. C'est la vie.



What albums (or songs, if you've simply been downloading) have you listened to by these guys? Their first two albums have a different vocalist then their two newer ones, and their sound has changed significantly enough that I might be able to introduce you to some similar bands in either of their styles.

Old albums = _Killswitch Engage_ and _Alive or Just Breathing_ and are more thrash/metalcore.

If you liked these albums, may I suggest: As I Lay Dying, God Forbid, Mastodon, Shadows Fall, Lamb of God


New Albums = _The End of Heartache_ and _As Daylight Dies_ and are more melodic metalcore.

If you liked these albums, may I suggest: Children of Bodom, In Flames (esp. the newer albums _Soundtrack to Your Escape_ and _Come Clarity_), Port Amoral, Avenged Sevenfold and Trivium.

If you liked either of these 'eras' for the band, you'd also probably like DevilDriver and Unearth. Also, pick up a copy of Roadrunner United: the All-Star Sessions. Read here for more details. It has an excellent variety of metal sub-genres on it, and is a a fantastic listen that you'll keep going back to - and many of the band I mentioned (including the newer Killswitch Engage vocalist) are featured on this album.

cheers,
--N


----------



## Brimshack

Lemmy once spoke to me. The man looked right at me and said; "covered in %^$%# blood, eh?" 

...(Sigh) my sole brush with fame.


----------



## ShadowX

I hate to get all tr00, but this thread has far too much glam and mallcore that rightfully belongs in the confession section.  Captain Tagon you betray your ignorance about the genre with such insipid remarks and I suggest you go back to listening to your kvlt black metal albums with unpronounceable names and no vowels.

Confessions: I once listened to Detroit Rock City and.. yes... I sang along.

Brag: Metal Church, Megadeth, Black Sabbath, Judas Priest, Iron Maiden, Angel Witch, Angra, Hibria, Rage, Gamma Ray, Scanner, Agent Steel, Diamond Head, Slayer, Anthrax, Virgin Steele, Iron Savior, Attacker, Omen, Liege Lord (Master Control is phenomenal), Helloween, Iced Earth, Trouble, Queensryche, Fates Warning, Running Wild, Grave Digger, Accept, Saxon, Motorhead, Rush, Jethro Tull, Guns 'N' Roses, Jag Panzer, Catharsis (Russian), and many more.


----------



## rjs

Megadeath? Really? (For me, that would qualify as a confess). 

You want metal to curl your hair and make nuns explode? Try Vader. They've posted a slew of mp3s on their website: http://www.vader.pl/mp-e.html 

I recommend This is War off the Art of War EP. Now that sir is metal.


----------



## Kurashu

ShadowX said:
			
		

> I hate to get all tr00, but this thread has far too much glam and mallcore that rightfully belongs in the confession section.  Captain Tagon you betray your ignorance about the genre with such insipid remarks and I suggest you go back to listening to your kvlt black metal albums with unpronounceable names and no vowels.




There's nothing wrong with listening to what you want to.

BUT, if you want to get into that, Rush, Jethro Tull, and Guns 'N' Roses aren't real metal. Rush was influenced by metal early on, Guns 'N' Roses was rock that sounded like metal, and Jethro Tull was confused with Metallica by the Grammies.

And looking at history, Slayer, Anthrax, Metallica and Megadeth were the beginning of modern "mallcore" by mixing metal and hardcore. Death metal has used breakdowns in songs for years now. Look at Suffocation, they formed just to do over the top death metal breakdowns and turned into a great band.

Besides, that's such a stupid term, "mallcore". I think people have just gotten lazy with insult and just tag core on to semi-offensive words. 

I'm just saying.

And also, there's nothing wrong with black metal, kvlt or not. Glam, while being more towards the side of power pop, is alright too.


----------



## Biohazard

_Content deleted - Biohazard, if you post like that again you WILL face a time-out from the boards. Do not post any further in this thread.

If you can't understand why your post has been deleted, please feel free to email me.

Plane Sailing, Moderator_


----------



## rjs

Wow man. I thought this thread was about gushing over your favorite metal bands. I suspect this was friendly banter and not a call to war (well, my post was... VAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADDDDDDDDDDDDDDEEEEEEEEEEEERRRRRRRRRRR). Anyway, relax. No one here kicked your dog


----------



## Nyaricus

ShadowX said:
			
		

> Captain Tagon you betray your ignorance about the genre with such insipid remarks and I suggest you go back to listening to your kvlt black metal albums with unpronounceable names and no vowels.



Please do not call out other forum members with such generalized remarks - it's rude and simply makes you look like the jerk. What he considers to be metal doesn't affect you, adversely or otherwise, in any way.

As for the "mallcore" statement, that was another unnecessary swipe at board members, and keep it out of this discussion. Personally, I've been enjoying this thread up to this point and wouldn't want to see a perfectly fine discussion of metal be ripped up over the umpteenth clash of the dead, beaten horse that is "tr00 metal" vs "n00 metal". Leave it out of this. Please.

thanks,
--N


----------



## Plane Sailing

No flaming or trolling in the thread please - and if anyone does, then please report it rather than respond.

No further warnings!

Regards,


----------



## Fishbone

rjs said:
			
		

> Megadeath? Really? (For me, that would qualify as a confess).



Megadeth as a confession? You didn't like KIMB, Peace Sells... or Rust in Peace? Rust in Peace is a thrash masterpiece, a seminal, mandatory album.
Vader is indeed great though. God is Dead! Dead! Hellelujah!


----------



## Ferret

Nyaricus said:
			
		

> What albums (or songs, if you've simply been downloading) have you listened to by these guys? Their first two albums have a different vocalist then their two newer ones, and their sound has changed significantly enough that I might be able to introduce you to some similar bands in either of their styles.
> 
> Old albums = _Killswitch Engage_ and _Alive or Just Breathing_ and are more thrash/metalcore.
> 
> If you liked these albums, may I suggest: As I Lay Dying, God Forbid, Mastodon, Shadows Fall, Lamb of God
> 
> 
> New Albums = _The End of Heartache_ and _As Daylight Dies_ and are more melodic metalcore.
> 
> If you liked these albums, may I suggest: Children of Bodom, In Flames (esp. the newer albums _Soundtrack to Your Escape_ and _Come Clarity_), Port Amoral, Avenged Sevenfold and Trivium.
> 
> If you liked either of these 'eras' for the band, you'd also probably like DevilDriver and Unearth. Also, pick up a copy of Roadrunner United: the All-Star Sessions. Read here for more details. It has an excellent variety of metal sub-genres on it, and is a a fantastic listen that you'll keep going back to - and many of the band I mentioned (including the newer Killswitch Engage vocalist) are featured on this album.
> 
> cheers,
> --N





I have one from both eras, "Alive or Just breathing", and "The End of Heartache". I like them both mostly. But I have them in the same playlist, and I don't play them that often so I've not noticed the difference! But I like Rose of Sharyn.

Of the top suggestions I've only heard one track and that's from Shadows Fall. But I don't even remember it. From the second list I have Children of Bodom (who are nearly too heavy for me to enjoy), I also have In Flames - Soundtrack to your Escape. But I really didn't like that. I put the CD on, and nothign really caught my attention . I have Avenged sevenfold, but I listened to them so much I got tired of them! And I've listened to Trivium...but I didn't like that either, too much screaming.

I've heard of DevilDriver and they sounded too heavy...Not heard of Unearth though...I've got the Roadrunner stuff but it as really hit and miss.

Most of my music is from my brother. Lots of his stuff was on his old laptop he gave me, so I don't really know much about the bands or when the album is from. Which is why I'm so clueless about all this stuff!


----------



## Fishbone

Roadrunner isn't hit or miss
Early catalog on Digipack:Rocks 
What they put out now: Dog crap(for the most part)
Its that simple.


----------



## Kurashu

Ferret, may I reccomend Fear Before The March of Flames' The Always Open Mouth. There's also Bless The Fall, All Else Failed, A Day To Remember,  Demon Hunter, Maylene and the Sons of Disaster, Protest The Hero, Scay Kids Scaring Kids, Thrice, Acid Bath.

I'm probably off on some of those...but it happens.


----------



## Ferret

I meant hit and miss as in whether I like them or not. It seemed like there were a lot of different styles in the album I have, some of which weren't to my tastes.

Also, Kurashu: I have Thrice stuff (but I never play it, not sure what its like) and I've heard of Protest the Hero, I think my sister has the CD. But I will look into the others! Cheers guys!

Edit:

I've bee sloping round on last.fm and I found some clips of the songs. Most of the stuff like Mastadon is the sort of metal I don't like. Particularly 'I am Ahab'. Unearth was more promising, I really liked some of the guitar work but I disliked the vocals (I only listened to The Chosen). Same problem with Lamb of God, I dislike the vocals (also the guitar stuff wasn't my thing). The Shadows Fall clips didn't sound too bad though, 'Destroyer of Senses', 'Thoughts without Words' and redemption. Its much closer but I didn't fall in love with it (like I did with megadeth and some classic Iron maiden). I think its the metalcore element I dislike.

In Flames didn't go down well either, Soilwork is however a band I like. I need to hear more of them I think....I didn't bother looking for Trivium (disliked) or Avenged sevenfold (liked but got tired of, may go back to that). Strangely though, I like some Children of Bodom stuff.

I'm going to look at the other recommendations tomorow sometime.

Thanks guys!


----------



## Kurashu

Last.Fm is probably one of the best sources to find music. However, my plugin hasn't been working lately. Shame.


----------



## Nyaricus

Fishbone said:
			
		

> Roadrunner isn't hit or miss
> Early catalog on Digipack:Rocks
> What they put out now: Dog crap(for the most part)
> Its that simple.



We were talking about the Roadrunner United project, not the label itself. What is so bad about it's recent releases, in your opinion, anyway? Just curious 

cheers,
--N


----------



## Nyaricus

Ferret said:
			
		

> I meant hit and miss as in whether I like them or not. It seemed like there were a lot of different styles in the album I have, some of which weren't to my tastes.
> 
> Also, Kurashu: I have Thrice stuff (but I never play it, not sure what its like) and I've heard of Protest the Hero, I think my sister has the CD. But I will look into the others! Cheers guys!
> 
> Edit:
> 
> I've bee sloping round on last.fm and I found some clips of the songs. Most of the stuff like Mastadon is the sort of metal I don't like. Particularly 'I am Ahab'. Unearth was more promising, I really liked some of the guitar work but I disliked the vocals (I only listened to The Chosen). Same problem with Lamb of God, I dislike the vocals (also the guitar stuff wasn't my thing). The Shadows Fall clips didn't sound too bad though, 'Destroyer of Senses', 'Thoughts without Words' and redemption. Its much closer but I didn't fall in love with it (like I did with megadeth and some classic Iron maiden). I think its the metalcore element I dislike.
> 
> In Flames didn't go down well either, Soilwork is however a band I like. I need to hear more of them I think....I didn't bother looking for Trivium (disliked) or Avenged sevenfold (liked but got tired of, may go back to that). Strangely though, I like some Children of Bodom stuff.
> 
> I'm going to look at the other recommendations tomorow sometime.
> 
> Thanks guys!



Mastodon - the first time I heard them, which was on the Unholy Alliance Tour with Slayer and Lamb of God, I **hated** them. I randomly picked up their album 'Blood Mountain' to test my musical tastes, and found myself enjoying a decent amount of stuff on it. Agreed that it takes a very specific type of ear to enjoy it.

Unearth - I have their two newest albums, neither of which has the track 'the Chosen' on it, so I can't vouch for that. However, their song 'Giles' is a great track, and a good history lesson to boot  Lie to Purify is another must-have by this band.

Lamb of God - too bad you didn't like 'em. They're likely my favourite band at this time  Their sound has changed a bit over time - could you throw out some track names you listened to at all? Maybe I can guide you a bit with some choices. Their earlier stuff in particular was not very well-polished at all.

Shadows Fall - fairly solid band here. Destroyer of Senses is actually my fav track by them, so good on you for snagging that one. I also really like 'Ghosts of Past Failures', which is another powerful track by them.

Trivium is *very* hit or miss (and they were terrible when I saw them live). I simply threw them out there to see if you'd dig them at all. Personal favs by them are: 'Rain', Pull Harder on the Strings of Your Martyr', 'Ignition' and 'Dying in Your Arms'. Other then those, they don't have much (I've personally found) which really sticks out.

Children of Bodom is pretty heavy (vocals-wise) but they have some awesome instruments. Anything from Follow the Reaper is *excellent* material by them, and by most of the people I've talked to about CoB, their best material they've put out.

cheers,
--N


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Been away for a while...

Friends, Shredders, Headbangers!  Can't we all just wear our denim & leather and not worry about whether someone considers a particular genre of hard rock is or isn't "metal?"

C'mon...

 *One Nation Over 11!*  

As for some of the latest bands...I still don't care for many of the newbies of the past 4 or 5 years.

I'm slowly, slowly, slowly warming up to Mastodon.

And I'm beginning to hear similarities between early Anthrax and Shadows Fall that had eluded me before- IOW, despite previous pans of them, I'm warming up to SF as well.

The twin guitarists of Dragon Force intrigue me- they have two very different styles.  Its like listening to a band with Yngwie Malmsteen and Steve Vai trading licks.

Wolfmother and Black Stone Cherry are pure 70's style hard rock throwbacks, as is Early Man.  The difference- the vocalists in the first 2 bands can stay on key consistently.


----------



## Nyaricus

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> I'm slowly, slowly, slowly warming up to Mastodon.



Do you have Blood Mountain? If so, what tracks are you liking on it?

cheers,
--N


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

I did buy that album, largely on the strength of "Colony of Birchmen", but I can't tell you exactly which tracks I'm enjoying because I'm listening to it in my car- and since I've been driving 2 60+ yr old women around a lot lately, I haven't had time to really get into it.  I usually don't look to see which track is playing to check its title or whatever, but I can say this:

While the instrumentals smack a bit of failed King Crimson pieces, I found "The Wolf is Loose" to be a solid opening track, with the next few keeping the energy pretty consistently, up to my fave ("Birchmen").


----------



## DungeonmasterCal

What people consider metal or hard rock is a very subjective opinion, so I try to just live and let live.  But the next person that calls Poison metal is gonna get....ahem..anyway.

Lately, I've really come to like bands like Edenbridge, Lacuna Coil, Stream of Passion, Nightwish, and several other bands in this vein.  Are they metal?  Who cares?  I dig 'em. I agree with Dannyalcatraz; One Nation Over 11! (man, I wish I'd thought of that).  

Crank.
It.
Up.

Whatever "it" might be to you!


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Poison is metal!

(Just kidding!)

The reason I started this thread was to see if my observations about my other metalhead buddies was true around the world.

You see, I have found that almost every metalhead I can name has some guilty pleasure that would get them ridiculed if their buddies knew about it.  I'm not just talking about our New Wave, Jazz, or Big Band stuff- which was no lesser _quality_ music than the metal we enjoyed- I'm talking about bands like the aforementioned Poison.  The truly glam-rock/metal bands of the late 1970s-early 1990s.

The first time I really noticed it was when I hanging out with a guy who loved Motorhead & JP, etc., but was also a big fan of Winger.  See, Kip Winger is actually a hell of a bass player who was mainly a highly demanded studio musician and...well he... :\ 

Then a buddy of mine who turned me on to bands like Rainbow & Yngwie started raving about Crimson Glory (think of Queensryche but with Costume Ball domino masks and lots of red spangles and rhinestones)...and others talked about White Lion and so forth.

Not like I had any reason to jeer, what with a complete collection of Europe's recordings...

The final impetus for this post came when I found out that another buddy of mine with a Masters in Jazz had once taught a class about the musical quality of Debbie Gibson.

(OK, so she's singing leads roles on Broadway now, so he knew his stuff, but C'MON!)


----------



## D.Shaffer

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> The final impetus for this post came when I found out that another buddy of mine with a Masters in Jazz had once taught a class about the musical quality of Debbie Gibson.
> 
> (OK, so she's singing leads roles on Broadway now, so he knew his stuff, but C'MON!)



...For what it's worth, as a teen I liked Debbie Gibson as well.  But that for qualities OTHER then her music.


----------



## Theron

For some reason, the direction this thread took somewhat reminds me of this story from The Onion:

Metal Council Convenes To Discuss 'Metal Hand Sign' Abuse


----------



## Fishbone

Hahaha, The Grand Elder Lemmy line is great.


----------



## ShinHakkaider

I should preface this by saying that I am by no stretch of the imagination a metalhead. 

However, back in JHS almost all of the guys that I played D&D with WERE metalheads so some of the music did rub off on me. 

I still have a decent amount of metal of my ipod, when I go running the playlist I used to get me amped conists mostly of Metallica (thier cover of THE PRINCE, Fight Fire with Fire, Battery, Blackened and Fade to Black) Anthrax (among the Living and Efilikufesin) and Iron Madien (Wasted Years and The Trooper). 

As for rock I have my old roomate Damon to thank for my Led Zepplin and Rush education. A lot of Led Zepplin on my ipod as well. Also some Lynyrd Skynyrd. Keep in mind I'm a black d00d from brooklyn who literally just heard Freebird for the first time while watching THE DEVIL'S REJECTS on Showtime and fell in love with the song. So that and Sweet Home Alabama are on my ipod as well. 

Also I'm a big Fishbone fan (Chim Chim's Badass Revenge gets constant play) and was just given a copy of Bad Brains I vs. that I havent listened to yet. 

Mostly I tend to listen to hip-hop (not the mainstream stuff that everyone seems to hate, but still listen too) and alot of dance music (because I used to club alot and still like to dance alot) but there are times where I get tired of listening to the same ol' same ol' or want to get amped, I listen to whatever metal I've got on my ipod.


----------



## Ferret

Nyaricus said:
			
		

> Mastodon - the first time I heard them, which was on the Unholy Alliance Tour with Slayer and Lamb of God, I **hated** them. I randomly picked up their album 'Blood Mountain' to test my musical tastes, and found myself enjoying a decent amount of stuff on it. Agreed that it takes a very specific type of ear to enjoy it.



I may have to find some other stuff then, if you liked some but not others of there stuff.



			
				Nyaricus said:
			
		

> Unearth - I have their two newest albums, neither of which has the track 'the Chosen' on it, so I can't vouch for that. However, their song 'Giles' is a great track, and a good history lesson to boot  Lie to Purify is another must-have by this band.



 There is a 30 second clip of 'the Chosen' Here. This is the only track I've heard. If I can get my hands on any more I may find I like them and buy some of there stuff.



			
				Nyaricus said:
			
		

> Lamb of God - too bad you didn't like 'em. They're likely my favourite band at this time  Their sound has changed a bit over time - could you throw out some track names you listened to at all? Maybe I can guide you a bit with some choices. Their earlier stuff in particular was not very well-polished at all.



 Again the only ones I heard were on last.fm...which were: Laid To Rest, Hourglass, Now You've Got Something To Die For, Omerta. Some of the guitar work was ok...but not all of it.



			
				Nyaricius said:
			
		

> Shadows Fall - fairly solid band here. Destroyer of Senses is actually my fav track by them, so good on you for snagging that one. I also really like 'Ghosts of Past Failures', which is another powerful track by them.



 I did only have one of there tracks, but it was quite good. Not sure what it was called though. I didn't snag anything these are all still on last.fm! I may buy a random album of theres though...



			
				Nyaricus said:
			
		

> Trivium is *very* hit or miss (and they were terrible when I saw them live). I simply threw them out there to see if you'd dig them at all. Personal favs by them are: 'Rain', Pull Harder on the Strings of Your Martyr', 'Ignition' and 'Dying in Your Arms'. Other then those, they don't have much (I've personally found) which really sticks out.



 They missed! I had a few friends who rave about them and I'm like 'Huh?!'. The Guitar isn't so bad but some of the vocals annoy me. Although I'm listening to some of the stuff (Dying in your arms is the only one) and its ok....I may look into that...



			
				Nyarcius said:
			
		

> Children of Bodom is pretty heavy (vocals-wise) but they have some awesome instruments. Anything from Follow the Reaper is *excellent* material by them, and by most of the people I've talked to about CoB, their best material they've put out.
> 
> cheers,
> --N




They are, yet I like them....Same with Killswitch. Some of there stuff is a bit heavier then I'd expect me to like...


Dannyalcatraz has reminded me I need to get my hands on some anthrax! Yeah! I like! I also really like Wolfmother, that makes me want to just sing along all day 

"Edenbridge, Lacuna Coil, Stream of Passion, Nightwish" I've had my Eye on some of those bands (heard some from Lacuna Coil) and liked it but it seemed a bit too quiet and reserved, I don't want to be rude but at times Dirge-like.

I'm trying to think of what else I listen to, but I can't think of much. if you want to see, check me out on last.fm  (am I allowed to post a link?)


----------



## Nyaricus

Ferret said:
			
		

> I may have to find some other stuff then, if you liked some but not others of there stuff.



Yeah. Also, their album Leviathan (the one before Blood Mountain) is supposed to be a bit of a hard listen (I don't own it, just what I've heard). Mastodon is definitely a progressive band, but at some times they are so beyond what I'm used to listening to that it's really hard to get into it. On 'Blood Mountain', I find the first 5 tracks are my favourites out of what I've listened to, but then I've not listened to the second half of the album much. Just keep listening - either it'll click or it won't.


			
				Ferret said:
			
		

> There is a 30 second clip of 'the Chosen' Here. This is the only track I've heard. If I can get my hands on any more I may find I like them and buy some of there stuff.



Hmmmm, that sounds like a fairly standard Unearth song. They tend to have a lot of forgettable tracks IMO. Know what, try the band God Forbid - they have waaaay more memorable tracks then Unearth anyway, and are a tight unit. Plus they have a big black guy singing, which is unique in metal (and he is a really good screamer). Personally, I think they have a similar sound to the old Killswitch Engage sound and Lamb of God - but that's juust me.



			
				Ferret said:
			
		

> Again the only ones I heard were on last.fm...which were: Laid To Rest, Hourglass, Now You've Got Something To Die For, Omerta. Some of the guitar work was ok...but not all of it.



Hmmmm. Laid to Rest is, in my opinion, one of their best tracks. Their old sound is heavier then what they have now, with harsher, less understandable vocals and with poorer guitarmanship. The one thing I could offer is: try their new album 'Sacrament', and see how that goes. Their guitar work is much more technical, even compared to their 'Ashes of the Wake'-era style (which is the album all of the songs you listened to are from) and is *really* good, and the vocals are a bit cleaner, and more easily decipherable. Their sound is more metalcore on the album, similar to the metalcore style on 'Alive or Just Breathing'/Killswitch Engage S/T-era KsE. Try it out, you might like it.



			
				Ferret said:
			
		

> I did only have one of there tracks, but it was quite good. Not sure what it was called though. I didn't snag anything these are all still on last.fm! I may buy a random album of theres though...



Try 'The Art of Balance'. Nary a song in sight you won't like if you like the Shadows Fall style (IMO, of course).



			
				Ferret said:
			
		

> They missed! I had a few friends who rave about them and I'm like 'Huh?!'. The Guitar isn't so bad but some of the vocals annoy me. Although I'm listening to some of the stuff (Dying in your arms is the only one) and its ok....I may look into that...



'Ascendancy' is a better album then 'The Crusade', if you ask me - but only slightly.



			
				Ferret said:
			
		

> They are, yet I like them....Same with Killswitch. Some of there stuff is a bit heavier then I'd expect me to like...



They are catchy, which has something to do with it. Power metal is awesome like that 



			
				Ferret said:
			
		

> "Edenbridge, Lacuna Coil, Stream of Passion, Nightwish" I've had my Eye on some of those bands (heard some from Lacuna Coil) and liked it but it seemed a bit too quiet and reserved, I don't want to be rude but at times Dirge-like.
> 
> I'm trying to think of what else I listen to, but I can't think of much. if you want to see, check me out on last.fm  (am I allowed to post a link?)



Sure, post a link.

As for Lacuna Coil and Nightwish, they definitely have an interesting sound, one that I'm a fan of. I'm not into much Gothic metal, but Lacuna Coil is awesome and has a decently competent male screamer. Nightwish is good symphonic metal, and I dig a few of their tracks.

If you're getting more into the power metal/symphonic metal, I can suggest quite a few bands along those lines as well. Gothic metal, I've not as well-versed in - but Evanescence is a good "poppy" gothic _rock_ style which I like as well. Plus, Amy Lee is _HAWT!!_ 

cheers,
--N


----------



## Ferret

Nyaricus said:
			
		

> Hmmmm, that sounds like a fairly standard Unearth song. They tend to have a lot of forgettable tracks IMO. Know what, try the band God Forbid - they have waaaay more memorable tracks then Unearth anyway, and are a tight unit. Plus they have a big black guy singing, which is unique in metal (and he is a really good screamer). Personally, I think they have a similar sound to the old Killswitch Engage sound and Lamb of God - but that's juust me.



 See I' mnot sure what the 'old sound' of Killswitch is. I do have some God Forbid tracks, not sure if I like them that much, but I don't dislike them enough to have deleted them. Which is a good sign!




			
				Nyarcius said:
			
		

> Hmmmm. Laid to Rest is, in my opinion, one of their best tracks. Their old sound is heavier then what they have now, with harsher, less understandable vocals and with poorer guitarmanship. The one thing I could offer is: try their new album 'Sacrament', and see how that goes. Their guitar work is much more technical, even compared to their 'Ashes of the Wake'-era style (which is the album all of the songs you listened to are from) and is *really* good, and the vocals are a bit cleaner, and more easily decipherable. Their sound is more metalcore on the album, similar to the metalcore style on 'Alive or Just Breathing'/Killswitch Engage S/T-era KsE. Try it out, you might like it.



 I may try and find some tracks off of friends but I don't think it would be worth me buying an album of theres... :\ 




> Try 'The Art of Balance'. Nary a song in sight you won't like if you like the Shadows Fall style (IMO, of course).



 I'll look for it, thanks 




> 'Ascendancy' is a better album then 'The Crusade', if you ask me - but only slightly.



 Ah but its all Trivium =p, nah I'll ask someone who listens to them lots for a peak at them.




> They are catchy, which has something to do with it. Power metal is awesome like that



 Power metal is awesome. Perion. \m/




> Sure, post a link.



http://www.last.fm/user/Pureferret/



> As for Lacuna Coil and Nightwish, they definitely have an interesting sound, one that I'm a fan of. I'm not into much Gothic metal, but Lacuna Coil is awesome and has a decently competent male screamer. Nightwish is good symphonic metal, and I dig a few of their tracks.
> 
> If you're getting more into the power metal/symphonic metal, I can suggest quite a few bands along those lines as well. Gothic metal, I've not as well-versed in - but Evanescence is a good "poppy" gothic _rock_ style which I like as well. Plus, Amy Lee is _HAWT!!_
> 
> cheers,
> --N




I know someone who would be into that sort of stuff, may be pinch a track or to from them. I am interested in them though, but whats symphonic metal?

Also, whilst we are somewhat in that direction...industrial anyone?


----------



## Nyaricus

Ferret said:
			
		

> See I'm not sure what the 'old sound' of Killswitch is. I do have some God Forbid tracks, not sure if I like them that much, but I don't dislike them enough to have deleted them. Which is a good sign!



Here's my view: Old Killswitch has a harsher, more powerful vocalist and is more 'thrashy' then the new version. The new Killswitch has a much more melodic feel to their songs, and largely they have lost their "edge" they had in their first two albums with the original vocalist. JMHO, of course.



			
				Ferret said:
			
		

> I know someone who would be into that sort of stuff, may be pinch a track or to from them. I am interested in them though, but whats symphonic metal?



Symphonic Metal is a sub-genre of metal stylized by a specific "symphonic" feel of the songs - keyboards are fairly prevalent in the genre, as well as clean vocals. Many bands try to give a symphonic sound to their songs - as if the band is being backed by a whole orchestra. In the recording process, some bands even do go to such a length.

Largely, this genre has a lot of overlap with power metal, but bands like Rhapsody are obviously power metal, while Nightwish (for example) has none of the power metal feel to it - it's purely a symphonic sound to their music. That's about all I can think of saying about this.



			
				Ferret said:
			
		

> Also, whilst we are somewhat in that direction...industrial anyone?



I'm actually just getting into industrial. I've always kinda dabbled in bands who they themselves have an 'industrial'-like feel to them (Crossbreed, Static-X, The Clay People, Rammstein, Spineshank), but I dated a girl back in December who introduced me to CombiChrist, :wumpscut:, Ministry, Skinny Puppy and some others, and I found myself especially liking :wumpscut: and CombiChrist. Ministry and Skinny Puppy I haven't even really listened to, lol. In any case, I have to say I'm rather liking this small smattering of industrial bands, and some of the industrial metal bands I listed (namely, Rammstein and Static-X, though both have a variety of other genre influences in their sound) count among my very favourite bands.

Yourself?

cheers,
--N


----------



## Kurashu

It's sad. I love Rammstein. Yet, my German teacher and my friend who went to Germany as an exchange student loathe them because of their lyrics. "All their songs are obscene." is their reasoning. However, the only song that ever gets brought up is "Du Hast", which is about a marriage. I could understand if they brought up songs like  "Du Reichst So Gut" or "Bueck Dich".

However, they totally ignore songs like "Rammstein", or "Amerika" which are about real issues or "Klavier", "Alter Mann", or "Spieluhr" which are just good songs. Not everything Rammstein does is to offend. They're no worse than any other metal band. If anything, they're probably tame compared to some of the metal that comes out of the German/Denmark/Scandinavian area. They jsut get a lot of crap because they're popular.

As for the whole symphonic thing, it's just another adjective to add to a genre. Kind of like tech or blackened. If you really wanted to, you could have Symphonic Blackened Tech Death Metal, which would probably be really good if done right; however, I have a feeling that SBTDM will never be done, at least well.


----------



## Nyaricus

Kurashu said:
			
		

> It's sad. I love Rammstein. Yet, my German teacher and my friend who went to Germany as an exchange student loathe them because of their lyrics. "All their songs are obscene." is their reasoning.
> 
> [snip]
> 
> If anything, they're probably tame compared to some of the metal that comes out of the German/Denmark/Scandinavian area. They just get a lot of crap because they're popular.



Yes, Rammstein's lyrics can be pretty immature (Spiel Mit Mir, anyone? - great song BTW) but they also have some great serious works. Stein Um Stein. Dahlia Lama. Spring. Reise Reise. Moskau. Ohne Dich. Angel. Those songs are all powerful, moving songs - and are all excellent in their own rights.

Speaking of "right" - you are definitely right that they are tame compared to some bands out of the Germano-Europe area, and are probably right that they get crapped on so much just because they are popular. 



			
				Kurashu said:
			
		

> As for the whole symphonic thing, it's just another adjective to add to a genre. Kind of like tech or blackened. If you really wanted to, you could have Symphonic Blackened Tech Death Metal, which would probably be really good if done right; however, I have a feeling that SBTDM will never be done, at least well.



I can't say I really agree with you with the statement, "it's just another adjective to add to a genre." Generally, bands are specifically seeking to add a symphonic feel to their music - bands that get really technical in their music get labelled as tech, or who verge on black metal can get labelled as a "blackened X metal" band - but if you're adding stuff like synths and keyboards, then you're definitely going out of your way to create that atmosphere.

BTW, I ris to your challenged of finding a good "symphonic blackened tech death metal" band with the following: Winds of Plague. Their Encyclopedia Mettalum page lists them as a "Symphonic Deathcore/Blackened Death Metal" band, but I have to say this: they actually sound *really* good. It's about as close to SBTDM as I can get, sorry 

And just when you thought everything was done, eh? 

cheers,
--N


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

> While the instrumentals smack a bit of failed King Crimson pieces, I found "The Wolf is Loose" to be a solid opening track, with the next few keeping the energy pretty consistently, up to my fave ("Birchmen").




That should have read:







> While the instrumentals smack a bit of failed _*Steve Vai*_ pieces, I found "The Wolf is Loose" to be a solid opening track, with the next few keeping the energy pretty consistently, up to my fave ("Birchmen").




I was listening to King Crimson at the time I wrote that comment.

(BTW: "Sleeping Giant" and "Hunters of the Sky" are pretty doggone cool.)

For those of you who like Static-X (as I do) and similar bands, check out Prong if you haven't already.  Yeah, the stuff's a decade+ old, but they (and Ministry) kind of defined the style.

And that mention of Bad Brains!  Wow- I had forgotten them!  They started the whole Black (guys) Rock/Metal band thing way back when...even before Living Colour.  And the bands that followed them and LC... 24-7 Spyz, Eye & I, Follow For Now, Fluid Foundation, Lucy Brown, Mother's Finest (so many were so short lived).


----------



## Theron

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> And that mention of Bad Brains!  Wow- I had forgotten them!  They started the whole Black (guys) Rock/Metal band thing way back when...even before Living Colour.  And the bands that followed them and LC... 24-7 Spyz, Eye & I, Follow For Now, Fluid Foundation, Lucy Brown, Mother's Finest (so many were so short lived).




Bad Brains basically created hardcore.  I love pointing that fact out to skinheads.


----------



## Ferret

Nyaricus said:
			
		

> Here's my view: Old Killswitch has a harsher, more powerful vocalist and is more 'thrashy' then the new version. The new Killswitch has a much more melodic feel to their songs, and largely they have lost their "edge" they had in their first two albums with the original vocalist. JMHO, of course.



 The problem arises when I tell you that I don't know what what Thrash or melodic actually are. I have a vague idea, but not really enough to imagin what the two sound like.




			
				Nyaricus said:
			
		

> Symphonic Metal is a sub-genre of metal stylized by a specific "symphonic" feel of the songs - keyboards are fairly prevalent in the genre, as well as clean vocals. Many bands try to give a symphonic sound to their songs - as if the band is being backed by a whole orchestra. In the recording process, some bands even do go to such a length.
> 
> Largely, this genre has a lot of overlap with power metal, but bands like Rhapsody are obviously power metal, while Nightwish (for example) has none of the power metal feel to it - it's purely a symphonic sound to their music. That's about all I can think of saying about this.



Hmmm, I'm liking the 'cleanness' part of it. I'll need to investigate this. Also the power metal overlap would suit me fine . Not so sure about the orchestral bit, as in how its fits in with the overal sound.




			
				Nyaricus said:
			
		

> I'm actually just getting into industrial. I've always kinda dabbled in bands who they themselves have an 'industrial'-like feel to them (Crossbreed, Static-X, The Clay People, Rammstein, Spineshank), but I dated a girl back in December who introduced me to CombiChrist, :wumpscut:, Ministry, Skinny Puppy and some others, and I found myself especially liking :wumpscut: and CombiChrist. Ministry and Skinny Puppy I haven't even really listened to, lol. In any case, I have to say I'm rather liking this small smattering of industrial bands, and some of the industrial metal bands I listed (namely, Rammstein and Static-X, though both have a variety of other genre influences in their sound) count among my very favourite bands.
> 
> Yourself?
> 
> cheers,
> --N



I'll be looking at all of those names...atm I've only heard one song properly, and that's 'Shut me up by Mindless Self Indulgence. Tell a lie, the same person who sent me that track sent me a Velvet Acid Christ track...I tihnk I liked it, but not as much as that one.


----------



## Kurashu

Nyaricus said:
			
		

> I can't say I really agree with you with the statement, "it's just another adjective to add to a genre." Generally, bands are specifically seeking to add a symphonic feel to their music - bands that get really technical in their music get labelled as tech, or who verge on black metal can get labelled as a "blackened X metal" band - but if you're adding stuff like synths and keyboards, then you're definitely going out of your way to create that atmosphere.




Ok, my phrasing was poor. I meant it wasn't a genre in and of itself, symphonic that is, and that it was a term used to describe a certain feel for an established genre of music. Like a subset, as you put it. Arcturus is black metal. But they also fit into the symphonic subset as well. Demilich is death metal. But they also fit into the techincal subset. However, I will offset this by saying that Tech/Math metal is a legit genre: Psyopus, Dillinger Escape Plan, The Number 12 Looks Like You, Meshuggah, and Ion Dissonance to name a few.



			
				Nyaricus said:
			
		

> BTW, I ris to your challenged of finding a good "symphonic blackened tech death metal" band with the following: Winds of Plague. Their Encyclopedia Mettalum page lists them as a "Symphonic Deathcore/Blackened Death Metal" band, but I have to say this: they actually sound *really* good. It's about as close to SBTDM as I can get, sorry
> 
> And just when you thought everything was done, eh?
> 
> cheers,
> --N




Awesome band. Good find.


----------



## Ferret

Tech/math metal? I've heard mesuggah before and I didn't like it...but its math metal now?


----------



## Kurashu

It's been called math metal for a while. Kind of like how's there's math rock. More often than not it's called Mathcore. Happens.

But you know what, regardless of what it's called, it makes for a great Pre-Calc Presentation.

Edit:
Also, Meshuggah is a lot different from the other bands I listed there. They have some things in common, but they sound entirely different.


----------



## Ferret

Oh I've heard of Math Rock, I was just wondering what about the sound makes it Math Metal. I don't think I meant to put no on there. I've read about MathX bands(Math Mock or Math Metal etc) but I couldn't link the bands I heard.....

But looking at the list on Wiki I saw SikTh, which I really like!

Oh, I've also started listening to Mudvayne and Soilwork!


----------



## Nyaricus

Ferret said:
			
		

> The problem arises when I tell you that I don't know what what Thrash or melodic actually are. I have a vague idea, but not really enough to imagin what the two sound like.



My best advice: just listen to a bunch of both. The site www.metal-archives.com can help you in that direction. Click on "Bands by Genre", and look under the different genre headings - many bands now have MySpace pages which you can listen to their music for free - and the Metal Archive site listed above will likely have any of the abdns MySpace pages linked on thier info page. Just listen and listen and listen and listen and find stuff you like from it. 



			
				Ferret said:
			
		

> Hmmm, I'm liking the 'cleanness' part of it. I'll need to investigate this. Also the power metal overlap would suit me fine . Not so sure about the orchestral bit, as in how its fits in with the overal sound.



The thing about most symphonic metal is that it is easily mixed with other genres - as *Kurashu* says below, there are bands which mix black metal (which you likely wouldn't like based on what you do) and other disparate genres. 

Hint: Seach under "power/thrash" in the genres on that metal archive site, and then hit ctrl+f on your keyboard. This will open the "Find" window in your brower. Type in "symphonic" and hit next, checking out each new band it highlights along the way. Firefox (and, I suppose, the new version of IE) is brilliant with it's tabbed browsing - just click on the bands, save them all in a folder labeled "Power/Symphonic Metal" and check it as as you wish. The Metal Archives has thousands of bands to check out, so you have plenty of selection.



			
				Ferret said:
			
		

> I'll be looking at all of those names...atm I've only heard one song properly, and that's 'Shut me up by Mindless Self Indulgence. Tell a lie, the same person who sent me that track sent me a Velvet Acid Christ track...I tihnk I liked it, but not as much as that one.



I don't really care for MSI - they are kinda crazy. But *do* check out those bands I've listed. Some great stuff in them.



			
				Kurashu said:
			
		

> Ok, my phrasing was poor. I meant it wasn't a genre in and of itself, symphonic that is, and that it was a term used to describe a certain feel for an established genre of music. Like a subset, as you put it. Arcturus is black metal. But they also fit into the symphonic subset as well. Demilich is death metal. But they also fit into the techincal subset. However, I will offset this by saying that Tech/Math metal is a legit genre: Psyopus, Dillinger Escape Plan, The Number 12 Looks Like You, Meshuggah, and Ion Dissonance to name a few.



TTTO  No hard feelings.



			
				Kurashu said:
			
		

> Awesome band. Good find.



I agree! I'm going to be ordering their cd when it comes out!

cheers,
--N

P.S. 

*Danny*,

'Sleeping Giant' reminds me, in a way, of "Global Warming" by Gojira - which is funny because press in Europe has deemed Gojira the "French Mastodon" lol

cheers,
--N


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

I can understand the Gojira/Mastodon comparison...though I think they're also a little bit like Godflesh.

So far, I like Gojira just a bit better than Mastodon.

As for Godflesh, I was sorry to see them break up, but I do like Broadrick's new band, Jesu.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

I love Helmet, but their last 2 albums have lacked something.  Paige's voice seems a bit different from his earlier stuff, and they don't seem quite as...complex...as they used to.  Don't know why.

Lacuna Coil- good band- reminds me of Evanescence (for obvious reasons).


----------



## Nyaricus

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> I can understand the Gojira/Mastodon comparison...though I think they're also a little bit like Godflesh.
> 
> So far, I like Gojira just a bit better than Mastodon.
> 
> As for Godflesh, I was sorry to see them break up, but I do like Broadrick's new band, Jesu.



Godflesh, eh? Haven't heard of them.... *will look up soon*

And yeah, I'm digging Gojira more then Mastodon myself. Last week I bought 5 CDs, got a late b-day present CD and my buddy bought a CD - and that was just Friday! Among the ones I bought was the Gojira CD 'The Link', which is excellent in my opinion. Mixes up a variety of metal sub-genres but the amazing chugga-chugga-chugga sound is simply drool-inducing 

Also bought a Daath CD today. I'm really enjoying it. Mixes industrial metal, death and dare I say a dash of groove into one tasty mix. Vocals reminds me of the guy from Amon Amarth (which is a viking-themed death metal band everyone here should have heard of already, right? Right. ).

cheers,
--N


----------



## Nyaricus

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> Lacuna Coil- good band- reminds me of Evanescence (for obvious reasons).



Agreed. On all fronts 

I have 'Comalies' by Lacuna Coil - is there anything else you (or others) can recommend by them?

cheers,
--N


----------



## Kurashu

On the Lacuna Coil/Evanescence comparison, I'll take Lacuna Coil over Evanescence anyday, despite Evanescence's drummer being from Living Sacrifice.

Also, something interesting, if you look at the label Living Sacrifice was on when they broke up, for a while, every band on there had an ex-member of Living Sacifice in it. However, I think Norma Jean is the only one that has one now (Corey, their singer played guitar I believe). I'm pretty sue Comeback Kid and Figure Four have one as well, but they're both on Victory.


----------



## Ferret

Its odd how band members drift off and join other bands, or don't.....

Is anyone else looking forward to United Abominations?


----------



## BOZ

Ferret said:
			
		

> Its odd how band members drift off and join other bands, or don't.....




been doing it since forever - look how many bands Eric Clapton was in.  it's tradition to be flighty as an artist.


----------



## Ferret

Now, please don't kill me...but I fear I'm too young to know about this Clapton. I've heard his song Layla, its damn good. But I don't know much esle.


----------



## Kurashu

You haven't heard of Eric Clapton, the man who snorted his own father's ashes?!

I can't name a single thing he's done, but at least I've heard of the man!

What is the generation coming too?


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

> You haven't heard of Eric Clapton, the man who snorted his own father's ashes?!




That was Keith Richards, of Rolling Stones fame- and it was a (lame) joke on his part.

EC has a long solo career, was the guitarist in Cream, and was one of 3 legendary guitarists in the Yardbirds (along with Jeff Beck and Jimmy Page).

Currently, he's doing whatever he wants- playing on albums with _his_ idols & mentors like B.B. King & J.J. Cale; sponsoring big music festivals (Crossroads), and whatever befits rock royalty.

Essential songs would include: "Layla" "Cocaine" "Sunshine of your love" and "White Room" among many, many others.


----------



## Ferret

I heard he said something like "I was close enough [physically] to snort it" People thought he meant he was close to snorting it....as in he was about to but didn't.


----------



## FreeXenon

Def Leppard, AC/DC, Bon Jovi, Poison, Kenny G, Jeff Healy, Pat Benetar, Trans-Siberian Orchestra, Aerosmith, Creed, Evanescence, Nickleback, Guns and Roses, Metallica (Black), Madonna, Pearl Jam, Queen, Scorpians, White Snake

I've seen Def Leppard twice, and Bon Jovi and TSO once.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Nah..."Keef" said he and his dad were so close that he snorted his ashes...as in they were good buddies, soulmates, etc. that he snorted the cremains to maintain that closeness, in jest of his well-documented history of drug abuse.


----------



## Kurashu

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> That was Keith Richards, of Rolling Stones fame- and it was a (lame) joke on his part.
> 
> EC has a long solo career, was the guitarist in Cream, and was one of 3 legendary guitarists in the Yardbirds (along with Jeff Beck and Jimmy Page).
> 
> Currently, he's doing whatever he wants- playing on albums with _his_ idols & mentors like B.B. King & J.J. Cale; sponsoring big music festivals (Crossroads), and whatever befits rock royalty.
> 
> Essential songs would include: "Layla" "Cocaine" "Sunshine of your love" and "White Room" among many, many others.





SEE! I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT!


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Ask your elders...or Elder Gods   - even though its not "metal" probably the majority of today's generation's pro guitarists have great respect for Clapton, if not outright worship the man.  (The same could be said of his contemporaries, as well.)

I dare say that had Jimi Hendrix not existed, Clapton would be the one rock guitarist everyone knows.

He's not the fastest.  He's not the flashiest.  He's not the heaviest.  He just simply plays great guitar 100% of the time.


----------



## papastebu

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> He's not the fastest.  He's not the flashiest.  He's not the heaviest.  He just simply plays great guitar 100% of the time.




"Slowhand".

And yes, he is a major undercurrent in music, as far as guitarists are concerned. I've had guys tell me they hated Eric Clapton, but they damn sure know who he is, then, don't they? My dad even knows about him, and his entire 32~ year career was spent in country/western music and the old crooner-type songs.
Really, for me, if the guitarist is good, then any kind of music the band plays is alright. Sometimes, though, it's all about what part of a song catches my ear on that listen. If I'm into lyrics right then, and they're not talkin' to me, then I move on. Same thing for bass, vocals, or tempo. Very rarely a drum solo or keyboard/piano riff will get me.
I think that's one of the main reasons I don't play professionally. I'm too ecclectic, and I listen more than I play. I get so into what I'm hearing, sometimes, that actually keeping with the song I'm playing is too hard. :\


----------



## BOZ

Ferret said:
			
		

> Now, please don't kill me...but I fear I'm too young to know about this Clapton.




that's no excuse.  

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Clapton


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

OK, youngsters...

Other bands/artists you should know because of the direct impact they had on hard rock:

Black Sabbath
Deep Purple
Rush
Led Zeppelin
ZZ Top
Budgie
Queen
Iron Maiden
Ynqwie J. Malmsteen

Less obvious ones would include:

Django Reinhardt: even with 2 damaged fingers on his fretting hand, he managed to play some awesome jazz guitar licks.  Without him, we wouldn't have Heavy Metal as we know it.  Why?  Because it is his life story that kept Tony Iommi from giving up guitar after slicing off the tips off of 2 fingers on _his_ fretting hand, and as we all know, TI is the guitarist for Black Sabbath, the band that started true heavy metal.

Metal Church: contemporaries of Anthrax, Metallica and Megadeth, they are often forgotten masters of early speed metal- they would be the 4th of the "Four Horsemen" as some called those bands. They're still around. The original lead singer left, and formed a band called Reverend (which was pretty cool too).

Testament: one of the later bands in the speed metal movement, and a major launching pad for guitar wizard Alex Skolnick (Satriani protege and jazz fusion experimenter).  Their music is/was as intense as anyone else's.

Shawn Lane: a guitar phenom at 16, he mastered country, rock & jazz before his untimely death just a couple of years ago.

Al DiMeola: legendarily fast jazz/rock fusion guitarist, could trade licks with YJM without blinking.  Some of his stuff is pure shred- "Race With the Devil along a Spanish Highway"

Dick Dale: The king of surf guitar, one of the first true shredders in rock history.  Faster and more aggressive than any other guitarist of his era, if it weren't for him, speed metal guitarists wouldn't have had anything to shoot for.  If you've watched Pulp Fiction, you've heard his work.


----------



## Ferret

How much am I supposed to know about these guys/bands?

Black Sabbath - Liked some of the songs, like war pigs, paranoid and the one about the jet fighters
Deep Purple - Who? (I have heard of them)
Rush - Who?
Led Zeppelin - They are great, but I'm not that big of a fan
ZZ Top - Have 'Tush' but not heard anything else...
Budgie - Who?
Queen - Who? Kidding! They are AWESOME.
Iron Maiden - Also awesome, but not keen on the new album.
Ynqwie J. Malmsteen - Have one track but I seriously want to get more.

Hows that?


----------



## Kurashu

You've seriously don't know about Rush?

They're probably the three most talented people with their instruments. I just have Chronicles and I know I'm missing out on so much.

Canada has given the world some great stuff, maple syrup...and uhh...maple syrup, but Rush. Rush is just so good.

Deep Purple, if I'm remember right (probably not because I'm still in musical mode), is the band that wrote Smoke on the Water, and now every guitarist plays that one riff in the song. It's probably the one riff more wide spread than Stairway to Heaven.

Led's pretty good.

AC/DC is too.


----------



## papastebu

Anybody ever listen to Bela Fleck and the Flecktones?
This stuff is like the best blues/jazz/rock/metal fusion on a BANJO that I've ever heard. The only, really.
Then there's Futureman, with his drummitar. Amazing.
Django Reinhardt was extremely inspiring. What about Charlie Christian? IIRC, he was one of the first people to do lead guitar, playing the guitar like a solo instrument, instead of the rhythm instrument it usually was. He was around hornsmen and woodwinders all the time, and was occasionally asked to fill in during their breaks for live radio shows, and so lead guitar was born.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

> Black Sabbath - Liked some of the songs, like war pigs, paranoid and the one about the jet fighters
> Deep Purple - Who? (I have heard of them)
> Rush - Who?
> Led Zeppelin - They are great, but I'm not that big of a fan
> ZZ Top - Have 'Tush' but not heard anything else...
> Budgie - Who?
> Queen - Who? Kidding! They are AWESOME.
> Iron Maiden - Also awesome, but not keen on the new album.
> Ynqwie J. Malmsteen - Have one track but I seriously want to get more.




OK...breathe...breathe...[grumpyoldman]_WHIPPERSNAPPER!_[/grumpyoldman]

 
Black Sabbath is the band that invented true heavy metal.  I'm not saying buy everything they ever did (though I did), or like everything they ever did (I don't), but their influence is heard today even in the new bands, some more than others.  Earth, Corrosion of Conformity, Kyuss...almost any of the black/death metal bands out of northern Europe...all owe them a great debt.  Then there's all that interrelation thing: BS has had 4 full time vocalists- Ozzy Osbourne (you know his solo career & TV show, right?), Ronnie James Dio (Elf, Rainbow, Dio), Ian Gillen (Deep Purple) & Tony Martin, and the album "Seventh Star was recorded and toured with by Glen Hughes & Geoff Nicholls.  Ray Gillen was briefly in the band, but his vox were replaced on Eternal Idol by those of Tony Martin, which would have been RG's first with the band.  It sounds like you've heard the Ozzy stuff, the Ian Gillen album, Born Again, has some of the wickedest stuff they ever recorded, and Dio's era is no less classic than Ozzy's.  In fact, there's a collection of the best from the Dio era out right now, including 3 new songs.  Geezer Butler, the bass player, had a stint with his more modern metal band called GZR, and Tony Iommi has recorded some solo stuff as well.  Like Carlos Santana, Iommi did his first true solo album (ignoring Black Sabbath's Seventh Star) with a varied band that included a new vocalist on each track, including the likes of Henry Rollins, Serj Tankian, Dave Grohl, Billy Corgan, Peter Steele, Ian Astbury, Brian May, Skin, and even Ozzy. (The second solo album is mediocre, though.)

Deep Purple, along with Led Zep & Black Sab were the bands that really shaped early hard rock into what we hear today, and their classic lineup featured the acid-rock keyboards of John Lord, the skyrocketing vocals of Ian Gillen, and the classically informed guitar work of Ritchie Blackmore.  David Coverdale (Whitesnake, Coverdale/Page) also recorded with this band.

Rush is the hypertalented power trio from Canada.  Each player- Geddy Lee (Bass, Keyboards & Vox), Neil Peart (Drums, Percussion), and Alex Lifeson (Guitar)- is a legend on their chosen instrument.  Originally just another hard rock band, they lifted a page from prog rock legends Yes and started writing intelligent lyrics with pyrotechnic music to go along with it.

Budgie is a Welsh (I believe) power trio that never broke big, but their music influenced countless bands.  Unlike contemporaries like Rush, they never bought into the prog-rock vibe, but stayed more psychedelic...a rock style that was pretty much dying when they came along.  You've probably heard their work covered by someone else, like Metallica's version of Breadfan.

BTW, I forgot to mention them, but they're no less important...you have heard of Judas Priest?


----------



## Ferret

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> OK...breathe...breathe...[grumpyoldman]_WHIPPERSNAPPER!_[/grumpyoldman]



Hahaha, yeah 




			
				Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> Black Sabbath is the band that invented true heavy metal.  I'm not saying buy everything they ever did (though I did), or like everything they ever did (I don't), but their influence is heard today even in the new bands, some more than others.  Earth, Corrosion of Conformity, Kyuss...almost any of the black/death metal bands out of northern Europe...all owe them a great debt.  Then there's all that interrelation thing: BS has had 4 full time vocalists- Ozzy Osbourne (you know his solo career & TV show, right?), Ronnie James Dio (Elf, Rainbow, Dio), Ian Gillen (Deep Purple) & Tony Martin, and the album "Seventh Star was recorded and toured with by Glen Hughes & Geoff Nicholls.  Ray Gillen was briefly in the band, but his vox were replaced on Eternal Idol by those of Tony Martin, which would have been RG's first with the band.  It sounds like you've heard the Ozzy stuff, the Ian Gillen album, Born Again, has some of the wickedest stuff they ever recorded, and Dio's era is no less classic than Ozzy's.  In fact, there's a collection of the best from the Dio era out right now, including 3 new songs.  Geezer Butler, the bass player, had a stint with his more modern metal band called GZR, and Tony Iommi has recorded some solo stuff as well.  Like Carlos Santana, Iommi did his first true solo album (ignoring Black Sabbath's Seventh Star) with a varied band that included a new vocalist on each track, including the likes of Henry Rollins, Serj Tankian, Dave Grohl, Billy Corgan, Peter Steele, Ian Astbury, Brian May, Skin, and even Ozzy. (The second solo album is mediocre, though.)




I once downloaded every one of there songs, but they all got lost due to a hard ware crash. Too much at one though I think. I wasn't a big fan of stuff like Fairies Wear Boots (?) but I liked Sweetleaf. The problem was I might like the music, but that doesn't mean I want to listen to it. I like lots of stuff on the radio, but I'd never buy Mika's album, or the black eyed pea's... I just found a discography: Hand of doom, Iron man, Never Say Die, Johnny Blade, I won't cry for you. Problem is that I heard these tracks so long ago I either don't remember what they sound like of I do but I don't know which ones those are.... I read up on the group when I was trying them out....Lots of crazy stuff happened and it was quite sad, didn't one of ozzys friends die just as he came back off of drugs, and he wrote an album for him but it didn't do well? I do realise how influential Black Sabbath were, but I'm not a black/death metal fan so I don't hear 'their sound' too often



			
				Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> Deep Purple, along with Led Zep & Black Sab were the bands that really shaped early hard rock into what we hear today, and their classic lineup featured the acid-rock keyboards of John Lord, the skyrocketing vocals of Ian Gillen, and the classically informed guitar work of Ritchie Blackmore.  David Coverdale (Whitesnake, Coverdale/Page) also recorded with this band.



 I've never gotten in to them. Never occured to me that I might like them...The only part of Smoke On The Water I like is the bass line. =/



			
				Dannyalcateaz said:
			
		

> Rush is the hypertalented power trio from Canada.  Each player- Geddy Lee (Bass, Keyboards & Vox), Neil Peart (Drums, Percussion), and Alex Lifeson (Guitar)- is a legend on their chosen instrument.  Originally just another hard rock band, they lifted a page from prog rock legends Yes and started writing intelligent lyrics with pyrotechnic music to go along with it.
> 
> Budgie is a Welsh (I believe) power trio that never broke big, but their music influenced countless bands.  Unlike contemporaries like Rush, they never bought into the prog-rock vibe, but stayed more psychedelic...a rock style that was pretty much dying when they came along.  You've probably heard their work covered by someone else, like Metallica's version of Breadfan.



 Not heard of either...wait I might have had a song by them on a comp' album called "The best heavy metal album II". But I didn't liek them, I'll just go see what they were...I can't find them.



			
				Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> BTW, I forgot to mention them, but they're no less important...you have heard of Judas Priest?




Uh, yeah! Not enough though. I think I like them. I've only heard Breaking the law properly though.

Now are there any songs from these I should hear? Not jsut their best but sides I haven't heard that youthink I should, like from Black sabbaths era where Ozy wasn't with them....?


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Songs by those bands you should hear (not exhaustive):

Black Sabbath sans Ozzy: Disturbing the Priest, Trashed, & Zero the Hero (with Ian Gillen); Neon Knights, Mob Rules, Voodoo, Falling off the edge of the World, Heaven & Hell, TV Crimes (with Dio); Eternal Idol, Nightmare, Ancient Warrior, Black Moon, Headless Cross (with Tony Martin).

Deep Purple: Speed King, Child in Time, Highway Star, My Woman from Tokyo, Space Truckin', Stormbringer, Burn, Perfect Strangers, Knocking at your Back Door.

Rush: 2112 (entire album), Trees, La Villa Strangiato, YYZ, Red Barchetta, Distant Early Warning, The Body Electric, Bastille Day, Xanadu, Cygnus X-1, By-Tor and the Snow Dog, The Spirit of Radio, Jacob's Ladder, Free Will, Natural Science, New World Man, Countdown, The Stars Look Down

Budgie: Breadfan, Hot as a Dockers Armpit, Nude Descending Parachutist Woman, Guts, Homicidal Suicidal, Stranded, In for the Kill, Crash Course in Brain Surgery, Melt the Ice Away.

PS: I just found out that Budgie was still releasing studio albums as of 2005!  I seemed to have missed a few!

Judas Priest: Breaking the Law, Bloodstone, You've Got Another Thing Comin', Electric Eye, Pain and Pleasure, Fever, Freewheel Burning, The Sentinel, Livin after Midnight, Hell Bent For Leather, Green Manalishi (With The Two-Prong Crown), Painkiller, Rocka Rolla, Caviar & Meths, Never Satisfied, Victim of Changes, The Ripper


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Just FYI:

VH-1 Classic is airing Metal Mania _right now_- a collection of hard rock/metal songs from the 1980s-90s- and this episode is starting with The Scorpions' "Still Loving You"


----------



## Ferret

It would be nice if I had VH-1 then =p

I'll try and find some of those songs! Mark my words!


----------



## Moulin Rogue

If you like Queen, you should check out yet another British group that hit the scene at the very beginning of the '70s - Uriah Heep. I've never read a reliable source that says Uriah Heep influenced Queen, but it's easy to listen to Heep and THINK they did, because Uriah Heep came a little earlier and they used some operatic vocal harmonies in their music.

But beyond that, they delved into the "fantasy" genre with their lyrics more than other bands around at the time. There was a little bit of this around anyway (Sabbath's "The Wizard", Zep's Tolkein references in "Ramble On" and later with "Battle Of Evermore") but Heep went furthest yet with lyrics about wizards and magic and stuff. Their debut album is definitely heavy by 1970 standards. They are actually still around but have had many, many, many lineup changes throughout the years.

Some Uriah Heep songs to check out, all from 1970-72: Gypsy, Dreammare, Bird Of Prey, Lady In Black, Look At Yourself, Tears In My Eyes, The Wizard, Easy Livin', Rainbow Demon, Sunrise, The Magician's Birthday.

So if you're familiar with Black Sabbath, Led Zeppelin, Deep Purple, Budgie and Uriah Heep I would say you've got the "first generation" of heavy metal (early '70s) all covered. It's probably worth noting that all the bands in that list are from the UK. Americans at this time were more "hard rock" like Grand Funk Railroad, Alice Cooper... the US caught on to Led Zeppelin real quick because Zeppelin was very bluesy and mostly sang about familiar rock n' roll stuff. I'd say early heavy metal is defineably "British" with all their crumbling medieval castles and the gloomy climate and so on - the US took a little while to capture that medieval dark aspect.

The first American band to really sound "metal" was Blue Oyster Cult (yes, they of "Don't Fear The Reaper" and 'needs more cowbell' fame). THAT song is not very heavy but they did other songs that are.... their 1972 debut album includes the Sabbath-y song "On Flame With Rock And Roll", so I thought I should mention them here as well.


----------



## Kurashu

Ok, I've been looking for some good black metal bands to start with. Any suggestions?


----------



## Thunderfoot

Hey Danny, sit down for a while, I've got this. 

Okay kiddies, Thunderfoot is not my name due to some sort of strange dwarven character I played, it was handed down as my street name because of my feet (Duh) as I played double bass - yes I am a drummer.  So sit back and take notes, you may want to grab a soda/beer/blood and possibly something that will clog your arteries, I hear live bat is good.

Let's start with the very basics, some vocabulary - 

"Heavy Metal" was coined in the song _Born to Be Wild_ by Steppenwolf. The song intended to point the phrasing to motorcycles, but some how got applied to the heavy rock sound (for at the time it WAS heavy) of the song and started a new wave of music in Britain and America.

"Wearing the Leather(s)" - Rob Halford of Judas Priest is the first known metalhead to wear leather.  At the time his homosexuality was buried and known only to a few close associates, in the male homosexual scene, bondage was all the rage in the mid to late 70s.  When Halford began to wear his bondage gear on stage, the look took off, accompanied by their breakout hit _Hell Bent For Leather_, a fashion movement was formed.

"Hard Rock" - The more melodic younger brother of Heavy Metal.  Hard rock was the original term coined for the eventual 'heavy rock' movement.  Hard rock is any music with loud distorted guitars, big drums, heavy flat line bass, but a more melodic spin on the music to include keyboards, light distintive vocals and harmoized guitar parts.  There are several genres within or related to hard rock such as Arena Rock, Hair Metal, Pop Metal and Progressive Pop (qv below).  Artists that have fallen into this category over the years include but are not limited to:  Aerosmith, AC/DC, Alice Cooper, Asia, Boston, Cream, Foghat, GTR, Journey, KISS, Queen, Rush, Styx, Triumph, Van Halen, Vixen, Whitesnake, Yes, Zebra

"Arena Rock" - Hard Rock style popular between the late 70s and mid 80s, so named because the stage shows were so large they could only be performed in arenas.  Concerts usually included extended guitar solos, drum solos, keyboard solos and even bass solos.  Often times the crowd is encouraged to sing along and pyrotechnical and laser displays are the norm.  Alice Cooper and KISS set the bar high with their early theatrical shows so many groups later had to come up with new and inovative ways to draw in the crowds.  The best arenas show artists as reviewed in a tone of resources included (but are not limited to) AC/DC, Foreigner, Journey, Motley Crew, Rush, Scorpions, Styx, Triumph, Van Halen, and ZZ Top.

"Hair Metal/Pop Metal" - As Heavy Metal progressed through the 80s the later period saw a reprise of the 70s glam rock style invade the leather look of Britian.  If leather was homo-erotic than wearing ladies lingere was even more so.  Began in American in the New York club scene by veteran rockers Twisted Sister, Dee Snyder is quoted as saying, "our wives and girlfirends would do our make-up and hair and we would shop for clothing in the 'oh my god I'm fat' ladies departments."  The look and sound was orginally fresh and cutting edge, but by the downfall of metal to the grunge era of the 90s, the 'Pop Metal" tag, where bands were engineered by producers and image consultants, started to water down and over use the 'power ballad'.  Bands include (you know the rest): Aerosmith, Bon Jovi, Def Leppard, Dokken, Guns n' Roses, Kix, Motley Crew, Poison, Quiet Riot, Stryper, Trixter, Vixen, and Warrant.

"Progressive Pop/Rock/Metal" - This group of music is the most hard to define, while the hard edge is there, the musicianship of the individual players often times presses the very envelope of known music.  Often times a band in this category will achieve commercial success with a single song or series of songs gaining new 'fans' only to have those same 'fans' disappear when they play their other selections.  The lyrics are often deep in meaning, touching on political and social aspects that popular music shies away from.  Groups that live here are: Black Sabbath (with Ronnie James Dio), Cream, Dream Theater, Emerson Lake and Palmer (Powell) or ELP, Kansas, Kings X, Rainbow (with Ronnie James Dio), Rush, Yngwie Malmsteen, Frank Zappa and Zebra.

"Death Metal/Black Metal" - Music form originating in the mid 80s as a result of the constant right wing protest groups touting Satanic influence of Heavy Metal music.  Originally this music was musically no different than 'traditional' metal but used more minor keys and dimished chord progressions, as the style progressed the vocals became less pronounced and more of a 'growl' than a true metal 'scream'.  Bands are not limited to the following: Black Angel, Corrosion of Conformity, Deth, Embalmed, GWAR, King Diamond, Rancid, Slayer, Voivod, and Witchblade.

"Speed Metal/Thrash" Speed metal was all about the speed baby, it wasn't enough to be loud and hard, you had to push 250 beats per minute (bpm). The music was noted by its all out assualt on the eardrums by 68th note guitar licks, quadruple triplets on the drums and a steady 'dubba-dubba" stroked on the bass.  vocals ranged from audible to mindless gibberish sometimes melodically sang and other times just yelled and squalled.  Thrash was the fusing of this new speed mentality with eneregy of punk infusing it with odd times, sudden breaks and other farsical but musically appealing techniques.  Bands of note include: Anthrax, Megadeath, The Misfits, Motorhead, and the granddaddies of the genre Metallica (Please note that this was before the _And Justice For ALL_ album when they became "ALTERNNICA.")

"Christian Metal" - the musical answer to the 'death metal' scene.  Infused with positive lyrics and a message of salvation, this alternative to doom and gloom was looked upon by the 'true metal' community as a moronic step-child, however, just as metal asked to keep an open mind, further listening reveals many of these groups were quite talented.  The "CM" tag actually spanned all of the known accepted forms of metal described above so you could literally find the positive equivallent to anything you may find aurally pleasing.  Bands are listed with appropriate style behind name in parenths: Angelica (Progressive.Pop), Bloodgood (Hard Rock), Bride (Hard Rock/Arena), Holy Soldier (Hair/Arena), Jet Circus (Arena/Progressive), Mana (Hard Rock/Arena), Shout (Arena), Stryper (Hair/Pop/Arena), Tourniquet (Speed/Thrash), Throne (White/Black/), and Xalt (Arena/Pop)

That's enough for now.  Next time we'll go over history and they way the music progressed to fit movements, social policy and economic status during the Cold War.


----------



## Nyaricus

Kurashu said:
			
		

> Ok, I've been looking for some good black metal bands to start with. Any suggestions?





Do I!

Here's the thing: there is a big difference in the sound of "troo" black metal and it's more popular bands. True black metal is distinguished by it's raw production, and has a bleak and angry feeling to it, whereas most of BM's popular bands (Cradle of Filth and Dimmu Borgir pop to mind) have a very different sound.

Nargaroth - this is a german BM band, and I have to say that their album _Black Metal Ist Krieg (A Dedicated Monument)_ is a fantastic piece of work. It features a compilation of covers and original work all about BM, and has a fantasic flow to it all. Recommended Tracks:  'Amarok - Zorn Des Lammes III', 'Pisen Pro Satana (Root cover)', 'I Burn For You (Lord Foul cover)'.

Burzum - this is Varg Vikernes' band. He's the guy that killed Euronymous, guitar player for Mayhem, which is argueably BM's most infamous band. While the man himself is obviously not a nice guy, I've listened to a variety of his work, and it's amazing what he's done. May I suggest the album _Hvis Lyset Tar Oss_, which opens with the epic 14 minute long tack 'Det Som En Gang Var', an amazing mix of synth, guitars and keyboards. Did I mention Varg plays all of his own instruments?

Gorgoroth - while I can't call myself a raving fanatic about this band, I do have the album 'Under the Sign of Hell' and I can say it's a solid piece of BM work, with some decent tracks like 'Krig' (a personal favourite of mine), 'Blood Stains the Circle' and 'The Rite of Infernal Invocation'.

Impaled Nazarene - the one album I have by them, 'Suomi Finland Perkele', has a few solid tracks as well, though I'd recommend Nargorath or Gorgoroth over this one. Tracks of note: 'Let's ing Die', 'The Oath of the Goat', and 'Blood is Thicker than Water'.

------

As for the more popular bands of the genre, Cradle of Filth is not only one of my favourite bands, but they are also BM; thus I can say a lot about them.

CoF has greatly changed their sound over the years. They've almost always had a certain gothic/symphonic bit going on, what with orchestra-inspired intro tracks on most of their albums and a keyboardist in the band for most (all?) of their career, but they have undeniably evolved as a band. Their newest album (Thornography) can best be described as not black metal, but a particular sub-genre is also hard to come by - I'd shoot for blackened melodic groove metal with black and death metal influences, but as I said, it's hard to define.

In any case, they have slews of fantastic work, what with a decade and a half as a band under their belt.

I'll do a Chronological play-by-play for the albums I own:

_Dusk and Her Embrace_ (1996) - Not missing much if you don't have this album; it had a few so-so tracks, but most are largely forgettable - much like the album itself. I do like 'A Gothic Romance (Red Roses for the Devil's Whore)' though 

_Cruelty and the Beast_ (1998) - This is a CoF release which sticks very much to the true black metal spirit while still feeling melodic and experimental. It's a very solid piece, and has numerous good tracks: 'Cruelty Brought Thee Orchids' (a personal favourite), 'Desire in Violent Overture' and 'The Twisted Nails of Fate'. I should note I have the limited double-disk edition which has tracks from a previously released Celtic Cross edition which has bonus tracks. Get this version if you can - it has a fantastic cover of Venom's 'Black Metal' (the song which, IIRC, started the BM movement) and Iron Maiden's 'Hallowed Be Thy Name'.

_Midian_ (2000) - This album likely incorporates the keyboards moreso then CoF ever had previously, It has a great horror/gothic theme to it, opening up (after an intro track) with the essential 'Cthulhu Dawn', and with many other excellent tracks alongside it: 'Death Magic for Adepts', 'Lord Abortion', 'Tearing the Veil from Grace' and the amazing track 'Her Ghost in the Fog', which is very melodic and dark. 

_Damnation and a Day_ (2003) - this is *the* album which got me into Cradle of Filth. This was the first (and last, at the time of this posting) album CoF did with Sony. With a huge budget, they found themselves backed by a full orchestra, and their previous flirtations with keyboards came full swing. It's an epic album, with 17 tracks breaking in at over an hour and 15 minutes of symphonic black metal, with amazing work by the entire band here. If I were to say "pick up one CoF album", well this would be that album. It's crisp, it has depth, it has energy and it is, IMO, the pinnacle of what CoF has done in their career; check out 'Hurt and Virtue', 'Better to Reign in Hell, 'Serpent Tongue' when you buy this album 

_Nyphetamine_ (2004) - this CD is CoF settling down in their symphonic black metal niche, and is kinda the yang of _Midian_'s ying, if that makes sense. There are many tracks you simply should not miss, although the special double disk edition is skippable - the second disk really has nothing of interest on it, other then an interesting cover of Cliff Richard's 'Devil Woman'. The main disk, however, is absolutely loaded with good tracks, with 'Nymphetamine Fix' and Nymphetamine Overdose' taking the lead. Overdose is simply Fix with an intro and an outro and ups the length by a good 3 or 4 minutes - but either are enjoyable. The intro instrumental 'Satyriasis' is, IMO, CoF's best one yet, and 'Gilded ', 'Nemesis' and 'Absinthe With Faust' are all essential CoF tracks. This album strays fairly far from CoF's BM roots, but it's a very interesting take.

I won't bother going over _Thornography_, as it really is not BM, but I would recommend you buy this album if you are a death metal, black metal or symphonic metal fan - there is really something for everyone on this album.

Hope that helps!

cheers,
--N


----------



## Nyaricus

Thunderfoot said:
			
		

> Okay kiddies, Thunderfoot is not my name due to some sort of strange dwarven character I played, it was handed down as my street name because of my feet (Duh) as I played double bass - yes I am a drummer.  So sit back and take notes, you may want to grab a soda/beer/blood and possibly something that will clog your arteries, I hear live bat is good.



\m/ Thunderfoot is an awesome nick-name, haha.



			
				Thunderfoot said:
			
		

> "Wearing the Leather(s)" - Rob Halford of Judas Priest is the first known metalhead to wear leather.  At the time his homosexuality was buried and known only to a few close associates, in the male homosexual scene, bondage was all the rage in the mid to late 70s.  When Halford began to wear his bondage gear on stage, the look took off, accompanied by their breakout hit _Hell Bent For Leather_, a fashion movement was formed.



I never knew that; I always figured metal's association with leather was due to bikers wearing it (and their subsequent association with metal) - but then I'm not sure (now) if bikers were influenced then by metal to wear leather. Very neat little tidbit, anyway 

cheers,
--N


----------



## Kurashu

Thunderfoot said:
			
		

> "Christian Metal" - the musical answer to the 'death metal' scene.  Infused with positive lyrics and a message of salvation, this alternative to doom and gloom was looked upon by the 'true metal' community as a moronic step-child, however, just as metal asked to keep an open mind, further listening reveals many of these groups were quite talented.  The "CM" tag actually spanned all of the known accepted forms of metal described above so you could literally find the positive equivallent to anything you may find aurally pleasing.  Bands are listed with appropriate style behind name in parenths: Angelica (Progressive.Pop), Bloodgood (Hard Rock), Bride (Hard Rock/Arena), Holy Soldier (Hair/Arena), Jet Circus (Arena/Progressive), Mana (Hard Rock/Arena), Shout (Arena), Stryper (Hair/Pop/Arena), Tourniquet (Speed/Thrash), Throne (White/Black/), and Xalt (Arena/Pop)




[rant]

Lordy do I hate that term. The actual term does nothing to describe any style of music being played, just the content of lyrics. I don't see Nile being called egyptian death metal because they're songs are usually about Egypt. If I made a band that had songs about the Shinto religion would that be Shinto Metal? Or what about Islam? Deicide isn't "nihilist death metal".

The only thing I hate more is when my mom calls everything, EVERYTHING, I listen to that's heavy "death metal" regardless of how it sounds.

[/rant]



			
				Nyaricus said:
			
		

> Burzum - this is Varg Vikernes' band. He's the guy that killed Euronymous, guitar player for Mayhem, which is argueably BM's most infamous band. While the man himself is obviously not a nice guy, I've listened to a variety of his work, and it's amazing what he's done. May I suggest the album _Hvis Lyset Tar Oss_, which opens with the epic 14 minute long tack 'Det Som En Gang Var', an amazing mix of synth, guitars and keyboards. Did I mention Varg plays all of his own instruments?




Ah yes. Burzum. I was wondering when that name'd come up. I suppose once can't mention black metal without either Burzum or Mayhem coming up. Euronymous. Am I the only one who finds his name, in Greek, means "well named" amusing?

Nyaricus, thanks for the suggestions. Cradle of Filth annoys me. From both what I've heard of them and the fact that everyone here who listens to them thinks they're BMFs, like Samuel L Jackson or something.


----------



## jgbrowning

Ferret said:
			
		

> Uh, yeah! Not enough though. I think I like them. I've only heard Breaking the law properly though.




Try the song _Killing Machine_ from _Hell Bent for Leather_. It's not as popular as many of Judas Priest's other songs, but I think it does a great job of capturing the aggression and bravado indicitive of their style. That said, pretty much anthing from about 1978 to 1984 by Priest is good music. Also, give their recent reunion album a listen: it's surprisingly good as well.

Glad you like metal Ferret.  Right now I'm loving me some _Therion_ hard core (been listening to their last 4 albums a lot recently), but I've got Kiss' _Creatures of the Night_ in my headphones right now.

Oh a bit of funny gamer/metal knowledge. The ENnie award winning adventure last year, _The Pleasure Palace of the B'thuvian Demon Whore_ was written exclusively to the Judas Priest discograpy. And a butt-load of Mountain Dew. 

joe b.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Nice post, Thunderfoot!

Would you mind cutting & pasting it in Metal School?


----------



## Nyaricus

Kurashu said:
			
		

> Nyaricus, thanks for the suggestions. Cradle of Filth annoys me. From both what I've heard of them and the fact that everyone here who listens to them thinks they're BMFs, like Samuel L Jackson or something.



BMF's = big mother "freakers"?

What tracks have you listened to, and why did they annoy you? In any case, while they have indeed broke into the mainstream with their work, they are still a very good band, IMO. Of course, I've heard (on ther net here, at various metal sites) that some people either love them or hate them, and that you might choose to hate 'em doesn't really surprize me.

I guess I'm kinda like you in that I've always shied away from what everyone was blabbing about. I had a friend who used to go on and on and on and on about Tool, and I hated them solely based upon how much excessive preaching he'd do about them. I bought a CD on a whim last year, and now own 3 different Tool CDs. They are hardly a favourite band of mine (I could name you many, many others that rank higher) but they do have some good tracks to their name.

Just sayin', is all 

cheers,
--N


----------



## Thunderfoot

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> Nice post, Thunderfoot!
> 
> Would you mind cutting & pasting it in Metal School?



I was originally going to, but saw that you referenced this thread - will do at some point and post future updates there.


----------



## Thunderfoot

Kurashu said:
			
		

> [rant]
> Lordy do I hate that term. The actual term does nothing to describe any style of music being played, just the content of lyrics. I don't see Nile being called egyptian death metal because they're songs are usually about Egypt. If I made a band that had songs about the Shinto religion would that be Shinto Metal? Or what about Islam? Deicide isn't "nihilist death metal".
> 
> The only thing I hate more is when my mom calls everything, EVERYTHING, I listen to that's heavy "death metal" regardless of how it sounds.
> [/rant]



Correct! But the tag was actually created by outside concerns, (ie the industry not the artists).  If you have ever had a one on one conversation with any of the artists they will tell you that theyare a (INSERT TYPE OF METAL) band with positive Christian lyrics.  So if you have a problem with the tag, speak to your fellow metalheads and the CEOs of the major lables, THEY came up with the term, not the artists.   Hope this clears things up and if you still lhave an issue with it, I suggest Prozac.


----------



## Kurashu

The rant wasn't aimmed at you, Thunderfoot; just at the term itself. The things primarily wrong with the term is that bands are bought by parents because "it's christian".

I'd go further into this, but I'd probably end up breaking a few rules.


Anyways, the most exposure I've had to Cradle of Filth (and this'll probably come across as bad form) is MTV and a couple of songs my friends have played for me. I'll probably give them an earnest chance sometime, but later. Something about them just irks me.


----------



## Ferret

Moulin Rogue said:
			
		

> If you like Queen, you should check out yet another British group that hit the scene at the very beginning of the '70s - Uriah Heep. I've never read a reliable source that says Uriah Heep influenced Queen, but it's easy to listen to Heep and THINK they did, because Uriah Heep came a little earlier and they used some operatic vocal harmonies in their music.




I've got their song easy living, but I didn't impress me much. I might look at it again though 



			
				Thunderfoot said:
			
		

> Hey Danny, sit down for a while, I've got this.
> 
> Okay kiddies, Thunderfoot is not my name due to some sort of strange dwarven character I played, it was handed down as my street name because of my feet (Duh) as I played double bass - yes I am a drummer.  So sit back and take notes, you may want to grab a soda/beer/blood and possibly something that will clog your arteries, I hear live bat is good.
> 
> *cue metal history*




Wow. Yay. Hurrah!

I would have put my self down as liking thrash then: Megadeth, Metallica and Anthrax (I need to get me some more of that I *love* 'What Doesn't Die.'

I recognised some of those names you mentioned though but it was a good lesson in Metal/rock! Thanks!



			
				jgbrowning said:
			
		

> Try the song _Killing Machine_ from _Hell Bent for Leather_. It's not as popular as many of Judas Priest's other songs, but I think it does a great job of capturing the aggression and bravado indicitive of their style. That said, pretty much anthing from about 1978 to 1984 by Priest is good music. Also, give their recent reunion album a listen: it's surprisingly good as well.
> 
> Glad you like metal Ferret.  Right now I'm loving me some _Therion_ hard core (been listening to their last 4 albums a lot recently), but I've got Kiss' _Creatures of the Night_ in my headphones right now.
> 
> joe b.



I'll be looking into them now, but I'm not that great a fan of Kiss, not heard of therion but the name sounds cool!

Thanks guys!


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Here's some info on KISS


----------



## Thunderfoot

Kurashu said:
			
		

> The rant wasn't aimmed at you, Thunderfoot; just at the term itself. The things primarily wrong with the term is that bands are bought by parents because "it's christian".
> 
> I'd go further into this, but I'd probably end up breaking a few rules.
> 
> 
> Anyways, the most exposure I've had to Cradle of Filth (and this'll probably come across as bad form) is MTV and a couple of songs my friends have played for me. I'll probably give them an earnest chance sometime, but later. Something about them just irks me.



Never took it as a personal hit, however, I did want to try and clear up from whence that 'name tag' had came.  And from the other other perspective, it gave me an excuse to listen to something and say, but see, it's Christian...


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Actually, there were some pretty cool Christian metal bands out there...very few made any mainstream radio or MTV play.

Bloodgood was one of my faves- "The Messiah" from their 1987 release Detonation was pretty darn good.

And let's not discount the more mainstream rock/metal bands who definitely have a Christian vibe, like P.O.D. and King's X.

And, while we're not really talking about it- howabout those Asian (mostly Japanese) bands?

In a time when the country was basically awash in pop & retro music, Loudness opened Japan's door to American glam metal, broke big, then came to the good old USA.  Then came EZO.  Then you started seeing more Asian players in bands like Reverend and Dream Theatre. The women got into it as well- see Super Junky Monkey.

Now we're getting metal bands from Japan that are as whacked out as anyone else today- Dir En Gray, anyone?  They have closed the metal gap!


----------



## Thunderfoot

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> Actually, there were some pretty cool Christian metal bands out there...very few made any mainstream radio or MTV play.
> 
> Bloodgood was one of my faves- "The Messiah" from their 1987 release Detonation was pretty darn good.
> 
> And let's not discount the more mainstream rock/metal bands who definitely have a Christian vibe, like P.O.D. and King's X.
> 
> And, while we're not really talking about it- howabout those Asian (mostly Japanese) bands?
> 
> In a time when the country was basically awash in pop & retro music, Loudness opened Japan's door to American glam metal, broke big, then came to the good old USA.  Then came EZO.  Then you started seeing more Asian players in bands like Reverend and Dream Theatre. The women got into it as well- see Super Junky Monkey.
> 
> Now we're getting metal bands from Japan that are as whacked out as anyone else today- Dir En Gray, anyone?  They have closed the metal gap!




Thank you EZO - without you we might never have had Jake E. Lee,


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

OK, Thunderfoot- you actually stumped me.  

What's the connection between EZO and Jake E Lee?

( http://music.aol.com/artist/ezo/17197/biography )

( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jake_E._Lee )


----------



## Lanefan

Well, a lot of this thread has been talking about bands I've never heard of...i.e., those newer than about 1995 or so...but I'm glad to see that metal lives. 

A few stray thoughts:

Much of what is being referred to as "hard rock" is metal to me...Deep Purple, Rainbow, AC-DC...as that's what I remember it as, and still consider it such when I hear it today. 

The Rush song "Roll the Bones" always makes me think of gaming; roll the bones being an old slang term for throwing dice.

My own musical tastes are all over the map...The Cars, Neil Young, Rainbow/Dio, Enya, Loreena McKennitt, Midnight Oil...but there's a metallic streak in there somewhere (though perhaps a bit rusty these days) 

Some so-called grunge groups e.g. Nirvana are every bit as heavy as most other metal, and deserve to be included in the genre.

I once read a review that described Hawkwind as "a barbarian horde let loose on technology"; it fits.

Lanefan


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

I agree, Lanefan- the line between hard rock and metal is quite blurry, especially before 1990.  AC/DC, Rainbow & DP _are_ all metal bands- its just that heavier forms have been "discovered" since then.

Personally, I have tended towards using the terms interchangeably...essentially thinking of hard rock as the overarching genre of which metal is a major subcategory.


----------



## Kurashu

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> Actually, there were some pretty cool Christian metal bands out there...very few made any mainstream radio or MTV play.




Oh definetly. I'm very surprised how many people know about Norma Jean, but not Zao and Living Sacrifice. August Burns Red is an extremely talented band. Twelve Gauge Valentine is excellent as well. The Chariot is alright, but they aren't for everyone. Extol is good, but their style changes from album to album and the last album wasn't metal (not to say it wasn't good). And while not metal/metalcore, Beloved, Comeback Kid, and Figure Four are great hardcore bands.


----------



## Nyaricus

Lanefan said:
			
		

> Some so-called grunge groups e.g. Nirvana are every bit as heavy as most other metal, and deserve to be included in the genre.



I completely disagree on this. While I fully accept that many hard rock bands flirted with metal in many of their songs, and thus there is some crossover between the two genres (GNR, ACDC, etc etc [I don't really listen to these bands anyways]), grunge is is sub-genre of rock and =/= metal whatsoever. Hell, Nirvana and the grunge scene is what castrated the metal scene in North America in the 90s, till much later on in the decade when 'Nu Metal' became popular. Metal never died out in Europe in the 90s, and many metal acts are extremely popular over there, by which I mean mainstream (Nightwish, Lordi etc... not very well versed in the specific acts which have risen to popularity in Europe).

Only now in N.A. are we really seeing the metal truely regain it's foothold, what with last years release of Lamb of Gods' _Sacrament_ reach number 8 on he Billboard top 100 in the first week, for example. In my city, I'm seeing more and more major metal acts coming through, more local metal bands forming, more great metal CDs coming out by heavy-hitting bands, etc.

But, as for grunge, it's definitly not metal. Not even close.

cheers,
--N


----------



## Kurashu

Yeah. Grunge was the death of metal. But Dave Grohl apologized with Probot, so it's ok to like grunge again.


----------



## D.Shaffer

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> And, while we're not really talking about it- howabout those Asian (mostly Japanese) bands?
> ...
> Now we're getting metal bands from Japan that are as whacked out as anyone else today- Dir En Gray, anyone?  They have closed the metal gap!



Which leads to another confession.  I'm a big fan of Animetal.   
Cheesy, yeah, but hearing the Mazinger Z or Yamato theme on heavy guitar rocks.


----------



## Thunderfoot

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> OK, Thunderfoot- you actually stumped me.
> 
> What's the connection between EZO and Jake E Lee?
> 
> ( http://music.aol.com/artist/ezo/17197/biography )
> 
> ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jake_E._Lee )



Oops, I misquoted myself.   See, never post at 1 am - your mind plays very strange tricks on you..  :\ 

Would believe I actually meant Eric Carr - how I got Jake E Lee from Eric Carr, I have no idea.  And to explain that link, when Eric started having health issues, Gene went on hiatus to Japan, that's when he found EZO.  (BTW this is incorrectly handled in his biography - the wording makes it seem like he had health issue and then was immediately diagnosed, he actually had some issues with fatigue which was later diagnosed when the symptoms started getting worse.)  The line does cross back with Jake E Lee, but only through Eric Singer and that happened later,


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

That makes more sense- thanks TF!


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Just FYI, MTV2 is airing Headbanger's Ball right now.


----------



## Nyaricus

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> Just FYI, MTV2 is airing Headbanger's Ball right now.



[homer]mmmmmm, Headbangers Ball[/homer]

I just got back from a Dimmu Borgir, Unearth, DevilDriver and Kataklysm show. I'll post a full detail of it tomorrow!

cheers,
--N


----------



## Ferret

Someone sent me a song by Dimmu Borgir once, my response? Scary! 

I need to start writing down the bands I've been advise to go find! Then plan what to do next!


----------



## Kurashu

Ferret said:
			
		

> Someone sent me a song by Dimmu Borgir once, my response? Scary!
> 
> I need to start writing down the bands I've been advise to go find! Then plan what to do next!




Dimmu's alright from what I've heard of them. My friend has For All Tid.



			
				Nyaricus said:
			
		

> [homer]mmmmmm, Headbangers Ball[/homer]




I've been disappointed with Headbanger's Ball lately. It's just been a let down to me. It went to metal/metalcore to anything that sounded remotely metal (Kutless? Seriousky.)



			
				Nyaricus said:
			
		

> I just got back from a Dimmu Borgir, Unearth, DevilDriver and Kataklysm show. I'll post a full detail of it tomorrow!





I'd say that's an eclectic group, but the Dragonforce/He Is Legend/Chimria/Killswitch tour made me scratch my head. Iunno. I seem to think that tours that have bands that are similiar are better, not that variety is bad but some things make go "What?" Like when Zao was going to do a tour with Story of the Year and Hawthrone Heights (I believe that was the other band).


I might be going to see Despised Icon, The Faceless, As Blood Runs Black, & Animoisty tonight. The details are still fuzzy, so I don't know. I might not be able to go because stupid Baccalureate (I don't even care that I butchered that word).

Stupid graduation. Seniors should just show up one day and our teachers just say "Go home. It's over. Don't come back. Here's your diploma and awards, leave."

That's a different subject.


----------



## Nyaricus

Kurashu said:
			
		

> Dimmu's alright from what I've heard of them. My friend has For All Tid.



They were fairly impressive, from what I saw last night. But I'll get into it more when I post a reveiw of the concert in a bit.



			
				Kurashu said:
			
		

> I've been disappointed with Headbanger's Ball lately. It's just been a let down to me. It went to metal/metalcore to anything that sounded remotely metal (Kutless? Seriousky.)



Heh, I have a Kutless album. They are hard alternative rock at their heaviest 



			
				Kurashu said:
			
		

> I'd say that's an eclectic group... I seem to think that tours that have bands that are similiar are better, not that variety is bad but some things make go "What?"



Yeah, these tour organizers are really trying to throw together some different elements as of late, ie:

Lamb of God's _Sacrament_ Support Tour
Gojira - progressive death/doom/groove metal
Machine Head - groove metal/half-thrash
Trivium - metalcore/thrash
Lamb of God - groove metal/metalcore

Dimmu Borgir's _In Sorte Diaboli_ Support Tour
Kataklysm - death metal
DevilDriver -  death metal/groove metal, some elements of nu metal
Unearth - metalcore
Dimmu Borgir - symphonic black metal

But in any case, I saw both of those line-ups, and they were amazing shows. The variety is nice though, since I'm a big metal fan of all its' sub-genres, and I love Unearth, DevilDriver and the Dimmu I've listened to beforehand. So it was alright with me 

cheers,
--N


----------



## Kurashu

I can see the Lamb of God tour. That makes sense to me. But the other one, no not so much. However, if it exposes people to new bands/genres, I'm not complaining.


----------



## Nyaricus

Kurashu said:
			
		

> I can see the Lamb of God tour. That makes sense to me. But the other one, no not so much. However, if it exposes people to new bands/genres, I'm not complaining.



I'm basically in agreement with your sentiments; the Dimmu tour did have a bit of a mash-up of genres (Esp. considering Unearth, a metalcore band, were the direct-support band  )

But it's definitely a good thing to get people into new bands and genres. I was just last year exposed to metalcore (well, "pure" metalcore, since Lamb of God was a fav of mine for a couple years before that, and they have elements of that sub-genre in their music) for the first time, and now it ranks amongst my favourite metal sub-genres (right alongside death and groove metal).

cheers,
--N


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

That's why I loved the Lollapalooza tours.

Simply Awesome!


----------



## Kurashu

Just got the new Becoming the Archetype album The Physics of Fire. I love it. It's amazing. It's a definite shift from Terminate Damnation, a shift towards a more progressive death metal sound. The songs are not only bound by a common story (the end times as told by the Bible) but as well as a common theme (redemption of a people) and the overwhelming presense of fire imagery.

Brett's and Alex's vocal styles fit nicely together. Duck's drumming is intense as ever. The guitar and bass work is awesome.


Between this, The Fiancee (The Chariot's new album), and ABR's new album (Messengers), Solid State may be experience a remdemption of their past (before LS started to suck and Zao left). Hopefully Twelve Gauge Valentine can keep pace with these bands. Norma Jean, eh. I could care less, after Scogin left they started to suck. Redeemer was a decent album, but not enough to keep me interested in another one.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Just thought I'd put in a plug for the Black Sabbath "Dio Years" compellation.

Heck, I've keep pressing the buttons to listen to "Children of the Sea," "Voodoo" and "Mob Rules" [Dio]over and over and over again![/Dio]


----------



## Nyaricus

Well, it's been a week, and I don't think I'm goign to do a full reveiw of the conert anymore, but here are some thoughts:

Kataklysm - 4/5. Great showmen and good DM songs; I liked them. And they promised to come back 

DevilDriver - 3/5. Crappy showmen  I was really expecting more. Played a new song off their upcoming album. Sounds good. Hope they come back to a bigger stage, so there's room to mosh; maybe they'd be in their element more.

Unearth - 4/5. Great crowd-pleasers and I really wasn't expecting them to be so good - but their live show is *much* better then their albums. They really kept the crowd moving and moshing, and their songs were top-notch live and all stood out. Great guys, great show.

Dimmu Borgir - 3.5 (almost a 4) /5. Well, these guys were pretty scary looking metalheads, but I was honestly expecting more from the headliners. I said 3.5 because I felt like they really didn't try to get the crowd going throughout their time on stage, and the singer, I felt, honestly brought the band down. Maybe it was just the acoustics live. Not sure. Their bassist however, sang some clean vocals which were amazing - and he was an amazing bassist to boot - those fingers FLEW over the strings. The drumming was intense, and the keyboardist was really good and atmosphereic as well. So somewhere between a 3.5 and a 4.

Oh, and one more thing about Dimmu Borgir's drummer - he's kinda famous in his own right. You see, he is Hellhammer, the fellow who used to drum in Mayhem, the band with Varg Vikernes et al. And *I* caught one of his drumsticks  Now that is a keeper.

cheers,
--N


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

That is probably a +2 Unholy Paladinbane Drumstick!


----------



## Nyaricus

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> That is probably a +2 Unholy Paladinbane Drumstick!



Yeah, and it got beat the  out of too - might do slashing damage too  I know I already got a splinter from this thing, haha

And, I got some pics, too:

HellHammer's Hellhammer (with Unearth's _III: In the Eyes of Fire_ and DevilDriver's _The Fury of Our Maker's Hand Re-release_:






Hellhammer Detail (looks blurry, but quite sharp-edged IRL:





cheers,
--N


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Just thought I'd pass along this tangent:

There is an avant garde modern composer named Glenn Branca who composes hard rock/metal symphonies.  You might want to give him a listen.

http://www.glennbranca.com/

And for giggles

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glenn_Branca
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Glenn_Branca#Disputed


----------



## Testament

*Blessed is the Black*

Nycarius, how could you post Black Metal acts and not include the two of the true legends of the form, Emperor or Mayhem?

Mayhem are pretty much the godfathers of the infamous Norwegian wave of BM, their _Deathcrush_ demo is an icon of so called "tr00" or "kvlt" BM.  They've been through a huge number of lineup changes, all of them forced to some degree, and as a result all of their albums are quite distince.  Their latest, _Ordo Ad Chao_ is murky, muted and unrelentingly dark, and very hard to get in to.  _De Mysteriis Dom Sathanas_ is probably their most famous, and is quite accessible.  Very nasty, very evil, with suprisingly good production, and Attila Csihar does some seriously wicked vocals.  The title track is absolutely killer, with some demonic moaning operatic howling interspersed with the snarling vocals.

Emperor are, in my opinion, nothing less than gods.  I have all their albums, from _Wrath of the Tyrant_ to _Scattered Ashes_, and I adore them all.  These guys took the genre to its boundaries and beyond constantly, using classical flourishes before Dimmu Borgir had even been formed, let alone drowned an album in keyboards, and moving beyond christ-killing church burning lyrics into further fields.  _In The Nightside Eclipse _ is their first album and oozes sorrow and menace from every track.  Ihsahn's vocals are very much demonic screams, and the primitive production does hurt this album somewhat.  Despite that, it features two of their best ever songs, "I Am the Black Wizards" and "Inno A Satana".  If you want a good starting point for Emperor, then grab _Anthems to the Welkin at Dusk_, their second album.  The production is good without being overly slick, the tracks are bold and powerful, and Ihsahn's vocals are probably at their peak.

Another good band to check out is Immortal, and Darkthrone are also noteworthy, although they're the absolute epitome of raw, "necro" BM.  Sigh are pretty much impossible to classify, although _Scorn Defeat_ and _Hangman's Hymn: Musicalische Exequien _ are more than a bit BM, and are both excellent albums.  _Hangman's Hymn _ in particular has become a favourite of mine.

On the matter of CoF, I was a fan, then they did _Thornography_, an album I consider to be a disgrace and an insult to their awesome early work, especially _Dusk...And Her Embrace _ and ESPECIALLY _Cruelty and the Beast_.  _Damnation_ is good, although horribly overproduced for my liking and drowned in samples and FX.  I'd reccomend starting off with _Cruelty and the Beast_.

As for Dimmu Borgir, I'm one of many BM fans who thinks they could be really good again if they'd get rid of Shagrath (honestly, he's like Dani Filth with less than half that psycho's range) and put Vortex on vocals full time.  Not only does he have a magnificent clean voice, but he can snarl and shriek with the best of them.


----------



## Ferret

Nyaricus said:
			
		

> Well, it's been a week, and I don't think I'm goign to do a full reveiw of the conert anymore, but here are some thoughts:
> 
> Kataklysm - 4/5. Great showmen and good DM songs; I liked them. And they promised to come back
> 
> DevilDriver - 3/5. Crappy showmen  I was really expecting more. Played a new song off their upcoming album. Sounds good. Hope they come back to a bigger stage, so there's room to mosh; maybe they'd be in their element more.
> 
> Unearth - 4/5. Great crowd-pleasers and I really wasn't expecting them to be so good - but their live show is *much* better then their albums. They really kept the crowd moving and moshing, and their songs were top-notch live and all stood out. Great guys, great show.
> 
> Dimmu Borgir - 3.5 (almost a 4) /5. Well, these guys were pretty scary looking metalheads, but I was honestly expecting more from the headliners. I said 3.5 because I felt like they really didn't try to get the crowd going throughout their time on stage, and the singer, I felt, honestly brought the band down. Maybe it was just the acoustics live. Not sure. Their bassist however, sang some clean vocals which were amazing - and he was an amazing bassist to boot - those fingers FLEW over the strings. The drumming was intense, and the keyboardist was really good and atmosphereic as well. So somewhere between a 3.5 and a 4.
> 
> Oh, and one more thing about Dimmu Borgir's drummer - he's kinda famous in his own right. You see, he is Hellhammer, the fellow who used to drum in Mayhem, the band with Varg Vikernes et al. And *I* caught one of his drumsticks  Now that is a keeper.
> 
> cheers,
> --N




Sounds like you had an awesome time! I need to get into more of theses gigs though, and still hear more types of metal. I mean, groove metal?  

Nice souvenir though!


----------



## Nyaricus

Testament said:
			
		

> Nycarius, how could you post Black Metal acts and not include the two of the true legends of the form, Emperor or Mayhem?



 Well, at the time of posting I actually wasn't much of a fan of Mayhem, actually. Their music is just very hard to get into, and I just didn't get it. Now though, I've really taken a liking to DMDS and to a lesser degree their newest disk.

As for Emperor, this is a band I really need to get into. Ironically, I just bought Ihsahn's _The Adversary_ a few days ago, and I've completely fallen in love with the disk - the style is indescribable in regards to genre... it retains a symphonic metal edge throughout while flirting with power and black metal, and all the while being incredibly progressive in sound and scope. WHERE DO I FIND MORE MUSIC LIKE THIS?

Other then that, I've really begun to delve deeper into BM, with Rotting Christ, Marduk, Woods of Ypres and Akercocke being new favourites.

cheers,
--N


----------



## reanjr

Confession is a strong word, since I am proud of my entire music collection.  Some very non-metal stuff that appears in my collection (and of which I am a big fan):

Bjork
Collective Soul
Motown of all varieties
Eminem
Sunny Day Real Estate
Phil Collins

I have all sorts of metal stuff, but nothing too obscure (my obscure tastes tend to run outside of metal). This is probably the best example of obscure I've got (or maybe I'm too out of touch with mainstream to even know how obscure my collection is):

Agalloch
Green Carnation


----------



## reanjr

Testament said:
			
		

> _Damnation_ is good, although horribly overproduced for my liking and drowned in samples and FX.  I'd reccomend starting off with _Cruelty and the Beast_.




I LOVED Damnation.  But I'm a big My Dying Bride fan and especially of Martin Powell (MDB's violinist, now CoF's Keyboardist) who wrote most of the album.


----------



## Weinbehalter

I'm not exactly sure if you will be able to help me, but im looking for more good melodic death metal bands. I absolutely love In Flames, Soilwork, and Opeth.

Also great thread guys, im listening to lots of great metal I didn't even know about until recently.

As for the first purpose of the thread, I must confess I have cd's of falloutboy and some rap. 

As for the metal though, I own every iron maiden album, and have albums of iced earth, in flames, soilwork, opeth, at the gates, kataklysm, slayer, sonata arctica, kamelot, dragonforce, static-x, emperor, lamb of god, children of bodom, unearth, god forbid, megadeth, disturbed, killswitch engage, etc. I can go on and on. Then theres all the hard rock bands which have already been mentioned.

I'm all over the place in metal genres.


----------



## Testament

Nyaricus said:
			
		

> Well, at the time of posting I actually wasn't much of a fan of Mayhem, actually. Their music is just very hard to get into, and I just didn't get it. Now though, I've really taken a liking to DMDS and to a lesser degree their newest disk.
> 
> As for Emperor, this is a band I really need to get into. Ironically, I just bought Ihsahn's _The Adversary_ a few days ago, and I've completely fallen in love with the disk - the style is indescribable in regards to genre... it retains a symphonic metal edge throughout while flirting with power and black metal, and all the while being incredibly progressive in sound and scope. WHERE DO I FIND MORE MUSIC LIKE THIS?
> 
> cheers,
> --N




No argument whatsoever as to Mayhem being hard to get into.  I'm not really that enamoured of most of the Maniac era stuff, but DMDS and OAC are fantastic.  OAC in particular is almost impentrable, its so murky, bleak and dark.  But then again, I also love Sunn 0))), so the drone influence that Attila brought across with him to Mayhem is something I consider a plus.

Glad to hear you like _The Adversary_.  If you liked it, then its pretty safe to assume you'll like _Prometheus: The Discipline of Fire and Demise_, the last Emperor album, considering that its pretty much a solo project by Ihsahn.  Its very much the prototype to his solo work, and is very difficult to get into, but will reward repeated listenings.  The work he did with his wife and his brother in-law as Peccatum can be a stone cold bitch to track down, but also well worth checking out.  Its even more avant-garde than _The Adversary_, but never dull and always challenging.


----------



## Testament

Weinbehalter said:
			
		

> I'm not exactly sure if you will be able to help me, but im looking for more good melodic death metal bands. I absolutely love In Flames, Soilwork, and Opeth.
> 
> Also great thread guys, im listening to lots of great metal I didn't even know about until recently.
> 
> As for the first purpose of the thread, I must confess I have cd's of falloutboy and some rap.
> 
> As for the metal though, I own every iron maiden album, and have albums of iced earth, in flames, soilwork, opeth, at the gates, kataklysm, slayer, sonata arctica, kamelot, dragonforce, static-x, emperor, lamb of god, children of bodom, unearth, god forbid, megadeth, disturbed, killswitch engage, etc. I can go on and on. Then theres all the hard rock bands which have already been mentioned.
> 
> I'm all over the place in metal genres.




You want more good melodeath?  Two words for you then: Arch Enemy.  Their early stuff with Johann Liiva on vocals is alright but the first album with Angela Gossow on vocals is probably their best to date, _Wages of Sin_.  _Anthems of Rebellion_ is alright, at best, IMO, and _Doomsday Machine_ is fairly good.  These guys are all about the big showy solos that almost cross into power metal territory they're that over the top, but some very good drumming and Angela's scorched raw screaming keep it firmly rooted in Gothenburg death.  Well worth checking out.

Great, now I need to put it on, "Ravenous" has just lodged itself in my brain.


----------



## Nyaricus

Ferret said:
			
		

> Sounds like you had an awesome time! I need to get into more of theses gigs though, and still hear more types of metal. I mean, groove metal?
> 
> Nice souvenir though!



Yes it was! I'm also seeing Cannibal Corpse, The Black Dahlia Murder, The Red Chord and Goatwhore next Wednesday, which is going to kick something major 

Groove metal is also known as "half-thrash" and/or "post thrash". Pantera or Machine Head are good examples of Groove metal.

cheers,
--N


----------



## Nyaricus

Testament said:
			
		

> No argument whatsoever as to Mayhem being hard to get into.  I'm not really that enamoured of most of the Maniac era stuff, but DMDS and OAC are fantastic.  OAC in particular is almost impentrable, its so murky, bleak and dark.  But then again, I also love Sunn 0))), so the drone influence that Attila brought across with him to Mayhem is something I consider a plus.
> 
> Glad to hear you like _The Adversary_.  If you liked it, then its pretty safe to assume you'll like _Prometheus: The Discipline of Fire and Demise_, the last Emperor album, considering that its pretty much a solo project by Ihsahn.  Its very much the prototype to his solo work, and is very difficult to get into, but will reward repeated listenings.  The work he did with his wife and his brother in-law as Peccatum can be a stone cold bitch to track down, but also well worth checking out.  Its even more avant-garde than _The Adversary_, but never dull and always challenging.



Ah, so that's what the crazy murky feeling was on that album... drone. I dunno, I own an Earth album, and it was okay... 'Seven Angels' was a decent track... but it's really just not my style. I do enjoy some doom metal (an I really need to check out more) but drone is just too... listless for me, I guess.

I'll be sure to check out that Emperor album, as well as the one with that 'Black Wizards' track... I saw a live video on YouTube and I was like *drools* haha 

cheers,
--N


----------



## Nyaricus

Weinbehalter said:
			
		

> I'm not exactly sure if you will be able to help me, but im looking for more good melodic death metal bands. I absolutely love In Flames, Soilwork, and Opeth.
> 
> Also great thread guys, im listening to lots of great metal I didn't even know about until recently.
> 
> As for the first purpose of the thread, I must confess I have cd's of falloutboy and some rap.
> 
> As for the metal though, I own every iron maiden album, and have albums of iced earth, in flames, soilwork, opeth, at the gates, kataklysm, slayer, sonata arctica, kamelot, dragonforce, static-x, emperor, lamb of god, children of bodom, unearth, god forbid, megadeth, disturbed, killswitch engage, etc. I can go on and on. Then theres all the hard rock bands which have already been mentioned.
> 
> I'm all over the place in metal genres.



Yeah, metal is good no matter what the genre...

As for melodeath (other then Arch Enemy, which has of course been mentioned) I'll point you towards Amon Amarth. They play a unique brand of melodic death metal which focuses on fairly simply, but power lead guitar work during choruses (Here's their newest video for Rune Stones to My Memory from their album _With Oden on Our Side_). Their newest album, With Oden on Our Side, is by far (IMO) their best work, with power, battle-ready songs which really pack a punch, but they've had a long career, and in particular their _Versus the World_ two disk 'Viking' edition features their demos/EPs on the second disk, and in which you can hear a distinct black metal influence on their music. Definitely a couple of Cds worth checking out. Faet of Norns and the Crush are also really good.

cheers,
--N


----------



## Testament

THREADCROMANCY!



			
				Nyaricus said:
			
		

> Burzum - this is Varg Vikernes' band. He's the guy that killed Euronymous, guitar player for Mayhem, which is argueably BM's most infamous band. While the man himself is obviously not a nice guy, I've listened to a variety of his work, and it's amazing what he's done. May I suggest the album _Hvis Lyset Tar Oss_, which opens with the epic 14 minute long tack 'Det Som En Gang Var', an amazing mix of synth, guitars and keyboards. Did I mention Varg plays all of his own instruments?
> 
> Impaled Nazarene - the one album I have by them, 'Suomi Finland Perkele', has a few solid tracks as well, though I'd recommend Nargorath or Gorgoroth over this one. Tracks of note: 'Let's ing Die', 'The Oath of the Goat', and 'Blood is Thicker than Water'.




I went shopping in the past few weeks.

FINALLY got my posterior around to picking up some Burzum stuff.  _Hvis Lyset Tar Oss _ and _Filosofem _ are both good (excluding a certain 20 min+ instrumental on Filosofem) but his last album, _Hiljdskaf_, is his peak.  I never thought pure keyboards could sound so bleak, empty and dark.  The man is a psycho and a racist, but he's also a musical genius.

Impaled Nazarene - _Pro Patria Finlandia_.  Get this album.  NOW.  It freaking rocks.  "One Dead Nation Under a Dead God" is on a recent ep of Blackmetalradio.com if you're curious.

I also bagged Arch Enemy and Nile's latest albums.  _Rise of the Tyrant_ is a real return to form for the Swedish beasts, easily ranks up there with _Wages of Sin_.  The only issue is they don't really do anything new here.  You know what you're in for on an Arch Enemy album, but hey, if it ain't broke...

Nile may be the only band I love as much as Emperor and Sunn 0))).  These guys do crushing, brutal Death Metal with brains, while most DM acts lyrics are like 80s slasher films, these guys are doing "Lawrence of Arabia", to the point of having done at least one song ENTIRELY in Ancient Egyptian.  They were always going to have a horribly hard time following up their last two masterpieces, In _Their Darkened Shrines _ and _Annihilation of the Wicked_, and I really do think they stumbled somewhat on _Ithyphallic_.  The fast songs on their have prompted me to nickname it "Punishment of the Naughty", since they do feel like rejects from the crushing AotW (my fave album of theirs), other than The Essential Salts*.  When it slows down though, like on "Eat of the Dead" and the title track...WOW.  That's when it hits its best.  The title track is DAMNED good stuff, but I already knew that from hearing it live when they toured Aus earlier this year.  And "Eat of the Dead" is one of the best slow oozing Death tracks since Morbid Angel did "Where the Slime Live".

I've also placed orders for some work by Moss and Wolfmangler, some hardcore Drone/Doom work, and I'm eagerly awaiting my copy of the debut from Serpentcult, the band that rose from the sudden and disgusting downfall of Thee Plague of Gentlemen...look it up if you're curious, Mayhem haven't lost members in quite such an alarming manner IMO.

*Seriously, how many arms does George Kollias have?  He raised the bar to dizzying heights for himself on this one, not even "Chapter of absurdly long title" and "Burning Pits of the Duat" from AotW are this insane.


----------



## Blackrat

I think I too need to confess something:
I like Boney M. And I do own several vinyl albums of the Beatles

But then to brag, as Finland is the promised land of metal:
Finntroll - Folk metal by finnish guys with swedish lyrics
Ajattara
Apocalyptica
Kilpi
Moonsorrow
Turisas
Impaled Nazarene
Children of Bodom - I'll be damned if any non-finn actually knows where the name of this band comes without looking it up.

These I'm not sure if they belong to the confess or brag, yes they're metal but in the more heavy-oriented group of friends they might be more of a confess:
Ensiferum
Nightwish
Sonata Arctica
Teräsbetoni

And then there is Sarviperkele, and if any non-finn actually has ever even heard of this band not to mention heard their music I'm totally amazed. They did make one album but there was probably less than 50 people who bought it. Me being one.


----------



## Nyaricus

Testament said:
			
		

> THREADCROMANCY!



I love this thread


----------



## DungeonmasterCal

In August I got to see Alice Cooper.  I took my (then) 13 year old son with me.  It was his first metal show, and Uncle Alice has a new fan!


----------



## Testament

DungeonmasterCal said:
			
		

> In August I got to see Alice Cooper.  I took my (then) 13 year old son with me.  It was his first metal show, and Uncle Alice has a new fan!




Spread the love!  Taking the significant other with me Halloween night to see Trivium (shudder), Machine Head (woo) and Arch Enemy (BOOYA) at The Black Crusade.  Should be good, other than Trivium.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Heya!

Been away a while- things in the RW got _very_ interesting for about a month- but I'm back.

I still can't get into the more extreme reaches of post-2000 metal...while the guitarists are clearly no less talented than their predecessors and pre-deceasors   , the vocalists simply leave me cold.

OTOH, in other news...

Prong has released a new album!  Yay!

I tried out the new Atreyu album and think they're OK, but their cover of FNM's "Epic" was pretty shoddy.

I've picked up Kylesa, Evan's Blue and a whole bunch of other stuff but can't listen to them right now...blew my speakers on Atreyu and Corrosion of Conformity (and Annie Lennox & M'Shell N'Degeocello). :\


----------



## Testament

Well, my hearing's returned after The Black Crusade.  Awesome night, with plenty of drinks and damned fine metal.

*Arch Enemy* are ultimately who I was there to see.  Short set (only about 40 minutes), with only one song each from Wages of Sin and Rise of the Tyrant, but they made a hell of an impression.  The crowd went ballistic for _Dead Eyes See no Future_ and _Ravenous_, and Angela Gossow again owned the stage through her mixture of metal agression and sex appeal.  Whole band was in fine form, even with the average (at best) acoustics of Festival Hall.  8/10

I want to like *Trivium*.  I really do, especially after last night, but the execrable album The Crusade just keeps getting in the way.  Thankfully, its contribution last night was small, limited to _We Are the Fire_.  That sent the crowd nuts, but I was more enamoured of their earlier stuff (_Pull Harder on the Strings of your Martyr_ also got a response).  Seeing so many younger fans (All ages show) in Trivium shirts was a revelation, I had to stop myself from screaming though when I saw several full blown Emos also wearing Trivium gear, get the hell out of metal before you kill another band like you killed SOAD.  These guys have a lot of talent, they need to stop squandering it on trying to be Metallica* and put out a challenging, defining album that establishes their OWN identity.  Otherwise a pleasant surprise.  6.5/10

The roof-shattering chant of "WE WANT HEAD/WE LOVE HEAD"   that started up the moment Trivium left the stage made it clear who most people were there to see.  Them appearing in full halloween costume, already slightly drunk in Rob Flynn's case, was good fun.  Rob chatted with the audience heavily, joking around and generally being good entertainment.  The music was still front and centre though, with _Imperium_, _Davidian _ and _Old _ sending the crowd into a complete frenzy that near broke the front barriers.  Importantly, nothing from The Burning Red or The Album that Shall Not Be Named Lest I Summon It appeared.  This was a show that said much the same as The Blackening did: Machine Head are back and badder then ever.  Heck of a way to close the evening  8.5/10

*Seriously guys, NOONE is Metallica.  Metallica aren't even Metallica anymore.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

RE: Trivium/Metallica

Trivium's lead singer _does_ have certain James Hetfield-ian qualities to his voice, so the comparison and drive to emulate is natural.


----------



## Testament

Dannyalcatraz said:
			
		

> RE: Trivium/Metallica
> 
> Trivium's lead singer _does_ have certain James Hetfield-ian qualities to his voice, so the comparison and drive to emulate is natural.




That may be so, but does he have to play it up as much as he does on The Crusade?  Trying to emulate a band as legendary and important as Metallica is only going to earn scorn amongst the public("riding on their coattails" etc), and the fact that the band in question has managed to do a wonderful job of utterly and irrevocably destroying its credibility just compounds the problem.

As I've said, I think they've got incredible potential, they just need to exercise it.  They can still do thrash-type stuff if they want, heck, bands like Municipal Waste and Evile are doing a good job reviving that style, but they need to do something to forge their own identity if they ever want _respect _ alongside success.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

> Trying to emulate a band as legendary and important as Metallica is only going to earn scorn amongst the public("riding on their coattails" etc), and the fact that the band in question has managed to do a wonderful job of utterly and irrevocably destroying its credibility just compounds the problem.




First, you sing how you sing.  If he tried not to sing like like himself because he sounds like Hetfield, he might sound like a guy doing a bad Hetfield impression...and it would definitely dam his creative flow.

Besides, if you try too hard to change your vocal style, you can actually injure your vocal cords.

As far as public opinion goes, it all depends.  Some bands have done quite well doing their own version of the Led Zeppelin (David Coverdale, Bonham, Katmandu, Fastway, etc.) Black Sabbath (Kyuss, Early Man), AC/DC (Dirty Looks) and many other bands' sound.  By that I mean that some of those musicians were mocked for their emulations, and others were lauded.  It depends largely upon whether they bring anything new and special to the mix.

For instance, Corrosion of Conformity has a very Sabbath-esque formula to their compositions...but they also have a definite Lynnard Skynnard vibe (and other influences) in there as well, giving them a tasty and identifiable sonic architecture and a fair number of fans.


----------



## Leif

*Here's My Two-Cents'-Worth -- the dude with the Epiphone Les Paul 100 avatar*



Dannyalcatraz said:


> First, you sing how you sing.  If he tried not to sing like like himself because he sounds like Hetfield, he might sound like a guy doing a bad Hetfield impression...and it would definitely dam his creative flow.
> 
> Besides, if you try too hard to change your vocal style, you can actually injure your vocal cords.
> 
> As far as public opinion goes, it all depends.  Some bands have done quite well doing their own version of the Led Zeppelin (David Coverdale, Bonham, Katmandu, Fastway, etc.) Black Sabbath (Kyuss, Early Man), AC/DC (Dirty Looks) and many other bands' sound.  By that I mean that some of those musicians were mocked for their emulations, and others were lauded.  It depends largely upon whether they bring anything new and special to the mix.
> 
> For instance, Corrosion of Conformity has a very Sabbath-esque formula to their compositions...but they also have a definite Lynnard Skynnard vibe (and other influences) in there as well, giving them a tasty and identifiable sonic architecture and a fair number of fans.



DA, you mention D. Coverdale, but you leave off Deep Purple, which is where DC got his initial exposure.  And yes, they and the bands you mention do not really qualify by present-day standards of "Heavy Metal," but that they are the genesis of the genre is without question, and, I submit, the best and shining examples thereof.  But I'll go one step further and add Eric Clapton, Cream, and Jimi Hendrix to the list.  Admittedly, Clapton is quite well known for some classic softer songs, almost ballads even, but let's face it -- Slowhand ROCKS!  Cream is, of course, just another Clapton format, as was Blind Faith, which while it has the softer edge of Steve Winwood's vocals, nevertheless proudly sports the heavy-rockin' Clapton guitar solos.

Until my personal journey of discovery through Clapton Land, I was convinced that the best, purest examples of true heavy metal were, in this order:

1. Deep Purple [first album released 1968]
2. Black Sabbath [first album released 1970]
3. Whitesnake (particularly the albums 'Ready And Willing' and 'Slide It In')  (Although I gladly admit that Steve Vai is a total genius and added immeasurably to the band's overall appeal) [Whitesnake, of course, is a continuation of the Deep Purple effect]
4. Dio  [similarly, a continuation of the Black Sabbath effect]
5. Motley Crue [say what you will, their debut album, 1981's "Too Fast For Love," marks the true beginning of modern heavy metal]
6. Metallica [these guys just f****** rock]
7. Iron Maiden [Serious Rockin happenin' here, but they have a small 'egghead probem']
8. [Apologies for leaving others off this list, but that's all that I can think of at this second, although I'm sure there are more.]



Nyaricus said:


> I love this thread



Me. too!!  Sorry I only found it this late!


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Leif said:


> DA, you mention D. Coverdale, but you leave off Deep Purple, which is where DC got his initial exposure.  And yes, they and the bands you mention do not really qualify by present-day standards of "Heavy Metal," but that they are the genesis of the genre is without question, and, I submit, the best and shining examples thereof.  But I'll go one step further and add Eric Clapton, Cream, and Jimi Hendrix to the list.  Admittedly, Clapton is quite well known for some classic softer songs, almost ballads even, but let's face it -- Slowhand ROCKS!  Cream is, of course, just another Clapton format, as was Blind Faith, which while it has the softer edge of Steve Winwood's vocals, nevertheless proudly sports the heavy-rockin' Clapton guitar solos.
> 
> Until my personal journey of discovery through Clapton Land, I was convinced that the best, purest examples of true heavy metal were, in this order:
> 
> 1. Deep Purple [first album released 1968]
> 2. Black Sabbath [first album released 1970]
> 3. Whitesnake (particularly the albums 'Ready And Willing' and 'Slide It In')  (Although I gladly admit that Steve Vai is a total genius and added immeasurably to the band's overall appeal) [Whitesnake, of course, is a continuation of the Deep Purple effect]
> 4. Dio  [similarly, a continuation of the Black Sabbath effect]
> 5. Motley Crue [say what you will, their debut album, 1981's "Too Fast For Love," marks the true beginning of modern heavy metal]
> 6. Metallica [these guys just f****** rock]
> 7. Iron Maiden [Serious Rockin happenin' here, but they have a small 'egghead probem']
> 8. [Apologies for leaving others off this list, but that's all that I can think of at this second, although I'm sure there are more.]
> 
> 
> Me. too!!  Sorry I only found it this late!




Wow- an almost 7 year necro?  Well...it's only appropriate, given metal's connection to the supernatural. 

I didn't mention DC's involvement in DP because the DP sound was still predominant.  He didn't really get around to aping Led Zeppelin- and thus, getting called "David Coverversion"- until much later.

Anyway, it's clear that you're a bona fide metalhead (BTW, check out the link to Metal School in my sig for more headbanging fun), but _you have to follow the rules of the thread! _ What "wussy" music do you have in your collection?  What are your guilty pleasures?

*CONFESS!*


----------



## Leif

*(Grudging) Confession*

Sorry, I didn't see the rules:

Wussified music in my collection:

1.  The Go-Gos' _Beauty and the Beat_
2. Michael Jackson's _Thriller_
3. Devo's _Freedom of Choice_ and _New Traditionalists_
3.5 Vandenburg's first album [Sheesh, what a bunch of quasi-metal wannabe wankers!]
4. Assorted modern jazz that I really like
5. Assorted classical


Guilty Pleasures:

Singing along with the radio when my daughter is listening to KIYS-FM (pre-teen/teen-pop-schlock-drivel)  [ KISS ] or KFIN Supercountry  [ KFIN ].  She acts all "offended" and stuff and tells me to stop.  To which I laugh.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

I'll make you feel at home and admit to Devo, and...well everything you mentioned except _Thriller._


----------



## Leif

What can I say?  I spent much of 1982 and 1983 in a state of utter confusion.  I blame puberty.

And no, it doesn't really make me feel any better to know that someone else was [almost] as confused as I was, sorry.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Oh, I'm not confused.  I'm very broad in my musical tastes.

Here's a _part_ of the collection:


----------



## Leif

Color me impressed!  I note the axes, too.  

I have recently become an Epiphone convert, myself.  I have one "flat-ish black" Les Paul Special, a red SG special, [these two were bought on ebay], an ebony Les Paul 100, and a DR100 acoustic dreadnought, [these two were ordered new -- the LP100 from Sweetwater and the DR100 from GuitarCenter].  I also still have the first two guitars I ever owned, a bright blue Electra Phoenix, circa 1983, and a junior-sized Hummingbird acoustic from when I was about 11 or 12, which I guess makes it circa 1978-79.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

My first guitar was an Alvarez starter acoustic which I killed to death until it was no longer alive.

I still have my first electrics- a Dean Special Select EVO and a Time Capsule Cadillac (see my avatar)- and have added a ridiculous number of guitars (covering several brands)  since then.  Ditto pedals.  Only me amp, though- a 40w Fender HRD 1x12 combo.  

Not very metal an amp, I know, but it covers everything else very well.  So I'm going to get an Orange combo amp for the heavier stuff.


----------



## Leif

I had just one amp for years and years -- a Crate P.O.S.  Took me forever to figure out that it was what was wrong with my playing.  Next, several months ago, I got two little 5W practice amps by Gibson, or so the ebay ad said, but nowhere on the amps does the Gibson name appear.  Oh, well.  They work great.  Then I got a little 10 or 15W Marshall.  Tiny, but it packs a wallop.  And last week I got in my 40W Peavey Vypyr VIP 2 1X12, along with a Gator case to hold it.  I'm ready now.

For effects, I have a D.O.D. Overdrive pedal and an Electra Phase.  The cool thing about the Peavey amp is that it has a couple dozen effects built in -- various distortion settings, as well as chorus, delay, and I'm not even sure what alll else.  I haven't had a chance to sit down and play with it properly yet.  But I have seen ALL the pretty lights that shine when you turn that bad boy on.  Peavey Vypyr VIP 2.  Oh, yeah, the 'unusually long shipping delay' mentioned for the VyperVIP2 turns out to be about a week.  At least for me it did.

A Fender amp is a quality investment.  Kudos on your choice there.  I've seen the Orange amps, but haven't heard one.  I was tempted, but I could get a bigger Peavey with lots of bells and whistles for a good price, and I'm familiar with Peaveys, whereas an Orange would, for me, be a pig in a poke.  The coolest thing is the deal I got from Sweetwater for the Epiphone Les Paul 100, the 40W Peavey amp, and Gator cases for each of them  --  24-month, no-interest financing.  It was too good to pass up.  If I have a regret, it's that I didn't get higher $ equipment, but that's just blowing smoke -- I'm perfectly happy.  My Epiphone Les Paul 100 looks just about identical to my Enworld Avatar.

Also, I'm learning now that effects pedals are not always necessary to get special sounds.  There's something to be said for Spinal Tap amps that crank all the way to 11.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

The band Boris is but one reason I'm set on going after an Orange.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_GgowniQWk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gs6AjuzJJNk


----------



## Leif

Gotcha.  I'm too d***** old to bang _that_ hard anymore.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Dude!

You do know that Dio was 67 when he died, right?  And I'll make 47 this year, myself.  Metal isn't only for the young!

Went shopping today- looked at a Gretsch Electomatic 12-string (impressive for the sub-$1000 price!) and an Orange Thunderverb combo amp.  30 watts, switchable down to 15.  And there's another switch on the back that will drop it down to 7w.  One of my sales-dudes has ne, and says its convincingly hard even at that lowest level.  Alas, didn't get a chance to try it out.


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## Leif

I will also mark the completion of my 47th year in 2014.


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## RevTurkey

Guilty: Cliff Richard

Bragging: Wolfsbane!


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## Leif

RevTurkey said:


> Guilty: Cliff Richard



Ooooh, I had forgotten that -- I had a single of _"Devil Woman"_ back in the day.


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## Asmo

Guilty: the genius of Pat Methany

Bragging: Helker

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D674JznAYZA


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## Leif

I don't really care if I'm guilty or not, Pat Metheny is a flippin' Genius!


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## Leif

*Redemption?*

Perhaps I have undone some of my unwise music choices over the years by ordering and now owning a Les Paul 100 guitar, even if it is only an Epiphone.  Ebony, of course, with an ivory-toned pickguard -- see my avatar for a stock picture of the axe in question.  It does rock out righteously and heinously.   What amazes and delights me is that I have yet even to find a desire to hook up my overdrive pedal to it!  It just has by its very nature that growly, throaty, F-U sound to its humbuckers.  Allow me to also make a pitch for my amazing and astonishing guitar pushers, uh, suppliers:  Sweetwater, who have deals equal or superior to anyone out there, and yes, that includes the big name nationwide stores.  And Sweetwater never charges for shipping as far as I can tell.


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## Dannyalcatraz

Sweetwater is one of my favorite purveyors of musical gear.

Rock on, bro!


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## Leif

Dannyalcatraz said:


> Sweetwater is one of my favorite purveyors of musical gear.
> 
> Rock on, bro!



Indeed, that's the plan.  I have been briefly tempted by ads from Zzzounds recently, but whenever I compare one of their deals to Sweetwater's price for the same gear, they fail to exceed Sweetwater's value.  And I already know and trust Sweetwater and they have given me my very own sales consultant who gave me invaluable assistance with a recent purchase.  I just told him I needed a mic, and I'd prefer if there was a way to plug it into a spare guitar amp.  Two or three days later, I had my Shure mic and a quarter-inch adapter plug.


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## Dannyalcatraz

Don't be afraid to buy quality used gear, either- often, it is the best deal around.


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## Leif

Of course, the downside to this deal is that now, with my shiny new Les Paul, my 40W Peavey amp, my Shure mic, and a 15W Marshall to power the mic, I am fresh out of excuses as to why I'm not gigging at local clubs.  All I really need now is to get some good practice time in the ol' woodshed, and work up a 40-50 minute set, and throw my butt out there on a stage.  I don't want to have to depend on other people, so I'm thinking about concentrating on songs that I can pull-off without a band.  That makes me want to concentrate on doing electrified blues.  Most rock songs require at least a bass, but Black Sabbath songs have the bass almost playing in unison with Iommi's rhythm riff, so that's a possibility, too.  Black Sabbath's music is only about an inch-and-a-half away from Blues, anyway.  Singing Ozzy's lyrics is going to be a problem, however.  I have a bass/baritone voice, so I won't be screeching out N.I.B. or Iron Man.  On the other hand, Dio is more of a baritone, but I can't do much of his screaming, either.


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## Leif

Dannyalcatraz said:


> Don't be afraid to buy quality used gear, either- often, it is the best deal around.



Absolutely!  Almost every pawnshop in my hometown, and we've got 8 or 10 of them, has at least one Epiphone guitar available for very little green.  Most of them have probably been abused and seen better days for sure, but I bet you could scrape up three or four passable instruments out of all of them, or maybe by combining parts of several of them to make a Frankenstein Epiphone.


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## Dannyalcatraz

I was also thinking of online sites.  I've scored a few good deals for myself, but I've been helping people at the sites I frequent find deals as well.  In fact, in the past 3 weeks, I helped one guy score two different pro-level Fender Telecasters and another guy snag a Fernandes Retrorocket DG (a Strat-clone).

So, if you haven't found a good online guitar community, you should.  And don't be shy to ask me about gear, too!


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## Herschel

Used gear is often the only way to fly. I have a top-of-the line kit and cymbals for the price of an intermediate kit just by being patient and shopping around. 

Mapex Saturn (Maple/Walnut shells) 10", 12", 14" & 16" toms, 14" snare, 22" kick alonf with a 1965 14" x 5" Slingerland CoB snare. 

Paiste Cymbals 14" 2002 Hi Hats, 14" Colorsound 5 (plated 2002) Hi Hats, 20" Black Label (2002) Ride, 16" Innovations Crash, 16" Dimensions Thin Crash, 18" 2002 Crash, 16" Colorsound 5 (plated 2002) Power Crash, 18" Signature China, 20" 3000 Novo China, 10" Signature Splash, 10" Wuhan (trashy effect cymbal) splash. 

Roland TD-6 Drum Module w/ Pintech Concert Cast pads, 2 6" DDrum Decaabans (10" and 12" depth, from Carmine Appice's Demo Kit)

Pearl Eliminator Double Pedal, Mapex Hi Hat stand (replacing my old Tama Titan), Yamaha pedal (for e-kick when hybrid set up), Pearl Drum Rack. 

What was purchased new? The Colorsound Hi Hats back in the late 80's (my first set), the Wuhan and the kick pedals.


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## Leif

That is an awesome rig, Herschel!  I've not been fortunate enough to play in bands with a drummer who could field a set-up like that.  In fact, there's only been one drummer that I've played with, in high school band and two bands of our own creation.  There was a third collection of guys that jammed together some, but we were never really a band _per se_.  I resisted because the drummer's older brother was hanging around a lot.  He's a pretty fair guitarist, but he has a mild "God-complex" and has to run the show, no matter what.  That got old for me really fast.

Danny, I haven't found an online community of guitarists.  Heck, I didn't even know there were such things!  I'd ask about gear, but I'm afraid my tastes run to the low end of things.  I have an Electra Phoenix, circa 1983-4 that I bought new.  It's got a three pick-ups, s-h-s, and a strat-style body.  It has a tremolo bridge, but just a very basic one.  That was my first electric guitar.  More recently, I've been buying a few online, some through ebay and two (an acoustic and an electric) from Sweetwater.  ALL four of the recent purchases have been Epiphones -- I have an SG Special and a Les Paul Special both that I got for about $100 apiece on ebay.  (They're worth what I paid, or the SG may be worth a little more -- its not got that many features, but its got a great sound and it feels excellent when I play it.  It looks great, too!  Candy-apple red, and not a blemish on it.  The two I bought new are an Epi DR-100 acoustic -- kinda sorry, but good enough to plunk around on, and an ebony Epi Les Paul 100 that looks, feels, and sounds like ten times what I paid for it.  [See my avatar!]  Since I got the LP100, I haven't touched my Phoenix/strat.  And I picked up a Peavey Vypyr VIP2 40W amp to go with the LP.  

What I'm looking at now is an Epiphone G-400 Pro SG.  Seems like I couldn't go wrong for $349.00!

The acoustics I'm looking at are Epis, too, an AJ-220S and an EJ-200CE acoustic/electric.

Also, from what I've seen, used Epiphones go for just about the same price you can get a brand new one from Sweetwater.  The new ones come with a guarantee from Sweetwater, too, so that's my option of choice.  I can't see me buying anything but an Epi until I get much, much better at playing one.  By then, maybe I'll have a record deal and can afford to buy some of Rick Neilsen's used Gibsons, Gretsches, and Hamers.


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## Dannyalcatraz

Well, GuitarPlayer.com has a forum- to my mind, the players there are older, but full of knowledge.  Some do pedal mods and post the how-to.  Its slower, but good.

The other one I frequent is Ultimate-guitar.com.  A lot of metalheads , punks and proggers, and I think the average age is much lower.  Most of the metalheads seem to be teens and young adults.  They also have a massive tab section.


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## Leif

Dannyalcatraz said:


> Well, GuitarPlayer.com has a forum- to my mind, the players there are older, but full of knowledge.  Some do pedal mods and post the how-to.  Its slower, but good.
> 
> The other one I frequent is Ultimate-guitar.com.  A lot of metalheads , punks and proggers, and I think the average age is much lower.  Most of the metalheads seem to be teens and young adults.  They also have a massive tab section.



Wow, both sound very cool!  I'll have to check them out.  I could always use more tabs, but I'm not sure I'd have much use for just heavy metal tabs.  Okay, okay, Black Sabbath, Deep Purple, Dio, Ozzy, and Iron Maiden I could use.

Got those 2 sites bookmarked.  Thanks!


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## Leif

Trivia time: Name, if you can, the song and artist whose music is heard in the currently running Cialis commercial?

(Admittedly, it's not exactly metal, but it is a pre-cursor to rock in general.)


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## Dannyalcatraz

I might be able to if I knew the commercial in question.


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## Leif

Okay, turns out I was wrong -- the commercial is actually from 2011.  Here's a link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4I4xBCq_cpw


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## Dannyalcatraz

Howlin' Wolf's Smokestack Lightning
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXy7x9ynrQE&sns=em


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## Leif

DING DING DING!!  You win the virtual kewpie doll!


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## Leif

I was messing around on ultimate-guitar.com just now, and imagine my surprise to find this post(!):

http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showpost.php?p=32282211&postcount=11

Speaking of the dicussion there, I have an Epiphone SG Special, and it plays just fine.  I also have an Epi Les Paul special, and sometimes the tuning machines slip a bit and just seem a little wonky.  But my SG Special and my Epi Les Paul 100 (yes, I know, I own three Epis, alright?  Sheesh!) seem to be free of these issues.

What I want is an Epiphone G400 with Grover tuners (sells for around $350.00), but the Guild S-100 with open-faced Grovers is also tempting, although it is about $450.00 more ($799.00).  Both are made in east asia, the Guild in Korea and the Epiphone in China, Japan, Singapore, or somewhere over there.


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## Dannyalcatraz

Between those two, I'd go with the Guild.  I've heard nothing but good about 'em.


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## Leif

I thought I'd post the Sweetwater catalog entries for both.  Not the Epi is on sale for the rest of August.....

Guild:
http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/S100CR

Epiphone:
http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/EGGVWBCH


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## Dannyalcatraz

If you're buying sight unseen, I'd REALLY go for the Guild over the Epi.  Anyone can make a gem or a lemon, but you can't tl without trying.  Guilds are, on average, better made than Epis- though you will see Epis used by pros- and your odds are just that much better of getting an acceptible instrument with the Guild.

And Sweetwater has good policies, FWIW.


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## Leif

Oh I've been VERY pleased with Sweetwater!  Ok, you've convinced me.  I'll start saving up to get the Guild S-100, and stifle my unholy urges to buy yet another Epi.  (It won't be hard, really -- I've already been doing it for months now.  I've lusted after two different G400/G350 models for better than a year.  Guess part of my brain knows what's what.

But dos the Guild have coil tapping?  I've been reading about that recently, and I understand (was told) Thatcoil tapping is superior to coil splitting.  Funny thing -- I have an Electra Phoenix that I bought new in the fall of 1983.  It's got a S-H-S configuration and two tone controls with a push-pull function.   What I don't understand is why it needs two push-pull knobs when it has only one humbucker.  Could one be a coil split and the other a coil tap?  Wouldn't having both on one guitar yield a division by zero error or something?


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## Dannyalcatraz

Coil tapping and coil splitting each nap have their advantages and disadvantages.  I wouldn't call either better, just different.  Tapping doesn't reintroduce singlecoil hum, though.

As to why the SHS Phoenix-nice axe, BTW- has 2 push/pulls, I honestly don't know.  These guys might know more.
http://www.rivercityamps.com/electrapage/index.php?m=01&y=08&entry=entry080123-120502

You might also contact the guys at the reborn Electra guitar company. They're industry vets, and they bought the Electra IP along with the brand name when they revived the company a few years ago.  They may even have the schematics in their desks right now...
http://www.electraguitar.com


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## Leif

Thanks!  You're the first person who's ever known what I was talking about when I said, "Phoenix."  Truly, though, it does look more awesome than it is.  (Except for the big ding I put on the top edge when I dropped it.)  It's got a trainload of singlecoil hum.  That's why I tend to favor my HH Epis.


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## Dannyalcatraz

Well, back in 2013, I bought an Electra Omega Prime, and I love it.  So I knew EXACTLY what you were talking about.


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## Leif

That is a beautiful axe!  I love the natural finish and the darker freboard inlays.

My current baby is in my avatar, an ebony epi LP, but I still have a soft spot for my red epi SG Special.  I've got to drag out my Phoenix, dust it off, and limber it up again.


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## Dannyalcatraz

Thank you!  I tell you, though- the ceruse version is just as pretty.  I had a hell of a time deciding between them...and still think about getting one.


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## Leif

Agreed!  That one's just as awesome!  I tend to lean towards black guitars anyway.  I think I have a touch of Les Paul's "tuxedo guitar" disease.


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## Dannyalcatraz

Do you?  Well then, you'll dig 2 of my others:

Malden Bad Karma




Reverend Rick Vito sig hardtail:


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## Thunderfoot

Dannyalcatraz said:


> Don't be afraid to buy quality used gear, either- often, it is the best deal around.



You can say that again I got my drum rack (Tama Stainless dual bass round) for $250 used in the 90 - back when they were running $1500 new.  Great part is someone didn't know the phrase "finger tight"  and had cranked the holders down and used duct tape to try to keep them from moving - (that doesn't work btw....)  One I cleaned it up I essential had a brand new rack...


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## Dannyalcatraz

Hey, T!  Sounds like you got a steal of a deal.  No damage done?


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## Leif

DA, the Malden and Vito are, indeed, quite black.  And cool, too, but I still like the two Electras best.  I'm probably prejudiced in favor of Electras, since my first serious guitar is an Electra Phoenix, but I don't really care.  Another one I have been looking at very hard lately is a Guild  S-100 Polara in cherry red.  And Sweetwater has a 36-month-no-interest deal going now that they say includes Guild, but the page for that guitar only reflects 24 months, last I checked. 

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/S100CR

I have this nagging sensation that I am repeating myself....

While I'm at it and thinking guitar .... I also have a $110.00 Epi acoustic that, for the most part does adquately, but there are some dead spots on the neck around the 3rd to the 5th frets on the high E and B strings.  This is the only indication that I have ever had that Epiphone might somehow deserve their reputation far and wide for making cheap sh*t.  I have never had a problem out of my Les Paul Special, my SG Special, or my Les Paul 100, all three of which I got for a total of around $460.00, over a span of around 12-15 months.  My Electra Phoenix cost $469.00 in 1983 dollars.  None of the Epis came with cases, however, so I spent another $350.00 on two epiphone cases and one Gator case for the Les Paul 100.  I'll be the first to admit that Epi CASES stink to high heaven, with shoddy latches that don't work properly, which is why I got the Gator for the LP 100.  Gator lives up to the hype.  Very respectable quality product.


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## Dannyalcatraz

Contact them directly- a sales advisor will give you the real info, one way or another.


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## reelo

Just want to chime in: long time metalhead/guitarist here. Have been playing the guitar since I was 14, so that's 21 year now. Though I'm currently not active due to family/job constraints.
My gigging gear was a BC Rich Warlock, a customised Yamaha guitar (which used to be a HSH/FR superstrat but is now a HH/Hardtail with Series/Parallel switching) a Boss GT-10 and a HK Triamp Mk.I (midi-switchable via the Boss unit)
I also have a nice Squier 60s Start and a 6W VHT tube-amp (think Fender Champ)
I think by the time I'll get around to being in a band again, I'll be 50 and playing the blues...


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## Dannyalcatraz

Then all is right in the world.


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## Leif

reelo said:


> Just want to chime in: long time metalhead/guitarist here. Have been playing the guitar since I was 14, so that's 21 year now. Though I'm currently not active due to family/job constraints.
> My gigging gear was a BC Rich Warlock, a customised Yamaha guitar (which used to be a HSH/FR superstrat but is now a HH/Hardtail with Series/Parallel switching) a Boss GT-10 and a HK Triamp Mk.I (midi-switchable via the Boss unit)
> I also have a nice Squier 60s Start and a 6W VHT tube-amp (think Fender Champ)
> I think by the time I'll get around to being in a band again, I'll be 50 and playing the blues...




BC Rich Warlocks are some COOL-LOOKING guitars!  I always kinda wanted either a warlock or a bich, but never followed through.


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## reelo

Leif said:


> BC Rich Warlocks are some COOL-LOOKING guitars!  I always kinda wanted either a warlock or a bich, but never followed through.



Anything BUT Tune-o-matic bridges for me. Just hate them with a passion. I need a solid block of metal as a hand rest, and with TOM bridges I feel like my guitar is missing a piece.
So I tend to play either hardtails or, preferably, guitars with a tremolo (can even be immobilized)

My Warlock is pretty beat up by now, it'd need new frets at the very least. I've played it for 12 years as a main guitar, with heavy gauge strings... Intonation is completely off due to the uneven frets. :-/


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## Dannyalcatraz

Are you actively shopping, or are you just musing over your current situation?


----------



## Leif

reelo said:


> Anything BUT Tune-o-matic bridges for me. Just hate them with a passion. I need a solid block of metal as a hand rest, and with TOM bridges I feel like my guitar is missing a piece.
> So I tend to play either hardtails or, preferably, guitars with a tremolo (can even be immobilized)
> 
> My Warlock is pretty beat up by now, it'd need new frets at the very least. I've played it for 12 years as a main guitar, with heavy gauge strings... Intonation is completely off due to the uneven frets. :-/




I don't know about that, I've never had a problem with the tune-o-matic bridge.  In fact, I've never really noticed a bridge while I'm playing.  Sounds like you have a pretty unique style, if you're using the bridge as a handrest.


----------



## reelo

Leif said:


> Sounds like you have a pretty unique style, if you're using the bridge as a handrest.




One word: Palm-muting.


----------



## Leif

reelo said:


> My Warlock is pretty beat up by now, it'd need new frets at the very least. I've played it for 12 years as a main guitar, with heavy gauge strings...



I've always kinda wanted a Warlock or a Bich.  But I wound up with a strat copy (Electra Phoenix, SHS), 2 Epi Les Pauls (one special and one 100), and an Epi SG Special.

I've always fluctuated between XLight strings, Lights, and Mediums.  I like them all for different reasons, but I tend more towards the Lights because they're heavy enough on the low end to give me enough "boom," but not too stiff to make a good bend.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Because half of what I play is in NST (CGDAEG, low to high), I have had to make custom sets up.  This means I often have leftover strings which I sometimes use for my E Standard guitars.  Sooooo...sometimes, a guitar might have a slightly lighter or heavier string in one position than it usually does.

But there are retailers online who sell strings individually.  That way you could have heavy strings on the low end, and nice, light bendy ones on the high end.


----------



## Leif

Yeah, and some company, I think it was Dean Markley, used to make a particular gauge called "Heavy Bottom, Light Top" or something.  So that's kinda what you 're talking about packaged together.

I see that you brandish a Traveller badge.  Ever GM much Traveller here?  I'd find it very cool to play, if so.  My favorite system, rules-wise, is GURPS Traveller, because it abandons all the "enlistment" nonsense and you just roll up a character in the regular manner, but I'd like playing so much that I wouldn't really care what system you used.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

I haven't GMed Traveller in at least a decade.  I kinda miss it.  

I always thought the career stuff was nifty.  The idea that a party need not be composed of persons of similar ability, but could instead be made up of people of all kinds of backgrounds was, IMHO, revolutionary.  ESPECIALLY since was hit upon so early in the history of RPGs.

(However, my all-time favorite RPG system is HERO.)


----------



## Bedrockgames

Leif said:


> I've always kinda wanted a Warlock or a Bich.  But I wound up with a strat copy (Electra Phoenix, SHS), 2 Epi Les Pauls (one special and one 100), and an Epi SG Special.
> 
> I've always fluctuated between XLight strings, Lights, and Mediums.  I like them all for different reasons, but I tend more towards the Lights because they're heavy enough on the low end to give me enough "boom," but not too stiff to make a good bend.




I lean toward 10s and 11s for strings. I like my lower strings to have a certain heaviness, but I do want some speed and bends on the higher end. I also like my action insanely low.


----------



## Bedrockgames

Dannyalcatraz said:


> Well, back in 2013, I bought an Electra Omega Prime, and I love it.  So I knew EXACTLY what you were talking about.





That looks pretty awesome. I just got a new guitar myself (been a while since I did that). I went in thinking of getting an Ibanez or ESP and picked up a Schechter of all things because the action was so outstanding.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

There have been a couple of Schecters that tempted me.  There was the Devil Tribal, as I recall...




Never bought one, though...couldn't find one to buy.

But my most "metal" guitars currently are a Malden Bad Karma (LP clone), a pair of Fernandes Ravelles, and 2 Deans- an EVO (another LP clone) and a Cadillac.


----------



## Bedrockgames

Dannyalcatraz said:


> There have been a couple of Schecters that tempted me.  There was the Devil Tribal, as I recall...
> 
> View attachment 70219
> 
> Never bought one, though...couldn't find one to buy.
> 
> But my most "metal" guitars currently are a Malden Bad Karma (LP clone), a pair of Fernandes Ravelles, and 2 Deans- an EVO (another LP clone) and a Cadillac.




I ended up getting the C-1 Platinum. For the price, pretty nice guitar.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

So I hear!


----------



## Leif

What do you guys know about the Guild S-100 Polara?
red

And/or the Epiphone G-400?
worn brown

I'm also looking at a black Epi G-400, _a la_ Tony Iommi:
black

The black epi is $50 more, but it has coil taps.  The worn brown one, on the other hand, is cheaper and has Grover tuners.  And epi tuners, in my experience, can be a bit questionable.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Even though I prefer the visual aesthetics of the Epi SGs, the Guild is probably the better guitar.


----------



## Leif

Thanks.  I feel pretty much the same way.

And, hey, while I'm thinking about it, do you know how Gator cases and SKB cases copare?  I have one Gator and I really like it, but I've heard good things about SKB, too.  And I can definitely confirm that while their Asian-made Gibson-clone guitars can get you by in a pinch, and they even manage to produce the occasional gem now and then, Epiphone cases have major suckage issues.


----------



## Dannyalcatraz

Sounds mostly like my take on it, too.  I have several Gators.  The few SKBs I've seen looked decent.  The one Epi case I have is actually a decent case, too, but is bought it for a guitar that didn't come with one...and have since found one with a better fit.


----------



## Leif

The middle latch on my one epi case (fool me once....) gave completely out after just a week or two's use.  That was it for me.


----------

